1 00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:05,560 Speaker 1: Hilda. 2 00:00:05,640 --> 00:00:08,840 Speaker 2: I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page, a 3 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:10,559 Speaker 2: daily podcast. 4 00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:12,039 Speaker 1: Presented by the New Zealand Herald. 5 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 2: New Zealand is on high alert after an Auckland ferry 6 00:00:19,400 --> 00:00:23,600 Speaker 2: worker tested positive for measles. They were infectious while on 7 00:00:23,640 --> 00:00:27,240 Speaker 2: board a number of Buller's three sixty sailings on May fifth, 8 00:00:27,280 --> 00:00:29,440 Speaker 2: at a Kelston supermarket. 9 00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:30,720 Speaker 1: And downtown car park. 10 00:00:30,880 --> 00:00:34,360 Speaker 2: Two days later they were at Unicem New Lynn and 11 00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:38,559 Speaker 2: Packensave Mount Albert. The marine crew member had recently traveled 12 00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:41,680 Speaker 2: to Asia, but they weren't infectious on their flight home. 13 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:45,320 Speaker 2: So how concerning is this latest outbreak? And have we 14 00:00:45,360 --> 00:00:48,000 Speaker 2: not learned anything from our days of COVID? Today on 15 00:00:48,040 --> 00:00:51,879 Speaker 2: the front Page, University of Auckland Senior lecturer and research 16 00:00:52,040 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 2: virologist Natalie Netzler joins us to take us through the 17 00:00:55,680 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 2: does and don'ts when it comes to measles. And just 18 00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:02,640 Speaker 2: a quick note after we recorded this interview, Health Minister 19 00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:07,240 Speaker 2: Simeon Brown released updated Health New Zealand vaccination data. Just 20 00:01:07,319 --> 00:01:10,880 Speaker 2: over eighty percent of all kids are now fully immunized 21 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:13,679 Speaker 2: by the age of two, the highest rate since twenty 22 00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:16,640 Speaker 2: twenty two. 23 00:01:19,040 --> 00:01:21,880 Speaker 1: So this may seem like a silly question. 24 00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:24,280 Speaker 2: But for those of us who don't know or just 25 00:01:24,319 --> 00:01:27,680 Speaker 2: don't think about measles because we're I don't know vaccinated, 26 00:01:27,959 --> 00:01:31,480 Speaker 2: what exactly is measles and why is it such a concern. 27 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, measles is a really dangerous virus, and I think 28 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:38,880 Speaker 3: it's really underestimated. It's highly contagious, and it's spread through 29 00:01:38,880 --> 00:01:42,000 Speaker 3: the air through coughs and sneezes and droplets. I think 30 00:01:42,000 --> 00:01:45,640 Speaker 3: what's most concerning is that if you're unvaccinated, nine out 31 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:48,600 Speaker 3: of ten people can catch this. If they're exposed, you 32 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:52,120 Speaker 3: get symptoms like cough, red eyes, running nose, spots in 33 00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:54,320 Speaker 3: the mouth, and sometimes a fever and a rash. But 34 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 3: what's more concerning is that over one in ten of 35 00:01:57,280 --> 00:02:01,120 Speaker 3: those who are infected will need hospital care. The complications 36 00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:03,880 Speaker 3: that range from something simple like an air infection, but 37 00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:08,560 Speaker 3: right through to things like permanent hearing loss, brain inflammation, 38 00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:10,800 Speaker 3: and even death. And we see that one in a 39 00:02:10,880 --> 00:02:13,799 Speaker 3: thousand people in New Zealand that are infected will end 40 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:16,799 Speaker 3: up dying, and that's usually from pneumonia. I think what's 41 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:19,760 Speaker 3: even more concerning and people don't really know about, is 42 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:23,080 Speaker 3: that measles can also make our immune system forget. So 43 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:26,400 Speaker 3: if we are unvaccinated and we get infected, then the 44 00:02:26,480 --> 00:02:30,040 Speaker 3: measles actually turns off our immune system, so it forgets 45 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:33,240 Speaker 3: some of the things that we're previously been trained to 46 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 3: be protected against, so we actually get more sick in 47 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:38,840 Speaker 3: the period after we have measles from other things that 48 00:02:38,919 --> 00:02:42,240 Speaker 3: shouldn't normally make us sex. So it's a really dangerous virus. 