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Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talks EDB. Follow

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Speaker 1: this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: Get inside the game from every angle. It's Rugby Direct

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Speaker 1: with Elliot Smith powered by News Talks EDB.

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Speaker 2: Welcome into Rugby Direct, powered by Excess Solutions, elevating you

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Speaker 2: and your business to a higher level. Back for another

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Speaker 2: week to chat everything in the rugby world. My name

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Speaker 2: is Alligott Smith, News Talk MB, lead rugby commentator in Dublin.

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Speaker 2: And joining me Liam Napier, chief sports writer, rugby correspondent

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Speaker 2: for the New Zealand Herald. Liam back again and two

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Speaker 2: matches down of the All Blacks inter vid Silla Greetings.

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Speaker 3: Hello Eliot, ses two down, three to go and well

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Speaker 3: not all positive news but two from two and the

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Speaker 3: All Black train remains just on the tracks for now,

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Speaker 3: doesn't it.

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Speaker 2: Well I was going to ask you twenty four to

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Speaker 2: twenty two, are you a glass half full? Glass half empty?

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Speaker 2: Sorts of person? I guess the All Blacks got the

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Speaker 2: win in the end, which is what they're paid to

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Speaker 2: do and expected to do. But again they've sort of

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Speaker 2: won in spite of everything going on, rather than because

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Speaker 2: they put in a good performance.

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Speaker 3: The All Blacks are a very mercurial team, aren't they.

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Speaker 3: It's hard to gauge on them. But look, I think

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Speaker 3: the fact that they won has to be a glass

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Speaker 3: half full. And they overturned an eight points second half leads,

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Speaker 3: you know, almost blew. It could would have should have

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Speaker 3: for England again, just like it was in those two

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Speaker 3: tests in July some four months ago. But look, I

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Speaker 3: think from my perspective, the All Blacks were the better team.

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Speaker 3: They created a lot, they scored three tries to one.

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Speaker 3: But there were a lot of frustrations in that performance,

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Speaker 3: weren't there I think at twenty two turnovers, a lot

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Speaker 3: of handling eras, discipline issues in the first half, late

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Speaker 3: yellow card again. So they did everything possible to throw

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Speaker 3: it away and they really won it through some individual

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Speaker 3: brilliance Wallace, a tit mark to lee Is finishing, Damian McKenzie,

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Speaker 3: sideline conversion, some big performances off the bench which we

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Speaker 3: can touch on. But it was a real rocks and

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Speaker 3: diamonds performance from the All Blacks.

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Speaker 2: It certainly was discipline another one to throw on that

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Speaker 2: pot as well. It was poor at times. They couldn't

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Speaker 2: seem to adjust to the way that England were attacking

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Speaker 2: the tackling without the ball was a real issue, especially

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Speaker 2: in the first spell off Your Black's got three or

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Speaker 2: four penalties against them that way. It seemed like England

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Speaker 2: were running their runners in a manner where the All

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Speaker 2: Blacks basically had to make a decision around who they're

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Speaker 2: going to tackle. A lot of the times that was

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Speaker 2: an incorrect That was the way that England were attacking

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Speaker 2: their throwing runners into that space and confusing the space.

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Speaker 2: I thought quite well from England and drawing those penalties

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Speaker 2: out of the All Blacks. At one point that the

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Speaker 2: penalty count against the All Blacks was eleven two, got

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Speaker 2: back to eleven seven at the end of the game,

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Speaker 2: because the scrum turns into a weapon once offered, throwing

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Speaker 2: a fussy and passily or TOSSI came onto the park,

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Speaker 2: but again just struggling to find a cohesive performance from

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Speaker 2: the All Blacks and they just couldn't quite set the

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Speaker 2: platform despite being fourteen six up. Now you go, okay, well,

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Speaker 2: fourteen sex up. Wallace to TC and bakes that break

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Speaker 2: to provive he can stretch out and reel it in

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Speaker 2: and finish it. The All Blacks I think would be

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Speaker 2: up probably twenty one to nine, I think at that

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Speaker 2: point in time, and the game heading into halftime is done,

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Speaker 2: but they don't, and then they can see a couple

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Speaker 2: of penalties fourteen twelve different game heading into the halftime sheds,

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Speaker 2: they sort of took two steps forward during the game,

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Speaker 2: they had one step back, and then after halftime took

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Speaker 2: two or three steps back and somehow found themselves not somehow,

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Speaker 2: but found themselves down on the lead on the scoreboard

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Speaker 2: by virtue of some good, really good England play. So

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Speaker 2: we look at that eighty minute performance, it's really hard,

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Speaker 2: I think, to sort of assess where the All Blacks

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Speaker 2: are at because it was a win, yet they didn't

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Speaker 2: actually play that well for long stretches of that game.

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Speaker 3: No very Decko and hired, wasn't it. They did a

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Speaker 3: lot of things well and then they'd undo that good work.

