WEBVTT - The Panel: Chinese warships, illegal dumping, James Bond 0:00:05.721 --> 0:00:09.401 You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from news Talks 0:00:09.481 --> 0:00:14.441 EDB debating all the issues and more. It's the panel 0:00:14.561 --> 0:00:16.961 on the Weekend Collective on news Talk. 0:00:16.801 --> 0:00:17.121 Said B. 0:00:50.561 --> 0:00:53.161 Had a very good afternoon to you. Welcome to the show. 0:00:53.721 --> 0:00:56.001 Great you company. This is the Weekend Collective for Saturday, 0:00:56.081 --> 0:00:59.561 the twenty second February. Text your feedback anytime at nine 0:00:59.641 --> 0:01:02.201 two nine two and you can you can email as 0:01:02.201 --> 0:01:03.561 well if you like. If you're not in a hurry, 0:01:03.561 --> 0:01:06.201 tim be at Newstalk, SAIDB dot com in Z after 0:01:06.241 --> 0:01:07.961 four o'clock, of course, it'll be O eight hundred and 0:01:07.961 --> 0:01:09.601 eighty ten eighty is the way to get in touch. 0:01:09.841 --> 0:01:12.281 Coming up on today's show in just a moment. My 0:01:12.521 --> 0:01:15.801 panelists as always esteemed. I'll be introducing them in a 0:01:15.841 --> 0:01:18.321 tick after four o'clock. We have a new guest for 0:01:18.521 --> 0:01:21.521 the one roof radio show. It's else A Wolf and 0:01:21.601 --> 0:01:24.521 she is a real estate investor and coach at Wolf Property, 0:01:24.921 --> 0:01:28.201 talking about renovating and how you avoid actually spending too 0:01:28.321 --> 0:01:32.041 much money on your renovations, but how to improve return 0:01:32.561 --> 0:01:34.801 and how bad does the property to be before you 0:01:34.841 --> 0:01:36.681 should renovate it and spend a bit of money on it. 0:01:36.681 --> 0:01:39.601 To make a bit of money and after five o'clock 0:01:39.601 --> 0:01:42.281 the Parents Squad another new guest. It's new guest on 0:01:42.561 --> 0:01:47.561 today Layla Mason, doctor Layla Mason, who's she's a pediatrician 0:01:47.601 --> 0:01:49.161 and author of Children's Health. 0:01:49.561 --> 0:01:51.801 Eight is Z and we're talking about why is. 0:01:51.761 --> 0:01:54.321 This generation more anxious than previous ones, but also what 0:01:54.441 --> 0:01:57.481 are the biggest issues in children's health today? And before six, 0:01:57.521 --> 0:02:00.441 of course we'll be wrapping sport previewing, well not previewing 0:02:00.481 --> 0:02:02.481 because it'll kick off I think at five o'clock Auckland 0:02:02.641 --> 0:02:06.361 FC and Wellington Phoenix Alex Smith ill be joining us 0:02:06.361 --> 0:02:09.921 for that and also Fiji Endurer against the Hurricanes will 0:02:09.961 --> 0:02:12.561 be underway at ter for four point thirty five, so 0:02:12.601 --> 0:02:14.081 we'll be having a look at probably the last few 0:02:14.081 --> 0:02:15.921 minutes of that and telling us how it went. 0:02:16.001 --> 0:02:19.281 Welcome to the Weekend Collective. It is eight past. 0:02:19.201 --> 0:02:24.281 Three, insightful, entertaining and always on points. Tim Beveridge on 0:02:24.441 --> 0:02:26.961 the Weekend Collective News talks'. 0:02:26.561 --> 0:02:28.321 B yes, right into it. 0:02:28.401 --> 0:02:30.841 Look and it's time for our panel and in no 0:02:30.881 --> 0:02:33.841 particular order. The age before beauty is slightly not as 0:02:33.881 --> 0:02:36.641 obvious as it is for other panels, so the best 0:02:36.641 --> 0:02:39.081 way to put it, it is definitely if we were 0:02:39.081 --> 0:02:41.081 on TV right now, you'd be like, look at those 0:02:41.121 --> 0:02:45.481 silver foxes, and the word is distinguished, I think is 0:02:45.521 --> 0:02:48.521 the word. And we have distinguished professor of well these 0:02:48.561 --> 0:02:51.521 all sorts of things really, but it's Paul Spoonley, get. 0:02:51.361 --> 0:02:53.641 It, Paul, Hen you go, Jim, I'm good, good, good good. 0:02:53.681 --> 0:02:58.841 Remind us what you were distinguished at such a leading question, 0:02:58.921 --> 0:02:59.241 isn't it? 0:03:00.601 --> 0:03:04.561 The boys call me the undistinguished. It's a reflection of 0:03:04.721 --> 0:03:06.121 your international standing. 