1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,400 Speaker 1: We bring in our next guest, Zach Rosenblad, who covers 2 00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:04,200 Speaker 1: the team for the Athletic and is kind enough to 3 00:00:04,200 --> 00:00:06,440 Speaker 1: get up early and join us on the fan morning 4 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:09,560 Speaker 1: show in the Payless Lookers hotline this morning. Good morning, Zach. 5 00:00:09,760 --> 00:00:11,440 Speaker 1: Kept you busy yesterday, didn't we. 6 00:00:11,960 --> 00:00:14,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, they always do. It's nothing new around here. 7 00:00:15,520 --> 00:00:17,360 Speaker 1: How's this going down in New York right now? 8 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:21,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I think, as a Dust has said 9 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:23,960 Speaker 2: a little bit, I think the general reaction has been 10 00:00:24,040 --> 00:00:26,360 Speaker 2: positive because of the amount of draft capital they got, 11 00:00:26,440 --> 00:00:28,160 Speaker 2: not only with this trade, but with the Quinn Williams 12 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 2: on with the Cowboys and just kind of reset the 13 00:00:30,400 --> 00:00:32,040 Speaker 2: board and now they have five first round picks of 14 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:35,760 Speaker 2: the next two years. So but in the moment, you know, 15 00:00:35,880 --> 00:00:38,320 Speaker 2: and even now still, honestly, it was pretty shocking. I 16 00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 2: don't think there's any inkling that Sauces available or even 17 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:43,600 Speaker 2: potentially going to get traded. I mean, he just signed 18 00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:46,280 Speaker 2: a new contract, so like that. The moment it happened, 19 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:47,839 Speaker 2: it was one of those moments where you're looking at 20 00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:49,280 Speaker 2: the tweets and making sure they're not fake. 21 00:00:50,560 --> 00:00:52,879 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's certainly the case, at least a mind as 22 00:00:52,880 --> 00:00:55,160 Speaker 3: well as Zach and again thanks for joining us on 23 00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:57,960 Speaker 3: the show. So reading through your story this morning, and 24 00:00:58,080 --> 00:01:00,200 Speaker 3: we collabed on a bunch of stuff yesterday. A lot 25 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:03,000 Speaker 3: of Slack messages after that trade went down. But one 26 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 3: of the things you were able to report is that 27 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:09,400 Speaker 3: this was not some last minute approach from the Colts. 28 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:11,960 Speaker 3: This was something that had been working. They had been 29 00:01:11,959 --> 00:01:14,040 Speaker 3: working toward over a number of weeks. So what can 30 00:01:14,080 --> 00:01:17,479 Speaker 3: you tell us about just the process of first reaching 31 00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:19,240 Speaker 3: out to the Jets about Sauce and then getting it 32 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:21,000 Speaker 3: over the finished line to finally get him in the 33 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:21,840 Speaker 3: Colts at uniform. 34 00:01:22,880 --> 00:01:25,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, so, I mean, I think it was more like 35 00:01:25,560 --> 00:01:27,959 Speaker 2: a couple of weeks ago. They just had conversations like 36 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:30,640 Speaker 2: all teams, do you know, the Cults were calling around 37 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:33,600 Speaker 2: the league looking for a corner and they called the 38 00:01:33,680 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 2: Jets to ask them about their corner backs. Not Jets sauce, 39 00:01:36,120 --> 00:01:38,120 Speaker 2: but Sauce was the main part of the conversation. And 40 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:40,320 Speaker 2: the Jets were like, yeah, we're not really training him 41 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:42,480 Speaker 2: unless somebody blows us away with an offer, and the 42 00:01:42,560 --> 00:01:45,600 Speaker 2: Colts were like okay, And then you know, you get 43 00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:48,160 Speaker 2: back to now this week and the Colts call again 44 00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:50,640 Speaker 2: and they start offering a little bit more, and as 45 00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:52,880 