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Speaker 1: There's a business of education, more change coming longer. Way

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Speaker 1: to consultation for polytexs is now open. In simple terms,

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Speaker 1: we want to take the struggle well, the struggling texts,

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Speaker 1: group them together, let the successful one stand alone. Penny

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Speaker 1: Simmons is the tertiary minister in chargeable with this, and

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Speaker 1: she's with us very good morning.

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Speaker 2: Yes, good morning mate.

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Speaker 1: This readjig you're looking at is what should have been

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Speaker 1: done in the first place. And given it you're from

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Speaker 1: South London, you were running a moderately successful operation. You

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Speaker 1: would have known that, wouldn't you.

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Speaker 2: Yes, And look this should have happened four years ago

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Speaker 2: and a lot of what we're looking at doing now

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Speaker 2: is advice that the previous minister was given not to

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Speaker 2: go wholesale into a big change, but to address the

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Speaker 2: problem areas and let the other ones get on with

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Speaker 2: running their polytechnics.

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Speaker 1: Now is when you put these in correct me if

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Speaker 1: I'm wrong in saying this year your group of the

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Speaker 1: strugglers together, let the successful ones get on with it.

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Speaker 1: Are there too many people in the sector? In other words,

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Speaker 1: and grouping strugglers together are you asking for trouble?

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Speaker 2: Look, we can't group them together until we get the

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Speaker 2: costs out, So that's the exercise we're going through. Now,

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Speaker 2: there's significant cost that has to come out. There's identified

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Speaker 2: one hundred and thirty million dollars worth of building and

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Speaker 2: land that isn't being used that needs to be sold.

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Speaker 2: There is poor operating practice that needs to be sorted.

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Speaker 2: So we've got to get the costs out first, or

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Speaker 2: else we'll just be pouring water into a sieve.

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Speaker 1: So the costs are the waste and the fat. So

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Speaker 1: you're confident it's not to the bone and therefore it's

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Speaker 1: not worth the exercise.

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Speaker 2: Look, some of it is to the bone, and those

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Speaker 2: very small places the far north, New Plymouth, west coast

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Speaker 2: of the South Island, and that's why we need them

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Speaker 2: definitely in a federation so they can get access to

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Speaker 2: the one hundred and sixty programs that the Open Polytechnic

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Speaker 2: has got online, so they can then offer a blended

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Speaker 2: delivery of on campus and online, so that gives them

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Speaker 2: the support to still be able to run courses. But

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Speaker 2: in some of the bigger urban areas where there are

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Speaker 2: big deficits being we have to get costs out of there.

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Speaker 1: Okay, the criticism, I have some simpathy for despite the

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Speaker 1: fact that what you're doing makes sense. Is this too

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Speaker 1: much change on top of change?

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Speaker 2: Well, we in status quo isn't an option. They're going

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Speaker 2: to run out of money. They are running big deficits

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Speaker 2: and they will run out of money churning through reserves.

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Speaker 2: We haven't got an option to just leave them.

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Speaker 1: How many courses are there, how many politics are there

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Speaker 1: that when you look at it from the outside and

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Speaker 1: you go, you know what, there's too much frippery going

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Speaker 1: on and we're just wasting time and money here.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Look, I think industry involvement is key to this,

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Speaker 2: and community involvement's key to it. So yes, there will

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Speaker 2: be some of that. But remember you use polytechnics as

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Speaker 2: a pathway to employment. It's not education for education sake.

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Speaker 2: It's the year to get people into employment. So that's

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Speaker 2: why we've got to get industry and communities involved with

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Speaker 2: in the game.

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Speaker 1: I watch you in question time. You're feeling the heat.

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Speaker 1: Labor have got you in their sites along with Stello,

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Speaker 1: along with Chure. Are you feeling the heat?

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Speaker 2: Well, look, no I'm not because I know that we've

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Speaker 2: got to do this and we've got to get it right.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, They're going to put me under pressure. That's

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Speaker 2: what I'm there.

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Speaker 1: For, all right, Go well, Penny Simmons, who's the Tertiary

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Speaker 1: and Education of Skills Medicine. For more from the Mic

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Speaker 1: Asking Breakfast, listen live to news talks. It'd be from

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