1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,280 Speaker 1: Deal has been done. As I mentioned Julian Assange. He 2 00:00:02,360 --> 00:00:04,880 Speaker 1: pleads guilty, having served time, and is now essentially a 3 00:00:04,960 --> 00:00:06,960 Speaker 1: free man on his way back to Australia. This is 4 00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:08,479 Speaker 1: aw all happened as I mentioned a moment ago, and 5 00:00:08,520 --> 00:00:10,760 Speaker 1: so I penned you as Commonwealth North of Guam part 6 00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:13,160 Speaker 1: of the Marianna's Of course, sith Stone is the director 7 00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:15,720 Speaker 1: of advocacy at Freedom of the Press and as well. 8 00:00:15,760 --> 00:00:19,640 Speaker 1: A safe morning to you, good morning, great to be here. 9 00:00:19,760 --> 00:00:20,560 Speaker 1: You're happy, you'll not. 10 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:26,000 Speaker 2: Well, it's a mixed bag. We're of course happy that 11 00:00:26,040 --> 00:00:29,080 Speaker 2: this saga is finally over and that there won't be 12 00:00:29,720 --> 00:00:33,519 Speaker 2: a trial of a publisher of newsworthy information for routine 13 00:00:33,640 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 2: journalistic conduct obtaining and publishing information from sources. On the 14 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:42,120 Speaker 2: other hand, it was entirely unnecessary to force a guilty 15 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 2: plea here. The Biden administration could have simply dropped the charges. 16 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:50,360 Speaker 2: This guilty plea will not set a legal precedent in 17 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:54,000 Speaker 2: the US courts. That being said, every judge and prosecutor 18 00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:56,920 Speaker 2: will be aware of it and will feel emboldened to 19 00:00:57,080 --> 00:01:01,960 Speaker 2: pursue similar constitutionally dubious case against other journalists for doing 20 00:01:01,960 --> 00:01:02,480 Speaker 2: their jobs. 21 00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:04,720 Speaker 1: If you and Julie Assange, would you have done what 22 00:01:04,800 --> 00:01:05,760 Speaker 1: he's just done. 23 00:01:08,520 --> 00:01:12,000 Speaker 2: Accepted the plea deal. Yeah, I can't fault for doing 24 00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:14,160 Speaker 2: what they need to do to get out of prison. 25 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:16,560 Speaker 2: I'm sure Julian Assange would have preferred to not have 26 00:01:16,640 --> 00:01:19,119 Speaker 2: to take a plea deal, or to plead to something 27 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 2: else besides a violation of the Espionage Act, which is 28 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:27,680 Speaker 2: an unconstitutional century old law which could have taken literally 29 00:01:27,920 --> 00:01:31,720 Speaker 2: criminalize what journalists at the world's most respected newspapers do 30 00:01:31,840 --> 00:01:35,759 Speaker 2: every day. That being said, it's far for me to 31 00:01:35,800 --> 00:01:38,040 Speaker 2: tell someone who's been in prison for five years and 32 00:01:38,080 --> 00:01:39,679 Speaker 2: wants to get out and be with their family what 33 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:40,240 Speaker 2: they should do. 34 00:01:40,440 --> 00:01:42,759 Speaker 1: What does it say about the politics? Because Baden City 35 00:01:42,880 --> 00:01:45,760 Speaker 1: was considering it. Obviously he's acted. Even Trump said he 36 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:48,200 Speaker 1: would consider What does that say about what's happening in 37 00:01:48,280 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 1: American politics? 38 00:01:51,920 --> 00:01:55,840 Speaker 2: Well, the idea that it's even something that needs to 39 00:01:55,880 --> 00:01:59,760 Speaker 2: be considered is disturbing. It should be automatic. We've got 40 00:01:59,800 --> 00:02:04,960 Speaker 2: a First Amendment here that protects the rights of journalists, publishers, 41 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:09,679 Speaker 2: essentially anybody to speak to speak freely about matters of 42 00:02:09,919 --> 00:02:12,680 Speaker 2: public concern. This is a case that should have never 43 00:02:12,720 --> 00:02:16,120 Speaker 2: been brought in the first place by the Trump administration. 44 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:21,440 Speaker 2: But everyone recognizes the Trump administration is outwardly anti press. 45 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:24,800 Speaker 2: The Bided administration purports to be something else. They purport 46 00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:27,320 Speaker 2: to be friends of the free press. So for them 47 00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:32,600 Speaker 2: to have continued this case for years before even beginning 48 00:02:32,639 --> 00:02:38,440 Speaker 2: to reportedly consider finding a way out is quite disturbing. 49 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:39,600 Speaker 2: We should have never gotten to this. 50 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:42,360 Speaker 1: Point of all the cases. And he's not the first 51 00:02:42,360 --> 00:02:45,640 Speaker 1: person who's done. He's the most celebrated and the most famous. 52 00:02:45,680 --> 00:02:47,720 Speaker 1: Of course, where do you think the story sits in 53 00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:50,840 Speaker 1: the annals of history. 54 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:54,800 Speaker 2: Well, it's the first time in the history of the 55 00:02:55,000 --> 00:03:00,240 Speaker 2: Espionage Act that a publisher of newsworthy information and as 56 00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:03,240 Speaker 2: opposed to a source or a leaker of newsworthy information, 57 00:03:03,800 --> 00:03:08,120 Speaker 2: has been prosecuted and convicted. A guilty plea is still 58 00:03:08,160 --> 00:03:13,080 Speaker 2: technically a conviction, So it's really a dark day in 59 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:18,359 Speaker 2: American history. I would say other past administrations have considered 60 00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:22,880 Speaker 2: prosecuting publishers of news under the ESPIONAJAC, but they've thought 61 00:03:22,919 --> 00:03:25,640 Speaker 2: the better of it because they've recognized the repercussions that 62 00:03:25,680 --> 00:03:30,880 Speaker 2: could have for newsworthy, legitimate journalism, the kind of investigative 63 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:33,799 Speaker 2: journalism that has led that has shaped American history, is 64 00:03:33,840 --> 00:03:37,200 Speaker 2: shaped world history to an extent. So this is a 65 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:42,920 Speaker 2: departure from that tradition and really a troubling omen for 66 00:03:42,960 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 2: how the First Amendment will be applied in the future. 67 00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:48,080 Speaker 2: If this is what Biden does, imagine what Trump would 68 00:03:48,080 --> 00:03:49,160 Speaker 2: do if he gets another term. 69 00:03:49,400 --> 00:03:52,200 Speaker 1: Sopstone, who is will us procureat? You're inside, Director of 70 00:03:52,200 --> 00:03:54,720 Speaker 1: Advocacy at Freedom All the print. 71 00:03:54,920 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 2: For more from news talks at b Listen live or 72 00:03:58,200 --> 00:04:00,920 Speaker 2: online and keep house shows we view wherever you go 73 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:03,240 Speaker 2: without podcasts on iHeartRadio.