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Speaker 1: Got sir JK on the line with us right now. JK, hello,

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Speaker 1: how are you do? Very well? Thank you? Why is

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Speaker 1: TJ back?

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Speaker 2: Well? I think that's a really really interesting team I've

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Speaker 2: just managed to look at. I think because there's an

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Speaker 2: old All Black saying that says, you can play badly once,

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Speaker 2: but if you play badly twice, you're probably never going

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Speaker 2: to make it a game. So when I was an

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Speaker 2: All Black, one of the things we knew was that

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Speaker 2: if we had a bad day, then we'd probably get

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Speaker 2: another chance. Normally what happens is though if we had

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Speaker 2: won the other night, then you know, the guys that

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Speaker 2: played badly probably didn't wouldn't be as much highlighted. So

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Speaker 2: I think it comes back to some some old All

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Speaker 2: Black things that that I actually believe in, because I

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Speaker 2: you know, it's now up to TJ Pirenara to get

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Speaker 2: out there, and you know he'll be disappointed himself from

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Speaker 2: the game he played last week, and so he'll he'll

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Speaker 2: get out there and make amends or he'll be under

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Speaker 2: some real pressure. So that's that's probably why he's out there.

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Speaker 2: The Anton Leonard Brown one is probably your next question either,

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Speaker 2: is that correct?

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Speaker 1: I was actually to ask you about Sam Kaine and

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Speaker 1: whether he was, but give me the Anton Leonar Brown

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Speaker 1: because I think it's probably more interesting because you were

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Speaker 1: thinking about it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Look, I think I think that's a hard one.

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Speaker 2: I thought he was one of the players of the

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Speaker 2: game last week, and he's still in He's still in

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Speaker 2: the starting lineup, so that's that's probably you go, Okay,

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Speaker 2: then he's going to come on as an impact The

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Speaker 2: Sam Kaine is another really interesting one. I think that's

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Speaker 2: about his leadership. You know, I don't see Sam as

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Speaker 2: an impact player anymore. You know, back in his early

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Speaker 2: days he used to come on for Richard mccaugh and

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Speaker 2: that was cool. But I think what happened last week

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Speaker 2: is probably more around his leadership late and having that

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Speaker 2: cool head sometimes. You know, I think the last ten

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Speaker 2: or twelve minutes, and this leadership group is young, right,

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Speaker 2: so in the last ten or twelve minutes, they probably

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Speaker 2: needed an old head out there. So I think what

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Speaker 2: they'd do is they'd put him out there the last

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Speaker 2: fifteen to twenty minutes if it comes down to the wire.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean he's got a fair few

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Speaker 1: caps under his belt, right, so he will know what

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Speaker 1: to do. Jk's good to talk to you. Thank you,

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Speaker 1: Sir John Cowan, former All Black five twenty three.

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