WEBVTT - Rugby Direct Episode 247: Rugby's greatest rivalry tour: The squad is set 0:00:09.093 --> 0:00:11.973 You're listening to a podcast from News Talks ed B. 0:00:12.373 --> 0:00:16.173 Follow this and our Wide Ranger podcast now on iHeartRadio. 0:00:19.333 --> 0:00:20.853 Straight down the middle of. 0:00:20.973 --> 0:00:32.573 DRUP Squad, try. 0:00:28.733 --> 0:00:33.253 Get inside the game from every angle. It's Rugby Direct 0:00:33.373 --> 0:00:37.133 with Elliott Smith and Liam Napier, powered by News Talks EDB. 0:00:37.813 --> 0:00:41.773 Welcome into Rugby directpowered by Access Solutions, elevating you and 0:00:41.813 --> 0:00:45.093 your business to a higher level. Elliott Smith with me, 0:00:45.293 --> 0:00:49.213 Liam Napier, and we have the forty four man squad 0:00:49.573 --> 0:00:54.173 for Rugby's greatest rivalry confirmed. Liam going to read us 0:00:54.173 --> 0:00:54.893 off the top of your head? 0:00:55.213 --> 0:00:56.533 How many? How manyame? Is it there? 0:00:57.573 --> 0:01:00.893 That's a bumper squad, isn't it, Elliott? But it must 0:01:00.933 --> 0:01:03.533 be the biggest squad certainly in recent memory, in all 0:01:03.573 --> 0:01:07.093 back's history. But it's going to be a brutal to 0:01:07.413 --> 0:01:09.413 and you'd have to think most of these players will 0:01:09.453 --> 0:01:12.493 be needed, certainly initially until you get to the back 0:01:12.573 --> 0:01:15.333 end and those midweek games cease. 0:01:15.813 --> 0:01:18.493 Absolutely, there's gonna be a better rotation. I suspect with 0:01:18.613 --> 0:01:21.093 for six to two bench used when Dave Renny front 0:01:21.093 --> 0:01:22.573 of media a couple of weeks back. But I guess 0:01:22.613 --> 0:01:28.013 your initial top line reactions to the squads. I guess 0:01:28.053 --> 0:01:30.733 we probably thought that thirty four that played in July, 0:01:30.853 --> 0:01:33.213 or at least were named originally for July, would be there. 0:01:33.253 --> 0:01:35.253 That has been the case. No one's come in or 0:01:35.333 --> 0:01:38.893 out through injury or form. Jamie Hannah was added to 0:01:38.893 --> 0:01:41.893 that squad and is not in the touring party for 0:01:41.933 --> 0:01:45.173 this tour, with Fabi and Holan coming back, so no 0:01:45.293 --> 0:01:47.693 surprises in those thirty four names. I guess the ten 0:01:48.173 --> 0:01:51.613 that have been included, we have three uncapped players there 0:01:51.613 --> 0:01:55.453 in Hurricanes props, Ali Lawaukee, justh Jacob out of the 0:01:55.973 --> 0:02:00.253 Highlanders from next year, but also Tartanaki and Samesi to Portailor. 0:02:00.333 --> 0:02:03.453 The drums started beating for him a fear about last week, 0:02:03.453 --> 0:02:05.733 and sure enough he is there. So three new faces. 0:02:05.733 --> 0:02:07.333 But what do you make of the overall squad. 0:02:07.973 --> 0:02:12.213 I think when he's shown a pension for being bold 0:02:12.333 --> 0:02:15.933 and surprising us throughout his short tenure, we saw that 0:02:16.093 --> 0:02:19.893 in July, and I think we're seeing it again here. 0:02:20.173 --> 0:02:24.693 I'm not sure other all Black coaches would have selected Smessie. 0:02:25.413 --> 0:02:29.493 I think he has a lot of upside. He's a 0:02:29.693 --> 0:02:32.813 very powerful ball carrier, damaging and that was very evident 0:02:33.053 --> 0:02:37.693 in a pretty poor wineer pacifica team. I think by 0:02:37.733 --> 0:02:43.373 selecting him, the probably backing themselves to not recondition him, 0:02:43.453 --> 0:02:45.733 but improve his fitness and get more out of him 0:02:46.653 --> 0:02:50.853 so that he's the big bolter, isn't he? From a 0:02:50.933 --> 0:02:55.853 Rockie perspective, Lawaki can play both sides of the scrum. 