Speaker 2: they keep having more conversations, now offer more and more, 46 00:01:52,920 --> 00:01:56,639 Speaker 2: to the point where darreon Moodie the Jets GM couldn't 47 00:01:56,640 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 2: really say no anymore. And you know, they agreed on 48 00:01:59,440 --> 00:02:01,760 Speaker 2: the draft pick, and then Mouji wanted to throw in 49 00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:04,520 Speaker 2: Adi Mitchell. I think he was really high on his potential, 50 00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 2: so you add him into that, and and uh, you know, 51 00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:12,480 Speaker 2: Muji kind of interestingly said in his press conference yesterday 52 00:02:12,520 --> 00:02:14,840 Speaker 2: and this was kind of you could kind of see 53 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:16,079 Speaker 2: it at the time, but I didn't think they would 54 00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 2: train him right away, but they structured in a way 55 00:02:17,680 --> 00:02:20,919 Speaker 2: that would allow them to trade him if the opportunity arose, essentially, 56 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:23,680 Speaker 2: which is pretty crazy thing to admit, not crazy, but 57 00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:25,720 Speaker 2: pretty interesting thing to admit, because you know, that's the 58 00:02:25,800 --> 00:02:28,360 Speaker 2: star player, and that's someone who you built around, and 59 00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:30,520 Speaker 2: you just announced that your cornerstone a few months ago. 60 00:02:31,000 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 4: Zach, thanks for the time this morning. If we had 61 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 4: this conversation yesterday at nine oh five, and I told 62 00:02:36,639 --> 00:02:39,079 Speaker 4: you saus Gardner was about to get traded, you would 63 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:41,840 Speaker 4: have thought the compensation. Compensation would have looked like what. 64 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:46,920 Speaker 2: Man, That's a good question. Multiple firsts, for sure, like 65 00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 2: that's what I would have thought, like that, Yeah, yeah, 66 00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:53,720 Speaker 2: probably yeah, I mean, I but it's hard for me 67 00:02:53,760 --> 00:02:55,360 Speaker 2: to even answer that because I just like, it wasn't 68 00:02:55,400 --> 00:02:58,800 Speaker 2: a thing not even considered. So, you know, like if 69 00:02:58,840 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 2: you asked me like the same question about Garrett Wilson 70 00:03:01,520 --> 00:03:03,040 Speaker 2: right now, I don't know that i'd have a good answer. 71 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 2: Probably two first three first in a player or something 72 00:03:05,919 --> 00:03:08,400 Speaker 2: like something crazy like that. So you know, it's rare 73 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:11,040 Speaker 2: that non quarterbacks get traded for multiple firsts. It takes 74 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:13,920 Speaker 2: a really special player. I do think Sauce is maybe 75 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:16,240 Speaker 2: better than some of the perception that's gotten out about 76 00:03:16,280 --> 00:03:18,560 Speaker 2: him at this point. He is a flawed player, like 77 00:03:18,560 --> 00:03:21,760 Speaker 2: he's not Patrick Sartan, but I think he's been one of, 78 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 2: if not the top five best corners in the NFL 79 00:03:24,639 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 2: over the last five years. 80 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:27,880 Speaker 4: So could you delve a little bit deeper into that? 81 00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:29,960 Speaker 4: And I hate to throw out letter grades, but I 82 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:31,600 Speaker 4: am a son of two teachers, so I tend to 83 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:33,680 Speaker 4: kind of do that. You know, maybe early in his 84 00:03:33,680 --> 00:03:35,680 Speaker 4: career he was what a plus type of player, and 85 00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:37,680 Speaker 4: maybe I don't know, this year, it's you know, a 86 00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:41,040 Speaker 4: minus B plus if you want to get super technical, 87 00:03:41,120 --> 00:03:43,560 Speaker 4: there and also could you hit on the how much 88 00:03:43,640 --> 00:03:46,280 Speaker 4: shadowing did he do for you know, a variety of 89 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:47,320 Speaker 4: defenses he played for. 90 00:03:48,400 --> 00:03:51,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, so I'll answer the second part first. You know, 91 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:54,920 Speaker 2: with the Robert Solid defense, they had their guys staying 92 00:03:54,960 --> 00:03:56,880 Speaker 2: on their sides, so they had Sas Gardner on one side, 93 00:03:56,920 --> 00:03:58,480 Speaker 2: d d Red on the other. And he almost never 94 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:01,040 Speaker 2: traveled with this new THEE he was traveling a little 95 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 2: bit more and still wasn't like one hundred percent of 96 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:04,640 Speaker 2: the time, but he was traveling and he was doing 97 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:07,240 Speaker 2: a pretty good job of it. And then oh, you 98 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:10,520 Speaker 2: asked about like the grades, so I'd say, yeah, A plus. 99 00:04:10,520 --> 00:04:11,960 Speaker 2: The first two years, I mean, in all pro, your 100 00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:14,120 Speaker 2: first year is in the NFL, is is pretty crazy. 101 00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:16,720 Speaker 2: And I think in retrospect, Jets fans, in realistes spoiler, 102 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:19,320 Speaker 2: they were And what that did was it raised the expectations. 103 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:21,560 Speaker 2: So the last two years, where I'd say he was 104 00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:25,400 Speaker 2: a BB plus, probably they thought that he was bad 105 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:27,919 Speaker 2: and that was not the case. The reality of Sauce 106 00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:31,559 Speaker 2: is like fans, not only Jets fans, but especially Jets fans, 107 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:33,680 Speaker 2: focused on the things that he doesn't do, which is 108 00:04:33,720 --> 00:04:36,520 Speaker 2: he doesn't really get interceptions and he hasn't historically have 109 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 2: been a great tackler, but they don't focus on the 110 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:42,080 Speaker 2: thing that he does do, which is keep the receiver 111 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:43,720 Speaker 2: from catching the ball, and he does it as well 112 00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:46,680 Speaker 2: as anybody in the NFL. Quarterbacks do not throw it 113 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:48,600 Speaker 2: in his direction, which is why it harder for him 114 00:04:48,640 --> 00:04:50,479 Speaker 2: to get picked a lot of times, because you know, 115 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:53,839 Speaker 2: I think he think he averages it a catch against 116 00:04:53,880 --> 00:04:57,719 Speaker 2: him every twenty snaps, which is the best rate in 117 00:04:57,720 --> 00:04:59,600 Speaker 2: the NFL in terms of like how how rarely he 118 00:04:59,640 --> 00:05:01,960 Speaker 2: gives up catch and in terms of targets, he's like 119 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:04,719 Speaker 2: top ten this year as well. So quarterbacks don't throw 120 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:07,240 Speaker 2: it in his direction. And you know, when the Colts 121 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:09,240 Speaker 2: get healthy and they have trevarious awards, it's gonna be 122 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 2: very interesting to see how that goes. Zach. 123 00:05:12,839 --> 00:05:14,719 Speaker 3: I'm sure you haven't been able to catch up with 124 00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:16,880 Speaker 3: Sauce just yet, and I'll probably do it on my 125 00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:20,359 Speaker 3: end here if he's available today in Indianapolis. But do 126 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:22,600 Speaker 3: you get the sense that he even thought that was 127 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:25,120 Speaker 3: a possibility on his end or that he was open 128 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 3: to that idea. I know he tweeted about, you know, 129 00:05:27,400 --> 00:05:29,960 Speaker 3: all love to New York, but it is quite the 130 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:33,200 Speaker 3: flip from you know, a couple months ago being the 131 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:36,320 Speaker 3: highest paid, richest contract in cornerback history. 132 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:39,599 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know when I understand he did not see 133 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:41,160 Speaker 2: it coming at all. I don't think it was something 134 00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:45,200 Speaker 2: that was really broached to him at all. But I 135 00:05:45,200 --> 00:05:47,719 Speaker 2: think he'll take it in stride. I think he's somebody 136 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:51,800 Speaker 2: that is highly motivated already anyway. He's somebody who has 137 00:05:51,839 --> 00:05:53,360 Speaker 2: been taking a lot of the losing that he's had 138 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:56,760 Speaker 2: to deal with pretty bad. And I imagine that he's 139 00:05:57,000 --> 00:05:58,719 Speaker 2: as he sits down and thinks about what's going on 140 00:05:58,760 --> 00:06:01,520 Speaker 2: in Indianapolis and how good they are right now, Like, 141 00:06:01,560 --> 00:06:03,160 Speaker 2: he hasn't been on a team with this kind of record. 142 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:04,839 Speaker 2: The best the Jets were with him were six and 143 00:06:04,880 --> 00:06:07,120 Speaker 2: three to start the twenty twenty two season, and then 144 00:06:07,120 --> 00:06:10,280 Speaker 2: they won seven games that whole season. So I imagine he's 145 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:12,520 Speaker 2: pretty excited for the opportunity to play meeting for football 146 00:06:12,520 --> 00:06:13,320 Speaker 2: at this time of the year. 147 00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:17,080 Speaker 4: A flight Plan that is a podcast listened to last 148 00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 4: night was Zach Rosenblatt from The Athletic. He joins us here, Zach, 149 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:22,600 Speaker 4: I thought I heard you, and if I misheard you, 150 00:06:22,839 --> 00:06:24,599 Speaker 4: I don't know, blame it on my dumb brain. But 151 00:06:24,839 --> 00:06:27,400 Speaker 4: did you say at some point this offseason you went 152 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:29,080 Speaker 4: to Detroit to do a little bit more of a 153 00:06:29,080 --> 00:06:30,400 Speaker 4: future story on Sauce. 154 00:06:31,360 --> 00:06:33,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, I shared, did it. So I went to Detroit. 155 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:35,400 Speaker 2: The main goal was to do in Aaron Glenn story, 156 00:06:35,440 --> 00:06:37,000 Speaker 2: which I did, but while I was there, I wanted 157 00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:39,200 Speaker 2: to also dig into Sauce in his background. I went 158 00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:41,120 Speaker 2: to his high school. I walked through the school with 159 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:43,400 Speaker 2: the AD. I talked to his coach. I talked to, 160 00:06:44,360 --> 00:06:46,440 Speaker 2: you know, one of his old teammates. Like I was 161 00:06:46,440 --> 00:06:48,280 Speaker 2: getting ready to do it. I focused on Aaron Glenn 162 00:06:48,320 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 2: won the lead end of the season, and my plan 163 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:52,480 Speaker 2: was to write the Sauce story early in the season 164 00:06:52,520 --> 00:06:54,840 Speaker 2: after a win. And so, as you can imagine, the 165 00:06:54,920 --> 00:06:56,840 Speaker 2: Jets just got the first win a few days ago 166 00:06:57,880 --> 00:07:00,320 Speaker 2: and Sauce wasn't even playing. So I just like have 167 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:02,440 Speaker 2: not had the opportunity to write it. And then, you know, 168 00:07:02,480 --> 00:07:04,800 Speaker 2: as it happens in this job, sometimes you put a 169 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:07,799 Speaker 2: lot of work into something and then you know, events 170 00:07:07,839 --> 00:07:10,240 Speaker 2: happen that keep you from me able to pursue it. 171 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 2: But maybe I'll write it down the line. If the 172 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:13,640 Speaker 2: if the Colts ca on like a Super Bowl run. 173 00:07:13,600 --> 00:07:16,760 Speaker 4: This year, maybe a snippet of your boots on the 174 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:19,960 Speaker 4: ground reporting I selfishly, I love to see Sauce Gardner 175 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:21,760 Speaker 4: now all of a sudden obsessed with the game of golf. 176 00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:23,880 Speaker 4: But I'm sure you your boots on the ground led 177 00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:24,800 Speaker 4: to some other things there. 