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Speaker 1: Retirement Commission has got a bunch of ideas to boost

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Speaker 1: our kew WE Saber pot default contribution should be rising

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Speaker 1: from three to four percent. Employers match that they stop

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Speaker 1: short of making it compulsory. Sam Stubbs, founder of course

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Speaker 1: of the que Saber Schemes Simplicity, is back with us. Sam,

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Speaker 1: very good morning to you.

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Speaker 2: Good morning.

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Speaker 1: Her ideas and your ideas, do they align broadly or not?

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Speaker 2: Not perfectly, Mike. I mean, I think she wants contributions

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Speaker 2: to rise one percent, but if you look at Ozzie,

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Speaker 2: you know they're paying twelve percent. So the Aussies have

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Speaker 2: got five times our population, but they've got thirty five

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Speaker 2: times our savings. So we are savings, but we're not

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Speaker 2: saving nearly enough. But she has to introduce this idea

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Speaker 2: gradually because you know, everyone's gone through a cost of

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Speaker 2: living crisis right now. You know she was to say

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Speaker 2: that QI seven contributions were going she'd go from three

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Speaker 2: to twelve percent, everybody would laugh. But that's possible, but

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Speaker 2: it just takes a long time. I think we should

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Speaker 2: do it about a half a percent a year and

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Speaker 2: take an awful long time to get there, but we

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Speaker 2: have to go there.

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Speaker 1: What's your assessment of the eighteen years and the amount

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Speaker 1: of money people have got put away? And in fact

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Speaker 1: it's not as great as it should be could be.

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Speaker 1: Have we failed or not?

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Speaker 2: I think we have failed. I mean when when when

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Speaker 2: Rob mald Doing canceled, canceled this the last time we

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Speaker 2: tried to do this, you know, we would have had

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Speaker 2: almost well at least a trillion dollars saved by now.

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Speaker 2: So we failed to save enough. I'd say this much

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Speaker 2: like no country in the world ever says that they've

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Speaker 2: got enough money saved by their population. Maybe Singapore, maybe

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Speaker 2: there's one example. So everyone's always saving. You should saying

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Speaker 2: you to save more. But we're certainly a long way

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Speaker 2: behind Ozzie and a long way behind the rest of

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Speaker 2: the developed world in terms of saving for a time,

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Speaker 2: and we have to do more. We're just going to

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Speaker 2: have to do it slowly.

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Speaker 1: What about the government contribution? They've mucked around with it,

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Speaker 1: so they're as guilty as we are, aren't they At

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Speaker 1: the end of the day. Once you I mean the

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Speaker 1: thing about retirement, so you've got to commit, you're in

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Speaker 1: and you're staying.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, And look, the government contribution exists because it's

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Speaker 2: not compulsory. If it was compulsory, then the government wouldn't

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Speaker 2: have to incentivize people to do it right, And there's

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Speaker 2: about three hundred three hundred million dollars worth of incentives

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Speaker 2: which aren't claimed. If so, I think we have to

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Speaker 2: ask ourselves, you know, do we just bite the bullet,

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Speaker 2: spend a billion dollars in another way, make it compulsory,

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Speaker 2: increase it over time, or do we keep having to

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Speaker 2: try to incentivize people. Because the problem here, Mike is

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Speaker 2: that as long as it's not compulsory, the people who

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Speaker 2: most need it won't have it, you know, will there

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Speaker 2: will always be people who will not save for their retirement.

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Speaker 2: Those are the people that probably most have to good.

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Speaker 1: And so appreciate Sam sam Stubbs, Simplicity founder. She wants

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Speaker 1: it round changes around the self employed, people on parental leave,

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Speaker 1: the soft compulsion, This is the auto enrollment, then the

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Speaker 1: opting out she thinks works. With draws on the houses

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Speaker 1: for first time she thinks is okay. Only one percent

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Speaker 1: of members on average had withdrawn funds for first time deposits.

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Speaker 1: So that's it. I mean, that's part of the argument

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Speaker 1: as well. I mean, are you saving for the retirement,

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Speaker 1: or you're saving for a house. Then if you argue

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Speaker 1: you're saving for a house, is a house part of

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Speaker 1: your retirement, and so it goes.

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