0:02:56.613 --> 0:02:59.773 He is a real comer. I think he'll be there 0:02:59.813 --> 0:03:02.293 for a long period of time and it makes sense 0:03:02.333 --> 0:03:04.453 to get him in and blood him. And then the 0:03:04.493 --> 0:03:09.613 other talking points are no grief and Noah Hotham. I 0:03:09.613 --> 0:03:13.173 think those are the two biggest emissions and those guys 0:03:13.213 --> 0:03:17.773 will be pondering the futures. Potentially only three half backs 0:03:17.773 --> 0:03:21.253 in that squad four first five, so interesting balance there. 0:03:21.733 --> 0:03:26.333 But if your doc Carefa, you're sitting back. First it 0:03:26.373 --> 0:03:30.973 was Anton Segna, now it's Ethan Blackadder. You can't make 0:03:31.013 --> 0:03:33.893 a forty four man squad. So this changing regime has 0:03:33.973 --> 0:03:36.653 really hurt you last year when you turned down an 0:03:36.693 --> 0:03:41.933 overseas contract to stay to chase that all black jersey. 0:03:42.053 --> 0:03:46.253 So he will be filthy probably. 0:03:46.053 --> 0:03:48.733 Yeah, I mean you'll be frustrated because he's gone from 0:03:48.733 --> 0:03:51.693 being quite high on the depth chart to plunging down 0:03:51.733 --> 0:03:54.773 quite quickly not Hopam's the same, and he started against 0:03:54.773 --> 0:03:58.693 South Africa and Wellington last year, albeit in ad midst 0:03:58.693 --> 0:04:00.733 of an injury crisis at halfback for the All Blacks, 0:04:00.733 --> 0:04:02.973 but now not in the squad to go to South 0:04:02.973 --> 0:04:05.613 Africa less than twelve months later. So there's been some 0:04:05.693 --> 0:04:07.893 really big drops. So I guess if we get the 0:04:07.893 --> 0:04:12.053 emission out of the way, you're right, Preston Karefi, Christian 0:04:12.093 --> 0:04:14.893 Leo Willie maybe offered throng a FASTI to an extent 0:04:14.933 --> 0:04:18.773 as well, those players that would consider themselves perhaps a 0:04:18.773 --> 0:04:20.253 little disappointed. 0:04:19.773 --> 0:04:20.533 Not to be there. 0:04:21.813 --> 0:04:24.333 The third half back scenario or fourth half back scenario 0:04:24.333 --> 0:04:27.813 was fascinated because they've clearly gone we back ourselves to 0:04:27.853 --> 0:04:31.533 get through the tour games by using Ratman and Preston. 0:04:32.053 --> 0:04:34.213 And if we need to, maybe we look at Leroy 0:04:34.213 --> 0:04:35.893 Carter because he's talked about a six or two bench, 0:04:36.133 --> 0:04:38.893 so maybe Leroy Carter comes into the reckoning. There is 0:04:39.213 --> 0:04:41.613 a bench option at half back that can also slot 0:04:41.653 --> 0:04:44.973 on the wing, maybe midfield as well, So perhaps they've 0:04:45.013 --> 0:04:46.693 gone we can cover that there mentioned here what Dave 0:04:46.733 --> 0:04:47.533 Rennie thinks as well. 0:04:47.813 --> 0:04:51.013 Yeah, I think you're right, but I am surprised half 0:04:51.013 --> 0:04:53.613 back such a specialized position. You look at hookers the same. 0:04:53.813 --> 0:04:58.013 They have gone a fourth hooker with George Bell. I think, yeah, 0:04:58.013 --> 0:05:00.933 maybe you're looking at it at Leroy Carter, even a 0:05:01.053 --> 0:05:06.013 Damien McKenzie type character who can give you ten minutes 0:05:06.053 --> 0:05:09.413 at half back. Perhaps, but just on Hopem I think 0:05:09.453 --> 0:05:14.293 the messaging was clear around him not being fast enough 0:05:14.333 --> 0:05:20.693 to the base. Maybe there's an attitude or a personality 0:05:20.733 --> 0:05:23.733 thing with him and Careffe as well. Not too sure, 0:05:23.773 --> 0:05:28.213 but look, Hotham for me still has a lot of upside. 0:05:28.253 --> 0:05:32.893 He has a great running game and I think his 0:05:33.053 --> 0:05:37.693 kicking needs some work, but his distribution is usually pretty sound. 0:05:38.613 --> 0:05:42.293 So it's a massive drop if you think about you know, 0:05:42.413 --> 0:05:46.013 you potentially considering going to Africa for potentially once in 0:05:46.053 --> 0:05:49.573 a lifetime tour, and now you're back playing provincial rugby. 