0:03:06.801 --> 0:03:07.281 Excellent. 0:03:07.601 --> 0:03:09.601 Well, speaking of which I'm going to apply the same 0:03:09.721 --> 0:03:12.961 description to my next guest. He's no stranger to people 0:03:12.961 --> 0:03:16.601 who follow media, and he's been a wonderful journalist and 0:03:16.601 --> 0:03:20.681 current affairs journalist and among other things, as well as 0:03:20.721 --> 0:03:23.201 a digger driver. And we went into how he started life. 0:03:23.201 --> 0:03:25.201 But he was very busy man doing all sorts of things. 0:03:25.561 --> 0:03:26.401 It's Mark Kreisel. 0:03:26.481 --> 0:03:30.921 Yeah. I prefer to think of myself as extinguished. Well, 0:03:32.281 --> 0:03:34.681 I'm triving. Can I just point out that I was 0:03:34.681 --> 0:03:38.721 a pupil of Paul's back in nineteen eighty? Is that 0:03:38.761 --> 0:03:41.681 your way eighteen of resulting eighty? Is that your way 0:03:41.761 --> 0:03:42.681 of resolving the age? 0:03:42.721 --> 0:03:45.481 I could have been an adult student, couldn't I And 0:03:45.521 --> 0:03:47.361 he could have been a student tutor. 0:03:47.481 --> 0:03:49.241 But yeah, that was way back in China. 0:03:49.281 --> 0:03:50.401 See child genius. 0:03:50.681 --> 0:03:55.801 Yeah you but yeah, absolutely brilliant New Zealand. 0:03:55.881 --> 0:03:58.041 I think it's a great cupe to have them. What 0:03:58.041 --> 0:04:04.441 were you studying? No idea that sociology? Sociology? Okay, well 0:04:04.481 --> 0:04:06.561 that's a relief that he could Yeah. There, you've done 0:04:06.601 --> 0:04:06.961 your job. 0:04:07.681 --> 0:04:10.401 He'd spent some time in your tutelage, and he does 0:04:10.481 --> 0:04:13.881 know the subject, yes, literally just what the subject was. 0:04:14.081 --> 0:04:16.361 I might not ask any fair the questions. 0:04:16.401 --> 0:04:20.201 No, yes, I don't have any letters after my name anyway. 0:04:20.281 --> 0:04:24.481 Hey, by now, look it's worth mentioning. Not that sounds 0:04:24.481 --> 0:04:27.281 like such a trivial way to mention it, but of 0:04:27.321 --> 0:04:31.081 course today is actually it's probably I actually know how 0:04:31.121 --> 0:04:33.601 long I've known you, Mark, because I met you on 0:04:33.641 --> 0:04:37.001 the twenty second of February, which was when the christ 0:04:37.041 --> 0:04:39.641 Church earthquake was going off, wasn't it? And six point 0:04:39.681 --> 0:04:43.481 three magnitude earthquake. It's fourteen years ago, one hundred and 0:04:43.481 --> 0:04:45.521 eighty five lives. We know what the destruction was. It 0:04:45.561 --> 0:04:48.961 was a horrendous event, and I mean there's still we're 0:04:48.961 --> 0:04:50.281 doing some rebuilding. 0:04:49.841 --> 0:04:52.721 Although christ Church has got some really. 0:04:52.601 --> 0:04:54.521 I mean, there's some great things about what they've done 0:04:54.561 --> 0:04:57.841 with the rebuild, but gosh, it's don't fix these things 0:04:57.881 --> 0:04:58.201 over night. 0:04:58.721 --> 0:04:59.401 I think it's that thing. 0:04:59.401 --> 0:05:02.801 As journalists, you parachute into places when these big things happen, 0:05:03.241 --> 0:05:05.201 and you hit it really hard. I did the a 0:05:05.241 --> 0:05:07.521 lot when I was euro correspondent for TVNZ. You go 0:05:07.561 --> 0:05:10.241 to places where a disaster is happening. Then you'd leave, 0:05:11.281 --> 0:05:13.441 but you don't realize for the people are left behind. 0:05:13.601 --> 0:05:16.441 There is years and years and years of rebuilding. And 0:05:16.481 --> 0:05:20.681 it's not just rebuilding buildings, it's rebuilding people, communities and 0:05:20.721 --> 0:05:23.081 communities and all those sorts of things that come along. 