1 00:00:09,093 --> 00:00:11,973 Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talks at B. 2 00:00:12,373 --> 00:00:17,013 Speaker 1: Follow this and our Wide Ranger podcasts now on iHeartRadio. 3 00:00:19,333 --> 00:00:31,293 Speaker 2: Straight down the Middle, Get inside the game from Every 4 00:00:31,373 --> 00:00:31,733 Speaker 2: end Goal. 5 00:00:32,173 --> 00:00:36,173 Speaker 1: It's Rugby Direct with Elliott Smith and Liam Napier powered 6 00:00:36,173 --> 00:00:37,133 Speaker 1: by News Talks EDB. 7 00:00:37,653 --> 00:00:40,133 Speaker 3: Welcome in to Rugby Direct powered by Habit Health Physio 8 00:00:40,133 --> 00:00:43,853 Speaker 3: book today and Stay in the Game podcast number two 9 00:00:44,053 --> 00:00:47,533 Speaker 3: of Rugby Direct Today Elliott Smith and by popular demand, 10 00:00:47,613 --> 00:00:50,173 Speaker 3: We've had letters, We actually have had letters demanding Liam 11 00:00:50,293 --> 00:00:53,453 Speaker 3: Napier return to the podcast on this day of all days, 12 00:00:53,453 --> 00:00:56,653 Speaker 3: as Dave Rennie is an Ounstall Blacks coach. Liam Napier 13 00:00:56,933 --> 00:00:59,653 Speaker 3: returns to Rugby Direct. Then you, as you label yourself 14 00:00:59,653 --> 00:01:01,213 Speaker 3: before Bionic. 15 00:01:00,813 --> 00:01:05,133 Speaker 4: Man, that's right, Elliott's. I couldn't miss such a big day. 16 00:01:06,053 --> 00:01:09,493 Speaker 4: I wouldn't say come from the hospital bed, but shall 17 00:01:09,493 --> 00:01:11,333 Speaker 4: we stay new and improved back? 18 00:01:11,893 --> 00:01:13,773 Speaker 3: Good to have you back. Well, let's start with us. 19 00:01:13,813 --> 00:01:17,573 Speaker 3: Your reaction even before the media conference to Dave Rennie 20 00:01:17,573 --> 00:01:20,173 Speaker 3: being confirmed as the All Blacks head coach. 21 00:01:21,613 --> 00:01:22,613 Speaker 5: Look for me, Elliott's. 22 00:01:22,693 --> 00:01:25,453 Speaker 4: I think it's the right call and I think from 23 00:01:25,533 --> 00:01:28,813 Speaker 4: my perspective, it's an easy decision. I felt from the 24 00:01:28,813 --> 00:01:32,013 Speaker 4: outset that Dave Rennie was the compelling candidate. That's not 25 00:01:32,053 --> 00:01:34,333 Speaker 4: to say it's going to be easy for him. It's 26 00:01:34,333 --> 00:01:36,253 Speaker 4: going to be a pretty tough variety. He's got what 27 00:01:36,493 --> 00:01:40,213 Speaker 4: four months before the first test, five months before going 28 00:01:40,253 --> 00:01:42,653 Speaker 4: to South Africa, in fifteen months before the World Cup, 29 00:01:42,733 --> 00:01:48,693 Speaker 4: so it's a really tough scenario there. And look, Jamie 30 00:01:48,773 --> 00:01:54,133 Speaker 4: Joseph had credentials, but I just I feel like Joseph 31 00:01:54,173 --> 00:01:57,413 Speaker 4: not having Tony Brown with him was a major blow 32 00:01:57,573 --> 00:02:01,333 Speaker 4: for his credentials. And also when we go through and 33 00:02:01,333 --> 00:02:03,813 Speaker 4: look at their respective coaching teams, I think Joseph was 34 00:02:03,813 --> 00:02:07,333 Speaker 4: looking at retaining a lot of Scott Robertson's assistance and 35 00:02:07,373 --> 00:02:09,453 Speaker 4: I didn't really like the sound of that as well. 36 00:02:09,533 --> 00:02:11,853 Speaker 4: So on the face of it, I think they've been 37 00:02:11,893 --> 00:02:14,333 Speaker 4: through a thorough process. They went up to Japan, they 38 00:02:14,333 --> 00:02:17,893 Speaker 4: went to Dunedin, they spoke to a number of different references, 39 00:02:18,013 --> 00:02:21,293 Speaker 4: they had three four hour long in person interviews. 40 00:02:21,613 --> 00:02:23,253 Speaker 5: So I don't think you can knock the process. 41 00:02:23,413 --> 00:02:26,733 Speaker 4: Maybe you would have wanted more candidates involved, the likes 42 00:02:26,733 --> 00:02:30,133 Speaker 4: of Joe Schmidt, but the way things are boiled down, 43 00:02:30,333 --> 00:02:33,333 Speaker 4: I think Dave Renni is the best possible candidate in 44 00:02:33,373 --> 00:02:34,173 Speaker 4: the circumstance. 45 00:02:34,893 --> 00:02:39,893 Speaker 3: The culture that Dave Rennie brings to an organization, he 46 00:02:40,013 --> 00:02:43,093 Speaker 3: was famous for it at the Chiefs around what he 47 00:02:43,173 --> 00:02:46,133 Speaker 3: was able to tap into the Malti culture and the 48 00:02:46,173 --> 00:02:49,973 Speaker 3: Waiktau and linking that all back together and won them 49 00:02:50,013 --> 00:02:52,373 Speaker 3: a couple of titles in twenty twelve and twenty thirteen, 50 00:02:52,453 --> 00:02:54,973 Speaker 3: and they were there or thereabouts and the other years 51 00:02:55,013 --> 00:02:57,453 Speaker 3: as well. From what I understand, the Wallabies had a 52 00:02:57,493 --> 00:03:00,973 Speaker 3: really strong culture under him as well. How much do 53 00:03:01,013 --> 00:03:03,653 Speaker 3: you think that played a key part in terms of 54 00:03:04,293 --> 00:03:06,773 Speaker 3: he's got an eighteen month window through to the Rugby 55 00:03:06,813 --> 00:03:09,893 Speaker 3: World Cup next year, getting a culture in place quickly 56 00:03:10,773 --> 00:03:13,133 Speaker 3: and being able to get you know, where this team 57 00:03:13,133 --> 00:03:14,653 Speaker 3: needs to be from a culture perspective. 58 00:03:15,573 --> 00:03:18,173 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's certainly a major factor. Look, culture's 59 00:03:18,373 --> 00:03:21,973 Speaker 4: an interesting concept, doesn't it. It's intangible and when you 60 00:03:22,013 --> 00:03:25,573 Speaker 4: look at Scott Robertson's rise to the All Blacks, he 61 00:03:25,733 --> 00:03:28,453 Speaker 4: was by and large sort of tagged as a bit 62 00:03:28,453 --> 00:03:31,613 Speaker 4: of a culture coach, but couldn't carry that from the 63 00:03:31,653 --> 00:03:34,813 Speaker 4: Crusaders through to the All Blacks. That that was a 64 00:03:34,893 --> 00:03:37,973 Speaker 4: real downfall of his Dave Rennie, as you mentioned, has 65 00:03:38,013 --> 00:03:41,893 Speaker 4: done a great job of it everywhere. He's been tapping 66 00:03:41,893 --> 00:03:46,053 Speaker 4: into that mouldiedom at the Chiefs, making the players help 67 00:03:46,533 --> 00:03:49,573 Speaker 4: build their training base, all those sort of skin in 68 00:03:49,613 --> 00:03:52,093 Speaker 4: the game purpose and meaning. 69 00:03:52,253 --> 00:03:52,973 Speaker 5: He took a lot of. 70 00:03:52,893 --> 00:03:56,573 Speaker 4: That from Dave, from Wayne Smith as well, So I 71 00:03:56,573 --> 00:03:59,213 Speaker 4: think he's learned from a lot of different coaches along 72 00:03:59,253 --> 00:04:03,613 Speaker 4: the way. I think Renie's got very good relationships both 73 00:04:03,653 --> 00:04:08,573 Speaker 4: with players and coaches. He has built on that over time, 74 00:04:08,693 --> 00:04:10,693 Speaker 4: and you touched on it there with the Wallabies, even 75 00:04:10,693 --> 00:04:14,373 Speaker 4: when he was ousked by Hamish mcclennan for Eddie Jones, 76 00:04:14,533 --> 00:04:17,293 Speaker 4: which was a complete train wreck. So many of those 77 00:04:17,333 --> 00:04:19,853 Speaker 4: senior Wallabies spoke out in favor of Rennie and what 78 00:04:19,973 --> 00:04:23,293 Speaker 4: he was building and the build up to that World 79 00:04:23,333 --> 00:04:26,453 Speaker 4: Cup and that they were really annoyed that he had 80 00:04:26,493 --> 00:04:29,733 Speaker 4: been let go. So I think he's really popular among players, 81 00:04:29,893 --> 00:04:32,613 Speaker 4: and I think, look, I think this All Black team 82 00:04:32,693 --> 00:04:34,773 Speaker 4: does need to be brought together. It does need a 83 00:04:34,773 --> 00:04:37,213 Speaker 4: bit of a reset. It needs to get everyone on 84 00:04:37,253 --> 00:04:40,973 Speaker 4: the same page. It needs alignments, and I think Dave 85 00:04:41,013 --> 00:04:45,333 Speaker 4: Rennie has shown throughout his coaching career and a track 86 00:04:45,413 --> 00:04:48,093 Speaker 4: record I've been able to do that. But the All 87 00:04:48,133 --> 00:04:50,373 Speaker 4: Blacks that are a completely different beast, aren't they. The 88 00:04:50,413 --> 00:04:53,733 Speaker 4: pressure of the expectation, the scrutiny, the schedule, with what's 89 00:04:53,773 --> 00:04:56,653 Speaker 4: to come this year, it's going to be a tough ask. 90 00:04:57,133 --> 00:05:01,293 Speaker 3: Indeed it is, Jamie. Joseph was being tagged and I 91 00:05:01,293 --> 00:05:03,813 Speaker 3: think this has gone around this, you know, the Raby 92 00:05:03,813 --> 00:05:06,733 Speaker 3: circles a bit, you know, being a little too old school. 