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Speaker 3: Whether it was a penalty to keep England in touch,

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Speaker 3: You know that they could have, like you say, with

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Speaker 3: Tupouvai and the Wallace to tit instance, they could have

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Speaker 3: been up by ten fifteen points at halftime and could

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Speaker 3: have put them away by that sort of margin had

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Speaker 3: they finished a lot of those chances, but a lot

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Speaker 3: of drop ball, a lot of basic skill errors, and

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Speaker 3: that's not what you expect from the All Blacks. This

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Speaker 3: is a team that in previous iterations have led the

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Speaker 3: world for just a simple catch pass execution under pressure

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Speaker 3: where I think it was a sign again that the

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Speaker 3: English rush defense put them under a lot of pressure.

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Speaker 3: They did adjust at times their depth and did find

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Speaker 3: some holes with the switch move that Boden Barrett pulled

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Speaker 3: off around the ruck, with the will Jordan cut back,

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Speaker 3: just simple things like that to change the point of

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Speaker 3: attack worked well, but for large parts that rush defense

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Speaker 3: from England did put them under a lot of pressure,

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Speaker 3: coursed a lot of errors, particularly from the back line.

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Speaker 3: I think the midfield didn't have a great performance. I

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Speaker 3: think Jordie was short of a gallop coming back from

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Speaker 3: that knee injury in Riquewuaney. I think he had that

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Speaker 3: hand injury that he had to go off for. It

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Speaker 3: was spewing blood. Did come back, but he dropped a

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Speaker 3: lot of ball as well. All Blacks under the high

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Speaker 3: ball were found a bit vulnerable the new sort of

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Speaker 3: laws about not escorting that I think they were they

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Speaker 3: were real sitting ducks. Weren't they the high ball recipients.

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Speaker 3: Will Jordan must have been bloody saw because he basically

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Speaker 3: took a serious pounding. But then there was you know,

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Speaker 3: moments of brilliance, chip kicks that that came off Wallace

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Speaker 3: TC and Mark t Lea fully justified his inclusion over

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Speaker 3: Seva Reese in the wing. We've sort of been calling

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Speaker 3: for that all year, haven't we. But a bit strange

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Speaker 3: the faith that the All Blacks had maintained in Sevu

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Speaker 3: when Mark Talia was out in the cold, and he

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Speaker 3: really proved as his finishing prowess there. I don't think

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Speaker 3: they get over the line without him. So good aspects

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Speaker 3: of takeaway from that All Blacks performance, the scrum you

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Speaker 3: mentioned there and the bench, you know, massive concerns about

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Speaker 3: the second half performances this year. Five times in the

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Speaker 3: Rugby Championship they didn't score a point in the last quarter.

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Speaker 3: This time, the bench, huge off between Fassi, Pasilio Tossi,

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Speaker 3: the scrum, Patrick two Poloto was one of the best performers,

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Speaker 3: just hugely physical in the second half. But some big

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Speaker 3: worries I think Elliott for the All Blacks around the

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Speaker 3: line out that capitulated in the second half they had

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Speaker 3: this insistence on throwing long. I think they lost three

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Speaker 3: line out throws and a lot of those were in

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Speaker 3: you know, striking distance of the English line. And when

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Speaker 3: you look ahead to this week, losing Cody Taylor and

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Speaker 3: Bowden Barrett, two hugely senior influential figures in that team,

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Speaker 3: how big of a concern is that, Well, I.

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Speaker 2: Think it is pretty big because they drop off of

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Speaker 2: the currently available hookers in the All Blacks is quite significant,

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Speaker 2: from Cody Taylor to to George Bell is a major

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Speaker 2: drop off. Are laid on some big hits on the weekend.

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Speaker 2: Had you play seventy five minutes and I thought around

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Speaker 2: the park he was actually quite good. But when you

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Speaker 2: a core skill is line out of throwing, you have

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Speaker 2: to get that right. And more often than not, it's

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Speaker 2: not a strength of a sofa a mow as it

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Speaker 2: seems to throw long to the back of the line

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Speaker 2: at all. Beyond those sort of plays you know, fall

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Speaker 2: apart of it when when aa a moo is throwing in,

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Speaker 2: So you can't be as predictable as just going to

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Speaker 2: the front every time either when as a security blanket,

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Speaker 2: so they're gonna have to figure that out over the

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Speaker 2: course of the next four or five days, a sofa

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Speaker 2: are more and get some real practicing or strategies around that,

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Speaker 2: because look, it's not a surprise and when it's been

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Speaker 2: talking about plenty that a sofa. A Moore's big work

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Speaker 2: on as a hooker is his line out throwing around

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Speaker 2: the park. He's great, but you're in there as the hooker.

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Speaker 2: You need to be able to throw him straight. And

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Speaker 2: it's not like George Bower has played a lot of

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Speaker 2: Test rugby or indeed had the greatest of Crusader seasons

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Speaker 2: to justify starting him ahead of of a Moer either.

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Speaker 2: So that's a big concern I think starting this week.

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Speaker 2: So Cody Taylor a big loss for the All Blacks.

