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Speaker 1: It's the final episode for twenty twenty five off the

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Speaker 1: Business of Tech powered by two Degrees Business, and what

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Speaker 1: a year it's been. From aislop and humanoid robots to

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Speaker 1: smart rings, streaming wars, and ev angst. It's felt like

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Speaker 1: the future finally arrived with all the weirdness that implies.

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Speaker 1: So to help make sense of it all, this week's

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Speaker 1: show turns into a bit of a text doc take

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Speaker 1: for the year that was and a peek into the

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Speaker 1: year to come. Joining the podcast is someone who's been

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Speaker 1: watching these Ways of Innovation break for decades, which doctor

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Speaker 1: co founder, market researcher and consumer tech guru Pat Pilcher.

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Speaker 1: Pat has been tracking everything from the AI megashift in

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Speaker 1: Apple's foldable dilemma, to the boom and Chinese evs, the

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Speaker 1: great streaming backlash, and why home robots and smart homes

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Speaker 1: finally started becoming useful in twenty twenty five. So we'll

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Speaker 1: cover all of that, and we'll also look ahead to

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Speaker 1: the categories about to explode potentially into six from smart

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Speaker 1: contact lenses and humanoid housekeeper robots to solid state batteries

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Speaker 1: that could rewrite the rule for evs, wearables, and laptops

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Speaker 1: Pat's been reviewing tech gear for around thirty years. He's

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Speaker 1: one of the country's most experienced consumer tech reviewers and journalists.

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Speaker 1: So I think you'll enjoy this bumper episode of the

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Speaker 1: Business of Tech. We pack a lot in so pour

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Speaker 1: something festive your notifications and settle in for a fast

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Speaker 1: tour through the year in tech with Pat Pilcher here

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Speaker 1: on the Business of Tech. So, Pat, welcome to the

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Speaker 1: Business of Tech. How are you doing?

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Speaker 2: Flash and pretty? It's all good. It's been a really

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Speaker 2: crazy time actually, there's so many, so many launchers, and

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Speaker 2: Black Friday of course has been utterly insane. It has

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Speaker 2: so yeah, yeah, a whole moment.

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Speaker 1: And look, we've known each other for probably twenty five years.

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Speaker 1: You're the biggest tech head I know. Obviously the co

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Speaker 1: found under an editor of Witch Doctor, which is probably

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Speaker 1: actually the only outlet consistently covering consumer tech in New

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Speaker 1: Zealand today.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there aren't many of us about and the numbers

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Speaker 2: are shrinking, but yeah, Witch Doctors hanging in there. So yeah.

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Speaker 1: Music lifestyle, Gary Steele obviously one of the most experienced

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Speaker 1: music journalists in the country, a massive gear head on

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Speaker 1: home high five stuff. Oh yeah, yeah, So he's part

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Speaker 1: of that as well, So go to witchdoctor dot co

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Speaker 1: dot nz to check out all of that. But you've

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Speaker 1: married that over the years. Market research really is your background,

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Speaker 1: right with ABC? Initially?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean I initially started out with IDC.

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Speaker 2: It was the heart of the tech boom. What a

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Speaker 2: time to be doing tech tech market research. It was crazy.

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Speaker 2: But it's sort of been really interesting doing research and

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Speaker 2: tech because there is a bit of a relationship between

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Speaker 2: tech journalism and research, because I mean, if you're journalist,

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Speaker 2: you're doing research of course, and you get to see

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Speaker 2: a lot of crazy treams happening in the market. And

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty five has been a year of some pretty

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Speaker 2: cool trends that are started kicking off.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, how would you sort of summon up? So it's

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Speaker 1: just ai everything at the moment, and AI agents really

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Speaker 1: hit peak in twenty twenty five. But with your yeah,

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Speaker 1: with your sort of marketing research trends had on and

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Speaker 1: your love of tech, what are the things that really

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Speaker 1: stood out for you?

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Speaker 2: I tell you what what stood out was who was

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Speaker 2: absent from the game? I mean you have you know,

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Speaker 2: you have chat GPT, Microsoft co Pilot, Google's Gemini, which

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Speaker 2: is of course the big AI claud treanthropic. Every tech

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Speaker 2: plarer and their pet pedle had an AI offering except Apple,

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Speaker 2: you know, and this is just crazy. This is a

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Speaker 2: company that sets the trends that everyone slavishly follows, and

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Speaker 2: they missed the bus on the biggest AI trend probably

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Speaker 2: of the decade.

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Speaker 1: Or did they? Or have they? I mean, are they

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Speaker 1: been quite clever about about being a late fight in this.

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Speaker 2: I think, look that there is a lot to be

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Speaker 2: said for doing that, because I mean it's such a

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Speaker 2: fast moving feast at the moment. I mean, you know,

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Speaker 2: I'm seeing new iterations of AI models and AIS systems

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Speaker 2: almost every week at the moment, and the capabilities are

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Speaker 2: just evolving and advancing almost on a daily basis. So

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Speaker 2: stepping back from that until they get a mature offering

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Speaker 2: in a way quite sensible. And I mean the iPhone

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Speaker 2: folders are common and if I was Apple, I keep

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Speaker 2: my powder dry and slaps MAYI goodness into the iPhone

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Speaker 2: fold And I think they could set the market on fire.

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Speaker 2: I mean they've got the resources.

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Speaker 1: They do have the resources. They're sitting on a cash

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Speaker 1: pile that's just vast. They have had a you know,

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Speaker 1: obviously Apple Intelligence has been a dud and they've admitted

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Speaker 1: that they've changed out the team. A lot of the

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Speaker 1: products offerings there have been delayed. Serri Supercharged with its

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Speaker 1: generative AI is not that flash.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think the thing is they really you know,

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Speaker 2: corporate group thing prevailed at the start, and I think

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Speaker 2: the Siri team got handed this AI think as it

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Speaker 2: was emerging and they went, ah, we've already got Suri,

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Speaker 2: you know, and of course Syria is script based. There's

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Speaker 2: no AI and Surrey at all in that. You could

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Speaker 2: argue serious is done as a brick really, but so

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Speaker 2: they got off on the back foot and everyone's gone

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Speaker 2: past them. But I think they're now looking at that

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Speaker 2: regrouping and have put some serious work in. So Michael

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Speaker 2: has watched the space.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the iPhone Air, lovely looking device, but has disappointed

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Speaker 1: when it comes to sales. So people are still going, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I just want the latest iPhone.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, this is the thing. I think it's a really

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Speaker 2: skinny phone, you know, it's Apple Gear. It is really

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Speaker 2: tasty to look at, but you know, it does it

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Speaker 2: scratched at it for an iPhone user, And I think

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Speaker 2: the mid range and flagship models are really what people

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Speaker 2: are spending money on. So who knows. But what struck

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Speaker 2: me the last couple of years with the iPhones is

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Speaker 2: they're very samey Samy. There's been a very little real innovation,

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Speaker 2: and I think that twenty twenty six is probably going

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Speaker 2: to be the year of the iPhone fold. You know,

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Speaker 2: Apple really need to jump on the fold bandwagon, and

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Speaker 2: I'm picking you'll probably get the technology of the iPhone

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Speaker 2: Air married with a foldable phone to come up with

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Speaker 2: something comparable to Samsung's Galaxy Fold seven. You know, a

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Speaker 2: really skinny foldable phone that will just be the same

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Speaker 2: form factor as a normal slab style phone, but while

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Speaker 2: unfolded to a mini tablet.

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Speaker 1: I reckon the equivalent of the flip, which is more

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Speaker 1: like the clamshell foldable which Samsung has done up both as.

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Speaker 2: Date, they're really I mean because they basically really pocketable

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Speaker 2: and you know, they have become a normal phone when

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Speaker 2: you flip them open. I mean, I really like them,

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Speaker 2: and that's one of these categories that I think hasn't

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Speaker 2: had the love that it deserves.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, they are expensive. Let's go back to AI assistance

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Speaker 1: because that there's been a lot going on there. We

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Speaker 1: just saw a couple of weeks ago the debut of

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Speaker 1: Gemini three, which is getting rave reviews on the benchmarks.

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Speaker 1: That's doing very well, also performing very well. We've seen

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Speaker 1: some of those leaked memos from Open Ai. Ei're worried

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Speaker 1: about Gemini.

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Speaker 2: I think they've got a lot to worry about it

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Speaker 2: at the moment. I mean, the you know, technology tends

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Speaker 2: to go on what they call the S shaped curve,

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Speaker 2: and you know at the beginning where at the bottom

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Speaker 2: of the yes before it slopes up, you get you know,

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Speaker 2: sort of this this mass sort of promotion and you

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Speaker 2: start heading into mass market adoption. But it's starting to

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Speaker 2: mature really fast, and if you're not at that inflection point,

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Speaker 2: you could find yourself in a bit of trouble. So

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Speaker 2: who knows, but open Ai definitely there. But I think,

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Speaker 2: you know, the AI think you're hearing a lot about

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Speaker 2: what's bad with AI. I mean, you know, there are

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Speaker 2: some huge downsides. I mean, go on to Facebook, go

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Speaker 2: on to x go on to LinkedIn, and they're a

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Speaker 2: wash with AI slop. You know, it's I went on

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Speaker 2: to a well I won't name them because I probably

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Speaker 2: get in trouble with lawyers. But I went onto a

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Speaker 2: very prominent bookstore last night with my reader, trying to

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Speaker 2: find something decent reader, and all I could find a

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Speaker 2: box packed with AI slot, you know, really badly written books.

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Speaker 2: And if you're an academic, I mean friends of mine

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Speaker 2: who are university professors are just pulling your hair out

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Speaker 2: because of course kids are resorting to AI. They're not learning,

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Speaker 2: they're getting AI do the work for them. And I

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Speaker 2: think the really fascinating story was UK's Channel four and

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Speaker 2: a documentary called Will AI Take My Job? And this

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Speaker 2: had this lovely host. She went through the program and explained,

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Speaker 2: you know, in laypersons speak, what AI was and how

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Speaker 2: it was going to affect businesses and things. And then

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Speaker 2: right at the very end, she steps up at the

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Speaker 2: camera she goes, by the way, I'm not real I

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Speaker 2: generated and was gone, yeah, you could almost hear the

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Speaker 2: sound of fourteen million jaws hitting the shad pole collectively.

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Speaker 2: It was, you know, and this is a thing that

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Speaker 2: I think people didn't realize with AI. It's the uncanny

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Speaker 2: value effect is, which is you know where sort of

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Speaker 2: machines are close to human but not close enough, but

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Speaker 2: they're creepy. We're sort of getting past that now and

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Speaker 2: ais can actually pass themselves off as humans in specific settings,

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Speaker 2: and it's a little scary to watch.

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Speaker 1: And I think particularly with saw A three open AI's

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Speaker 1: video AI generator, and when that exploded onto social media

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Speaker 1: and for the first time, I was actually seeing videos

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Speaker 1: of you know, like a line attacking someone, and normally

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Speaker 1: Facebook is full of.

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Speaker 2: These real videos all Smith eating spaghetti. I mean that

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Speaker 2: I had nightmares for weeks after watching Yeah, but that

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Speaker 2: one was clearly like weird. But the realism now to

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Speaker 2: a point and sometimes they have a water mic, but

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Speaker 2: we are I think you're right past that uncanny valley stage.

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Speaker 1: And it's really infuriating when you realize I've just spent

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Speaker 1: ten seconds looking at something and I've only realized by

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Speaker 1: reading the comments that it's fake. That's scary.

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Speaker 2: It's really scary. And I think the problem is the

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Speaker 2: general public need to be a lot more critical, a

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Speaker 2: lot more skeptical, and they're not in.

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Speaker 1: Our platform, so just running this stuff without prompting.

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Speaker 2: Or I mean, I've had access to Google's Gemini Vio

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Speaker 2: video creation model and that thing is astonishing. You know,

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Speaker 2: I'm generating I generated a little cinematic mini movie off

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Speaker 2: my Greyhound basically driving a Lamborghini into the Grand Casino

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Speaker 2: in Monte Carlo, and you know, I describe what he

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Speaker 2: was doing, what the car looked like, where it was,

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Speaker 2: the camera positioning, and then twen minutes later I had

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Speaker 2: this whole collection of clips that I just ended up

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Speaker 2: with Microsoft clip champ into this little mini movie. It

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Speaker 2: was basically had some James Bond music and voila, and

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Speaker 2: it was cinematic and obviously Greyhound Stone drive Lamborghinis. But

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Speaker 2: other than that, if there'd been a human being not

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Speaker 2: a dog, you wouldn't have known. You know, it was

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Speaker 2: literally that good.

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Speaker 1: For all the advances, you still have the taels, the

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Speaker 1: things that give it away, like fingers, it still has

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Speaker 1: a terrible job of.

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Speaker 2: What is it with things and background signs. You know,

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Speaker 2: they have this weird sort of Sanskrit slash tie. It

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Speaker 2: doesn't make sense, you know.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so it can't do it can't inject words, credible

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Speaker 1: words into an image and three can.