93 00:05:06,733 --> 00:05:09,413 Speaker 3: Do you think that hurt him in the sphere of 94 00:05:09,453 --> 00:05:10,973 Speaker 3: the all Blacks appointment panel. 95 00:05:12,213 --> 00:05:14,693 Speaker 4: I think some things that would have come through, depending 96 00:05:14,733 --> 00:05:18,373 Speaker 4: on who that panel spoke to, would have been some 97 00:05:18,533 --> 00:05:21,893 Speaker 4: things about the way he tuned through some assistant coaches. 98 00:05:22,373 --> 00:05:25,173 Speaker 4: There's been a string leave the handas in recent times 99 00:05:25,653 --> 00:05:28,533 Speaker 4: my understanding, as he approached a number of different assistant 100 00:05:28,573 --> 00:05:32,093 Speaker 4: coaches to join him in this all blackbird Kenny Lynn, 101 00:05:32,133 --> 00:05:36,173 Speaker 4: who's now with the Pumas, was one Ian foster, Joe Schmidt, 102 00:05:36,213 --> 00:05:39,653 Speaker 4: Tony Brown, and I think they all decline for various reasons. 103 00:05:40,613 --> 00:05:43,973 Speaker 4: I think that probably potentially hurt his cause as well. 104 00:05:44,693 --> 00:05:47,733 Speaker 4: I just think Joseph needs Tony Brown as that foil. 105 00:05:47,853 --> 00:05:48,013 Speaker 5: You know. 106 00:05:48,053 --> 00:05:51,493 Speaker 4: He's that old school, as you mentioned, tough task master, 107 00:05:51,893 --> 00:05:54,893 Speaker 4: he doesn't take any shit. He runs players really hard 108 00:05:54,893 --> 00:05:58,453 Speaker 4: in trainings, where Tony Brown is that softer foil, he 109 00:05:58,533 --> 00:06:03,653 Speaker 4: connects better with players, He's you know, a traditional assistant 110 00:06:03,653 --> 00:06:07,653 Speaker 4: in that regard. So I just didn't see Tony Brown, 111 00:06:08,013 --> 00:06:13,653 Speaker 4: sorry Jamie Joseph having that balance in his coaching. And 112 00:06:14,853 --> 00:06:17,213 Speaker 4: I think also the fact that while it didn't go 113 00:06:17,253 --> 00:06:21,213 Speaker 4: well from Renny has coached a Tier one international team 114 00:06:21,253 --> 00:06:24,653 Speaker 4: in the Wallabies, where Joseph had Japan, and while they 115 00:06:24,653 --> 00:06:29,213 Speaker 4: had success as a different kettle of fish, isn't it 116 00:06:29,253 --> 00:06:33,213 Speaker 4: in terms of expectations on week to week and having 117 00:06:33,253 --> 00:06:35,013 Speaker 4: to regularly beat Tier one opposition. 118 00:06:35,653 --> 00:06:40,533 Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, the pressures on and there's more media scrutiny, 119 00:06:40,653 --> 00:06:44,773 Speaker 3: there's more questions coming with a Tier one nation, and 120 00:06:45,053 --> 00:06:47,013 Speaker 3: you know he dealt with adversity as well in that 121 00:06:47,053 --> 00:06:49,253 Speaker 3: Wallaby's I know people will talk about the winning record 122 00:06:49,333 --> 00:06:51,413 Speaker 3: and I think it was thirty eight percent roughly, But 123 00:06:52,173 --> 00:06:53,893 Speaker 3: not to give him a pass necessarily, but you're going 124 00:06:53,933 --> 00:06:55,773 Speaker 3: to remember that first year was in COVID times. They 125 00:06:55,773 --> 00:06:58,813 Speaker 3: played the All Blacks four times in that first year. 126 00:06:58,813 --> 00:07:01,933 Speaker 3: They won one of those tests and probably should have 127 00:07:01,973 --> 00:07:05,133 Speaker 3: won two. That first Test in Wellington that year. He 128 00:07:05,133 --> 00:07:07,253 Speaker 3: had some wins over the spring Box there are a 129 00:07:07,293 --> 00:07:10,693 Speaker 3: couple of black marks. The lost to Italy along the way, 130 00:07:10,933 --> 00:07:13,293 Speaker 3: which is a you know, absolutely no no for the 131 00:07:13,293 --> 00:07:16,333 Speaker 3: the All Blacks going forward, but you know, it felt 132 00:07:16,333 --> 00:07:19,253 Speaker 3: like the Wallabies were on upwards trajectory by and large, 133 00:07:19,293 --> 00:07:22,053 Speaker 3: barring the Italy game heading into twenty three. The carpa 134 00:07:22,093 --> 00:07:24,213 Speaker 3: gets pulled out from underneath him and he has to 135 00:07:24,253 --> 00:07:27,213 Speaker 3: go elsewhere. How much do you think that the Kobe 136 00:07:27,693 --> 00:07:31,453 Speaker 3: role over the last couple of years has helped reinvent 137 00:07:31,573 --> 00:07:34,293 Speaker 3: him a little bit? I'm sure obviously obviously, you know, 138 00:07:34,333 --> 00:07:37,413 Speaker 3: we've talked about the members of the coaching panel go 139 00:07:37,493 --> 00:07:40,013 Speaker 3: over and observe him in Kobe, but he's also worked 140 00:07:40,013 --> 00:07:43,613 Speaker 3: with Ardie Savia, he's with Brodie Retallic, and I'm sure 141 00:07:44,173 --> 00:07:46,653 Speaker 3: that their comments haven't been lost on the you know, 142 00:07:46,693 --> 00:07:50,413 Speaker 3: the appointment panel around what they've dealt with at that. 143 00:07:50,453 --> 00:07:52,813 Speaker 5: Club he touched on before. 144 00:07:52,853 --> 00:07:55,813 Speaker 4: I guess that Rennie's popularity among players, and I think 145 00:07:56,493 --> 00:07:59,213 Speaker 4: those players, along with Antonina Brown, who's also at Kobe, 146 00:07:59,253 --> 00:08:03,933 Speaker 4: would have spoke very highly of Dave Renni. I don't 147 00:08:03,933 --> 00:08:07,973 Speaker 4: know if necessarily coaching in Japan helps your cause, but 148 00:08:08,013 --> 00:08:10,973 Speaker 4: the fact that he has been offshore for nine years. 149 00:08:11,333 --> 00:08:15,453 Speaker 4: He's been to Scotland's had success with Glasgow, took them 150 00:08:15,493 --> 00:08:17,653 Speaker 4: to I think it was the Pro fourteen at that 151 00:08:17,733 --> 00:08:21,893 Speaker 4: time finals, been to Australia, been to Japan and then 152 00:08:21,933 --> 00:08:25,253 Speaker 4: new factor in that the experience in New Zealand's coaching 153 00:08:25,293 --> 00:08:29,213 Speaker 4: Wellington to the provincial title back in two thousand, taking 154 00:08:29,253 --> 00:08:30,413 Speaker 4: one or two from real. 155 00:08:30,293 --> 00:08:33,733 Speaker 5: Salad Dwellers to quite a competitive. 156 00:08:33,533 --> 00:08:36,933 Speaker 4: Provincial team, having great success with the New Zealand twenties 157 00:08:37,693 --> 00:08:41,293 Speaker 4: going to the Chiefs. So when you pull all that together, 158 00:08:41,573 --> 00:08:45,733 Speaker 4: it is quite a compelling track record. Where Joseph has 159 00:08:45,813 --> 00:08:49,093 Speaker 4: largely been with the Highlanders, Japan, he had a bit 160 00:08:49,133 --> 00:08:50,973 Speaker 4: of time with Wellington and New Zealand, Maldi and the 161 00:08:50,973 --> 00:08:55,693 Speaker 4: All Blacks fifteen, but it doesn't quite stack up in 162 00:08:55,773 --> 00:08:59,413 Speaker 4: terms of international the breeks of experience that Rennie's had 163 00:08:59,573 --> 00:09:03,053 Speaker 4: and the contrasting experiences, and I think you'll see that 164 00:09:03,093 --> 00:09:07,693 Speaker 4: come through potentially with Renie's favored coaching team and the 165 00:09:07,733 --> 00:09:10,653 Speaker 4: way he played the game, and it has views on 166 00:09:10,813 --> 00:09:13,173 Speaker 4: how to approach it there and interestingly you touch on 167 00:09:13,213 --> 00:09:14,453 Speaker 4: the springbox there, Elliott. 