49 00:02:42,360 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 2: Looking at what we know about the current outbreak, how 50 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 2: concerning is it having these locations of interest. 51 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:49,720 Speaker 1: It feels like we're back in twenty twenty. 52 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:52,880 Speaker 3: Absolutely. I think for all of those that are vaccinated, 53 00:02:52,919 --> 00:02:56,320 Speaker 3: we're really well protected by the measles vaccine MMR gives 54 00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 3: ninety nine percent protection after two doses, so we are 55 00:02:59,800 --> 00:03:02,560 Speaker 3: all safe. But what's more concerning is that we have 56 00:03:02,720 --> 00:03:06,400 Speaker 3: quite low vaccination rates over all for measles at the moment, 57 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:10,040 Speaker 3: and with this one imported case, because it's so contagious, 58 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:13,959 Speaker 3: everybody that's unvaccinated and has been close to this person 59 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:17,520 Speaker 3: or in these areas of interest, they can be exposed 60 00:03:17,520 --> 00:03:20,679 Speaker 3: and catch the virus. We've seen lots of cases overseas 61 00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:23,320 Speaker 3: and here where we know measles can stay in the 62 00:03:23,360 --> 00:03:25,639 Speaker 3: air for a couple of hours after a cough or 63 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:27,720 Speaker 3: a sneeze, so you might walk into a room and 64 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:31,240 Speaker 3: not even know that someone with measles was there before you, right. 65 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:34,280 Speaker 2: And a fairy into supermarket. Those feel like quite concerning 66 00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 2: areas of contact. 67 00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:39,560 Speaker 3: Particularly. I think fairies are quite small, closed spaces, and 68 00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 3: things like the bathroom, really you're sort of trapped and 69 00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:45,680 Speaker 3: they're breathing that same air. So those are certain areas 70 00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 3: that would be high risk for exposure. 71 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:50,640 Speaker 2: So how good or bad are our vaccination rates at 72 00:03:50,640 --> 00:03:51,120 Speaker 2: the moment. 73 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 3: I think what we're seeing at the moment is they're 74 00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:57,320 Speaker 3: really just too low. So currently the rates that are 75 00:03:57,360 --> 00:04:01,200 Speaker 3: reported that we're between seventy six and seventy seven percent 76 00:04:01,320 --> 00:04:05,920 Speaker 3: of our two year olds are vaccinated overall for our immunizations. 77 00:04:06,160 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 3: But what's really concerning is that this is much lower 78 00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:12,680 Speaker 3: in some of our communities due to our really lack 79 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:16,120 Speaker 3: of access and chronic systemic barriers. So what we're seeing 80 00:04:16,160 --> 00:04:18,920 Speaker 3: for some of our Mighty communities is around thirty five 81 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:22,440 Speaker 3: percent our immunization coverage and forty four percent for some 82 00:04:22,480 --> 00:04:26,279 Speaker 3: of our Pacific communities. This is really concerning because after 83 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:29,960 Speaker 3: the twenty nineteen outbreak of measles and some more, we 84 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:33,440 Speaker 3: saw over eighty people died, but even more tragically, they 85 00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:36,640 Speaker 3: were mostly children under the age of four. So we 86 00:04:36,760 --> 00:04:39,000 Speaker 3: really need to get our IMS rates up to protect 87 00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:39,719 Speaker 3: our children. 