1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:03,440 Speaker 1: Now we've got the annual Grocery report out today. It 2 00:00:03,520 --> 00:00:05,880 Speaker 1: shows that we pay the fifth most in the world, 3 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:08,600 Speaker 1: in the developed world, at least for groceries, and it 4 00:00:08,640 --> 00:00:11,800 Speaker 1: shows that food stuff's had a higher profit percentage than 5 00:00:11,840 --> 00:00:15,560 Speaker 1: international supermarkets like Walmart, Tesco and Sainsbury's. P Van Headon 6 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:17,440 Speaker 1: is the Grocery commissioner. 7 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:20,919 Speaker 2: Hype here, good afternoon, ether, How is it that they. 8 00:00:20,800 --> 00:00:24,239 Speaker 1: Are making more, at least in terms of profit percentage 9 00:00:24,239 --> 00:00:25,400 Speaker 1: than the likes of Walmart. 10 00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:31,160 Speaker 2: Well, what the report shows is that the gross margins 11 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:34,720 Speaker 2: have actually stabilized after years of increasing, so that at 12 00:00:34,800 --> 00:00:37,920 Speaker 2: least is a good sign that there is some progress. 13 00:00:38,640 --> 00:00:42,680 Speaker 2: But competition is needed in order to bring those margins 14 00:00:42,720 --> 00:00:46,440 Speaker 2: down further. And you know that's why we so focused 15 00:00:46,520 --> 00:00:51,040 Speaker 2: on using all the tools we have available to ensure 16 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:54,160 Speaker 2: that we do get competition going in the market for 17 00:00:54,200 --> 00:00:55,120 Speaker 2: the long term. 18 00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:58,160 Speaker 1: Okay, when you calculate that we pay the fifth highest 19 00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:01,840 Speaker 1: for groceries in the developed world, is it like full like? 20 00:01:01,840 --> 00:01:01,960 Speaker 2: Like? 21 00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 1: Are we are we including? For example, somebody's pointed out 22 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:08,039 Speaker 1: on the texts that alcohol is not included in Australia 23 00:01:08,080 --> 00:01:10,200 Speaker 1: because they cannot sell alcohol in the supermarkets. Are we 24 00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 1: counting it as part of our purchase. 25 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 2: Here. The OECD have got a basket that they compare 26 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:18,400 Speaker 2: and those are the figures that we use. So I 27 00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 2: believe it is apples for apples. 28 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:23,920 Speaker 1: So it's not about it's it is looking at if 29 00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:25,480 Speaker 1: you if you're buying your milk and your cheese and 30 00:01:25,520 --> 00:01:29,640 Speaker 1: your broccoli and your toast whatever, how much A costs 31 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:31,120 Speaker 1: here versus how much A costs elsewhere. 32 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 2: That's my understanding of those CE report yests. 33 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:36,360 Speaker 1: Now, peer, what are we going to do about this? 34 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 2: Well? Here that when I look at the report, you know, 35 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:44,920 Speaker 2: there's there's signs of progress, but there's still a long 36 00:01:44,959 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 2: way to go. Are no consumers are struggling out out there. 37 00:01:50,440 --> 00:01:52,640 Speaker 2: But we've got to remember that this regime was put 38 00:01:52,680 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 2: in place to ensure that we get long term competition 39 00:01:55,560 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 2: that's sustainable and also efficiency in the industry. I don't 40 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:03,000 Speaker 2: have the tools to get short term results. It is 41 00:02:03,040 --> 00:02:05,680 Speaker 2: a long game, as I've said all along, and there's 42 00:02:05,720 --> 00:02:09,320 Speaker 2: no one silver bullet. You know, you've mentioned before the 43 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:14,600 Speaker 2: different tools that we use. As Grocery Commissioner, I'm involved 44 00:02:14,639 --> 00:02:17,360 Speaker 2: in every one of those areas. So whether it's the 45 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:21,440 Speaker 2: Commerce Act, Fair Trading Act or the Grocery Industry Competition 46 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:26,480 Speaker 2: Act that we use to enforce things with. I'm involved 47 00:02:26,480 --> 00:02:29,960 Speaker 2: across all of those to ensure consistency and that we 48 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:33,120 Speaker 2: have the focus on the whole industry. It's a twenty 49 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:36,640 Speaker 2: eight billion dollar industry which hasn't changed for a long time. 50 00:02:37,200 --> 00:02:40,800 Speaker 2: But I'm seeing signs that there's some behavioral change happening. 51 00:02:41,080 --> 00:02:43,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, is that going to be enough? Or do we are? 52 00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 1: We actually relying quite heavily on whatever it is that 53 00:02:45,520 --> 00:02:47,960 Speaker 1: Nicola Willis announces in the next few weeks. 