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Speaker 2: Now this is the thing they reckon Gemini. Three can

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Speaker 2: And in my early testing year, you know it's I

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Speaker 2: could put stuff up in social media. I mean, luckily

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Speaker 2: there's guardrails built in you can't post manipulate public figures

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Speaker 2: into doing things that would incriminate them or whatever. So

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Speaker 2: for instance, I kind of have the PM shagging a

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Speaker 2: sheep or something really that would cause litigation or whatever.

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Speaker 2: But there is still so much scope, and as we're

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Speaker 2: in an election year, this is going to become a

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Speaker 2: really big issue I think.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. So obviously there's still sort of an experimentation mode

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Speaker 1: with a lot of these AI assistants, but the business

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Speaker 1: model underpinning it. We saw Microsoft slapped majorly in Australia

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Speaker 1: by the Commerce Commissioner over there. They did a big

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Speaker 1: apology here in New Zealand as well about bundling the

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Speaker 1: co pilot assistant into an increased subscription for Microsoft three

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Speaker 1: sixty five. They had their backtracks seriously on that.

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Speaker 2: Well, this brings me to my next key trend I

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Speaker 2: noticed in twenty twenty five, and I don't know if

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Speaker 2: I'm allowed to say this, but inititification.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, and Corey doctor O's theory, and it's happening.

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Speaker 2: It's happening right now. I mean, you know, you subscribe

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Speaker 2: to a service, it sounds fantastic, and it's only five

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Speaker 2: dollars a month. Three months later, it's twenty five dollars

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Speaker 2: a month. Does less, requires more of your information and

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Speaker 2: they can't guarantee your privacy and by the way, your

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Speaker 2: password has been stolen. It's not good and sort of

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Speaker 2: you marry that up with AI. It's a little concerning.

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Speaker 2: So and as I said earlier, we're heading into an

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Speaker 2: election year. I can just see a few problems on

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Speaker 2: the way.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but the business model isn't quite there underpending these

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Speaker 1: AI agents, right, I mean the investment that Microsoft, Open Ai,

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Speaker 1: Google are putting into that is not being returned yet

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Speaker 1: and it won't be for years.

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Speaker 2: But that's the thing. I mean, it's it's got a

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Speaker 2: very long tail. And you know, we're in an environment

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Speaker 2: where geopolitical instabilities and macro economic instabilities are at play,

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Speaker 2: and we have companies investing billions and billions dollars and

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Speaker 2: massive data centers and Video is doing very nice out

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Speaker 2: of it. But you know, you saw the panic last

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Speaker 2: week when Video were announcing your results. You know that

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Speaker 2: speculation of tech bubble was going to burst. And if

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Speaker 2: that happens, I dread to think what New Zealand's economy

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Speaker 2: is going to do. If there is a tech bubble implosion.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and we saw the other news a couple of

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Speaker 1: weeks ago about Google doing a deal potentially with Meta

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Speaker 1: for its sensor processing units. So they've been quietly building

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Speaker 1: up their own chip capability to run their own data centers. Yes,

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Speaker 1: and obviously that's impressing third parties like Meta.

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Speaker 2: Well, this is the thing. I mean, Silicon is, you know,

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Speaker 2: such a hot potato now. I mean you just look

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Speaker 2: at what's happened in China with the you know, the

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Speaker 2: tech ban on Chinese companies from getting ultra high end

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Speaker 2: chip fab capabilities. You know, TCMC obviously got shut out

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Speaker 2: from the Chinese market with certain ship technologies, and China's

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Speaker 2: had to really work hard to get around that to

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Speaker 2: go beyond fourteen nanometers. And you know, chips are the

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Speaker 2: new global currency because you've got to have these data

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Speaker 2: centers to run AI, to stay in the game, to

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Speaker 2: keep sheeholders happy, and it's all very circular, could get wobbly,

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Speaker 2: who knows.

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Speaker 1: And the Chinese seem to be doing really well with

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Speaker 1: their own internal economy. Now for chips, they're not quite

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Speaker 1: as good on benchmarks as in video, but enough to

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Speaker 1: do most of what PROTECTAR consumers want, oh for sure.

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Speaker 2: I mean, this is the thing. I mean. I wrote

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Speaker 2: a while back in a witch Doctor about the Trump's

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Speaker 2: move to ban Wahwei and how Wahwei, if they were smart,

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Speaker 2: would stick to their guns and innovate. And they have been,

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Speaker 2: and they're now producing silicone that does rival Western silicon.

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Speaker 2: They've got their own operating system which is absolutely exploded

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Speaker 2: in the Chinese market and is starting to get really

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Speaker 2: big in Southeast Asia. It's harmony OS and the band

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Speaker 2: hasn't actually weakened China all, it's made them stronger. And

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Speaker 2: if I were, you know, sort of some of these

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Speaker 2: US companies, I would be a little scared because, you know,

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Speaker 2: there's this new operating system, there's new silicon technologies coming out.

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Speaker 2: China just announced an analog chip that uses analog, not

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Speaker 2: digital technologies. It's vastly faster than anything digital, uses a

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Speaker 2: fraction of the power. Now, look at the data seender situation.

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Speaker 2: Power consumption is a real issue. There's a race on

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Speaker 2: with AI. It's geopolitical. China could get the edge through this,

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Speaker 2: you know, it's everything's up for grabs.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, probably the biggest most flashy text splash of the

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Speaker 1: year wasn't entirely successful. It was metas smart glasses. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: events where the demos sort of failed. But actually it

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Speaker 1: was quite impressive how far they've come in smart glasses,

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Speaker 1: right I am.

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Speaker 2: I was Astralia recently and for some reason, you can't

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Speaker 2: get them in New Zealand. I mean, why don't we

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Speaker 2: get certain things in New Zealand? I mean, Google, where

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Speaker 2: is a pixel phone?

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Speaker 1: Never?

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Speaker 2: You know, this is a weird thing. But I had

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Speaker 2: to play with a pair of meta glasses and they

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Speaker 2: were the Oakley ray band or Oakley ray band which

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Speaker 2: one ray bands, and these things were seriously nice and

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Speaker 2: you put them on. You've got an assistant. Basically you

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Speaker 2: can talk through through the glasses and uses bone productions

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Speaker 2: so you can always hear this cons assistant wherever you are,

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Speaker 2: and it's got a camera. And I just looked around

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Speaker 2: and said describe and a couple what it was. Describe this?

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Speaker 2: It described it to me. I said, translate that sign it?

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Speaker 2: Did you know? And Facebook have demonstrated other prototype glasts

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Speaker 2: where you wear a band on your wrist. It can

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Speaker 2: track all the tender movements so you can do hand

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Speaker 2: gestures and all track movement and you are displays built

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Speaker 2: into the glasses that overlay reality, so you can have

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Speaker 2: a graphic pop up beside someone, so having a chat

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Speaker 2: with someone negotiating a deal. The glasses can do stress

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Speaker 2: and they've voice tell you if they're lying or not,

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Speaker 2: you know, or if you if you're in a strange

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Speaker 2: city you need to find your way around, you'll get

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Speaker 2: a map overlay on the streets and three dimensions atill

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Speaker 2: point you where we need to go. And these new

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Speaker 2: glasses are I mean, the technology is very tantalizing. But

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Speaker 2: will we see it in New Zealand. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: Well, eventually it will hit critical mass and they'll have

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Speaker 1: to sell it here. But it's interesting that Meta spent

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Speaker 1: so much money on virtual reality, brought Oculus and created

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Speaker 1: its reality labs spent forty to fifty billion dollars trying

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Speaker 1: to create the metaverse that hasn't really worked. But here

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Speaker 1: we have an augmented reality sort of world that could

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Speaker 1: be the breakthrough and may even be the format that

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Speaker 1: smartphones morph into.

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Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, and it's something I'm going to touch

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Speaker 2: on later on. I mean, that's another key trend that

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Speaker 2: I think is going to be really excited in tweeny

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Speaker 2: twenty six, So watch the.

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Speaker 1: Space Okay, so smart glasses, yeah, twenty twenty six. Related

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Speaker 1: to that another wearable smart rings. We both had a

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Speaker 1: crack at the at wearing the Samsung smart ring. This year,

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Speaker 1: there are a couple more on the market.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm amazed. Actually, how many have just started surfacing

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Speaker 2: your whole pile of little parallel import brands? As a

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Speaker 2: Samsung brand is an Aura brand, I think? So a yeah,

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Speaker 2: why can't they just call them something normal, bobbed, you know,

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Speaker 2: But yes, it's interesting. I mean, you know, you can

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Speaker 2: wear a smart watch. It'll track your health, it'll track

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Speaker 2: your heart rate. But I mean they're seriously big. It's

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Speaker 2: like giving a hubcap on your damn risk. And you know,

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Speaker 2: notifications are a real distraction. I whan I've lost count

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Speaker 2: the amount of times I've been working my way through

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Speaker 2: a complex subject, researching a story or whatever, and I've

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Speaker 2: got a notification off my watch totally derailed my train

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Speaker 2: of thought, and another two hours later, I'm finally back

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Speaker 2: where I was. You know, so they're blessing and a

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Speaker 2: curse smart watches, but smart rings they aren't obtrusive. You

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Speaker 2: put them on your finger they don't bombard with notifications.

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Speaker 2: They're tiny, they fit on your finger and I don't

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Speaker 2: get in the way. And the thing I really like

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Speaker 2: about them is that by monitoring your health stats, they

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Speaker 2: can actually tell you proactively when you're coming down with

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Speaker 2: a cold or a flu a week before you start

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Speaker 2: noticing symptoms.

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Speaker 1: Are they more accurate than smart watches generally?

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Speaker 2: Yes. In my initial testing, I was really surprised at

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Speaker 2: just how good it actually was. And I got a

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Speaker 2: blood pressure cuff, I got a digital thermometer, and I

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Speaker 2: tested the Jesus out of the smart ring and I

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Speaker 2: was pleasantly surprised. It was pretty close to mark. I mean,

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Speaker 2: it's obviously not going to be medical grade perfect, but

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Speaker 2: it's right up there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think for particularly for people who are

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Speaker 1: runners and just want to go completely minimalist, it will

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Speaker 1: gather all of that data. It doesn't have to have

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Speaker 1: the phone there, so then we'll sink it when you

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Speaker 1: come back to the house. So from that point of view,

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Speaker 1: the thing for me is I just kept forgetting to

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Speaker 1: charge it, you know, so yeah, it's flat, and then

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Speaker 1: to yet another thing, I have to charge it.

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Speaker 2: I have another trend that will cover that off. So

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty six, so we'll get to that show. We

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Speaker 2: can keep listening people.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so we've covered smart rings. Let's a bit of

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Speaker 1: a chat about streaming. What happened in twenty twenty five

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Speaker 1: either than the price going up?

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Speaker 2: Oh well, this is the thing. I mean, there's a

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Speaker 2: real history about this, and I've written about this in

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Speaker 2: The Herald years ago when the whole you know, piracy

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Speaker 2: regulation thing and the copyright amendments were all going through,

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Speaker 2: and I did a lot of research and very quickly

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Speaker 2: came to the conclusion that, you know, piracy is an

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Speaker 2: unwinnable game of whack a mole for regulators. No one

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Speaker 2: has won the piracy game. And the only way we've

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Speaker 2: actually put a real dent and piracy has been through

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Speaker 2: the launch of streaming services. You know, not only did

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Speaker 2: they push video easy into extinction, thank god, because going

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Speaker 2: and getting a videotape in the southerly is not great fun.

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Speaker 2: But you know, they sort of put a dent in

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Speaker 2: local broadcasters, PATV broadcasters, video stores, but also they actually

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Speaker 2: put a real crimp in piracy statistics. Piracy went down

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Speaker 2: massively with outvent of Netflix, Amazon, Apple Plus, because you

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Speaker 2: go pick up something and watch it, and it was

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Speaker 2: twenty bucks a month or something was affordable, you know.

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Speaker 2: But this year we've seen a lot of these companies

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Speaker 2: up in their prices, putting restrictions on who you can

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Speaker 2: share your account with, and all sorts of things that

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Speaker 2: have made them really unattractive. Add to that a cost

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Speaker 2: of living crisis. People are starting to go, my, the

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Speaker 2: hell with this, and they're bat piraty again. And piracy

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Speaker 2: is actually starting to.

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Speaker 1: Increase, right, And we do have legislation which was sort

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Speaker 1: of ill conceived. We've written about this fifteen years ago

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Speaker 1: or something, which was very much aimed at.

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Speaker 2: Streaming download peer to peer downloads mainly. Yeah, but I

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Speaker 2: mean a lot of streaming is peer to peer anyways.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. So they went after the peer to

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Speaker 1: peer networks and left all these streaming sites. So you

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Speaker 1: saw just like all these illegal streaming sites crop up.

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Speaker 1: Then they decided they're recording companies for music and the studios.

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Speaker 1: It was too expensive to go after New Zealanders to

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Speaker 1: prosecute them, so nothing has happened there. But we have

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Speaker 1: seen this return to piracy driven by this just as

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Speaker 1: share expense of it.

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Speaker 2: And also, I mean, look, virtually every key we home

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Speaker 2: well held Kei Home has fiber, and downloading a TV

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Speaker 2: episode now with gigabit fiber is an exercise in two minutes.

434
00:22:27,960 --> 00:22:31,600
Speaker 2: You know, it is just so effortless now, whereas you know,

435
00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:33,960
Speaker 2: about fifteen years ago, we were all sitting on you know,

436
00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:36,760
Speaker 2: DSL if we were lucky, or fifty six K mode

437
00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:40,399
Speaker 2: ands we're really unlucky, and downloading a TV episode was

438
00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:44,040
Speaker 2: a day's work. Yeah, so it's going to be interesting

439
00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:46,439
Speaker 2: to watch. And I think the other side of the

440
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:50,080
Speaker 2: coin is that consumers are a lot more savvy. You know,

441
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:54,040
Speaker 2: they've all got VPNs and they're all looking at services

442
00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:58,720
Speaker 2: that hide their tracks. And even if law changes happen,

443
00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:00,919
Speaker 2: it's going to be really hard not the crack. And

444
00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:04,520
Speaker 2: if streaming services keep going the way they are, you know,

445
00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:05,800
Speaker 2: it's going to be interesting. What happened?

446
00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:08,920
Speaker 1: Do you think there's going to be some consolidation. Netflix

447
00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:13,439
Speaker 1: has survived as the juggernaut and is doing quite well.

448
00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:15,600
Speaker 1: It's really hard to tell when it comes to Apple

449
00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:19,160
Speaker 1: and Amazon just how profitable they're streaming stuff is. It's

450
00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:21,160
Speaker 1: sort of a bit of a lost leader for Amazon

451
00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:25,479
Speaker 1: Prime in terms of Prime video and similarly for Apple.

452
00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:29,160
Speaker 1: But we do have a bigger streaming ecosystem than ever,

453
00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:32,240
Speaker 1: but it's more frustrating for consumers because all the good

454
00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:34,640
Speaker 1: content is smanted across all these players.

455
00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:38,240
Speaker 2: I sat down a while back and did the mathematics

456
00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:41,960
Speaker 2: on what we're paying for different streaming services, and I

457
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:44,560
Speaker 2: shocked myself. I was really surprised that just how much

458
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:47,720
Speaker 2: money is quietly being bled out of my bank account

459
00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:50,520
Speaker 2: every month for all these different streaming services that I

460
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:54,439
Speaker 2: barely use. And you know, it's just a mess. So

461
00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:57,960
Speaker 2: I don't know. Will Amazon stay the course, Will Apple

462
00:23:58,040 --> 00:24:00,400
Speaker 2: stay the course? And then of course underneath that you've

463
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:04,240
Speaker 2: got brick Box and all these other sort of you know,

464
00:24:05,119 --> 00:24:07,880
Speaker 2: second tear streaming services as well, and behind that you've

465
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:12,080
Speaker 2: got YouTube, the sleeping giant smart TVs bring it into

466
00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:16,200
Speaker 2: everyone's lounge. But will people continue to pay vast amounts

467
00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:19,560
Speaker 2: of money as they're struggling to feed themselves and heat

468
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:20,440
Speaker 2: their owns? Yeah?

469
00:24:20,520 --> 00:24:24,359
Speaker 1: I don't think so. And it's been interesting in watching

470
00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:29,160
Speaker 1: the New Zealand streaming landscape in terms of our own broadcasters,

471
00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:31,640
Speaker 1: and I think Timmans has done a good job. It's

472
00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:34,359
Speaker 1: a much better user experience now, you know, the ads

473
00:24:34,359 --> 00:24:38,160
Speaker 1: aren't really clunky and jarring when they come in. But

474
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:40,560
Speaker 1: the reality is they're really up against it, aren't they

475
00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:41,320
Speaker 1: staying relevant?

476
00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:43,800
Speaker 2: This is to my mind one of the probably the

477
00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:46,240
Speaker 2: most critical little tech battles happening that no one knows

478
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:49,360
Speaker 2: anything about. And you know what we're starting to see,

479
00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:51,840
Speaker 2: of course, is cargo culture happening in New Zealand. You know,

480
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:55,119
Speaker 2: New Zealand culture, New Zealand stories are being lost in

481
00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:59,520
Speaker 2: the sea of Netflix, Apple, Amazon, yahd Yah yah and

482
00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:02,160
Speaker 2: I I think TV and z TV three they all

483
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:05,320
Speaker 2: have a really compelling point of difference. They need to

484
00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:08,520
Speaker 2: play as hard and as fast as they can. Unfortunately

485
00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 2: requires money, and that is producing New Zealand content, telling

486
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:14,720
Speaker 2: New Zealand stories, hearing New Zealand accents on the TV.

487
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:17,320
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, there's been some great New Zealand

488
00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:20,120
Speaker 2: content produced, but there's just not enough of it. And

489
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,200
Speaker 2: I think New Zealanders need a reason to get behind

490
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:27,160
Speaker 2: New Zealand content. And you know, the government did slap

491
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:31,320
Speaker 2: that there was that taxa talking about changes to video production,

492
00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:34,640
Speaker 2: but it's still nibbling around the edges of the problem. Yeah,

493
00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:37,119
Speaker 2: and I think, you know, if that doesn't change, so

494
00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:38,960
Speaker 2: we're going to lose something pretty precious.

495
00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:42,400
Speaker 1: What we also need more of is electric vehicles if

496
00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:46,080
Speaker 1: we're going to hit our twenty fifty or even twenty

497
00:25:46,200 --> 00:25:50,399
Speaker 1: thirty targets for emissions reduction. That you know, flipping the

498
00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:54,639
Speaker 1: fleet is essential to that. But effectively, since the subsidies

499
00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:56,960
Speaker 1: came off, sales are really tanged, haven't they.

500
00:25:57,240 --> 00:26:00,240
Speaker 2: It's really interesting they have dipped. And it's quite sad

501
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:03,520
Speaker 2: because you know, up until sort of twenty twenty five,

502
00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:06,120
Speaker 2: you could walk down the road and you know, there

503
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 2: was quite good odds that an electric car would just

504
00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:11,239
Speaker 2: quietly were passed. You to be an MG or a

505
00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:14,720
Speaker 2: BYD or you know, if you're especially wealthy, a tesla.

506
00:26:14,880 --> 00:26:17,920
Speaker 2: But like you're saying, I mean, you know, it's starting

507
00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:21,800
Speaker 2: to change, and it's really interesting. I mean EV's are

508
00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:25,600
Speaker 2: pretty compelling, you know they. I've got a friend who

509
00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:27,960
Speaker 2: bought a BYD. He's got his house fittered with solar

510
00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 2: and he's basically charging his car, has got a car

511
00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:33,840
Speaker 2: to petrol car for long distance driving the EV for

512
00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:37,960
Speaker 2: you know, driving between the coast and Wellington, and he's

513
00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:39,840
Speaker 2: basically saving a ton of money.

514
00:26:39,960 --> 00:26:43,040
Speaker 1: Even with the road using charges now applied, it's still

515
00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:45,720
Speaker 1: a really good economic compared to what.

516
00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:48,640
Speaker 2: You're paying at the fuel pump. Definitely, yeah, yeah.

517
00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:51,120
Speaker 1: And I think this year has been characterized really by

518
00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:54,840
Speaker 1: the arrival of a whole ranging new Chinese brands, Cherry

519
00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:55,520
Speaker 1: being one of them.

520
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:59,440
Speaker 2: Yep, Cherry MG byd I've lost.

521
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:04,080
Speaker 1: Count great Great Wall has sort of utes and stuff

522
00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:07,679
Speaker 1: now and then the Shark, the bad Shike massive, yes,

523
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:08,880
Speaker 1: hybrid ute.

524
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:11,520
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, that's a beast, that thing. And this

525
00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:13,960
Speaker 2: is the thing. I mean, you know, back in the

526
00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:16,360
Speaker 2: sort of seventies and eighties, you know, the Japanese took

527
00:27:16,359 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 2: over the car market, and I think we're seeing history

528
00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:21,920
Speaker 2: repeat but with Chinese. And you know, the Chinese EV's

529
00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:24,639
Speaker 2: just everywhere. It's interested in going to China. You know,

530
00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:27,240
Speaker 2: back in the eighties or nineties, you went to China,

531
00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:30,239
Speaker 2: it was smoggy, it was noisey, it was chaotic. But

532
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:33,240
Speaker 2: you go there now and I can't know how quiet

533
00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:36,159
Speaker 2: it is. Everything's electric, evening just quietly worse passed you

534
00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:39,520
Speaker 2: and the air is actually clean, which is quite shocking too. Yeah.

535
00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:42,480
Speaker 1: I think there's still a couple of challenges around evs,

536
00:27:42,560 --> 00:27:46,240
Speaker 1: even though the price is quite attractive now, the infrastructure

537
00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:50,200
Speaker 1: for charge out and about. You're still sort of curing sometimes,

538
00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:53,840
Speaker 1: so we just need more infrastructure quickly. It's been doing

539
00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:57,200
Speaker 1: a great job and others, but you know, I think

540
00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:01,040
Speaker 1: the government put a big commitment to increase the number

541
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 1: of EV charges. That needs to happen, definitely. Yeah, And

542
00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:08,280
Speaker 1: also just dispelling the myths about the safety of lithium

543
00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:12,760
Speaker 1: ion batteries, which there is summers there, but compared to

544
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:16,320
Speaker 1: petrol diesel vehicles, you never hear about them going up

545
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:18,119
Speaker 1: in smoke because it's a lot more common.

546
00:28:18,160 --> 00:28:20,520
Speaker 2: Well, this is really interesting you mentioned this because my

547
00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:23,840
Speaker 2: colleague Gary Steele, who co owned Which Doctor, wrote a

548
00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:27,200
Speaker 2: story about this a while back, just about how there

549
00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:29,720
Speaker 2: was an accident between a bus and a vehicle and

550
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:33,080
Speaker 2: the bus caught fire and you know, all over social

551
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:35,720
Speaker 2: media was our batteries exploded and you know, the sky

552
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 2: is falling. It turned out, of course, that was a

553
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 2: petrol vehicle that a caught fire and set the bus

554
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,600
Speaker 2: on fire and large parts of the bus of fiberglass

555
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:47,560
Speaker 2: POxy resume glass that burns like anything. And you know,

556
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:50,040
Speaker 2: so there is a lot of misinformation around there about this,

557
00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 2: a lot of fear and a lot of fair uncertainty

558
00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:56,120
Speaker 2: in doubt, but there is a trend coming intween twenty

559
00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:58,520
Speaker 2: six I will touch on that really addresses that.

560
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:03,560
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, we're sitting in my apartment building in

561
00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:08,720
Speaker 1: Wellington and the Body corporate here has banned electric vehicles

562
00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:11,680
Speaker 1: from being in the garages underneath this building because they're

563
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:15,720
Speaker 1: so worried about a cargoing on fire and basically taking

564
00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 1: out the entire building because it's really hard to put

565
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:21,040
Speaker 1: these battery fires out. It is luckily three minutes down

566
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:24,480
Speaker 1: the road is the Central Wellington fire station, but it's

567
00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:27,440
Speaker 1: still not on strike. There's just that fair fact there.

568
00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:31,719
Speaker 1: We've got to get over and you know, the technology

569
00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:35,680
Speaker 1: is relatively very safe, so hopefully we'll see that happen.

570
00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:38,400
Speaker 2: Now here's the crazy thing. Electric vehicles are nothing new.

571
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:40,520
Speaker 2: I mean they had electric vehicles at the turn of

572
00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:43,280
Speaker 2: the century. Yeah, you know in New York in the

573
00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:44,840
Speaker 2: turn of the century. If you've caught a taxi it

574
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:47,680
Speaker 2: was electric. Yeah, you know, it didn't go very far

575
00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:51,040
Speaker 2: and lead acid battery, so you have five miles or

576
00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:52,880
Speaker 2: something crazy, but yeah, you know.

577
00:29:53,240 --> 00:29:55,840
Speaker 1: But yeah, but we're also saying I've been traveling a

578
00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:59,720
Speaker 1: bit this year and it's amazing, including here in New

579
00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:03,640
Speaker 1: zeal in airports and that you're seeing these big industrial

580
00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:08,840
Speaker 1: robotic vacuum cleaners. You go to restaurants. I was in Spain,

581
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:12,200
Speaker 1: Ireland and a lot of food is now being delivered

582
00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:15,680
Speaker 1: to tables by robots. By robots, dirty plates been collected

583
00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:19,479
Speaker 1: from tables, so just you know, and that is seeping

584
00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,440
Speaker 1: into the home as well, like the robot Great New

585
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:25,320
Speaker 1: Zealand company making robotic lawnmowers.