88 00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:42,440 Speaker 2: So you mentioned there are some barriers. Why are those 89 00:04:42,560 --> 00:04:44,160 Speaker 2: vaccination rates so low? 90 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:47,159 Speaker 3: I think, really it is very complex. So one of 91 00:04:47,200 --> 00:04:51,400 Speaker 3: the real battles we have is misinformation and disinformation all 92 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:55,000 Speaker 3: about vaccines, but particularly about MMR. I think what's really 93 00:04:55,040 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 3: important is that we get more funding from the government 94 00:04:57,360 --> 00:05:00,039 Speaker 3: to make sure that we can have community led in 95 00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:03,080 Speaker 3: initiatives to make sure that we deliver vaccines in a 96 00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:06,039 Speaker 3: way that is appropriate and is easy. So we see 97 00:05:06,040 --> 00:05:09,039 Speaker 3: a lot of access barriers in are harder to reach communities, 98 00:05:09,240 --> 00:05:12,200 Speaker 3: but we also see some real champions. We see cases 99 00:05:12,240 --> 00:05:14,960 Speaker 3: like the moukor van into Taytikuo, which is taking the 100 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 3: vaccine out to people that can't necessarily get to a clinic, 101 00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:20,719 Speaker 3: which is really encouraging. So I think if we could 102 00:05:20,720 --> 00:05:23,840 Speaker 3: put more funding into these areas where we can overcome 103 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:26,560 Speaker 3: some of these barriers, then that will make a big difference. 104 00:05:26,600 --> 00:05:31,400 Speaker 3: But things like access to clinics, lack of trust using 105 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:34,480 Speaker 3: a communication model that's one size fits all, these are 106 00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:39,200 Speaker 3: the barriers we really need to overcome measles. 107 00:05:39,279 --> 00:05:40,960 Speaker 4: Vaccines limit the spread. 108 00:05:41,880 --> 00:05:44,240 Speaker 2: Well, you said, you said it was the most effective 109 00:05:44,279 --> 00:05:46,320 Speaker 2: way to limit this limit the spread. 110 00:05:46,520 --> 00:05:49,560 Speaker 4: Yeah, you know with the present trum's possession of my 111 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:53,280 Speaker 4: possession is there is people who do not want to 112 00:05:53,279 --> 00:05:56,360 Speaker 4: get vaccine and that's their choice, right, and we are 113 00:05:56,400 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 4: to be able to treat them, and we know how 114 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:00,719 Speaker 4: to treat them and die there. It's wry to have 115 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 4: the betest information al treat Thumb understood that, and we're 116 00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:09,080 Speaker 4: focusing on that. But better to get to I get 117 00:06:09,120 --> 00:06:12,880 Speaker 4: the vaccine right because it doeses it limits. 118 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 1: Well and it prevents it. Right, It's it's preventing the illness. 119 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:19,359 Speaker 1: You know, two doses per effective and you said that, 120 00:06:19,440 --> 00:06:24,760 Speaker 1: you said that is this a vaccine that requires a booster. 121 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:28,839 Speaker 3: So this vaccine needs two doses to give you lifelong protection. 122 00:06:29,080 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 3: One dose is better than none. You get ninety five 123 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:33,720 Speaker 3: percent coverage, but it's best to get two doses and 124 00:06:33,720 --> 00:06:36,640 Speaker 3: that gives you ninety nine percent coverage against affection for 125 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 3: the rest of your life. Right. 126 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:40,520 Speaker 2: And the only way like is there any way to 127 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:43,240 Speaker 2: kind of because you usually get it when you're young, right, 128 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:45,240 Speaker 2: So you just have to ask your parents if you 129 00:06:45,279 --> 00:06:46,960 Speaker 2: got it, or is there a record or somewhere. 130 00:06:47,160 --> 00:06:49,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a really good question, and I think you know, 131 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:51,400 Speaker 3: normally we would hope that would be part of your 132 00:06:51,400 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 3: normal immunization schedule, so you get one at twelve and 133 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 3: fifteen months. But what's really important is that people like 134 00:06:57,600 --> 00:07:01,080 Speaker 3: me and my vintage you didn't necessarily have good records 135 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:03,919 Speaker 3: of whether or not you'd been vaccinated against measles because 136 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:06,400 Speaker 3: it was introduced and taken back and then introduced again 137 00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:08,760 Speaker 3: in the seventies as they got better vaccines, and so 138 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:11,400 