178 00:07:25,480 --> 00:07:27,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, so I'd said. The funny thing about him was, 179 00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:28,720 Speaker 2: you know, he's a guy that they had him at 180 00:07:28,760 --> 00:07:31,080 Speaker 2: receiver in early in high school and he was like 181 00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:34,440 Speaker 2: buried on the depth chart. They had a cornerback that 182 00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:38,000 Speaker 2: like got injured, and you know, I have desperation. They're like, 183 00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:40,080 Speaker 2: maybe we should just try Sauce there. They throw him 184 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:42,360 Speaker 2: out there. He like dominates that game and he never 185 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:44,560 Speaker 2: looks back. And one of his coaches told me that, 186 00:07:44,640 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 2: like before that it happened like he has all these 187 00:07:46,400 --> 00:07:49,880 Speaker 2: old dms on Twitter from Sauce where Sauce is like, coach, 188 00:07:49,880 --> 00:07:51,200 Speaker 2: I think you should play me, like I think I'm 189 00:07:51,200 --> 00:07:53,080 Speaker 2: pretty good. I think your guys are making mistake not 190 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:55,120 Speaker 2: playing me. Like he had the confidence like that, the 191 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:57,480 Speaker 2: coach said, he like he had confidence before he even 192 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:00,280 Speaker 2: had the skills necessarily, Like he just believed in self 193 00:08:00,360 --> 00:08:02,520 Speaker 2: completely from the beginning, and and then you know he 194 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:04,120 Speaker 2: was he was off for the race when he got Cincinnati, 195 00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:05,760 Speaker 2: I don't even think you ever let up a touchdown. 196 00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:07,960 Speaker 2: And and yeah, you know, he's a guy that you 197 00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:10,120 Speaker 2: guys are gonna love there in that lot, especially the 198 00:08:10,160 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 2: media for the locker room wise, the fans will like 199 00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:15,680 Speaker 2: him until they get mad about him by any interceptions, 200 00:08:15,720 --> 00:08:17,480 Speaker 2: I guess, like Jets fans, I'm. 201 00:08:17,280 --> 00:08:19,160 Speaker 1: Just curious before we let you go Zach Is as 202 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:21,560 Speaker 1: a follower of the NFL day in, day out and 203 00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 1: an objective guy, how are the Colts viewed right now? 204 00:08:26,720 --> 00:08:29,200 Speaker 2: That's a good question. I you know, I think they 205 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:31,400 Speaker 2: were kind of a laughing stop going into the season. 206 00:08:31,440 --> 00:08:34,439 Speaker 2: It felt like and you know, you you bank on 207 00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 2: Daniel Jones. And but I think the reaction I've heard 208 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:40,120 Speaker 2: just you know, listening to podcasts about trades and and 209 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:42,600 Speaker 2: kind of just you know, canvassing Twitter, I'd say outside 210 00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:45,080 Speaker 2: of Indianapolis, I think they're getting pretty criticized for this 211 00:08:45,160 --> 00:08:47,959 Speaker 2: deal because what they're what they're doing, and it's a 212 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:51,400 Speaker 2: statement that they believe in Daniel Jones, and you know 213 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:54,640 Speaker 2: it's a risky proposition, as the Giants saw. So I 214 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:57,079 Speaker 2: think they're getting criticism for that. But the Colts believe 215 00:08:57,120 --> 00:08:59,440 Speaker 2: in what they have there. You know, they're whatever, what 216 00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:02,400 Speaker 2: are they seven too? And just field like a team 217 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:04,400 Speaker 2: that can go on a run. So I don't blame 218 00:09:04,440 --> 00:09:06,280 Speaker 2: them for doing it, especially because I personally am pretty 219 00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:07,280 Speaker 2: high on Sus Gardner. 220 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:10,240 Speaker 1: Well, thanks for stopping by. We again appreciate your time 221 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:13,240 Speaker 1: and your insights, and we will run into you down 222 00:09:13,280 --> 00:09:15,440 Speaker 1: the road. As they say, have a good one, yeah 223 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 1: you two guys.