Speaker 1: Kyoda. I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page,
Speaker 1: a daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. Marsden
Speaker 1: Point operated as New Zealand's only oil refinery for nearly
Speaker 1: sixty years. At its peak in the eighties, it employed
Speaker 1: around seventeen hundred people. When it was closed in twenty
Speaker 1: twenty two, nearly two hundred and forty people lost their jobs.
Speaker 1: Run by Channel Infrastructure, the site now operates as New
Speaker 1: Zealand's largest fuel's import terminal, storing and distributing forty percent
Speaker 1: of the country's fuel. In recent weeks, a slew of
Speaker 1: ministers have visited the site, with New Zealand first in
Speaker 1: particular floating the idea of introducing our first Special Economic
Speaker 1: Zone to help pump invent into the site and life
Speaker 1: back into the Northland economy. Later, Channel Infrastructure CEO Rob
Speaker 1: Buchanan takes us through the future of Marsden Point, but
Speaker 1: first on the front Page, Massy University Emeritus Professor of
Speaker 1: Sustainable Energy and Climate Mitigation Ralph Simms joins us to
Speaker 1: discuss the site's past and potential. First off, Ralph pretend
Speaker 1: I've never heard of Marsden Point before.
Speaker 2: Can you tell me what is it?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 4: Well, Marsden Point is an oil refinery located up in
Speaker 4: Northland and it was established in nineteen sixty four because
Speaker 4: we were bringing petrol and diesel into New Zealand already refined,
Speaker 4: thought it was cheaper have we brought in crude oil
Speaker 4: and then produced our own fuel products and that worked well.
Speaker 4: For quite some time we were producing maybe half of
Speaker 4: New Zealand's demands of petrol, diesel and aviation fuel. A
Speaker 4: refinery takes crude oil, which is a very complex chemical
Speaker 4: if you like, and it varies from place to place,
Speaker 4: so a refinery breaks it down into useful products and petrol.
Speaker 3: Diesel the obvious ones.
Speaker 4: Aviation fuel, jet fuel is called also kerosene, other products
Speaker 4: chemical use as well, and also bitchamin is this stuff
Speaker 4: left over which of course we seal our roads with,
Speaker 4: so that all comes from an oil refinery.
Speaker 1: And so it hasn't been used as a refinery of
Speaker 1: course since it closed down in twenty twenty two. In
Speaker 1: the mid nineteen eighties, though, the refinery substantially expanded and
Speaker 1: upgraded to allow for increased production. Extra tanksity supplies and
Speaker 1: environmental treatment units were added. Along with a one hundred
Speaker 1: and seventy kilometer Marsden Point to Auckland pipeline. Now it's
Speaker 1: safe to say, hey, that the eighties were really its
Speaker 1: boom time.
Speaker 4: That's right, because it was expanded. A hydrocracker was installed,
Speaker 4: which was quite innovative at the time to get more
Speaker 4: diesel out of a barrel of oil. You can only
Speaker 4: get so much petrol, so much diesel, so much of
Speaker 4: the other products, and the hydrocracker was to say, let's
Speaker 4: get more diesel out because of our diesel demand, agricultural demands, trucks, etc.
Speaker 4: So this was a project. It was owned by the
Speaker 4: New Zealand refining companies. It was Shell that the oil
Speaker 4: company that first thought about it, and then they went
Speaker 4: into partnership with all the other oil companies in New
Speaker 4: Zealand and set up the business. And so then they
Speaker 4: thought they'd expand and then mister Muldoon came along with
Speaker 4: his think big project, so he thought that was a
Speaker 4: good idea. Through money at it and then it took five.
Speaker 3: Six years nineteen eighty six.
Speaker 4: It finally opened because there were strikes and there were
Speaker 4: delays and there was over a budget, and then eventually
Speaker 4: the government did a secret deal with the oil companies
Speaker 4: to buy it to pay for all the changes that
Speaker 4: had occurred, and that meant that we were then able
Speaker 4: to produce about seventy percent of our total fuel demand.
Speaker 4: We were still importing Sundays or some In course in
Speaker 4: the nineteen seventies there were the oil shocks.
Speaker 3: Around the world and we were having.
Speaker 4: Carliss days and rationing diesel, etc.
Speaker 3: Because there just simply wasn't enough that the.