Speaker 3: I had no record of my own measles vaccine. So 139 00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:14,000 Speaker 3: it's perfectly safe to go back as an adult and 140 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 3: get your catch up doses, which I did and you don't. 141 00:07:17,400 --> 00:07:19,320 Speaker 3: It doesn't matter if you had it previously and you're 142 00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:21,800 Speaker 3: not sure you can actually safely get those two doses 143 00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:24,120 Speaker 3: again to make sure you're fully covered. So I would 144 00:07:24,240 --> 00:07:26,760 Speaker 3: strongly suggest that you go along. It is free if 145 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:29,560 Speaker 3: you were born after the first of January nineteen sixty nine, 146 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:30,800 Speaker 3: and that's exactly what I did. 147 00:07:30,920 --> 00:07:33,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember in twenty nineteen that summer in outbreak, 148 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:35,720 Speaker 2: I had to frantically call my dad and he had 149 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 2: to rifle through boxes of old paperwork to try and 150 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:42,320 Speaker 2: get my vaccination records. It felt like for a while 151 00:07:42,400 --> 00:07:45,360 Speaker 2: there that measles was pretty close to being eradicated at 152 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:48,280 Speaker 2: one point, Right, So what's led to this kind of turn? 153 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's what's so tragic is that it's 154 00:07:50,880 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 3: vaccine preventable and we could eradicated if we had sort 155 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 3: of the right approach. But I think a lot of 156 00:07:57,240 --> 00:07:59,640 Speaker 3: there are a lot of complex reasons why vaccination rates 157 00:07:59,640 --> 00:08:01,360 Speaker 3: have driven I think all of us are a little 158 00:08:01,360 --> 00:08:04,560 Speaker 3: bit overhearing about COVID, and I think the COVID vaccine 159 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:06,560 Speaker 3: being mandated has made a lot of people have some 160 00:08:06,560 --> 00:08:10,280 Speaker 3: sort of fatigue around vaccines. I think again that misinformation 161 00:08:10,360 --> 00:08:13,440 Speaker 3: and disinformation really does a road trust, and that's something 162 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 3: that we have to work really hard to communicate the 163 00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:18,520 Speaker 3: right information to people so that they can make them 164 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:22,480 Speaker 3: formed decisions. I also think one thing that I rarely 165 00:08:22,720 --> 00:08:25,760 Speaker 3: discovered working with our communities around the COVID time to 166 00:08:25,840 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 3: answer questions, is that a lot of the population, a 167 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:32,320 Speaker 3: lot of us are not actually anti vax We just 168 00:08:32,440 --> 00:08:36,680 Speaker 3: want answers to our own specific questions about the vaccine 169 00:08:36,760 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 3: safety and effectiveness. So what I found is a lot 170 00:08:39,440 --> 00:08:42,280 Speaker 3: of mums and dads just wanted to know, my child 171 00:08:42,360 --> 00:08:45,040 Speaker 3: has this, you know, this heart condition or they have 172 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:48,520 Speaker 3: this illness, is the vaccine still safe for them? And 173 00:08:48,600 --> 00:08:51,319 Speaker 3: I found that if we could answer those questions, which 174 00:08:51,360 --> 00:08:54,199 Speaker 3: a GP or a health provider can help answer, then 175 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:57,000 Speaker 3: people were much more likely to go and get the vaccine. 176 00:08:57,000 --> 00:08:59,040 Speaker 3: So it really is just making sure that people have 177 00:08:59,240 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 3: all the right information from good sources so that they 178 00:09:02,679 --> 00:09:05,760 Speaker 3: can go and make informed decisions about getting up to 179 00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:08,720 Speaker 3: date on their immunizations, because that really is the single 180 00:09:08,760 --> 00:09:11,080 Speaker 3: best way to protect ourselves against measles. 