0:05:50.373 --> 0:05:52.533 I don't think, no, hope I will throw his toys 0:05:52.533 --> 0:05:56.973 and jump ship just yet. But if you're Coriffee at 0:05:57.013 --> 0:05:59.133 this stage in your career and you're not in that mix, 0:05:59.653 --> 0:06:02.693 I think he really will sit down and consider his options. 0:06:02.693 --> 0:06:04.013 Will you look at it now and go, okay, I'm 0:06:04.053 --> 0:06:06.093 not in this forty four man squads to go to 0:06:06.133 --> 0:06:09.253 South Africa in a year's time. They'reabout is they're going 0:06:09.293 --> 0:06:11.973 to have to take a World Cup squad now, Kareefe 0:06:12.173 --> 0:06:13.973 Hope Firm, Lego Willie are going to have to do 0:06:14.013 --> 0:06:16.533 a lot of work to get back in the selectors thinking. 0:06:16.893 --> 0:06:18.533 And you've still got plenty of rugby in front of 0:06:18.533 --> 0:06:19.813 you for those guys are going to a fall in 0:06:19.853 --> 0:06:22.093 PC season. Maybe they can impress it on the end 0:06:22.093 --> 0:06:23.813 of view too. They're going to a full super rugmiy sais. 0:06:23.853 --> 0:06:25.773 They're not out of time. But I guess it's a 0:06:25.813 --> 0:06:28.133 question now for them of do they have the willingness 0:06:28.613 --> 0:06:32.333 to go to work and get themselves up and chase 0:06:32.333 --> 0:06:34.093 that spot on the All Blacks which will be fascinated 0:06:34.133 --> 0:06:34.693 to see what they do. 0:06:36.093 --> 0:06:37.733 Yeah, it's interesting. I guess when you look at the 0:06:37.733 --> 0:06:40.533 balance of those and the contrasts and the complimentary skills 0:06:40.533 --> 0:06:42.973 that the lose. For blackad as your workhorse and so 0:06:43.013 --> 0:06:46.893 he probably edges Cariffe and sa Messi two po ty 0:06:46.973 --> 0:06:49.373 lower is your big ball carrying number eight and so 0:06:49.493 --> 0:06:52.133 they've gone that way rather than a Leio. 0:06:51.973 --> 0:06:53.333 Wade and. 0:06:54.773 --> 0:06:58.053 It's really hard to shift that needle and selection is 0:06:58.133 --> 0:07:02.333 so subjective. What Scott Robinson wanted is clearly different from 0:07:02.333 --> 0:07:06.973 what Dave Rennie, Neil Barnes and Graham Henry wants. So 0:07:07.693 --> 0:07:10.613 it is really hard to change that thinking you probably 0:07:10.693 --> 0:07:13.933 need a few injuries and as you say, a World 0:07:13.973 --> 0:07:18.133 Cup squads at least what ten players are reduction on this. 0:07:18.333 --> 0:07:22.293 So yeah, really tough. I don't see any other major 0:07:22.333 --> 0:07:25.853 major emissions you're talking about. Offer toing it fussy. I 0:07:25.853 --> 0:07:29.533 think time's probably moved on from him. He looked pretty 0:07:29.613 --> 0:07:32.373 gassed with ball in hand, in particularly only playing forty 0:07:32.373 --> 0:07:36.053 minutes for the Blues and basically scrummaging and not doing 0:07:36.053 --> 0:07:37.333 a lot else around the field. 0:07:37.373 --> 0:07:39.293 Well, it was remarkably came back from that neck injury 0:07:39.293 --> 0:07:41.893 at all, quite frankly, and good on him for doing so. 0:07:41.973 --> 0:07:44.093 But yeah, I think you're right. The thing of the moment's past. 0:07:44.453 --> 0:07:49.213 And then yeah, naturally Fabian Hollands will be a real asset. 0:07:49.253 --> 0:07:52.133 They'll gradually build him up. He's just played one game 0:07:52.893 --> 0:07:57.213 preseason for Otago. Ammonia Nahua is another one has played 0:07:57.253 --> 0:07:59.933 bugger or rugby, played a preseason game for Bay Have 0:08:00.013 --> 0:08:04.293 Plenty at the weekends and our producer wasn't glowing. Mark 0:08:04.533 --> 0:08:07.693 in his assessment of Emoni's performance and that. But I 0:08:07.733 --> 0:08:09.933 can't remember the last time he actually played for the Chiefs. 0:08:09.933 --> 0:08:11.773 It must have been the start of the season out 0:08:11.773 --> 0:08:15.373 of foot fracture, missed the bulk of that year. So 0:08:16.333 --> 0:08:17.853 he's another guy that's been picked. 