Speaker 4: Refinery could produce because of the oil supply, but also
Speaker 4: buying imported products, and so that was another reason to
Speaker 4: give it a boost in the eighties. Interestingly, New Zealand
Speaker 4: by that time was exploring and producing oil and gas.
Speaker 4: Oil was what's called a light sweet crude and it
Speaker 4: didn't match the refinery processing characteristics. Most of our crude
Speaker 4: oil that we extracted was sent off to a refinery
Speaker 4: in Australia and we were producing we were importing this
Speaker 4: medium sour crude from other parts of the world, Saudi
Speaker 4: Arabia and United Arab Emirates and wherever, and so that
Speaker 4: was unfortunate really because we were still relying on imported
Speaker 4: product and a small percentage, very small percentage of our
Speaker 4: our own crude oil would be blended in with the
Speaker 4: imported stuff, but not enough to make us self sufficient.
Speaker 5: Right over withster Peters. That from the person who agreed
Speaker 5: secretly to close down one of the three big industries
Speaker 5: in this country, namely Marson Point. Never told the workers,
Speaker 5: never told the unions, never told anybody up north, No
Speaker 5: COVID it did And she laughs this critical componatory, she
Speaker 5: laughs about this accused of me going secretly to the
Speaker 5: Prime minister. No, all twenty cabinet ministers were required to
Speaker 5: write to the Primise with their ideas. That's what I did.
Speaker 5: So don't believe the media crap and hype that somehow
Speaker 5: we did something special and there isn't appalling their debuty
Speaker 5: prime Minister has been caught talking to the Prime Minister.
Speaker 5: Only Labor could think there's something wrong.
Speaker 1: Looking back, do you think that there were any missed
Speaker 1: opportunities to integrate I guess more sustainable practices into Marsden
Speaker 1: Points refining activities.
Speaker 4: Yes, well, there was a lot of debated discussion about
Speaker 4: exactly what production it should achieve from an economic sustainability
Speaker 4: point of view. If we'd have gone to one hundred
Speaker 4: percent refining and if anything had gone wrong then that
Speaker 4: would have been a risk. The economic balance, as I
Speaker 4: understand it, was that we would produce two thirds or
Speaker 4: so of our own fuels, but still have some reliance
Speaker 4: on imported fuels, which gives some flexibility reduces the risk.
Speaker 4: I guess that was the main reason for not going
Speaker 4: to a full large refinery. But of course that was
Speaker 4: one of the reasons why it did close down in
Speaker 4: twenty twenty two, because it's a relatively small refinery on
Speaker 4: a global basis, and the cost of oil shipping it's
Speaker 4: a long way to come, and the value of the
Speaker 4: products was such that it was actually thought cheaper to
Speaker 4: import refined products from Singapore and other Asian countries rather
Speaker 4: than carry on with refining here. And of course by
Speaker 4: that time it was some of it was forty to
Speaker 4: fifty year years old, and these chemical engineering production processes
Speaker 4: equipment doesn't last forever, so there was quite a maintenance
Speaker 4: operation going on. So in the end, from an economic
Speaker 4: sustainability point of view, they decided maybe we would shut
Speaker 4: it down and import refined products. And that's another issue,
Speaker 4: because it was decided not to mothball the plant, which
Speaker 4: means to sort of shut it down, but put grease
Speaker 4: on it and paint it and protect it so that
Speaker 4: it could be used again. It was just decommissioned. It
Speaker 4: was just shut down and that was it. So parts
Speaker 4: of it have gone rusty and parts of it have
Speaker 4: been sold off, and there's more other bits that are
Speaker 4: possibly going to be sold from what I understand how
Speaker 4: the government, I think Minister Shane Jones has been thinking
Speaker 4: of re commissioning the refinery, but it would be very
Speaker 4: difficult and very expensive to do, so there has been
Speaker 4: a report to assess whether that's feasible or not. The
Speaker 4: idea of being that in this day and age, with
Speaker 4: all the geopolitical unrest and such like, we would have
Speaker 4: more security if we produced more of our own fuels,
Speaker 4: but that's unlikely to happen, I think. I think to
Speaker 4: the cost it would be billions of dollars to renovate it.
Speaker 1: In terms of the chat about making the area of
Speaker 1: Marsden Point a special economic zone, how does that sit
Speaker 1: with you, Ralph?
