1 00:00:06,667 --> 00:00:10,387 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Sport Podcast with Jason Fine 2 00:00:10,707 --> 00:00:11,787 Speaker 1: from Newstalk zed B. 3 00:00:12,907 --> 00:00:16,267 Speaker 2: One of the greatest rugby players ever to play the game, 4 00:00:17,107 --> 00:00:17,427 Speaker 2: five and. 5 00:00:17,467 --> 00:00:19,547 Speaker 3: Arriving touchline side back to the open left. 6 00:00:19,587 --> 00:00:25,907 Speaker 4: Rynan callaher midway point, Satim and Cologne. Look Sam, it's 7 00:00:25,947 --> 00:00:30,947 Speaker 4: a Pata ray for the All Blacks Semifinals day head 8 00:00:30,987 --> 00:00:36,707 Speaker 4: egg for the Semifinals. Nearly forty fasites Beta fans. 9 00:00:36,507 --> 00:00:38,627 Speaker 2: Now one of the most famous steals in All Blacks 10 00:00:38,707 --> 00:00:42,707 Speaker 2: rugby history. Rugby World Cup quarterfinal against Ireland last year. 11 00:00:42,987 --> 00:00:44,747 Speaker 2: Having debut for the All Blacks at the age of 12 00:00:44,747 --> 00:00:48,227 Speaker 2: twenty one, Sam Whitelock last year became the first and 13 00:00:48,267 --> 00:00:50,947 Speaker 2: so far the only All Black to reach one hundred 14 00:00:50,947 --> 00:00:54,227 Speaker 2: and fifty test caps. He finished on one hundred and 15 00:00:54,307 --> 00:00:58,187 Speaker 2: fifty three, the second highest by any international player, and 16 00:00:58,227 --> 00:01:00,947 Speaker 2: he captained the All Blacks in eighteen of those test matches. 17 00:01:01,307 --> 00:01:04,547 Speaker 2: He played twenty six Rugby World Cup games, more than 18 00:01:04,627 --> 00:01:08,587 Speaker 2: any other player, and appeared to three Rugby World Cup finals. 19 00:01:08,587 --> 00:01:13,267 Speaker 2: He's won eleven Try Nations Championships and never been in 20 00:01:13,307 --> 00:01:16,467 Speaker 2: an All Black side that relinquished the Bledisloe Cup. He 21 00:01:16,547 --> 00:01:20,067 Speaker 2: also played one hundred and eighty one times for the Crusaders, 22 00:01:20,387 --> 00:01:25,587 Speaker 2: winning seven Super Rugby titles. Samuel Whitelock's autobiography is out. 23 00:01:25,667 --> 00:01:29,387 Speaker 2: It's called View from the Second Row. Samuel white Lock 24 00:01:29,547 --> 00:01:31,467 Speaker 2: is with us. Great to chat to you, Sam. How 25 00:01:31,547 --> 00:01:33,187 Speaker 2: happy are you with the way the books come out? 26 00:01:33,867 --> 00:01:36,867 Speaker 3: Yeah? Really happy. You know a lot of time and 27 00:01:36,947 --> 00:01:39,027 Speaker 3: if it went into it, obviously went through it like 28 00:01:40,387 --> 00:01:42,787 Speaker 3: you know, with a fine tooth co and making sure 29 00:01:42,827 --> 00:01:45,587 Speaker 3: there was nothing in there that wasn't correct or wasn't 30 00:01:46,707 --> 00:01:48,867 Speaker 3: my true feelings. So it took a bit of time 31 00:01:48,867 --> 00:01:51,187 Speaker 3: to do the interviews with Dylan, but also so much 32 00:01:51,187 --> 00:01:53,907 Speaker 3: time to reread it and make sure everything was where 33 00:01:53,907 --> 00:01:54,587 Speaker 3: I wanted it to be. 34 00:01:55,187 --> 00:01:58,827 Speaker 2: It's a terrific greed. I enjoyed it very much, not 35 00:01:58,867 --> 00:02:01,467 Speaker 2: just the rugby stuff, but a lot of the formative 36 00:02:01,467 --> 00:02:04,787 Speaker 2: stuff as well. How much of the person you are 37 00:02:04,827 --> 00:02:08,427 Speaker 2: today and the rugby player became can be put down 38 00:02:08,467 --> 00:02:09,267 Speaker 2: to your upbringing. 39 00:02:10,547 --> 00:02:13,507 Speaker 3: Yeah. The upbringing is definitely the big part of it, 40 00:02:13,547 --> 00:02:16,187 Speaker 3: and that's something that I definitely wanted to have shined 41 00:02:16,227 --> 00:02:19,067 Speaker 3: through in the book. And the main thing is having 42 00:02:19,107 --> 00:02:21,627 Speaker 3: four boys under five years on a dairy farm and 43 00:02:21,667 --> 00:02:24,707 Speaker 3: the men or two. That's going to cause chaos, and 44 00:02:24,747 --> 00:02:26,507 Speaker 3: it's going to be full on and there's going to 45 00:02:26,507 --> 00:02:28,427 Speaker 3: be tears, there's going to be cuts and bruises and 46 00:02:28,427 --> 