586
00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:29,000
Speaker 2: They're awesome. They're awesome, and you know, a robot launmight

587
00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:33,040
Speaker 2: is something I cover deeply. You know, I have quite

588
00:30:33,080 --> 00:30:37,280
Speaker 2: a large section and mowing lawns is basically ours out

589
00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 2: of my life. I'm never getting back. If I can

590
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:41,880
Speaker 2: find a robot that can do that for me, I'm

591
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:44,480
Speaker 2: in Like Flynn, I just have to talk the fiscal

592
00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:48,240
Speaker 2: manager into approving budgets. But they're great, and you know,

593
00:30:48,360 --> 00:30:50,760
Speaker 2: this has twenty twenty five has really been the year

594
00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:53,560
Speaker 2: that home robots have come of age. I mean, you know,

595
00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:56,120
Speaker 2: robot vacuum clean is that everywhere you.

596
00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:58,600
Speaker 1: Know, and ebot I've had in the apartment here. It

597
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:02,200
Speaker 1: specializes in deep kipe, which we have does a great job.

598
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:04,880
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, and the latest ones I've got the ex

599
00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:07,600
Speaker 2: eleven at home that I just reviewed. And this thing

600
00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:10,480
Speaker 2: can actually lift itself over steel threshold, so you know,

601
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:13,600
Speaker 2: from carpenter to toll floors. It's got AI built in,

602
00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:16,080
Speaker 2: so i'd avoid sea things on the ground and avoids them.

603
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:18,560
Speaker 2: You know. Used to be that a robot vacuum a

604
00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:21,160
Speaker 2: few years back would run over a USB charging cable.

605
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 2: It would tangle up, the robot would stop. We'd have

606
00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:25,480
Speaker 2: to run and take it apart untangle it. By the end,

607
00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:28,680
Speaker 2: you might as well vacuum yourself. This new breed and

608
00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:32,360
Speaker 2: new generation with AI and actually does the job really well.

609
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:35,240
Speaker 2: And I'm actually struggling to tell the difference between a

610
00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:38,200
Speaker 2: robot vacuum in my kitchen and me going in the

611
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:39,960
Speaker 2: kitchen and doing it with the vacuum climber that yeah,

612
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:40,560
Speaker 2: good they've got.

613
00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:44,000
Speaker 1: Yeah. So this is the sort of the future we've

614
00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:45,480
Speaker 1: been promised for a long time.

615
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:46,600
Speaker 2: Where Jetson's we're here.

616
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:48,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, a lot of the sort of the hassle and

617
00:31:48,680 --> 00:31:52,360
Speaker 1: the mundane stuff in life is taken over by robots.

618
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 1: And we're going to talk about your picks for twenty

619
00:31:54,800 --> 00:31:58,400
Speaker 1: twenty six around humanoid robots. Oh yeah, oh yeah, but

620
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:01,680
Speaker 1: let's just touch on small homes. We're sort of both

621
00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:06,080
Speaker 1: enthusiasts of this, you know, connecting up the thermostats, lights,

622
00:32:06,560 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 1: all sorts of stuff to control our homes. The ecosystem

623
00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:13,600
Speaker 1: is definitely getting a lot more cohesive now, right.

624
00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:15,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is yeah, And look you've hit the nail

625
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:20,080
Speaker 2: right on the head. This is the number of the issue. Previously,

626
00:32:20,120 --> 00:32:23,160
Speaker 2: you had three competing ecosystems. You had Apple's Home Kit,

627
00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:26,640
Speaker 2: you had Googles what was Google's called Google Homes, and

628
00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:29,880
Speaker 2: then you had Alexa. They were incompatible and if you

629
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 2: went up and bought smart home gadgets, you had to

630
00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:34,160
Speaker 2: make sure you bought the right ecosystem for what you've

631
00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:39,040
Speaker 2: already had in your house. And to say that was annoying,

632
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:42,320
Speaker 2: painful and expensive as an understatement, But everyone in the

633
00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:44,000
Speaker 2: industry put the head together. They came up with the

634
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:47,360
Speaker 2: standard called matter and that's now starting to mature and

635
00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 2: we're seeing a lot of Matter capable gadgets hitting the market.

636
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 2: These things will basically work regardless if you have an Alexa,

637
00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:57,720
Speaker 2: Apple Surrey or a Google what are these smart things

638
00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:02,480
Speaker 2: called the Google one's complaining Google Home devices Home? Yeah, yeah,

639
00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:05,120
Speaker 2: you know, they'll just work and I mean that's really great.

640
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:08,080
Speaker 2: So I mean smart homes I think are just really

641
00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:09,880
Speaker 2: coming of age. And I mean I've got smart home

642
00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:11,880
Speaker 2: year this year I've used it. I mean the new

643
00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:16,480
Speaker 2: ring doorbell. Yeah that with the smart TV, which I'll

644
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:17,760
Speaker 2: get to what a combination.

645
00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:20,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've got one of those rings on the way

646
00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:23,240
Speaker 1: into the apartment and if someone gets out of the lift,

647
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:26,120
Speaker 1: it's got a proximity sensor, so if they go the

648
00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: other way, it doesn't send me an alert, but if

649
00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:30,640
Speaker 1: they come up to my front door, yes, that will

650
00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:34,000
Speaker 1: alert me. Says They've got really sharpe in terms of

651
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:35,440
Speaker 1: what they're capable of doing.

652
00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:38,040
Speaker 2: And I mean Mike Greyhound comes in, it tells me

653
00:33:38,120 --> 00:33:40,160
Speaker 2: there's a dog at the door. Courrier drops off a

654
00:33:40,200 --> 00:33:42,479
Speaker 2: package at my door. It tells me there's a package

655
00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:44,360
Speaker 2: at my door. And of course if there's a porch

656
00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:47,040
Speaker 2: partron and steal the package, they're on camera as well.

657
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:49,480
Speaker 2: So yeah, you know it's I think that's really cool.

658
00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 2: And the other thing, I really loved smart light bulbs.

659
00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:53,840
Speaker 2: They're nothing new, but my god, they're fun, you know.

660
00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:56,000
Speaker 2: And I mean you can change the ammens of a

661
00:33:56,120 --> 00:34:00,320
Speaker 2: room so quickly and so easily, you know, and I've

662
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 2: been using the whiz Hdumi light strip sync thing on

663
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 2: the back of my TV and it sort of does

664
00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:11,319
Speaker 2: for video what's around sound does for audio. Yeah, so

665
00:34:11,320 --> 00:34:13,800
Speaker 2: I'm watching TV there's an underwater scene. All of a

666
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:15,840
Speaker 2: sudden in the back wall and the ceiling are blue

667
00:34:15,880 --> 00:34:19,920
Speaker 2: and shimmering like water, and it's just it's really immersive.

668
00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:20,640
Speaker 2: It's kind of cool.

669
00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:25,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's cool. And in my apartment, as you can see,

670
00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:28,400
Speaker 1: there's no overhead lights. Yes, it's nineteen sixties apartment. They

671
00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:32,920
Speaker 1: didn't install lights as a design thing. So I've been

672
00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:36,480
Speaker 1: putting these sorts of panels, led panels and light strips

673
00:34:36,520 --> 00:34:39,759
Speaker 1: to light the side off the room and it's working

674
00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:44,280
Speaker 1: out really well. And seeing as we're talking Gadget's twenty

675
00:34:44,320 --> 00:34:48,560
Speaker 1: twenty five, any real standout things that you've had in

676
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:50,520
Speaker 1: your lab testing this.

677
00:34:50,640 --> 00:34:52,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, Oh look, I mean there's been a whole bunch

678
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 2: of things. I mean, first one I think would be

679
00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 2: the Shark Ninja pizza robines. It's not technically tech, but

680
00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:03,920
Speaker 2: it is sort of, you know, out of nowhere. This

681
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:06,520
Speaker 2: brand called Ninja just popped up and they're actually an

682
00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:08,880
Speaker 2: American brand, even though they sound like a Chinese knockoff,

683
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,640
Speaker 2: and they basically said, hey, do you want to review

684
00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:15,359
Speaker 2: this pizza oven. And as well as worrying about tech,

685
00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 2: I write about food. So I went down to Pizza rap.

686
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:19,640
Speaker 2: I learned how to make really good pizzas and YadA

687
00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:23,840
Speaker 2: YadA ya, and this thing really astonished me. I was

688
00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 2: crafting Neapolitan style pizzas with no effort. You know, it's

689
00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:30,799
Speaker 2: totally bomb proof. And the thing I love about it

690
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:33,919
Speaker 2: is that it's got a pizza stone, but it's also

691
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:36,040
Speaker 2: got a little palett box. He put wood pealetts in

692
00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:38,160
Speaker 2: and it supplies a bit of smoke, so you get

693
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:41,200
Speaker 2: that wood fired pizza thing happening. Yeah, it's really good.

694
00:35:41,239 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 2: I mean an the amount of money we've saved going

695
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 2: out for pizza, you know, because I don't need to

696
00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:46,160
Speaker 2: I can make them as good as anywhere go out

697
00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:46,600
Speaker 2: for dinity.

698
00:35:46,680 --> 00:35:49,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's what eight hundred bucks I think that says for.

699
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 1: And what's good about it is not just a pizza oven.

700
00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:54,399
Speaker 1: It can do a brisket, it can do a low

701
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:57,160
Speaker 1: and slow cook, it can do a roast. Oh yeah,

702
00:35:57,200 --> 00:35:58,440
Speaker 1: all of those sorts of things as well.

703
00:35:58,560 --> 00:35:59,920
Speaker 2: So I've got to say a roast chalk in the

704
00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:02,640
Speaker 2: thing is absolutely brilliant, you know.

705
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:06,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, You've been covering TVs for for a long

706
00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:08,920
Speaker 1: time and it sort of seems to have run out

707
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:11,680
Speaker 1: of steam really in terms of innovation and TVs. We've

708
00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:16,720
Speaker 1: gone eight K, we've gone O lead, Q leads, we've

709
00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:21,840
Speaker 1: gone HDR, we've gone one hundred and twenty herds and more.

710
00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:25,200
Speaker 1: Anything exciting in the TV world.

711
00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:27,200
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, this is a part of the trade. I mean,

712
00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:30,040
Speaker 2: occupational hazard is reviewing TV. So I've put my back

713
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:32,360
Speaker 2: up more times than I can count, lugging a you know,

714
00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:34,840
Speaker 2: an eighty five inch TV up onto the TV cabinet.

715
00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:39,000
Speaker 2: But one TV that stood out, really stood out for

716
00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:43,279
Speaker 2: me was Pattersonic Z ninety five A. This TV it's

717
00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:45,919
Speaker 2: only D so it's got those beautiful contrast level, super

718
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:49,439
Speaker 2: vivid colors on screen, motions, silky smooth. It's four K,

719
00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:52,839
Speaker 2: so if you can get four K footage, it looks fantastic.

720
00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:55,640
Speaker 2: But the selling point for me that really got me excited.

721
00:36:55,640 --> 00:36:58,879
Speaker 2: It's got an EXI built in. And just the other

722
00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:01,880
Speaker 2: night I was watching SO and someone came to the

723
00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:04,439
Speaker 2: door and I got to pop up on the TV

724
00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:06,840
Speaker 2: of video pop up showing his people at the door

725
00:37:07,600 --> 00:37:10,080
Speaker 2: overlaying what I was watching on TV, and I was like, oh.

726
00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:11,920
Speaker 1: Okay, it's coming from your ring camera.

727
00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:14,160
Speaker 2: Ring camera on my front door. Just saw them and

728
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:15,920
Speaker 2: because the TV's got Alexa on it and I've got

729
00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:19,120
Speaker 2: the a Lexus skill installed, this video popped up. And

730
00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:20,960
Speaker 2: the other thing I love about it is that I

731
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:23,160
Speaker 2: don't use the remote. I just talked to my TV

732
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:26,560
Speaker 2: and Alexa turned the volume down twenty percent. Alexa, find

733
00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:30,360
Speaker 2: me something good on YouTube. Yeah, and it just works.

734
00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:32,279
Speaker 2: It's a smart TV. I mean there's a lot of

735
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:35,040
Speaker 2: smart TVs out there, but some of them are pretty

736
00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:38,120
Speaker 2: horrible to use. Yeah, this isn't I actually found this

737
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:38,839
Speaker 2: really usue.

738
00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:40,719
Speaker 1: I think we were a bit skeptical when we went

739
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,440
Speaker 1: to the launch of that about Amazon basically taking over

740
00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:47,239
Speaker 1: the operating system of a TV. But it does work.

741
00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:49,680
Speaker 1: You do have to sort of sign in to make

742
00:37:49,719 --> 00:37:52,200
Speaker 1: the most of it as an Amazon account hold in

743
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:54,839
Speaker 1: which I'll get a larry off, but then it's sort

744
00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:58,640
Speaker 1: of it does a reasonable job of using AI. I

745
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:01,319
Speaker 1: guess going, Okay, these are the things you're interested in.

746
00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:04,600
Speaker 1: So the front screen displays all of that, and then

747
00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:06,560
Speaker 1: the slight home capability.

