1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,880 Speaker 1: There is significant pressure on Nikola Willis following yesterday's GDP bombshell. 2 00:00:04,000 --> 00:00:06,600 Speaker 1: Former Finance Minister Sir Roger Douglas has called for her 3 00:00:06,640 --> 00:00:09,680 Speaker 1: resignation after the economy contracted zero point nine percent in 4 00:00:09,720 --> 00:00:12,680 Speaker 1: the second quarter of the year, and now another finance minister, 5 00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:15,680 Speaker 1: Ruth Richardson. Former Finance Minister Ruth Richardson says that the 6 00:00:15,720 --> 00:00:18,720 Speaker 1: government needs a drastic change in direction and Ruth is 7 00:00:18,720 --> 00:00:21,760 Speaker 1: with us high Ruth far a goodedening before we get 8 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:23,439 Speaker 1: to what you want in terms of the direction of 9 00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:26,200 Speaker 1: the government. Do you think Nikola Willis should resign? 10 00:00:27,680 --> 00:00:30,760 Speaker 2: No, Look, I don't think playing the resignation game is 11 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:33,360 Speaker 2: going to get us anywhere. What we need to concentrate 12 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:36,960 Speaker 2: on is the quality of the policy, setting what's working 13 00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:41,760 Speaker 2: and what's not, and advocating the kinds of policies that 14 00:00:41,840 --> 00:00:47,200 Speaker 2: can snap us out of this dreadful position that we're 15 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:50,440 Speaker 2: in a flatlining economy and a rising unemployment. 16 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:51,880 Speaker 1: Okay, so what do you want to see? 17 00:00:53,320 --> 00:00:56,280 Speaker 2: Well, what I want to see is bold and decisive action. 18 00:00:56,800 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 2: It's clear that big government's got its throat on the economy. 19 00:01:00,640 --> 00:01:04,000 Speaker 2: It's stifling the hell out of the productive sector. The 20 00:01:04,040 --> 00:01:07,080 Speaker 2: government needs to put its house in order, stop racking 21 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:11,920 Speaker 2: up debt, getting serious about controlling its spending, and more importantly, 22 00:01:11,959 --> 00:01:16,399 Speaker 2: getting serious about delivering on the kind of important commitments 23 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:19,040 Speaker 2: that were made to New Zealand. You know, we're living 24 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:21,600 Speaker 2: in an era where the government mantra is let's go 25 00:01:21,680 --> 00:01:25,400 Speaker 2: for growth. Well, it's clear that the current formula is 26 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:28,920 Speaker 2: not working. On what I'm advocating are policies that would 27 00:01:28,920 --> 00:01:32,080 Speaker 2: give us a serious shot at going for growth. I 28 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:36,600 Speaker 2: know it because I've had to do it before. Like what, Well, 29 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 2: we've got public spending is completely out of control. Even 30 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:42,800 Speaker 2: if we were to wind back the level of public 31 00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 2: spending to that that occurred pro the COVID era, we'd 32 00:01:47,080 --> 00:01:49,720 Speaker 2: be in better shape. If we wind back public debt 33 00:01:49,760 --> 00:01:53,040 Speaker 2: to below thirty percent of GDP as opposed to heading 34 00:01:53,040 --> 00:01:56,240 Speaker 2: for fifty percent of GDP, we'd have more money to 35 00:01:56,280 --> 00:01:59,600 Speaker 2: spend on things that matter to us rather than debt servicing. 36 00:02:00,480 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 2: We're in a terrible spiral and we've got to snap 37 00:02:03,520 --> 00:02:05,880 Speaker 2: out of it, and that we're not going to snap 38 00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:08,120 Speaker 2: out of it by making heroic assumptions that we're going 39 00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:11,440 Speaker 2: to grow our way out of it. That's clearly not working. 40 00:02:11,840 --> 00:02:15,640 Speaker 2: We need to take bold policy strokes in order to 41 00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:19,200 Speaker 2: basically unleash the potential that the New Zealand economy has. 42 00:02:19,280 --> 00:02:20,359 Speaker 1: Okay, so what would you cut? 43 00:02:22,040 --> 00:02:25,840 Speaker 2: Well, for a start, it's clear that superinnuation setting is 44 00:02:25,880 --> 00:02:30,919 Speaker 2: completely unsustainable and the government should quick smart announce that 45 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:35,480 Speaker 2: we are going to in relatively short order, Ei did 46 00:02:35,480 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 2: it every six months, wrote the age of eligibility rose 47 00:02:40,200 --> 00:02:43,919 Speaker 2: from sixty to sixty five. We ought to start down 48 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:49,440 Speaker 2: that path. We ought to control the level of public servants. 49 00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:52,280 Speaker 2: I mean, we've got a very bloated public he back, 50 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:57,440 Speaker 2: what is this? I mean, you would get the government 51 00:02:57,480 --> 00:03:00,919 Speaker 2: into a position where it's living within its means. We're overspending. 52 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:06,040 Speaker 2: We're overspending and therefore we need to take the kind 53 00:03:06,080 --> 00:03:10,040 Speaker 2: of decisions around what is the level of public expenditure 54 00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:13,360 Speaker 2: that's consistent with the growth that we want and the 55 00:03:13,360 --> 00:03:15,960 Speaker 2: public services that we want to fund. Would you fund that? 56 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 1: Would you cut the public servants back to twenty seventeen 57 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:20,639 Speaker 1: when I do In took over. So that's a cut 58 00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:22,840 Speaker 1: of what maybe fourteen thousand or something like that. Would 59 00:03:22,840 --> 00:03:23,000 Speaker 1: you do? 60 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:26,799 Speaker 2: Well, that's a pretty good place to start. I mean, 61 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:29,520 Speaker 2: and as we've shown, you look at the Ministry Education. 62 00:03:30,440 --> 00:03:33,359 Speaker 2: She has been saying we need value for money. That's 63 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:35,600 Speaker 2: where we need to start. The idea that you're going 64 00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:38,160 Speaker 2: to get better education by throwing more money at it. 65 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:43,040 Speaker 2: It's clearly not the case. You need fundamental reform so 66 00:03:43,040 --> 00:03:45,720 Speaker 2: that we get better value for money for the public 67 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 2: expenditure that is deployed in the important area. So we've 68 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:52,640 Speaker 2: got a quantity problem too much, and we've got a 69 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:54,120 Speaker 2: quality problem too little. 70 00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, Ruth, it's good to talk to you. Thank you 71 00:03:55,480 --> 00:03:57,520 Speaker 1: very much for your time. Ruth Richards and former financement 72 00:03:57,520 --> 00:04:00,400 Speaker 1: is to also chair of the Taxpayers Union. For more 73 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:03,760 Speaker 1: from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to News Talks 74 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:07,000 Speaker 1: a B from four pm weekdays, or follow the podcast 75 00:04:07,080 --> 00:04:08,080 Speaker 1: on iHeartRadio.