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Speaker 1: Right now, we're heading to Australia. Doctors there have made

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Speaker 1: history this week. The patient became the first person in

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Speaker 1: the world to live with a mechanical heart for more

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Speaker 1: than one hundred days before receiving a donor heart transplant

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Speaker 1: and been able to live. The artificial heart was invented

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Speaker 1: by Australian engineer Dr Daniel Timms. He is said to

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Speaker 1: be it is said to be a huge step forward

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Speaker 1: in heart medicine. Dr Daniel tims is with me now.

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Speaker 2: Good A how are you doing?

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Speaker 1: Really good? Thanks for being with me. Can you describe

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Speaker 1: for our listeners what this artificial heart looks like.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, actually, it looks like something you might pull out

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Speaker 2: of the under the kitchen sink. It looks like a

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Speaker 2: titanium pump. Some people even described it as a nineteen

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Speaker 2: seventy four DUTs in carburetta. It does not look like

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Speaker 2: an artificial heart, but it absolutely functions like a normal

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Speaker 2: heart and that's really what the key is and the

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Speaker 2: groundbreaking design of this device.

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Speaker 1: Oh and I want to come to that it's sick.

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Speaker 1: But how did you come up with the design? That

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Speaker 1: was twenty years ago that you first sort of invented

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Speaker 1: it and it was to do with your dad.

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Speaker 2: Right, totally. Yeah, So he was a plumber by training.

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Speaker 2: Unfortunately around about a stage where I was completing my

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Speaker 2: engineering studies and mechanical engineering, and unfortunately he developed heart failure.

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Speaker 2: So we're like, well, what can I apply my engineering

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Speaker 2: skills too? Maybe tried to work on a pump that

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Speaker 2: might be able to pump the blood around, might be

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Speaker 2: able to help him one day. But together we worked

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Speaker 2: on that for probably five or six years, you know,

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Speaker 2: going bits and bobs, no money at all, but just

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Speaker 2: going to local hardware stores and just trying out different

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Speaker 2: prototypes of what ideas we might be able to make.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, effectively the idea was born out of you

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Speaker 2: know that backgrounds.

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Speaker 1: What is the hard bit about making an artificial heart?

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Speaker 1: What is the biggest challenge that you faced when you're

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Speaker 1: trying to do this?

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Speaker 2: Durability? So you can imagine, and it's so scary, like

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Speaker 2: you're pulling out somebody's heart completely and you put a

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Speaker 2: machine in its place, and you're relying on that cannot

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Speaker 2: stop right, so it can't wear out. And our previous

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Speaker 2: artificial hearts they're attempted to mimic the way that the

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Speaker 2: natural heart beats. So you have a compressed air sack

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Speaker 2: or bladder with four mechanical valves. There's lots of moving

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Speaker 2: parts and squeezing things that can eventually wear out, so

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Speaker 2: they are only used for a bridge, like a temporary

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Speaker 2: support device. What we wanted to do was make a

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Speaker 2: durable device that could last forever, and the way we

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Speaker 2: did that was doing away with that squeezing action of

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Speaker 2: the heart and instead used a spinning disc basically, a

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Speaker 2: rapidly spinning disc like an FN or a propeller on

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Speaker 2: the back of a boat to propel the blood forward.

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Speaker 2: And that disc is magnetically levitated, so we use levitations

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Speaker 2: like they do in the trains in Asia, so there's

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Speaker 2: no friction, there's no mechanical where the thing is durable,

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Speaker 2: which is the biggest challenge with an artificial heart.

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Speaker 1: Does it need a battery?

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Speaker 2: It does, so the device is powered through a wire

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Speaker 2: that protrudes through the tummy basically, and it goes off

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Speaker 2: to a lunch box sized control box that has batteries attached,

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Speaker 2: and those batteries power of the device through that way.

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Speaker 1: This patient who doesn't want to be named, so we

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Speaker 1: can't use their name, but you've met with this patient,

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Speaker 1: what did it do for them? And how long was

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Speaker 1: it inside them?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so it was remarkably life changing for the patient.

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Speaker 2: He could barely walk ten meters from his bed prior

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Speaker 2: to the surgery with the artificial heart, and after he

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Speaker 2: got the heart, he had the device for three and

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Speaker 2: a half months, just over one hundred days, and that

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Speaker 2: was enabling him actually to leave the hospital, walk around

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Speaker 2: the streets of Sydney, going shopping, going about his normal

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Speaker 2: daily activities, something that he'd never had a chance to

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Speaker 2: be able to do when he was suffering from heart failure,

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Speaker 2: and that all.

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Speaker 1: Had enough time in order to get a heart transplant.