0:05:23.121 --> 0:05:25.321 And I remember going back to christ Church over the 0:05:25.401 --> 0:05:27.921 years and oh my god, they went through a lot. 0:05:27.961 --> 0:05:30.201 And don't forget they also went through years and years 0:05:30.241 --> 0:05:33.641 and years of aftershocks. So straight away in your mind 0:05:33.681 --> 0:05:35.721 you're thinking, oh my god, where are the people I love? 0:05:36.361 --> 0:05:38.881 You know, are they safe? Am I going to be safe? 0:05:38.921 --> 0:05:41.481 So that's jolt, you know, literally being jolted back in. 0:05:41.761 --> 0:05:43.441 But I was talking to someone this morning at my 0:05:43.561 --> 0:05:46.081 daughter's cricket game and he'd just been down to christ 0:05:46.121 --> 0:05:50.041 Church at a convention. He said, the convention hall down 0:05:50.081 --> 0:05:53.361 there is just beautiful. He said, there's a royal spirit 0:05:53.601 --> 0:05:57.121 of the rebuild that they're creating a beautiful city center 0:05:57.201 --> 0:05:59.241 with the stadium coming up and people come. 0:05:59.201 --> 0:06:02.721 Up, the court, theaters taking shape as well, and the 0:06:02.881 --> 0:06:05.841 and the taka the stadium. 0:06:06.721 --> 0:06:08.201 Is it one of those events you remember where you 0:06:08.201 --> 0:06:08.921 were when it happened? 0:06:08.921 --> 0:06:11.601 Paul, Absolutely, we were in Wellington. It was a beautiful 0:06:11.641 --> 0:06:14.721 dan Wellington and these stories started to come through and 0:06:14.761 --> 0:06:18.441 we had people from christ Church in Wellington and it 0:06:18.721 --> 0:06:21.841 was surreal. It's a bit like you know when the 0:06:21.881 --> 0:06:26.441 white Waheni sank and some you're too young, you're too 0:06:26.481 --> 0:06:31.401 young to but when the Waheni sank and the weather's beautiful, 0:06:31.441 --> 0:06:34.801 what's happening? And I mean, I just feel for christ Church. 0:06:34.921 --> 0:06:37.641 I mean what we've got to acknowledge is what Marx 0:06:37.681 --> 0:06:41.081 talked about. But of course twenty nineteen, I mean it 0:06:41.121 --> 0:06:45.081 didn't end really taken the hits. 0:06:45.361 --> 0:06:47.361 And that was another one. Oh my god. 0:06:47.521 --> 0:06:52.281 Yes, So let's let's remember all of those people who've 0:06:52.281 --> 0:06:55.121 worked so hard to rebuild and those who were injured 0:06:55.161 --> 0:06:55.881 and hurt and. 0:06:55.921 --> 0:06:56.521 Care one. 0:06:58.481 --> 0:07:00.241 Well, of course there's another part of the world which 0:07:00.281 --> 0:07:03.241 is really feeling like this that I'm not sure if 0:07:03.281 --> 0:07:05.201 they feel it. Hope is dwelling, but they're under the 0:07:05.201 --> 0:07:08.721 They're in a troublesome spot, given that it seems that 0:07:08.801 --> 0:07:11.001 the support of the USA seems to be evaporating, with 0:07:11.481 --> 0:07:14.881 stants that Trump has taken towards Ukraine. I'll hold my 0:07:14.961 --> 0:07:17.041 fire on this one and throw it over you to Paul. 0:07:17.081 --> 0:07:19.641 What's your reaction to the way things have gone with 0:07:19.721 --> 0:07:21.641 the US and Ukraine and Trump. 0:07:21.841 --> 0:07:24.721 I think it's extraordinary. The economist has said that it's 0:07:24.841 --> 0:07:27.881 head spinning, and I think it's a reordering of what's 0:07:27.921 --> 0:07:31.201 happening in terms of international relations. I just cannot believe it. 0:07:31.641 --> 0:07:36.201 So the Ukraine has been portrayed. I use that word deliberately. 