WEBVTT - How low vaccination rates left NZ exposed to another measles outbreak

0:00:05.160 --> 0:00:08.360
<v Speaker 1>Kyotra. I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page,

0:00:08.840 --> 0:00:16.160
<v Speaker 1>a daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. New

0:00:16.239 --> 0:00:20.919
<v Speaker 1>Zealand may be on the cusp of another measles outbreak.

0:00:21.400 --> 0:00:24.880
<v Speaker 1>Health en Z has said the risk of further measles cases,

0:00:25.079 --> 0:00:30.440
<v Speaker 1>contacts and exposures across the country remains very high. The

0:00:30.440 --> 0:00:34.840
<v Speaker 1>confirmation of new cases unconnected to international travel, though, has

0:00:35.000 --> 0:00:39.320
<v Speaker 1>experts worried. Today on the front Page, University of Canterbury

0:00:39.479 --> 0:00:43.000
<v Speaker 1>Senior lecturer in epidemiology, Anna Howe is with us to

0:00:43.080 --> 0:00:50.000
<v Speaker 1>discuss what you need to know. So, Anna, how likely

0:00:50.360 --> 0:00:54.319
<v Speaker 1>is it that measles has started spreading through communities from

0:00:54.360 --> 0:00:55.440
<v Speaker 1>what we've seen so far?

0:00:57.120 --> 0:01:01.120
<v Speaker 2>Oh, I think that's it's not even likely that's what's happening.

0:01:01.560 --> 0:01:04.480
<v Speaker 2>We've seen that now with the cases crop up at

0:01:04.480 --> 0:01:08.240
<v Speaker 2>Wellington High School. So I think we have got community

0:01:08.280 --> 0:01:12.399
<v Speaker 2>transmission and we're sitting in an extremely precurious position.

0:01:12.680 --> 0:01:16.800
<v Speaker 1>What's the importance of knowing whether it's linked to overseas

0:01:16.880 --> 0:01:17.560
<v Speaker 1>travel or not.

0:01:18.080 --> 0:01:21.120
<v Speaker 2>So the importance for us is typically with that index

0:01:21.200 --> 0:01:25.959
<v Speaker 2>case because New Zealand doesn't actually have measles endemic, so

0:01:26.640 --> 0:01:30.759
<v Speaker 2>we rely basically measles for us is an important disease,

0:01:31.360 --> 0:01:36.280
<v Speaker 2>and so that's why it's incredibly important for us and

0:01:36.319 --> 0:01:38.800
<v Speaker 2>incredibly important for people who are traveling to places where

0:01:38.800 --> 0:01:40.679
<v Speaker 2>there are no and outbreaks to make sure that their

0:01:41.720 --> 0:01:44.880
<v Speaker 2>vaccination status is up to date and that they're cognizant

0:01:44.880 --> 0:01:47.160
<v Speaker 2>when they come home if they're feeling unwell.

0:01:47.120 --> 0:01:48.680
<v Speaker 1>Do you reckon we're good at that or not?

0:01:49.560 --> 0:01:53.440
<v Speaker 2>If I think it's hard. I think people have much

0:01:53.480 --> 0:01:57.800
<v Speaker 2>greater awareness now post COVID because we've all been through

0:01:57.840 --> 0:02:02.280
<v Speaker 2>the understanding isolation and trying to protect people that we

0:02:02.360 --> 0:02:08.359
<v Speaker 2>love and being cognizant of illness. I think though there's

0:02:08.360 --> 0:02:10.800
<v Speaker 2>a lot of fatigue that's happened post COVID as well,

0:02:11.000 --> 0:02:16.080
<v Speaker 2>and so with the habits always slip right. But also

0:02:16.120 --> 0:02:20.000
<v Speaker 2>I think some people have had negative experiences with that

0:02:20.120 --> 0:02:24.160
<v Speaker 2>as well. I think most people genuinely mean, well, it's

0:02:24.200 --> 0:02:26.880
<v Speaker 2>just sometimes we don't think about things.

0:02:27.360 --> 0:02:29.520
<v Speaker 1>Tell me a little bit about what happened in twenty

0:02:29.639 --> 0:02:33.520
<v Speaker 1>nineteen and perhaps how our situation now might mirror that.

