1 00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:03,520 Speaker 1: New PwC report the Maui gas field could run dry 2 00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:06,359 Speaker 1: by twenty twenty seven. Myth and X. This is Tartanaki, 3 00:00:06,519 --> 00:00:09,680 Speaker 1: largest gas user in the country, could shut early next year. 4 00:00:09,800 --> 00:00:12,760 Speaker 1: Report was done for the Gas Industry company basically says 5 00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:14,960 Speaker 1: we're on the road to running out of natural stuff. 6 00:00:15,520 --> 00:00:18,600 Speaker 1: Mike Casey rewiring alted oh CEO with me this morning. 7 00:00:18,600 --> 00:00:21,600 Speaker 2: Morning, Mike, Good morning, Ryan. My wait to pick off 8 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:22,119 Speaker 2: a Friday. 9 00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:25,080 Speaker 1: Hey, what does this tell us anything? We don't know? 10 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:26,760 Speaker 1: I mean, we know, we kind of know we're running 11 00:00:26,760 --> 00:00:27,760 Speaker 1: short on gas, don't we. 12 00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:31,400 Speaker 2: I mean, I think this report basically tells us that 13 00:00:31,440 --> 00:00:34,960 Speaker 2: the solution from the gas industry is more gas, and 14 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:36,599 Speaker 2: in reality, we need to figure out how to get 15 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:38,480 Speaker 2: New Zealanders off gas as fast as we can. 16 00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:41,040 Speaker 1: But they have a point, don't they, That there's this 17 00:00:41,159 --> 00:00:44,519 Speaker 1: turning point in the twenty thirties where we've got lots 18 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:50,800 Speaker 1: of demand still manufacturing, petrochemicals, food production. You can't transition overnight. 19 00:00:52,200 --> 00:00:54,120 Speaker 2: It's going to be a tough transition. But I think 20 00:00:54,160 --> 00:00:55,639 Speaker 2: the main thing is we have to look at what's 21 00:00:55,680 --> 00:00:58,000 Speaker 2: in the best interest of everyday new ylinders, and that's 22 00:00:58,040 --> 00:00:59,920 Speaker 2: certainly going to be giving them off gas. I think 23 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:03,680 Speaker 2: they're overestimating the amount of demands that is going to 24 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:06,360 Speaker 2: be for there is going to be four gas and 25 00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:10,320 Speaker 2: obviously trying to justify allergy gas terminals and things like that. 26 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:12,360 Speaker 2: But the real short answer here is that gas is 27 00:01:12,360 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 2: a really expensive, inefficient technology, especially in our homes, and 28 00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:18,240 Speaker 2: the more that we can do to electrify those homes, 29 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:20,520 Speaker 2: get our hot water off gas, get our spatial heating 30 00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:22,840 Speaker 2: off gas, and get our cooking off gas, the better 31 00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:24,040 Speaker 2: it's going to be for New Zealanders. 32 00:01:24,080 --> 00:01:26,679 Speaker 1: And where do we get the electricity from? 33 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:29,959 Speaker 2: So this is one of the big things, right you're 34 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:33,720 Speaker 2: referring heads to the dry year in particular. Yeah, yes, 35 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:36,480 Speaker 2: So we need to look at very seriously at the 36 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:38,360 Speaker 2: energy system of New Zealand and how do we build 37 00:01:38,360 --> 00:01:41,440 Speaker 2: out the cheapest and basically the most affordable energy system 38 00:01:41,440 --> 00:01:44,720 Speaker 2: we can. I believe that's certainly a rollout of renewables. 39 00:01:44,720 --> 00:01:46,120 Speaker 2: And when you look at the renewables that are in 40 00:01:46,160 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 2: the pipeline now, I think the dry your problem is 41 00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:51,280 Speaker 2: largely going to solve itself provided we make sure that 42 00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:54,040 Speaker 2: the renewables that are consented and are looking to be 43 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:56,279 Speaker 2: built R and D built and they're built quite quickly. 44 00:01:56,360 --> 00:01:59,000 Speaker 1: But even if you look at the most renewable as 45 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:03,000 Speaker 1: solar and Europe, et cetera. I mean, there are times 46 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:07,040 Speaker 1: when everybody says, the wind doesn't blow, the sun doesn't shine, 47 00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:08,360 Speaker 1: the rain doesn't fall, et cetera. 48 00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:12,160 Speaker 2: It's a classic fossil fuel industry line, isn't it. But 49 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:14,919 Speaker 2: you know, if it doesn't rain and the sun doesn't shine, 50 00:02:14,960 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 2: you're usually in a pretty interesting situation. I think with 51 00:02:18,440 --> 00:02:21,600 Speaker 2: the weather, the long story shorts, we have these amazing 52 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:25,119 Speaker 2: hydro dams that are great batteries, and when we're looking 53 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 2: about seasonal shortages, we're always going to have sun throughout 54 00:02:28,320 --> 00:02:30,240 Speaker 2: the season. And so one of the big things we 55 00:02:30,280 --> 00:02:34,760 Speaker 2: can do really is generate more energy, more electricity through renewables, 56 00:02:34,919 --> 00:02:36,600 Speaker 2: so that we can drain those dams a little bit 57 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:39,480 Speaker 2: less and ultimately hold onto our water for longer and 58 00:02:39,600 --> 00:02:41,040 Speaker 2: make our system way more secure. 59 00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:45,200 Speaker 1: At what date, on what date will we have enough 60 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:49,760 Speaker 1: renewable energy to power the entire country, including all of 61 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:54,080 Speaker 1: the aforementioned you know, private sector stuff that needs to 62 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:54,840 Speaker 1: be taken care of. 63 00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:58,480 Speaker 2: That is something that's going to be quite difficult to answer, 64 00:02:58,480 --> 00:03:01,080 Speaker 2: and I think they may always be the need for 65 00:03:01,200 --> 00:03:03,919 Speaker 2: a small amount of fossil fuels for that backup for 66 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:07,360 Speaker 2: the last a five to ten percent of our energy 67 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:10,160 Speaker 2: system doesn't really need to be gas. I think we've 68 00:03:10,160 --> 00:03:12,600 Speaker 2: been burning gas in our electricity system because it's been 69 00:03:12,639 --> 00:03:15,080 Speaker 2: there and it's been convenient to do so. We have 70 00:03:15,240 --> 00:03:17,520 Speaker 2: other fossil fuels in New Zealand as well, like diesel 71 00:03:17,520 --> 00:03:20,959 Speaker 2: and coal, and our argument really is it's roll out renewables. 72 00:03:21,080 --> 00:03:23,600 Speaker 2: Let's be pragmatic though, make sure that at the end 73 00:03:23,639 --> 00:03:25,480 Speaker 2: of it that if we do start to get into 74 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:27,600 Speaker 2: a situation where we run out more than that we 75 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:30,239 Speaker 2: should use the We should use the fossil fuels that 76 00:03:30,280 --> 00:03:32,400 Speaker 2: we already import to make sure that we keep the 77 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:34,079 Speaker 2: lights on and keep our economy going. 78 00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:36,480 Speaker 1: All right, Mike, appreciate your time. Mike Case is CEO 79 00:03:36,640 --> 00:03:38,760 Speaker 1: of Rewiring out here Doha. 80 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:42,720 Speaker 2: For more from earlier edition with Ryan Bridge, listen live 81 00:03:42,880 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 2: to news Talks it'd be from five am weekdays, or 82 00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:47,840 Speaker 2: follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.