00:02:30,547 Speaker 3: a bit of blood here and there. So I wanted 47 00:02:30,547 --> 00:02:33,267 Speaker 3: to make sure that people understood that's, you know, what 48 00:02:33,307 --> 00:02:37,267 Speaker 3: my upbringing was, and that's hopefully come through in the book. 49 00:02:37,307 --> 00:02:40,427 Speaker 3: There's a few photos there of us growing up and 50 00:02:40,707 --> 00:02:43,267 Speaker 3: me being the tall, skinny kid. So there's a couple 51 00:02:43,267 --> 00:02:46,987 Speaker 3: of photos there, probably not the most glamorous, but that's 52 00:02:47,067 --> 00:02:50,587 Speaker 3: just what it was, so true representation of being a 53 00:02:50,587 --> 00:02:51,667 Speaker 3: country kid in New Zealand. 54 00:02:51,787 --> 00:02:53,427 Speaker 2: I think that's what a lot of people enjoy when 55 00:02:53,467 --> 00:02:56,107 Speaker 2: they read books about people they've only ever seen it, 56 00:02:56,187 --> 00:02:59,267 Speaker 2: you know, at the adult stage of their lives, seeing 57 00:02:59,467 --> 00:03:01,187 Speaker 2: what was what a tam you're white look look like 58 00:03:01,227 --> 00:03:03,947 Speaker 2: as a kid. Some great haircuts, mate. 59 00:03:04,907 --> 00:03:09,347 Speaker 3: Yeah, there's my hair's falling out now. But back in 60 00:03:09,387 --> 00:03:10,947 Speaker 3: the day, I used to love having their bowl cut. 61 00:03:10,987 --> 00:03:13,947 Speaker 3: I think it was called I had had the longer here. 62 00:03:14,747 --> 00:03:16,707 Speaker 3: My older brother loves shaving off before I went to 63 00:03:17,147 --> 00:03:20,187 Speaker 3: boarding school. So I think mum's actually got a bit 64 00:03:20,187 --> 00:03:21,947 Speaker 3: of it at home somewhere, which sounds a bit creepy, 65 00:03:21,987 --> 00:03:24,267 Speaker 3: but she couldn't give up the long hair. 66 00:03:24,787 --> 00:03:28,907 Speaker 2: When did rugby become something that really moved to the 67 00:03:28,947 --> 00:03:31,187 Speaker 2: center of your life? All close to the center of 68 00:03:31,187 --> 00:03:32,267 Speaker 2: your life. 69 00:03:33,307 --> 00:03:37,467 Speaker 3: Yeah, Rugby's always been a part of myself and the family. 70 00:03:37,667 --> 00:03:40,027 Speaker 3: So I do not remember a time where Rugby's not 71 00:03:40,627 --> 00:03:44,067 Speaker 3: you know, in the conversation, whether that's when we were younger, 72 00:03:44,187 --> 00:03:47,787 Speaker 3: when we're older, even now. No matter whenever we catch 73 00:03:47,867 --> 00:03:49,747 Speaker 3: up with any family members, whether it's mom and dad 74 00:03:49,827 --> 00:03:52,827 Speaker 3: or a brother or sister in law, Rugby always, you know, 75 00:03:52,987 --> 00:03:57,067 Speaker 3: is there in the conversation. So it's always been a 76 00:03:57,067 --> 00:04:00,627 Speaker 3: massive part of our lives. But I think when rugby 77 00:04:01,347 --> 00:04:04,347 Speaker 3: became a possibility to be, you know, make a living 78 00:04:04,387 --> 00:04:08,307 Speaker 3: out of it during that seventeen eighteen nineteen and even 79 00:04:08,307 --> 00:04:10,067 Speaker 3: now thinking about it, there's no way I thought I'd 80 00:04:10,107 --> 00:04:12,307 Speaker 3: be able to play a professional games. So to be 81 00:04:12,387 --> 00:04:15,787 Speaker 3: able to achieve what we've achieved, and now that I'm 82 00:04:15,827 --> 00:04:19,587 Speaker 3: retired at actual's sitting back and assessing and looking and 83 00:04:19,627 --> 00:04:21,707 Speaker 3: reflecting a little bit. It's ass very humbling to know 84 00:04:21,787 --> 00:04:23,467 Speaker 3: that had such an amazing career. 85 00:04:23,907 --> 00:04:26,227 Speaker 2: I think throughout your test career, you know, when you 86 00:04:26,307 --> 00:04:28,347 Speaker 2: reached miles stones and there were a lot of them 87 00:04:28,467 --> 00:04:30,907 Speaker 2: near the end in terms of you know, test appearance 88 00:04:30,947 --> 00:04:33,747 Speaker 2: records and things like that. I think often your answer was, look, 89 00:04:33,787 --> 00:04:35,547 Speaker 2: it's not the sort of thing I can think about now. 90 00:04:35,907 --> 00:04:39,307 Speaker 2: I'll look back when I'm done and probably enjoy it more. 91 00:04:39,347 --> 00:04:39,507 Speaker 3: Then. 92 00:04:39,907 --> 00:04:42,667 Speaker 2: Now that you are well, I guess, well, maybe done. 93 00:04:43,147 --> 00:04:45,587 Speaker 2: Are you able to look back with a certain degree 94 00:04:45,867 --> 00:04:47,387 Speaker 2: of pride at what you achieved? 