0:08:19.093 --> 0:08:20.813 One of his last accident all next year's He was 0:08:20.813 --> 0:08:22.973 scoring that try at Eden Park against the spring Box 0:08:23.093 --> 0:08:25.333 last year. That's what he's capable of, but then had 0:08:25.333 --> 0:08:31.733 a very serious rib stomach issue around that punctured lunched lung. 0:08:31.813 --> 0:08:34.693 That's it. And you know, but we know what he's 0:08:34.693 --> 0:08:36.413 capable of as well. 0:08:36.533 --> 0:08:40.933 So and he's another essential essentially another fullback in that mix. 0:08:41.013 --> 0:08:44.053 So he's good in the air, quite silky skills. So 0:08:44.093 --> 0:08:46.093 he certainly fits that brief that they're looking for. 0:08:46.173 --> 0:08:49.973 It does indeed, I guess if we're just going to 0:08:50.053 --> 0:08:52.413 talking about Smithy Toboard tay Lower a little bit more 0:08:52.653 --> 0:08:53.813 like I've been a big fan of him for a 0:08:53.813 --> 0:08:54.573 couple of seasons. 0:08:54.653 --> 0:08:54.813 Now. 0:08:54.853 --> 0:08:57.773 Now technically he was ineligible while he was playing for 0:08:57.853 --> 0:09:01.773 Wader Pacifica. Now Moana no longer exists, he doesn't have 0:09:01.773 --> 0:09:04.693 a Super Rugby contract for next year. It's made him 0:09:04.893 --> 0:09:06.373 agualy be picked I'm sure they could have bent the 0:09:06.413 --> 0:09:08.653 rules some way to get him in there, but I've 0:09:08.653 --> 0:09:10.733 been very impressed by him. The question I would have 0:09:10.853 --> 0:09:13.413 is he's probably a little bit rough around the edges 0:09:13.413 --> 0:09:17.413 in terms of his play. I would also suggest that 0:09:17.493 --> 0:09:20.013 maybe we've seen players from Miwana Pacifica go to other 0:09:20.053 --> 0:09:24.013 Super Rugby franchises and maybe it's a case of big 0:09:24.053 --> 0:09:25.213 fessional pond sort of thing. 0:09:25.253 --> 0:09:25.693 At Mojana. 0:09:25.733 --> 0:09:27.453 You stand out when you are doing something in a 0:09:27.453 --> 0:09:29.893 team that isn't really getting much go forward. You think 0:09:29.933 --> 0:09:34.733 of Levi Moore potentially and other players as well, they 0:09:34.733 --> 0:09:38.053 haven't maybe further their careers at other teams. So that's 0:09:38.093 --> 0:09:40.373 the one reservation I have about him. But I think 0:09:40.413 --> 0:09:45.053 he's a quality player. He seems dialed in and yeah, 0:09:45.093 --> 0:09:47.093 I'm looking forward to seeing what he can do in 0:09:47.133 --> 0:09:49.013 a Black jersey. I think there's a big opportunity for 0:09:49.133 --> 0:09:51.293 him with an eye to not only this too a 0:09:51.293 --> 0:09:51.773 bit beyond. 0:09:52.693 --> 0:09:57.333 Yeah. I agree. I think what your biggest upside is 0:09:57.333 --> 0:10:00.813 a player is a point of difference, and you can't 0:10:01.493 --> 0:10:06.093 coach size. And when you look at the composition of 0:10:06.133 --> 0:10:09.693 that loose forward makes there's no one else like in 0:10:09.773 --> 0:10:13.653 terms of physical composition, he steamroll players were ball in hand. 0:10:13.893 --> 0:10:16.013 I think it was there a performance against the Chiefs 0:10:17.013 --> 0:10:19.853 that stands out, and as I was saying a pretty 0:10:19.853 --> 0:10:23.373 poor team, he did shine. So maybe there's it speaks 0:10:23.373 --> 0:10:24.013 to what you're saying. 0:10:24.053 --> 0:10:24.773 But also. 0:10:26.373 --> 0:10:28.293 Things have had to move pretty quickly behind the scenes. 0:10:28.373 --> 0:10:31.573 He's on Rugby has had to contract him for next 0:10:31.613 --> 0:10:34.333 season without a Super Rugby franchise, so interesting to see 0:10:34.933 --> 0:10:38.013 the scramble that goes on behind the scenes and who 0:10:38.533 --> 0:10:41.573 looks to pick him up. A couple of other points 0:10:41.573 --> 0:10:45.293 to note. Tatavanahwa back in the midfield, another guy with 0:10:45.333 --> 0:10:48.053 a point of difference. Probably not his best Super Rugby season. 