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, again it's the company that's come up with
Speaker 4: this concept and Minister Shane Jones has said, oh, this
Speaker 4: could be a good idea, so he's got involved there
Speaker 4: a bit to what decree, I don't know, but basically
Speaker 4: it's saying, well, we've got all these resources, all these facilities,
Speaker 4: how can we best utilize them? And so extra storage
Speaker 4: is one they've talked about producing green hydrogen, which is
Speaker 4: different hydrogen that comes from methane from natural gas, releases
Speaker 4: emissions into the atmosphere carbon dioxide as part of the
Speaker 4: producing hydrogen. Whereas green hydrogen, if you've got renewable electricity
Speaker 4: to electrolyze the water and produce the hydrogen, then there's
Speaker 4: no carbon emissions coming from that. They've there's a possibility
Speaker 4: of doing that. Hydrogen as a fuel is debatable in
Speaker 4: many ways at the moment, whether it be for cars
Speaker 4: or trucks or planes. Technically possible, but is it energy
Speaker 4: efficient to use all that electricity to produce hydrogen, store
Speaker 4: the hydrogen to turn the hydrogen back into electricity, or
Speaker 4: maybe use electricity directly for a car Obviously idiots makes
Speaker 4: more sense than for an aeroplane, but green hydrogen is
Speaker 4: a possible product that they could use. They could also
Speaker 4: produce biofuels, their liquid fuels that could replace spetrol and diesel.
Speaker 4: The IATA, the International Air Transport Association of All Airlines.
Speaker 4: Air New Zealand being a strong member, has from some
Speaker 4: years looked at sustainable aviation fuels and they've been analyzing
Speaker 4: this to a great degree. United Era of Emirates I've
Speaker 4: been involved with a little bit and they've been very
Speaker 4: strongly supporting this and advocating for the concept, even though
Speaker 4: they produce oil themselves. The IARTA have got nine different
Speaker 4: technologies that they can that they've approved in order to
Speaker 4: make these jetpul and one of them is through using
Speaker 4: green hydrogen.
Speaker 3: Another one, which.
Speaker 4: Channel Infrastructure is now looking at in association with Zealand
Speaker 4: and Scion, which was Forest Research Institute, is to convert
Speaker 4: woody biomass waste from the forest, so you take out
Speaker 4: the logs and then you're left with all the slash,
Speaker 4: which is quite controversial at the moment and in Sweden
Speaker 4: and the Austriaan whatever. And I've been advocating here for
Speaker 4: many years too. We should be using that to chip
Speaker 4: it up and turn.
Speaker 3: It into heat and power. We can turn it into.
Speaker 4: Electricity and it's very viable and it makes good sense
Speaker 4: and it's low carbon.
Speaker 1: But it's expensive though. Ralph is that where the special
Speaker 1: economic zone can come in, we can get some overseas
Speaker 1: investors in to invest in things like that.
Speaker 3: That's exactly right.
Speaker 4: I mean it's been done for heat and power for
Speaker 4: decades in many countries, so it's not expensive.
Speaker 3: If you've got the system in place, it can be competitive.
Speaker 4: But if you've got going to sustainable aviation fuels, it's
Speaker 4: a bigger process. It's a refining process, if you like,
Speaker 4: of the woody biomass into liquid biofuels. And that's where
Speaker 4: the economic zone could attract these investors for sure, which
Speaker 4: of course is what government's got in mind as being
Speaker 4: a good incentive to do so. And so the process
Speaker 4: there or lansa Tech is a company which is involved,
Speaker 4: which was originated in New Zealand some twenty years or
Speaker 4: more ago from a PhD study which was looking at
Speaker 4: bacteria to take emissions from steel mills and turn them
Speaker 4: into ethanol, which is a liquid fuel.
Speaker 3: You can run petrol cars on ethanol.
Speaker 4: And that developed into a company and then that went international.
Speaker 3: They've still got a research office in Auckland.
Speaker 4: It was New Zealand innovation at its best and they
Speaker 4: are now looking at jet fuels as a subsidiary company
Speaker 4: of Lanthotech and Scion's been looking at producing ethanol from
Speaker 4: woody biomass for decades and it's not I mean, when
Speaker 4: I was producing biodiesel in nineteen seventies, Forest Research Institute
Speaker 4: was looking at ethanol from woodchips and after twenty or
Speaker 4: thirty years they sort of gave up. So it is
Speaker 4: a challenge, but there's more development going on now. So
Speaker 4: this is where this consortium is thinking that ideally Marsden
Speaker 4: Point could be a world's leading center for producing sustainable
Speaker 4: aviation fuels. What the volume is that they can produce
Speaker 4: is probably enough for New Zealand, but on a global capacity,
Speaker 4: it's a real challenge through substitute avgas aviation fuel for
Speaker 4: sustainable aviation fuels.