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Speaker 2: And when you have Sam MASONI taky your holes still

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Speaker 2: sidelines for the rest of the year. Yeah, the All

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Speaker 2: Blacks don't have a lot of great depth hook it

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Speaker 2: at the moment. In Boden Bearl I think is a

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Speaker 2: big loss as well, just as I thought he actual

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Speaker 2: had a pretty good game at ten. Some of the

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Speaker 2: kicking slightly went Australia was the one that went dead.

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Speaker 2: There was a week Grubber into the twenty two that

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Speaker 2: looked relatively aimless. But I thought he was relatively assured

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Speaker 2: at ten and that performance and would have got better.

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Speaker 2: I think having a run of games at ten under

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Speaker 2: his belt on this tour, so to have it stop

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Speaker 2: start through the HIA protocols is a bit frustrating. I

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Speaker 2: think they're big losses there.

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Speaker 3: What say you loom, yeah, big time. I think you

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Speaker 3: touched on it there with the line out. I think

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Speaker 3: they're going to have to get creative around that because

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Speaker 3: throwing long as okay on occasions, but it becomes predictable

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Speaker 3: and it is higher risk, and so you need to

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Speaker 3: look at variations around that with that, be to the

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Speaker 3: prop at the front or short line out or just

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Speaker 3: going quickly. You need to alleviate some of that burden

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Speaker 3: on armor. It certainly will be an area that Island

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Speaker 3: will target the All Blacks. It's one of their strengths.

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Speaker 3: They're set peace in general, so I expect them to

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Speaker 3: come hard for the All Blacks there. And I agree

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Speaker 3: about Boden. Just the contrast and what Damien McKenzie offered

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Speaker 3: through the first eight tests of this year, some brilliant

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Speaker 3: moments and then some baffling ones. And for a Test

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Speaker 3: against Ireland. I think you're only going to get you know,

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Speaker 3: three four genuine opportunities to really strike. You're going to

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Speaker 3: need that game management. That's been a concern around Damien.

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Speaker 3: So look he now that kick from the sideline. He's

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Speaker 3: performed well off the bench, but it's completely different kettle

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Speaker 3: of fish coming in to start to control the test,

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Speaker 3: to be that navigator. That's you know, Boden has provided

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Speaker 3: a call come here in recent weeks, so it is

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Speaker 3: a real contrast for the All Blacks stare and I

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Speaker 3: think I would like to see a couple of other

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Speaker 3: we tweaked Eliot, I think cam Rougard, I'd like to

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Speaker 3: see him come in and start at half back. I'm

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Speaker 3: not sure about you. I thought Cortez was just a

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Speaker 3: wee bit hesitance at halfback, struggled a touch with the

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Speaker 3: pressure that England brought to the breakdown. And Rougo's sister

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Speaker 3: a bit of a bigger body. I thought he did

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Speaker 3: make a big impact when he came off the bench.

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Speaker 3: So maybe flip those two around there and then Patrick

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Speaker 3: two Poloto. I think he was huge off the bench,

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Speaker 3: you know, I know to been massive this season, so

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Speaker 3: maybe there's a conversation to have about which way around

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Speaker 3: those two props start sorry locks and then the other

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Speaker 3: one Ethan the group missing last week, your black scrum

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Speaker 3: was actually under a fair amount of pressure for fifty

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Speaker 3: odd minutes before they made those changes. So you'd think

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Speaker 3: Ethan the Groups served his punishment. Do you expect him

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Speaker 3: to come back in and start this week and shore

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Speaker 3: up that scrummer bit?

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Speaker 2: I do. I look, I thought the weekend was going

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Speaker 2: to be a big opportunity for Tomighty Williams, but he

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Speaker 2: got picked a couple of times at scrum time, didn't

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Speaker 2: have quite the impact on the game that he would

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Speaker 2: have hoped. I thought it could have been a wee

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Speaker 2: transition moment in terms of that, because I think Ethan

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Speaker 2: de Grootz had a roll heavily quiet year and that

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Speaker 2: all black role obviously missed some of the tests through

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Speaker 2: injuries as well. But I thought the game was set

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Speaker 2: up in theory for to Mighty Williams to have a

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Speaker 2: stormer and really create some question marks around the pecking

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Speaker 2: order of the Lucier prop. But I don't think he

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Speaker 2: did that, And I think Ethan de Grootz having served

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Speaker 2: his punishment, at least according to what Scott Robertson said

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Speaker 2: last week, we'll be back in the mix for this week.

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Speaker 2: I agree, can't argue with too many of those tweets

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Speaker 2: that you suggested there. I wondered whether t J. Pettinara

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Speaker 2: maybe the contender off the bench to back up Cam Royguard.

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Speaker 2: I really liked the idea of Roy Gards starting against

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Speaker 2: Ireland and his ability to snipe around the edges. His

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Speaker 2: running game is excellent. I think he matches up quite

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Speaker 2: well against this Irish team. Corte Isratama didn't have probably

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Speaker 2: since he's taken on the starting role. Wasn't the best

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Speaker 2: of performances from Cortez Ratama, But I think maybe here

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Speaker 2: you get Peter Andara on the bench this week for

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Speaker 2: his defensive abilities. But can't argue too much more with that,

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Speaker 2: especially on a six day turnaround. Almost think you kind

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Speaker 2: of need to keep the hot hand as much as

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Speaker 2: you possibly can with those players that were there at

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Speaker 2: twickt him, and then you can maybe look at a

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Speaker 2: couple of other tweaks here and there for France. Given

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Speaker 2: the nature of the workload that is in front of you.