0:02:34.040 --> 0:02:37.799
<v Speaker 2>So twenty nineteen was one of our largest outbreaks in

0:02:37.840 --> 0:02:40.920
<v Speaker 2>a really long time, and that was a direct result

0:02:41.040 --> 0:02:44.919
<v Speaker 2>of under immunization and so having what we are or

0:02:44.960 --> 0:02:47.800
<v Speaker 2>what I refer to as PAULS is susceptibility, right, So

0:02:49.160 --> 0:02:52.080
<v Speaker 2>you have groups that are costed together and allow that

0:02:52.240 --> 0:02:57.880
<v Speaker 2>measles to take hold and then it just it requires

0:02:58.000 --> 0:03:01.240
<v Speaker 2>vaccination again to put a dampner on that. And what

0:03:01.280 --> 0:03:04.760
<v Speaker 2>we saw was a lot of disease, and we saw

0:03:04.800 --> 0:03:09.040
<v Speaker 2>about a third of our cases requiring hospitalization care, which

0:03:09.120 --> 0:03:11.679
<v Speaker 2>is quite a lot. We saw a lot of very

0:03:11.760 --> 0:03:15.680
<v Speaker 2>serious cases, so they required intensive care, particularly in the

0:03:15.840 --> 0:03:19.560
<v Speaker 2>very young. We actually had three infants that required EKMO,

0:03:19.720 --> 0:03:23.919
<v Speaker 2>which is the circulatary support, so very very unwell. We

0:03:23.960 --> 0:03:27.400
<v Speaker 2>had three cases who had in caphalitis, and we had

0:03:27.440 --> 0:03:32.040
<v Speaker 2>two pregnant people who lost who lost their babies, and

0:03:32.120 --> 0:03:36.160
<v Speaker 2>so it was a really really severe event directly related

0:03:36.200 --> 0:03:40.920
<v Speaker 2>to our underimmunization and we unfortunately are in the same,

0:03:41.040 --> 0:03:45.160
<v Speaker 2>if not slightly worse place with our immunization coverage at

0:03:45.200 --> 0:03:48.160
<v Speaker 2>the moment, and so we could see exactly the same

0:03:48.160 --> 0:03:49.720
<v Speaker 2>thing happen again, if not worse.

0:03:49.920 --> 0:03:54.120
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, what level of vaccination coverage does New Zealand have

0:03:54.440 --> 0:03:57.840
<v Speaker 1>now and what ideally should we be at.

0:03:57.960 --> 0:04:03.839
<v Speaker 2>So at the moment, our childhood schedule provides MMR at

0:04:04.080 --> 0:04:08.600
<v Speaker 2>twelve fifteen months, and so we use our twenty four

0:04:08.640 --> 0:04:12.920
<v Speaker 2>month coverage milestone, isn't indicator that we've got that people

0:04:13.000 --> 0:04:15.680
<v Speaker 2>have got those two doses. So that twenty four month

0:04:15.760 --> 0:04:18.720
<v Speaker 2>coverage at the moment is sitting at eighty two percent,

0:04:19.800 --> 0:04:23.080
<v Speaker 2>that's a total, and we need to be at ninety

0:04:23.120 --> 0:04:27.680
<v Speaker 2>five percent in order to have that community coverage. The

0:04:27.760 --> 0:04:30.719
<v Speaker 2>problem is is like I to talked about before, with

0:04:30.839 --> 0:04:34.440
<v Speaker 2>the pools of susceptibility, so that coverage is not uniform

0:04:34.520 --> 0:04:37.600
<v Speaker 2>across the community even at eighty two percent, and so

0:04:37.680 --> 0:04:43.200
<v Speaker 2>we have areas like Northland and Lakes that have got

0:04:43.240 --> 0:04:45.800
<v Speaker 2>really low coverage down at sort of sixty two and

0:04:45.880 --> 0:04:49.520
<v Speaker 2>seventy three percent. And then we have other areas in

0:04:49.560 --> 0:04:53.000
<v Speaker 2>New Zealand. Fortunately some of those are in the Wellington region,

0:04:53.080 --> 0:04:56.760
<v Speaker 2>so het Up Valley capitally in Coast and Canterbury for

0:04:56.760 --> 0:05:03.120
<v Speaker 2>example have ninety percent coverage. And so we have, Yeah,

0:05:03.320 --> 0:05:05.960
<v Speaker 2>we have this under immunization, which means that we do

0:05:06.000 --> 0:05:07.640
<v Speaker 2>have these pools of susceptibility.