0:10:48.293 --> 0:10:50.293 I think he carried an injury for much of the year. 0:10:50.773 --> 0:10:53.493 And I'm not sure how much to read into this, 0:10:53.613 --> 0:10:55.933 but Rico jan he selected as an outside back, not 0:10:55.973 --> 0:10:56.653 a midfielder. 0:10:56.933 --> 0:10:58.853 Yeah, well it's gonna be interesting to see. Yeah, I mean, 0:10:59.653 --> 0:11:02.133 has this I heard a couple of people on Piney Show, 0:11:02.173 --> 0:11:03.693 I think it was of the Weekends, just thing that 0:11:03.733 --> 0:11:05.693 maybe he should be the starting center on this tour. 0:11:05.773 --> 0:11:07.533 I'm not sure that things will get to that point, 0:11:08.733 --> 0:11:12.253 but again, different coaches, it may see different things. Enrico 0:11:12.373 --> 0:11:16.573 Yuani and what he can do in a Test team. 0:11:16.813 --> 0:11:20.653 Josh Jacob Let's dial in a bit about him surprised 0:11:20.693 --> 0:11:25.013 by his selection. He takes the Richie Wonger spot that 0:11:25.053 --> 0:11:27.933 would have gone to Richie Wong's way, which sounds like 0:11:27.933 --> 0:11:30.133 he's good to go for the NPC opening round this 0:11:30.213 --> 0:11:33.573 weekend from that carf injury, but he gets a not 0:11:33.693 --> 0:11:35.773 in the All Blacks for the first time. To be honest, 0:11:35.973 --> 0:11:37.253 I've been a big fan of Josh Jacon for a 0:11:37.293 --> 0:11:39.533 few seasons, but I feel he's kind of stagnated a 0:11:39.573 --> 0:11:42.013 little bit at super Apeia level from the promise that 0:11:42.053 --> 0:11:44.853 he showed a couple of years ago, and maybe going 0:11:44.853 --> 0:11:46.613 to the Highland is next year a sea change would 0:11:46.613 --> 0:11:49.533 be good for him and everything else like that. But 0:11:51.133 --> 0:11:53.293 maybe Neil Barnes knows him at Tartanak and can get 0:11:53.333 --> 0:11:54.773 the best out of him. But I feel like he's 0:11:55.053 --> 0:11:57.293 stagnated a little bit. So it'll be interesting what role 0:11:57.333 --> 0:12:00.053 he has on this to with the All Blacks. 0:12:00.533 --> 0:12:04.413 Yeah, well, he's stagnated promptly because of a lack of opportunity. Right. 0:12:04.493 --> 0:12:09.173 He has been in that All Blacks fifteen on the 0:12:09.213 --> 0:12:12.973 cusp of Test selection, but not really in the conversation 0:12:13.093 --> 0:12:17.893 because Boden Barrett and Damien McKenzie and Mitch and Morong 0:12:17.893 --> 0:12:20.133 are coming back and Reuben Love now taking the reins, 0:12:20.173 --> 0:12:23.653 so you're quite well down the pecking order there. But yeah, 0:12:23.653 --> 0:12:25.213 going to the Highlands next year, we'll give him a 0:12:25.333 --> 0:12:27.293 chance to own a team to run the cutter and 0:12:27.373 --> 0:12:31.693 hopefully that'll be the making of his career. For me, 0:12:32.133 --> 0:12:35.573 he to this point in his career has been a 0:12:35.613 --> 0:12:39.173 real steady hand. I think he does the game management 0:12:39.853 --> 0:12:42.133 side of things well, but I think he to this 0:12:42.173 --> 0:12:44.613 point has lacked a bit of X factor in terms 0:12:44.653 --> 0:12:49.573 of challenging the line, a bit of creativity, So I 0:12:49.613 --> 0:12:51.853 want to see a bit more out of him there. 0:12:52.693 --> 0:12:55.973 The interesting scenario for me is they must have been 0:12:56.013 --> 0:12:59.013 tempted just to take three tens and then if you 0:12:59.053 --> 0:13:01.373 get an injury, you can immediately ask for an exemption 0:13:01.453 --> 0:13:03.653 to bring Moan over. So I'm a wee bit surprised 0:13:03.933 --> 0:13:06.813 that they've taken Jacob and four tens and they haven't 0:13:06.813 --> 0:13:11.573 closed that door because if if first five fullback goes down, 0:13:11.613 --> 0:13:14.133 they can argue they need someone. But it does kind 0:13:14.173 --> 0:13:16.053 of mitigate the need for Muwanga, doesn't It. 0:13:15.973 --> 0:13:17.933 Well, it does, but yeah, absolutely, because it's harder to 0:13:18.053 --> 0:13:20.853 argue if even if you ed to lose a random 0:13:20.853 --> 0:13:22.893 and random member of the squad, it's harder to go 0:13:22.973 --> 0:13:24.653 we always bring a rich and wonger there because you've 0:13:24.693 --> 0:13:27.813 got the cover there with fourteens. If it was if 0:13:27.813 --> 0:13:31.253 you had three teams and say a midfielder or outside 0:13:31.293 --> 0:13:33.133 back when down there and go, okay, we're going to 0:13:33.173 --> 0:13:35.613 put longer and we're going to move Barrett as outside 0:13:35.613 --> 0:13:37.453 back now or whatever it might be. But you do 0:13:37.573 --> 0:13:39.213 lose that argument a little bit. I'm sure there are 0:13:39.253 --> 0:13:42.813 ways to manipulate it. Point I've made previous on the 0:13:42.813 --> 0:13:45.133 podcast is that you know he fining off for it, 0:13:45.173 --> 0:13:46.893 continues to be selected by the All Blacks and is 0:13:46.933 --> 0:13:49.333 going on this tour. Still have not had an update 0:13:49.333 --> 0:13:51.173 as to whether he's out of this contract with Newcastle 0:13:51.253 --> 0:13:53.893 yet a player that's committed to New Zealand can't be selected, 0:13:53.933 --> 0:13:55.373 so I still find that baffling. 0:13:56.253 --> 0:13:58.613 Yeah, it's hard to get your head around some of 0:13:58.653 --> 0:14:03.133 those things, isn't it. Ardie severe as well, late start 0:14:03.253 --> 0:14:07.213 which was flagged by Rennie during July. He will arrive 0:14:07.333 --> 0:14:10.013 sometime closer to the first test, so we will essentially 0:14:10.053 --> 0:14:16.613 get two weeksish off to refresh physically, mentally, spend time 0:14:16.693 --> 0:14:21.493 a family. So there'll be another captain for the first 0:14:21.773 --> 0:14:22.693 three tour games. 0:14:23.853 --> 0:14:24.973 I believe in two captains. 0:14:25.013 --> 0:14:28.133 Yeah yeah, And look that's got to be needed, doesn't it. 0:14:28.173 --> 0:14:30.573 For ARTI's basically played eighteen months of rugby. 0:14:30.893 --> 0:14:33.013 Yeah, I mean it was his choice to go on sabbatical, 0:14:33.893 --> 0:14:36.053 so let's remember that. But it was again, if he 0:14:36.093 --> 0:14:38.293 goes doesn't go on sabbatical, perhaps it's not contract to 0:14:38.293 --> 0:14:40.213 member of New Zealand Rugby. So there are swings and 0:14:40.293 --> 0:14:43.733 roundabouts there and various things that have to be you know, 0:14:43.813 --> 0:14:46.573 you got to pay the piper, so to speak, and 0:14:47.573 --> 0:14:49.653 balance it out that way. I don't have a huge 0:14:49.653 --> 0:14:51.973 issue with for missing it. And there were reports obviously 0:14:52.013 --> 0:14:55.853 from Gregor Paul and others including yourself around you know, 0:14:55.933 --> 0:14:57.973 may not even play for the All Blacks again. So 0:14:58.973 --> 0:15:00.293 I think we've got to the point now if he's 0:15:00.293 --> 0:15:02.133 selling to miss those first two or three tour matches, 0:15:02.973 --> 0:15:05.613 probably about it right and and we know what we'll 0:15:05.653 --> 0:15:07.013 get out of Artie. I mean there was chatter that 0:15:07.053 --> 0:15:09.573 he maybe would miss the entire July series, but he 0:15:09.613 --> 0:15:12.133 was appointed captain. You can't have your captain missing the 0:15:12.173 --> 0:15:14.173 first three tests under a new era, so there was 0:15:14.493 --> 0:15:15.773 a little bit of balancing going on. 0:15:15.813 --> 0:15:17.933 I don't have a huge issue with it. What about yourself? 