181 00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:13,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I know a lot of people want to 182 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:15,959 Speaker 2: move on from COVID, But do you think we've moved 183 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:17,959 Speaker 2: on a bit too much and have forgotten some of 184 00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:20,920 Speaker 2: those key lessons, Like you basically never see anyone wearing 185 00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:24,120 Speaker 2: masks out in public anymore when they're clearly sick. My 186 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 2: producer was at the supermarket the other day, for example, 187 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:28,439 Speaker 2: and saw a man coughing all of the food without 188 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:29,440 Speaker 2: making any attempt to. 189 00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:30,120 Speaker 1: Cover his mouth. 190 00:09:30,400 --> 00:09:34,120 Speaker 2: There's just some basic things we're probably taught at school, 191 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:38,079 Speaker 2: and it doesn't seem that hyperbolic to say we've forgotten 192 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:38,640 Speaker 2: about them. 193 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:41,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, look, I think again a lot of people are 194 00:09:41,840 --> 00:09:44,440 Speaker 3: a bit overhearing about COVID, but that doesn't stop the 195 00:09:44,440 --> 00:09:46,959 Speaker 3: fact that infectious diseases are still out there and we're 196 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:50,000 Speaker 3: still getting exposed and falling sick. As I mentioned, there 197 00:09:50,000 --> 00:09:54,600 Speaker 3: are very few solutions to measles other than immunization, and 198 00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:56,600 Speaker 3: it's the same for a lot of viruses. We don't 199 00:09:56,679 --> 00:10:00,480 Speaker 3: have specific treatments for a lot of viral diseases. Munization 200 00:10:00,640 --> 00:10:02,480 Speaker 3: is the single best thing you can do, but there 201 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 3: are other things you can do to boost your immune 202 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:08,000 Speaker 3: system as well, for example, getting enough sleep, getting some sun, 203 00:10:08,040 --> 00:10:11,400 Speaker 3: eating while reducing stress. These things really keep your immune 204 00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:14,200 Speaker 3: system strong. But as you mentioned, it's really important to 205 00:10:14,200 --> 00:10:16,360 Speaker 3: stay home if you're sick to stop the spread of 206 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:19,200 Speaker 3: infectious diseases. And if you absolutely must go out, if 207 00:10:19,240 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 3: you live alone and you need food and you can't 208 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:23,240 Speaker 3: get it delivered, then it is really important to keep 209 00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:25,400 Speaker 3: your distance and wear a mask. It's just these basic 210 00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:27,480 Speaker 3: rules so that we can try and stop the spread 211 00:10:27,480 --> 00:10:38,200 Speaker 3: of these infectious diseases, including measles. 212 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:41,200 Speaker 2: But we are approaching winter, a lot of people I 213 00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:44,000 Speaker 2: know are starting to get sick. It's going around the office, 214 00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:46,720 Speaker 2: so probably everywhere, every other office as well. What do 215 00:10:46,760 --> 00:10:49,240 Speaker 2: we need to keep in mind as those winter bugs 216 00:10:49,280 --> 00:10:50,600 Speaker 2: start to spread about. 217 00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:53,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's just those basics. Back to basics, 218 00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:57,160 Speaker 3: keeping your immune system strong, getting immunized where you can, 219 00:10:57,320 --> 00:10:59,800 Speaker 3: Keeping in mind that there's lots of infectious diseases out 220 00:10:59,800 --> 00:11:02,720 Speaker 3: there that we don't have specific treatments or vaccines too, 221 00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:06,719 Speaker 3: so keeping yourself safe again. Those the best ways to 222 00:11:06,800 --> 00:11:09,520 Speaker 3: keep your immune system as strong as possible is to 223 00:11:09,520 --> 00:11:12,480 Speaker 3: get enough sleep and reduce your stress, keep moving, a 224 00:11:12,480 --> 00:11:16,079 Speaker 3: little bit of vitamin D sunlight, particular in these winter months. Actually, 225 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:19,200 Speaker 3: vitamin D deficiency is a big issue for our immune system, 226 00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:21,520 Speaker 3: So getting out into some of that little winter sun, 227 00:11:21,600 --> 00:11:23,600 Speaker 3: going for a bit of a walk, getting our bodies moving, 228 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:26,360 Speaker 3: eating well. All these simple basic rules are the best 229 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:29,959 Speaker 3: ways to keep our immune system strong. But again, immunization 230 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:33,160 Speaker 3: is the single best way to protect ourselves against measles. 