Speaker 3: But it's technically possible to do.
Speaker 4: And even you can term municipal solid waste instead of
Speaker 4: going into a landfill, you can turn that into sustainable
Speaker 4: fuels as well. So there's great hope, great potential there,
Speaker 4: but there is a challenge a on the chemistry beyond
Speaker 4: the costs. See on having a regular supply, where would
Speaker 4: all the wood chips come from? How do they get
Speaker 4: to the refinery? Coastal shipping might be the answer to
Speaker 4: that and rail as well that they've got to be
Speaker 4: delivered there in large volumes, but it's certainly worth looking at.
Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us, Ralph. The privately owned Marsden Point
Speaker 1: was New Zealand's only fuel refinery until it was decommissioned
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty two to become an import only fuel
Speaker 1: terminal under the name Channel Infrastructure. CEO Rob Buchanan is
Speaker 1: with us now to take us through what the future holds. Rob,
Speaker 1: how much fuel flows through Marsden Point at the moment
Speaker 1: and where does it all go?
Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's around three billion or over three billion
Speaker 2: liters a year of fuel that goes through the Marsten
Speaker 2: Point import terminal system. And just to give you a
Speaker 2: thumbnail sketch of how that works, our customers earth ships
Speaker 2: at Marsden Point where their product is stored either petro
Speaker 2: diesel and jet and a significant number of tanks that
Speaker 2: we've got back three hundred million liters of storage on site.
Speaker 2: Most product is ship down the pipeline to Auckland where
Speaker 2: it is then distributed either to the Auckland and why
Speaker 2: Cano region or in the case of jet, direct to
Speaker 2: Auckland Airport and a small amounts are taken off at
Speaker 2: our site to truckloading facility for distribution into Northland.
Speaker 1: How might Marsden Point adapt towards I suppose a renewable
Speaker 1: energy or sustainability in the future.
Speaker 6: Great question. So there's a couple of things there.
Speaker 2: I think the first for us is, you know, we
Speaker 2: think that the future for decarbonization of aviation is sustainable
Speaker 2: aviation fuel, which is dropping, which is to say that
Speaker 2: it can flow through our infrastructure today. So as then
Speaker 2: industry transitions from fossil jets to sustainable aviation fuel over
Speaker 2: the next twenty thirty years, you know that product can
Speaker 2: come straight through the masson Point I Bort terminal system
Speaker 2: like it can today. One of the unique features of
Speaker 2: our location and master point, and actually it's function in
Speaker 2: our history, is we've got a very large landholding which
Speaker 2: is consented for at least the next thirty five years
Speaker 2: anyway for fuels manufacture. And so one of the significant
Speaker 2: opportunities that we're exploring is renewable fuels manufacture on our
Speaker 2: site as.
Speaker 1: Well and all the infrastructures there for that. Or do
Speaker 1: you need significant investment from government or say elsewhere under
Speaker 1: a special economic zone, say.
Speaker 2: Well, to be clear, we're not looking for investment from government,
Speaker 2: so just to put that one to bead, but otherwise
Speaker 2: the answer is yes to both. So yes, there is
Speaker 2: a significant amount of infrastructure there by virtue of a
Speaker 2: range of decommissioned refinery assets and refined product tanks which
Speaker 2: are available for fuel storage and then the pipeline which
Speaker 2: can ship that product to Auckland or indeed the gen
Speaker 2: where it can be put into a boat and distributed elsewhere.
Speaker 2: But also there is a significant amount of investment that
Speaker 2: would be required by our partners ultimately to bring renewable
Speaker 2: fuels manufacture to master points. So one of the projects
Speaker 2: that we're working on with a consortium of international investors
Speaker 2: is indeed repurposing some of the old refinery assets for
Speaker 2: bio fuels production in New Zealand.
Speaker 7: What's the goal with that?
Speaker 1: So when we talk about biofuels, what would that then
Speaker 1: be used for?