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Speaker 1: So it's buying time basically.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, that's the initial stage that we're utilizing

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Speaker 2: the device for, is to buy a time until a

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Speaker 2: transplant can be made availed and also recover the patient

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Speaker 2: so all the other organs that are suffering from low

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Speaker 2: blood flow from heart failure get better. But our ultimate

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Speaker 2: goal on the back of their success is to eventually

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Speaker 2: have patients not have to return to the hospital to

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Speaker 2: get a heart transplant at all and they just remain

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Speaker 2: on this device for the rest of their life.

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Speaker 1: So one day we might not need human hearts.

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Speaker 2: That's a pretty lofty goal. But at the end of

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Speaker 2: the day as well, like heart transplantation doesn't have its limitation.

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Speaker 2: You know, there's fifty percent survival at ten years to

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Speaker 2: the anti rejection drugs. You're putting somebody else's heart in

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Speaker 2: your body. The body doesn't know it, it doesn't like

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Speaker 2: it being there, so it tries to reject it out.

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Speaker 2: Got to really reduce your rein system in those recipients,

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Speaker 2: and that comes with a lot of complications that end

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Speaker 2: up in you know, not the greatest outcome after a

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Speaker 2: period of time.

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Speaker 1: It's quite a personal thing a heart obviously. How does

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Speaker 1: it feel, especially given the history of this with your dad,

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Speaker 1: How does it feel knowing that this man, this patient

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Speaker 1: was walking around with something you invented in them and

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Speaker 1: that was basically keeping them going.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it was pretty surreal. I mean I spent a

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Speaker 2: lot of time with the patient over that duration of time,

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Speaker 2: firstly to give him a bit of confidence that we're

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Speaker 2: there all the time, but also to learn from him.

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Speaker 2: You know, how do you feel, is there anything we

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Speaker 2: can do differently to make your quality of life better

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Speaker 2: so we can keep improving it for the next patient,

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Speaker 2: and actually he was brought in entirely to that he

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Speaker 2: felt and it actually kind of comes out in the

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Speaker 2: fact that he wanted to remain anonymous. Is the fact

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Speaker 2: that he was doing this for himself obviously, but then

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Speaker 2: also for all the patients. It could come beyond him.

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Speaker 2: So he brought into the idea of giving us that

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Speaker 2: feedback and understanding of how he was feeling and what

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Speaker 2: we can do into the future.

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Speaker 1: What did he say about how it felt?

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Speaker 2: Actually we asked him that directly, like can you feel

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Speaker 2: it at all? I mean, He's like, no, I can't

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Speaker 2: feel it at all. And he said, the only time

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Speaker 2: I could hear it was in the debt of the

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Speaker 2: night when I went home in the hospital. There's deeps

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Speaker 2: and all that you can't hear, and the dead of

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Speaker 2: the night in the middle of a NYCAD could just

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Speaker 2: hear a little bit of a warring, you know, like oooh.

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Speaker 2: And that was about it.

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Speaker 1: Pretty incredible. What's the reaction being like to this, to

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Speaker 1: this development, particularly with this patient, but to the invention

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Speaker 1: in general. What's the reaction being like from you know,

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Speaker 1: the medical fraternity and from patients.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, it's pretty much providing hope for patients, right,

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Speaker 2: because there's a lot of patients out there that just

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Speaker 2: don't have any hope. They're waiting for a heart transplant

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Speaker 2: that may not ever come. So yeah, from them, it

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Speaker 2: gives them that hope. From the medical community, they understand.

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Speaker 2: For decades people have been trying to develop an artificial

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Speaker 2: heart as an alternative to transplant because there just aren't

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Speaker 2: enough donor organs around for all those that need it.

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Speaker 2: The medical community is extremely excited and you know, bullish

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Speaker 2: on this kind of technology because artificial heart is durable,

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Speaker 2: is something that's been out of grass for all of

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Speaker 2: those decades, and finally there's something available here that might

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Speaker 2: be able to challenge the usual standards care of heart

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Speaker 2: family patients.

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Speaker 1: What do you reckon your dad would think of all this, Daniel, Yeah.

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Speaker 2: He'd be pretty he'd be pretty stoked. But yeah it

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Speaker 2: is you know myself as while staying humble and knowing

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Speaker 2: there's so many milestones that had so who just be

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Speaker 2: is like that's a good little mile stone, Daniel, but

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Speaker 2: there's still plenty more to co So keep your head down.

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Speaker 1: And keep working well, keep up the good work, because

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Speaker 1: you're doing good work for all of us. Daniel really

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Speaker 1: appreciate your time. It's doctor Daniel Tamases, the inventor Australian

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Speaker 1: inventor of an artificial heart.

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