168 00:09:14,613 --> 00:09:16,773 Speaker 5: I think I don't know how much can you read 169 00:09:16,813 --> 00:09:17,133 Speaker 5: into this. 170 00:09:17,253 --> 00:09:19,693 Speaker 4: It's going to be trumped up and mentioned a lot 171 00:09:19,733 --> 00:09:23,533 Speaker 4: between now and the South African Tour. Rennie's record against Russia, 172 00:09:23,613 --> 00:09:28,213 Speaker 4: Rasmus's Russi, Raustmus's spring Box, He's sitting at seventy five percent. 173 00:09:28,533 --> 00:09:30,773 Speaker 4: How relevant is that when he steps into the all 174 00:09:30,813 --> 00:09:32,453 Speaker 4: Black skeg that was with the Wallabies. 175 00:09:32,853 --> 00:09:34,653 Speaker 3: Well, I think it's it's going to be mentioned, isn't 176 00:09:34,693 --> 00:09:37,933 Speaker 3: it at nauseum until that first test? When is it 177 00:09:38,413 --> 00:09:41,453 Speaker 3: late August between these two sides. I think it's about 178 00:09:41,453 --> 00:09:43,653 Speaker 3: the twenty first of August that that stat is going 179 00:09:43,693 --> 00:09:46,893 Speaker 3: to be mentioned on and on. I think it's valuable. 180 00:09:46,933 --> 00:09:50,493 Speaker 3: He's clearly found some secret source there. But it has 181 00:09:50,533 --> 00:09:52,213 Speaker 3: been a few years removed. You know that the spring 182 00:09:52,213 --> 00:09:55,693 Speaker 3: Box are a different team since they last played against 183 00:09:55,733 --> 00:09:58,133 Speaker 3: the Wallabies under Dave Rennie in twenty twenty two. I mean, 184 00:09:58,173 --> 00:10:00,653 Speaker 3: what four years removes since the end, I've added another 185 00:10:00,693 --> 00:10:03,573 Speaker 3: World Cup into the cabinet, They've got a new team, 186 00:10:03,613 --> 00:10:05,933 Speaker 3: They've got various other players. So I don't know that 187 00:10:06,013 --> 00:10:08,533 Speaker 3: you can read too much into it. I think it's 188 00:10:08,533 --> 00:10:11,133 Speaker 3: an encouraging stat, but you know, I think the spring 189 00:10:11,173 --> 00:10:13,853 Speaker 3: Walks have certainly changed since then. I want to get 190 00:10:13,853 --> 00:10:15,693 Speaker 3: on the media conference shortly in what you took out 191 00:10:15,693 --> 00:10:18,293 Speaker 3: of that when we were both there earlier in the 192 00:10:18,413 --> 00:10:22,133 Speaker 3: day as Dave Rennie and David Kirk fronted media. But 193 00:10:22,373 --> 00:10:25,053 Speaker 3: just going back to Dave Rennie's work with the Chiefs 194 00:10:25,133 --> 00:10:27,693 Speaker 3: and what stood out to me earlier in the day 195 00:10:27,813 --> 00:10:30,173 Speaker 3: is just looking, you know, back on Wikipedia and back 196 00:10:30,213 --> 00:10:33,013 Speaker 3: on the stats around the team for that final in 197 00:10:33,093 --> 00:10:35,613 Speaker 3: twenty twelve when they beat the Sharks, and some players 198 00:10:35,653 --> 00:10:38,173 Speaker 3: went on to hire honors after that, but Brady Retalick 199 00:10:38,173 --> 00:10:40,893 Speaker 3: hadn't made as All Black's debut at that point. Aaron 200 00:10:40,973 --> 00:10:43,853 Speaker 3: Cruden played a World Cup you know, semi final the 201 00:10:43,893 --> 00:10:45,453 Speaker 3: previous year, but it was his first year at the 202 00:10:45,533 --> 00:10:48,693 Speaker 3: Chiefs and hadn't properly established himself as an All Black. 203 00:10:49,253 --> 00:10:51,213 Speaker 3: You know, Sonny Williams in the midfield there, but you know, 204 00:10:51,213 --> 00:10:56,573 Speaker 3: players like Andrew Horror, Robbie Robinson, Assilia, Tom Craig Clark 205 00:10:56,933 --> 00:10:59,933 Speaker 3: in the twenty three these aren't with all due respect 206 00:10:59,933 --> 00:11:02,013 Speaker 3: to these guys, these aren't you know, greats of the 207 00:11:02,013 --> 00:11:04,133 Speaker 3: game that have gone on, you know, to become great 208 00:11:04,133 --> 00:11:07,893 Speaker 3: All Blacks. These are solid, very very hard working players 209 00:11:07,933 --> 00:11:11,973 Speaker 3: that he probably squeezed every last dropout of rather than 210 00:11:12,013 --> 00:11:13,733 Speaker 3: being you know, all blacks that he got the beast 211 00:11:13,733 --> 00:11:15,173 Speaker 3: out of at super rugby level. 212 00:11:16,293 --> 00:11:16,893 Speaker 5: Absolutely. 213 00:11:16,933 --> 00:11:20,133 Speaker 4: Gareth Anskim was another brought down from the Blues and 214 00:11:20,693 --> 00:11:23,333 Speaker 4: it was a real hallmark of that Chiefs team. You know, 215 00:11:23,373 --> 00:11:25,973 Speaker 4: everyone looks at the Aaron Crudens and the sunny Bill 216 00:11:26,013 --> 00:11:28,573 Speaker 4: Williams and yeah, the headline figures that Rennie brought him, 217 00:11:28,613 --> 00:11:33,213 Speaker 4: but he completely overhauled a team that was coached the 218 00:11:33,253 --> 00:11:35,613 Speaker 4: last two years prior to that by Ian Foster. I 219 00:11:35,613 --> 00:11:39,133 Speaker 4: think they finished tenth and eleventh and Super rugby. Rennie 220 00:11:39,173 --> 00:11:43,053 Speaker 4: comes in alongside Wayne Smith, Tom Coventry and others and 221 00:11:43,133 --> 00:11:46,213 Speaker 4: has a complete clean out and won successive titles. And 222 00:11:46,533 --> 00:11:49,493 Speaker 4: the trademark of those teams, as you mentioned, was he 223 00:11:49,533 --> 00:11:53,013 Speaker 4: went out and selected players largely based on character and 224 00:11:53,093 --> 00:11:55,453 Speaker 4: work great and that's what he looks for. 225 00:11:55,533 --> 00:11:57,933 Speaker 5: And it was very clear and evidence today, wasn't it. 226 00:11:58,013 --> 00:12:01,693 Speaker 4: And Rennie's statements, I thought he was very calm, very 227 00:12:01,693 --> 00:12:04,213 Speaker 4: comfortable in front of the cameras and very clear and 228 00:12:04,253 --> 00:12:07,173 Speaker 4: concise and he said, look, players are going to have 229 00:12:07,213 --> 00:12:09,333 Speaker 4: to earn their place in this team. I don't have 230 00:12:09,373 --> 00:12:12,373 Speaker 4: any loyalties and I don't think that's necessarily true. 231 00:12:12,413 --> 00:12:13,053 Speaker 5: Across the board. 232 00:12:13,053 --> 00:12:15,733 Speaker 4: He's not just going to not select an Artie severe, 233 00:12:16,253 --> 00:12:18,493 Speaker 4: but it's a very strong message to send in your 234 00:12:18,493 --> 00:12:19,693 Speaker 4: first press corrence, isn't it. 235 00:12:19,693 --> 00:12:21,453 Speaker 3: It is? Indeed, let's hear what Dave Rennie had to 236 00:12:21,493 --> 00:12:22,373 Speaker 3: say on that front. 237 00:12:22,613 --> 00:12:27,453 Speaker 6: I guess one of vantage's Yeah, you know, players are 238 00:12:27,453 --> 00:12:29,373 Speaker 6: going to turn the right to wear the jersey. I've 239 00:12:30,253 --> 00:12:31,973 Speaker 6: I've sort of got no law ties. I don't come 240 00:12:32,013 --> 00:12:34,693 Speaker 6: from a team where I've had a lot of these 241 00:12:34,693 --> 00:12:41,413 Speaker 6: guys previously, and so I think that's really exciting. And 242 00:12:41,853 --> 00:12:43,253 Speaker 6: you know, we'll select based. 