1
00:00:01,840 --> 00:00:03,840
Speaker 1: Sounds like Cabinet's going to decide on Monday how to

2
00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:07,200
Speaker 1: fund nationals thirteen cancer drugs. The word is the Cabinet

3
00:00:07,200 --> 00:00:10,000
Speaker 1: will bump farmac's budget up by about six hundred million

4
00:00:10,039 --> 00:00:12,039
Speaker 1: dollars over four years to make that happen. David Seymour

5
00:00:12,119 --> 00:00:15,440
Speaker 1: was the farm AC minister. Hey, David good, is that

6
00:00:15,440 --> 00:00:17,920
Speaker 1: one of the considerations, a funding boost of six hundred million.

7
00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:22,360
Speaker 2: I'm going to put numbers on it, but you don't

8
00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:26,439
Speaker 2: actually need any special inside information to work out that.

9
00:00:27,120 --> 00:00:32,040
Speaker 2: Nikola Willis really set out the options about two weeks ago,

10
00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:36,440
Speaker 2: and I think she did a very accurate portrayal. Either

11
00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:41,440
Speaker 2: FARMAC could be instructed to fund specific drugs so the

12
00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:44,680
Speaker 2: government can keep its promise to national and as patients.

13
00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:49,239
Speaker 2: That that would be I think an extraordinary departure from

14
00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:54,680
Speaker 2: Farmac's independence, but a logical possibility. Some other entities such

15
00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:58,880
Speaker 2: as what Labor did to buy the Farmac sorry COVID

16
00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:03,240
Speaker 2: vaccines would be set up again a pretty radical move.

17
00:01:03,960 --> 00:01:07,679
Speaker 2: The other is to give more money to FARMAC, protect

18
00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:13,240
Speaker 2: its independence and keep giving it money until more pharmaceuticals

19
00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:17,280
Speaker 2: come out. And that of course is the third logical possibility.

20
00:01:17,319 --> 00:01:19,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, the third option is obviously the one that would

21
00:01:19,360 --> 00:01:21,880
Speaker 1: be preferable. But how long would that? I mean you

22
00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:25,240
Speaker 1: could go for years, even decades without the stuff being funded,

23
00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:25,679
Speaker 1: couldn't you.

24
00:01:27,680 --> 00:01:31,840
Speaker 2: Well, that's not necessarily true. You know, FARMAC at any

25
00:01:31,840 --> 00:01:35,520
Speaker 2: given time has its options for investment lists, which it's

26
00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:38,679
Speaker 2: already done the maths on and said, if we had

27
00:01:38,680 --> 00:01:42,720
Speaker 2: an extra dollar, we would buy more of these treatments

28
00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:45,920
Speaker 2: because those are the ones that, according to our formula,

29
00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:51,760
Speaker 2: would deliver greater benefits for people who are fighting various conditions.

30
00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:52,800
Speaker 2: Up and Dounew Zealand.

31
00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:55,680
Speaker 1: Are all thirteen of these drugs on that wish list?

32
00:01:57,320 --> 00:02:01,880
Speaker 2: Well, I wouldn't even be able to ask Pharmac if

33
00:02:01,920 --> 00:02:04,520
Speaker 2: that was the case, because the whole point of it

34
00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:07,160
Speaker 2: is that there are at arm's links from politicians and

35
00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:11,440
Speaker 2: they're independent. And what's more, if I can find out,

36
00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:14,920
Speaker 2: then of course you end up with a situation where

37
00:02:14,960 --> 00:02:19,320
Speaker 2: politicians are basically sort of winking and nudge guiding the

38
00:02:19,400 --> 00:02:22,800
Speaker 2: decision making by giving money to get to a certain

39
00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:26,320
Speaker 2: drug on the list. So that's not how it works

40
00:02:26,320 --> 00:02:27,399
Speaker 2: and not how it should work.

41
00:02:28,120 --> 00:02:30,000
Speaker 1: You would never go down that path, would you? As

42
00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:31,799
Speaker 1: a cabinet David? You would never give them six hundred

43
00:02:31,800 --> 00:02:35,400
Speaker 1: million dollars and then expect them to fund these thirteen drugs.

44
00:02:36,720 --> 00:02:38,720
Speaker 2: Well, I think we have to be really clear that

45
00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:42,480
Speaker 2: if Farmac has some challenges, there's no question about that.

46
00:02:42,520 --> 00:02:44,160
Speaker 2: I've been quite open about it. It's part of the

47
00:02:44,200 --> 00:02:48,320
Speaker 2: reason why I took it on, and that's around listening

48
00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:52,200
Speaker 2: to patient voice, being prepared to show how funding more

49
00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:55,720
Speaker 2: treatments can save the healthcare system and the government money elsewhere.

50
00:02:56,120 --> 00:02:58,399
Speaker 2: It's about how they deal with devices which are sort

51
00:02:58,400 --> 00:03:01,160
Speaker 2: of half responsible for, and I think it's generally to

52
00:03:01,240 --> 00:03:03,760
Speaker 2: do a thing a bit more collegial. I've been quite

53
00:03:03,800 --> 00:03:08,200
Speaker 2: open about this criticisms. However, the pharmac model at Base

54
00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:12,160
Speaker 2: is run by some very able people, very good at

55
00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:16,840
Speaker 2: pharmacology and finance. They make good decisions, so the bust decisions,

56
00:03:16,840 --> 00:03:20,639
Speaker 2: and they negotiate less. The pharmaceutical company is on behalf

57
00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:23,680
Speaker 2: of all of us, and that hardcore of Farnach I

58
00:03:23,680 --> 00:03:26,920
Speaker 2: think is something that we should be very pleased to

59
00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:29,120
Speaker 2: have as a country. I think it serves us well

60
00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:32,480
Speaker 2: and we should always be very cautious about compromising it.

61
00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:34,880
Speaker 1: David, thank you for you. Tom appreciated good like on Monday.

62
00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:37,480
Speaker 1: That's David Seymour, the Farmac Minister, be dealing with it

63
00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:38,600
Speaker 1: on Monday Cabinet.

64
00:03:39,040 --> 00:03:42,240
Speaker 2: For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive listen live to

65
00:03:42,320 --> 00:03:45,360
Speaker 2: news Talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow

66
00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:47,160
Speaker 2: the podcast on iHeartRadio