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Speaker 1: I am fully aware that everybody and their mother thinks

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Speaker 1: it's a civil war.

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Speaker 2: I don't.

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Speaker 1: I do not think that we are in a place

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Speaker 1: of a civil war. I do not think that the

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Speaker 1: political right is being destroyed and magas being destroyed.

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Speaker 2: I always knew that when President Trump was no longer President.

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Speaker 1: Trump, this whole maga conversation would be different, lessoned.

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Speaker 2: It always is. But the idea of destroy it is

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Speaker 2: just this idea of people who.

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Speaker 1: Are desperate to build fiefdom and to build power to

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Speaker 1: do so.

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Speaker 2: So this is what they say. Reality is far different.

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Speaker 1: Tony Katz, Tony Katz today, great to be with you.

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Speaker 1: Let me bring in Ed Morrissey right there of hot

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Speaker 1: air dot com. That's where you find his work, Ed

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Speaker 1: Morrissey on the Twitter X and I play with a

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Speaker 1: couple of different shots.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to go with this one here for those

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Speaker 2: people watching the live stream.

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Speaker 1: Before we get to the story here whether or not

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Speaker 1: the political right has all just fallen apart. Let me

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Speaker 1: bring it to a story that you have this over

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Speaker 1: at hotair dot com. This having to do with the shutdown.

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Speaker 1: America's flight mare begins. Nearly a thousand flights canceled already

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Speaker 1: in Schumer's shutdown. This, of course, was Sean Duffy yesterday,

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Speaker 1: the Transportation Secretary of saying flights reduced by ten percent.

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Speaker 1: I have a real theory here on how we have

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Speaker 1: to handle this shutdown. But let's start with the basic

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Speaker 1: question to you, did you really think it would.

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Speaker 2: Last this long? No?

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Speaker 3: No, I'm surprised that lasted to the election. I get

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Speaker 3: you know. I sort of was getting that impression so

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Speaker 3: about mid month last month that they would probably try

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Speaker 3: to stretch it out that long. But I expected after

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Speaker 3: the election was over that that was really all that

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Speaker 3: the Democrats had to gain. Right, They fired up the

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Speaker 3: base in northern Virgininia. They fired up the base a

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Speaker 3: little bit in New Jersey, but I think the primary

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Speaker 3: impact there was Virginia. Right. They wanted to make sure

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Speaker 3: that the federal employees has got to remember, Northern Virginia

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Speaker 3: is basically DC south right, So that's where you have

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Speaker 3: federal employees. A lot of them live in Northern Virginia.

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Speaker 3: Federal contractors and their employees live and work in Northern Virginia,

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Speaker 3: and the secondary in tertiary economic structures in Northern Virginia

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Speaker 3: service those people. So if you're cutting the checks off

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Speaker 3: to federal employees and federal contractors. That's where it's going

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Speaker 3: to have a lot of impact than it did. Big

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Speaker 3: turnout in northern Virginia. They flipped I think a dozen

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Speaker 3: state legislative seats as a result. They had a good night,

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Speaker 3: and I expected Tony that that was basically the only

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Speaker 3: thing that they really had going right. But now it

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Speaker 3: appears that they are I'm going to I'm going to

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Speaker 3: say this. I think what you I think what they're

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Speaker 3: doing right now is they're getting at a little high

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Speaker 3: on their own supply and thinking that the election results

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Speaker 3: are a mandate.

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Speaker 2: To continue the shutdown.

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Speaker 3: I think that's a mistake on their part. They would

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Speaker 3: be better off just getting it off the table.

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Speaker 2: Now.

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Speaker 3: They've already proven they can fight, They've gotten what they

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Speaker 3: can get out of it.

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Speaker 2: What what are what else.

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Speaker 3: Are they going to get out of it? The Republicans

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Speaker 3: are not going to repeal the one big beautiful bill,

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Speaker 3: which is what their demand is.

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Speaker 1: WHOA, what do you mean? That's what the Republican demand is.

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Speaker 1: The Republicans demand no, no.

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Speaker 3: No, the Democrat that's what that's what the Democrat, that's

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Speaker 3: what the Democrat demand is they want they want to

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Speaker 3: repeal all of the provisions of the one big beautiful

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Speaker 3: bill that has to do with funding, you know, uh,

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Speaker 3: health care for illegal aliens. It's one of their big asks.

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Speaker 3: It's one of the things that they're they're using this

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Speaker 3: as pressure to get and Republicans aren't going to budge

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Speaker 3: on that they're not going to undo the Reconciliation Bill.

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Speaker 2: And so.

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Speaker 3: At this point, I'm not even sure what they're fighting

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Speaker 3: for any longer. Whatever they get is going to be

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Speaker 3: is going to be less than the damage that they're

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Speaker 3: doing to basically their own constituencies, the whole lot of

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Speaker 3: your red class.

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Speaker 2: This is Senator.

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Speaker 1: Richard Blumenthal, Democrat Connecticut, who lied about his Vietnam service.

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Speaker 1: I always say that it is important to remind people

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Speaker 1: of who he is.

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Speaker 2: This is him. Make sure you can hear this, listen.

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Speaker 2: I think that there is no reason to surrender now,

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Speaker 2: every reason to stand firm.

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Speaker 1: There's no reason to surrender now, every reason to stand firm.

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Speaker 2: So here we are, and they decided to your point.

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Speaker 1: You know, I always talk about the political left always

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Speaker 1: overplaced their hand, always in every single situation.

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Speaker 2: They can't just take a victory for the sake of it.

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Speaker 1: They think Virginia and New Jersey and Mom Donnie equals.

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Speaker 2: Let it last for forever.

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Speaker 1: You can make the Republicans capitulate on a million things,

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Speaker 1: or you can pretend to gain something else.

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Speaker 2: We're going to see day fifty five of this at

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Speaker 2: this rate.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it may it may last to Thanksgiving or even Christmas.

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Speaker 3: I don't think it gets them anything though. The They're

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Speaker 3: not going to win anything in the end. This is

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Speaker 3: the problem with shutdowns. You don't actually win anything in

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Speaker 3: a shutdown, especially when the other party has control of

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Speaker 3: the White House, because the White House can control how

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Speaker 3: shutdowns operate. And actually the Trump you know, you know,

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Speaker 3: Trump is demanding that Senate Republicans and the filibuster and

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Speaker 3: get this thing over with. I think is a short sighted,

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Speaker 3: short term solution to this issue. But still I think

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Speaker 3: I think it highlights the fact that there's really nothing

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Speaker 3: at stake here except for the partisanship. And Donald Trump

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Speaker 3: is sick and tired of the partisanship and he wants

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Speaker 3: to just get things moving again. And I think he

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Speaker 3: also understands too, and I think he understood this before

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Speaker 3: the election, that Republicans were making a somewhat foolish judgment

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Speaker 3: that the shutdown was going to hurt Democrats in these

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Speaker 3: in these off yer elections, even though these elections took

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Speaker 3: place in deep blue blue or deep blue territory. That

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Speaker 3: turned out to be incorrect.

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Speaker 2: It just did.

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Speaker 3: And I think Trump knew that, and I think that's

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Speaker 3: the reason why he's been pressing for the filibuster to

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Speaker 3: be either either reformed or eliminated as a means of

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Speaker 3: getting this thing over with.

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Speaker 2: He's calling for elimination.

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Speaker 1: Talking to Ed Morrissey of dot Com, I do believe

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Speaker 1: he's wrong, and I have just made the argument that

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Speaker 1: getting rid of the filibuster is only part one. What

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Speaker 1: is the whip count on all the things you want

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Speaker 1: to get done? How many centators do you have with you?

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Speaker 1: And then how are you gonna get it passed in

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Speaker 1: the House. You know you're gonna have Thomas Massey against

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Speaker 1: you on near everything, and you know you're gonna have

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Speaker 1: Victoria Sparts from Indiana my memory of Congress against you

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Speaker 1: on a whole bunch LEAs.

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Speaker 2: So it's not that these things exist in a vacuum.

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Speaker 1: You got to have a strategy that plays all the

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Speaker 1: way along here. But the real question is and I

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Speaker 1: think it was byron Yorke who first brought this up,

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Speaker 1: and I will.

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Speaker 2: Give him credit where it to too. If it wasn't him,

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Speaker 2: I'll give credit to whoever it was.

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Speaker 1: You got to take the conversation out of the hands

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Speaker 1: of Speaker Johnson.