0:07:36.561 --> 0:07:40.681 I think Putin is being rehabilitated. And if you think 0:07:40.801 --> 0:07:43.121 back to some of the events in the Cold War, 0:07:43.561 --> 0:07:46.321 and you think we wouldn't have stood aside and let 0:07:46.881 --> 0:07:52.241 what's happening in Czechoslovak or wherever taking place and not respond, 0:07:52.681 --> 0:07:57.161 So I think it's a huge geopolitical shift. I worry 0:07:57.161 --> 0:07:59.761 about the morality. I worry about the moral compass of 0:07:59.801 --> 0:08:02.521 the people that are involved, and I worry what's going 0:08:02.561 --> 0:08:03.761 to happen to the world. 0:08:03.961 --> 0:08:08.881 As a result enablement. I guess Mark's what's your response 0:08:08.961 --> 0:08:11.321 to the last week you're saying especially, I mean Trump 0:08:11.361 --> 0:08:13.401 callings is the lenscap dictator and he started the war. 0:08:13.441 --> 0:08:14.521 I mean he's senile, isn't he. 0:08:14.801 --> 0:08:18.001 It's just well, no, I you know, he just he 0:08:18.081 --> 0:08:21.041 talks a lot, and I don't know if he understands 0:08:21.081 --> 0:08:24.561 what is if his words, how much impact his words have. 0:08:25.121 --> 0:08:27.641 I think it's a very very dangerous time in the 0:08:27.641 --> 0:08:31.001 world at the moment. He's an emboldened putin, who is essentially, 0:08:31.121 --> 0:08:33.201 if you're talking about a dictator and someone who hasn't 0:08:33.481 --> 0:08:35.521 had a free and fair election to get into that role, 0:08:35.801 --> 0:08:38.361 there's one right sitting right in front of you. But 0:08:38.601 --> 0:08:40.681 I think it's going to embold in other countries. I'm 0:08:40.721 --> 0:08:43.201 thinking about what's happening in the Tasman at the moment, 0:08:43.241 --> 0:08:47.681 with China having those quite aggressive military or naval maneuvers, 0:08:48.361 --> 0:08:50.641 you know, one hundred and fifty two kilometers off the 0:08:50.641 --> 0:08:53.921 coast of Sydney, and I think they're just everybody's just 0:08:53.921 --> 0:08:57.121 feeling we can do whatever we want. I heard Trump 0:08:57.161 --> 0:09:00.721 describe the other day as a transactional president. So if 0:09:00.721 --> 0:09:03.641 he thinks he can get make some money out of 0:09:03.721 --> 0:09:09.441 rekindling relations with Russia and maybe of sidelining Ukraine, then 0:09:09.641 --> 0:09:10.761 that's what he thinks. 0:09:11.241 --> 0:09:12.121 That's what he's going to do. 0:09:12.201 --> 0:09:12.321 Well. 0:09:12.321 --> 0:09:14.601 I think one of the most appalling headlines I saw 0:09:15.201 --> 0:09:20.721 was the memo that had been presented to Zelensky by 0:09:20.721 --> 0:09:24.281 the States where this was initially I think reported by 0:09:24.281 --> 0:09:28.961 the Telegraph that the reparations they're seeking repayment for the 0:09:29.241 --> 0:09:34.201 American contribution, and the stats were that it's they want 0:09:34.241 --> 0:09:37.201 half of their minerals forever of the Ukraine. It's like 0:09:38.441 --> 0:09:40.761 Putin and Russia have been the proxy for America to 0:09:40.801 --> 0:09:43.281 go on and screw everything they can out of the Ukraine. 0:09:43.561 --> 0:09:46.201 And to put it in context, the article on the 0:09:46.201 --> 0:09:50.161 Telegraph said that as a percentage of GDP, what Trump 0:09:50.281 --> 0:09:54.521 was seeking out of Ukraine was more onerous than the 0:09:54.521 --> 0:09:56.841 Treaty of Versailles was after World. 0:09:56.641 --> 0:09:59.121 War One on World War one Germany and we all 0:09:59.161 --> 0:10:00.121 know what happened after that. 0:10:00.361 --> 0:10:04.041 Yeah, Well, that what it is is, it's the punching down. 0:10:04.081 --> 0:10:06.761 It's like, it seems to me that Trump is treating 0:10:06.961 --> 0:10:11.041 Ukraine like an understressed seller in the real estate market. 0:10:11.081 --> 0:10:12.881 Here's someone who's got some weakness, and I'm going to 0:10:12.921 --> 0:10:15.001 screw them. I can't think of someone I can view 0:10:15.041 --> 0:10:18.601 with more contempt than Donald Trump, and he is absolutely 0:10:19.121 --> 0:10:22.241 when I watched him do that present his speaking points 0:10:22.321 --> 0:10:26.481 or something about how Zelensky shouldn't have started the war. 0:10:26.481 --> 0:10:28.361 At how he's a dictator. 