748
00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:08,399
Speaker 2: So it's Amazon. I mean the downside of course being

749
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 2: an Amazon operating system, as it puts Amazon Prime first

750
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:15,040
Speaker 2: and foremost, so if you're not an Amazon Prime user, Yeah,

751
00:38:15,040 --> 00:38:18,799
Speaker 2: it's not ideal. But it's Android based, the fire tam

752
00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:21,400
Speaker 2: is and Android basing, so you can sideload so many different

753
00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:23,799
Speaker 2: call aps. I've actually got the Xbox app on it

754
00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:26,000
Speaker 2: and I've peered a control up of the TV. I'm

755
00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:28,680
Speaker 2: playing Xbox games on my TV with just a controller.

756
00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:31,319
Speaker 2: I don't even need an Xbox. Yeah, that's kind of cool.

757
00:38:31,719 --> 00:38:35,960
Speaker 1: Samsung, solid, solid year for Sam saying nothing really exciting.

758
00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:38,960
Speaker 1: I was more interested really LGA. The C five I

759
00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:42,239
Speaker 1: had to look at, was very impressed there with you

760
00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:45,080
Speaker 1: know again the black blacks, all of that letter is

761
00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:46,960
Speaker 1: just fantastic. You had to look at the G five,

762
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:48,080
Speaker 1: which is the high end one.

763
00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:50,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, the G five astonished me. I mean it was

764
00:38:51,200 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 2: only it has the one drawback with O letters. It's

765
00:38:53,640 --> 00:38:58,040
Speaker 2: not always as bright as LCD with backlighting. But LG

766
00:38:58,200 --> 00:39:00,640
Speaker 2: have got this new only technology. I can't what the

767
00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:04,120
Speaker 2: heck they call it. It's got a TLA, a three

768
00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:07,799
Speaker 2: letter acronym, but it's super super bright and you could

769
00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:09,920
Speaker 2: almost use this TV as a tanning clinic. It's that

770
00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:14,160
Speaker 2: bright and it was eye popping, absolutely beautiful to use.

771
00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:15,760
Speaker 2: And the other thing I really like about the LGG

772
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:18,400
Speaker 2: five was the remote has a gyroscope in it, so

773
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:20,400
Speaker 2: you moved the remote around with your wrist and a

774
00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:23,120
Speaker 2: pointer moves around on the screen. And I handed the

775
00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:25,120
Speaker 2: remote to my wife as a litmus test to see

776
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:28,720
Speaker 2: how duredive it was without telling her how to use it.

777
00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:30,399
Speaker 2: She sort of sat there for a couple of minutes

778
00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:33,160
Speaker 2: going what the heck, you know, and then five minutes

779
00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:35,200
Speaker 2: sadus she was merely away.

780
00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:38,080
Speaker 1: You know, it's a great minimalist remote. They've redesigned for

781
00:39:38,200 --> 00:39:41,800
Speaker 1: those TVs, so it's just a simpler way of interacting

782
00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:42,040
Speaker 1: with it.

783
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:44,759
Speaker 2: Just good design, you know. And I think, like you say,

784
00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:49,880
Speaker 2: the technology, I think it's matured for TVs, but design hasn't.

785
00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:53,839
Speaker 2: And this is where players like Samsung, LG, Panasonic are

786
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:56,160
Speaker 2: really earning the stripes, you know, they're refining the design

787
00:39:56,880 --> 00:39:59,719
Speaker 2: and just making the TV is much more joyful to you.

788
00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:03,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, and similarly, in the smartphone market, it's sort of

789
00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:07,720
Speaker 1: running out of steam in terms of innovation and design tricks.

790
00:40:07,719 --> 00:40:10,560
Speaker 1: They can come up with anything excite you this year

791
00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:11,320
Speaker 1: in phones.

792
00:40:12,520 --> 00:40:17,880
Speaker 2: Phones. Yeah, so phones are absolutely fascinating. Foldables. You know,

793
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:21,640
Speaker 2: there are so many foldables coming out, and I my

794
00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:25,840
Speaker 2: daily driver is a Galaxy Z fold seven phone. It's

795
00:40:25,880 --> 00:40:28,400
Speaker 2: beautiful and it folds up. It no longer feels like

796
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:31,120
Speaker 2: I've got a phone book in my pocket, so you know,

797
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:33,520
Speaker 2: I'm no longer ripping the lining out of my pockets.

798
00:40:33,680 --> 00:40:34,360
Speaker 2: Out of my pockets.

799
00:40:34,360 --> 00:40:36,080
Speaker 1: And that's the first year. Really it took sort of

800
00:40:36,120 --> 00:40:39,440
Speaker 1: seven iterations to get to a point where the S

801
00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:42,600
Speaker 1: twenty five Ultra, you know, you actually probably tip towards

802
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:43,960
Speaker 1: the foldable if you could afford it.

803
00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:46,680
Speaker 2: This is the thing. I mean, the foldables now so compelling.

804
00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:48,640
Speaker 2: I mean, the only thing I think S twenty five

805
00:40:48,760 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 2: Ultra has over the foldables is the cameras. Yeah, it's

806
00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:55,680
Speaker 2: got beautiful cameras, but this foldable, it's gorgeous. It just

807
00:40:55,760 --> 00:41:00,000
Speaker 2: does everything, you know. And the thing which doctor puts

808
00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:03,120
Speaker 2: a lot of which octor is high fi and the

809
00:41:03,160 --> 00:41:04,759
Speaker 2: thing a lot. But we don't know about Samsung is

810
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:07,320
Speaker 2: their phones actually have what they call adapt hearing, and

811
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:11,279
Speaker 2: you can put a set of headphones on and far

812
00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:13,680
Speaker 2: up adapt hearing with your phone and dial the audio

813
00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:17,600
Speaker 2: output to your specific hearing and the difference that makes

814
00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:20,480
Speaker 2: with the sound is phenomenal. So yeah, I'm really taken

815
00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:23,000
Speaker 2: with it. It's been the year I think of the foldable,

816
00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:26,120
Speaker 2: and I think Apple's iPhone fold whoever they're going to

817
00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:30,480
Speaker 2: call it a crazy marketing name. I think that's just

818
00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:33,160
Speaker 2: going to basically add a whole new level of competition

819
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:35,040
Speaker 2: into the foldable genre and we're just going to see

820
00:41:35,040 --> 00:41:35,719
Speaker 2: things get better.

821
00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've been using the Opophone X nine, which I

822
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:43,160
Speaker 1: really like. I think it's the coming of age. They've

823
00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:45,359
Speaker 1: still got a bit of work to do, but at

824
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:48,120
Speaker 1: the high end, you know, they always really struggled to

825
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:52,320
Speaker 1: compete against Samsung, so I think this is the start

826
00:41:52,400 --> 00:41:55,120
Speaker 1: maybe if of that happening. We've also got Honor coming

827
00:41:55,120 --> 00:41:56,360
Speaker 1: into the market launching.

828
00:41:56,400 --> 00:41:58,440
Speaker 2: It's really exciting. I mean, you know, I was a

829
00:41:58,480 --> 00:41:59,920
Speaker 2: bit of a wi Awei fan where I love to

830
00:42:00,080 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 2: phones when their cameras were astonishing, you know, and with

831
00:42:04,080 --> 00:42:06,640
Speaker 2: Wahwei no longer in the market, I was a bit sad.

832
00:42:06,680 --> 00:42:10,239
Speaker 2: But with Honor coming, which has Whawei DNA, it's no

833
00:42:10,320 --> 00:42:13,120
Speaker 2: longer really waycas I them off. But if they can

834
00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:15,799
Speaker 2: get the same level of innovation as Whahwei had. You know,

835
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:18,400
Speaker 2: that's only going to be great news because you know,

836
00:42:18,440 --> 00:42:20,080
Speaker 2: the amount of bang you're getting for your buck with

837
00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:22,960
Speaker 2: a phone now is just astonishing. I you know, I

838
00:42:22,960 --> 00:42:25,600
Speaker 2: found in my drawer a few months back an original

839
00:42:25,640 --> 00:42:29,440
Speaker 2: Galaxy Samsung Galaxy. I picked it up, I charged it up,

840
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:34,640
Speaker 2: parted on and it was nice. But I just couldn't

841
00:42:34,640 --> 00:42:37,719
Speaker 2: get over just how far we'd come in such a

842
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:41,280
Speaker 2: short time. And yeah, this is all to do with competition,

843
00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:44,360
Speaker 2: and you know, more players in the market, more competition,

844
00:42:44,880 --> 00:42:48,200
Speaker 2: cheaper phones that do more for less. It's a win win.

845
00:42:48,239 --> 00:42:52,760
Speaker 1: Situation and that Chinese ecosystem of phones me as well.

846
00:42:53,480 --> 00:42:56,880
Speaker 1: So yeah, it's good. They're putting pressure on, particularly on

847
00:42:56,960 --> 00:43:00,400
Speaker 1: Samsung as the biggest sort of Android maker in this

848
00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:01,799
Speaker 1: country anyway, they're huge.

849
00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:03,439
Speaker 2: But you know what I want for Christmas this year?

850
00:43:03,680 --> 00:43:06,799
Speaker 2: That's that a pixel phone. Why can Google bring the

851
00:43:06,840 --> 00:43:09,279
Speaker 2: pixel phone to New Zealand? Come on, Google, Stephen as

852
00:43:09,280 --> 00:43:11,279
Speaker 2: an online store or something. I guess there's a bit

853
00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:13,520
Speaker 2: of customization they have to do, but it would go

854
00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:15,840
Speaker 2: off well. I mean, it's not a cheap phone, but

855
00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:18,080
Speaker 2: there neither is the foldable phones. I mean, people have

856
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:21,520
Speaker 2: got the money for a phone. Yeah, and they're beautiful phones.

857
00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:24,040
Speaker 2: They're really nice phones. Why can't they launch the New

858
00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:25,640
Speaker 2: Zealand come on Google? Yeah? Finally.

859
00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:28,839
Speaker 1: The other big category is computers, obviously, and I haven't

860
00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:31,960
Speaker 1: had a huge play with Windows laptops. But I was

861
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:34,759
Speaker 1: disappointed really at the start of the year a lot

862
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 1: of hype around co Pilot PCs, and with the neural

863
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:42,520
Speaker 1: processing unit built in supposedly to do all this AI

864
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:47,120
Speaker 1: functionality on Windows based PCs, it was a bit of

865
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:47,839
Speaker 1: a fizzer. Really.

866
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:50,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, I've got to say it. I'm pretty much in

867
00:43:50,719 --> 00:43:53,000
Speaker 2: the same boat as you. I sort of. You know,

868
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:55,640
Speaker 2: I'm a three six five premium subscriber, which means I'm

869
00:43:55,719 --> 00:43:57,560
Speaker 2: paying a lot more than I was a few months back.

870
00:43:58,680 --> 00:44:02,120
Speaker 2: But the Copilot thing, I fired it up because it

871
00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:05,120
Speaker 2: comes with the three sixty five plan. It's nice, but

872
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:08,680
Speaker 2: you know, if you ask to generate a document for you,

873
00:44:08,719 --> 00:44:11,799
Speaker 2: like a PowerPoint presentation, it can do that, but then

874
00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:14,319
Speaker 2: you've still got to do half the work yourself, and

875
00:44:14,960 --> 00:44:17,200
Speaker 2: it's clunky, and you compare it with the likes of

876
00:44:17,239 --> 00:44:20,920
Speaker 2: Perplexity or Gemini, and I think they've just got such

877
00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:23,799
Speaker 2: a long way to go, you know, you know, when

878
00:44:23,800 --> 00:44:26,440
Speaker 2: you're an operating system vendor, your key strength should be

879
00:44:26,520 --> 00:44:29,520
Speaker 2: integrating all those features directly into the operating system. And

880
00:44:29,560 --> 00:44:31,440
Speaker 2: I think they've singularly failed to do that.

881
00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:34,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, and there's this switch in terms of the hardware

882
00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:40,759
Speaker 1: to iron architecture. It hasn't gone particularly well. But what

883
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:44,319
Speaker 1: do you think the whole concept of sort of edge

884
00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:47,600
Speaker 1: computing where a lot of the applications take, for instance,

885
00:44:47,600 --> 00:44:50,160
Speaker 1: of the Adobe Sweet they're adapting themselves so that a

886
00:44:50,200 --> 00:44:53,480
Speaker 1: lot more of the processing happens on this neural processing

887
00:44:53,600 --> 00:44:56,360
Speaker 1: units on your device. It takes the load off the

888
00:44:56,719 --> 00:45:01,320
Speaker 1: central processing units, so you should get faster results sending

889
00:45:01,400 --> 00:45:03,200
Speaker 1: less information to the cloud.

890
00:45:03,719 --> 00:45:05,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is the thing. This is and this is

891
00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:08,040
Speaker 2: the other big trend of twenty twenty five. The cloud has,

892
00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:10,560
Speaker 2: you know, from a little we strata cumulus is now

893
00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:14,360
Speaker 2: this massive cyclonic storm system that everyone is plugged into.