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Speaker 2: Let's talk about the Irish Test.

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Speaker 3: You know, a.

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Speaker 2: Grudge match in many ways it's developed into in recent

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Speaker 2: years on the back of twenty sixteen, the first win

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Speaker 2: in Chicago, a bit of bad blood around the return

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Speaker 2: match and Dublin a couple of weeks after that. There's

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Speaker 2: been other matches through there. The series in twenty twenty

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Speaker 2: two of course, which Ireland famously won and created havoc

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Speaker 2: in the All Blacks coaching staff and false changes there

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Speaker 2: and then the All Blacks winning the World Cup quarter

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Speaker 2: final mean there's no shortage of storylines between these two

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Speaker 2: teams in recent years. The backdrop to it is quite spectacular.

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Speaker 2: It's developed in quite the rivalry in recent years.

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Speaker 3: That's one of the great rivalries and world rugby, isn't that.

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Speaker 3: Elliott and the Springboks will always be the All Black's

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Speaker 3: greatest rival. But I think in terms of animosity or

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Speaker 3: feeling not quite mutual dislike. I've got a number of

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Speaker 3: Irish friends and the media continued as well, But there've

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Speaker 3: been so many heated battles and exchanges in recent years,

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Speaker 3: haven't they haven't there and on the pitch as well.

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Speaker 3: When you go back to that series in New zeal

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Speaker 3: Allen's and Peter o'manny calling Sam Kine a ship, Richie

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Speaker 3: mccaor and then the World Cup quarterfinal with Riquewane telling

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Speaker 3: six and to get on the plane and joy enjoy retirement.

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Speaker 3: So there's been a lot of back and forward, a

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Speaker 3: lot of genuine heat between the players. It's not manufactured

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Speaker 3: by us in the media or the fans. There's genuine

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Speaker 3: heats there. And while some of those players have moved on,

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Speaker 3: some of them are still very much front and center

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Speaker 3: and above all we else. It's just the closeness of

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Speaker 3: the contests and the intenseness of the matches that that

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Speaker 3: World Cup quarterfinal was one of the greatest matches and

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Speaker 3: World Cup history wasn't It could have gone either way,

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Speaker 3: the All Black's defending their line at the death for

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Speaker 3: what was it fifteen twenty odd phases, Sam Whitelocke getting

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Speaker 3: the turnover to win the match, just the emotion at

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Speaker 3: the and also I think the nature of the rivalry

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Speaker 3: has evolved significantly since twenty sixteen, because the backdrop to

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Speaker 3: that match in the World Cup was Ireland were hot

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Speaker 3: favorites and you go back, you know, six odd years

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Speaker 3: or so, that was unthinkable. And also just the level

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Speaker 3: of confidence among the Irish fans before that World Cup

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Speaker 3: quarterfinal was like nothing I've ever witnessed before from an

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Speaker 3: Irish rugby supporters group. They had that match won. There

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Speaker 3: was no question in their minds that they were winning

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Speaker 3: their first World Cup quarterfinal progressing beating the All Blacks.

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Speaker 3: There was just no sense of doubts at all and

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Speaker 3: the deflation afterwards was palpable, wasn't it Because there was

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Speaker 3: just that level of expectation that Ireland were going to

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Speaker 3: win that match from their fans and there were so

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Speaker 3: many of them traveling to fronts. So that match which

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Speaker 3: really changed the complexion of the World Cup and there's

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Speaker 3: no doubt that this Irish group will be helping on

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Speaker 3: revenge and carrying a lot of hurt from that result.

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Speaker 3: And look, they've done the All Blacks no favors either,

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Speaker 3: have they? With the six day turnaround Friday Nights, this

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Speaker 3: match sold out as soon as it's was put on sale.

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Speaker 3: As soon as the tickets went out to the Irish clubs,

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Speaker 3: they were snapped up. So it will be an absolutely

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Speaker 3: amazing atmosphere and a really you know, spectacular match again,

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Speaker 3: I'm sure.

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Speaker 2: Indeed all right, Liam, who wins Friday Night my time

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Speaker 2: Saturday morning in New Zealand.

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Speaker 3: Look, I'm in the Tip Islands Elliott's. I was reasonably

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Speaker 3: confident that the All Blacks would win last week at Twickenham,

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Speaker 3: but I just think they've got a lot against them

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Speaker 3: this week. The injuries, I think really hurt their chances.

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Speaker 3: As we've already touched on, I think Ireland are fresh.

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Speaker 3: The sixth day turnaround is tough, and Ireland of the

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Speaker 3: world's number one team. This is This is not you know, Australia, Argentina, England.

