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Speaker 1: We've got the treasuries half year scorecard yesterday. It's not pretty.

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Speaker 1: The government's books are worse than expected. The surplus timeline

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Speaker 1: has been pushed back a bit to twenty nine thirty.

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Speaker 1: That's back a year. The deficit blows out to nearly

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Speaker 1: fourteen billion dollars, one point eight billion worse than back

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Speaker 1: in May. So Nichola worse was quick to defend herself.

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Speaker 2: We have the receipts, and unfortunately for Labor, having opposed

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Speaker 2: every saving that we've delivered, they cannot take a position

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Speaker 2: of responsible fiscal management.

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Speaker 1: So Labor's economics spokesperson Barbara Vans is with us.

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Speaker 2: Hello Barbara, good morning, Andrew.

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Speaker 1: What do you say to what Nicholas said?

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Speaker 2: Oh, of course she's attacking Labor, and she's also attacking

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Speaker 2: the taxpayer union, who also said the books have gotten worse.

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Speaker 2: The alternative is is she would have to defend her books,

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Speaker 2: and they have said, what can Wes already know? Christopher

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Speaker 2: Luxe and Nicholallis have made them color?

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Speaker 1: Would you have made things better?

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Speaker 2: Absolutely? If you looked at what we had in the

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Speaker 2: pre election fiscal update, we would have been in surplus

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Speaker 2: in twenty six twenty seven. But the books don't lie.

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Speaker 2: I mean, ultimately, unemployment is forecast to get worse, growth

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Speaker 2: is weaker than expected, and food prices continue to go up,

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Speaker 2: you know, basics like bread is fifty three percent higher

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Speaker 2: over the last year.

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Speaker 1: And what would you as a government do to actually

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Speaker 1: change that? Would you cut spending? How would you cut spending?

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Speaker 1: Would you cut spending?

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Speaker 2: Well, ultimately we told them that the tax cuts were

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Speaker 2: unaffordable in the twenty three election. Also, it's all about choices.

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Speaker 2: They've decided to spend money on property speculators.

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Speaker 1: Hold on, hold you notice, bar But I said, would

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Speaker 1: you cut spending? And then you'd started talking about the

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Speaker 1: tax cuts, which is about tax We'll get onto that later.

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Speaker 1: Would you reduce the amount that that any government, if

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Speaker 1: you were running it, spends.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so that's what the forecast did show the pre

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Speaker 2: food twenty twenty three. We'd also gone through a fiscal

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Speaker 2: consolidation as well.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so you've met it already. Of course, the tax cuts,

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Speaker 1: the moving of the thresholds, you obviously would not have

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Speaker 1: done that, So that means you would have had higher

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Speaker 1: taxes than national currently has. Would you have increased taxes?

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Speaker 2: We would have kept on the same track that we

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Speaker 2: had had in twenty twenty three. That was our plan

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Speaker 2: back at the election. Ultimately, it all comes down to choices,

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Speaker 2: and they've chosen to give funding to things that don't

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Speaker 2: help every day kiwis like with the cost of living.

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Speaker 1: Okay, in the high food the cost of superannuation payments

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Speaker 1: is projected to increase from twenty four point eight billion

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Speaker 1: in twenty five to twenty six to thirty point nine

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Speaker 1: billion and twenty nine thirty. All the economists say this

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Speaker 1: is the biggest spending driver. Would you cut super No.

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Speaker 2: We've said we'd keep it at sixty five and that's

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Speaker 2: something that every party would need to take to the

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Speaker 2: election as well. New Zealanders want to be able to

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Speaker 2: plan for their retirement. Of course, obviously superannuation is part

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Speaker 2: of that house, as part of that qu we saver,

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Speaker 2: as part of that.

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Speaker 1: Okay, Well, how about this one, Working for Families tax credits.

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Speaker 1: If you abolish those, you could save three billion in

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Speaker 1: twenty five twenty six, or nearly fifteen billion over the

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Speaker 1: fore cast period. So would you cut Working for Families

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Speaker 1: tax credits?

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Speaker 2: No? Because we know right now it's really difficult for

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Speaker 2: a lot of families and they depend on their weekly

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Speaker 2: working for families. Will be working for families every week.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So how exactly would you reduce the cost of living,

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Speaker 1: which is about the only measure you've seen you do

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Speaker 1: so far. How would you do that?

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Speaker 2: So we'll set out much more of our cost of

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Speaker 2: living plan and next year as part of the election.

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Speaker 2: But we're also so far already announced, for example, that

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Speaker 2: we would look at providing three free GP visits for

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Speaker 2: people coming out.

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Speaker 1: All right, thank you, Barbara. Barbara Edmonds is Labies for

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Speaker 1: that spokesperson. For more from early edition with Ryan Bridge.

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Speaker 2: Listen live to News Talks it be from five am weekdays,

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Speaker 2: or follow the podcasts on iHeartRadio.