Speaker 2: Yeah, So in relation to that particular project, in particular,
Speaker 2: the main areas of focus renewable diesel or an alternative
Speaker 2: to diesel, and obviously sustainable aviation fuel And just to
Speaker 2: speak to both of those clearly, there is a pathway
Speaker 2: for decarbonization of light transport and evs and adoption will
Speaker 2: go up and down over time, but ultimately you know
Speaker 2: that pathway is there. I think that the pathway for
Speaker 2: heavy transport. And if you think about tractors on farms
Speaker 2: getting milk from remote locations in New Zealand to manufacturing sites,
Speaker 2: getting our products to export markets and getting them in
Speaker 2: a boat and shipping them overseas, that's where renew diesel
Speaker 2: is an opportunity to decarbonize that particular part of the
Speaker 2: supply chain. The opportunity and aviation, as I spoke to before,
Speaker 2: is sustainable aviation fuel.
Speaker 1: In terms of sustainable aviation fuel, though, does the whole
Speaker 1: world have to get on board for it to work?
Speaker 2: Well, that's actually a great question. And so you know
Speaker 2: that the most important point about sustainable aviation fuel is
Speaker 2: that it's dropping. So where it wouldn't work is if
Speaker 2: we couldn't use that fuel an existing jet turbine technology today.
Speaker 6: So you know the most important thing is that it's dropping.
Speaker 2: You can blend it with jet today and it can
Speaker 2: go straight into the aircraft that any Zealand for example,
Speaker 2: is fly around New Zealand or overseas, and so that
Speaker 2: means that we don't have to wait for technology changes
Speaker 2: at aircraft level, which I think, let's space, it would
Speaker 2: take decades. We can actually get into the piece of
Speaker 2: work now, and various countries are taking different or making
Speaker 2: that adoption at different speeds. Certainly, you know Europe is
Speaker 2: going faster than many other places. But actually some of
Speaker 2: the major trading partners in Asia have sustainble aviation fuel
Speaker 2: targets as well, like Japan.
Speaker 1: And why isn't it happening you know, tomorrow then? Or
Speaker 1: does it cost a lot of money? I know that
Speaker 1: the recommissioning project was costed out at about four point
Speaker 1: nine billion to seven point three billion. That was if
Speaker 1: we made Marsden Point an oil refinery against say, obviously
Speaker 1: that's a pipe dream, and that's probably are you are
Speaker 1: you confident to say that that's actually never going to happen.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, I think the government a significant piece of
Speaker 2: work on the recommissioning of the refinery and found that
Speaker 2: it was infeasible ultimately, so you know, it was permanently
Speaker 2: decommissioned and our position hasn't changed on that. I think
Speaker 2: that's the same aviation fuel piece. I probably distinguished between
Speaker 2: the opportunity to manufacture it and onw Zealand at Master Point,
Speaker 2: which we think is a fantastic opportunity, and the fact
Speaker 2: that it can actually be brought into New Zealand by
Speaker 2: a boat today and distribute it through our supply chain.
Speaker 2: But you've landed on one of the key issues for adoption.
Speaker 2: There's nothing cheap about decarbanization. We've seen it in the
Speaker 2: electricity sector and that transition to renewal electricity.
Speaker 6: And the impact that that's hand.
Speaker 2: On electricity prices, and it's the same with the same
Speaker 2: aviation fuel. It's as that technology gains traction and increasing
Speaker 2: scale is built around the world and the manufacturer of
Speaker 2: the sable aviation fuel, then the costs can come down.
Speaker 2: But right now it's significantly more expensive than fossil jet today,
Speaker 2: so the impact on is ultimately born by airlines or
Speaker 2: customers for making that choice around substitution in between fossil
Speaker 2: jets and statele aviation field.
Speaker 7: Our investigating the re establishment of Marsden Point refinery. Sadly
Speaker 7: we are left to gather the results of an awful
Speaker 7: decision made over the last two years, and it's driven
Speaker 7: served by a mixture of wokeism, a mixture of naivety
Speaker 7: and an unwillingness to accept with our gas, with our fuel,
Speaker 7: the nation will collapse. With New Zealand first in charge
Speaker 7: of such an initiative, our resilience will prosper.