0:15:18.413 --> 0:15:24.413 I think, look, it makes sense this window to refresh him. 0:15:25.173 --> 0:15:27.653 He's going to play full brutal tests against the Box 0:15:27.693 --> 0:15:32.133 and captain unless there's some major injury. So yeah, I 0:15:32.133 --> 0:15:35.613 think it makes sense. Just on Artie's future, I think 0:15:35.693 --> 0:15:38.973 he is definitely itching closer to inking a deal with 0:15:39.013 --> 0:15:41.693 the Blues. I know the Blues met with him in 0:15:41.733 --> 0:15:46.053 person during those three tests in July and they put 0:15:46.093 --> 0:15:50.213 forward a formal offer and it's now basically sitting with 0:15:50.253 --> 0:15:53.093 New Zealand Rugby to see if they can bridge the 0:15:53.133 --> 0:15:58.453 financial gap. But I think that will happen. That's my 0:15:58.533 --> 0:16:03.133 expectation because he doesn't really have anywhere else to go, 0:16:03.333 --> 0:16:06.253 certainly not within New Zealand Arabia, I wouldn't think, and 0:16:07.853 --> 0:16:11.733 the Blue who are the strongest commercial team in New Zealand, 0:16:11.773 --> 0:16:13.733 so I don't think you'll get any more money elsewhere. 0:16:14.773 --> 0:16:16.573 So maybe that deal gets done by the time he 0:16:16.613 --> 0:16:18.613 gets to Africa. Not one hundred percent on that, but 0:16:18.813 --> 0:16:20.333 it certainly wheels in motion. 0:16:20.453 --> 0:16:21.573 It would have been nice to see him in red 0:16:21.613 --> 0:16:24.773 and black, but you know, cut and everything. Who has 0:16:24.773 --> 0:16:26.973 the most again, out of let's say the ten players 0:16:27.333 --> 0:16:29.853 that have been recalled, we haven't touched Ethan black at 0:16:29.973 --> 0:16:31.333 back in the mix as well for the first time 0:16:31.533 --> 0:16:33.693 in a couple of years. Very much alike Forul Like 0:16:33.813 --> 0:16:35.653 with Jacobson, I suppose if you're going to shadow the 0:16:35.653 --> 0:16:38.573 two teams, there's just seven on the other side of things, 0:16:38.613 --> 0:16:41.373 and he's got in with Karefi. But out of those 0:16:41.733 --> 0:16:44.693 ten new ish names, who has the most again, in 0:16:44.813 --> 0:16:47.973 terms of making a test twenty three? Do you think, well, 0:16:48.013 --> 0:16:50.813 who has the most likelihood of breaking into the Test 0:16:50.813 --> 0:16:51.373 twenty three? 0:16:52.613 --> 0:16:56.253 Well, it partly depends on injuries. But look, if a 0:16:56.293 --> 0:17:00.533 guy like Samssi Toptaya Lower comes out and steamroll some 0:17:01.613 --> 0:17:06.773 massive South African opponents, I think he's a genuine candidate 0:17:06.813 --> 0:17:10.013 for the bench, isn't he him on with twenty minutes 0:17:10.053 --> 0:17:12.813 to go and unleash him. Look, he's as you to 0:17:12.893 --> 0:17:15.373 your point, he's still very raw and it'll be interesting 0:17:15.413 --> 0:17:18.653 to see how much game time he actually gets. But 0:17:18.733 --> 0:17:20.413 if you look at some of the other rookies like 0:17:20.533 --> 0:17:24.133 Jacob and Lowaki, they feel like they're further down the 0:17:24.133 --> 0:17:29.253 picking order where Taylor I feel like he could come 0:17:29.333 --> 0:17:32.813 up pretty quick, depending on performances and how he takes 0:17:32.893 --> 0:17:38.693 that environment. It can be very overwhelming and can take 0:17:38.733 --> 0:17:43.133 players sometime to find their feats, but I think he's 0:17:43.173 --> 0:17:46.973 certainly one guy. Jacob, I don't see him really pushing 0:17:46.973 --> 0:17:51.733 that hards. Fabian Holland obviously could rise up the ranks 0:17:51.733 --> 0:17:53.653 pretty quickly if he can get up to speeds. He 0:17:53.693 --> 0:17:56.493 hasn't played a lot of rugby this year, but he's 0:17:56.533 --> 0:17:59.173 a young man and by all accounts of Rehead, Well 0:17:59.253 --> 0:17:59.853 what about you. 0:17:59.893 --> 0:18:02.573 Yeah, I'd say Fabin Holand would be close to that 0:18:02.613 --> 0:18:04.893 match that first choice twenty three, I mean tweet, but 0:18:04.893 --> 0:18:07.853 lots he played really well starting opportunity with in Dowry 0:18:08.093 --> 0:18:10.613 play some great rugby this year as well. Josh Lord, 0:18:10.813 --> 0:18:13.653 I think we're well served with locks super vibe. But 0:18:13.813 --> 0:18:16.253 if you're going to have VI on the blind side, 0:18:16.813 --> 0:18:18.573 the question is whether you need a lot on the bench. 