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Speaker 1: Health New Zealand. Health New Zealand has started a new

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Speaker 1: round of restructuring. It's asking for voluntary redundancies from anyone

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Speaker 1: working in health administration, advisory and knowledge roles. To apply

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Speaker 1: for redundancy. Health Commissioner Alista Levy has previously said that

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Speaker 1: they need to cut between two thy five hundred and

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Speaker 1: three thousand back office staff to save money. Nurses Organization

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Speaker 1: Chief executive Paul Golter is with us on this.

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Speaker 2: Hey, Paul, good, good afternoon.

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Speaker 1: Do we know how many they may cut in this

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Speaker 1: round of redundancy?

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Speaker 2: No, No, we don't, which is one of the unfortunate

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Speaker 2: things that have resulted from their failure to follow a

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Speaker 2: proper consultation process. So we're unable to answer that. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Now, I mean, we'll probably disagree about whether the back

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Speaker 1: office is a little bit fat here, but I mean

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Speaker 1: I think what we will agree on is if you

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Speaker 1: cut too deep, it affects the front front of line staff,

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Speaker 1: doesn't it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's the that's the feedback we've been getting

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Speaker 2: all day as a nursa is saying, well, who's going

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Speaker 2: to do that work? And if it's us, who's going

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Speaker 2: to do the rest of the work we have to

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Speaker 2: leave behind. So there's real knock on effects in this

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Speaker 2: sort of thing, and that's the sort of thing that

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Speaker 2: should have been worked through with us.

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Speaker 1: But do you guys want to have a say on it?

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Speaker 2: Well, the proposition has always come from the employer, But

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Speaker 2: basically there are consultation clauses inside the collective agreements which

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Speaker 2: require the employer to bring the their proposal to the

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Speaker 2: table and you sit down and you have a talk

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Speaker 2: about the numbers, and you wik your way through it,

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Speaker 2: and ultimately a proposal will emerge, which will be the

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Speaker 2: employer's proposal, and ultimately it's their decision. But working through

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Speaker 2: that process is way better understanding that what's going on,

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Speaker 2: and a chance to say, maybe, as an employee, you

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Speaker 2: got it.

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Speaker 1: Wrong, Paul, but I mean with respect, While I do

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Speaker 1: totally understand that you guys want to have to say,

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Speaker 1: if they have to consult with every single union that

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Speaker 1: is represented in a hospital, they will be consulting for

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Speaker 1: months because it's you guys, it's the doctors, it's the

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Speaker 1: other doctors, it's the cleaners, it's everybody.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, they should have thought about it that when

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Speaker 2: they put those clauses into the agreement.

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Speaker 1: Is the agreement, is that clause in the agreement not

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Speaker 1: pertaining to consultation with the affected union, not every other union.

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Speaker 2: With the book. So I can only expect, obviously for

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Speaker 2: ended no, and we definitely have that clause, and I

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Speaker 2: understand that's common to the others. But we will be

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Speaker 2: affected by the proposal. There's no doubt to talk about that.

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Speaker 2: And so we just didn't get a chance to have

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Speaker 2: a conversation at all about that. So it was just

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Speaker 2: pretty much announced.

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Speaker 1: Does your so do your contracts, your collective agreements say

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Speaker 1: that they have to consult with you guys, not just

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Speaker 1: on redundancies that affect nurses, but on redundancies that affect

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Speaker 1: literally any job that may be adjacent.

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Speaker 2: To a nurse it's affected by is the test and

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Speaker 2: I think you put your finger on it right opening question.

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Speaker 2: You know, the knock on effects of taking roles out,

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Speaker 2: particularly in a very and a dependent industry like our

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Speaker 2: health has a real iumpact.

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Speaker 1: Paul, Can you assure me that you guys are not

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Speaker 1: just being difficult to make life difficult for a center

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Speaker 1: right government that you don't support, because this just feels

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Speaker 1: a bit picky from you.

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Speaker 2: No, I think enforcing or having your contractful obligations in

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Speaker 2: the cliquic agreements met. I think that's independent of who's

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Speaker 2: in power, and more importantly, they're there to get a

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Speaker 2: better outcome than just one party saying this is the

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Speaker 2: rules and you've got to abide by them.

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Speaker 1: Paul, listen. Thank you very much. I really appreciate I actually, Paul,

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Speaker 1: before I let you go, do you know anything about

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Speaker 1: what's going on here with the HDU department in Wellington?

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Speaker 2: I'm sorry, I just you just dropped out HDU partners.

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Speaker 1: No, no, do you anything about what's going on with

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Speaker 1: the HDU the High Dependency Unit in Wellington Regional Hospital?

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Speaker 2: No, no, I don't. I'm sorry. I know there's constant

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Speaker 2: problems here.

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Speaker 1: You're not expected to know everything. Thank you very much,

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Speaker 1: PAULA really appreciate it. Paul Goalter from the New Zealand

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Speaker 1: Nurses Organization. For more from hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen

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