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Speaker 1: Good afternoon. The economy grew zero point two percent in

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Speaker 1: the first quarter of this year, officially taking us out

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Speaker 1: of recession just but that figure has been propped up

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Speaker 1: by some massive immigration into the country. So the real

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Speaker 1: figure you need to look at, which is GDP per capita,

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Speaker 1: shows it actually went backwards zero point three percent. Nikola

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Speaker 1: Willis is the finance minister. Hey Nikoler, Hello Heather. That

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Speaker 1: number is so close to zero that I worry it's

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Speaker 1: going to get revised backwards. Were going to end up

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Speaker 1: in recession. What do you think the chances are?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Look, I'd rather a positive number than a negative number,

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Speaker 2: But I would be wrong to say it's all sorted. Clearly,

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Speaker 2: we have a lot of work to go. There are

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Speaker 2: going to be better times ahead for our economy. But

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Speaker 2: the numbers are telling me the same thing as the

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Speaker 2: business owners, the employers and the families are telling me,

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Speaker 2: which is it's still pretty tough out there. Inflation still

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Speaker 2: isn't under control, interst rates are high, and we haven't

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Speaker 2: got growth back yet. Good users, The government is doing

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Speaker 2: everything right. We are forecasting inflation to come back and

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Speaker 2: do b That means interstrates can drop and growth will recover.

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Speaker 2: We are doing everything we can and there are better

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Speaker 2: times for head.

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Speaker 1: Do you think that we might be through the worst

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Speaker 1: of it or close to.

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Speaker 2: I think we will feel like we're through the worst

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Speaker 2: of it when we see that first cuts to the

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Speaker 2: official cash rate. That will be the moment when people

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Speaker 2: feel some air breeze through our economy.

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Speaker 1: I'm thinking that happens in November.

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Speaker 2: What do you think, I'm thinking It's not my job

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Speaker 2: to predict that or to be seen to be trying

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Speaker 2: to influence the Reserve Bank governor on that. What we

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Speaker 2: obviously need to see is inflation under control. We've had

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Speaker 2: almost three years of it out of control. We are

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Speaker 2: feeling the long shadow of a government that mismanaged the

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Speaker 2: economy through fuel on the inflation fire, and we've had

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Speaker 2: a longer deeper inflation crisis than many other countries around

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Speaker 2: the world. Interest frates have had to go high to

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Speaker 2: sort that. Then they've now been high for a year.

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Speaker 2: That hurts. No economy can escape the pain that, So

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Speaker 2: we're now nattling down to do the work to get

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Speaker 2: inflation behind us, so the interest rates can come down

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Speaker 2: and there their bank can do its job there, and

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Speaker 2: then we've got to grow this joint. We've got to

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Speaker 2: grow this place, get productivity and investment going again. And

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Speaker 2: we're all about those things. And so we've now got

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Speaker 2: a government that's on the side of business and it's

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Speaker 2: very serious about lifting opportunity through everyone.

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Speaker 1: I know that you can't I know, you can't really

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Speaker 1: actually weigh into when the ocr cut's going to happen.

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Speaker 1: But I mean, if you look at the numbers that

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Speaker 1: we're seeing at the moment, it would be really hard

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Speaker 1: to imagine that he can keep us in this place

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Speaker 1: for a long time because things are so bad, aren't they.

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Speaker 2: Oh, there's just no doubt. There's a lot of people

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Speaker 2: who are doing it tough out there. And whether it's

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Speaker 2: families with a mortgage who are watching hundreds of dollars

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Speaker 2: without their bank account into their bank's account each fortnight,

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Speaker 2: whether it's the small businesses who are feeling fewer customers

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Speaker 2: coming through the door because they're spending all that money

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Speaker 2: on their mortgage. Across the economy, you're seeing pain. To

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Speaker 2: some extent. You could argue this is the recession that

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Speaker 2: the Reserve Bank governor admitted he was trying to engineer.

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Speaker 2: We are seeing the inflation numbers coming down. This is

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Speaker 2: the horrible hangover after the big spending party that the

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Speaker 2: last government imbacked on. It's not good, but we are

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Speaker 2: doing everything to cure it as quickly as possible so

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Speaker 2: that we can get on and grow.

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Speaker 1: While I've got you, what do you know about this

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Speaker 1: complaint that was laid over the alleged manipulation of government

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Speaker 1: bonds by a bank?

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Speaker 2: Well mesters to do with any complaints about financial markets

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Speaker 2: fit with the Financial Markets Authority. It's the them to

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Speaker 2: comment on. It's not appropriate for me to comment on

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Speaker 2: those matters.

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Speaker 1: They are not saying if they've taken any action? Do

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Speaker 1: you know if they have?

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Speaker 2: They are the only ones who are to comment on

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Speaker 2: those matters. There's a very proper separation between me as

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Speaker 2: the Minister of Finance and them. Is the Financial Market's

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Speaker 2: conduct Authority, so they look into those matters, they comment

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Speaker 2: on those matters. It's not for me to tell them

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Speaker 2: to say or to comment to musicians.

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Speaker 1: Have you had a chat to them about maybe saying

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Speaker 1: a little bit more than they are.

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Speaker 2: I haven't chatted to them. I did ask to be

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Speaker 2: updated on this matter because of course it's important to

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Speaker 2: me that new Zealand's bond markets are conducted with absolute

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Speaker 2: integrity and on the advice that I have received, I

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Speaker 2: do not think that there is any challenge with the

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Speaker 2: conduct of our bond markets.

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Speaker 1: Good stuff, Nichola, thank you very much appreciated. It's Nichola Willis,

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Speaker 1: the Finance Minister. For more from Heather Duplessy Allen Drive.

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Speaker 1: Listen live to News Talk said B from four pm weekdays,

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Speaker 1: or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.