Speaker 1: What's the future look like for Marsden Point, say in
Speaker 1: the next ten years and then twenty years and so forth.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, we put out I think, as you know,
Speaker 2: the Marten Point Energy Precinct, which is our vision the
Speaker 2: future at that site, and I'd summarize to you it
Speaker 2: in a couple of ways. You know, we see it
Speaker 2: as over the next ten to fifteen years as a
Speaker 2: massive opportunity for energy security for New Zealand. And by
Speaker 2: that I mean we've got the ability to store more fuel,
Speaker 2: we've got the bility to manufacture biofuels at Marston Point,
Speaker 2: noting that the feedstock for biofuels is domestic, so we
Speaker 2: aren't subject to the geopolitical risks that come with international shipping.
Speaker 2: And we are also working on some energy firming opportunities
Speaker 2: as well, like peak electricity peaking and the like, And
Speaker 2: so we think it's a real opportunity for an energy security.
Speaker 6: Play in New for New Zealand.
Speaker 2: In a world which is quickly becoming more geopolitically contested,
Speaker 2: and we think it's a massive opportunity for Northland if
Speaker 2: the Energy Precinct is built out. Just to how we
Speaker 2: think it could be over the next ten, fifteen, twenty years,
Speaker 2: it's twenty thousand construction jobs, it's twelve hundred jobs on
Speaker 2: an ongoing basis, it's a quarter of a billion dollars
Speaker 2: contribution to New zealergyp. You know, it's a massive opportunity
Speaker 2: for New ZEALANDIC And if you think about some of
Speaker 2: the the industrialization they were seeing around us with manufacturing
Speaker 2: closing high energy prices, we've got the opportunity and to
Speaker 2: lean into solving a couple of those things with the
Speaker 2: Energy Precinct.
Speaker 1: And in order for all of those things to happen seamlessly,
Speaker 1: do we need a special Economic Zone?
Speaker 2: Well, I think the SEZ, which you know the Associate
Speaker 2: Minister for Energy announced back in February as something that
Speaker 2: government was considering, is I think something that would speed
Speaker 2: up the development of the Energy Precinct. So when we
Speaker 2: talk to international investors and international capital providers, you know
Speaker 2: they've got the choice to put the capital and their
Speaker 2: IP and many locations around the world. We think master
Speaker 2: points particularly unique location, but that especially kind of like
Speaker 2: zone provides that.
Speaker 6: Long term government endorsement or this being a place.
Speaker 2: For energy security type projects, that international investors can feel
Speaker 2: comfortable and safe about deploying capital into this area and
Speaker 2: recovering that capital and returns which are very long dated.
Speaker 1: And is anything happening at all? Our ministers just flocking
Speaker 1: to Marsden Point to have a look around all of
Speaker 1: a sudden, You've had three in the last few weeks.
Speaker 6: Yeah, Look, we've got stuff happening right now.
Speaker 2: So we're in the process of building what will be
Speaker 2: or converting an old crud teak from the refinery turned
Speaker 2: to what will be New Zealand's equal largest jet tech
Speaker 2: form of our customers and energy and that that tank
Speaker 2: SIT's next to the other largest tank jet tank in
Speaker 2: New Zealand and.
Speaker 6: So that's being developed at the moment.
Speaker 2: It's got a number of innovations which will help provide
Speaker 2: additional product quality, which is obviously credibly important for a
Speaker 2: product like jet. We've actually commenced construction for a new
Speaker 2: Bitchamen import terminal for one of our new customers, Higgins,
Speaker 2: and so that's going to involve building a new Bitchumen
Speaker 2: import line onto our wool for jety storage and distribution facility,
Speaker 2: and noting the government's policy around roads at national significance
Speaker 2: and the fact that they're looking at significant investment in roading.
Speaker 6: In Auckland and north of Auckland.
Speaker 2: The next nearest Bitchmen import terminal is in port A Tower, Honor,
Speaker 2: so you know it will be an incredibly important and
Speaker 2: valuable a set for the delivery of those things. So no, absolutely,
Speaker 2: we're kind of full flight right now, get it on with.
Speaker 6: Some of these things.
Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us, Rob, Thank you very much. That's
Speaker 1: it for this episode of The Front Page. You can
Speaker 1: read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage at
Speaker 1: enzdherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is produced
Speaker 1: by Jane Ye and Richard Martin, who is also our editor.
Speaker 1: I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to The Front Page on iHeartRadio
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