54 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:53,120 Speaker 2: Well, whatever the government is doing is in addition to 55 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:57,320 Speaker 2: what we're doing. Our report will help inform the government 56 00:02:57,520 --> 00:03:00,880 Speaker 2: on what the current state is said last year, it 57 00:03:00,919 --> 00:03:03,799 Speaker 2: looks at this year, and it informs them of all 58 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:06,760 Speaker 2: of that. And then they coming back where did they 59 00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 2: take them away. 60 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:09,680 Speaker 1: Ahead of this big announcement that we're now all waiting for. 61 00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:11,360 Speaker 1: Has she come to you guys and ask for some 62 00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:12,399 Speaker 1: help with ideas. 63 00:03:14,240 --> 00:03:16,840 Speaker 2: We meet with the Minister regularly as well as with 64 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:21,520 Speaker 2: MB and provide them with insights and information from the industry, 65 00:03:21,520 --> 00:03:24,720 Speaker 2: But the policy basically sits with the government. 66 00:03:25,280 --> 00:03:27,120 Speaker 1: What is the idea that you've told her would be 67 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:27,799 Speaker 1: the best idea. 68 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 2: Well, we wouldn't go into detail with that because we 69 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:36,680 Speaker 2: basically meet confidentially with the minister has given what is 70 00:03:36,760 --> 00:03:38,600 Speaker 2: happening in the industry. 71 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:42,040 Speaker 1: Have you given? Have you given her ideas? 72 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:46,280 Speaker 2: We've spoken about where the industry is at at the 73 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:50,720 Speaker 2: moment and what is required in order to get structural 74 00:03:50,840 --> 00:03:52,120 Speaker 2: change within the industry. 75 00:03:52,200 --> 00:03:53,920 Speaker 1: How hard do you reckon she's going to go? I mean, 76 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:56,480 Speaker 1: are we talking about significant stuff that's going to make 77 00:03:56,520 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 1: a real difference or are we just talking about tinkering here. 78 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:02,840 Speaker 2: Well, that's something that you'll need to ask the Minister 79 00:04:03,240 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 2: and the government about. You know, we very focused on 80 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:10,640 Speaker 2: making sure we're doing everything in our power to use 81 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:13,560 Speaker 2: every single tool we have to get change. 82 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:16,640 Speaker 1: If she just did tinkering, would that be sufficient? 83 00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:22,200 Speaker 2: Well, again, you know, that's a decision that the government 84 00:04:22,240 --> 00:04:25,920 Speaker 2: of the day makes. I'm here to make sure that 85 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:29,120 Speaker 2: whatever tools I've got to use them to the best effect. 86 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:32,800 Speaker 2: And as I said in this report, we can see 87 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:36,799 Speaker 2: some progress being made and that will help us inform 88 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:38,560 Speaker 2: us where to focus on. 89 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:40,560 Speaker 1: As a result, I'm trying to get a handle of 90 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:43,000 Speaker 1: kind of what it is, how big the problem is, 91 00:04:43,320 --> 00:04:45,560 Speaker 1: and how big we have to go to fix it, Like, 92 00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:47,839 Speaker 1: are we talking about a problem that is so big 93 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:51,160 Speaker 1: that we need I don't know, some false divestment here 94 00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:54,560 Speaker 1: or some structural breakoup. Is that what we're dealing with? 95 00:04:56,240 --> 00:04:59,040 Speaker 2: Well, I think you're aware that the problem is big. 96 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:05,120 Speaker 2: Kiwis are struggling. We don't have enough competition in the market. 97 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:08,880 Speaker 2: We are one of the countries in the world with 98 00:05:08,960 --> 00:05:12,279 Speaker 2: the least amount of competition in the superharer market industry, 99 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:15,359 Speaker 2: and that is why some of these unique tools have 100 00:05:15,440 --> 00:05:19,240 Speaker 2: been brought in to try and ensure that we focus 101 00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:22,160 Speaker 2: on how do we get that change going and then 102 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:23,960 Speaker 2: it's up to the policy makers. 103 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:28,000 Speaker 1: So big, big problem equals must have big a big solution, 104 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:30,200 Speaker 1: basically a big fix to fix it. Now, do you 105 00:05:30,240 --> 00:05:32,120 Speaker 1: have any idea what she's going to announce? 106 00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:38,360 Speaker 2: No, we haven't been taken into confidence on the government's announcements, 107 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:42,240 Speaker 2: and you know that is something that they will determine 108 00:05:42,240 --> 00:05:43,240 Speaker 2: when they announced that. 109 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:46,480 Speaker 1: Interesting. Hey, peer, Thanks very much, Pervnhead and Grocery Commissioner. 110 00:05:47,520 --> 00:05:50,680 Speaker 1: For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to 111 00:05:50,800 --> 00:05:53,839 Speaker 1: news talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow 112 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:55,640 Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio.