1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,320
Speaker 1: Pay Lewis, is that Asia Business correspondent paid a good evening,

2
00:00:03,400 --> 00:00:07,800
Speaker 1: Good evening, Ryan. How's that TikTok deal being received in China?

3
00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:12,719
Speaker 2: Well, interestingly, China is saying very very little about it,

4
00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:16,639
Speaker 2: which makes you wonder, has this really been agreed? We

5
00:00:16,760 --> 00:00:19,880
Speaker 2: know that Donald Trump has this habit of announcing deals

6
00:00:20,800 --> 00:00:23,079
Speaker 2: and saying that you know, they've all been signed off

7
00:00:23,120 --> 00:00:25,640
Speaker 2: when both parties haven't agreed and there's a lot of

8
00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:30,440
Speaker 2: details still left to negotiate. Or China is saying so

9
00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:33,960
Speaker 2: far about this deal, and I'll read you their statement.

10
00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:36,800
Speaker 2: They say, the Chinese government respects the wishes of the

11
00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:41,000
Speaker 2: enterprise I Bite Dance and welcomes it to carry out

12
00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:45,440
Speaker 2: commercial negotiations in accordance with market rules that reaches a

13
00:00:45,440 --> 00:00:50,120
Speaker 2: solution compliant with China's laws and regulations. Now that's a

14
00:00:50,240 --> 00:00:53,479
Speaker 2: far cry from what Donald Trump is saying, which is

15
00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:56,680
Speaker 2: that the deal is all signed off, China is on board,

16
00:00:56,680 --> 00:01:00,480
Speaker 2: Beijing's being much more guarded than Washington. It was also

17
00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:05,800
Speaker 2: noticeable that yesterday when he signed the executive order, no

18
00:01:05,959 --> 00:01:09,960
Speaker 2: representatives from byte Dance were present at the signing. In fact,

19
00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:13,959
Speaker 2: Byte Dance hasn't even acknowledged that a transaction is taking place.

20
00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:17,360
Speaker 2: So far, there is no mention of the purchase price.

21
00:01:17,959 --> 00:01:20,640
Speaker 2: There is no indication that China's made changes to the

22
00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:23,560
Speaker 2: laws that it would have to do to enable this

23
00:01:23,600 --> 00:01:27,240
Speaker 2: deal to go ahead. And in particular, the regulator last

24
00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:31,480
Speaker 2: week re emphasized that what China was doing was it

25
00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:36,560
Speaker 2: would license the algorithm to this US company that's ultimately

26
00:01:36,560 --> 00:01:41,679
Speaker 2: going to host the US version of TikTok. Now, licensing

27
00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:45,400
Speaker 2: the algorithm is very, very different from it being split

28
00:01:45,480 --> 00:01:49,600
Speaker 2: out from by dance and separated out into a company,

29
00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:54,440
Speaker 2: because the algorithm is obviously the secret source behind TikTok.

30
00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:59,080
Speaker 2: That's what decides what videos are recommended to people. And

31
00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:01,680
Speaker 2: the concerns all has been that this could be abused,

32
00:02:02,320 --> 00:02:06,040
Speaker 2: that the algorithm could be used for propaganda purposes and

33
00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:11,200
Speaker 2: influencing elections and so on. Now, if China is only

34
00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:16,000
Speaker 2: licensing this algorithm, can you really say that it's been

35
00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:19,400
Speaker 2: sold and it's been put into an American company because

36
00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:24,040
Speaker 2: China will still control and own the algorithm. So there

37
00:02:24,080 --> 00:02:28,120
Speaker 2: are things clearly missing so far from this deal. I

38
00:02:28,200 --> 00:02:32,320
Speaker 2: wonder if it will if US Congress had this in

39
00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:36,120
Speaker 2: mind when they signed the law forcing TikTok to be

40
00:02:36,200 --> 00:02:40,000
Speaker 2: divested from byte Dance had in mind a licensing agreements,

41
00:02:40,639 --> 00:02:43,919
Speaker 2: because it seems that doesn't really pass muster in terms

42
00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:45,840
Speaker 2: of what Congress intended.