0:05:08.800 --> 0:05:12.719
<v Speaker 1>How do we like, what do we do to help

0:05:13.160 --> 0:05:18.279
<v Speaker 1>that more awareness or I mean I suppose it's a

0:05:18.360 --> 0:05:21.599
<v Speaker 1>question that's been pondered for years and years and years.

0:05:23.279 --> 0:05:26.120
<v Speaker 2>Yes, and It's not technically my area of expertise, but

0:05:26.200 --> 0:05:27.960
<v Speaker 2>I work with a lot of colleagues who are in

0:05:28.000 --> 0:05:32.800
<v Speaker 2>this space, and there's a lot of reasons why we

0:05:32.839 --> 0:05:36.560
<v Speaker 2>have low coverage, particularly I mean ours, we're starting to

0:05:36.600 --> 0:05:41.440
<v Speaker 2>go down even before the COVID pandemic, but the pandemic

0:05:41.520 --> 0:05:46.720
<v Speaker 2>definitely interrupted immunization schedules, and as a result, we've also

0:05:46.760 --> 0:05:50.280
<v Speaker 2>seen grown vaccine hesitancy. We've seen a lot of that

0:05:50.360 --> 0:05:55.000
<v Speaker 2>media from overseas as well being played out in New Zealand,

0:05:55.160 --> 0:06:01.240
<v Speaker 2>and so I think there's I mean, I advocate compassion

0:06:02.760 --> 0:06:05.720
<v Speaker 2>if people are hesitant, actually trying to understand why they

0:06:05.800 --> 0:06:08.560
<v Speaker 2>might be hesitant, because there are lots of different reasons

0:06:08.560 --> 0:06:12.160
<v Speaker 2>for that to be the case. But also there are

0:06:12.200 --> 0:06:16.640
<v Speaker 2>lots of system problems, like healthcare system problems that also

0:06:17.320 --> 0:06:21.760
<v Speaker 2>contribute to our underimmunization. And so it's all very well

0:06:21.800 --> 0:06:25.600
<v Speaker 2>and good to have a target, and we've had immunization

0:06:25.680 --> 0:06:29.919
<v Speaker 2>targets before, and the healthcare system works really hard to

0:06:30.040 --> 0:06:33.159
<v Speaker 2>try and achieve those targets, but that comes at a

0:06:33.200 --> 0:06:37.960
<v Speaker 2>cost as well, and you get our worker fatigue and

0:06:38.040 --> 0:06:41.880
<v Speaker 2>burnout along the way, and so we have to manage

0:06:42.279 --> 0:06:44.760
<v Speaker 2>both the healthcare system side of things really well as

0:06:44.800 --> 0:06:47.800
<v Speaker 2>well as the individual level. So if you're having conversations

0:06:47.839 --> 0:06:50.600
<v Speaker 2>with people, it's just really important, I think, to be

0:06:50.720 --> 0:06:54.480
<v Speaker 2>compassionate and listen to what they have to say, reiterate

0:06:54.560 --> 0:06:59.400
<v Speaker 2>what we know scientifically, and then give them space to

0:06:59.480 --> 0:07:01.480
<v Speaker 2>actually think about that and make a decision.

0:07:07.000 --> 0:07:10.280
<v Speaker 3>The vaccine which protects us against measles, comes into combinations

0:07:10.280 --> 0:07:13.000
<v Speaker 3>called the MMR so measles and months rebell it, so

0:07:13.040 --> 0:07:16.000
<v Speaker 3>you actually get protected against three different diseases at the

0:07:16.040 --> 0:07:19.760
<v Speaker 3>same time, which is great news. MEMR vaccine is supposed

0:07:19.760 --> 0:07:23.200
<v Speaker 3>to stimulate your body to be able to fight off infection.

