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Speaker 1: So the Kim dot Com saga finally coming to a

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Speaker 1: close or is it twelve years? And lord knows how

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Speaker 1: many millions and lawyers fees and appeals and headlines. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: the Justice Minister signed this extradition paper. So what happens now,

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Speaker 1: Barrister Clive elliotts, where's Clive warning to you? Yes, Monie,

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Speaker 1: have you followed nice and closely like I have?

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Speaker 2: I've kept an eye on it, but it's been a

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Speaker 2: moving feast. So yes, I think I know what's happening.

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Speaker 1: So as far as the Minister's concerned, there will be

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Speaker 1: a review or an appeal of something. Do we know

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Speaker 1: how that works, how long it takes and how long

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Speaker 1: this is going to drag.

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Speaker 2: Out for well, I think a bit shorter than the

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Speaker 2: previous appeals. What will happen is that now that the

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Speaker 2: minister has signed the extradition order, I suspect that Kim

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Speaker 2: dot Com will seek a review of that decision. I

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Speaker 2: don't think you can appeal it because it's not a

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Speaker 2: court decision, it's a minister It's a ministerial decision. So

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Speaker 2: it'll be a question of whether it was properly executed.

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Speaker 1: Is that part of the argument as to why he

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Speaker 1: will have taken the minister taken so long to sort

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Speaker 1: of tie it up in a nice bow so that

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Speaker 1: when it is inevitably reviewed, it's locked up.

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Speaker 2: That's right. And I think the Minister made a statement

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Speaker 2: to say that he'd carefully considered the matter, which is

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Speaker 2: going to be the question is whether he had done so.

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Speaker 1: And when you say carefully considered the matter, what's to consider?

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Speaker 1: The Americans want him. You got to kind of hand

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Speaker 1: him over, don't you.

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Speaker 2: Well, basically, I mean he's been through ten years of

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Speaker 2: appeals and the court has looked at all sorts of angles,

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Speaker 2: and I think the Minister is entitled to say, well,

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Speaker 2: he's had his day in court, and were obliged to

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Speaker 2: hand him over under our treaty with the US.

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Speaker 1: Exactly when you say he's had his day in court,

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Speaker 1: he's had his weeks, months and years in court. Is

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Speaker 1: there something profoundly wrong with the judicial process that if

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Speaker 1: you have enough money and enough lawyers you can pretty

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Speaker 1: much put off a day of reckoning for as long

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Speaker 1: as you want.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think that's a valid question. Yes, I think

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Speaker 2: that's a very valid question. And but he is entitled

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Speaker 2: to exercise all of his appeal rights, which he's done,

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Speaker 2: and I think now the basically that the Minister has

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Speaker 2: to make a decision and he's done.

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Speaker 1: So what I find interesting about it, apart from the

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Speaker 1: fact that's taken so long, is what I mean, you

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Speaker 1: can't answer this, but why is the Why are the

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Speaker 1: Americans so gripped by this?

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Speaker 2: They cut a.

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Speaker 1: Deal with a Sange? Why wouldn't they cut a deal

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Speaker 1: with him? Because I mean, do they need him that badly?

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Speaker 2: Well? I think the I think the view that the

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Speaker 2: Justice Department has taken is that was this was topyright

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Speaker 2: infringement on an industrial scale and it was huge according

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Speaker 2: to their estimates exactly.

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Speaker 1: And my humble opinion, correct me if I'm wrong. Clive.

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Speaker 1: What he always claimed was, look, I've got this vehicle

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Speaker 1: here called mega Upload, and what you do on it's

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Speaker 1: got nothing to do with me, so therefore you can't

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Speaker 1: ping me. That was the stupid still arguments, wasn't it.

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Speaker 2: Well that yeah, that was his argument because he said, look,

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Speaker 2: I don't know what you're doing on the facility. Look

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Speaker 2: a nudge in a wink, I know you, I know

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Speaker 2: you infringing copyright, but that's your problem, not mine. And

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Speaker 2: I think the problem was that Mega Upload was notified

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Speaker 2: by the film studios that there was infringing content on there,

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Speaker 2: so they couldn't use the innocence defence any longer.

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Speaker 1: Exactly, it's been an interesting story. The sad thing that

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Speaker 1: appreciated Clark Clarke Elliott case. The sad thing is this

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Speaker 1: is only a thing because he chose New Zealand. If

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Speaker 1: he didn't land in New Zealand, he was in Hong Kong. Remember,

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Speaker 1: he could have landed anywhere. If he didn't land in

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Speaker 1: New Zealand, we never would have heard of him. The

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Speaker 1: judicial process never would have been bogged down with them,

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Speaker 1: the government never would have been involved with them at all.

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Speaker 2: For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to

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Speaker 2: news talks that'd be from six am weekdays, or follow

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