243 00:12:43,053 --> 00:12:45,773 Speaker 3: On form, select based on form. I think that's encouraging 244 00:12:45,813 --> 00:12:48,893 Speaker 3: their land what he did say around that, because I 245 00:12:48,933 --> 00:12:52,133 Speaker 3: think there has been a tendency to select players that 246 00:12:52,613 --> 00:12:55,493 Speaker 3: either you're comfortable with or have reputations and have been 247 00:12:55,533 --> 00:12:59,013 Speaker 3: around the international game for a number of years. I hope, 248 00:12:59,173 --> 00:13:01,773 Speaker 3: you know, without wanting to disrespect anyone, but I hope 249 00:13:01,773 --> 00:13:03,813 Speaker 3: that Dave Rennie does stick to that and does select 250 00:13:03,893 --> 00:13:06,013 Speaker 3: on forman it is a clean slate, and he looks 251 00:13:06,013 --> 00:13:08,893 Speaker 3: for those hard working players and remodels it into his 252 00:13:08,973 --> 00:13:11,613 Speaker 3: image of wanting those hard working types that are going 253 00:13:11,613 --> 00:13:13,533 Speaker 3: to win test matches for their country. 254 00:13:14,813 --> 00:13:16,613 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's a great message to send, isn't it. 255 00:13:16,653 --> 00:13:20,213 Speaker 4: You've got you're essentially saying no one's safe. Look over 256 00:13:20,253 --> 00:13:24,933 Speaker 4: your shoulder, play well now because nobody's safe, and I 257 00:13:24,933 --> 00:13:28,253 Speaker 4: think that should evoke a rise in everyone. There's so 258 00:13:28,373 --> 00:13:32,613 Speaker 4: many contestable positions within their all Black squads. You've got 259 00:13:32,653 --> 00:13:35,453 Speaker 4: Richard Muwanga coming back, You've got a number of fringe 260 00:13:35,493 --> 00:13:38,693 Speaker 4: guys who could be putting their hands up, and a 261 00:13:38,813 --> 00:13:40,813 Speaker 4: change of coach can have a massive impact. 262 00:13:40,613 --> 00:13:41,653 Speaker 5: On squad selection. 263 00:13:41,853 --> 00:13:45,053 Speaker 4: So it's going to be very intriguing to see how 264 00:13:45,133 --> 00:13:47,493 Speaker 4: quickly Rennie progresses that come July. 265 00:13:48,013 --> 00:13:50,373 Speaker 3: Indeed, it is as you mentioned. I thought he was 266 00:13:50,413 --> 00:13:53,613 Speaker 3: calm and assured at the media conference today. He didn't 267 00:13:53,613 --> 00:13:56,773 Speaker 3: give away too much around the style of rugby that 268 00:13:56,813 --> 00:14:01,133 Speaker 3: he wants to play, necessarily keeping that in his arsenal 269 00:14:01,173 --> 00:14:03,373 Speaker 3: for the time being, but he said he had a 270 00:14:03,413 --> 00:14:05,973 Speaker 3: clear idea around they want you, they wanted to play. So, 271 00:14:06,533 --> 00:14:08,973 Speaker 3: based on what you know about Dave Rennie, what kind 272 00:14:09,013 --> 00:14:13,173 Speaker 3: of style are you expecting from him? He mentioned that 273 00:14:13,253 --> 00:14:15,093 Speaker 3: he's got some ideas around how they can make some 274 00:14:15,613 --> 00:14:18,293 Speaker 3: shifts from what he's seen the last couple of years. 275 00:14:18,333 --> 00:14:20,493 Speaker 3: But what do you expect the Dave Rennie style to 276 00:14:20,573 --> 00:14:22,253 Speaker 3: be for the All Blacks. 277 00:14:23,573 --> 00:14:26,173 Speaker 4: I think if you go back and look at the 278 00:14:26,253 --> 00:14:30,853 Speaker 4: Chiefs in particular, they were very confrontational and competitive around 279 00:14:30,853 --> 00:14:31,333 Speaker 4: the breakdown. 280 00:14:31,373 --> 00:14:33,333 Speaker 5: A lot of teams actually complained. 281 00:14:33,333 --> 00:14:37,533 Speaker 4: About the way they cleared out past the breakdown. So 282 00:14:37,733 --> 00:14:40,893 Speaker 4: they push the boundaries of the law, but very much 283 00:14:41,933 --> 00:14:47,253 Speaker 4: strong Ford orientated set piece, but not necessarily a. 284 00:14:47,293 --> 00:14:48,413 Speaker 5: Huge kicking game. 285 00:14:48,773 --> 00:14:51,893 Speaker 4: And Rennie's teams traditionally are not afraid to have a 286 00:14:51,933 --> 00:14:54,213 Speaker 4: crack from inside their own half, and I think that's 287 00:14:54,333 --> 00:14:57,573 Speaker 4: real contrast for Jamie Joseph. He's more of a territorial 288 00:14:57,653 --> 00:15:00,293 Speaker 4: based coach, doesn't like to play in his own half, 289 00:15:00,453 --> 00:15:03,253 Speaker 4: will use the box kick or tactical kicking quite a lot, 290 00:15:03,773 --> 00:15:06,653 Speaker 4: and then look to play where Rennie's teams are not 291 00:15:06,733 --> 00:15:09,773 Speaker 4: afraid to chance their inside their own forty, inside their 292 00:15:09,773 --> 00:15:11,853 Speaker 4: own twenty two, to use their skills to have a 293 00:15:11,853 --> 00:15:15,173 Speaker 4: real crack and to try and create space. Any traditionally 294 00:15:16,453 --> 00:15:18,813 Speaker 4: as an attacking mind, so I think he will look 295 00:15:18,893 --> 00:15:21,733 Speaker 4: to bring on an attack coach, but that's one of 296 00:15:21,773 --> 00:15:23,773 Speaker 4: his strengths. So I think that's where you could see 297 00:15:23,773 --> 00:15:26,773 Speaker 4: some big shifts from the Saw Black team who do possess. 298 00:15:26,893 --> 00:15:30,493 Speaker 4: Let's be honest, a range of potent athletes that have 299 00:15:30,653 --> 00:15:34,813 Speaker 4: been stuttering in the past eighteen months, haven't they? 300 00:15:35,013 --> 00:15:36,973 Speaker 3: They have, And it was interesting to hear him say 301 00:15:37,013 --> 00:15:40,733 Speaker 3: that he thinks that maybe New Zealanders don't appreciate the 302 00:15:40,853 --> 00:15:43,373 Speaker 3: quality of the rugby being played in the Northern Hemisphere 303 00:15:43,453 --> 00:15:45,493 Speaker 3: and that we've probably been a little bit closed minded 304 00:15:45,533 --> 00:15:48,053 Speaker 3: around the innovation of the game that happens here. And 305 00:15:48,253 --> 00:15:50,493 Speaker 3: we've been beating that Drum and others have as well 306 00:15:50,533 --> 00:15:53,533 Speaker 3: around the fact that New Zealand's been left behind in 307 00:15:53,533 --> 00:15:57,533 Speaker 3: that regard. But he seems more open minded around that 308 00:15:57,653 --> 00:16:00,653 Speaker 3: and how you know, perhaps New Zealand's been left behind 309 00:16:00,693 --> 00:16:04,893 Speaker 3: a little bit around some of those key innovations in rugby. 310 00:16:06,173 --> 00:16:08,733 Speaker 4: Yeah, And I think New Zealanders in general, because of 311 00:16:08,733 --> 00:16:11,013 Speaker 4: the time zone, because of our isolation, we can be 312 00:16:11,493 --> 00:16:13,733 Speaker 4: guilty of being in a bit of a bubble and 313 00:16:13,773 --> 00:16:15,533 Speaker 4: only looking at our own. 314 00:16:15,933 --> 00:16:17,893 Speaker 5: Backyard to a degree, or Australia. 315 00:16:18,333 --> 00:16:20,773 Speaker 4: But you look at the Top fourteen, which we don't 316 00:16:20,813 --> 00:16:23,213 Speaker 4: see a lot of here, there's some brilliant rugby up 317 00:16:23,213 --> 00:16:27,933 Speaker 4: there in the UK as well. Northampton have played a 318 00:16:28,053 --> 00:16:31,733 Speaker 4: very open, expansive style of game in recent years. And 319 00:16:32,173 --> 00:16:34,893 Speaker 4: you know Lens has had great success in Ireland, so 320 00:16:36,053 --> 00:16:39,293 Speaker 4: Renny has experience that hasn't he with his two years 321 00:16:39,293 --> 00:16:42,253 Speaker 4: in Scotland and they think he's taken a lot from that. 322 00:16:42,373 --> 00:16:45,933 Speaker 4: And then even in other aspects of Japan and the Wallabies, 323 00:16:46,213 --> 00:16:49,973 Speaker 4: he's worked with a number of different coaches from around 324 00:16:50,013 --> 00:16:52,613 Speaker 4: the world, so I think that can only benefit him. 325 00:16:53,053 --> 00:16:56,053 Speaker 3: Well, it's touch on that the assistant coaches I said 326 00:16:56,053 --> 00:16:57,733 Speaker 3: before even front of the media that I su to 327 00:16:57,733 --> 00:17:01,973 Speaker 3: speak to. You'll go with players, coaches that he's worked 328 00:17:01,973 --> 00:17:07,133 Speaker 3: with before, from his chiefs environment. You know, he hasn't 329 00:17:07,173 --> 00:17:10,093 Speaker 3: got a lot of times he emphas today to get 330 00:17:10,093 --> 00:17:13,573 