0:18:18.613 --> 0:18:20.573 So maybe he's either got to be in the starting 0:18:20.613 --> 0:18:22.853 side or not at all, and that lends you should 0:18:22.853 --> 0:18:24.973 get more flankers on the bench, So maybe he might 0:18:25.013 --> 0:18:28.053 not be able to crack that twenty three potentially for 0:18:28.093 --> 0:18:30.853 this tour. I think in morning Nadawa, you know, every 0:18:30.853 --> 0:18:33.213 time he's been in the black jersey has stood up. 0:18:34.053 --> 0:18:35.613 I think if you get some reps under his belt, 0:18:35.653 --> 0:18:37.253 then there's a very good chance that he could find 0:18:37.293 --> 0:18:39.573 his way into a twenty three man. Not history starting, 0:18:40.493 --> 0:18:43.213 but just that versatility off the bench is that he 0:18:43.253 --> 0:18:45.733 can play the wings, he can play full back. He's 0:18:45.733 --> 0:18:48.253 played midfield as well at Super Rugbia level I think, 0:18:48.253 --> 0:18:50.933 but certainly in n PC. So it just gives the benchrops, 0:18:51.053 --> 0:18:52.373 especially if you want to go for a six to two. 0:18:52.453 --> 0:18:54.533 So I think think of our players that can rapidly 0:18:54.533 --> 0:18:56.373 climb up the first choice ranks. 0:18:56.573 --> 0:18:59.733 I think Fabian Holland. Look, he's a red hot chance 0:18:59.893 --> 0:19:02.773 of being the starting lock for the All Blacks again. 0:19:02.893 --> 0:19:05.693 It was only eighteen months ago as World Rugby Breakthrough 0:19:05.693 --> 0:19:07.013 Player of the Year, was probably one of the All 0:19:07.053 --> 0:19:12.533 Blacks best last year. He just physically he's a massive 0:19:12.853 --> 0:19:16.933 units so shouldn't have any any trouble in that regard 0:19:17.213 --> 0:19:21.533 and a great line out target. Prior to his injury 0:19:21.573 --> 0:19:24.293 he was an eight minute player half the time as well, 0:19:24.333 --> 0:19:26.733 even at Test level, so he's a real asset. To 0:19:26.733 --> 0:19:27.133 get back. 0:19:27.253 --> 0:19:29.333 Yeah, and looked pretty good for the forty minutes. I 0:19:29.333 --> 0:19:31.653 saw a bit of that the other day Otago in 0:19:31.693 --> 0:19:34.853 the Shield defense. That about does us rugby direct quick. 0:19:34.893 --> 0:19:38.013 We've done Brad Moore leaving the Crusaders as an assistant coach, 0:19:38.253 --> 0:19:40.373 We'll take on the Fiji and drew it job. So 0:19:40.893 --> 0:19:42.573 he was sort of jostling with Scott Hanson by the 0:19:42.573 --> 0:19:45.093 sound of it for that Crusader's job, deciding to go 0:19:45.133 --> 0:19:49.573 abroad and take on newer pastures, warmer past years, probably 0:19:49.653 --> 0:19:50.293 in Fiji. 0:19:50.613 --> 0:19:57.973 Yeah, the smiling assassin's buller buller. Yeah, it's a it's 0:19:58.013 --> 0:20:00.653 a good gig. I think the Duror have a lot 0:20:00.693 --> 0:20:05.853 of potential. I think they faded from mcburn to Glenn Jackson. 0:20:06.293 --> 0:20:08.973 It's interesting to see what Brad Moore can get out 0:20:08.973 --> 0:20:12.653 of them. He's vast experience. He's traveled with the Globe 0:20:13.373 --> 0:20:19.013 and the Fiji national team of the concern at the moment. 0:20:19.133 --> 0:20:21.293 So if you do well with the Duror, you rarely 0:20:21.333 --> 0:20:24.413 put yourself in the shop window for their national team, 0:20:24.573 --> 0:20:28.933 who got pumped a couple of times in November with 0:20:29.053 --> 0:20:32.973 their surprising coaching change. So there's there's a real pathway 0:20:32.973 --> 0:20:33.733 to progression there. 0:20:33.813 --> 0:20:34.573 Yeah, very much so. 0:20:34.693 --> 0:20:37.893