231 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:39,000 Speaker 5: Most at risk of those who have not been vaccinated, 232 00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:45,199 Speaker 5: so for us that is under twelve months babies and 233 00:11:45,240 --> 00:11:49,840 Speaker 5: then anybody who hasn't had two measles containing vaccination. So 234 00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:52,760 Speaker 5: in New Zealand we use MMR the measles month through 235 00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:55,840 Speaker 5: BELLA vaccination. You need to have two of those to 236 00:11:55,880 --> 00:12:00,559 Speaker 5: be completely protected. So those born between nineteen sixty nine 237 00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:04,800 Speaker 5: in two thousand and four may have only received one vaccination, 238 00:12:04,960 --> 00:12:08,559 Speaker 5: So we're especially asking those people to check your vaccination records. 239 00:12:08,600 --> 00:12:12,040 Speaker 2: With winter approaching and hospitals already filling up, the last 240 00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:18,480 Speaker 2: thing our health system needs is an outbreak. There's a 241 00:12:18,559 --> 00:12:21,960 Speaker 2: high trust model to the public health response, now, isn't there. 242 00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:23,839 Speaker 2: I mean, people are being asked to get in touch 243 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:26,959 Speaker 2: if they believe they aren't considered immune. But if you've 244 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:29,720 Speaker 2: chosen not to be vaccinated, are you really going to 245 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:32,160 Speaker 2: engage with the health authorities? Or am iybe just being 246 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:33,400 Speaker 2: a bit too pessimistic? 247 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:37,480 Speaker 3: Care Again, I sort of come back to the work 248 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:39,839 Speaker 3: that we did with communities in COVID when we were 249 00:12:39,880 --> 00:12:42,840 Speaker 3: answering questions about the virus. So I think one thing 250 00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:45,800 Speaker 3: that really comes across here is that these communities, often, 251 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:49,440 Speaker 3: these communities that have low vaccination rates, it's not because 252 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:52,319 Speaker 3: they necessarily just don't want the vaccine. What we hear 253 00:12:52,360 --> 00:12:55,600 Speaker 3: from them is that there is certainly a lack of trust, 254 00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:58,440 Speaker 3: But often actually what we hear is that it's a 255 00:12:58,520 --> 00:13:01,559 Speaker 3: lack of access to the right information. I think if 256 00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:05,120 Speaker 3: we have this one size fits all approach for communications 257 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:08,280 Speaker 3: about our medicines and our vaccines that just isn't going 258 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:10,440 Speaker 3: to work. And again I come back to the fact 259 00:13:10,480 --> 00:13:12,840 Speaker 3: that the work we did during COVID showed me that 260 00:13:12,920 --> 00:13:15,280 Speaker 3: a lot of people are not anti vacs. They just 261 00:13:15,400 --> 00:13:19,440 Speaker 3: really want their specific questions answered, and it's about knowing 262 00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:22,679 Speaker 3: who to go to for those that information. And I 263 00:13:22,760 --> 00:13:24,720 Speaker 3: think one thing that we could really do better as 264 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:28,400 Speaker 3: a nation is having government funding that really backs community 265 00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:31,760 Speaker 3: leaders that are trusted within that community, that can help 266 00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:35,360 Speaker 3: share the right information and the right way for these 267 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:37,880 Speaker 3: communities so that we get trusts in uplift. And we 268 00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:40,880 Speaker 3: saw this actually during COVID. The more work we did 269 00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:44,320 Speaker 3: in this, the more investment we made, the higher those 270 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:47,120 Speaker 3: immunization rates got. And we actually saw for a while 271 00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:50,360 Speaker 3: they're pecific communities were leading the rates in terms of 272 00:13:50,559 --> 00:13:54,559 Speaker 3: New Zealand vaccinations against COVID. So it really is about 273 00:13:54,559 --> 00:13:57,439 Speaker 3: getting that communication out and getting it right and making 274 00:13:57,480 --> 00:14:00,360 Speaker 3: sure that people really do have the right information in 275 00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:02,439 Speaker 3: the right format to make informed decisions. 