Speaker 3: into things. He's still with Kobe until early June. Then 331 00:17:13,693 --> 00:17:15,293 Speaker 3: it's going to be roughly what a month until his 332 00:17:15,333 --> 00:17:17,053 Speaker 3: first test in charge and then you look at the 333 00:17:17,053 --> 00:17:19,133 Speaker 3: bigger picture and its certainly not long to the Rugby 334 00:17:19,173 --> 00:17:21,653 Speaker 3: World Cup. So you can't go in with people that 335 00:17:21,693 --> 00:17:24,893 Speaker 3: you don't trust, are uncertain about. So is he more 336 00:17:25,013 --> 00:17:27,213 Speaker 3: likely do you think Liam to go with the you know, 337 00:17:27,373 --> 00:17:29,893 Speaker 3: the people that he knows well, the assistants that he's 338 00:17:30,173 --> 00:17:32,893 Speaker 3: worked with previously at you know, the number of places 339 00:17:32,893 --> 00:17:33,413 Speaker 3: he's been to. 340 00:17:34,773 --> 00:17:36,933 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think all coaches want to do that. You 341 00:17:36,933 --> 00:17:40,133 Speaker 4: look at Scott Robinson and his first coaching team. He 342 00:17:40,213 --> 00:17:44,453 Speaker 4: was so set from even probably a year out from 343 00:17:44,453 --> 00:17:45,093 Speaker 4: being appointed. 344 00:17:45,173 --> 00:17:46,453 Speaker 5: Wasn't here that Leo. 345 00:17:46,373 --> 00:17:51,013 Speaker 4: McDonald, Jason Hollands, Jason Ryan and Scott Hansen were his 346 00:17:51,093 --> 00:17:52,933 Speaker 4: men and he never. 347 00:17:52,773 --> 00:17:53,853 Speaker 5: Really wavered from that. 348 00:17:54,133 --> 00:17:56,373 Speaker 4: So all coaches want to work with people that they 349 00:17:56,413 --> 00:17:58,533 Speaker 4: know and trust, and I think Dave Renny's no different. 350 00:17:59,093 --> 00:18:02,173 Speaker 4: I'm hearing he'll look to bring in Neil Barnes who 351 00:18:02,213 --> 00:18:06,093 Speaker 4: as one of his lead assistants. He worked with Barnes 352 00:18:06,093 --> 00:18:09,013 Speaker 4: and Ready worked together at the Chiefs. Barnes has also 353 00:18:09,253 --> 00:18:12,013 Speaker 4: had experience on the international scene with Canada and Italy. 354 00:18:12,253 --> 00:18:14,533 Speaker 4: I think he's been with Tartanaki and had success there 355 00:18:14,573 --> 00:18:17,573 Speaker 4: for six years. He's known as a real tough task 356 00:18:17,653 --> 00:18:21,253 Speaker 4: master with a lot of expertise around the lineup. Also 357 00:18:21,373 --> 00:18:26,453 Speaker 4: hearing whispers around someone like Mike Blair, who's currently coaching 358 00:18:26,533 --> 00:18:30,653 Speaker 4: with Rennie in Kobe. He's Scotland's most capted halfback, has 359 00:18:30,733 --> 00:18:34,853 Speaker 4: experience with Glasgow. He was head coach in Edinburgh and 360 00:18:35,053 --> 00:18:38,253 Speaker 4: Scotland before moving to Japan to join Rennie, so he 361 00:18:38,293 --> 00:18:40,653 Speaker 4: could potentially come on board as an attack coach. But 362 00:18:40,733 --> 00:18:43,213 Speaker 4: that would be very interesting from an All Blacks perspective. 363 00:18:43,773 --> 00:18:46,973 Speaker 4: Haven't had a foreign coach in the mix before. I 364 00:18:47,013 --> 00:18:50,773 Speaker 4: know you've advocated for that before, So interesting to see 365 00:18:51,013 --> 00:18:54,413 Speaker 4: how New Zealand Rugby would react to that. Andrew Strawbridge 366 00:18:54,453 --> 00:18:57,333 Speaker 4: potentially in the mix as a skills coach and other 367 00:18:57,533 --> 00:19:01,853 Speaker 4: former Chiefs guy, and I'm hearing Phil Healey as in 368 00:19:01,933 --> 00:19:05,693 Speaker 4: line likely to replace Nick Gill as strength and conditioning coach. 369 00:19:06,133 --> 00:19:10,013 Speaker 4: Phil Healey comes highly regarded. It was another guy that 370 00:19:10,133 --> 00:19:12,493 Speaker 4: was at the Chiefs and at the Blues and he's 371 00:19:12,573 --> 00:19:15,733 Speaker 4: now also in Kobe, so he's done on Rugby. 372 00:19:15,773 --> 00:19:17,293 Speaker 5: May push back on some of that and. 373 00:19:17,213 --> 00:19:20,413 Speaker 4: Look to get Renny to retain more of the current 374 00:19:20,453 --> 00:19:23,013 Speaker 4: assistant coaches, maybe to look to save some money. But 375 00:19:23,573 --> 00:19:25,973 Speaker 4: if Renny got his way, I think Jason Ryan could 376 00:19:25,973 --> 00:19:28,853 Speaker 4: be the only survivor of those current assistant coaches. 377 00:19:29,013 --> 00:19:30,733 Speaker 3: That would be a heck of a cleanout, wouldn't it. 378 00:19:30,733 --> 00:19:33,853 Speaker 3: And look, we talked at the top about Jamie Joseph 379 00:19:34,493 --> 00:19:38,133 Speaker 3: potentially more aligning with the current assistants. This it would 380 00:19:38,173 --> 00:19:39,973 Speaker 3: be on the verge of a pretty much a clear 381 00:19:40,013 --> 00:19:42,093 Speaker 3: out of the of the current assistants there, And I 382 00:19:42,133 --> 00:19:45,693 Speaker 3: think it's a hard one to say that the assistant 383 00:19:45,733 --> 00:19:48,533 Speaker 3: should be retained because you know a lot of them, 384 00:19:48,653 --> 00:19:51,373 Speaker 3: you know, are tarnished by the Scott Robertson brush of 385 00:19:51,853 --> 00:19:55,613 Speaker 3: that era just not working in the end. So I 386 00:19:55,653 --> 00:19:57,773 Speaker 3: think it's going to be interesting to see just where 387 00:19:57,813 --> 00:20:01,373 Speaker 3: Rennie lands if he does keep Jason Ryan. That is, 388 00:20:01,493 --> 00:20:04,133 Speaker 3: you know, full on clean out when you consider some 389 00:20:04,173 --> 00:20:06,493 Speaker 3: of the other roles that have departed, you know Nick 390 00:20:06,493 --> 00:20:08,373 Speaker 3: Gill as you mentioned there and others too. So so 391 00:20:08,893 --> 00:20:11,093 Speaker 3: it's going to be a different looking all back staff 392 00:20:11,093 --> 00:20:11,813 Speaker 3: this year, isn't. 393 00:20:11,653 --> 00:20:13,093 Speaker 5: It It is? 394 00:20:13,293 --> 00:20:16,333 Speaker 4: And look, there may be some form of compromise needed there. 395 00:20:16,413 --> 00:20:18,813 Speaker 4: News own Rugby may say, look, we want you to 396 00:20:18,853 --> 00:20:23,573 Speaker 4: retain Tumbody Allison or Bryn Evans. You know, there may 397 00:20:23,613 --> 00:20:28,413 Speaker 4: be some form of compromise required on Renney's behalf there. 398 00:20:28,453 --> 00:20:32,733 Speaker 4: But generally speaking, head coaches get car blanche, don't they. 399 00:20:32,733 --> 00:20:34,533 Speaker 4: They get to work with who they know and trust, 400 00:20:34,613 --> 00:20:37,253 Speaker 4: who they believe as the right man for the job. 401 00:20:37,333 --> 00:20:40,893 Speaker 4: And when you look at those assistant coaches, I think 402 00:20:41,533 --> 00:20:45,333 Speaker 4: Scott Hansen has to be in the spotlight because he 403 00:20:45,533 --> 00:20:50,053 Speaker 4: switched from defense portfolio to the attacking one and it 404 00:20:50,173 --> 00:20:51,133 Speaker 4: just it didn't work. 405 00:20:51,493 --> 00:20:54,933 Speaker 5: So for me, he has to be in the firing line. 406 00:20:55,253 --> 00:21:00,093 Speaker 4: Tumbody Allison took over the defense, and I think he's 407 00:21:00,133 --> 00:21:02,653 Speaker 4: going to be a great coach in time. Whether he's 408 00:21:02,693 --> 00:21:06,093 Speaker 4: ready for the international arena now in a defensive coaching 409 00:21:06,173 --> 00:21:09,653 Speaker 4: role which comes with vast responsibility, not too sure. I 410 00:21:09,653 --> 00:21:11,813 Speaker 4: think Brandy Evans did a great job with the lineup, 411 00:21:12,133 --> 00:21:14,813 Speaker 4: but with Neil Barnes coming in and potentially Jason Ryan 412 00:21:14,893 --> 00:21:16,973 Speaker 4: being retained as well as their room for him, so 413 00:21:17,453 --> 00:21:19,613 Speaker 4: there's some big decisions and you'd expect that to play 414 00:21:19,653 --> 00:21:22,053 Speaker 4: out pretty quickly over the coming weeks because as you mentioned, 415 00:21:22,093 --> 00:21:25,093 Speaker 4: there's not a lot of time before that first Test. 416 00:21:24,933 --> 00:21:26,613 Speaker 3: No, and he's going to need bodies on the ground, 417 00:21:26,693 --> 00:21:28,573 Speaker 3: isn't he in New Zealand, Because he mentioned he's going 418 00:21:28,613 --> 00:21:31,453 Speaker 3: to be spending every waking hour watching over tape and 419 00:21:31,653 --> 00:21:34,333 Speaker 3: he has been anyway watching a fair bit of super rugby, 420 00:21:34,333 --> 00:21:35,773 Speaker 3: but he's going to have to really dial that up 421 00:21:35,813 --> 00:21:38,813 Speaker 3: and he needs people on the ground to get the 422 00:21:38,853 --> 00:21:42,893 Speaker 3: ball rolling on some of those things. I asked Dave Rennie. 