0:07:23.640 --> 0:07:26.640
<v Speaker 3>They if it sees the disease in real time, and

0:07:26.680 --> 0:07:28.880
<v Speaker 3>so that potentially means that you can have some of

0:07:28.920 --> 0:07:32.320
<v Speaker 3>those side effects that occur when you are vaccinated, getting

0:07:32.320 --> 0:07:34.880
<v Speaker 3>a temperature that you may actually get a rash afterwards

0:07:34.880 --> 0:07:37.920
<v Speaker 3>for the vaccine. That's actually quite common. Some people might

0:07:37.960 --> 0:07:41.200
<v Speaker 3>find their glands actually go up after having the vaccine,

0:07:41.240 --> 0:07:42.600
<v Speaker 3>and some people they can have a little bit of

0:07:42.640 --> 0:07:45.160
<v Speaker 3>achy body. For some people that symptoms may occur in

0:07:45.160 --> 0:07:47.520
<v Speaker 3>the first few hours, for others it can occur up

0:07:47.520 --> 0:07:49.920
<v Speaker 3>to a week or two weeks later, but actually they

0:07:49.960 --> 0:07:53.239
<v Speaker 3>stay well with it, so despite having some mild side effects,

0:07:53.240 --> 0:07:55.760
<v Speaker 3>they actually stay very well.

0:07:56.120 --> 0:08:00.240
<v Speaker 1>So the vaccine, it's the MMR vaccine, and you need

0:08:00.320 --> 0:08:03.320
<v Speaker 1>two of them. How can you How easy is it

0:08:03.400 --> 0:08:06.040
<v Speaker 1>for a New Zealander to check whether they actually had

0:08:06.080 --> 0:08:06.720
<v Speaker 1>those two?

0:08:07.080 --> 0:08:09.560
<v Speaker 2>So if you're old like me, you might have to

0:08:09.560 --> 0:08:12.560
<v Speaker 2>dig out your plunket book, which I actually did, as

0:08:12.600 --> 0:08:17.160
<v Speaker 2>did I out of curiosity. Yep, but even I in

0:08:17.240 --> 0:08:20.280
<v Speaker 2>twenty nineteen decided that I would just get a third

0:08:20.400 --> 0:08:24.560
<v Speaker 2>dose because I fit into the age group where maybe

0:08:24.600 --> 0:08:28.560
<v Speaker 2>there was waning immunity and so yeah, so pulling out

0:08:28.560 --> 0:08:31.640
<v Speaker 2>your old health records. If you're old like me, or

0:08:32.679 --> 0:08:35.080
<v Speaker 2>if you're born from two thousand and five onwards, the

0:08:35.440 --> 0:08:38.800
<v Speaker 2>immunization register should have captured that, so you should be

0:08:38.840 --> 0:08:42.520
<v Speaker 2>able to talk to your healthcare provider. And I believe

0:08:42.760 --> 0:08:47.280
<v Speaker 2>if you've got access to the electronic my health records,

0:08:47.280 --> 0:08:50.360
<v Speaker 2>you should be able to see what your statuses as well.

0:08:50.400 --> 0:08:54.520
<v Speaker 2>But generally speaking, if you're not pregnant or immuno compromised,

0:08:55.520 --> 0:08:58.560
<v Speaker 2>then just get a third dose. So you can get

0:08:58.600 --> 0:09:00.560
<v Speaker 2>a dose even if it's through a third one.

0:09:00.640 --> 0:09:06.679
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, okay, cool, Yeah, Because I had the awkward conversation

0:09:06.960 --> 0:09:11.840
<v Speaker 1>of ringing my dad asking him him not knowing, and

0:09:11.880 --> 0:09:15.480
<v Speaker 1>then him having to dive through a thousand boxes to

0:09:15.559 --> 0:09:18.960
<v Speaker 1>try and find because I'm Australian, right, so even people

0:09:19.120 --> 0:09:21.400
<v Speaker 1>from other countries need to be checking this. But you're

0:09:21.440 --> 0:09:24.360
<v Speaker 1>saying that even if you don't have that information at hand,

0:09:24.960 --> 0:09:26.800
<v Speaker 1>it's all good if you get a third dose.

0:09:27.600 --> 0:09:30.880
<v Speaker 2>That's correct and I think too, so you can get

0:09:30.920 --> 0:09:33.240
<v Speaker 2>what we call SEROH testing done and that will check

0:09:33.320 --> 0:09:36.319
<v Speaker 2>the antibody status or the level of protection that you have.

0:09:37.400 --> 0:09:39.840
<v Speaker 2>But because for the most part, there's no harm in

0:09:39.840 --> 0:09:42.880
<v Speaker 2>getting that third dose, it's just easier just to get

0:09:42.920 --> 0:09:43.520
<v Speaker 2>that done.