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Speaker 2: I think like Johnson is an able speaker. I think

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Speaker 2: he's proven himself in a lot of ways.

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Speaker 1: But this is now time for a wartime conciliary. This

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Speaker 1: is a time to punch Democrats in the face and

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Speaker 1: say you want a government shutdown. You explain to people

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Speaker 1: why you want their kids to starve. Here's the continuing resolution.

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Speaker 2: I'm out of it.

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Speaker 1: I think there needs to be a strategy difference if

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Speaker 1: this is the way Democrats are going to play.

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Speaker 2: Am I right or am I wrong? No? I think

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Speaker 2: you're right.

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Speaker 3: I don't think. I think Republicans are making a mistake

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Speaker 3: by trying to come up with packages and that sort

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Speaker 3: of thing. I think they just should have said, we've

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Speaker 3: got a continuing resolution on the table that will fund

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Speaker 3: government today. We're gonna keep putting it up there until

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Speaker 3: you vote for it. I don't care what else everybody wants.

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Speaker 3: We're not negotiating at all until the hostage is released,

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Speaker 3: basically the budget being the hostage. Yeah, and I don't

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Speaker 3: necessarily like the hostage language because we just got done

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Speaker 3: with two years of actual hostages and dealing with actual hostages.

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Speaker 3: But I think it's but it is what it is.

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Speaker 3: That's exactly what this is. They're trying to hold the

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Speaker 3: federal government hostage in order to undo the Reconciliation Bill.

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Speaker 3: But it's really what they want to do. They just

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Speaker 3: really want to undo the Reconciliation Bill. That's what this

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Speaker 3: is all about.

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Speaker 2: And so yeah, I think.

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Speaker 3: That I think that, you know, I like Thune, I

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Speaker 3: like Johnson, both of them, and actually Johnson I think

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Speaker 3: has been tougher on this than Thune has. Johnson's just

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Speaker 3: Johnson saying I'm not even bringing the house back until

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Speaker 3: you pass the CR. He's been tough on that. It's

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Speaker 3: Thune that's going, well, maybe we'll package it with this,

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Speaker 3: Maybe we'll package it with that. We want to talk

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Speaker 3: to these people, talk to those people. No, you just say, look,

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Speaker 3: here's the CR. We're going to keep putting the CR

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Speaker 3: until it expires. Then I'm going to go ask my

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Speaker 3: friend Mike Johnson to pass another CR, clean CR, and

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Speaker 3: we're gonna put that on the table until that one expires,

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Speaker 3: and we're not reopening, you know, Diddley until we until

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Speaker 3: we pass the clean CR.

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Speaker 2: That's it period.

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Speaker 1: Sorry to hear what Richard Blumenthal just said of his

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Speaker 1: blood doesn't boil, then he's the wrong guy for leadership.

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Speaker 2: That would be my immediate take.

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Speaker 1: Talking to Ed Morrissey over there at hotair dot com.

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Speaker 1: Let's move the subject to the civil war amongst the

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Speaker 1: political right and the end of Magan Republicanism as we

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Speaker 1: know it.

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Speaker 2: Oh you mean heritage? Oh sure, right.

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Speaker 1: The level of everything is ruining everything. Everybody is destroying everything. Listen,

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Speaker 1: I had William Jacobson on the show yesterday. He certainly

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Speaker 1: is no fan of Tucker Carlson and the clear not

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Speaker 1: just anti Israel, anti Jewish sentiment that he is espousing.

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Speaker 1: That the interview with Nick Fuentes, which had no pushback,

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Speaker 1: the platforming of somebody you know, is that ugly is

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Speaker 1: more than just well we're having conversation here, but kay,

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Speaker 1: this person's trying to destroy MAGA.

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Speaker 2: That one's trying to destroy MAGA.

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Speaker 1: The Republican parties and disarrays a total civil war. Are

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Speaker 1: dogs and cats living together mass hysteria?

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Speaker 2: No, No, the answer is clearly no. But this is

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Speaker 2: what's desperately wanted. How do you describe what's happening.

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Speaker 3: I describe what's happening as hygienic. You've got some fringe

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Speaker 3: characters who are trying to encroach on your movement. You

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Speaker 3: criticize them, you push them out, and you for people

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Speaker 3: who are trying to mainstream them, you criticize them and

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Speaker 3: push them out. And that's exactly what was going on here.

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Speaker 3: I mean, this is not new. Ace's Shades actually had

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Speaker 3: a really good lengthy post as Ace is won't to do,

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Speaker 3: talking about the fact that the whole point of politics

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Speaker 3: is to is to create hygiene for the body politic right,

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Speaker 3: So if you've got gropers to the left of you,

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Speaker 3: groupers to the right of you, you push back against

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Speaker 3: both sides at the same time, and.

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Speaker 2: You're doing ale measure. Stuck in the middle.

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Speaker 3: Answer, stuck in the middle with you, Yes, exactly, Steelers wheel,

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Speaker 3: Little Steeler's wheel for.

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Speaker 2: Tony Kats fans. But I mean that's that's politics.

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Speaker 3: That's what you're supposed to do. You're not supposed to

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Speaker 3: wrap your arms around somebody because they might be on

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Speaker 3: your side when they are a totally toxic I mean again,

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Speaker 3: Nick Quentis is a guy who is professing his fandom

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Speaker 3: of Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, you know, and was saying

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Speaker 3: that vote for Kamala Harris and I'm going to destroy Magga.

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Speaker 3: That's not exactly an ally that you're dealing with there.

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Speaker 3: And he's a fringe character. Yeah, he's got a few

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Speaker 3: million followers on social media.

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Speaker 1: Who a few million, He's got five million, but I've

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Speaker 1: got five million.

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Speaker 4: Largest scale point as a problem, Well, it's a problem.

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Speaker 4: But the way you deal with the problem is to

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Speaker 4: call it out, not to cover it up, not to say, oh,

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Speaker 4: no enemies to the right.

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Speaker 3: You know, this is not you know, this is not

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Speaker 3: the the Soviet We're not supposed to take the Soviet

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Speaker 3: approach to things. We're not supposed to take the Lenin

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Speaker 3: Marx line. No enemies to the right, no enemies to

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Speaker 3: the left. We are supposed to be looking at this,

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Speaker 3: especially Heritage is a think tank, it's supposed to be

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Speaker 3: looking at this and saying this is what conservative is,

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Speaker 3: conservatism is, and this is what conservatism isn't and Nick

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Speaker 3: Fuente's and Tucker Carlson at the moment is what conservatism

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Speaker 3: isn't and you need that type of hygiene. So this

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Speaker 3: is hygiene. It's not a civil war. This is first off,

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Speaker 3: it's just a debate. I mean, the whole civil war

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Speaker 3: thing is a little overblown anyway in terms of hyperbole.

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Speaker 2: But this isn't even that.

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Speaker 3: This is this is people criticizing fringe characters. It's hardly

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Speaker 3: a civil war. Neither one, neither Tucker nor Nick Quintes

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Speaker 3: is a guy who is trying to you know, promote

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Speaker 3: either the Republican Party or Mega or Conservatism incorporated, whatever

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Speaker 3: you want to call things, you know, different at different levels.

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Speaker 3: They're actively opposed to it. So this isn't even a

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Speaker 3: civil war. This is, I guess, if you want to

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Speaker 3: use a a war analogy, this is the barbarians at

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Speaker 3: the gates, and you didn't win. You know, they didn't

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Speaker 3: save the city of Vienna by by allowing the Turks

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Speaker 3: to come in, right they you know, the barbarians. You know,

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Speaker 3: the city of Rome fell because they let the barbarians

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Speaker 3: in the gates. I mean, you go back to history.

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Speaker 3: This is the barbarians at the gates. You just have

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Speaker 3: to keep them out, and the way you do that

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Speaker 3: is to point out who they are and what they represent.

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Speaker 3: I mean, the idea that that's a civil war is nonsense,

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Speaker 3: and you're you're going.

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Speaker 1: To take heat for saying that, Oh you don't understand,

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Speaker 1: Oh they run the party or they're the future. We

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Speaker 1: do have a fight on our hands. That much cannot

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Speaker 1: be denied ed. Morrissey hotair dot com. Appreciate you as

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Speaker 1: always being here more to get to keep it right here, guys.

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Speaker 2: I'm Tony Katz and this it's Tony Katz today