0:10:30.161 --> 0:10:33.121 He doesn't he wants to accede to the no NATO 0:10:33.241 --> 0:10:37.601 membership for Ukraine, the withdrawal of US soldiers from Europe, 0:10:38.561 --> 0:10:40.841 and I just sort of thought it was like, I 0:10:40.841 --> 0:10:44.721 have a pro Putin talkback caller on Oh, I know, 0:10:45.201 --> 0:10:47.801 you get a few and it was like he and 0:10:47.881 --> 0:10:50.881 Trump we have had had dinner together before that, before 0:10:50.881 --> 0:10:53.121 that press release, absolutely parroting. 0:10:53.681 --> 0:10:56.601 He is so much Putin's poodle. But it's not funny. 0:10:56.641 --> 0:10:57.361 It's very strong. 0:10:57.401 --> 0:11:01.761 That propaganda is very strong, and it's skillfully distributed, and 0:11:02.641 --> 0:11:05.561 a lot of people fall for it. Basically, But this 0:11:05.641 --> 0:11:08.241 is I think this is a really frightening time. I 0:11:08.281 --> 0:11:10.881 think a lot of people have lost faith in democracy 0:11:11.321 --> 0:11:14.241 and this has given rise to leaders like Trump who 0:11:14.241 --> 0:11:17.001 are disruptors, who feel like they come outside the box. 0:11:17.401 --> 0:11:20.641 You've got Europe's all over the place, in terms of leadership, 0:11:20.681 --> 0:11:23.721 there's no strong person who is standing up there and saying, 0:11:24.281 --> 0:11:26.241 you know, they're trying to get it all together, but 0:11:26.281 --> 0:11:29.521 they're all swimming around. There's no real opposition in America 0:11:29.601 --> 0:11:32.641 to Trump. The Democrats all over the place. The Republicans 0:11:32.681 --> 0:11:33.041 are proven. 0:11:33.081 --> 0:11:35.921 What is it cash Pattel and RFK Junior and Pete 0:11:35.921 --> 0:11:39.121 heck sith none of those senators. I think they've all 0:11:39.161 --> 0:11:41.841 been castrated at some cause. They've certainly got the guys 0:11:41.921 --> 0:11:44.001 have got no balls? Have they pardoned me? 0:11:44.121 --> 0:11:46.241 But let's be honest, Tim, can I go back because 0:11:46.921 --> 0:11:50.841 it's an interesting suggestion that Trump is being played by Putin. 0:11:51.401 --> 0:11:53.681 Well, it gives the impression of it. 0:11:53.281 --> 0:11:55.801 Is, doesn't he I mean, you know, Putin leads a 0:11:55.841 --> 0:12:00.201 renegade state, and here he is, he's being rehabilitated by 0:12:01.001 --> 0:12:04.521 what Trump is doing. Trump is effectively dealing with Russia 0:12:04.681 --> 0:12:07.481 as an equal and ruling out others. 0:12:07.601 --> 0:12:08.721 And it's that. 0:12:08.881 --> 0:12:11.761 That's a reordering of what's happened, what's happened internationally. 0:12:12.361 --> 0:12:14.721 Let's not forget this is how he behaved towards Putin 0:12:14.761 --> 0:12:17.481 in his first term as well. There's always been the 0:12:17.561 --> 0:12:19.801 rumors that Russia have got something over him, and there 0:12:20.241 --> 0:12:24.081 was a suggestion, yeah, let's not go there, but that 0:12:24.201 --> 0:12:27.441 may or may not be true. But there is something 0:12:27.441 --> 0:12:30.681 about him and Putin that turns him into a puppet. 0:12:30.961 --> 0:12:34.081 And the Russians have always had a great term for 0:12:34.521 --> 0:12:37.401 people that they've used like this through the KGB and 0:12:37.441 --> 0:12:42.321 everything like that, and that's useful idiots, useful, useful idiots, 0:12:42.561 --> 0:12:45.761 and that's I'm sorry for all the Trump supporters out there, 0:12:46.041 --> 0:12:48.681 but I think that's exactly what we're seeing playing out 0:12:48.721 --> 0:12:49.201 at the moment. 