0:09:43.960 --> 0:09:46.720
<v Speaker 1>In terms of what happened in twenty nineteen to now,

0:09:46.720 --> 0:09:49.280
<v Speaker 1>and I know it's a tricky question because COVID has

0:09:49.360 --> 0:09:52.240
<v Speaker 1>happened in between that time, but do you reckon we've

0:09:52.320 --> 0:09:53.319
<v Speaker 1>learned anything?

0:09:55.360 --> 0:09:58.600
<v Speaker 2>Yes, we did. There are some very nice reports that

0:09:58.679 --> 0:10:03.320
<v Speaker 2>have been produced about the twenty nineteen outbreak, and we've

0:10:03.360 --> 0:10:07.560
<v Speaker 2>also had the Immunization Task Force put out recommendations as

0:10:07.600 --> 0:10:13.160
<v Speaker 2>well about the New Zealand childhood schedule. It's just they

0:10:13.200 --> 0:10:17.960
<v Speaker 2>require system changes and so that's the hard part.

0:10:19.080 --> 0:10:22.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, what out of all of those recommendations that you've

0:10:22.760 --> 0:10:25.959
<v Speaker 1>seen what one do you reckon we should do tomorrow

0:10:26.120 --> 0:10:27.960
<v Speaker 1>if we could sign it off, get it done.

0:10:28.559 --> 0:10:31.040
<v Speaker 2>I'm really in favor of what was trying to be

0:10:31.080 --> 0:10:35.319
<v Speaker 2>achieved with the health reforms, and that was giving communities

0:10:35.360 --> 0:10:38.640
<v Speaker 2>the ability to decide how best to help their communities.

0:10:38.679 --> 0:10:41.520
<v Speaker 2>And we definitely learned that from COVID as well, that

0:10:41.640 --> 0:10:46.079
<v Speaker 2>when we funded communities to decide how best to help

0:10:46.120 --> 0:10:49.280
<v Speaker 2>their communities, we had a lot of success. And so

0:10:49.640 --> 0:10:54.120
<v Speaker 2>I think that would be the most cost effective way

0:10:54.200 --> 0:10:55.719
<v Speaker 2>to go to get good outcomes.

0:10:56.320 --> 0:10:59.199
<v Speaker 1>And let's not forget in twenty nineteen as well, measles

0:10:59.400 --> 0:11:03.800
<v Speaker 1>imported from New Zealand resulted in five seven hundred ish

0:11:03.880 --> 0:11:08.680
<v Speaker 1>cases in some more and that included eighteen hundred hospitalizations

0:11:08.720 --> 0:11:13.120
<v Speaker 1>and eighty three deaths from measles, mostly children under five.

0:11:14.000 --> 0:11:16.240
<v Speaker 1>So not only do we have to think about our

0:11:16.280 --> 0:11:19.360
<v Speaker 1>own communities, but it's important to think about our Pacific

0:11:19.400 --> 0:11:20.280
<v Speaker 1>neighbors as well.

0:11:20.320 --> 0:11:26.440
<v Speaker 2>Hey, absolutely, it is horrifying that we were responsible for

0:11:26.480 --> 0:11:29.880
<v Speaker 2>such a horrific event, and we have a responsibility as

0:11:29.920 --> 0:11:34.320
<v Speaker 2>caretakers in supporters of our Pacific nations to make sure

0:11:34.360 --> 0:11:38.920
<v Speaker 2>that that's not actually happening. So particularly important for people

0:11:38.920 --> 0:11:43.720
<v Speaker 2>who have holidays booked overseas to check out their vaccination

0:11:43.880 --> 0:11:46.000
<v Speaker 2>status and or just get a dose.

0:11:46.520 --> 0:11:49.280
<v Speaker 1>So what symptoms should people be aware of?

0:11:50.000 --> 0:11:51.000
<v Speaker 2>How does it start?

0:11:51.200 --> 0:11:53.960
<v Speaker 1>When should you be you know, when should alarm bells

0:11:54.040 --> 0:11:54.880
<v Speaker 1>start going off?