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Speaker 3: This this is Ireland and in their own backyard they

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Speaker 3: are incredibly tough to beat. I think the All Blacks

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Speaker 3: have lost their last two in Dublin. Correct me if

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Speaker 3: I'm wrong there. And Andy Farrell is a very studie coach. Look,

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Speaker 3: I think if the All Blacks perform to their best

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Speaker 3: and get rid of those eras that we talked about,

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Speaker 3: they are real. They are real chants. But I think

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Speaker 3: the tab has the All Blacks two fifty and Ireland

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Speaker 3: one fifty. I think that's pretty accurate.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think Ireland certainly going his favorites for this one.

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Speaker 2: I've tipped the All Blacks and people go, how do

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Speaker 2: you think this tour is going to play out. I've

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Speaker 2: actually thought they're gonna win. I've said, you know, I

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Speaker 2: think they're going to beat England and I think they're

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Speaker 2: going to beat Ireland and maybe drop the game against

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Speaker 2: France next week. So I'm going to stick with that

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Speaker 2: for the time being. We'll see how it plays out

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Speaker 2: on Saturday morning, Usal on time, Live Tree on gold

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Speaker 2: Sport News Talk, ZMB and iHeartRadio can follow live blog.

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Speaker 2: It's INZID Herald dot co dot NZ as well in

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Speaker 2: all the match reaction on the New Zealand Herald site soon.

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Speaker 2: I was also told today the Rayburn shield the lineal

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Speaker 2: Rugby shields, the mythical beast that it is and go

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Speaker 2: right back into the Rugby Director archives to hear more

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Speaker 2: about that. That match, that trophy on the line this

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Speaker 2: week Island the current holders to something else to play for.

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Speaker 2: We'll take quick break here on Rugby Direct. Back with

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Speaker 2: the second half after this.

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Speaker 1: This is Rugby Direct, a podcast for real rugby fares.

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Speaker 3: Powered by News Talks V.

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Speaker 2: You're back with Rugby Direct powered by Excess Solutions.

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Speaker 1: Now.

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Speaker 2: Reports Liam and the South Afragan Outlet report of a

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Speaker 2: speculation of an IPL style tournament with the United States.

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Speaker 2: Links details fairly thin on the around, but described as

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Speaker 2: the best of the best in i PL sort of

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Speaker 2: style tournament. You've been a big ten nice Super Kings

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Speaker 2: fan for as long as I can remember, So does

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Speaker 2: this get the blood pumping?

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Speaker 3: No, it certainly does not, Elliott, And look, this has

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Speaker 3: been around the concept, hasn't it for you know a

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Speaker 3: good four years. There was talk about it being in

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Speaker 3: London I think last time, and Steve Hanson and various

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Speaker 3: other you know rugby identities coaches were paid to promote

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Speaker 3: us and get involved. So it's interesting to see where

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Speaker 3: it goes that the IPL has caused well T twenty

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Speaker 3: cricket has caused a massive disruption, hasn't it to the

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Speaker 3: international game of cricket? And there's a real sea change

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Speaker 3: in terms of players going for the money and not

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Speaker 3: playing for their country. So if this does come off

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Speaker 3: as has been reported, it would be a massive issue

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Speaker 3: for international rugby to tackle hit on because ultimately the

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Speaker 3: players are putting their bodies on the line and a

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Speaker 3: lot of them will sell to the highest bidder and

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Speaker 3: I don't think you can blame them for that. And

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Speaker 3: a sport as tough as rugby. So if it does

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Speaker 3: get pulled off and the figures are correct, is you know,

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Speaker 3: talk about nine hundred thousand for one player to go

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Speaker 3: and play in this twelve tournament. That's a staggering figure

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Speaker 3: for a short amount of time. I think it would

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Speaker 3: cause massive issues.

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Speaker 2: I think so, And to be honest, it feels like

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Speaker 2: rugby has been waiting for this moment and trepidation. Cricket

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Speaker 2: obviously has had it. We've had to lived golf as well,

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Speaker 2: and while this isn't sort of Saudi backed, it feels

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Speaker 2: like something was like this was coming for rugby at

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Speaker 2: some point. I guess the model is slightly different. Players

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Speaker 2: spread out as is anyway in France and England and

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Speaker 2: Japan in terms of that financial boon for a lot

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Speaker 2: of Kiwi players, so maybe that is going to limit

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Speaker 2: some of the damage. But I think it is worrying

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Speaker 2: for international rugby if this becomes off the ground and

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Speaker 2: is able to create some players, because ultimately money dictates

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Speaker 2: so many decisions and you'd hate to see international rugby

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Speaker 2: dwarfs or hurt by something like this concept. I do

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Speaker 2: think there is enough still an international rugby to keep

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Speaker 2: players from making that decision the World Cups and Lions

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Speaker 2: Tours and whatever else it might be. But it's something

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Speaker 2: that I think Ruggy bosses are going to have to

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Speaker 2: be cognizant of over the next few years.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure. I think it's a massive issue and

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Speaker 3: it'd be interesting to know who's the financial backup, where's

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Speaker 3: the money coming from? Because it's head turning, isn't it?

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Speaker 3: And as it sustainable, is it going to last? Is

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Speaker 3: it actually going to get off the ground. There's a

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Speaker 3: lot of questions around this, but like you say, money

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Speaker 3: talks and those are pretty big sums being thrown around.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, hopeful it's not Allen Stanford right. Topic number two

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Speaker 2: in the Final four Johnny Sexton in the Ireland coaching

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Speaker 2: set up. I believe he's helping out the tens specifically

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Speaker 2: and the playmakers for this week. Just adds a little

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Speaker 2: bit of extra spice to proceedings this week. Having Johnny

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Speaker 2: still in the mix. Is everyone heads to.

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Speaker 3: A either, Sure it does, Elliott's you don't have to

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Speaker 3: go back too far to hear Johnny's thoughts on Riquewhanny

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Speaker 3: and the whole rugby world. He came out and fired

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Speaker 3: a few shots in his book, didn't he? And you know,

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Speaker 3: I guess that's what you want when you're selling an autobiography.

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Speaker 3: But no surprise that someone of Johnny's elk is involved

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Speaker 3: in the Irish coaching team. I think he'd be silly

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Speaker 3: not to tap into his nausis and as an analyst,

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Speaker 3: as a mentor for the tens. It sounds like he

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Speaker 3: is actually heavily involved, but it certainly ads a bit

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Speaker 3: of spice given how things played out at the World Cup.

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Speaker 3: My advice would be to keep him off the pitch

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Speaker 3: so he doesn't go abusing referees or get up and

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Speaker 3: recol one his grill because then more from rugby to

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Speaker 3: UFC pretty rapidly.

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Speaker 2: Topic number three in the final four is what of TSI,

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Speaker 2: the most assured All Blacks debutante in the last decade?

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Speaker 2: How good was he on the weekend?

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Speaker 3: It's doing it every week, Elliott, it really is. I

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Speaker 3: haven't seen him for a couple of weeks, and I

431
00:24:36,613 --> 00:24:39,853
Speaker 3: guess you can forget about the breadth of his skill,

432
00:24:40,733 --> 00:24:47,133
Speaker 3: his confidence. It's easy to forget just how how shorter

433
00:24:47,293 --> 00:24:49,413
Speaker 3: period that he's been in this All Black team, only

434
00:24:50,013 --> 00:24:53,653
Speaker 3: a couple of months. Going back to his first starts

435
00:24:53,693 --> 00:24:58,573
Speaker 3: in Cape Town, his footwork at the line, his involvement

436
00:24:58,613 --> 00:25:01,613
Speaker 3: on the carry, his line out work. He created that

437
00:25:01,653 --> 00:25:04,893
Speaker 3: first try for Mark Tala by sucking into defenders and offloading.

438
00:25:05,733 --> 00:25:07,973
Speaker 3: He fired that ball back on the inside after a

439
00:25:07,973 --> 00:25:11,373
Speaker 3: massive break that tuper I couldn't quite gather. And yeah,

440
00:25:11,413 --> 00:25:15,213
Speaker 3: I think you're right, Lewis Herman Watts, one of our

441
00:25:15,373 --> 00:25:17,773
Speaker 3: sort of former friends and colleagues who's now in London,

442
00:25:17,813 --> 00:25:20,493
Speaker 3: that sent me a tweet saying he's the best rookie

443
00:25:20,533 --> 00:25:23,893
Speaker 3: since And I said Aaron Smith and that was going

444
00:25:23,933 --> 00:25:26,573
Speaker 3: back to twenty twelve. And what about you? Is there

445
00:25:26,573 --> 00:25:29,533
Speaker 3: anyone that he could throw up that has made a

446
00:25:30,733 --> 00:25:34,773
Speaker 3: more swift impression on the international scene. You know, you'd

447
00:25:34,773 --> 00:25:36,533
Speaker 3: have to think Wallas the teaser. Just hand him that

448
00:25:36,573 --> 00:25:39,213
Speaker 3: the World Breakthrough Player of the Year award, now, right.

449
00:25:39,573 --> 00:25:42,453
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so. I'm really battling to think of

450
00:25:42,493 --> 00:25:45,813
Speaker 2: players that have made such an immediate impact. I mean,

451
00:25:45,853 --> 00:25:49,933
Speaker 2: Cam Roy guards developed well as a Test footballer and

452
00:25:50,533 --> 00:25:55,173
Speaker 2: took his opportunities when he's been given them. Think back

453
00:25:55,173 --> 00:25:58,373
Speaker 2: to someone like Nearhi Milner's scudder in twenty fifteen, who

454
00:25:58,453 --> 00:26:01,333
Speaker 2: played Test rugby like he played it. All of his life.

455
00:26:01,413 --> 00:26:05,933
Speaker 2: Unfortunately it burned out pretty quickly for Milner's scudder with injuries,

456
00:26:05,933 --> 00:26:07,853
Speaker 2: but he's someone to go back to. But that Aaron

457
00:26:07,893 --> 00:26:11,453
Speaker 2: Smith can parison is very very apt because you expect

458
00:26:11,453 --> 00:26:14,493
Speaker 2: players to take their time to develop into Test footballs.

459
00:26:14,493 --> 00:26:17,613
Speaker 2: You don't expect them to have it from the word go.

460
00:26:18,533 --> 00:26:22,293
Speaker 2: Wallace the t T, much like Aaron Smith, appears destined

461
00:26:22,293 --> 00:26:24,933
Speaker 2: to be a Test footballer for a very very long

462
00:26:24,973 --> 00:26:27,053
Speaker 2: time and on the back of what we've seen in

463
00:26:27,093 --> 00:26:28,773
Speaker 2: his test matches to date, and I hope that is

464
00:26:28,813 --> 00:26:31,493
Speaker 2: indeed the case, because he could be you know, a

465
00:26:31,653 --> 00:26:34,133
Speaker 2: very very long term All Black. Without wanting to put

466
00:26:34,293 --> 00:26:36,453
Speaker 2: you know, too much on his shoulders at this young age,

467
00:26:36,493 --> 00:26:39,573
Speaker 2: but you know, I think that Aaron Smith the comparison

468
00:26:40,333 --> 00:26:43,533
Speaker 2: is absolutely bang on. And Wallace the TT, you know,

469
00:26:43,613 --> 00:26:45,853
Speaker 2: if he has we had Aaron Smith on the podcast

470
00:26:45,853 --> 00:26:46,893
Speaker 2: ear the end of the year, if he can play

471
00:26:46,893 --> 00:26:48,333
Speaker 2: one hundred tests with the All Blacks, I think he'll

472
00:26:48,333 --> 00:26:50,453
Speaker 2: be doing pretty well.

473
00:26:50,333 --> 00:26:51,933
Speaker 3: And that's right, and that's something to look forward to,

474
00:26:51,973 --> 00:26:53,293
Speaker 3: isn't it. When you get to one hundred tests for

475
00:26:53,333 --> 00:26:57,293
Speaker 3: the All Blacks, you get the accolade and the respect

476
00:26:57,293 --> 00:26:59,853
Speaker 3: of coming on Ruggay Direct, so it's something something for

477
00:26:59,933 --> 00:27:01,933
Speaker 3: him to look forward to in his later career.

478
00:27:02,253 --> 00:27:05,613
Speaker 2: Absolutely that is part of the deal. Get the silver

479
00:27:05,693 --> 00:27:09,973
Speaker 2: cap and the appearance on Rugby e Wrecks and final topic,

480
00:27:10,253 --> 00:27:12,693
Speaker 2: in fact, it's a few topics. Who will win the

481
00:27:12,733 --> 00:27:16,373
Speaker 2: fixtures this weekend outside of Ireland and the All Blacks

482
00:27:16,373 --> 00:27:19,213
Speaker 2: weigame of predictions for that moment ago, let's run through

483
00:27:19,253 --> 00:27:24,653
Speaker 2: these liam Saturday Local Times that Sunday morning, New Zealand,

484
00:27:24,773 --> 00:27:28,013
Speaker 2: England and Australia at Alion Stadium, Twickenham.

485
00:27:29,173 --> 00:27:32,573
Speaker 3: Yes, back to Twickers. Look, Australia's got will skelt him

486
00:27:32,573 --> 00:27:35,053
Speaker 3: back in the mix, but that will not be much

487
00:27:35,173 --> 00:27:36,493
Speaker 3: enough to get them over the line.

488
00:27:37,613 --> 00:27:41,933
Speaker 2: I think Australia wins that match. Joey sewer Lee if

489
00:27:41,933 --> 00:27:45,133
Speaker 2: he plays will Skeleton. It's all come together in the

490
00:27:45,133 --> 00:27:52,773
Speaker 2: words you love Ehlee and Argentina. You are Motherland of

491
00:27:52,853 --> 00:27:54,373
Speaker 2: sorts against Argentina.

492
00:27:55,173 --> 00:27:59,133
Speaker 3: That's the beautiful Homelands just makes the heart sing. Elliott,

493
00:27:59,573 --> 00:28:04,773
Speaker 3: take me back to Italy now, look, Italy on the rise?

494
00:28:04,773 --> 00:28:08,053
Speaker 3: Aren't they improving? It's always a bit of an unpredictable

495
00:28:08,053 --> 00:28:11,213
Speaker 3: fiction that but I think you'd have to go with

496
00:28:11,253 --> 00:28:14,173
Speaker 3: the Pomas just on the basis of what they put

497
00:28:14,213 --> 00:28:16,493
Speaker 3: out during the Raby Championships, some big victories over the

498
00:28:16,533 --> 00:28:20,013
Speaker 3: spring Box at home and the All Blacks in New Zealand,

499
00:28:20,093 --> 00:28:22,813
Speaker 3: so I'll tip them to start their tour on a

500
00:28:22,853 --> 00:28:23,533
Speaker 3: positive note.

501
00:28:23,773 --> 00:28:26,253
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm going to disappoint a friend of leader as well.

502
00:28:26,293 --> 00:28:30,013
Speaker 2: I'm going to go with Argentina. Pablo Mateta out with

503
00:28:30,333 --> 00:28:33,453
Speaker 2: suspension for this game, but I still think Argentina will

504
00:28:33,493 --> 00:28:36,373
Speaker 2: be too strong. France and Japan at Star de France

505
00:28:37,693 --> 00:28:39,693
Speaker 2: look hard to go past the home side, isn't it.

506
00:28:40,893 --> 00:28:44,973
Speaker 3: Yeah again, France are unpredictable, weren't they when they play

507
00:28:44,973 --> 00:28:48,693
Speaker 3: opposition that are beneath them? And I think Japan certainly

508
00:28:48,733 --> 00:28:51,493
Speaker 3: are that. But surely they don't lose at home to

509
00:28:52,373 --> 00:28:54,893
Speaker 3: Japan and the state that they are. And currently with

510
00:28:55,013 --> 00:28:55,693
Speaker 3: Bertie Jones.

511
00:28:56,133 --> 00:28:59,933
Speaker 2: We move on now to Sunday in Europe and Wales

512
00:29:00,013 --> 00:29:04,453
Speaker 2: hosting Fiji in Cardiff. This is a really tricky game

513
00:29:05,093 --> 00:29:07,773
Speaker 2: to pick. I think Fiji it's been a little up

514
00:29:07,813 --> 00:29:13,933
Speaker 2: and down this year, blown out by Scotland's on the weekends.

515
00:29:13,933 --> 00:29:17,013
Speaker 2: But do they go to Cardiff and get the win?

516
00:29:18,413 --> 00:29:21,613
Speaker 3: I think they'll push Wales for sure, and they should

517
00:29:21,653 --> 00:29:24,693
Speaker 3: be better for a head out in Scotland, but that

518
00:29:24,933 --> 00:29:27,533
Speaker 3: was quite a big margin that the Scot's put on

519
00:29:27,573 --> 00:29:32,373
Speaker 3: them in Edinburgh, so lo I'll tip Wales, but I

520
00:29:32,373 --> 00:29:36,893
Speaker 3: wouldn't be putting any money on that match because hard

521
00:29:36,973 --> 00:29:38,933
Speaker 3: to know where Wales are at and what they're going

522
00:29:39,013 --> 00:29:40,093
Speaker 3: to bring as well and.

523
00:29:40,213 --> 00:29:42,773
Speaker 2: Gets you trust. I'm going to go Wales as well.

524
00:29:43,493 --> 00:29:47,773
Speaker 2: And the final match of this weekend see Scotland's at

525
00:29:47,853 --> 00:29:52,533
Speaker 2: murray Fields hosting South Africa. What do you reckon?

526
00:29:54,613 --> 00:29:57,133
Speaker 3: Oh? I think this will be tight, Elliott, Scotland's not

527
00:29:57,133 --> 00:30:00,613
Speaker 3: an easy place to go, but I'm going to tip

528
00:30:00,653 --> 00:30:02,853
Speaker 3: South Africa to start their tour. I know they've got

529
00:30:02,853 --> 00:30:06,213
Speaker 3: a few injury concerns and rust you'll be juggling that

530
00:30:06,293 --> 00:30:10,053
Speaker 3: squads and have a few excuses up his sleeve just

531
00:30:10,093 --> 00:30:12,573
Speaker 3: in case. But I think the box to win that.

532
00:30:13,253 --> 00:30:15,893
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm going to go to Scotland to lose. South

533
00:30:15,933 --> 00:30:21,653
Speaker 2: Africa to win. I have seen some online suggestions that

534
00:30:21,733 --> 00:30:26,493
Speaker 2: the Scotts are very very confident, but I just can't

535
00:30:26,533 --> 00:30:30,213
Speaker 2: see it this weekend. I think South Africa will be

536
00:30:30,293 --> 00:30:34,733
Speaker 2: too good at Murrayfield and get the job done against

537
00:30:34,813 --> 00:30:37,573
Speaker 2: the Scotts. They're all about. Do us for Rugby Direct

538
00:30:37,613 --> 00:30:41,813
Speaker 2: for another week, Liam, big weekend of rugby awaits, so

539
00:30:41,893 --> 00:30:44,573
Speaker 2: look forward to catching up again in a week's time.

540
00:30:45,853 --> 00:30:48,293
Speaker 3: That's it. Go well, Elli, enjoy the call and get

541
00:30:48,293 --> 00:30:51,213
Speaker 3: stuck into a feel the points of the good stuff

542
00:30:51,253 --> 00:30:54,933
Speaker 3: and try stay safe and temple Barrow. I know you'll

543
00:30:54,973 --> 00:30:59,613
Speaker 3: be highly popular and learn in some deep dark rooms.

544
00:31:01,453 --> 00:31:04,653
Speaker 2: All right, Okay, we'll leave on that note. Has been

545
00:31:04,733 --> 00:31:08,933
Speaker 2: Rugby Direct powered by Excess Solutions, elevating you end your

546
00:31:08,973 --> 00:31:11,173
Speaker 2: business to a higher level.

547
00:31:16,613 --> 00:31:19,213
Speaker 1: For more from News Talks at b Listen live on

548
00:31:19,333 --> 00:31:22,293
Speaker 1: air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever

549
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