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Speaker 1: So we've got a long term plan for building more

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Speaker 1: hospital beds, twenty billion dollars worth of upgrades over an

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Speaker 1: unspecified period of time and no funding confirmed yet. But

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Speaker 1: there's a plane at least. Then there's the issue of

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Speaker 1: who's going to work in them. The minister and senior

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Speaker 1: doctors still fighting. Here's Samin Brown.

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Speaker 2: You can't complain about waiting lists whilst you're going to

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Speaker 2: make waiting lists longer. At the same time, these are

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Speaker 2: some of the most well paid public servants and what

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Speaker 2: they should be doing is going back to the negotiating table.

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Speaker 1: And here is a doctor from northvid on urn zed

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Speaker 1: last night.

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Speaker 3: He's attacking medical specialists as highly paid public servants. I

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Speaker 3: had an unsuccessful resuscitation on a trauma patient last night.

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Speaker 3: You know what has he done in the past twenty

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Speaker 3: four hours?

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Speaker 1: Rob Campbell form its yeer health endzed with us. Hey, Rob,

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Speaker 1: good morning, Yeah, good thank you. Two quick things on

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Speaker 1: the strikes before we get to the hospital beds. You've

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Speaker 1: been privy to these before. How do they end this quickly?

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Speaker 4: Well, if you've got one that is completely intransigent and

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Speaker 4: holds a lot of power to say no, and you've

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Speaker 4: got others who are trying to look after a profession.

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Speaker 4: I think it's pretty inevitable. Really, there has to be

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Speaker 4: a compromise here. I think there hopefully will be. But

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Speaker 4: these doctors don't work walkout unstruct very easily, so you

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Speaker 4: have to take it much more seriously than the minister

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Speaker 4: seems to me to be thin. Of course, these are

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Speaker 4: relatively high public, highly paid public servants. Wouldn't you expect

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Speaker 4: our salaried medicals, businesst to be that?

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Speaker 1: Well, yeah, you would. Actually, the Minister says there are

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Speaker 1: more of them now than when National took office, more

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Speaker 1: senior doctors and a lower tune. So how do I like?

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Speaker 1: These two things don't make sense. You've got the minister

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Speaker 1: saying there's more of you, but then you've got the

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Speaker 1: doctors saying it's worse.

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Speaker 4: What gives Well, I'd be inclined to believe the doctors myself.

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Speaker 4: I mean the question of churn as a statistical measure.

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Speaker 4: He's only been in power for a relatively short period

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Speaker 4: of time. I would think that whatever Gisha lying on

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Speaker 4: is pretty meaningless.

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Speaker 1: Frankly, now, the build, the twenty billion dollars and the

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Speaker 1: pipeline of work sound good.

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Speaker 4: Well, there's no news in it. I mean, it seems

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Speaker 4: to me that Simeon's a bit like Captain Cook on

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Speaker 4: his own little voyage of discovery, announcing he's discovered things

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Speaker 4: that everyone else who lived in all along. And that's

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Speaker 4: exactly what's happened here. There's no new news in this.

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Speaker 4: That list has been known for a very long time.

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Speaker 4: The issue is that successive governments haven't done much about it.

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Speaker 4: So what we have there's a list, there's no times

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Speaker 4: on it, there's no proper costing on it, there's no

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Speaker 4: evidence of why certain things have been prioritized. Are there others?

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Speaker 4: So yes, it's a list, It's a piece of paper.

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Speaker 4: Health Health New Zealand and the Ministry of Health have

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Speaker 4: been good at producing lists of paper over the years.

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Speaker 4: What they're not quite so good at is producing outcomes.

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Speaker 4: And there's just no example of it as far as

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Speaker 4: I can see.

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Speaker 1: Are we yeah at fair point because as you say,

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Speaker 1: there's no specified period, there's no funding confirmed, but they

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Speaker 1: are going to go to the private sected get some money.

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Speaker 1: Will that speed things up?

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Speaker 4: Well? It may or may not. I mean, if you

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Speaker 4: take a guarantee return to the private sector, no doubt

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Speaker 4: The private sector will pop up for it. But the

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Speaker 4: issue is designing, prioritizing, and managing these processes. There's always

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Speaker 4: money for these things from the private sector. If you

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Speaker 4: pay them enough, you know that they will pop up.

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Speaker 4: Are they the right things to do? Is it the

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Speaker 4: most efficient way? Isn't They've got no idea, they're just

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Speaker 4: kissing it.

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Speaker 1: But Rob, isn't it better that we had something pop

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Speaker 1: up rather than nothing?

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Speaker 2: Oh?

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Speaker 4: Yes, we looked. There's no question we need hospital builds.

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Speaker 4: There is at least twenty billion dollars worth of work

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Speaker 4: that needs to be done, and getting on with it

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Speaker 4: is really their priority and everyone I think in the

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Speaker 4: sector will be fully supportive of that. And indeed, the

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Speaker 4: under the right basis, it's inevitable there will be private

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Speaker 4: involvement in that. After all, there there's no one in

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Speaker 4: the state sector who's available to build these things, so

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Speaker 4: of course the private sector will be involved. There's no

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Speaker 4: point in making sort of new virtues out of things

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Speaker 4: that are just necessities. But yes, get on and do it,

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Speaker 4: as what I would.

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Speaker 1: Say here, Rob, Good to have you on the program.

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Speaker 1: As always. Rob Campbell former share at health end.

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