423 00:21:42,893 --> 00:21:44,293 Speaker 3: I think it was the only question I got in 424 00:21:44,853 --> 00:21:48,013 Speaker 3: whether the all Blacks can win next year's Rugby World Cup. 425 00:21:48,013 --> 00:21:49,893 Speaker 3: This is how he responded, all ances. 426 00:21:49,653 --> 00:21:51,613 Speaker 6: Yes, and I'll take a hell of lot of work. 427 00:21:52,173 --> 00:21:54,213 Speaker 6: It'll take a lot of alignment. We're going to make 428 00:21:54,253 --> 00:21:58,613 Speaker 6: sure that players and staff and S and C and 429 00:21:58,653 --> 00:22:01,373 Speaker 6: the medical and we're all aligned so he can get 430 00:22:01,373 --> 00:22:04,453 Speaker 6: the athlete in the best possible position to execute and 431 00:22:04,453 --> 00:22:04,973 Speaker 6: play well. 432 00:22:05,253 --> 00:22:07,653 Speaker 3: So that was Dave Rennie talking about the World Cup, hope. 433 00:22:07,693 --> 00:22:09,253 Speaker 3: So it was honest, but he said that's going to 434 00:22:09,293 --> 00:22:11,493 Speaker 3: take a lot of work. And I thought there was 435 00:22:11,493 --> 00:22:15,373 Speaker 3: a refreshing honest answer from Dave Rennie on that one. Liam. 436 00:22:16,613 --> 00:22:19,693 Speaker 5: Yeah, absolutely, I thought he was very concise and clear 437 00:22:19,773 --> 00:22:22,173 Speaker 5: and honest. 438 00:22:22,253 --> 00:22:25,653 Speaker 4: And he also acknowledged the fact that it's highly likely 439 00:22:25,693 --> 00:22:27,333 Speaker 4: that the All Blacks are on a collision course with 440 00:22:27,373 --> 00:22:32,773 Speaker 4: the spring Box and a World Cup quarterfinal. And when 441 00:22:32,933 --> 00:22:34,773 Speaker 4: I like the fact that when he talked about that, 442 00:22:34,933 --> 00:22:36,773 Speaker 4: he said we're going to get a lot of practice 443 00:22:36,773 --> 00:22:39,133 Speaker 4: against them, and how a lot of people view this 444 00:22:39,213 --> 00:22:42,213 Speaker 4: tor to South Africa as daunting prospects and I think 445 00:22:42,253 --> 00:22:46,053 Speaker 4: that's certainly how you and I were looking at it 446 00:22:46,813 --> 00:22:49,853 Speaker 4: from an All Blacks perspective prior to Scott Robinson sacking 447 00:22:49,893 --> 00:22:52,053 Speaker 4: and even now with the amount of change that the 448 00:22:52,053 --> 00:22:53,533 Speaker 4: All Blacks are going to have to go through in 449 00:22:53,573 --> 00:22:56,653 Speaker 4: a short space of time, going to South Africa, facing 450 00:22:56,653 --> 00:22:59,373 Speaker 4: the World champions on their home soil and their Super 451 00:22:59,413 --> 00:23:02,173 Speaker 4: rugby teams with the amount of depth that they had, 452 00:23:02,973 --> 00:23:05,973 Speaker 4: it seems very daunting. But they've Renny sort of flipped 453 00:23:05,973 --> 00:23:09,173 Speaker 4: down on his head, didn't he and talked about it 454 00:23:09,213 --> 00:23:11,653 Speaker 4: as as relishing that prospect. 455 00:23:12,053 --> 00:23:16,133 Speaker 3: Indeed, the other interesting point around the media conference, and 456 00:23:16,133 --> 00:23:18,733 Speaker 3: it's already been jumped on, is what Dave Renny said 457 00:23:18,733 --> 00:23:22,893 Speaker 3: around the eligibility laws. This has been a constant hot topic, 458 00:23:22,933 --> 00:23:26,293 Speaker 3: hasn't it on with Richie Mwanga and other players should 459 00:23:26,293 --> 00:23:29,093 Speaker 3: they be selected from abroad. Here's what he had to say. 460 00:23:31,293 --> 00:23:34,893 Speaker 6: I'll comment on Bradier Retel. I'll get to see him 461 00:23:35,453 --> 00:23:39,573 Speaker 6: and train and play every week. He's stronger than he's 462 00:23:39,573 --> 00:23:42,293 Speaker 6: ever been, he's fit of and he's ever been top 463 00:23:42,333 --> 00:23:44,493 Speaker 6: tri score in Japan at the moment with eleven pretty 464 00:23:44,533 --> 00:23:47,813 Speaker 6: low at him back. I'm not sure if I'm allowed 465 00:23:47,813 --> 00:23:52,613 Speaker 6: to yet, but yeah, it's no doubt. You want to 466 00:23:52,613 --> 00:23:54,413 Speaker 6: win a World Cup. Ideally you've got your best players 467 00:23:54,453 --> 00:23:58,573 Speaker 6: available and obviously Richie's coming back, which which would be good. 468 00:23:58,573 --> 00:24:03,573 Speaker 6: He's been in great form in Japan and yeah, certainly 469 00:24:03,933 --> 00:24:07,493 Speaker 6: you have someone like a Bradier Retelic coming into the environment. 470 00:24:08,413 --> 00:24:12,053 Speaker 6: I reckon it'll really grow the whole group. He's he's 471 00:24:12,053 --> 00:24:16,253 Speaker 6: done a phenomenal job around leadership at Colby and you know, 472 00:24:16,373 --> 00:24:18,333 Speaker 6: I'm not sure him. How much do you guys watch 473 00:24:18,693 --> 00:24:22,973 Speaker 6: of that competition, but it's it's gone through the roof. 474 00:24:23,053 --> 00:24:25,733 Speaker 6: It's a lot of experienced coaches up there's some of 475 00:24:25,773 --> 00:24:27,213 Speaker 6: the best players in the world playing there and the 476 00:24:27,333 --> 00:24:31,013 Speaker 6: Coaley's really strong, so you know his sites up there, 477 00:24:31,053 --> 00:24:36,413 Speaker 6: it'll beat Sigarepey teams in this competition. So yeah, So 478 00:24:36,413 --> 00:24:38,893 Speaker 6: he's been phenomenal and if I had the chance to 479 00:24:38,933 --> 00:24:40,973 Speaker 6: get him back, I'd certainly jump in it. 480 00:24:41,293 --> 00:24:43,853 Speaker 3: That was Dave Rennie talking about the eligibility laws. Interesting 481 00:24:43,893 --> 00:24:47,693 Speaker 3: that he put Brodie Ritelli's name out there. Not the 482 00:24:47,773 --> 00:24:49,253 Speaker 3: answer I expected from him. 483 00:24:49,293 --> 00:24:52,293 Speaker 4: Liam, No, it did catch me off guard, as oh, 484 00:24:52,333 --> 00:24:54,533 Speaker 4: I think it's the topic that will never die. 485 00:24:55,173 --> 00:24:55,493 Speaker 5: It was. 486 00:24:56,013 --> 00:24:58,413 Speaker 4: It was the topic that Scott Robinson was pretty passionate 487 00:24:58,453 --> 00:25:01,373 Speaker 4: about pushing. Wasn't he presented to the board he wanted 488 00:25:01,493 --> 00:25:04,013 Speaker 4: new Zealand Rugby to keep an open mind and for 489 00:25:04,133 --> 00:25:08,533 Speaker 4: Dave Rennie to tackle it so confrontingly and it's first 490 00:25:08,573 --> 00:25:13,973 Speaker 4: press currence signals that's that's high on his agenda as well. Look, personally, 491 00:25:14,293 --> 00:25:15,973 Speaker 4: I don't think that's a fight he's going to win, 492 00:25:16,453 --> 00:25:19,693 Speaker 4: but I can understand his perspective that he wants the 493 00:25:19,693 --> 00:25:22,253 Speaker 4: best players available to win a World Cup and he 494 00:25:22,333 --> 00:25:24,453 Speaker 4: still believes that Brodie Retelck is one of us. 495 00:25:24,573 --> 00:25:27,013 Speaker 3: Well, Brodie Retelick is only thirty four years of age. 496 00:25:27,213 --> 00:25:28,973 Speaker 3: My understanding is that when he went up there he 497 00:25:29,053 --> 00:25:33,293 Speaker 3: signed a three year deal which is now up after 498 00:25:33,493 --> 00:25:38,173 Speaker 3: the season. So it's interesting. You know, maybe it was 499 00:25:38,213 --> 00:25:41,493 Speaker 3: more a signal to David kirkho was standing alongside him 500 00:25:41,493 --> 00:25:44,013 Speaker 3: that maybe not seeped him from overseas, but we should 501 00:25:44,013 --> 00:25:45,693 Speaker 3: be trying to get this bloke back in New Zealand 502 00:25:45,733 --> 00:25:48,533 Speaker 3: rugby because he's still got eighteen months he could give 503 00:25:48,613 --> 00:25:51,693 Speaker 3: us in the run to next year's World Cup. So look, 504 00:25:51,733 --> 00:25:54,933 Speaker 3: that was a fascinating development. Could you see Brody Retelick 505 00:25:54,933 --> 00:25:55,973 Speaker 3: back in New Zealand rugby? 506 00:25:56,013 --> 00:25:58,893 Speaker 4: Liam, I think it's the only way that he'll play 507 00:25:58,893 --> 00:25:59,773 Speaker 4: for the All Blacks again. 508 00:26:00,013 --> 00:26:01,813 Speaker 5: And if Dave Rennie wants him. 509 00:26:01,813 --> 00:26:03,693 Speaker 4: I think he could probably convince him to come home, 510 00:26:03,773 --> 00:26:08,133 Speaker 4: and it was I did watch David Kirk his reaction. 511 00:26:08,613 --> 00:26:11,973 Speaker 4: Has Reny pointedly suggested that their Retelic should be selected 512 00:26:12,013 --> 00:26:15,213 Speaker 4: from off shore and there were a few raised eyebrows. 513 00:26:15,253 --> 00:26:17,813 Speaker 4: It's fair to say so. I don't see any winning 514 00:26:17,853 --> 00:26:20,933 Speaker 4: that fight. But yeah, what by all means, let's see 515 00:26:20,973 --> 00:26:23,053 Speaker 4: him back in New Zealand rugby. I think going to 516 00:26:23,133 --> 00:26:29,453 Speaker 4: Japan definitely prolonged players' careers. Brodie Retelic's still doing his thing. 517 00:26:29,493 --> 00:26:32,693 Speaker 4: He's top triscrew in the Japanese comps ready mentioned, So 518 00:26:33,413 --> 00:26:35,973 Speaker 4: bring him home and let's see him available. New Zealand 519 00:26:36,013 --> 00:26:39,973 Speaker 4: actually has some pretty talented locks running around to provide 520 00:26:40,013 --> 00:26:43,093 Speaker 4: and among others, Scott Barrett's. 521 00:26:45,613 --> 00:26:49,093 Speaker 5: Exactly. So the depth at lock is certainly better than 522 00:26:49,093 --> 00:26:49,733 Speaker 5: it than it was. 523 00:26:49,813 --> 00:26:52,493 Speaker 4: There was grave fears weren't there and the post Sam 524 00:26:52,493 --> 00:26:55,853 Speaker 4: White Lock Brodie Retallic era. But I don't think anyone 525 00:26:55,853 --> 00:26:58,813 Speaker 4: would would turn down Retallic if he was available for selection, 526 00:26:59,573 --> 00:27:03,093 Speaker 4: just on the Scott Barrett scenario there. We also talked 527 00:27:03,093 --> 00:27:06,933 Speaker 4: about the captaincy at the Press Currents today. What do 528 00:27:06,973 --> 00:27:09,613 Speaker 4: you envision happening with your Black captaincy. 529 00:27:09,773 --> 00:27:11,653 Speaker 3: It was a straight back from Dave Rennie, but it 530 00:27:11,693 --> 00:27:15,293 Speaker 3: certainly wasn't I would say a ringing endorsement. Wasn't Scott 531 00:27:15,293 --> 00:27:18,493 Speaker 3: Barrett is going to continue in this role. He called 532 00:27:18,573 --> 00:27:21,613 Speaker 3: him a fantastic player, said he's the current captain, said 533 00:27:21,613 --> 00:27:23,653 Speaker 3: he's keen to have a chat with him going forward. 534 00:27:24,213 --> 00:27:26,933 Speaker 3: That didn't sound to me like he's definitely the captain. 535 00:27:28,093 --> 00:27:30,893 Speaker 3: You know, he was far from a ringing endorsement. I 536 00:27:30,973 --> 00:27:32,973 Speaker 3: thought we may end up that he is the captain, 537 00:27:33,053 --> 00:27:35,573 Speaker 3: but at this point in time, it didn't sound like it. 538 00:27:35,653 --> 00:27:37,413 Speaker 3: And to be honest, I doubt that he will be 539 00:27:37,493 --> 00:27:40,013 Speaker 3: the captain for that All Blacks test against France on 540 00:27:40,133 --> 00:27:44,013 Speaker 3: July fourth. I can't see it happening. What about you, Yeah, I. 541 00:27:43,933 --> 00:27:44,973 Speaker 5: Think there will be a change. 542 00:27:45,093 --> 00:27:48,413 Speaker 4: I think just as Sam came was Ian Foster's man 543 00:27:48,453 --> 00:27:51,213 Speaker 4: and Scott Robinson made a change when he came in, 544 00:27:51,533 --> 00:27:53,933 Speaker 4: I think Dave Rennie will do the same. Coaches tend to, 545 00:27:54,573 --> 00:27:58,213 Speaker 4: just as they do with their assistant coaches, select someone 546 00:27:58,293 --> 00:28:01,613 Speaker 4: that they prefer, that they know that they are aligned with. 547 00:28:02,453 --> 00:28:04,773 Speaker 4: Dave Rennie hasn't had, as far as I'm aware, a 548 00:28:04,813 --> 00:28:08,773 Speaker 4: great experience with Scott Barrett throughout his coaching career. They 549 00:28:08,773 --> 00:28:13,773 Speaker 4: were adverse series between the Chiefs and the Crusaders over 550 00:28:13,813 --> 00:28:17,853 Speaker 4: the years, and from my point of view, I think 551 00:28:18,773 --> 00:28:22,333 Speaker 4: it Woods relinquishing the captaincy would free Scott bart up. 552 00:28:22,653 --> 00:28:24,773 Speaker 4: I think he was a reluctant captain from the outset, 553 00:28:24,773 --> 00:28:26,533 Speaker 4: and I think it would allow him to get back 554 00:28:26,533 --> 00:28:30,693 Speaker 4: to the film that had him placed among the world's 555 00:28:30,733 --> 00:28:31,293 Speaker 4: best locks. 556 00:28:31,333 --> 00:28:34,093 Speaker 5: So I think it would potentially be a win win scenario. 557 00:28:34,693 --> 00:28:37,093 Speaker 3: Let's wrap this up, Leam, Just finally, if we go 558 00:28:37,173 --> 00:28:38,813 Speaker 3: back to the man that missed out on this job 559 00:28:38,893 --> 00:28:41,493 Speaker 3: rather than the one that has got it in Jamie Joseph, 560 00:28:41,933 --> 00:28:45,413 Speaker 3: We're too now for him obviously missed out on this 561 00:28:45,533 --> 00:28:47,933 Speaker 3: role the second time. He sort of shot for it 562 00:28:47,973 --> 00:28:52,253 Speaker 3: after missing out in twenty twenty three when Robertson was 563 00:28:52,253 --> 00:28:56,893 Speaker 3: appointed for twenty twenty four. We're two now for him. 564 00:28:56,933 --> 00:28:59,053 Speaker 3: Does he surely he's not going to stick around the 565 00:28:59,093 --> 00:29:02,013 Speaker 3: Highlanders forever. It feels like he's got more international coaching 566 00:29:02,453 --> 00:29:05,493 Speaker 3: in him, but it doesn't seem like he'll probably ever 567 00:29:05,573 --> 00:29:08,773 Speaker 3: coach the All Blacks, to be honest, if his time now, 568 00:29:09,013 --> 00:29:10,893 Speaker 3: and it feels like the window might have closed on him. 569 00:29:10,893 --> 00:29:14,373 Speaker 3: So is there a window in international rugby somewhere still 570 00:29:14,373 --> 00:29:16,213 Speaker 3: for Jammy Joseph? 571 00:29:16,373 --> 00:29:19,333 Speaker 4: Yeah, potentially. Look, I think you're right. I don't think 572 00:29:19,373 --> 00:29:21,293 Speaker 4: he sticks around. The Highland is too long. And I 573 00:29:21,333 --> 00:29:23,253 Speaker 4: think this is a real kick in the guts because, 574 00:29:23,293 --> 00:29:26,733 Speaker 4: as you say, it's his second crack at it. He's 575 00:29:26,773 --> 00:29:30,133 Speaker 4: been you know, by all accounts gracious in defeats. Sent 576 00:29:30,213 --> 00:29:34,773 Speaker 4: Dave Rennie a text and you know, supported him and 577 00:29:34,813 --> 00:29:38,813 Speaker 4: wished him well. But he was the front runner early 578 00:29:38,853 --> 00:29:42,853 Speaker 4: on for this role. He has coached the All Blacks fifteen? 