0:12:49.681 --> 0:12:53.361 Actually, I'll tell you the one this put Let's put 0:12:53.361 --> 0:12:56.041 a positive, positive spin on this. I don't mean a 0:12:56.081 --> 0:12:56.641 positive span. 0:12:56.841 --> 0:12:59.561 Let's find these silver lining in the cloud of Trump's 0:12:59.641 --> 0:13:02.761 rhetoric and you know, and the rhetoric that's been presented 0:13:02.761 --> 0:13:06.561 to the EU and to Europe at some I mean 0:13:06.601 --> 0:13:08.841 it is a wake up call for the EU and 0:13:08.881 --> 0:13:11.001 European countries because they haven't got there. 0:13:11.321 --> 0:13:13.441 They're act sorted out. When it comes to the military. 0:13:13.081 --> 0:13:17.241 They're going to have to upscale quickly. Then again, I mean, 0:13:17.361 --> 0:13:19.201 whether Russia is as big as a threat. I mean, 0:13:19.281 --> 0:13:20.801 look how long they've been at war and they still 0:13:20.801 --> 0:13:23.961 haven't managed to They've conquered twenty percent of Ukrainian territory. 0:13:24.081 --> 0:13:26.641 It's not like they're armed forces are ready to go 0:13:26.721 --> 0:13:30.401 like the Third Reich. So what do you reckon for? 0:13:30.681 --> 0:13:35.121 Well, you see, I don't think European the European politics 0:13:35.161 --> 0:13:37.281 is going in the right direction. And if you look 0:13:37.321 --> 0:13:39.401 at the domestic politics. I've just come back from two 0:13:39.401 --> 0:13:44.001 and a half months in Europe, mostly in Sweden, Swedish politics, 0:13:44.041 --> 0:13:50.401 German politics, you know, Polish, Hungarian politics. They're all riven 0:13:50.681 --> 0:13:56.961 by tribal and very nationalistic and populist politics. So if 0:13:57.001 --> 0:13:59.881 you're thinking that Europe is somehow going to come together 0:14:00.321 --> 0:14:03.721 and be as a cohesive voice, I think you're dreaming. 0:14:03.921 --> 0:14:04.721 I really do know. 0:14:04.881 --> 0:14:06.961 I we probably need to hope that enough of the 0:14:07.001 --> 0:14:09.081 significant countries there can come together. 0:14:11.561 --> 0:14:17.241 Germany, Germany has got an economic elections and elections. 0:14:17.561 --> 0:14:19.081 There is no Angela. 0:14:18.681 --> 0:14:23.201 Merkel type character who was therefore, and Schultz wasn't that guy. 0:14:23.561 --> 0:14:26.401 But also I think in a way they've all got 0:14:27.201 --> 0:14:29.841 they've all got m MP governments, and so they have 0:14:29.921 --> 0:14:34.201 to cobble together coalitions that don't always agree with each other, 0:14:34.321 --> 0:14:36.081 and they're all over the you know, they can be 0:14:36.081 --> 0:14:38.121 all the same. You could say the same thing that's 0:14:38.121 --> 0:14:40.681 happening here at the moment. You know that quite often 0:14:40.681 --> 0:14:43.281 the tail ends up wagging the dog, and if it's 0:14:43.281 --> 0:14:47.081 an extreme right party, they're used to being aggressive and 0:14:47.201 --> 0:14:51.401 saying things that that may be unpalatable. But taking people, 0:14:51.601 --> 0:14:52.041 you think. 0:14:51.961 --> 0:14:54.641 MMP enables slightly more extreme points of view because no 0:14:54.681 --> 0:14:56.121 one's really trying to capture that middle ground. 0:14:56.161 --> 0:14:58.841 And I don't think anything it gets done like you 0:14:59.001 --> 0:15:02.641 used to. That's an interesting one. Mark Kreisl advocates for 0:15:02.641 --> 0:15:08.841 getting rid of m MP. You never said that. 0:15:05.201 --> 0:15:14.041 I think people are losing faith in institutions and democracy, yes, 0:15:14.081 --> 0:15:17.201 and I think that was exacerbated during COVID, But I 0:15:17.321 --> 0:15:20.161 just don't think it's working in terms of giving people 0:15:20.201 --> 0:15:22.041 what they need and what they want. 0:15:22.321 --> 0:15:25.761 And post COVID, we've seen a number of patterns. Win is, 0:15:26.401 --> 0:15:30.961 existing political parties lose elections. Number two, the trust and 0:15:31.041 --> 0:15:34.921 politicians and political systems has gone down big time and 0:15:34.961 --> 0:15:37.761 it's not clear what's going to restore that trust. And Third, 0:15:37.801 --> 0:15:43.281 your information systems, your information systems would feed into understanding 0:15:43.281 --> 0:15:46.201 and political debate are now struggling. 