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Speaker 1: It is the classic rock and roll story. A group

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Speaker 1: of three musicians looking for a break, don't have a

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Speaker 1: scint can't get a gig, do a deal with a

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Speaker 1: record company, can't get one of those either. One song

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Speaker 1: changes at all of them. For a while, they were

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Speaker 1: the biggest band in the world, Stuart Copeland, Sting and

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Speaker 1: Andy Summers created Police of course, seventy five million records sold,

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Speaker 1: six Grammy's Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and all

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Speaker 1: of that. So Andy Summer's coming here for three nights,

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Speaker 1: bringing his best selling show, The Correct Lens and a

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Speaker 1: Missing String. Andy Summers with us from New York.

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Speaker 2: Good morning, I'll go mine to you. Nice to be

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Speaker 2: here now.

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Speaker 1: First of all, talk us through the Correct Lens and

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Speaker 1: a Missing String. I've seen a little bit of it.

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Speaker 1: I mean, how clever people must respond brilliantly to it.

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Speaker 2: Well, I'm getting the standing ovation every night, and we

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Speaker 2: pretty much sold out everywhere, so I think it's going well. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I originally started this just prior to the whole COVID thing.

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Speaker 2: I managed about ten shows and so the idea was born,

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Speaker 2: you know, combining you know, well, it's really a multi

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Speaker 2: media show, but photography talking guitar playing obviously and different things,

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Speaker 2: so and so forth, and then resurrected it as we

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Speaker 2: were able to come back to, you know, going out

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Speaker 2: on the road, and you know, you think going with

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Speaker 2: a show like this, I think you just keep adding

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Speaker 2: refinements to it and gets better all the time. So

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Speaker 2: we're having a pretty good time on New York Ividio

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Speaker 2: at the moment and playing tomorrow night here.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, So the idea of the linkage between the photographs

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Speaker 1: and the music. How long have you been into photography?

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Speaker 1: By the way, I.

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Speaker 2: Saw photography seriously as a medium I wanted to work

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Speaker 2: in in nineteen seventy nine when I was in New

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Speaker 2: York City with the police and had, you know, as

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Speaker 2: you might imagine a lot of time in my hands

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Speaker 2: because we were touring constantly and I was, you know,

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Speaker 2: we the van was surrounded by photographers all the time.

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Speaker 2: So I finally sort of crossed over and got a

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Speaker 2: good camera and said, well, right, I'm going to do this,

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Speaker 2: and you know, in factic turned into it. You know

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Speaker 2: that I stayed with ever since.

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Speaker 1: So what do you look for? I mean, what do

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Speaker 1: you shoot?

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Speaker 2: Well, I look for abstraction, really, you know, I mean

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Speaker 2: I would give it to you. I'm not looking for

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Speaker 2: like an interesting place. I'm looking for like shape, color, line,

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Speaker 2: you know, balance within a rectangular frame, balance of light

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Speaker 2: and dark. So I think of it in formal properties,

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Speaker 2: not like, oh, that's an exciting moment, that man going

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Speaker 2: to that man, you know, whatever, you know. I think

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Speaker 2: in a different way.

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Speaker 1: Is it the same as music. I mean it's a

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Speaker 1: creative expression.

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Speaker 2: I think so, you know, and I often like to

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Speaker 2: cite well, well, I mean the famous phrase is all

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Speaker 2: art aspires to the condition of music, And it's absolutely true,

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Speaker 2: because I find the information that I had from music

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Speaker 2: is sort of you can take it across the photography

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Speaker 2: and again, you know, like in music, you would be

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Speaker 2: thinking of line, shape, one thing contrasting against another, a structure.

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Speaker 2: All these things can be applied to photography. I mean,

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Speaker 2: obviously you have to learn how to use a camera

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Speaker 2: and study photography, but you find in the end that

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Speaker 2: some of the properties you're looking for are the same

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Speaker 2: ones that are expressed in music.

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Speaker 1: Do you reckon if you're good at music, you're good

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Speaker 1: at photography, or if you're good at photography you can

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Speaker 1: be good at music.

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Speaker 2: I think if you go in a photography, and you've

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Speaker 2: you're a musician, you're already in an advantageous place. I

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Speaker 2: really think that you've sort of trained your mind along

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Speaker 2: certain minds to think that way abstractly and straightforwardly, which

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Speaker 2: however you want to phrase it. And we'll give you

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Speaker 2: an advantage as a photographer because I think those things

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Speaker 2: are already in you. If you're coming in as a musician,

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Speaker 2: it is quite like a quite natural step in a

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Speaker 2: way to me. You know, photography you can get into

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Speaker 2: learn technically, whereas painting, for instance, as a visualize is

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Speaker 2: much more difficult because unless it's born in you and

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Speaker 2: it's literally in your hand, you'll only ever get to

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Speaker 2: be so good photography, I think you have more of

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Speaker 2: a chance that you know. I was very art inspired.