579 00:29:43,733 --> 00:29:45,733 Speaker 4: Does he really want to hang around and do that again? 580 00:29:46,053 --> 00:29:48,333 Speaker 4: I think he will certainly be putting the feelers out 581 00:29:48,333 --> 00:29:51,853 Speaker 4: there offshore and seeing what's available. But let me put 582 00:29:51,853 --> 00:29:55,613 Speaker 4: this to you, Elliott, Dave Rennie's contracts only for eighteen 583 00:29:55,653 --> 00:29:56,973 Speaker 4: months through to the World Cup. 584 00:29:58,853 --> 00:30:00,013 Speaker 5: Would he have liked longer? 585 00:30:00,213 --> 00:30:02,533 Speaker 4: And then does that potentially open the door for a 586 00:30:02,613 --> 00:30:06,893 Speaker 4: Joseph or somebody else, a Joe Schmidt, someone else potentially 587 00:30:06,933 --> 00:30:10,213 Speaker 4: waiting in the wings long runway? What happens if the 588 00:30:10,293 --> 00:30:13,213 Speaker 4: All Blacks loser World Cup, World Cup quarterfinal? You know, 589 00:30:13,773 --> 00:30:17,573 Speaker 4: I know we're shooting a little bit cart before the 590 00:30:17,573 --> 00:30:21,173 Speaker 4: horse here, but an eighteen month contract pretty rare, and 591 00:30:22,213 --> 00:30:24,893 Speaker 4: if they potentially lost the World Cup quarter final, maybe 592 00:30:24,973 --> 00:30:29,733 Speaker 4: Reny is out the door, you know. So coaching longevity 593 00:30:29,813 --> 00:30:32,413 Speaker 4: as we've seen what the All Blacks is not guaranteed either. 594 00:30:32,573 --> 00:30:35,053 Speaker 3: No, it's not. I'm sure he would have wanted more. 595 00:30:35,973 --> 00:30:38,373 Speaker 3: I'm sure Jamie Joseph that he got the job, would 596 00:30:38,373 --> 00:30:42,813 Speaker 3: have wanted more. My understanding is that, in an interesting break, 597 00:30:43,373 --> 00:30:48,893 Speaker 3: the negotiations were actually done with both parties before the 598 00:30:48,933 --> 00:30:53,613 Speaker 3: final interviews, so both parties knew the length of the 599 00:30:53,653 --> 00:30:56,213 Speaker 3: contract that they were getting, into the amount of money 600 00:30:56,253 --> 00:30:59,093 Speaker 3: they were getting paid and various other things. So that's 601 00:30:59,093 --> 00:31:03,013 Speaker 3: my understanding that they knew the term they were getting 602 00:31:03,013 --> 00:31:06,293 Speaker 3: and there wasn't really any regal room around it. We 603 00:31:06,333 --> 00:31:10,973 Speaker 3: saw the distraction that had happened last year or two 604 00:31:11,053 --> 00:31:13,853 Speaker 3: years ago now three years ago now when Scott Robertson 605 00:31:13,893 --> 00:31:16,893 Speaker 3: was appointed, Ian Foster was very upset with the way 606 00:31:16,933 --> 00:31:20,413 Speaker 3: that it played out, and so I can't see New 607 00:31:20,453 --> 00:31:23,373 Speaker 3: Zealand Rugby going through that process again. So I don't 608 00:31:23,373 --> 00:31:26,453 Speaker 3: think they'll make any decisions on it until whenever the 609 00:31:26,493 --> 00:31:29,133 Speaker 3: All Blacks are knocked out or lift the Rugby World 610 00:31:29,173 --> 00:31:32,333 Speaker 3: Cup next year in Australia. I think that's just the 611 00:31:32,733 --> 00:31:34,653 Speaker 3: probably accepted it that you know they'll have to go 612 00:31:34,693 --> 00:31:37,253 Speaker 3: with whoever comes through before then. You'd hate to see 613 00:31:37,333 --> 00:31:40,173 Speaker 3: Dave Rennie commit overseas or go somewhere else before then. 614 00:31:40,213 --> 00:31:42,133 Speaker 3: I don't think he would do that. But you know, 615 00:31:42,333 --> 00:31:44,693 Speaker 3: this is a risk that they are taking by not 616 00:31:44,733 --> 00:31:48,533 Speaker 3: signing him too longer than the end of November or 617 00:31:48,573 --> 00:31:52,653 Speaker 3: thereabouts next year. So it's a fascinating we wrinkle in 618 00:31:52,733 --> 00:31:54,453 Speaker 3: the process that they're going to have to do things 619 00:31:54,493 --> 00:31:57,533 Speaker 3: differently once again. But it appears liam that this is 620 00:31:57,533 --> 00:31:59,773 Speaker 3: a risk that New Zealand Rugby is willing to take 621 00:31:59,813 --> 00:32:03,253 Speaker 3: that they'll have to go with whoever's available, be that 622 00:32:03,333 --> 00:32:05,813 Speaker 3: Rennie or someone else post the twenty seven World Cup. 623 00:32:06,933 --> 00:32:08,973 Speaker 5: Yeah, I think it's probably the right way to go 624 00:32:09,053 --> 00:32:09,453 Speaker 5: about it. 625 00:32:09,453 --> 00:32:15,013 Speaker 4: It's just very short, tough, hit and run mission, isn't it, 626 00:32:15,093 --> 00:32:18,133 Speaker 4: To come into the hot seat, to go to South Africa, 627 00:32:18,253 --> 00:32:21,973 Speaker 4: to go on winning World Cup in Australia, to rebuild 628 00:32:22,293 --> 00:32:24,413 Speaker 4: the culture of the All Blacks, to get everyone on 629 00:32:24,493 --> 00:32:26,693 Speaker 4: the same page all in that short space of time, 630 00:32:26,733 --> 00:32:29,933 Speaker 4: and then to win a contract renewal. 631 00:32:30,053 --> 00:32:31,733 Speaker 5: So tough gig for Rennie. 632 00:32:31,733 --> 00:32:35,453 Speaker 4: But it's a dream coaching role, wasn't it, And he 633 00:32:35,573 --> 00:32:38,773 Speaker 4: certainly started well today and we'll see how he goes 634 00:32:38,813 --> 00:32:39,653 Speaker 4: on the field comes. 635 00:32:39,493 --> 00:32:42,013 Speaker 3: Your life, indeed we will, Liam Napi, thank you so 636 00:32:42,093 --> 00:32:45,133 Speaker 3: much for your time. Look forward to touching base again 637 00:32:45,293 --> 00:32:48,333 Speaker 3: on Monday with our next pod. We'll get some super 638 00:32:48,373 --> 00:32:51,373 Speaker 3: rugby tips etc. In the background, and we'll check the 639 00:32:51,413 --> 00:32:54,173 Speaker 3: mail bag and there's been some interesting feedback demanding your return. 640 00:32:54,213 --> 00:32:57,133 Speaker 3: As I said at the top, So whoever you paid 641 00:32:57,133 --> 00:33:00,093 Speaker 3: to fire that through, thank you very much. But we 642 00:33:00,133 --> 00:33:02,533 Speaker 3: will touch base on Monday with another edition of the pod, 643 00:33:02,573 --> 00:33:05,773 Speaker 3: and who knows where the story's gone to you over 644 00:33:05,773 --> 00:33:07,653 Speaker 3: the next few days, So we'll watch the space but 645 00:33:07,773 --> 00:33:10,413 Speaker 3: Nape so I think so much your time. As always, no. 646 00:33:10,453 --> 00:33:10,853 Speaker 5: Worries, mate. 647 00:33:10,853 --> 00:33:13,053 Speaker 4: I'll be sure to bring some some heat for your 648 00:33:13,093 --> 00:33:15,533 Speaker 4: crusaders along the way, just to keep those Keep Hours 649 00:33:15,653 --> 00:33:16,813 Speaker 4: listeners happy. 650 00:33:16,613 --> 00:33:19,613 Speaker 3: Like the Fijian heats that wilted the hurricanes. 651 00:33:20,613 --> 00:33:23,493 Speaker 4: Well look the state of that pitch, you know's there's 652 00:33:23,493 --> 00:33:25,533 Speaker 4: a lot to be said for that, and it's gonna 653 00:33:25,533 --> 00:33:27,253 Speaker 4: be great to see the Kinges bounce back against the 654 00:33:27,333 --> 00:33:27,973 Speaker 4: cards this week. 655 00:33:28,053 --> 00:33:30,133 Speaker 3: We will see about that Lee and maybe Thank you 656 00:33:30,173 --> 00:33:33,093 Speaker 3: for your time. Mark Kelly, executive producer of Rugby Direct 657 00:33:33,253 --> 00:33:35,853 Speaker 3: and we're powered by Habit Heald Physio. Book Today and 658 00:33:35,933 --> 00:33:36,813 Speaker 3: stay in the. 659 00:33:36,773 --> 00:33:43,413 Speaker 1: Game for more from News Talks B Listen live on 660 00:33:43,493 --> 00:33:46,453 Speaker 1: air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever 661 00:33:46,493 --> 00:33:49,093 Speaker 1: you go with our podcast on iHeartRadio