0:15:48.121 --> 0:15:53.201 Trust me, I'm a journalist actually actually well, and it does. 0:15:53.041 --> 0:15:55.521 Seem like awkward like sort of perfect timing that the 0:15:55.801 --> 0:15:59.121 Chinese are flexing their muscle by by basically flexing their 0:15:59.121 --> 0:16:00.921 biceps off the coast of Australia. 0:16:00.961 --> 0:16:04.081 But do you think that's coincidental? No, No, I think that's. 0:16:03.881 --> 0:16:06.881 Not a thing. Yeah, I seeah being ironic. 0:16:07.521 --> 0:16:10.201 Okay, Yeah, And I think they're filling a vacuum. They've 0:16:10.241 --> 0:16:15.401 seen an opportunity to be the leading world par Yeah. 0:16:15.521 --> 0:16:18.321 We're not going to trust Trump in America at the moment, 0:16:18.321 --> 0:16:18.681 are we? 0:16:18.841 --> 0:16:21.321 No? Oh, no, you couldn't. Unfortunately you can't. 0:16:21.561 --> 0:16:23.681 No, I don't know what it means for Orcus but 0:16:24.481 --> 0:16:26.601 as well, because you know, he can have whatever packs 0:16:26.601 --> 0:16:28.601 you have. But his rhetoric just seems to ping around 0:16:28.601 --> 0:16:31.241 from whatever, you know, whether he's had a bad cheeseburger or. 0:16:31.241 --> 0:16:34.521 Not, depending on what he says. But anyway, do you 0:16:34.521 --> 0:16:34.841 think we. 0:16:34.761 --> 0:16:36.921 Should be spending more on our military because it seems 0:16:36.961 --> 0:16:39.561 like half our navy is Navy is underwater off the 0:16:39.561 --> 0:16:40.521 coast of Samoa. 0:16:40.601 --> 0:16:43.681 It doesn't feel like we're low blow. 0:16:44.401 --> 0:16:46.921 Seriously, seriously, does it feel to you like we have 0:16:47.121 --> 0:16:49.921 anything significant to our armed forces that we can brag about, 0:16:49.921 --> 0:16:52.561 apart from the wonderful quality of our soldiers. 0:16:52.841 --> 0:16:54.681 Okay, yeah, I backed that up. 0:16:54.721 --> 0:16:57.481 I've been in East Team or when our soldiers turned up, 0:16:57.481 --> 0:16:59.001 and it's one of the proudest I've been as in 0:16:59.041 --> 0:17:04.081 New Zealand. They represent us, they look like us, and 0:17:03.041 --> 0:17:07.081 they bring values that you know, in terms of like 0:17:07.161 --> 0:17:07.961 from the bottom up. 0:17:08.001 --> 0:17:11.121 They work with local people really well. I think they're great. 0:17:11.201 --> 0:17:14.561 I think we do have to pay our way a 0:17:14.601 --> 0:17:18.921 lot more. We don't, we know, piggyback on the back 0:17:18.921 --> 0:17:22.321 of the Aussies and the Americans or whatever. But that's 0:17:22.361 --> 0:17:25.401 a hard ask now because we've got a health system 0:17:25.441 --> 0:17:28.961 that's failing. We've got you know, people are losing their 0:17:29.041 --> 0:17:31.561 jobs all over the place. We've got you know, an 0:17:31.601 --> 0:17:34.681 aging population. We've got so many big problems that are 0:17:34.721 --> 0:17:37.161 asking for more money. Do you wish and it's billions. 0:17:37.201 --> 0:17:39.681 I do wish Helen had actually bought those F sixteens. 0:17:39.681 --> 0:17:41.881 To be honest, you, yeah, I like the idea that 0:17:41.921 --> 0:17:44.241 we might have in when we see a fishing vessel 0:17:44.321 --> 0:17:46.201 that's off, we don't just send a sort of dingy 0:17:46.241 --> 0:17:48.761 over there and go, but boy back you go. You 0:17:48.841 --> 0:17:50.761 have an F sixteen go over top in the marke think, oh, 0:17:50.761 --> 0:17:52.201 maybe we shouldn't leave anyway. 