276 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:04,920 Speaker 2: It's interesting you bring that up, actually, because I remember 277 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:07,439 Speaker 2: that and it really points to the fact that targeted 278 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:10,559 Speaker 2: messaging for different communities really works. Hey, so if you 279 00:14:10,559 --> 00:14:13,640 Speaker 2: had a magic wand ruguess of magic checkbook, would that 280 00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:14,640 Speaker 2: be the first thing you do? 281 00:14:15,240 --> 00:14:18,560 Speaker 3: Yeah? Look, if I if I was a billionaire and 282 00:14:17,640 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 3: I could self fund these things, I think, really it 283 00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:25,240 Speaker 3: is about protecting children, and it really is about making 284 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:28,280 Speaker 3: sure that parents understand that the vaccines we have in 285 00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:30,880 Speaker 3: New Zealand, they've gone through so many hoops and so 286 00:14:30,960 --> 00:14:33,760 Speaker 3: many tests to make sure that they are absolutely safe 287 00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:38,400 Speaker 3: for use. But it's also about knowing what, where and 288 00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:40,600 Speaker 3: where they can't be used. And so I think what 289 00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 3: I would do is fund community leaders in every single 290 00:14:44,040 --> 00:14:47,880 Speaker 3: community that are already trusted, that have people's ear, and 291 00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:50,240 Speaker 3: make sure that they have the right information and then 292 00:14:50,280 --> 00:14:52,200 Speaker 3: make sure that they can pass that on and share 293 00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:54,960 Speaker 3: that with communities and maybe have this two way dialogue 294 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:57,400 Speaker 3: where that person is sort of a champion in both directions, 295 00:14:57,400 --> 00:15:00,720 Speaker 3: can get the latest sort of information from from health 296 00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:03,680 Speaker 3: providers and then pass that into communities, and then they 297 00:15:03,680 --> 00:15:06,600 Speaker 3: can pass back the questions and really have that dialogue 298 00:15:06,640 --> 00:15:08,920 Speaker 3: so that it's not just one message going out saying 299 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:11,640 Speaker 3: you should do this. Trust us when we've done terrible 300 00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:13,960 Speaker 3: things in the past, and you know you should just 301 00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:16,280 Speaker 3: sort of forget all that and take this medicine to 302 00:15:16,280 --> 00:15:18,240 Speaker 3: stop you from getting sick. It would be more of 303 00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:20,840 Speaker 3: a dialogue in terms of making sure that people understand 304 00:15:20,920 --> 00:15:24,400 Speaker 3: exactly what is in the vaccine, that it's been tested 305 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:27,280 Speaker 3: rigorously to make sure it's very safe, that it is 306 00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:29,760 Speaker 3: the best way to keep our tomadiki out of hospital. 307 00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:31,960 Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us, Natalie, Thank you very much for 308 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:32,320 Speaker 1: having me. 309 00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:39,320 Speaker 2: That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You 310 00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:43,160 Speaker 2: can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage 311 00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:47,240 Speaker 2: at enzadherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is 312 00:15:47,240 --> 00:15:51,000 Speaker 2: produced by Ethan Seals and Richard Martin, who is also 313 00:15:51,160 --> 00:15:52,200 Speaker 2: our sound engineer. 314 00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:55,640 Speaker 1: I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to the. 315 00:15:55,560 --> 00:15:59,000 Speaker 2: Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts, 316 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:03,120 Speaker 2: and tune in tomorrow for another look behind the headlines.