95 00:04:49,147 --> 00:04:53,467 Speaker 3: Yeah, there's It's weird because you know, there's a lot 96 00:04:53,467 --> 00:04:55,147 Speaker 3: of guys still playing in New Zealand. At the moment 97 00:04:55,147 --> 00:04:57,707 Speaker 3: that I spent a lot of time with. The French 98 00:04:57,747 --> 00:04:59,307 Speaker 3: were still in France. At the moment the French team 99 00:04:59,307 --> 00:05:01,387 Speaker 3: that I played for, I want to watch them do 100 00:05:01,427 --> 00:05:03,387 Speaker 3: their fitness tests for twenty minutes and I was like, 101 00:05:03,387 --> 00:05:05,947 Speaker 3: oh bugg this, I'm out of here. More just showed 102 00:05:05,987 --> 00:05:08,947 Speaker 3: up to or a few people. So I'm still on 103 00:05:09,027 --> 00:05:11,147 Speaker 3: and around the rugby environment. I think when we get 104 00:05:11,187 --> 00:05:13,747 Speaker 3: home to New Zealand in a month's time and we're 105 00:05:13,787 --> 00:05:17,307 Speaker 3: on the farm and we're doing something completely different, that'll 106 00:05:17,347 --> 00:05:20,507 Speaker 3: be a time where it will sink in and I'll 107 00:05:20,507 --> 00:05:23,067 Speaker 3: probably reflect on a little bit more. I had a 108 00:05:23,107 --> 00:05:25,347 Speaker 3: few copies of the book arrived to us here in 109 00:05:25,387 --> 00:05:28,747 Speaker 3: France the other day and just seeing it in person, 110 00:05:28,867 --> 00:05:30,947 Speaker 3: looking at it open and up and looking at some 111 00:05:30,987 --> 00:05:35,187 Speaker 3: photos definitely did get the reflection piece going. But it's 112 00:05:35,187 --> 00:05:38,147 Speaker 3: still probably a little bit earlier to really assess what 113 00:05:38,227 --> 00:05:38,627 Speaker 3: we've done. 114 00:05:38,947 --> 00:05:41,107 Speaker 2: It was a bit of chatter earlier this year about 115 00:05:41,147 --> 00:05:44,067 Speaker 2: the possibility of an early return. It would have been 116 00:05:44,147 --> 00:05:47,747 Speaker 2: very early return from retirement. Were you ever close to 117 00:05:48,947 --> 00:05:52,307 Speaker 2: coming back and playing for the All Blacks under Scott Robertson. 118 00:05:53,267 --> 00:05:55,907 Speaker 3: Yeah, the desire is always going to be there, and 119 00:05:56,027 --> 00:05:58,307 Speaker 3: I think if you talk to any rugby player that's 120 00:05:58,307 --> 00:06:02,147 Speaker 3: played for the All Blacks or potentially was close, there's 121 00:06:02,147 --> 00:06:03,947 Speaker 3: always that little bit of you that will go, yep, 122 00:06:04,347 --> 00:06:07,187 Speaker 3: if the phone rings are definitely answer and have a 123 00:06:07,227 --> 00:06:10,507 Speaker 3: really good conversation with the kids and my wife around, 124 00:06:10,787 --> 00:06:12,707 Speaker 3: you know, is that something that we need to do. 125 00:06:13,507 --> 00:06:15,667 Speaker 3: So I think that's always going to be there. And 126 00:06:15,867 --> 00:06:18,187 Speaker 3: talking to some other great players that I played with, 127 00:06:18,227 --> 00:06:20,387 Speaker 3: I think their desire is always there as well. So 128 00:06:22,027 --> 00:06:24,427 Speaker 3: it's a hard one because you've got to walk away 129 00:06:24,467 --> 00:06:26,867 Speaker 3: at some stage, whether you're told you're done or whether 130 00:06:26,947 --> 00:06:30,587 Speaker 3: you pull the pen yourself. So just kind of going 131 00:06:30,587 --> 00:06:31,387 Speaker 3: through all that at the moment. 132 00:06:31,587 --> 00:06:34,147 Speaker 2: So so are you done? 133 00:06:34,387 --> 00:06:37,267 Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I'm definitely finished. But you know, I think 134 00:06:37,307 --> 00:06:42,227 Speaker 3: it was big Lahore got the sos and you know 135 00:06:42,307 --> 00:06:45,227 Speaker 3: he left the farm and when you played a tessmatch. 136 00:06:45,267 --> 00:06:47,147 Speaker 3: I think it's a little bit different now with being 137 00:06:47,147 --> 00:06:49,547 Speaker 3: professional rather than just being fed on the farm. So 138 00:06:50,427 --> 00:06:52,107 Speaker 3: we are done at the stage. 139 00:06:52,227 --> 00:06:53,987 Speaker 2: You devote for the ald Blacks as a twenty one 140 00:06:54,067 --> 00:06:57,547 Speaker 2: year old looking back now, did you feel ready for 141 00:06:57,587 --> 00:06:59,787 Speaker 2: test rugby? 142 00:07:00,667 --> 00:07:04,947 Speaker 3: Probably not. I think the best thing I had is 143 00:07:04,987 --> 00:07:08,427 Speaker 3: I had the ideal and production. I had three really 144 00:07:08,427 --> 00:07:12,827 Speaker 3: good coaches with Ted Smith and Chad. They really looked 145 00:07:12,867 --> 00:07:15,467 Speaker 3: after me. They never threw me in the deep end 146 00:07:15,747 --> 00:07:17,587 Speaker 3: I played. I think it was my first team met 147 00:07:17,947 --> 00:07:20,787 Speaker 3: whose teen Test matches off the bench, so most I 148 00:07:20,827 --> 00:07:23,187 Speaker 3: played was around twenty twenty five minutes. I never really 149 00:07:23,187 --> 00:07:27,027 Speaker 3: got exposed to the brutality of it for more than 150 00:07:27,067 --> 00:07:30,347 Speaker 3: that time, and it was a time for me to 151 00:07:30,387 --> 00:07:33,467 Speaker 3: allow my body to grow, get bigger and stronger and 152 00:07:33,547 --> 00:07:37,627 Speaker 3: actually build up my defenses. And there was pretty much 153 00:07:37,627 --> 00:07:40,867 Speaker 3: the ideal way to be introduced to test match footy 154 00:07:40,987 --> 00:07:43,507 Speaker 3: rather than throwing the deep end, get hurt and then 155 00:07:44,147 --> 00:07:45,147 Speaker 3: you're dealing with an injury. 156 00:07:45,147 --> 00:07:47,987 Speaker 2: From then on, How long did it take you to 157 00:07:48,147 --> 00:07:52,307 Speaker 2: feel at home comfortable in the all blacks environment? 158 00:07:54,187 --> 00:07:57,867 Speaker 3: I probably never feel felt one hundred percent comfortable because 159 00:07:57,867 --> 00:08:01,227 Speaker 3: I always knew you're only one performance away from being 160 00:08:01,267 --> 00:08:05,347 Speaker 3: the last. But in saying that, obviously was around the environment, 161 00:08:05,427 --> 00:08:07,747 Speaker 3: got to know the people, got to know what was 162 00:08:07,787 --> 00:08:10,467 Speaker 3: expected of me, what was expected of being an all Black, 163 00:08:10,587 --> 00:08:14,067 Speaker 3: and then obviously being a senior a black. So that 164 00:08:14,227 --> 00:08:17,467 Speaker 3: side of it grew as I was there, but it 165 00:08:17,507 --> 00:08:20,227 Speaker 3: took a little while to kind of call myself in 166 00:08:20,267 --> 00:08:22,707 Speaker 3: all black. I still feel we're saying it now even 167 00:08:22,707 --> 00:08:25,707 Speaker 3: though I have been around the environment so long, because 168 00:08:26,307 --> 00:08:28,307 Speaker 3: it was exactly that. It was a childhood dream and 169 00:08:28,507 --> 00:08:30,947 Speaker 3: having a chance to do it for so many years 170 00:08:31,067 --> 00:08:34,827 Speaker 3: is very, very humbling, and it was an absolute privilege. 171 00:08:34,907 --> 00:08:37,147 Speaker 2: The word you use before to describe test rugby was 172 00:08:37,187 --> 00:08:40,387 Speaker 2: the brutality of test rugby, and certainly in your position, 173 00:08:40,427 --> 00:08:46,067 Speaker 2: the physicality required at test level, how much of being 174 00:08:46,067 --> 00:08:48,747 Speaker 2: able to do that test after test, week after week 175 00:08:48,827 --> 00:08:53,147 Speaker 2: subject your body to some massive collisions is a mental thing. 