894
00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:18,040
Speaker 2: And it's really interesting. If you're an enterprise in New Zealand,

895
00:45:18,160 --> 00:45:22,640
Speaker 2: you're using AI, you're doing business queries about a sensitive topics,

896
00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:26,880
Speaker 2: takeover a merger or something, and using AI to generate

897
00:45:26,880 --> 00:45:29,680
Speaker 2: a document or proof of document whatever that's going to

898
00:45:29,680 --> 00:45:33,239
Speaker 2: the cloud. You know, and I can just see so

899
00:45:33,320 --> 00:45:37,000
Speaker 2: many potential security issues around that, regardless of what spin

900
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:42,120
Speaker 2: the various cloud writers put on that. So it's it's

901
00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:44,319
Speaker 2: a fascinating one and I just don't know how that's

902
00:45:44,360 --> 00:45:48,799
Speaker 2: going to land, to be honest. Yea, But the arm

903
00:45:48,880 --> 00:45:52,200
Speaker 2: processor thing. The thing I really love about arm processes

904
00:45:52,280 --> 00:45:55,960
Speaker 2: is their battery life. Incredible. These laptops just go and

905
00:45:56,000 --> 00:45:59,359
Speaker 2: go and go and go, and you know, you're away

906
00:45:59,400 --> 00:46:01,799
Speaker 2: from the office more than you're in the office nowadays,

907
00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:05,359
Speaker 2: and having that battery life is critical. And yet at

908
00:46:05,360 --> 00:46:07,640
Speaker 2: the same time, we're running all this AI stuff which

909
00:46:07,680 --> 00:46:11,399
Speaker 2: is really energy hungry, you know, so we're expecting more

910
00:46:11,440 --> 00:46:14,680
Speaker 2: of our PCs, but of course we're also wanting longer

911
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:17,960
Speaker 2: battery life, and the silicon using your PC plays a

912
00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:20,160
Speaker 2: huge part in that. And I think this is where

913
00:46:20,239 --> 00:46:22,799
Speaker 2: Armory has got something to offer. Although I do feel

914
00:46:22,800 --> 00:46:23,919
Speaker 2: sorry for Intel at the moment.

915
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:26,359
Speaker 1: You know, they've heard in trouble and the government is

916
00:46:26,440 --> 00:46:29,120
Speaker 1: effectively bailing them out by taking a stake in them,

917
00:46:29,120 --> 00:46:30,200
Speaker 1: which is really weird.

918
00:46:30,520 --> 00:46:33,480
Speaker 2: I don't see that being sustainable. I mean, they if

919
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:36,880
Speaker 2: they can't innovate. You know, the tech industry is littered

920
00:46:36,920 --> 00:46:39,560
Speaker 2: with records from this in the past, and the US

921
00:46:39,640 --> 00:46:42,440
Speaker 2: government just doesn't seem to be learning from its previous mistakes.

922
00:46:42,960 --> 00:46:45,759
Speaker 2: And the tech industry, you know, if Intel don't start

923
00:46:45,800 --> 00:46:48,920
Speaker 2: innovating delivering what people want and need, they're not going

924
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:49,400
Speaker 2: to survive.

925
00:46:56,920 --> 00:46:59,960
Speaker 1: Okay, looking forward to twenty twenty six, put your few

926
00:47:00,160 --> 00:47:05,680
Speaker 1: tryst had on and your market trends experience to bear

927
00:47:05,719 --> 00:47:09,720
Speaker 1: on this. What are you picking in terms of tech trends,

928
00:47:10,239 --> 00:47:13,840
Speaker 1: new categories or finally the arrival of categories that have

929
00:47:13,880 --> 00:47:15,120
Speaker 1: been talked about for a long time.

930
00:47:17,040 --> 00:47:18,400
Speaker 2: When you asked me to do this, so we know,

931
00:47:18,520 --> 00:47:22,400
Speaker 2: I did some research, hey, researching, you know, and one

932
00:47:22,440 --> 00:47:25,760
Speaker 2: of the first things I stumbled across was smart contact lenses. Wow,

933
00:47:25,960 --> 00:47:28,560
Speaker 2: and these things that are the size of normal contact Lensmen,

934
00:47:28,600 --> 00:47:30,920
Speaker 2: they've got their own built in display and power source

935
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:35,000
Speaker 2: and you were a movement tracking bracelet so you can

936
00:47:35,040 --> 00:47:38,040
Speaker 2: do hand gestures with them, which is probably a microphone

937
00:47:38,080 --> 00:47:41,000
Speaker 2: somewhere so you can use voice commands, and you literally

938
00:47:41,080 --> 00:47:45,920
Speaker 2: have a computer display built into your eyes. So you know,

939
00:47:46,040 --> 00:47:48,920
Speaker 2: this could actually see smartphones look like as quaint as

940
00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:51,560
Speaker 2: a model t forward very very shortly. I mean, you

941
00:47:52,239 --> 00:47:57,040
Speaker 2: could always have access to the metaverse and have augmented

942
00:47:57,080 --> 00:48:00,680
Speaker 2: reality or even virtual reality overlaid on your world. So

943
00:48:01,200 --> 00:48:03,160
Speaker 2: you want a shopping list at the supermarket, it's there.

944
00:48:03,800 --> 00:48:07,000
Speaker 2: You need to get to a new building in another town,

945
00:48:07,360 --> 00:48:08,360
Speaker 2: it'll guide you there.

946
00:48:08,280 --> 00:48:11,600
Speaker 1: So going past smoke glasses, almost hopping over it. Will

947
00:48:11,640 --> 00:48:15,880
Speaker 1: Will people be comfortable wearing a you know, contact lens,

948
00:48:16,520 --> 00:48:18,400
Speaker 1: presumably it's going to be a bit thicker than a

949
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:19,280
Speaker 1: typical one.

950
00:48:19,640 --> 00:48:23,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, the early models I've seen aren't exactly as thin

951
00:48:23,560 --> 00:48:26,480
Speaker 2: as a disposable contact. I mean, they're chunky monkeys. But

952
00:48:28,280 --> 00:48:31,239
Speaker 2: I suspect, like any technology, it's going to mature, and

953
00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:33,640
Speaker 2: as it mature is it's going to become really compelling.

954
00:48:34,239 --> 00:48:36,160
Speaker 2: Your twenty twenty six will b when I think that

955
00:48:36,200 --> 00:48:39,359
Speaker 2: category starts getting some airtime and there'll be a bit

956
00:48:39,400 --> 00:48:41,160
Speaker 2: of g w was around it, but you know it's

957
00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:42,520
Speaker 2: going to be a big watch. The space.

958
00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:45,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, one category that got a lot of airtime this year,

959
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:50,080
Speaker 1: really thanks to the hype around Elon Musk and his

960
00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:53,360
Speaker 1: what's it called the robot?

961
00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:55,520
Speaker 2: Oh gosh, I can't remember, Rosie.

962
00:48:55,920 --> 00:48:59,720
Speaker 1: No, No, it's Ultimate Optimus.

963
00:49:00,200 --> 00:49:02,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, I keep them transformers. You're optimists.

964
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:08,360
Speaker 1: So he did his big, flashy debut off the robot

965
00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:10,200
Speaker 1: and then had that event where he had the robotic

966
00:49:10,239 --> 00:49:13,920
Speaker 1: taxes and he had the humanoid robots, although that I

967
00:49:13,920 --> 00:49:15,920
Speaker 1: think they were being remotely controlled, so it was a

968
00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:19,160
Speaker 1: bit smoke and mirrors. But we're definitely seeing a lot

969
00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:22,960
Speaker 1: more humanoid robots doing impressive things.

970
00:49:23,719 --> 00:49:26,040
Speaker 2: It's yeah, definitely, And I mean, you know, twenty twenty

971
00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:28,600
Speaker 2: five was the era where people started dabbling with it

972
00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:31,400
Speaker 2: and manufacturer started ramping up what they've been doing. And

973
00:49:31,400 --> 00:49:33,160
Speaker 2: there's a whole bunch of players in the US and

974
00:49:33,239 --> 00:49:36,840
Speaker 2: China doing stuff. And the humanoid robots have got to

975
00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:39,120
Speaker 2: the point where they can pick things up, they can

976
00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:41,560
Speaker 2: recognize objects, they can do a lot of stuff that's

977
00:49:41,600 --> 00:49:44,680
Speaker 2: really handy. But what we're starting to see now is

978
00:49:45,600 --> 00:49:50,719
Speaker 2: increasingly affordable AI silicon, increasingly compact AI models marry that

979
00:49:50,760 --> 00:49:54,120
Speaker 2: with a humanoid robot. You could soon see a humanoid

980
00:49:54,239 --> 00:49:57,520
Speaker 2: robot that could become your own in house housekeeper. And

981
00:49:58,200 --> 00:50:00,719
Speaker 2: I wouldn't be surprised if in late twent twenty six

982
00:50:00,960 --> 00:50:04,160
Speaker 2: in some markets humor and robots become the next must

983
00:50:04,200 --> 00:50:07,520
Speaker 2: have consumer electronics category for the well held. You know,

984
00:50:08,480 --> 00:50:10,160
Speaker 2: if you can afford it, you'll have one of these things.

985
00:50:10,160 --> 00:50:12,120
Speaker 2: In your house or do your vacuumen. It will fold

986
00:50:12,160 --> 00:50:14,560
Speaker 2: your laundry, it'll cook for you, you know.

987
00:50:15,160 --> 00:50:18,279
Speaker 1: And as Musk points out at you, I think ninety

988
00:50:18,280 --> 00:50:22,960
Speaker 1: percent if the engineering work now on humanoids is in

989
00:50:23,040 --> 00:50:23,520
Speaker 1: the hand.

990
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:26,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, you've got to have those degrees of movement as

991
00:50:26,600 --> 00:50:31,520
Speaker 2: touch sensitivity, dexterity. It's, you know, the hard stuff's pretty

992
00:50:31,600 --> 00:50:34,560
Speaker 2: much been done. It's you know, it's a category that's

993
00:50:34,600 --> 00:50:37,160
Speaker 2: about to really ignite. And I think next year it

994
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:40,239
Speaker 2: could be the year it really starts to happen, you know.

995
00:50:40,280 --> 00:50:42,480
Speaker 2: And you've got China doing some incredible stuff, You've got

996
00:50:42,480 --> 00:50:45,880
Speaker 2: the US doing some incredible stuff. And there was a robot.

997
00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:48,439
Speaker 2: The first robot was commercially launched about a month ago,

998
00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:50,759
Speaker 2: twenty thousand US dollars. I can't read the name of

999
00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:54,879
Speaker 2: it now. It looked really compelling until you realize that

1000
00:50:54,960 --> 00:50:58,440
Speaker 2: it wasn't actually driven by AI but a minimum wage

1001
00:50:58,680 --> 00:51:03,480
Speaker 2: graduate dark room somewhere at corporate HQ, remote your pilot

1002
00:51:03,520 --> 00:51:05,320
Speaker 2: and to sing inside your house. You're all sorts of

1003
00:51:05,400 --> 00:51:08,120
Speaker 2: privicy concerns. And it was a bit creepy, yeah.

1004
00:51:08,120 --> 00:51:11,040
Speaker 1: Very very creepy, and slightly creepy as well. It's just

1005
00:51:11,040 --> 00:51:14,719
Speaker 1: a military application of this. You know, there's just the

1006
00:51:14,800 --> 00:51:18,120
Speaker 1: robotic dogs, for instance, So I will be sent into

1007
00:51:18,160 --> 00:51:21,759
Speaker 1: war in the next big land war. You've got the

1008
00:51:21,840 --> 00:51:25,480
Speaker 1: drones that are on the front lines killing people every day.

1009
00:51:25,480 --> 00:51:27,800
Speaker 2: And one of these guys says, are you sir, economy,

1010
00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:31,319
Speaker 2: I'm booking it out of here. You know, it's I mean,

1011
00:51:31,920 --> 00:51:35,120
Speaker 2: it's definitely going to be fascinating to watch, and it's

1012
00:51:35,200 --> 00:51:37,480
Speaker 2: just going to be like a lot of tech, it's

1013
00:51:37,480 --> 00:51:39,759
Speaker 2: going to be wild down predictable. Who knows. What do

1014
00:51:39,760 --> 00:51:40,160
Speaker 2: you think.

1015
00:51:40,040 --> 00:51:42,759
Speaker 1: About the you know, the big sort of term this

1016
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:46,560
Speaker 1: year was AI Agent's agentic AI and a lot of

1017
00:51:46,640 --> 00:51:50,480
Speaker 1: hype around it. And you know, I've seen lots of

1018
00:51:50,520 --> 00:51:53,240
Speaker 1: demos of this and action. Some of it works, okay,

1019
00:51:53,360 --> 00:51:56,759
Speaker 1: some of it doesn't. Some of it's super expensive. When

1020
00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:58,920
Speaker 1: you actually break down the cost, sometimes you might have

1021
00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:02,640
Speaker 1: five or six agents working in the background. That's tokens

1022
00:52:02,680 --> 00:52:07,600
Speaker 1: and tokens that you are burning with these big hyperscalers.

1023
00:52:08,040 --> 00:52:10,800
Speaker 1: What do you think about what is coming in twenty

1024
00:52:10,880 --> 00:52:12,479
Speaker 1: twenty six with agentic AI.

1025
00:52:12,800 --> 00:52:15,799
Speaker 2: Well, it's really interesting you mentioned that because recently I

1026
00:52:15,840 --> 00:52:21,840
Speaker 2: got on an early advanced beta of Perplexities Comet browser.

1027
00:52:22,520 --> 00:52:25,440
Speaker 2: This thing has a gentic and ergenic version of perplexity

1028
00:52:25,440 --> 00:52:29,719
Speaker 2: built into it, and it's free to use, actually, which

1029
00:52:29,800 --> 00:52:34,000
Speaker 2: is quite surprising. And if you're a free user, you

1030
00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:35,920
Speaker 2: get a very limited number of queries you can use

1031
00:52:35,920 --> 00:52:38,279
Speaker 2: with it. I mean, obviously they want their shareholders kept happy,

1032
00:52:38,320 --> 00:52:40,200
Speaker 2: so they're going to charge you for whatever, and they've

1033
00:52:40,200 --> 00:52:44,000
Speaker 2: got data centers to pay for. But just using this

1034
00:52:44,080 --> 00:52:46,879
Speaker 2: thing on the free mode, I said to it, find

1035
00:52:46,960 --> 00:52:51,200
Speaker 2: me returned business class flights to Singapore times dates are

1036
00:52:51,200 --> 00:52:54,120
Speaker 2: not a problem. Find me the best date, best airline,

1037
00:52:54,680 --> 00:52:58,520
Speaker 2: and tell me the best month to go. And that

1038
00:52:58,560 --> 00:53:01,680
Speaker 2: would have been probably I would guess half a day's

1039
00:53:01,680 --> 00:53:03,320
Speaker 2: work for someone to sit down and do that manually,

1040
00:53:03,360 --> 00:53:05,920
Speaker 2: because you were finding the data and you're recutting it,

1041
00:53:06,000 --> 00:53:09,000
Speaker 2: reslicing it. This thing went away, and it actually showed

1042
00:53:09,040 --> 00:53:12,480
Speaker 2: me how it was using a different website, travel labrogration sites.

1043
00:53:12,520 --> 00:53:14,439
Speaker 2: It was actually like a human being dropping down drop

1044
00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:19,040
Speaker 2: box forms, clicking radio buttons, filling in my information, like

1045
00:53:19,080 --> 00:53:21,520
Speaker 2: a human being doing my bidding. And it went away

1046
00:53:21,520 --> 00:53:23,080
Speaker 2: and did it five minutes. Said I had a full

1047
00:53:23,120 --> 00:53:28,439
Speaker 2: list of cheap flights by airline, by month, etc. Et cetera,

1048
00:53:28,520 --> 00:53:31,799
Speaker 2: and I was astonished with amount of money it could

1049
00:53:31,800 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 2: have saved me if I'd had actually been serious about

1050
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:36,440
Speaker 2: doing it. You know, it knock something like two and

1051
00:53:36,480 --> 00:53:39,040
Speaker 2: a half k off over return flight. You know.

1052
00:53:39,239 --> 00:53:41,960
Speaker 1: So it's getting better, and I think one of the

1053
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:44,200
Speaker 1: things in twenty twenty six that will be even more

1054
00:53:44,239 --> 00:53:49,160
Speaker 1: impressive is the agents. The length of the task that

1055
00:53:49,200 --> 00:53:52,319
Speaker 1: they can complete is getting longer and longer. Yeah, so,

1056
00:53:52,600 --> 00:53:54,279
Speaker 1: you know, we will get to the point probably in

1057
00:53:54,320 --> 00:53:57,759
Speaker 1: twenty twenty six where in the enterprise world anyway, where

1058
00:53:57,800 --> 00:53:59,919
Speaker 1: you can set it to do some bit of add

1059
00:54:00,239 --> 00:54:03,040
Speaker 1: that would normally take someone all day to do and

1060
00:54:03,080 --> 00:54:07,360
Speaker 1: have multiple elements and need multiple different sources of information,

1061
00:54:07,960 --> 00:54:09,440
Speaker 1: and you'll just set that to work and it will

1062
00:54:09,480 --> 00:54:12,160
Speaker 1: do in thirty minutes what took seven eight hours.

1063
00:54:12,239 --> 00:54:14,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, weeks. Maybe this is the thing I think, and

1064
00:54:14,800 --> 00:54:17,640
Speaker 2: the corollery to there is a lot of people are going,

1065
00:54:17,640 --> 00:54:20,640
Speaker 2: oh my god, I'm gonna lose my job. But here's

1066
00:54:20,680 --> 00:54:25,719
Speaker 2: the thing AI hallucinates. It makes mistakes, and it can

1067
00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:29,239
Speaker 2: get very simple things wrong and be totally unaware that

1068
00:54:29,280 --> 00:54:31,839
Speaker 2: it's done it. So people still needed to keep an

1069
00:54:31,840 --> 00:54:35,399
Speaker 2: eye on the AI, and you need people who can

1070
00:54:35,440 --> 00:54:39,720
Speaker 2: write good AI prompts and manage the AIS. So I

1071
00:54:39,760 --> 00:54:41,520
Speaker 2: don't really think there's going to be a lot of

1072
00:54:41,600 --> 00:54:44,520
Speaker 2: job losses, but I think we're going to start doing

1073
00:54:44,560 --> 00:54:46,920
Speaker 2: a lot more with what we already have, so it

1074
00:54:46,960 --> 00:54:49,880
Speaker 2: could drive a lot of productivity increases. Yeah, if we

1075
00:54:49,960 --> 00:54:51,759
Speaker 2: get it right, it's a bigger if.

1076
00:54:51,840 --> 00:54:55,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, And yes, I was a bit skeptical really at

1077
00:54:55,719 --> 00:54:57,600
Speaker 1: the start of the year, really about our ability to

1078
00:54:57,680 --> 00:55:01,600
Speaker 1: get it right. But the more I see companies adopting

1079
00:55:01,640 --> 00:55:05,000
Speaker 1: this technology, I think they're quite shrewd here in New Zealand.

1080
00:55:05,000 --> 00:55:08,120
Speaker 1: You know, they're not doing massive, flashy spins. And even

1081
00:55:08,160 --> 00:55:11,880
Speaker 1: though startups we don't have a lot of AI centric startups,

1082
00:55:11,880 --> 00:55:14,960
Speaker 1: what we're seeing is a tech companies are embracing AI

1083
00:55:15,000 --> 00:55:17,399
Speaker 1: and building it into what they're selling. And I think

1084
00:55:17,400 --> 00:55:21,719
Speaker 1: that's slightly more sustainable than just like going where we're

1085
00:55:21,760 --> 00:55:25,440
Speaker 1: going all in on AI. Government's still, you know, lagging

1086
00:55:25,480 --> 00:55:29,480
Speaker 1: in terms of understanding what we need to do with

1087
00:55:29,520 --> 00:55:33,040
Speaker 1: the workforce for upskilling and reskilling to actually take best

1088
00:55:33,080 --> 00:55:34,080
Speaker 1: avent totally.

1089
00:55:34,239 --> 00:55:36,440
Speaker 2: You know, we're nibbling around the edges of it, and

1090
00:55:36,480 --> 00:55:38,280
Speaker 2: I think what I'd like to see from the government

1091
00:55:38,440 --> 00:55:41,600
Speaker 2: is a proper task force looking into this and making

1092
00:55:41,640 --> 00:55:45,560
Speaker 2: some recommendations and making it a multi party task force.

1093
00:55:45,719 --> 00:55:48,120
Speaker 2: I mean, the problem we see with so many of

1094
00:55:48,160 --> 00:55:51,360
Speaker 2: these sort of emerging technologies are investigated by governments is

1095
00:55:51,960 --> 00:55:54,680
Speaker 2: governments are so slow moving. It's like wading through frozen

1096
00:55:54,719 --> 00:55:57,719
Speaker 2: triagule dealing with them. And then, of course, you know,

1097
00:55:57,760 --> 00:56:00,360
Speaker 2: and election comes along and one party gets pushed by

1098
00:56:00,360 --> 00:56:04,239
Speaker 2: another party becomes government. That party dismantles the previous government's work,

1099
00:56:04,320 --> 00:56:06,800
Speaker 2: sets up their own stuff. Three is later, their stuff's dismantled.

1100
00:56:07,800 --> 00:56:10,080
Speaker 2: The need effect is, of course we're standing still, which

1101
00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:12,040
Speaker 2: in tech means we're going backwards.

1102
00:56:12,120 --> 00:56:12,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly.

1103
00:56:12,960 --> 00:56:14,759
Speaker 2: And I think you know what we need is for

1104
00:56:14,840 --> 00:56:16,400
Speaker 2: all sides of the house to go, look, this is

1105
00:56:16,760 --> 00:56:19,719
Speaker 2: a game changer for our economy. We need to do this.

1106
00:56:19,760 --> 00:56:21,520
Speaker 2: Everyone needs to agree that we need a long term,

1107
00:56:21,600 --> 00:56:22,560
Speaker 2: twenty year strategy.

1108
00:56:22,760 --> 00:56:26,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we've got an election coming up. I doubt

1109
00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:29,080
Speaker 1: AI is going to be an election year issue or

1110
00:56:29,160 --> 00:56:33,600
Speaker 1: anything tech related, but labor is you know, the future

1111
00:56:33,640 --> 00:56:37,719
Speaker 1: of work and employment. So you know, Labor party and

1112
00:56:38,880 --> 00:56:40,839
Speaker 1: the incumbent should be concerned about it.

1113
00:56:41,200 --> 00:56:43,200
Speaker 2: I think they should. I mean, if I were both

1114
00:56:43,360 --> 00:56:46,440
Speaker 2: all parties, I'd be looking at you know, a government

1115
00:56:46,560 --> 00:56:50,000
Speaker 2: level national COEO. Yeah, you know, and I would have

1116
00:56:50,040 --> 00:56:53,399
Speaker 2: someone whose job it was was to monitor all these

1117
00:56:53,400 --> 00:56:57,200
Speaker 2: different tech trends and help enable businesses. You know, we've

1118
00:56:57,239 --> 00:56:59,360
Speaker 2: got a great, big neighbor seven times our size and

1119
00:56:59,400 --> 00:57:02,359
Speaker 2: three hours they've hoovered up a lot of the gold

1120
00:57:02,360 --> 00:57:05,360
Speaker 2: out of our economy. We're focused on a very narrow

1121
00:57:05,400 --> 00:57:07,759
Speaker 2: part of the economy selling, but it's dead animals and

1122
00:57:07,800 --> 00:57:10,640
Speaker 2: trees to the world. We're a price taker, we're not

1123
00:57:10,680 --> 00:57:12,840
Speaker 2: a price maker. Our economy is to a narrow It

1124
00:57:12,960 --> 00:57:17,440
Speaker 2: means we're very exposed to geopolitics and global economic shocks.

1125
00:57:18,040 --> 00:57:19,400
Speaker 2: What we need to do is to add value to

1126
00:57:19,440 --> 00:57:21,520
Speaker 2: our economy, and I think tech is one of the

1127
00:57:21,640 --> 00:57:25,040
Speaker 2: key areas doing that. But like I was saying before,

1128
00:57:25,080 --> 00:57:26,800
Speaker 2: we don't have a strategy, we don't have a long

1129
00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:31,120
Speaker 2: term approach. Maybe the government and reous other parties should

1130
00:57:31,200 --> 00:57:31,960
Speaker 2: take that to heart.

1131
00:57:32,440 --> 00:57:35,160
Speaker 1: One last sort of thing for twenty twenty six. So

1132
00:57:35,160 --> 00:57:38,200
Speaker 1: I know that you've been looking into solid state batteries.

1133
00:57:38,920 --> 00:57:42,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was really interesting. So you're talking about EV's

1134
00:57:43,320 --> 00:57:46,000
Speaker 2: and you know lithium. Yeah, it doesn't mix the water

1135
00:57:46,120 --> 00:57:48,840
Speaker 2: or oxygen very well, has a habit of going boom,

1136
00:57:48,960 --> 00:57:52,840
Speaker 2: very hard to put out. Also, you know, the downsider

1137
00:57:52,880 --> 00:57:54,480
Speaker 2: with an EV is you've got to plug it into

1138
00:57:54,480 --> 00:57:57,160
Speaker 2: a charger and are fully charged. An EV you think

1139
00:57:57,240 --> 00:58:00,640
Speaker 2: up to eight hours, you know, and you've got rain anxiety.

1140
00:58:00,680 --> 00:58:04,840
Speaker 2: You know, it may only be you know, one hundred

1141
00:58:04,840 --> 00:58:09,320
Speaker 2: and twenty k's to get to you know, parapraam from Wellington,

1142
00:58:10,040 --> 00:58:12,760
Speaker 2: But there are hills, and that means your battery life

1143
00:58:12,760 --> 00:58:15,200
Speaker 2: takes a much bigger hit than what it initially thinks.