0:11:55.679 --> 0:11:58.000
<v Speaker 2>I mean alarm bell should start going off if you

0:11:59.000 --> 0:12:02.920
<v Speaker 2>are feeling unwell and you have been a contact of

0:12:02.960 --> 0:12:07.880
<v Speaker 2>a case, or if you've been overseas somewhere recently. Because

0:12:07.920 --> 0:12:09.800
<v Speaker 2>the important part to notice that you can actually be

0:12:09.840 --> 0:12:15.120
<v Speaker 2>contagious before you have symptoms. So that's fun. But it

0:12:15.200 --> 0:12:18.200
<v Speaker 2>begins with a fever and a cough and a running

0:12:18.240 --> 0:12:22.120
<v Speaker 2>nose and sore red eyes, and then you will probably

0:12:22.160 --> 0:12:24.400
<v Speaker 2>start to see a rash which typically starts on the

0:12:24.400 --> 0:12:28.800
<v Speaker 2>face and then moves down the body. And so most

0:12:28.840 --> 0:12:32.320
<v Speaker 2>people will feel really really crap for a while, and

0:12:32.400 --> 0:12:37.400
<v Speaker 2>particularly our small peppy will be very very unhappy. And

0:12:37.720 --> 0:12:43.160
<v Speaker 2>then you run into getting complications, so diarrhea, pneumonia, but

0:12:43.200 --> 0:12:46.559
<v Speaker 2>also you can go into like cornial ulcerations potentially a

0:12:46.600 --> 0:12:51.319
<v Speaker 2>leading to blindness. You've got titus media or air infections

0:12:51.360 --> 0:12:53.679
<v Speaker 2>which can have implications if they're really bad. And then

0:12:53.720 --> 0:12:57.040
<v Speaker 2>you start getting into the more severe end of in carefulitis,

0:12:57.160 --> 0:13:01.559
<v Speaker 2>so that fever cough, running nose, or red eyes. Yeah,

0:13:01.600 --> 0:13:02.200
<v Speaker 2>big clues.

0:13:02.440 --> 0:13:04.959
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and it must be so difficult, especially around the

0:13:05.640 --> 0:13:09.320
<v Speaker 1>seasons changing as well, when people are getting you know

0:13:09.360 --> 0:13:12.920
<v Speaker 1>those flu like cold like symptoms. I've got hay fever

0:13:13.080 --> 0:13:16.400
<v Speaker 1>at the moment, which is super fun, but really recognizing

0:13:16.600 --> 0:13:20.360
<v Speaker 1>a between A and B. Hey like, So, if you're

0:13:20.360 --> 0:13:22.960
<v Speaker 1>feeling any of those things, you've been linked to a case,

0:13:23.280 --> 0:13:27.240
<v Speaker 1>or you've traveled overseas, it's really important to maybe check

0:13:27.280 --> 0:13:30.520
<v Speaker 1>the Ministry of Health website, check out those locations of interest,

0:13:30.600 --> 0:13:31.160
<v Speaker 1>I suppose.

0:13:31.679 --> 0:13:34.480
<v Speaker 2>Oh, that's great advice. The other thing I would recommend

0:13:34.559 --> 0:13:37.840
<v Speaker 2>too is you can call Healthline and have a chat

0:13:37.880 --> 0:13:41.320
<v Speaker 2>with them because they'll guide you too. And that also

0:13:41.400 --> 0:13:43.439
<v Speaker 2>means that you don't have to go into your GP

0:13:43.720 --> 0:13:48.920
<v Speaker 2>or the hospital and be potentially contagious there too. So yeah,

0:13:49.000 --> 0:13:51.720
<v Speaker 2>so have a look see if it is. And I

0:13:51.720 --> 0:13:53.440
<v Speaker 2>mean it's always better to err on the side of

0:13:53.480 --> 0:13:58.480
<v Speaker 2>caution with this, so you know, isolate yourself if you

0:13:58.520 --> 0:14:02.080
<v Speaker 2>think that you it might actually be that thing, and

0:14:02.120 --> 0:14:04.160
<v Speaker 2>get somebody asked to bring over some goodies for you

0:14:04.200 --> 0:14:06.320
<v Speaker 2>to hang out with by yourself.