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Speaker 2: I did try painting for a while a few years back,

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Speaker 2: but I thought, ultimately I thought, no, I haven't got it.

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Speaker 2: I haven't got the thing. It's not emmy because obviously

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Speaker 2: I can't do that didn't come out like that. But

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Speaker 2: photography I think I'm very good at, and I think

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Speaker 2: that comes from to something extent. Well, I obviously haven't mind,

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Speaker 2: but I have the advantage of having played music all

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Speaker 2: my life.

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Speaker 1: So the extension in this new ep of yours Vitigenous Kenyons.

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Speaker 1: How do you go about writing music for photography?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well it's a good point, and no one's asked

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Speaker 2: me quite like that. For I did this my latest

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Speaker 2: photography book, which is Pretend Noise in Germany, and they

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Speaker 2: asked for it. And I haven't actually done that, but

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Speaker 2: I have scored films that the music. The music on

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Speaker 2: that Vitigenous Canyons I played. I made it in about

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Speaker 2: two and a half hour. All of it is improvisations,

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Speaker 2: you know, no great brand scheme. It's just I'll get

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Speaker 2: a sound through various you know, typical electric car devices.

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Speaker 2: Got a sound going that would you know, sort of

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Speaker 2: create a mood in me and you know, create something

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Speaker 2: with it. But I made that those tracks in one afternoon,

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Speaker 2: which I think is very healthy.

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Speaker 1: See, it's funny you should say that. It's one of

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Speaker 1: the great mysteries if you write a song. I mean,

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Speaker 1: do you ever worry about saying, oh, look it only

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Speaker 1: took me half an hour to write, even though it's brilliant.

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Speaker 1: I mean, is that just how music like photography, like

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Speaker 1: soundtracks are created?

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Speaker 2: Well? No, okay, look, there's a lot of things to this. First,

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Speaker 2: going to be talented, just to have a talent and

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Speaker 2: a feel for the medium you're in. I'm naturally a musician.

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Speaker 2: I don't think it matters. Some of the greatest things

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Speaker 2: are done in your minutes, you know, and it's just

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Speaker 2: they just try. And I was trying to tell somebody

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Speaker 2: this morning another interview. You know, you sit there and

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Speaker 2: slug away trying to write something, and then you give up,

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Speaker 2: and the last minute you give up, it suddenly arrives

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Speaker 2: in your head. I mean, I think this stuff comes

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Speaker 2: to you sort of from there. You could say it

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Speaker 2: comes from years of training and practicing and working at it.

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Speaker 2: But there's another sort of mysterious element to it where

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Speaker 2: it just arrives sometimes and you have the ability to

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Speaker 2: recognize it. Oh my god, that's it. I know, it's

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Speaker 2: all of that, and suddenly it pops out. So you

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Speaker 2: don't depend on it. You work for it, and then

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Speaker 2: suddenly it arrives. I like that sort of mysterious element

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Speaker 2: of creation. Creativity.

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Speaker 1: If you like composition, is that the same as playing

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Speaker 1: the guitar. I mean, it's always fascinated me. At what

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Speaker 1: point do you get to if you ever do you

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Speaker 1: are so at one with the thing you no longer

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Speaker 1: even think about it.

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean, you know, not sounding statistical, I did think.

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Speaker 2: I am at one with it. I've done it since

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Speaker 2: I was a kid, and millions of hours to play

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Speaker 2: the guitar, you know, in front of people think Oh

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Speaker 2: I love the guitar. I love playing it. I love

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Speaker 2: the fact that I managed to live my life as

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Speaker 2: a guitarist. And it'll probably see me out as well.

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Speaker 2: And you know, I don't necessarily sit with an earnest

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Speaker 2: expression on my day, my face every day and I

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Speaker 2: kind of wind. You know, I've got to be better.

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Speaker 2: I don't. I'm at one with it, like you pointed out.

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Speaker 2: You know, I'm doing shows now. It's just me on stage.

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Speaker 2: This is all I'll be bringing in New Zealand. And

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Speaker 2: I'm very comfortable with it, you know. I just I

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Speaker 2: can do it. You know. It's not like I don't

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Speaker 2: have to work up to anything. I'm there. I just

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Speaker 2: hope to have a good night with it.

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Speaker 1: It's good, A good, good place to be. By the way,

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Speaker 1: how did you work out even when the police fell

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Speaker 1: apart in the eighties, how did you work out what

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Speaker 1: you were going to do, How are you going to

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Speaker 1: do it? Whether you needed, you know, to formulate a

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Speaker 1: whole new career. How did that come about?

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Speaker 2: Well, I would say, you know, in my musical thought,

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Speaker 2: my musical head, you know, all those years running parallels

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Speaker 2: to place, I was interested in a lot of other things,

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Speaker 2: you know. I mean, I grew up not really as

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Speaker 2: a rock guitarist, but as a plastic book as a jazz.

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Speaker 2: I was a jazz planning as a kid. You know,

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Speaker 2: I was learning from people like Kenny Burrell, Jimmy Rainy,

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Speaker 2: whereas Montgomery. This is where I started. But then I

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Speaker 2: started my professional life in a rid of and blues band.

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Speaker 2: But you know, post Police, I had a lot of

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Speaker 2: information about all kinds of music, and so then there

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Speaker 2: was really time to start composing instrumental music, not pop songs.

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Speaker 2: And that's where I went with it, you know, influenced

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Speaker 2: by all kinds of ECM records, for instance, with one

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Speaker 2: of the influential meaning music of Coilonious Monk Miles Davis.

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Speaker 2: All this was something that I wished to take elements

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Speaker 2: from and kind of build my own style, my own

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Speaker 2: big mixture, if you like.

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Speaker 1: What's more creatively fulfilling? Post the police or the police.

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Speaker 2: Well that's not that's a bit of a cool question

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Speaker 2: because you know, well, I mean, well, I can't really

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Speaker 2: answer that. I mean they were both there, two different things. Obviously,

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Speaker 2: I was a huge contributor to the police, as we

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Speaker 2: all were, you know, with the Magic band. You know,

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Speaker 2: they don't come along way after. But I've enjoyed I've

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Speaker 2: made fifteen solo albums and I really dug into it

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Speaker 2: and I totally enjoyed making albums. In fact, I just

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Speaker 2: renewed my studio equipment completely two you know, go back

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Speaker 2: to recording in the next Well, I hope this year. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I think we went through a weird time with COVID

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Speaker 2: and everything seemed to stop, and now it feels like

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Speaker 2: life is coming back again. And you know, I'm on

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Speaker 2: the road and we knew the studio, so yeah, I

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Speaker 2: support to it.

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Speaker 1: I always like to know the answer with stories like yours,

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Speaker 1: so if people don't know it at the beginning, before

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Speaker 1: the police started, when you nothing right and no one

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Speaker 1: would hire you and there was no money and there

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Speaker 1: weren't any hits, and then not long after that Roxane

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Speaker 1: came along, you were suddenly being the biggest band in

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Speaker 1: the world, having headed all and had nothing. What's it

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Speaker 1: like to live through that?

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Speaker 2: Well, it was fabulous. And I'll just comment on that

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Speaker 2: because I did get you know, when I was living

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Speaker 2: in California, he's before going back to London and then

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Speaker 2: ultimately joining the police, I was down to literally nothing,

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Speaker 2: you know, I was, you know, hand about existence. I've

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Speaker 2: never forgotten it. The one thing that kept me going, honestly,

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Speaker 2: I'm not stand Corney was my faith in the guitar,

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Speaker 2: faith in music, and my abilities were there, and you

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Speaker 2: know that maybe virtually one day it would surface, you know,

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Speaker 2: And it did, you know, but in a most unlikely way.

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Speaker 2: Because I joined a band that had nothing and no future.

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Speaker 2: The only thing we could believe in was our ability

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Speaker 2: to make music. And once you would cut through fact,

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Speaker 2: it was pretty quick job. Yeah, so you've got to

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Speaker 2: keep the faith, you know, And it's hard to say

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Speaker 2: that to young musicians because the whole game has changed.

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Speaker 2: You know, people don't buy records anymore. You know, it's

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Speaker 2: all gone now, it's just dreaming and all that. And

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Speaker 2: you know, a young person wants to live a life

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Speaker 2: in music, even make any money anymore, to stay their

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Speaker 2: life looking.

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Speaker 1: Forward to seeing you in the country. By the way,

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Speaker 1: what's your relationship with New Zealand. How long has it been.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's been a few years. I don't

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Speaker 2: think I've ever played there on my own, so this

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Speaker 2: would be at first. I did play the over the place,

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Speaker 2: and I toured Australia on my own, but not New Zealand.

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Speaker 2: But of course you know you're one. I mean this,

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Speaker 2: maybe I shouldn't say this, but you do tend to

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Speaker 2: associate New Zealand with Great Britain. You know, the first

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Speaker 2: time I ever worked there, I thought, oh, it's just

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Speaker 2: like not that much, but get a climate as much.

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Speaker 2: So it's sort of a key that's different for an

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Speaker 2: English person with say America, you know, sheileiums. You feel

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Speaker 2: partly British and no question about that exactly.

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Speaker 1: Hey listen, go well and we'll catch up when you

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Speaker 1: hear later on in the andy summers out of New

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Speaker 1: York for us this morning, the crack Lens and the

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Speaker 1: Missing String. He's here September. The middle of September is

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Speaker 1: obviously taking a holiday between the two September nineteen and

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Speaker 1: Wellington twenty in christ Church. Then there's a break until

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Speaker 1: the third of October when he is in Auckland.

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Speaker 2: For more from the mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to

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Speaker 2: news talks. It'd be from six am weekdays, or follow

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Speaker 2: the podcast on iHeartRadio