1144
00:58:16,720 --> 00:58:20,320
Speaker 2: Lithium on batteries have a very finite energy density that

1145
00:58:20,400 --> 00:58:22,200
Speaker 2: take a long time to charge. You're a fire risk.

1146
00:58:22,760 --> 00:58:26,560
Speaker 2: Solid state batteries don't use lithium. They use a solid

1147
00:58:26,640 --> 00:58:30,439
Speaker 2: electrolyte and this gives them a few advantages. Are much

1148
00:58:30,480 --> 00:58:33,560
Speaker 2: higher powering, so they can hold much more charge. So

1149
00:58:34,320 --> 00:58:37,560
Speaker 2: solid state batteries in theory could see cars having a

1150
00:58:37,560 --> 00:58:40,600
Speaker 2: fifteen hundred mile range of a single charge. You know,

1151
00:58:40,680 --> 00:58:42,760
Speaker 2: suddenly that range anxiety just goes away.

1152
00:58:42,880 --> 00:58:43,160
Speaker 1: You know.

1153
00:58:44,200 --> 00:58:47,880
Speaker 2: Also, they charge really really fast, and you know, in

1154
00:58:48,000 --> 00:58:50,480
Speaker 2: theory and I sort of think this is quite there, ye,

1155
00:58:50,560 --> 00:58:52,000
Speaker 2: but in theory you should be able to charge a

1156
00:58:52,000 --> 00:58:54,959
Speaker 2: sol state battery as fast as you're putting petrol into

1157
00:58:55,160 --> 00:58:58,640
Speaker 2: a standard you know, gas, GUZL and car. That's not

1158
00:58:58,720 --> 00:59:01,800
Speaker 2: quite the case yet, but who knows. And then the

1159
00:59:01,840 --> 00:59:03,800
Speaker 2: other thing is that you can put a nail through

1160
00:59:03,800 --> 00:59:06,640
Speaker 2: a soli state battery. You can drop them in a

1161
00:59:06,680 --> 00:59:10,960
Speaker 2: bath of water. They won't go bang. They're very very safe. Right. So,

1162
00:59:11,760 --> 00:59:14,919
Speaker 2: and with evs, that's exciting. That's a total game change

1163
00:59:14,960 --> 00:59:17,320
Speaker 2: that could see EV's becoming far more compelling than they

1164
00:59:17,320 --> 00:59:22,200
Speaker 2: already are. But then add that to laptops, to smart watchers,

1165
00:59:22,360 --> 00:59:26,080
Speaker 2: smart rings, all those other products. Imagine a smart watch

1166
00:59:26,160 --> 00:59:30,680
Speaker 2: that just held a charge and ran for three weeks. Yeah,

1167
00:59:30,720 --> 00:59:32,439
Speaker 2: that would be nice, wouldn't it be great? I mean,

1168
00:59:32,760 --> 00:59:34,440
Speaker 2: I've got the smart watch on my wrist that does

1169
00:59:34,480 --> 00:59:36,240
Speaker 2: sleep tracking. The only problem is I'm going to take

1170
00:59:36,240 --> 00:59:37,320
Speaker 2: it off from charge every night.

1171
00:59:37,360 --> 00:59:40,120
Speaker 1: Well that's the Apple Watch definitely, you know, what were

1172
00:59:40,120 --> 00:59:44,200
Speaker 1: they thinking? So there's a lot of players developing solid

1173
00:59:44,240 --> 00:59:47,400
Speaker 1: state batteries. Do you think any of them will sort

1174
00:59:47,400 --> 00:59:49,600
Speaker 1: of hit commercial viability in twenty twenty six?

1175
00:59:49,880 --> 00:59:52,560
Speaker 2: There are a lot of players in the US, Europe

1176
00:59:52,560 --> 00:59:54,440
Speaker 2: and China that say they're on the cusp of it,

1177
00:59:56,160 --> 00:59:57,600
Speaker 2: And I think it's just going to be a case

1178
00:59:57,640 --> 01:00:00,480
Speaker 2: of navigating the hype and finding the reality. Given the

1179
01:00:00,600 --> 01:00:02,160
Speaker 2: number of players that are doing it, I think at

1180
01:00:02,240 --> 01:00:05,120
Speaker 2: least one or two are going to Whoever gets there

1181
01:00:05,160 --> 01:00:07,880
Speaker 2: first is going to claim a very large pot of gold.

1182
01:00:07,920 --> 01:00:09,680
Speaker 2: I mean, there is huge money in this.

1183
01:00:10,680 --> 01:00:15,520
Speaker 1: And it is sodium based batteries for probably more for storage,

1184
01:00:15,560 --> 01:00:17,800
Speaker 1: for power plants and that sort of thing. That's going

1185
01:00:17,840 --> 01:00:18,960
Speaker 1: a long way as well, isn't it.

1186
01:00:19,120 --> 01:00:21,800
Speaker 2: This is yeah. I was in South Australia recently and

1187
01:00:23,000 --> 01:00:26,160
Speaker 2: I was really surprised that the sheer amount of photovoltaics

1188
01:00:26,200 --> 01:00:29,400
Speaker 2: on houses over there, something like I think it's one

1189
01:00:29,440 --> 01:00:32,240
Speaker 2: in three houses in South Australia has solar on the roof.

1190
01:00:32,880 --> 01:00:37,080
Speaker 2: And South Australia is now generating so much surplus energy

1191
01:00:37,120 --> 01:00:40,960
Speaker 2: they're finding out ways to have free electricity with some utilities.

1192
01:00:41,400 --> 01:00:44,080
Speaker 2: You know, they're actually supplying other states with electricity and

1193
01:00:44,120 --> 01:00:46,720
Speaker 2: they've got more than they can actually use. And I

1194
01:00:46,760 --> 01:00:49,640
Speaker 2: sat look at New Zealand and go, why haven't we

1195
01:00:49,720 --> 01:00:52,160
Speaker 2: done that? Why are we looking at large scale sodium

1196
01:00:53,000 --> 01:00:57,360
Speaker 2: battery plants. Let's burn some more coal. It just doesn't

1197
01:00:57,400 --> 01:00:59,760
Speaker 2: make any sense. I mean, you know, if you think

1198
01:00:59,800 --> 01:01:02,280
Speaker 2: about you put solar on a house your house is

1199
01:01:02,400 --> 01:01:04,560
Speaker 2: quy during the day because you're at the office. The

1200
01:01:04,600 --> 01:01:07,400
Speaker 2: only thing drawing octricity is your fridge. All that extra

1201
01:01:07,440 --> 01:01:10,040
Speaker 2: cultricity goes out to the grid, to the city, to

1202
01:01:10,080 --> 01:01:13,520
Speaker 2: the factories, to office buildings where it's needed. Yeah, and

1203
01:01:13,640 --> 01:01:15,840
Speaker 2: you scared out across some ent our suburbs. You're talking

1204
01:01:15,880 --> 01:01:17,600
Speaker 2: a very large amount of electricity.

1205
01:01:17,640 --> 01:01:20,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, we've struggled on solar and you know there was

1206
01:01:20,640 --> 01:01:23,040
Speaker 1: that big solar company that sort of went bust. Yeah

1207
01:01:23,120 --> 01:01:24,959
Speaker 1: this year, which didn't help.

1208
01:01:25,960 --> 01:01:29,240
Speaker 2: And also just to cost electricity in this country is insane.

1209
01:01:29,280 --> 01:01:33,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, that issue has has seen manufacturing shut down in

1210
01:01:33,640 --> 01:01:37,720
Speaker 1: parts of the country. So that's an existential threat anyway.

1211
01:01:37,840 --> 01:01:40,120
Speaker 2: So what it's time to be alive?

1212
01:01:40,120 --> 01:01:42,040
Speaker 1: What it's time to be alive A twenty twenty five

1213
01:01:42,280 --> 01:01:45,800
Speaker 1: was a really interesting year dominated by AI. I think

1214
01:01:45,840 --> 01:01:48,520
Speaker 1: twenty twenty six is going to be really interesting to

1215
01:01:48,520 --> 01:01:52,280
Speaker 1: see how AI shakes out. There will be some losers there,

1216
01:01:52,320 --> 01:01:55,200
Speaker 1: there will be a lot of value that's destroyed. Hopefully

1217
01:01:55,200 --> 01:01:59,960
Speaker 1: it doesn't take down the entire global economy with it.

1218
01:02:00,280 --> 01:02:02,080
Speaker 1: But a lot of these technologies that have been bubbling

1219
01:02:02,120 --> 01:02:06,520
Speaker 1: away in the background, augmented by AI, are starting to accelerate,

1220
01:02:06,560 --> 01:02:08,000
Speaker 1: So it's going to be a really interesting one.

1221
01:02:08,120 --> 01:02:10,000
Speaker 2: That's exactly it. When you start seeing some of these

1222
01:02:10,040 --> 01:02:13,760
Speaker 2: technologies married to AI, exciting stuff starts happening. I think

1223
01:02:13,760 --> 01:02:16,320
Speaker 2: next year's when some of that starts hitting the shop shelves.

1224
01:02:17,000 --> 01:02:18,960
Speaker 2: You know it's going to be really exciting.

1225
01:02:19,160 --> 01:02:23,000
Speaker 1: Thanks Pat for worlwind trip through tech and you can

1226
01:02:23,080 --> 01:02:25,680
Speaker 1: check out all of your reviews at which doctor dot

1227
01:02:25,720 --> 01:02:26,720
Speaker 1: co dot nz.

1228
01:02:27,080 --> 01:02:27,640
Speaker 2: So you're there.

1229
01:02:27,720 --> 01:02:28,840
Speaker 1: Thanks so much for coming on.

1230
01:02:29,040 --> 01:02:29,840
Speaker 2: Happy to be here.

1231
01:02:39,280 --> 01:02:42,240
Speaker 1: Pewh. Well, that's it for the final episode of the

1232
01:02:42,280 --> 01:02:45,440
Speaker 1: Business of Tech for twenty twenty five. A huge thanks

1233
01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:48,160
Speaker 1: to Pat Pilcher for taking us on that whirlwind ride

1234
01:02:48,240 --> 01:02:53,400
Speaker 1: through AI hype and reality, the streaming squeeze, ev growing pains,

1235
01:02:53,480 --> 01:02:57,480
Speaker 1: and the revolutionary gadgets that actually changed how we lived

1236
01:02:57,600 --> 01:03:01,200
Speaker 1: this year. Incidentally, just after we were recorded this episode,

1237
01:03:01,240 --> 01:03:05,000
Speaker 1: Panasonic announced that it's pulling out of the TV market

1238
01:03:05,040 --> 01:03:07,560
Speaker 1: in New Zealand, which is a real shame, but it

1239
01:03:07,680 --> 01:03:09,840
Speaker 1: sort of does go to show how fast things are

1240
01:03:09,920 --> 01:03:12,240
Speaker 1: moving in tech and the big names we know so

1241
01:03:12,360 --> 01:03:16,000
Speaker 1: well now from the past won't necessarily be the big

1242
01:03:16,080 --> 01:03:18,439
Speaker 1: names of the future. If you want to deeper dive

1243
01:03:18,600 --> 01:03:20,760
Speaker 1: into any of the gear and trends we talk about.

1244
01:03:20,840 --> 01:03:23,760
Speaker 1: You can read Pats reviews and commentary over at which

1245
01:03:23,800 --> 01:03:27,000
Speaker 1: doctor dot co dotian zed. You'll find my own tech

1246
01:03:27,040 --> 01:03:31,160
Speaker 1: reviews in the life section at Business deesk dot co dotianz.

1247
01:03:31,600 --> 01:03:34,240
Speaker 1: If you enjoyed the episode, follow or subscribe to the

1248
01:03:34,240 --> 01:03:37,040
Speaker 1: Business of Tech, leave a rating or review, and share

1249
01:03:37,080 --> 01:03:39,880
Speaker 1: it with someone you spent too much money on tech

1250
01:03:39,920 --> 01:03:42,360
Speaker 1: this year and needs to know what is coming next.

1251
01:03:42,760 --> 01:03:46,360
Speaker 1: Thanks so much for listening all year forty nine episodes.

1252
01:03:46,400 --> 01:03:50,720
Speaker 1: We're here every week delivering tech insights and interviews with

1253
01:03:51,000 --> 01:03:54,240
Speaker 1: some of our best tech leaders, so I'd love to

1254
01:03:54,280 --> 01:03:56,520
Speaker 1: have you back next year. Thanks so much to two

1255
01:03:56,520 --> 01:03:59,840
Speaker 1: degrees for continuing to sponsor us into our third season,

1256
01:04:00,040 --> 01:04:03,200
Speaker 1: hopefully into our fourth as well. Have a great Christmas,

1257
01:04:03,240 --> 01:04:05,520
Speaker 1: a new year, and I'll see you in twenty twenty

1258
01:04:05,560 --> 01:04:08,120
Speaker 1: six as we find out whether the robots really do

1259
01:04:08,320 --> 01:04:12,640
Speaker 1: take over the housework and hopefully nothing more. All the

1260
01:04:12,720 --> 01:04:14,000
Speaker 1: best for the year ahead.