176 00:08:54,787 --> 00:08:58,987 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's mental and physical. So, like my introduction was 177 00:08:59,027 --> 00:09:00,907 Speaker 3: great because I was I think it was one hundred 178 00:09:00,907 --> 00:09:03,147 Speaker 3: and six kgs where they wanted me around there one 179 00:09:03,187 --> 00:09:06,267 Speaker 3: hundred and fourteen, one hundred and fifteen. So the biggest 180 00:09:06,507 --> 00:09:09,147 Speaker 3: thing for myself for those first couple of months was 181 00:09:09,227 --> 00:09:13,147 Speaker 3: just eat, eat food, protein, get bigger and stronger, because 182 00:09:13,427 --> 00:09:16,747 Speaker 3: I would have broken. And once you get your body 183 00:09:16,787 --> 00:09:18,667 Speaker 3: to it at state where you know that you can 184 00:09:18,667 --> 00:09:21,747 Speaker 3: withstand those collisions, then it comes down to a mental game. 185 00:09:21,747 --> 00:09:23,867 Speaker 3: Like you've said, it's been able to back it up 186 00:09:23,947 --> 00:09:26,827 Speaker 3: time and a time again, and when you're playing week in, 187 00:09:26,907 --> 00:09:29,187 Speaker 3: week out, you've got bruises and cuts from the week 188 00:09:29,227 --> 00:09:31,507 Speaker 3: before and you've just got to find a way to 189 00:09:31,547 --> 00:09:34,227 Speaker 3: get out there and deal with it. And I think 190 00:09:34,227 --> 00:09:35,907 Speaker 3: that's the best thing about New Zealand, and they do look 191 00:09:35,947 --> 00:09:39,187 Speaker 3: after the player. We don't play too much rugby, so 192 00:09:39,227 --> 00:09:41,667 Speaker 3: you do have little blocks you can look at and 193 00:09:41,667 --> 00:09:43,547 Speaker 3: go okay, about five big weeks here, then I'm going 194 00:09:43,587 --> 00:09:46,067 Speaker 3: to get a week off. So that's an easy way 195 00:09:46,107 --> 00:09:48,467 Speaker 3: to break it down rather than look at it as 196 00:09:48,547 --> 00:09:49,227 Speaker 3: a whole season. 197 00:09:49,227 --> 00:09:51,627 Speaker 2: And one when do you reckon you were playing your 198 00:09:51,627 --> 00:09:55,827 Speaker 2: best rugby? When were you at your absolute peak? 199 00:09:57,547 --> 00:10:00,027 Speaker 3: I don't actually know. That's probably for everyone else to 200 00:10:00,067 --> 00:10:02,507 Speaker 3: make that decision, but I felt like I was still 201 00:10:02,507 --> 00:10:05,787 Speaker 3: playing really, really good rugby right up to the end 202 00:10:05,787 --> 00:10:08,027 Speaker 3: of my career. So there was one thing I was 203 00:10:08,067 --> 00:10:10,707 Speaker 3: definitely aware of. I didn't want to be the guy 204 00:10:10,747 --> 00:10:13,267 Speaker 3: out there that you know, the father would said his son, 205 00:10:13,427 --> 00:10:14,747 Speaker 3: see that guy out there, he used to be a 206 00:10:14,747 --> 00:10:20,107 Speaker 3: good player. I really wanted to finish and play to 207 00:10:20,187 --> 00:10:22,747 Speaker 3: a really high standard my whole career, and I would 208 00:10:22,787 --> 00:10:24,787 Speaker 3: like to say that I did that, but yet again 209 00:10:24,827 --> 00:10:25,947 Speaker 3: that's not my decision to make. 210 00:10:26,227 --> 00:10:29,187 Speaker 2: Well, I think most observers would say that that was 211 00:10:29,187 --> 00:10:33,827 Speaker 2: absolutely the case. Twenty eleven Rugby World Cup Final, subbed 212 00:10:33,867 --> 00:10:35,707 Speaker 2: off with thirty minutes to go. You said you hate 213 00:10:35,707 --> 00:10:38,787 Speaker 2: it every minute of the rest of the game. How 214 00:10:38,827 --> 00:10:40,867 Speaker 2: do you reflect back on that night now? 215 00:10:41,987 --> 00:10:46,147 Speaker 3: Yeah, Like I said, I was twenty two, twenty three 216 00:10:46,187 --> 00:10:48,267 Speaker 3: at the time, so I was the baby of the team. 217 00:10:48,307 --> 00:10:51,307 Speaker 3: I was the guy that no one probably expected to 218 00:10:51,307 --> 00:10:55,027 Speaker 3: be there four years before, but played every game at 219 00:10:55,027 --> 00:10:57,027 Speaker 3: the World Cup. And as you found, when you're on 220 00:10:57,067 --> 00:11:00,147 Speaker 3: the field, it's fine because you have a job to do. 221 00:11:00,267 --> 00:11:03,307 Speaker 3: You obviously thinking about the Lonet calls or what you're 222 00:11:03,307 --> 00:11:05,627 Speaker 3: going to do. But once I had stepped off the field, 223 00:11:05,667 --> 00:11:07,427 Speaker 3: I knew I couldn't have an influence on the game. 224 00:11:07,467 --> 00:11:09,907 Speaker 3: I couldn't help the team because it was so loud 225 00:11:10,627 --> 00:11:13,587 Speaker 3: they couldn't hear you. So I turned into a fan 226 00:11:13,667 --> 00:11:16,387 Speaker 3: that every other key he was feeling. I felt helpless, 227 00:11:16,427 --> 00:11:19,107 Speaker 3: and I remember I tried to sit down, I stood up, 228 00:11:19,227 --> 00:11:22,067 Speaker 3: I was pacing, and there's a number of other guys 229 00:11:22,107 --> 00:11:25,067 Speaker 3: doing the same. So that's where compared to the twenty 230 00:11:25,147 --> 00:11:28,707 Speaker 3: fifteen final, being on the field, it was such a 231 00:11:28,707 --> 00:11:31,707 Speaker 3: different feeling because I was actually involved, I had something 232 00:11:31,747 --> 00:11:34,587 Speaker 3: to do. I didn't have that feeling of helplessness. 