0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:10.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and with cat in terms of I know that

0:14:10.559 --> 0:14:12.880
<v Speaker 1>the Ministry of health or health in New Zealand rather

0:14:13.000 --> 0:14:15.959
<v Speaker 1>is saying that there are obviously burther cases, there's a

0:14:16.040 --> 0:14:21.640
<v Speaker 1>risk of them, and exposures across the country remains high.

0:14:22.080 --> 0:14:25.760
<v Speaker 1>Is New Zealand on the cusp of another measles outbreak?

0:14:25.840 --> 0:14:26.720
<v Speaker 1>Or are we in it?

0:14:27.200 --> 0:14:28.760
<v Speaker 2>I think at this point it's safe to say that

0:14:28.760 --> 0:14:32.320
<v Speaker 2>we're in an outbreak. It's just a case of waiting

0:14:32.320 --> 0:14:34.320
<v Speaker 2>a few more weeks, probably to see how bad it's

0:14:34.360 --> 0:14:39.240
<v Speaker 2>going to get. Because people talk about how infictious measles is.

0:14:39.280 --> 0:14:43.000
<v Speaker 2>It's one of our most infectious diseases, and so in

0:14:43.000 --> 0:14:47.400
<v Speaker 2>an unvaccinated population that one person can potentially make twelve

0:14:47.400 --> 0:14:50.680
<v Speaker 2>to eighteen other people sick. And again this comes back

0:14:50.720 --> 0:14:54.840
<v Speaker 2>to having those pools of unvaccinated people or grouped together

0:14:55.800 --> 0:14:59.400
<v Speaker 2>and then suddenly, yeah, we're off. It's like I describe

0:14:59.440 --> 0:15:02.480
<v Speaker 2>it sort of as tender in a wildfire situation.

0:15:03.520 --> 0:15:07.960
<v Speaker 1>If we're looking at case numbers, what would be considered

0:15:08.280 --> 0:15:10.240
<v Speaker 1>quite bad?

0:15:11.720 --> 0:15:15.760
<v Speaker 2>Well, personally, I would consider one case really bad because

0:15:15.800 --> 0:15:19.720
<v Speaker 2>every case has the potential to have those severe complications,

0:15:20.760 --> 0:15:24.800
<v Speaker 2>and also nobody makes it out of this without some

0:15:24.920 --> 0:15:28.840
<v Speaker 2>kind of lasting consequence. So our research has shown that

0:15:29.360 --> 0:15:33.520
<v Speaker 2>for those cases in twenty nineteen that even those who

0:15:33.560 --> 0:15:36.680
<v Speaker 2>were based in the community and what we considered mild

0:15:38.440 --> 0:15:42.600
<v Speaker 2>had sort of a knock on effect where they didn't

0:15:42.640 --> 0:15:46.120
<v Speaker 2>have the immunity that they had had beforehand. So compared

0:15:46.200 --> 0:15:51.160
<v Speaker 2>to healthy controls, those cases had more non measles hospitalization

0:15:51.240 --> 0:15:55.040
<v Speaker 2>events and pharmaceutical dispensing in the four years posts in fiction.

0:15:55.320 --> 0:15:58.640
<v Speaker 2>So I guess I don't think anyone's coined it as

0:15:58.680 --> 0:16:00.880
<v Speaker 2>long measles, but we're talking about the same sort of

0:16:00.880 --> 0:16:05.200
<v Speaker 2>situation as long COVID that are even surviving. That infection

0:16:05.320 --> 0:16:10.720
<v Speaker 2>itself doesn't come with our other consequences further down, so

0:16:10.880 --> 0:16:13.720
<v Speaker 2>I would argue one case is bad. Thanks so much

0:16:13.720 --> 0:16:16.120
<v Speaker 2>for joining us, Anna, You're welcome. Thank you.

0:16:19.160 --> 0:16:22.400
<v Speaker 1>That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You

0:16:22.440 --> 0:16:26.320
<v Speaker 1>can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage

0:16:26.360 --> 0:16:30.440
<v Speaker 1>at enzidherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is

0:16:30.520 --> 0:16:33.920
<v Speaker 1>produced by Jane Ye and Richard Martin, who is also

0:16:34.120 --> 0:16:38.600
<v Speaker 1>our editor. I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to The Front Page

0:16:38.640 --> 0:16:42.280
<v Speaker 1>on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts, and tune

0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:45.320
<v Speaker 1>in tomorrow for another look behind the headlines.