0:17:52.521 --> 0:17:54.881 I'm an aging piece neck. I would argue that our 0:17:54.921 --> 0:17:56.801 part of the world, the Pacific, is going to become 0:17:56.841 --> 0:18:00.761 a much more contentious and troubled place, and you can 0:18:00.801 --> 0:18:03.721 see it with the Cooks, and I agree. We need 0:18:03.761 --> 0:18:07.921 to invest more in our safety and our protection as 0:18:07.961 --> 0:18:10.961 well as a commitment to international alliances. You do have 0:18:11.001 --> 0:18:12.521 to be careful who you get into bed with, though, 0:18:12.881 --> 0:18:16.441 absolutely well, but we may we maintained a reasonably independent 0:18:16.481 --> 0:18:20.561 stance since the effectively the seventies and the eighties, and 0:18:20.801 --> 0:18:24.881 unless that's going to change significantly, let's make sure that 0:18:25.041 --> 0:18:26.201 our interests Gosha. 0:18:26.281 --> 0:18:28.161 Month's a long time in politics, isn't it? Weak a 0:18:28.281 --> 0:18:32.921 day Larichy And hopefully four years will pass quickly. Yeah, well, 0:18:34.001 --> 0:18:36.281 we're going to have a little bit more politics to come, 0:18:36.321 --> 0:18:38.481 but slightly more localized. And whether we're going to talk 0:18:38.521 --> 0:18:41.881 about well, Wayne Brown's promising to stand for count for 0:18:42.081 --> 0:18:44.601 mayor again, but we'll discuss that in just a moment. 0:18:44.641 --> 0:18:46.441 This is the panel of the Weekend Collective. It's twenty five 0:18:46.481 --> 0:19:01.721 past straight, a whole lot of love lead Zippe and 0:19:01.761 --> 0:19:04.401 I'm going through a very retro phase with my listening habits. 0:19:04.401 --> 0:19:10.201 So my producer tire as she is appeasing some of 0:19:10.241 --> 0:19:12.361 my requests on the music front. Anyway, welcome back to 0:19:12.361 --> 0:19:14.681 the Weekend Collective. This is the panel news talk said 0:19:14.721 --> 0:19:18.001 be Mark Kreisel and Paul Spoonley are my guest. Just 0:19:18.041 --> 0:19:20.201 a little bit more on the politics. Wayne Brown standing 0:19:20.201 --> 0:19:24.441 for reelection. He's asking rat Walkland rate payers to back 0:19:24.521 --> 0:19:28.241 him finishing the job. I would say that, well, there 0:19:28.241 --> 0:19:29.961 was a question right when the Desley was standing. But 0:19:30.001 --> 0:19:31.921 I don't think Dessley Simpson's going to I think that 0:19:31.961 --> 0:19:34.681 website was simply because she was thinking he might stop, 0:19:34.721 --> 0:19:38.401 not stand. Well, he'll win by a landslide, whon't he? 0:19:38.441 --> 0:19:38.681 Boys? 0:19:38.801 --> 0:19:41.881 Yeah, good on them for restanding. 0:19:43.601 --> 0:19:44.841 But we need a contest. 0:19:44.921 --> 0:19:46.761 We need somebody who's going to go up again, some 0:19:46.841 --> 0:19:51.521 test ideas, test loyalties, test support. If it's going to 0:19:51.521 --> 0:19:54.121 be a one horse race, that's not good for Auckland. 0:19:54.641 --> 0:19:57.281 And remember a third of New Zealand as a residents 0:19:57.281 --> 0:19:57.761 of Auckland. 0:19:57.801 --> 0:19:58.801 We've got to get. 0:19:58.601 --> 0:20:01.881 The politics in the city right, Mark, you'll be giving 0:20:01.881 --> 0:20:04.081 me away giving him to It's only one tech, there's 0:20:04.081 --> 0:20:05.481 no party politics, it's just Wayne. 0:20:05.721 --> 0:20:08.521 We'll wait and see who else turns up. I'm not 0:20:08.721 --> 0:20:11.761 casting him a vote now, and you know I wouldn't 0:20:11.801 --> 0:20:12.761 tell you I voted. 0:20:13.641 --> 0:20:15.641 But I mean it's interesting, is that. 0:20:15.761 --> 0:20:19.561 I mean, God, he had a terrible start in the 0:20:19.641 --> 0:20:24.961 role and he's kind of grown. There's a grudging dislike 0:20:25.041 --> 0:20:25.721 for him now. 0:20:26.321 --> 0:20:29.121 He's not to get the council sort of working together, 0:20:29.201 --> 0:20:30.041 hasn't he seems to. 0:20:30.041 --> 0:20:33.801 Have I mean a grudging respect or wedging. 0:20:33.561 --> 0:20:36.321