233 00:11:35,947 --> 00:11:38,347 Speaker 2: As new players come into the all blacks environment and 234 00:11:38,387 --> 00:11:42,667 Speaker 2: you became a more experienced voice and presence in the 235 00:11:42,667 --> 00:11:45,907 Speaker 2: all blacks environment, how did you go about making sure 236 00:11:45,947 --> 00:11:48,747 Speaker 2: that the new players coming in were well aware of 237 00:11:48,787 --> 00:11:51,827 Speaker 2: the responsibility that they had in being an all black. 238 00:11:53,747 --> 00:11:57,027 Speaker 3: Yeah, it was something that I got set up really 239 00:11:57,067 --> 00:11:59,827 Speaker 3: well with people like Kevin me Lamu and some of 240 00:11:59,827 --> 00:12:02,827 Speaker 3: those senior guys Mills. I did a really good job 241 00:12:02,827 --> 00:12:05,867 Speaker 3: when I was first brought into the environment, and they 242 00:12:05,907 --> 00:12:10,067 Speaker 3: did it through telling stories about expectations, what was expected 243 00:12:10,067 --> 00:12:12,867 Speaker 3: and what was not. So talked around people doing it well, 244 00:12:12,867 --> 00:12:15,867 Speaker 3: but talked around people that didn't do it well. So 245 00:12:15,947 --> 00:12:18,187 Speaker 3: then as a player, it was actually really easy. Okay, 246 00:12:18,227 --> 00:12:20,467 Speaker 3: this is what's expected, this is not. Here are the 247 00:12:20,507 --> 00:12:23,107 Speaker 3: consequences of getting it right and also getting it wrong. 248 00:12:23,587 --> 00:12:25,667 Speaker 3: So it was actually really easy. And that's pretty much 249 00:12:25,667 --> 00:12:29,947 Speaker 3: how I tried to do it alongside people, and it's 250 00:12:29,947 --> 00:12:33,387 Speaker 3: always intimidating. When I first walked into the all black environment, 251 00:12:33,387 --> 00:12:36,507 Speaker 3: I was walking into a team that was really established. 252 00:12:37,307 --> 00:12:39,787 Speaker 3: Some of the legends of the game were we're there. 253 00:12:39,867 --> 00:12:43,187 Speaker 3: So I didn't say boo to a mouse where I 254 00:12:43,227 --> 00:12:44,987 Speaker 3: knew as a senior player, I had to go be 255 00:12:45,067 --> 00:12:47,827 Speaker 3: the first person to say gooday, to ask them questions 256 00:12:47,867 --> 00:12:50,547 Speaker 3: about themselves and get to know them. And once I 257 00:12:50,547 --> 00:12:52,867 Speaker 3: did that, then I could actually help influence them. What 258 00:12:52,947 --> 00:12:53,547 Speaker 3: was expected. 259 00:12:54,387 --> 00:12:56,707 Speaker 2: How challenging a year was twenty twenty two. 260 00:12:58,587 --> 00:13:02,667 Speaker 3: Yeah, it was challenging. Every year's challenging. Every year has 261 00:13:02,707 --> 00:13:06,747 Speaker 3: different highs and lows. But obviously results weren't going the 262 00:13:06,787 --> 00:13:09,787 Speaker 3: way we wanted them to go and the way we 263 00:13:09,907 --> 00:13:13,387 Speaker 3: expected and saying with our fans and our friends and family, 264 00:13:13,507 --> 00:13:17,547 Speaker 3: so that I put a bit of pressure on everyone. 