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Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from Newstalks EDB. Follow this

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Speaker 1: and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio. Yet

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Speaker 1: Inside the Game from Every Angle against Rugby Direct with

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Speaker 1: Elliott Smith powered by News Talks EDB.

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Speaker 2: Welcome into Rugby Direct powered by folkliveb Solutions, lifting you

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Speaker 2: and your business to a higher level Elliott Smith and

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Speaker 2: leaving Apier back again to review the week that was

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Speaker 2: in the world of rugby and liam By. This time

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Speaker 2: last week we were assessing All Blacks defeat in Wellington.

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Speaker 2: This time though, it's a comfortable All Blacks wind, built

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Speaker 2: off the back of a very impressive first half at

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Speaker 2: Eden Park thirty five to three at halftime. The All

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Speaker 2: Blacks didn't really put a foot wrong in the first spell.

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Speaker 2: What are your top lines out of that performance?

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Speaker 3: I think we saw from the All Blacks what we

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Speaker 3: expected to see in Wellington essentially, and it was a response,

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Speaker 3: wasn't it the required that demanded rebounds? And it all

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Speaker 3: started up front, the intent, the physicality from the All

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Speaker 3: Blacks pack. They've got a lot more scrums, but they

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Speaker 3: were very direct with their ball carrying and the pick

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Speaker 3: and drive. A few subtle tweaks around simpler flying. The

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Speaker 3: game plan made some big shifts with the kicking game,

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Speaker 3: little chips and behind the defense, and the All Blacks

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Speaker 3: were just ruthless and clinical and that's what we've been

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Speaker 3: waiting for from Scott Robertson's All Blacks and this was

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Speaker 3: the first time that we'd really seen it.

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Speaker 2: It was and everything that they couldn't do last week,

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Speaker 2: especially in that first half on Saturday night, they will

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Speaker 2: managed to do this week. They built pressure, they paid

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Speaker 2: them down the right areas of the ground, Their kicking

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Speaker 2: game was a hell of a lot better and they

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Speaker 2: got a lot more out of their full pack as

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Speaker 2: well in terms of the loose forwards Nowadaysavey had a

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Speaker 2: good game in Wellington, but Ethan blakeatter I thought it

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Speaker 2: had a very strong game. Don Papalei is still a

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Speaker 2: bit quiet, but it was an improvement I thought, and

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Speaker 2: think that they didn't get right in the Capital, they

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Speaker 2: kind of put right again at Eden Park.

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Speaker 3: They did and they played to the conditions. They knew

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Speaker 3: rain was coming from a long way out and the

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Speaker 3: only you know, not to be a negative nancy or whatever,

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Speaker 3: but go for it. Look, the Pumas were poor and

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Speaker 3: they were played off the park. But the theme of

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Speaker 3: the Pumas falling off a mental cliff following a triumph

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Speaker 3: over the All Blacks continues, doesn't it. We saw it

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Speaker 3: in twenty twenty, we saw it in twenty twenty two

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Speaker 3: and it was the same theme. Now, credit to the

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Speaker 3: All Blacks. They did everything that was asked of them,

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Speaker 3: but the Pumas it just felt like they weren't at

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Speaker 3: the races compared to Wellington.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's been the issue. As you point out,

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Speaker 2: those two wins have had over the All Blacks haven't

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Speaker 2: been able to back them up, not even in the

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Speaker 2: form of a win, but even a close loss the

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Speaker 2: following week, putting pressure on a game that's not decided

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Speaker 2: until the last ten minutes or thereabouts. So they've been

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Speaker 2: blown off the park and each of those occasions. And

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Speaker 2: it was interesting hearing Felipe Contopomy after the game on

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Speaker 2: Saturday sort of say, well, we're emotional people, but how

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Speaker 2: do you know it wasn't the All Blacks that raise

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Speaker 2: their emotions by thirty percent. I respect his argument, but

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Speaker 2: I certainly think it's an issue with the Pumas now

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Speaker 2: as well as that they get so high after a

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Speaker 2: win and why not. It was magnificent on those three occasions.

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Speaker 2: But they need to keep their heads level and whoever

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Speaker 2: the coach is, whether it's Felipe himself or whatever, they

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Speaker 2: can find that magic potion that is able to get

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Speaker 2: them to be consistent in world rugby will have a

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Speaker 2: real team on their hands.

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Speaker 3: And it's something inherent in South American Latin cultures, isn't it.

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Speaker 3: They're naturally emotive people and you see that with the

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Speaker 3: anthem and just their style of play. Look at Marcos

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Speaker 3: Crema and you know the way that they play, who

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Speaker 3: they are, who they embrace as people. But it is

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Speaker 3: something that they need to grasp, the ability to maintain

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Speaker 3: some form of level. But look, you've got to give

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Speaker 3: the All Blacks credit. While the Pumas were inept and

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Speaker 3: a lot of aspects, a lot of that was your

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Speaker 3: black supplying pressure. Defensively, they were superbed as a couple

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Speaker 3: of charge doowns. They got off the line and applied

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Speaker 3: relentless pressure and forced the Pumas into mistakes, whether that

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Speaker 3: be in their ball carrying or kicking. And like you

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Speaker 3: pointed out, there was so much more patient with their attack.

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Speaker 3: It wasn't like you didn't feel they were trying to

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Speaker 3: score off every play. They built pressure, whether that be

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Speaker 3: through their defense or phases, or they're more or the scrum,

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Speaker 3: and that allowed them to capitalize. So a lot more

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Speaker 3: patients on attack and it just felt like they're on

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Speaker 3: the same page a lot more. If you think about

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Speaker 3: what we'd seen from this team to this point. Their

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Speaker 3: attack in particular was quite clunky. They felt like they

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Speaker 3: were tripping over each other. Maybe too many men, maybe

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Speaker 3: too many set plays. I'm not sure what it was,

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Speaker 3: but it really shined through for me. TJ Pedinara Scott

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Speaker 3: robertson to Mikey Williams all talking about how it was

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Speaker 3: simple messaging about what they had to get right, what

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Speaker 3: they had to fix, and while no opposition is the same,

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Speaker 3: I do feel like that needs to be a bit

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Speaker 3: of a blueprint for the saw Blacks team, not trying

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Speaker 3: to do too much in a week, not trying to

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Speaker 3: over complicate things, and just pick a couple of really

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Speaker 3: key rocks to get right and a really you know,

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Speaker 3: rugby is a simple game. When you get that go

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Speaker 3: for platform, everything else tends to fall into place.

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Speaker 2: Speaking of that go for platform, TJ pen and I

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Speaker 2: looked a damn site better on Saturday night than he

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Speaker 2: did the previous week where he was confused at times

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Speaker 2: and was labored in his efforts. I would have switched

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Speaker 2: to cortez Ra and TJ. Penn and R and I

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Speaker 2: still probably would have even with the benefit of hindsight

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Speaker 2: from that performance at Eden part. But it was a

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Speaker 2: really good performance from TJ Pedinara and showed why they

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Speaker 2: put some faith in it and them for this year

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Speaker 2: is last year in New Zealand, Rugby represented the All

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Speaker 2: Blacks to still be the starting number nine at this

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Speaker 2: point in time.

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Speaker 3: I think if you broadened it out to the selections

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Speaker 3: in general, there was a lot of scrutiny, wasn't there

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Speaker 3: on Scott Robinson. He made four starting changes and this

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Speaker 3: was a real box to the wall, their first real

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Speaker 3: spotlight test for the All Blacks, and they showed a

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Speaker 3: lot of faith. They leaned heavily on experience, and myself

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Speaker 3: and others were questioned that and TJ. Pteranara really was

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Speaker 3: at the forefront of that. He was poor and Wellington

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Speaker 3: didn't have the platform but charged a number of times

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Speaker 3: with his kicking quite slow and labored from the base

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Speaker 3: and he wasn't perfect in this match either, but that

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Speaker 3: little snipe down the blind side was a brilliant, classy

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Speaker 3: piece of attacking play, not only in the vision, but

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Speaker 3: the ability to hold the offload up, draw the defender

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Speaker 3: and then set will Jordan away. It is, I guess

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Speaker 3: curious if you take a step back and look at

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Speaker 3: him and Sam Kine and the fact that they are

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Speaker 3: leaving at the end of the year. Kane came off

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Speaker 3: the bench and played half an hour. You know, where

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Speaker 3: is this team going is? It's about the here and now?

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Speaker 3: You know, do you just play who's available for this

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Speaker 3: year or are you looking to develop long term? It

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Speaker 3: is a bit of a vexed, delicate question, isn't it.

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Speaker 2: It is look the TJ question before I circle back around.

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Speaker 2: He's played plucking a number out of thin here, but

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Speaker 2: it's probably in the vicinity of seventy five to eight

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Speaker 2: percent of his test match is coming off the bench

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Speaker 2: for the All Blacks. Now in the twilight of his career,

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Speaker 2: you're asking him to start. I think, yes, he's still

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Speaker 2: worthy of being in that All Blacks mix, but wouldn't

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Speaker 2: you keep him in the bench position that he's most

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Speaker 2: accustomed to be your finisher and you can either slow

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Speaker 2: down or bring the pace of the game up depending

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Speaker 2: on what you need in the last twenty five minutes

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Speaker 2: of a Test match. That's what something I'm still not

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Speaker 2: entirely sold on, but I think if you're Robinson, you

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Speaker 2: need to win matches in the here and now. You

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Speaker 2: don't get a honeymoon period if you're All Blacks coach.

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Speaker 2: So he started with two tests against England. They put

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Speaker 2: in a lot of the incumbents from last year that

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Speaker 2: were there. It wouldn't surprise me in the two Tests

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Speaker 2: against South Africa if Sam Kaine has leaned upon to

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Speaker 2: start these two test matches.

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Speaker 3: In all honesty, yeah, I don't know if they will

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Speaker 3: go that way, but I think having included him in

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Speaker 3: this group that he will certainly be a strong consideration.

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Speaker 3: Just on the halfbacks. I think it would be a

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Speaker 3: different consideration if camer or gab was fit. I think

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Speaker 3: he is. You're bolted on starter by some distance, provided

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Speaker 3: he comes back at a similar level to where he was.

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Speaker 3: But I think it does show a bit of lack

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Speaker 3: of faith in Cortez Artama at the stage for him

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Speaker 3: to handle the white hot heat of a desperate All

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Speaker 3: Black team needing to front the conditions as well, very

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Speaker 3: difficult on the face of Eden, So the All Blacks

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Speaker 3: just wanted to calm head at the base and I

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Speaker 3: think having seen the way Pirana responded, it's going to

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Speaker 3: be pretty difficult to go away from him. Looking ahead

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Speaker 3: to South Africa on what's going to be one of

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Speaker 3: the toughest tests that they will face this year.

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Speaker 2: Sodney will be Damie McKenzie I thought had a very

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Speaker 2: good game at ten again, coming under pressure during the

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Speaker 2: week and when it's all bound that front football, isn't

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Speaker 2: it When the front foot ball you get from the

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Speaker 2: Fords is laying it on for the nine and ten,

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Speaker 2: instantly they look better. But I thought that combination stepped

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Speaker 2: up really well. He did.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, he wasn't flawless again. I think he skied one

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Speaker 3: kick out on the fall and dropped a high ball

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Speaker 3: in the second half, but it's a wee bit nitpicky.

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Speaker 3: He scored the opening try and I think it is

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Speaker 3: a credit to the All Blacks coaching team that they

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Speaker 3: spotted that space and behind the Puma's rush defense, Jeordie

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Speaker 3: Barret executed on one occasion. Damien McKenzie on another and

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Speaker 3: there were two runners pushing through the line at the

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Speaker 3: same time, so it was a clear plan and executed

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Speaker 3: really well. It was a step in the right direction

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Speaker 3: for mackenzie. I think Scot Robinson called it his best

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Speaker 3: test this year and that's fair. Boden Barrett played the

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Speaker 3: last half an hour at first five, so I think

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Speaker 3: that's still a live debate. But you have to say

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Speaker 3: McKenzie's bolted on to start the next test against the box.

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Speaker 3: What about the forward pack. You know there's been so

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Speaker 3: much debate and scrutiny on the loose forward trio. At

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Speaker 3: the balance of it, what did you make of I

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Speaker 3: guess the faith that was retained there was it repaid?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: I think it was by and large. Like I probably

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Speaker 2: would have gone with more ball carriers and Savia and

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Speaker 2: Satiti starting together. I still think you need that extra

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Speaker 2: ball carrier to dent the line. That the question I

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Speaker 2: don't think was necessarily answered in that performance at eating

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Speaker 2: part because the defense wasn't up to scratch from Argentina.

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Speaker 2: It's gonna be different against South Africa. But I think

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Speaker 2: you need twin ball carriers in that loose ford trio,

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Speaker 2: and I don't think necessarily got it. Having said that,

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Speaker 2: I thought Ethan Blackader had a very very good test match,

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Speaker 2: probably his best test off the top of my head.

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Speaker 2: At Blindside. He made second highest tackles for the All

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Speaker 2: Blacks with eighteen, a lot of carries. He was dynamic,

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Speaker 2: he scored a try, was responsible for killing the pumas

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Speaker 2: more on occasions. So really like what the Ethan Blackader did.

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Speaker 2: And you can see when he gets into a rhythm

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Speaker 2: and he's playing some regular rugby and not hampered by injury,

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Speaker 2: what he's certainly capable of. So helly on his start.

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Speaker 2: I'm sure he'll start against South Africa. I still think, Look,

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Speaker 2: I don't know whether it's Sam Caine or that Satiti

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Speaker 2: savea combination. I just think there is still a question

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Speaker 2: about the best makeup of that loose Ford trio that

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Speaker 2: I think they're still going to tinker with it at

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Speaker 2: some point over the course of the coming tests.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, some of Penny females. Another guy is and he

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Speaker 3: hasn't been cited since those tests against England, and I

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Speaker 3: think there's a few who bumps and bruises. He's been

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Speaker 3: nursing behind the scenes, but he on Sunday as we're

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Speaker 3: recording this will play for Wakato and will certainly be

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Speaker 3: in that squad that goes to South Africa. He's a

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Speaker 3: big body, likes the TC and I agree that Full

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Speaker 3: Pack has lacked big ball carriers, and I think that

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Speaker 3: is still a big question mark when you look at

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Speaker 3: the box and their proficiency in the area. When you're

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Speaker 3: broad in that conversation out along the ball carrying discussion,

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Speaker 3: Scott Barrett coming back as a big body. Patrick Patrick

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Speaker 3: two Polotu doesn't sound like he's going to tour South

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Speaker 3: Africa because of a calf, so he's another big physical

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Speaker 3: presence that you will not have. But let's just talk

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Speaker 3: about the development of the All blackslocks because that's been

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Speaker 3: a real success against the Pomas despite you know, square

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Speaker 3: in the ledger Sam Dowry, I think he's hugely exceeded expectations,

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Speaker 3: still probably in the early stages of his development, young

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Speaker 3: guy still growing into his frame, and Tupuvai has run

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Speaker 3: the line out exceptionally well for the All Blacks. That's

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Speaker 3: a huge responsibility for a young man. So I think

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Speaker 3: some big ticks and probably the well not probably definitely

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Speaker 3: the most area of concern from a depth perspective.

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Speaker 2: It certainly was heading into the season. The All Blacks

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Speaker 2: are worried and they've been publicly worried about their their

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Speaker 2: locking depth and then to go all right, we're going

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Speaker 2: to start two Rugby Championship Tests with tuperv and Sam Dowry.

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Speaker 2: At the start of the year he would have gone jeepers,

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Speaker 2: but both of them have stepped up incredibly well. Supervise

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Speaker 2: has been around the All Blacks of four years now

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Speaker 2: but hasn't had many starting opportunities, but he was called

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Speaker 2: upon to call the lineouts in the last couple of tests,

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Speaker 2: did that very very well. Sam Derry slotting in for

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Speaker 2: two test starts wasn't in the squad at the start

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Speaker 2: of the year, so I think they can be very

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Speaker 2: very pleased with what they've managed to get out on

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Speaker 2: the park. And now there's an interesting conversation. Probably not

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Speaker 2: so much with Patrick two but lot too out injured.

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Speaker 2: But I think with that tests in South Africa, you'd

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Speaker 2: expect him to start in the second row with Scott Barrett.

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Speaker 2: Maybe Sam Dowry comes off the bench later on. We're

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Speaker 2: still seeing Josh Lord come back into it. I think

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Speaker 2: he needs more game time, but all of a sudden.

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Speaker 2: It's not the problem solved necessarily, but there's a lot

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Speaker 2: more depth beginning to develop at Lock than there was,

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Speaker 2: you know, two months ago for the All Blacks, and

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Speaker 2: that is really promising. I did also want to touch

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Speaker 2: on the second half last night for this All Blacks performance,

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Speaker 2: because thirty five three up at halftime when this often happens.

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Speaker 2: I mean, they've made five changes at once and that's

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Speaker 2: always going to disrupt rhythm. But I think they'll probably

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Speaker 2: be and they've said as much. They're a little bit

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Speaker 2: disappointed with the way things tracked in the second spell.

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Speaker 2: They were a little bit clunky. There's a lot more

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Speaker 2: handling errors in the second spell, disruptions with scrums. They're discipline.

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Speaker 2: When a little bit of stray, we sort of stuff

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Speaker 2: like a Moor yellow card. So I mean it's packing

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Speaker 2: nets to an extent. But thirty five to three up

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Speaker 2: at halftime, you know, Scott Roberts, I think they used

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Speaker 2: the line we wanted to bury them in the garden.

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Speaker 2: They didn't quite get there. The game was definitely over,

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Speaker 2: but they probably would have liked to score a few

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Speaker 2: more tries in the second spell and really put their

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Speaker 2: foot on the throat.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm thinking of an analogy here about not quite

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Speaker 3: finishing the landscaping or the DIY left undone for another week.

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Speaker 3: It did lack a ruthlessness and ability to really put

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Speaker 3: the foot on the throat, and that probably is down to,

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Speaker 3: like what you say that the game's gone thirty five

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Speaker 3: to three at halftime, you introduce five players from the

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Speaker 3: bench at the fifty minute mark, couple more a couple

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Speaker 3: of minutes later, you lose a bit of cohesion and accuracy.

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Speaker 3: So I'd probably load to be too harsh about it

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Speaker 3: at that point. If the game was contestable, I think

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Speaker 3: they would have played very differently, probably a bit more

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Speaker 3: expansively as it transpired. But yeah, that's certainly a work

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Speaker 3: on But I think you want to at that point

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Speaker 3: use your full squad. They put Recoaled to left wing.

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Speaker 3: Bowden went to ten, so those elements are important. What

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Speaker 3: about will Jordan amazing return to Test rugby. He is

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Speaker 3: now a phenomenal triyscreen record. I think it's thirty four

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Speaker 3: trials from thirty four tests. He's hunting down Joe Doug

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Speaker 3: Howlett very quickly. Are the All Blacks is Scott Robinson

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Speaker 3: essentially going to have to do it about face and

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Speaker 3: leave him on the wing.

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Speaker 2: I think for the time being yes, because he is

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Speaker 2: so good there and he sean that he isn't just

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Speaker 2: a finisher on the right wing. He is able to

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Speaker 2: get involved in the game. There were couple of occasions

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Speaker 2: where he popped up in the middle of the park

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Speaker 2: when we're on a roaming sort of role. I think

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Speaker 2: for the time being, until maybe the end of the

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Speaker 2: year to it, I think they're going to stick with

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Speaker 2: ten fifteen with Mimith, Mackenzie and Barrett. That means that

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Speaker 2: Will Jordan will stand in the right wing. Maybe against

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Speaker 2: Astralia gets a test at fullback, they look to change

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Speaker 2: things around for them, but I think for the time

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Speaker 2: being he'll have to bite his time on the right

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Speaker 2: wing and this is just a horses for courses thing.

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Speaker 2: I think he'll be loath to distrupt too much heading

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Speaker 2: to South Africa. So I think Will Jordan has to

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Speaker 2: wear the fourteen for the time being.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so too, and Boden Barrett's knowledge vision

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Speaker 3: kicking ability in particular from the backfield has proved hugely valuable.

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Speaker 3: So I don't send the All Blacks changing that left

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Speaker 3: wings probably up for debate. Caleb Clark difficult match to

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Speaker 3: get into, took his chances where he did, but Mark

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Speaker 3: t Lea has been in good form, so interesting to

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Speaker 3: see where they go there. The only other real talking

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Speaker 3: point injury concerned for the All Blacks is Ethan de group.

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Speaker 3: He was absent with a neck injury. It sounded like

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Speaker 3: it was going to be at least a couple of weeks,

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Speaker 3: so maybe he doesn't make the trip to South Africa.

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Speaker 3: What did you make of to Mighty Williams debut and

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Speaker 3: how much of a step up would it be if

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Speaker 3: he's asked to start at Alice Park.

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Speaker 2: I think it'll be a bit step up for Tomighty Williams.

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Speaker 2: But I thought he handled the Test match against Argentina

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Speaker 2: very well. Penalosed early at scrum time, then whatever the

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Speaker 2: issue was there reset and had no further issues for

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Speaker 2: the rest of the night. I think he is developing really,

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Speaker 2: really nicely. Obviously Ethan Degreet you'd like to have him there,

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Speaker 2: But I think in terms of a starter, that made

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Speaker 2: it quite clear that Ethan de Groot's a starter, and

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Speaker 2: in terms of the replacements, they've got that about right

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Speaker 2: as well. But if you're got your starting player out

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Speaker 2: and Ethan de Groot to Mighty comes out of it

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Speaker 2: out straight out of twenty three and as your starter,

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Speaker 2: So I think you lose a little bit. But it's

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Speaker 2: not Panic Stations. On the basis of what we saw

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Speaker 2: to Mighty, Williams do Eden Park fifty up for the

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Speaker 2: All Blacks. They are very, very impressive. You know, whatever

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Speaker 2: they is going wrong on the All Blacks, just the

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Speaker 2: trip to Eden Park bumps that right out, buffs that

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Speaker 2: right out.

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Speaker 3: It's good, good, it's right. It could probably solve house

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Speaker 3: prices and inflation. And yeah, just maybe throw the doors open,

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Speaker 3: let let everyone set up camp at Eden Park. I

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Speaker 3: mean it is a concrete jungle and I actually have

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Speaker 3: a lot of love for it, But the All Blacks

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Speaker 3: as a spiritual home, isn't it. It's a phenomenal record

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Speaker 3: and it stood the test of time. Scott Robertson, you know,

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Speaker 3: he's a big themeing guy, and he talked about I

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Speaker 3: think this would have been his message to the team

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Speaker 3: during the week that you know, those who have walked

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Speaker 3: before set that legacy for them and they were pretty

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Speaker 3: determined to uphold that. So that elements along with you

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Speaker 3: know Artie Severe standing up in front of the team

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Speaker 3: at the start of the week and laying it on

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Speaker 3: the forward pack to deliver physical intense. All those elements

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Speaker 3: were born out in that performance.

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Speaker 2: Look forward to them beginning a new era at some

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Speaker 2: point at the Key Park Stadium. You can it happened.

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Speaker 3: I hope so I really do. I mean, chrush It

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Speaker 3: has got a new stadium, so it's high time Aukland

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Speaker 3: got one too.

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Speaker 2: Let's take a break here on Rugby Direct and come

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Speaker 2: back with the second half of the podcast after this.

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Speaker 4: This is Rugby Direct, a podcast for real rugby fans.

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Speaker 4: Howard the News Talk.

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Speaker 2: You're back with Rugby Direct. Time now for our final

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Speaker 2: four to four rugby topics that Liam and myself debate.

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Speaker 2: Want to get your highlights of the second round of

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Speaker 2: the NPC, bearing in mind we are recording this midafternoon

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Speaker 2: on a Sunday afternoon. But my highlights certainly isn't the

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Speaker 2: performance of Canterbury losing to Tasman.

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Speaker 3: Well, it's mine, obviously highlight.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, tough to say, Okay, I think that the exciting

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Speaker 2: thing has been just the even nature of the comp

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Speaker 2: Now obviously not everyone's had wins to this point in

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Speaker 2: time of the competition. But I really liked the fact

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Speaker 2: that it, buy and large is even and both teams

401
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Speaker 2: seem to be in games. It doesn't seem to be

402
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Speaker 2: too many teams that are being blown off the park,

403
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Speaker 2: which I think has been a problem in recent season,

404
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Speaker 2: now only in round two, and that may happen over

405
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Speaker 2: time with fatigue sitting in. But I think by and large,

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Speaker 2: I mean Auckland, who would have picked that they would

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Speaker 2: be zero and two to start the season, have had

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Speaker 2: a bit of a toll at team with Harry Plummer

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Speaker 2: the All Blacks and having to whisk away Christian ledier

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Speaker 2: Fino from Waikato camp into Auckland. But I think that's

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Speaker 2: the truth and nature of it. Auckland from two to

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Speaker 2: start the season. Not many would have predicted that with

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Speaker 2: their squad.

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Speaker 3: No, I think you're right that it is a reasonably

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Speaker 3: level playing field. Otago. They're upset there been really impressed

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Speaker 3: impressed by bay plenty. I think they've been big movers.

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Speaker 3: Wallis Hollahaller returning from Wales coming back. I think if

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Speaker 3: I was a super rugby team, the Highlanders or the like,

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Speaker 3: I'd be snapping him up, he's thirty four years old,

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Speaker 3: but proving you've still got the goods deserving of a

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Speaker 3: one year contract or maybe even one of the Aussie

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Speaker 3: teams snaps him up. So impressed by him and nice

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Speaker 3: to have a game on a Wednesday night viewing Magpies

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Speaker 3: keep the shield so you know that might be in

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00:22:00,813 --> 00:22:06,093
Speaker 3: need of refurbishment again sometime soon. But yeah, it's great

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Speaker 3: to have the NPC back and it does seem reasonably

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Speaker 3: open this year, doesn't it.

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Speaker 2: It certainly does right Topic number two, let's cross the Tasman.

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Speaker 2: Where are the Wallabies out after five tested this season?

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Speaker 2: Two against South Africa which were always going to be

431
00:22:20,213 --> 00:22:23,693
Speaker 2: really really tough for them, But look they're got the

432
00:22:24,093 --> 00:22:29,893
Speaker 2: under under new management sign up, they're under refurbishment, but

433
00:22:30,013 --> 00:22:31,853
Speaker 2: there is a lot of work to do and this

434
00:22:32,253 --> 00:22:35,133
Speaker 2: head and run project, if it is that from Joe

435
00:22:35,173 --> 00:22:38,813
Speaker 2: Schmidt targeting the Lions in twenty twenty five, they're going

436
00:22:38,853 --> 00:22:41,573
Speaker 2: to have to make up some real ground over the

437
00:22:41,613 --> 00:22:44,293
Speaker 2: next ten months or they'reabouts to get them in that

438
00:22:44,373 --> 00:22:47,893
Speaker 2: right position because they've swept off the park last week

439
00:22:47,933 --> 00:22:50,733
Speaker 2: in Brisbane. It was closer in Perth, but that was

440
00:22:50,773 --> 00:22:53,733
Speaker 2: wet conditions and The thing with Australia for me is

441
00:22:53,733 --> 00:22:58,333
Speaker 2: that they seem very very limited on attack. And again

442
00:22:58,453 --> 00:22:59,693
Speaker 2: you go back to what was talking about the all

443
00:22:59,733 --> 00:23:01,813
Speaker 2: Blacks with the full pack and being dominated there by

444
00:23:01,853 --> 00:23:04,453
Speaker 2: South Africa. You don't see a lot from Australia, even

445
00:23:04,453 --> 00:23:06,453
Speaker 2: when they do have born hand. It seems a lot

446
00:23:06,493 --> 00:23:11,453
Speaker 2: of crossfield kicking, aimless stuff from Strautiger. Joe Schmidt's got

447
00:23:11,453 --> 00:23:13,533
Speaker 2: a big job on his hands, he does.

448
00:23:13,573 --> 00:23:16,573
Speaker 3: Indeed, it does feel like reality must be starting to

449
00:23:16,653 --> 00:23:20,133
Speaker 3: dawn on Schmidt and Mike Cronn and others in that

450
00:23:20,733 --> 00:23:25,333
Speaker 3: coaching environment because from a cattle perspective, you know, we've

451
00:23:25,533 --> 00:23:32,213
Speaker 3: talked about this Australian rugby really you know, lacks not superstars,

452
00:23:32,293 --> 00:23:36,893
Speaker 3: but just some real key positions. They've got debate about

453
00:23:36,933 --> 00:23:40,813
Speaker 3: their best number. Ten. No Loto Ceo is still a

454
00:23:40,893 --> 00:23:43,853
Speaker 3: project despite the fact he's been around for a few years.

455
00:23:43,893 --> 00:23:46,013
Speaker 3: He has been cast on the scrap peep and brought back.

456
00:23:46,773 --> 00:23:51,013
Speaker 3: They're still trying to integrate reintegrate their overseas players. Look,

457
00:23:51,053 --> 00:23:53,733
Speaker 3: they were in that contest with the box until about

458
00:23:54,333 --> 00:23:56,773
Speaker 3: ten minutes fifteen minutes to go and then just got

459
00:23:56,853 --> 00:24:01,013
Speaker 3: rolled over the top of the box. More and the

460
00:24:01,053 --> 00:24:04,133
Speaker 3: context to that match that they lost convincingly in the end,

461
00:24:04,173 --> 00:24:05,973
Speaker 3: and that was a spring Box side that made ten

462
00:24:06,093 --> 00:24:08,213
Speaker 3: changes to their squad very much. You know, it was

463
00:24:08,493 --> 00:24:10,453
Speaker 3: to be a Springbox B team and they still did

464
00:24:10,453 --> 00:24:13,853
Speaker 3: it comfortably. So it really does show just where the

465
00:24:13,853 --> 00:24:16,893
Speaker 3: Wallabies are at and how far they have to go.

466
00:24:17,533 --> 00:24:19,493
Speaker 2: Let's flip that and go where it's at Africa after

467
00:24:19,573 --> 00:24:21,453
Speaker 2: five tiers, obviously with a night of the All Blacks

468
00:24:21,453 --> 00:24:24,493
Speaker 2: coming up for them, but I think Russy will be

469
00:24:24,493 --> 00:24:28,213
Speaker 2: pretty happy split that series against Ireland comfortably. Big Portugal

470
00:24:28,333 --> 00:24:31,213
Speaker 2: now two wins away in Australia, which hasn't always been

471
00:24:31,213 --> 00:24:34,613
Speaker 2: a happy hunting ground for them. I think Russy and

472
00:24:34,653 --> 00:24:37,813
Speaker 2: you mentioned those changes, the ability to change out ten

473
00:24:37,853 --> 00:24:40,773
Speaker 2: players in your team and still get the victory. Go

474
00:24:40,853 --> 00:24:43,373
Speaker 2: to from two in the Rugby Championship. They're looking really,

475
00:24:43,413 --> 00:24:43,893
Speaker 2: really good.

476
00:24:44,733 --> 00:24:47,853
Speaker 3: It's daunting prospect to play the spring Box anywhere at

477
00:24:47,853 --> 00:24:51,533
Speaker 3: this stage, let alone at home in the Republic at altitude.

478
00:24:52,333 --> 00:24:55,413
Speaker 3: You know, it's one of the greatest places to tour

479
00:24:55,933 --> 00:24:59,093
Speaker 3: in rugby. But the Box are a better team now

480
00:24:59,413 --> 00:25:02,453
Speaker 3: with Tony Brown in their mix. They have evolved, They

481
00:25:02,493 --> 00:25:05,653
Speaker 3: have more to their game. Our conditions in Perth was

482
00:25:05,733 --> 00:25:09,333
Speaker 3: torrential rain that the pitch cut up rough and the

483
00:25:09,373 --> 00:25:12,533
Speaker 3: Box sort of went back to their DNA their strengths

484
00:25:12,533 --> 00:25:17,253
Speaker 3: with the mall But having made those changes and built

485
00:25:17,613 --> 00:25:22,173
Speaker 3: such phenomenal depth over the past four years, there's so

486
00:25:22,253 --> 00:25:25,533
Speaker 3: many avenues that they can turn to. They genuinely have

487
00:25:25,893 --> 00:25:29,253
Speaker 3: two to three players in most positions, which is a

488
00:25:29,293 --> 00:25:34,893
Speaker 3: testament to what Russy's done and I think the leeway

489
00:25:34,933 --> 00:25:37,333
Speaker 3: he's had to develop that team as well. You know,

490
00:25:37,373 --> 00:25:40,493
Speaker 3: they haven't actually had a great record in between World Cups,

491
00:25:40,893 --> 00:25:44,213
Speaker 3: and that's at times because they do field second string teams.

492
00:25:44,253 --> 00:25:47,413
Speaker 3: You think about the World Cup last year and the

493
00:25:47,453 --> 00:25:49,853
Speaker 3: team that they sent out to Mount Smart Stadium to

494
00:25:49,853 --> 00:25:51,933
Speaker 3: play the All Blacks left a number of their frontline

495
00:25:51,933 --> 00:25:55,773
Speaker 3: players at home. But look, the Box are in great shape,

496
00:25:55,853 --> 00:25:59,173
Speaker 3: aren't they, and making those changes rotating from Test one

497
00:25:59,173 --> 00:26:02,853
Speaker 3: to two for the Wallabies, clearly they have an eye one,

498
00:26:02,893 --> 00:26:05,613
Speaker 3: if not two, on hosting the All Blacks. That will

499
00:26:05,653 --> 00:26:08,373
Speaker 3: be a real pinnacle series for them, and there's so

500
00:26:08,453 --> 00:26:10,053
Speaker 3: much that goes into it. Isn't it the World Cup

501
00:26:10,093 --> 00:26:12,973
Speaker 3: final rematch from last year? So many of the All

502
00:26:12,973 --> 00:26:15,133
Speaker 3: Blacks will have that in the back of their minds,

503
00:26:15,173 --> 00:26:19,773
Speaker 3: the spring Box status as world champions, Tony Brown and

504
00:26:19,773 --> 00:26:24,493
Speaker 3: that coaching mix Scott Robertson played against Russy, So you know,

505
00:26:24,533 --> 00:26:27,453
Speaker 3: where do you start. It's going to be a fascinating series.

506
00:26:27,213 --> 00:26:29,333
Speaker 2: If only the cut Aways Cup was on the line

507
00:26:30,133 --> 00:26:36,573
Speaker 2: and topic number four story coming out Damie McKenzie missing

508
00:26:36,613 --> 00:26:39,813
Speaker 2: the bus while the All Blacks were on tour in

509
00:26:40,053 --> 00:26:43,133
Speaker 2: San Diego after that match against Fiji, didn't get the

510
00:26:43,453 --> 00:26:49,253
Speaker 2: trip with the team down to the flight getting back

511
00:26:49,293 --> 00:26:55,373
Speaker 2: home and wasn't punished by the All Blacks internally. I

512
00:26:55,373 --> 00:26:57,293
Speaker 2: guess your action to the story.

513
00:26:58,173 --> 00:27:00,893
Speaker 3: It's interesting, isn't it. And this is the first off

514
00:27:00,933 --> 00:27:06,093
Speaker 3: field indiscretion for Scott Robinson to tackle, so it is

515
00:27:06,173 --> 00:27:09,973
Speaker 3: very interesting to see how they've handled it. We I

516
00:27:10,013 --> 00:27:13,413
Speaker 3: don't know all the details surrounding it, but the context

517
00:27:13,733 --> 00:27:15,813
Speaker 3: is it's the end of July, so the All Blacks

518
00:27:15,813 --> 00:27:18,893
Speaker 3: have finished their their series and they've got a bit

519
00:27:18,933 --> 00:27:21,413
Speaker 3: of rope. I think to go out and enjoy themselves.

520
00:27:21,853 --> 00:27:23,693
Speaker 3: And I don't have any issues with that by all

521
00:27:23,733 --> 00:27:27,053
Speaker 3: means blufsome steam because it doesn't happen very often. But

522
00:27:27,493 --> 00:27:30,573
Speaker 3: I think from what I do know, McKenzie has missed

523
00:27:30,573 --> 00:27:34,653
Speaker 3: the transports and you had to get a two hour over,

524
00:27:34,933 --> 00:27:38,333
Speaker 3: you know, at his own expense. And Scott Robinson sort

525
00:27:38,333 --> 00:27:40,373
Speaker 3: of tried to brush it off postmatch and said there

526
00:27:40,413 --> 00:27:42,773
Speaker 3: was no curfew and that might not That may be

527
00:27:42,893 --> 00:27:46,933
Speaker 3: the case, but I think we've seen in previous regimes

528
00:27:47,413 --> 00:27:51,253
Speaker 3: the All Blacks cracked down hard on standards, and I

529
00:27:51,253 --> 00:27:53,533
Speaker 3: think this was a missed opportunity from Scott Robertson to

530
00:27:55,013 --> 00:27:58,613
Speaker 3: set those standards to say this is unacceptable, this is

531
00:27:58,653 --> 00:28:02,493
Speaker 3: what we expect from you. And I don't know whether

532
00:28:02,973 --> 00:28:06,213
Speaker 3: an injury to Stephen Petefetter may be played into it,

533
00:28:06,253 --> 00:28:10,813
Speaker 3: maybe some lack of depth around ten, but from what

534
00:28:10,853 --> 00:28:14,453
Speaker 3: I do know, I think McKenzie was fortunate to have

535
00:28:14,853 --> 00:28:15,533
Speaker 3: no punishment.

536
00:28:15,693 --> 00:28:19,213
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think this, Yeah, it was an opportunity, perhaps

537
00:28:19,293 --> 00:28:20,773
Speaker 2: just to lay a marker in the sand. Now we

538
00:28:20,813 --> 00:28:22,293
Speaker 2: don't know if that that may have actually been done

539
00:28:22,413 --> 00:28:25,933
Speaker 2: internally and it hasn't sort of transpired out externally, but

540
00:28:25,973 --> 00:28:27,773
Speaker 2: he didn't miss a game for it. We don't know

541
00:28:27,773 --> 00:28:30,973
Speaker 2: what else has gone on internally, but yeah, interesting story.

542
00:28:31,013 --> 00:28:33,373
Speaker 2: And Dave McKenzie han't missed any test matches. You think

543
00:28:33,373 --> 00:28:35,733
Speaker 2: that to Mark d'alaia last year the World Cup. There's

544
00:28:35,733 --> 00:28:37,773
Speaker 2: been other instances as well when players have sort of

545
00:28:37,773 --> 00:28:40,693
Speaker 2: been stood down for a game for missing curfew or

546
00:28:41,253 --> 00:28:43,813
Speaker 2: breaking team protocol. That didn't happen on this occasion.

547
00:28:44,173 --> 00:28:47,173
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think the key takeaway is the All Blacks

548
00:28:47,333 --> 00:28:52,053
Speaker 3: have eight more tests I think away from home this year.

549
00:28:53,653 --> 00:28:56,613
Speaker 3: What happens if this happens again. You know, there's a

550
00:28:56,613 --> 00:29:00,413
Speaker 3: bit of a precedent been set here, so you leave

551
00:29:00,453 --> 00:29:04,413
Speaker 3: the door a jar for these things to happen. So, yeah,

552
00:29:04,453 --> 00:29:08,773
Speaker 3: an interesting story. Scott Robinson's chose to handle it in

553
00:29:08,813 --> 00:29:13,373
Speaker 3: one way. That's his riots, his team. But you, standards

554
00:29:13,373 --> 00:29:17,053
Speaker 3: are important, and I guess what's happened previously with Mark

555
00:29:17,093 --> 00:29:19,733
Speaker 3: tala Maybe some players might have been miffed about a

556
00:29:19,773 --> 00:29:24,373
Speaker 3: potential lack of accountability or double standards. But it is

557
00:29:24,413 --> 00:29:27,893
Speaker 3: a new regime and Razor can run his team how

558
00:29:27,973 --> 00:29:28,373
Speaker 3: he wants.

559
00:29:28,533 --> 00:29:31,173
Speaker 2: Yep, there's certainly a lot of standards here on Rugby

560
00:29:31,613 --> 00:29:36,573
Speaker 2: Direct and where we keep it to a tight show. Yeah,

561
00:29:36,613 --> 00:29:39,133
Speaker 2: sometimes sometimes now, Liam, you wanted to lay something on

562
00:29:39,173 --> 00:29:39,973
Speaker 2: the line.

563
00:29:40,653 --> 00:29:44,653
Speaker 3: Finish look, I think September one. You know, we're big

564
00:29:44,693 --> 00:29:49,373
Speaker 3: fans of provincial rugby here at Rugby Direct Canterbury v Wellington.

565
00:29:49,493 --> 00:29:52,013
Speaker 3: Sorry September one, you'll be in South Africa so he

566
00:29:52,173 --> 00:29:54,533
Speaker 3: probably won't even see the game. But Cannabry v Wellington,

567
00:29:54,613 --> 00:29:56,093
Speaker 3: I think it's only fair. You know, we have a

568
00:29:56,093 --> 00:29:59,413
Speaker 3: bit of a wager here. Sure, So look, I've got

569
00:29:59,453 --> 00:30:03,853
Speaker 3: two proposals for one is the loser, where's the opposing

570
00:30:04,333 --> 00:30:08,093
Speaker 3: jersey in the office for a day. The second is

571
00:30:08,133 --> 00:30:10,773
Speaker 3: that you have to call and we have to record

572
00:30:10,813 --> 00:30:14,093
Speaker 3: this somebody close to you, you know it might be

573
00:30:14,133 --> 00:30:16,253
Speaker 3: a friend or a family member, and tell them that

574
00:30:16,293 --> 00:30:19,893
Speaker 3: you're switching allegiance so you can choose you your punishment.

575
00:30:19,893 --> 00:30:21,893
Speaker 3: Because Wellington again on one say it's going to be.

576
00:30:23,933 --> 00:30:25,893
Speaker 2: Take the jersey option, I think I think that might

577
00:30:25,893 --> 00:30:26,933
Speaker 2: be the same for all candidates.

578
00:30:27,173 --> 00:30:28,493
Speaker 3: I'll make sure you get a picture of that for

579
00:30:28,533 --> 00:30:30,173
Speaker 3: our listeners out there.

580
00:30:30,253 --> 00:30:34,293
Speaker 2: Come on, you can tab lost the Tasmin with pathetically instant.

581
00:30:34,413 --> 00:30:40,333
Speaker 2: It's all right. Then, I'll do us for Rugby Directs

582
00:30:40,413 --> 00:30:43,173
Speaker 2: powered by Excess Solutions, elevating you and your business to

583
00:30:43,213 --> 00:30:45,413
Speaker 2: a higher level of Thanks to Dan Goodwin standing in

584
00:30:45,453 --> 00:30:47,893
Speaker 2: for our production this week. We'll see you next week

585
00:30:47,893 --> 00:30:48,693
Speaker 2: on Rugby Direct.

586
00:30:57,693 --> 00:31:00,653
Speaker 1: For more from News Talks b Listen live on air

587
00:31:00,853 --> 00:31:03,533
Speaker 1: or online, and keep our shows with you wherever you

588
00:31:03,613 --> 00:31:06,013
Speaker 1: go with our podcast on iHeartRadio