43
00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:50,960
Speaker 1: No, certainly that was the mainess. It's the reason that

44
00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:53,320
Speaker 1: this all came to the fore right, So fascinating to

45
00:02:53,360 --> 00:02:55,760
Speaker 1: know that a little bit of detail. China hitting for

46
00:02:55,840 --> 00:03:00,000
Speaker 1: a record one point two trillion dollar trade surplus Peter.

47
00:03:01,320 --> 00:03:05,000
Speaker 2: And that's incredible, isn't it. That's the biggest trade surplus

48
00:03:05,360 --> 00:03:08,120
Speaker 2: that any country has had with the rest of the

49
00:03:08,160 --> 00:03:11,480
Speaker 2: world on record. I mean, basically, China has got a

50
00:03:11,520 --> 00:03:14,680
Speaker 2: trade surplus with nearly every single country in the world.

51
00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:19,360
Speaker 2: And all of this is coming despite these months of

52
00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:26,040
Speaker 2: sky high US tariffs. It hasn't stopped China's export engine

53
00:03:26,080 --> 00:03:30,400
Speaker 2: from really powering ahead. So it begs the question, how

54
00:03:30,480 --> 00:03:33,240
Speaker 2: is this happening? What's going on here? Well, what it

55
00:03:33,280 --> 00:03:38,000
Speaker 2: appears is that with access to the US markets being curtailed,

56
00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:44,080
Speaker 2: Chinese manufacturers have been very adept at switching their attention elsewhere. So,

57
00:03:44,200 --> 00:03:47,640
Speaker 2: for example, with India, the trade the trade surplus there,

58
00:03:48,360 --> 00:03:51,720
Speaker 2: purchases from India are to India by Indians, and all

59
00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:55,400
Speaker 2: time high shipments to Africa look like they're going to

60
00:03:55,400 --> 00:03:59,560
Speaker 2: be an annual records. Southeast Asia they're now above what

61
00:03:59,600 --> 00:04:02,920
Speaker 2: they were before the pandemic, shipments to the Middle East

62
00:04:02,960 --> 00:04:06,400
Speaker 2: all time highs. So what it appears is that there's

63
00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:10,320
Speaker 2: this reordering of global trade as certainly as far as

64
00:04:10,440 --> 00:04:14,520
Speaker 2: China is concerned anyway, and it's sort of creating a

65
00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:19,400
Speaker 2: new global trading system that doesn't include the US. Now

66
00:04:19,440 --> 00:04:22,560
Speaker 2: you can argue that actually it's the US itself that's

67
00:04:22,640 --> 00:04:26,560
Speaker 2: cut itself out from this new reordering of trade, and

68
00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:29,320
Speaker 2: countries like China had no choice but to look for

69
00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:34,080
Speaker 2: new markets, but it is being very successful in doing this. Now,

70
00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:36,800
Speaker 2: this is going to raise concerns because, of course there

71
00:04:36,839 --> 00:04:38,960
Speaker 2: are countries that are going to be very fearful about

72
00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:43,320
Speaker 2: what happens to their own domestic industries if China is

73
00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:47,839
Speaker 2: exporting to them in vast amounts, you know, cars, evs,

74
00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:52,240
Speaker 2: auto parts, steel, and so on. And we're already seeing

75
00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:56,360
Speaker 2: some problems. Indian authorities, for example, have received over fifty

76
00:04:56,400 --> 00:05:01,760
Speaker 2: applications now for investigations into goods dumped from China. Mexico

77
00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:05,279
Speaker 2: has already hit pack publicly. It's floating tariffs now of

78
00:05:05,320 --> 00:05:09,919
Speaker 2: fifty percent on Chinese products. So you would think that

79
00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:12,359
Speaker 2: this is going to cause some problems because these countries

80
00:05:12,400 --> 00:05:16,040
Speaker 2: don't want to see their domestic industry is being devastated

81
00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:20,600
Speaker 2: by this flood of Chinese exports. China says it's not dumping.

82
00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:23,480
Speaker 2: It says, you know, it's doing this all fairly and

83
00:05:23,520 --> 00:05:27,800
Speaker 2: it's just creating demand for high quality products. But not

84
00:05:27,880 --> 00:05:29,120
Speaker 2: everyone is convinced by that.

85
00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:33,440
Speaker 1: We have similar problems here. I watched a little bit

86
00:05:33,440 --> 00:05:35,040
Speaker 1: of shih ing ping of the you in this week

87
00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:37,080
Speaker 1: in taking a swipe at Donald Trump when it comes

88
00:05:37,120 --> 00:05:39,880
Speaker 1: to climate change. But there the largest messa in the world.

89
00:05:39,880 --> 00:05:40,640
Speaker 1: Buy a long.

90
00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:47,240
Speaker 2: Shot, absolutely, And there has been some criticism of China's

91
00:05:47,320 --> 00:05:53,159
Speaker 2: new carbon reduction plan there. What they're saying is they're

92
00:05:53,160 --> 00:05:55,560
Speaker 2: going to aim for about a seven to ten percent

93
00:05:55,680 --> 00:06:00,640
Speaker 2: cut in emissions by twenty thirty five from its now.

94
00:06:00,880 --> 00:06:03,760
Speaker 2: People were hoping that we were going to see maybe

95
00:06:03,800 --> 00:06:07,960
Speaker 2: double that, around fifteen percent cut in emissions. Otherwise, there's

96
00:06:08,000 --> 00:06:13,120
Speaker 2: really no hope of the global temperature rise being restricted

97
00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:15,680
Speaker 2: to one and a half degrees centigrade above what they

98
00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:20,719
Speaker 2: were in the pre industrial period. But nevertheless, there is

99
00:06:20,760 --> 00:06:23,880
Speaker 2: a signal here and the signal is that China, first

100
00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:27,920
Speaker 2: of all, is certainly prepared to do something. It is

101
00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:31,400
Speaker 2: making efforts to try and get its emissions down. It's

102
00:06:31,440 --> 00:06:34,919
Speaker 2: making huge strides in green energy. I mean, it is

103
00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:37,960
Speaker 2: the world's leader now in green energy. I mean, look

104
00:06:38,000 --> 00:06:40,960
Speaker 2: at if you go to Beijing these days, and I

105
00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:43,240
Speaker 2: believe you used to live in Beijing, you'll remember the

106
00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:46,640
Speaker 2: smog and the pollution that was there. Well that is

107
00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:51,440
Speaker 2: all gone because everyone is driving electric vehicles these days.

108
00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:55,520
Speaker 2: These cities are becoming very high tech, very green en

109
00:06:56,560 --> 00:07:02,359
Speaker 2: environmentally friendly sort of cities. Compare that with the US,

110
00:07:02,480 --> 00:07:05,120
Speaker 2: where basically Donald Trump is saying climate change is a

111
00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:10,440
Speaker 2: con job and those countries that use renewable energy are

112
00:07:11,080 --> 00:07:14,600
Speaker 2: are destroying themselves. So a very big contrast between the

113
00:07:14,640 --> 00:07:16,920
Speaker 2: approach that she Jin Pig is taking and I think

114
00:07:16,920 --> 00:07:19,920
Speaker 2: he was trying to highlight here to what Donald Trump

115
00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:20,360
Speaker 2: is doing.

116
00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:23,640
Speaker 1: Peter, always fascinating talk to you. Thanks so much, Peter

117
00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:27,560
Speaker 1: lewis that Asia Business correspondent. For more from Hither Duplessy

118
00:07:27,600 --> 00:07:30,360
Speaker 1: Alan Drive, listen live to news talks it'd be from

119
00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:34,080
Speaker 1: four pm weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.