265 00:13:18,187 --> 00:13:21,747 Speaker 3: The best thing through my experience experiences was I just 266 00:13:21,787 --> 00:13:26,827 Speaker 3: knew I had to concentrate on rugby and me. So 267 00:13:27,027 --> 00:13:28,787 Speaker 3: that's what I tried to do. I tried to just 268 00:13:29,387 --> 00:13:31,547 Speaker 3: concentrate on playing good rugby. I knew if I was 269 00:13:31,827 --> 00:13:35,267 Speaker 3: doing that, then everything else would sort itself out. I 270 00:13:35,347 --> 00:13:37,587 Speaker 3: was a rugby player at the time and that's what 271 00:13:37,707 --> 00:13:39,347 Speaker 3: is expected to do, So go out there and play 272 00:13:39,347 --> 00:13:42,667 Speaker 3: good rugby. And I tried to leave all the external 273 00:13:42,707 --> 00:13:47,107 Speaker 3: noise exactly is that external noise? But sometimes that's easier 274 00:13:47,147 --> 00:13:47,667 Speaker 3: said than done. 275 00:13:47,707 --> 00:13:49,667 Speaker 2: Yeah, I was going to ask there was it easier 276 00:13:49,707 --> 00:13:50,107 Speaker 2: said than that? 277 00:13:51,587 --> 00:13:56,467 Speaker 3: I think for myself, not a massive present on social 278 00:13:56,507 --> 00:13:59,627 Speaker 3: media and things like that. So I just went back 279 00:13:59,667 --> 00:14:01,747 Speaker 3: to some of my hobbies outside of rugby. So when 280 00:14:01,787 --> 00:14:04,307 Speaker 3: I was fully committed with rugby, I was all rugby. 281 00:14:04,587 --> 00:14:06,987 Speaker 3: When I needed to step away, I could do that 282 00:14:07,027 --> 00:14:08,867 Speaker 3: whether I was reading a book or dealing with some 283 00:14:08,867 --> 00:14:11,627 Speaker 3: stuff at the farm, and I think that's when I've 284 00:14:11,627 --> 00:14:14,307 Speaker 3: played my best rugby. I've had a busy life, but 285 00:14:14,387 --> 00:14:16,827 Speaker 3: it's busy in different areas as well. 286 00:14:17,907 --> 00:14:21,227 Speaker 2: So you're you're the all time leading test appearance maker 287 00:14:21,267 --> 00:14:25,027 Speaker 2: for the All Blacks. Is that a record that you're 288 00:14:25,027 --> 00:14:27,027 Speaker 2: proud of? 289 00:14:27,027 --> 00:14:30,227 Speaker 3: Of course, it's something I'm immensely proud of being able 290 00:14:30,267 --> 00:14:35,427 Speaker 3: to represent our beautiful country so many times, but at 291 00:14:35,467 --> 00:14:39,707 Speaker 3: the same time exactly that it's just numbers, so I'd 292 00:14:39,827 --> 00:14:43,587 Speaker 3: rather hear people talk around performance. Has been able to 293 00:14:43,627 --> 00:14:46,947 Speaker 3: back it up time and time again, but it is 294 00:14:46,987 --> 00:14:50,667 Speaker 3: something that's so humbling, and I hope that it's inspiring 295 00:14:50,707 --> 00:14:53,347 Speaker 3: the next generation, whether that's boys or girls, to go 296 00:14:53,387 --> 00:14:56,747 Speaker 3: out there and train hard and fall in love with 297 00:14:56,187 --> 00:14:57,787 Speaker 3: the game of rugby. 298 00:14:58,027 --> 00:14:59,907 Speaker 2: How do you Reckon Razor regards All Blacks coach. 299 00:15:01,307 --> 00:15:04,107 Speaker 3: Yeah, he's three from three at the moment. Yeah. True, 300 00:15:04,267 --> 00:15:07,187 Speaker 3: that's a perfect way to start. I'm sure he'll be 301 00:15:07,267 --> 00:15:11,387 Speaker 3: very happy with that. I know he is. So it's 302 00:15:11,387 --> 00:15:15,067 Speaker 3: going to come down to how he evolves and grows 303 00:15:15,507 --> 00:15:18,867 Speaker 3: his style of coaching, how he grows the other coaches 304 00:15:18,867 --> 00:15:22,067 Speaker 3: out of there, how he grows the leadership group, the captains, 305 00:15:22,827 --> 00:15:26,507 Speaker 3: but more importantly, the All Blacks game and the players. 306 00:15:26,507 --> 00:15:30,787 Speaker 3: So it's not an easy job. I wouldn't think a 307 00:15:30,787 --> 00:15:32,827 Speaker 3: lot of people would put their hand up to do it. 308 00:15:33,027 --> 00:15:35,187 Speaker 3: I think some would would, but maybe wouldn't do the 309 00:15:35,187 --> 00:15:38,147 Speaker 3: best of the jobs. So he's been pretty excited to 310 00:15:38,187 --> 00:15:41,907 Speaker 3: get into the season. He's been a little bit annoying 311 00:15:43,027 --> 00:15:45,547 Speaker 3: previously because he hasn't had a team to coach, but 312 00:15:46,347 --> 00:15:48,907 Speaker 3: he's right in the middle of it now and they've 313 00:15:48,907 --> 00:15:50,747 Speaker 3: got a test match coming up, so I'm sure they're 314 00:15:51,147 --> 00:15:52,587 Speaker 3: preparing as well as they can for that. 315 00:15:53,027 --> 00:15:54,387 Speaker 2: I just want to finish with a phrase in the 316 00:15:54,387 --> 00:15:57,627 Speaker 2: book that I absolutely loved, and it's fairly simple. Darkening 317 00:15:57,667 --> 00:16:02,347 Speaker 2: the jersey. Is that something that you know? I mean, 318 00:16:02,627 --> 00:16:05,027 Speaker 2: I'm not going to ask you darkened the jersey? How 319 00:16:05,067 --> 00:16:06,867 Speaker 2: proud are you of the fact that you did that? 320 00:16:08,587 --> 00:16:12,427 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a bit of a different saying, obviously, as 321 00:16:12,507 --> 00:16:15,387 Speaker 3: Kiwi's we were black and it's awesome watching the Olympians 322 00:16:15,387 --> 00:16:16,947 Speaker 3: out there at the moment with their black on and 323 00:16:16,987 --> 00:16:20,067 Speaker 3: the silver fern on their chest and then representing all 324 00:16:20,107 --> 00:16:24,027 Speaker 3: of us. So as Kiwi's darkening the jersey is actually 325 00:16:24,107 --> 00:16:28,067 Speaker 3: the highest compliment you can receive. And hearing people say 326 00:16:28,067 --> 00:16:31,867 Speaker 3: that it was one thing definitely wanted to put in 327 00:16:31,907 --> 00:16:35,707 Speaker 3: the book around the feeling you get when you hear 328 00:16:36,347 --> 00:16:39,067 Speaker 3: some of those special words, You know you've taken the 329 00:16:39,107 --> 00:16:42,347 Speaker 3: jersey and put it in a better spot. So pretty 330 00:16:42,347 --> 00:16:46,787 Speaker 3: cool to have that, you know, those we said about myself. 331 00:16:47,387 --> 00:16:49,867 Speaker 2: It's a great read, Samuel, I really enjoyed it. Samuel 332 00:16:49,867 --> 00:16:52,707 Speaker 2: white Lock View from the second Row available wherever you 333 00:16:52,747 --> 00:16:55,387 Speaker 2: get good books right now. So you're still in France, 334 00:16:55,507 --> 00:16:57,787 Speaker 2: back home at some stage soon and then what does 335 00:16:57,827 --> 00:17:00,267 Speaker 2: the next little while look like for Samuel white Lock 336 00:17:00,307 --> 00:17:00,747 Speaker 2: in the family. 337 00:17:01,747 --> 00:17:05,067 Speaker 3: Yep, so we are. I think we have twenty odd 338 00:17:05,107 --> 00:17:07,307 Speaker 3: days left here and the side of the world. We've 339 00:17:07,347 --> 00:17:09,587 Speaker 3: got a bit of a ticky tour through the south 340 00:17:09,627 --> 00:17:12,707 Speaker 3: of England and then onto the plane, flying back into 341 00:17:12,747 --> 00:17:15,427 Speaker 3: christ Church for a week, picking up all the things 342 00:17:15,427 --> 00:17:17,227 Speaker 3: of left in christ Church, moving up to the farm 343 00:17:17,267 --> 00:17:20,507 Speaker 3: and Hawks Bay, and then straight into becoming a farmer 344 00:17:20,587 --> 00:17:24,187 Speaker 3: and the real world. So looking forward to getting to 345 00:17:24,187 --> 00:17:27,307 Speaker 3: know the community up there. There's plenty of jobs to 346 00:17:27,347 --> 00:17:29,587 Speaker 3: be done on the farm, so I'm sure I won't 347 00:17:29,587 --> 00:17:32,107 Speaker 3: be won't be bored and won't get into too much trouble. 348 00:17:32,507 --> 00:17:34,827 Speaker 2: Good to hear, great to chat, Samuel, Thanks for taking 349 00:17:34,827 --> 00:17:35,187 Speaker 2: the time. 350 00:17:35,827 --> 00:17:37,627 Speaker 3: Awesome cheers, Thank you very much, No, thank. 351 00:17:37,507 --> 00:17:40,307 Speaker 2: You, sam sam Whitelock. There his book is out. View 352 00:17:40,387 --> 00:17:43,587 Speaker 2: from the second row is it's really good. It's really good. 353 00:17:43,787 --> 00:17:45,547 Speaker 2: It's not just oh we played these guys and won 354 00:17:45,587 --> 00:17:48,347 Speaker 2: by this. There's a bit of that obviously, talking about 355 00:17:48,387 --> 00:17:50,987 Speaker 2: big games, but there's a lot more to it than that. 356 00:17:51,107 --> 00:17:53,907 Speaker 2: Dylan Cleaver was involved in the writing of this book 357 00:17:53,907 --> 00:17:58,667 Speaker 2: as well. Sam Whitelock view from the second row, how family, 358 00:17:58,707 --> 00:18:01,507 Speaker 2: farming and footy made a champion. 359 00:18:02,347 --> 00:18:05,507 Speaker 1: For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine. Listen live 360 00:18:05,627 --> 00:18:08,907 Speaker 1: to news talks it be weekends from midday, or follow 361 00:18:08,947 --> 00:18:10,507 Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio.