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Speaker 1: On the huddle with me this evening, Allie Jones of

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Speaker 1: Red pr and Tim Wilson of the Maximums. She'd hire

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Speaker 1: you too are a term Hi Heather, Hello Ali? Now

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Speaker 1: have you seen that building? And on a scale of

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Speaker 1: one to hideous, where do you see it?

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Speaker 2: I give it hideous? Yeah. But look, I don't think

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Speaker 2: I agree with Ken. I don't think you can be

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Speaker 2: destroying the buildings because they don't look the way you

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Speaker 2: want them to look. We know that in christ Church,

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Speaker 2: you know we It was a different situation with the

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Speaker 2: earth quakes, but the then Minister for Canterbury Recovery, Jerry Brownley,

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Speaker 2: wanted to destroy or get rid of a whole lot

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Speaker 2: of these types of buildings. He famously called them old

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Speaker 2: dungers and using his extraordinary powers, managed to remove them.

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Speaker 2: So and I heard what Ken said there, and I

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Speaker 2: do think the trade off is key. And when you

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Speaker 2: look at what's happening with our cathedral at the moment,

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Speaker 2: we've been sitting around and talking about that for ten

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Speaker 2: years and nothing's happened. This building has sat there for

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Speaker 2: so long, been and I saw cost a huge amount

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Speaker 2: of money. The space is needed and it needs to

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Speaker 2: be designed. You know to more more and standards for

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Speaker 2: student accommodation. I think the trade off is a good one.

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Speaker 3: And what do you think, Tim Well, I've got I

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Speaker 3: actually share of you with Allian Ken. But for I've

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Speaker 3: got to say that, can we roll the tape back?

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Speaker 3: Like ugly isn't beautiful? Ugly is horrid? All right, let's

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Speaker 3: just agree on that. So let's roll that back. I

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Speaker 3: say we leave them. There is a reminder of how

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Speaker 3: lame now they were built in nineteen fifty nine, but

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Speaker 3: that's basically the sixties. Their tedious rectangular asbestos and huge

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Speaker 3: prison cells fressed up as brutalism, free love and fate

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Speaker 3: call some decades were actually lamer than others. If you

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Speaker 3: forget history, you're doomed to repeat it. Leave the tombstones, aloft.

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Speaker 1: I feel like you're being deeply unfair to the sixties,

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Speaker 1: because the sixties had some really cool things going.

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Speaker 3: On, not just shuck.

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Speaker 2: No.

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Speaker 3: But I think you know what the problem is here too.

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Speaker 3: The problem is we're actually so desperate for heritage we'll say, oh,

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Speaker 3: look at this, you know. The city council, the Welling

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Speaker 3: City Council last year tried to classify a mid century

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Speaker 3: oil tank as heritage. I mean, we we've got to find.

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Speaker 1: Some better heroge make an excellent point now, Allie. I'm

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Speaker 1: not offended by the swearing that happened happened today in

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Speaker 1: the Silly Committee because a couple of reasons. I think

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Speaker 1: number one, it wasn't of the sea bomb level, and

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Speaker 1: number two it was it was just swearing out loud.

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Speaker 1: It wasn't describing somebody. What do you think?

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Speaker 3: Well?

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Speaker 2: Was it even out loud? This struck me as being

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Speaker 2: like being back in high school. It's the biggest laugh

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Speaker 2: I've had all day. You know, you've got duncan web,

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Speaker 2: but yeah, can you imagine it?

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Speaker 3: Or where?

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Speaker 2: What did you just say?

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Speaker 1: No?

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Speaker 2: No, go on, tell us all say it again.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: It's like picking the note up and making him read

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Speaker 2: it out. So that was the first thing I thought of.

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Speaker 2: It sounded like a game. I mean, Seymour even smirked

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Speaker 2: when he got told about this. I heard that he

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Speaker 2: thought it was quite funny. I had said both those

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Speaker 2: things over and over again in meetings, accompanied sometimes by

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Speaker 2: eye rolling. So I'm not saying that it's actually a

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Speaker 2: good thing to do. But come on, no one heard it.

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Speaker 2: Didn't someone tell on them, wouldn't on Deeba.

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Speaker 1: Rough Yes, Deba Russell got told on this isn't I mean?

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Speaker 1: And this? I want your take on this. You're you're

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Speaker 1: a very good conservative, very good Christian, so tell me

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Speaker 1: what you think.

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Speaker 3: I'm actually a very poor Catholic. But then so are

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Speaker 3: a lot of us. I actually, you know, I've got

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Speaker 3: the controversial view that adulthood is about self control. We

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Speaker 3: don't value in continents at one end of the body,

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Speaker 3: why should we value it at the other end of

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Speaker 3: the body. And can I just say we had a problem.

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Speaker 3: I think we should introduce a swear jar for Parliament

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Speaker 3: at NK every time you get caught you can actually

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Speaker 3: use that money to buy heritage buildings rather than designate

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Speaker 3: that the heritage buildings can prevent other people from using them.

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Speaker 3: Problem solved.

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Speaker 2: You're full of it today, you are love it.

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Speaker 1: Oh he's just he's you know what, He's at a

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Speaker 1: quiet day. He's been sitting there thinking what can I

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Speaker 1: say to wind? People?

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Speaker 2: Are no.

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Speaker 3: Not I do? I mean? I actually I used to

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Speaker 3: be an enthusiastic swearer and once I stopped, the foul

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Speaker 3: taste left my mouth.

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Speaker 2: I encourage I listen to this on a buckhead.

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Speaker 3: I've got I've got to actually, you know what, there's

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Speaker 3: a bucket of heritage ging a role.

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Speaker 1: Okay, stop, we'll take a break just to get them

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Speaker 1: to calm down for a minute, and then we'll come

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Speaker 1: back quarter two. Right, you're back with the huddle. I

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Speaker 1: got Alie Jones and Tim Wilson. Tim, now, how weird

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Speaker 1: do you think this plan?

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Speaker 3: Is?

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Speaker 1: That act has to make it easy for bosses to

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Speaker 1: fire staff who earned one hundred and eighty thousand dollars plus.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, look, I was listened to what you said earlier.

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Speaker 3: In terms of one hundred and eighty thousands, not that much,

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Speaker 3: but the average the average wage in New Zealands is

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Speaker 3: seventy three K. It's seventy six in Orphan, which is

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Speaker 3: what you'd expect. So this is actually double plus. And

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Speaker 3: it's interesting the way it's been presented because it's like workers'

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Speaker 3: rights being impinged. But I wonder if you're on one

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Speaker 3: hundred and eighty k whether you're still a worker. I

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Speaker 3: don't think Marks or Lennon would have said that it's

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Speaker 3: happened in Australia and where it leads.

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Speaker 1: To huge amounts of litigation.

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Speaker 3: Well, an important key. We employment lawyer who's crossed a

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Speaker 3: guy called Salmon sal Money says that it allows employers

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Speaker 3: and employees to have more frank conversations. And look, if

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Speaker 3: you're on higher pay, you should be subject to higher standards.

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Speaker 3: And if it gives some flexibility for young people to

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Speaker 3: step up, then I'm all for it.

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Speaker 1: Oh wow, that's not what I know at all, and

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Speaker 1: I know I totally disagree.

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Speaker 2: If anything has got me wound up today, this is it.

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Speaker 2: Laws are there for a reason. I don't know why

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Speaker 2: we're becoming fixated on what people earn here as a

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Speaker 2: reason to apply laws. I mean, there's no reason why

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Speaker 2: people treated badly where a personal breevance or PG would

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Speaker 2: be successful, should be precluded from seeking justice and taking

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Speaker 2: out a PG just because of what they earn. I'm

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Speaker 2: absolutely gobsmacked by this. What's going to be next? We're

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Speaker 2: going to put laws in place depending on what color

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Speaker 2: you hair and eyes are as well the money and

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Speaker 2: what you earn has got nothing to do with people

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Speaker 2: being treated badly, or rather their desire and the law

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Speaker 2: wanting them to be treated fairly.

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Speaker 1: Tim, how do you respond?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Look, you do make a fair point, Ellie and

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Speaker 3: and I agree people should be treated fairly at all points.

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Speaker 3: But I do think that salary is something that does

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Speaker 3: define in a sense the role, and I think that

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Speaker 3: the possibility of flexibility. And if it's inhibiting workplace culture,

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Speaker 3: and there's a suggestion that it's provoked more open conversations

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Speaker 3: in Australia between employers and employees, what.

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Speaker 1: Could improversations be. Would they be your fire, Yeah, you

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Speaker 1: suck your fired?

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Speaker 3: Gone by the zono, I think you can jump in.

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Speaker 3: My understanding from what the employment lawyer was saying was

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Speaker 3: that they allow you to get to deal with issues

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Speaker 3: a lot sooner. So it's not like, oh, we go

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Speaker 3: to our because it's going to end up in this

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Speaker 3: litigation and there'll be a PG. We actually stay in

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Speaker 3: our stay in our lanes and we don't, you know,

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Speaker 3: we legalize it in some way.

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Speaker 2: So I've got an example term if I can jump in,

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Speaker 2: of some who was earning over two hundred k Australian

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Speaker 2: treated appallingly in her workplace, had been there for twelve years.

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Speaker 2: And I know this is a one off example, but

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Speaker 2: she was treated so badly that when she did leave,

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Speaker 2: it was counted as constructive dismissal. She's now on an insurance.

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Speaker 2: They've got an insurance system there where you can continue

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Speaker 2: to be paid if the employer is found to be

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Speaker 2: in breach of the rules and you can't return to work.

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Speaker 2: Now she wouldn't get absolutely nothing if that had happened

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Speaker 2: under these rules. And I go back to that point

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Speaker 2: again that if someone is being treated badly, if the

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Speaker 2: employer is breaching the law, then regardless of what you're earning,

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Speaker 2: you should have the protection of those laws. Communication is

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Speaker 2: there regardless of the law, and maybe the workplace culture

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Speaker 2: needs looking at, not the employment law. I'm gobsmacked by

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Speaker 2: some of this discussion.

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Speaker 1: Because I'll tell you what the common theme here may

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Speaker 1: well be. I mean, remember, this is law, tim that

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Speaker 1: is designed to protect, to some extent, the employee from

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Speaker 1: bad bosses. Right, it doesn't matter when you're earning. Your

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Speaker 1: boss can still say be a bad boss.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I look, I completely get that.

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Speaker 1: And are you starting to change your mind just to

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Speaker 1: weep it.

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Speaker 3: I think I need to see. I need to see

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Speaker 3: what the legislation actually looks like.

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Speaker 1: Oh yes, it's the retreat and too. I need to

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Speaker 1: read the legislation.

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Speaker 3: I need to actually read the footnotes, so before I

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Speaker 3: can form.

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Speaker 1: I tell you what. I'll tell you what. Tim, Stay

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Speaker 1: tuned because after six we're going to talk to Jennifer Mills,

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Speaker 1: whos an employment lawyer, and maybe she'll change, maybe you

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Speaker 1: get some information from her. I appreciate both of you

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Speaker 1: coming on this evening. Thank you very much, Ellie Jones

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Speaker 1: and Tim Wilson our huddle, it's eight away from six.

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Speaker 3: For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to

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Speaker 3: news talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow

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