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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Saturday Morning with Jack Teams podcast

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Speaker 1: from News Talks.

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Speaker 2: Be time to catch up with our sustainability commentator, Kate

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Speaker 2: Hall aka ethically Kate.

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Speaker 3: Game.

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Speaker 2: Yeah very well, thanks. You're about to embark on a

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Speaker 2: nationwide tour and are you still going to be all

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Speaker 2: like all over the place over the next couple of months.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, literally from Auckland, tod Topa, Wellington, Nelson, down

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Speaker 3: to Duneda and Queenstown everywhere.

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Speaker 2: Really fantastic. What are you doing?

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Speaker 3: So we're going on the South Fifth Tour. I do

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Speaker 3: a lot of work online, but I really am in

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Speaker 3: person person. So we are hosting many kind of community

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Speaker 3: focused free events that people can come along meet us,

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Speaker 3: play some picnic games, do a permaculture farm, visit with us,

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Speaker 3: you know, get stuck in a local community gardens. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: a real variety of event can come along Tom and

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Speaker 3: bring in one they want to.

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Speaker 2: That's awesome. Oh very good. Okay, Well, I look forward

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Speaker 2: to hearing about the tour as that continues. But this

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Speaker 2: morning we wanted to talk about navigating kind of differences

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Speaker 2: of philosophy or opinion when it comes to sustainability, because

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Speaker 2: I think a lot of like a lot of couples

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Speaker 2: often have one person who might be a bit more

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Speaker 2: like sustainably minded than another one, right, and it can

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Speaker 2: lead to a little bit of conflict from time to time.

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Speaker 2: Is it your experience, Yes, it is.

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Speaker 3: I mean I'm very lucky I kind of my immediate

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Speaker 3: family and to my husband on board with a lot

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Speaker 3: of things I do. But you know, I still engage

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Speaker 3: with you know, friends or people we meet at parties

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Speaker 3: or you know, distant relatives at barbecues where you know,

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Speaker 3: even if you're not the person who's standing there preaching

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Speaker 3: over a barbecue about you know, how we should look

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Speaker 3: after the planet more just by kind of existing with

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Speaker 3: those values, can we really tiresome and kind of take

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Speaker 3: that that social energy and text I get asked a

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Speaker 3: lot from people who you know, have watched a documentary

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Speaker 3: and they're really stoked to live to their to their values,

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Speaker 3: but they just come up against hard conversations which you know,

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Speaker 3: full of conflicts. No one wants that. Yeah, or just

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Speaker 3: have partners who it just drives a wedge between them. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: you know, I've had moments where, yeah, I've sometimes got

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Speaker 3: it right, sometimes got it wrong about how I navigate

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Speaker 3: different situations. Yeah, and you know, it's been eight years

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Speaker 3: of me kind of living as exul kate and sharing

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Speaker 3: about this. But I'm always trying. But I'd like to

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Speaker 3: think that I've kind of come up with some ways

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Speaker 3: that when people say, oh my gosh, you know, how

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Speaker 3: do I navigate this with my partner or my friends

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Speaker 3: or you know, like, yeah, what do I do that,

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Speaker 3: I've kind of got a bit of a handle on it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, right, Okay, So run us through some of those

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Speaker 2: tips and the start off with lead with positivity.

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Speaker 3: Yes, So one thing I find is to not point

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Speaker 3: fingers or start in a negative space, so that, for example,

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Speaker 3: is wait for the positive conversation conversation to come to you. So,

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Speaker 3: for example, instead of saying, oh my gosh, is that

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Speaker 3: shirt from Glassons? Didn't you know that is the main

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Speaker 3: fashion polluters to wait for a moment where someone says, oh,

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Speaker 3: I really like your top, and then you can talk

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Speaker 3: about you know, the ethical story behind it or the

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Speaker 3: fact that it's secondhand or you know your friends made

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Speaker 3: it for you something.

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Speaker 2: Like that, as opposed to preachy.

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Speaker 3: Totally totally, and you're you're actually waiting for other people

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Speaker 3: to kind of condone and consent to that conversation rather

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Speaker 3: than being the instigator of it, because I think that

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Speaker 3: is really tiresome. If someone has a different opinion and

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Speaker 3: they're constantly trying to push their own agenda on you,

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Speaker 3: no one wants that, Like immediately the conversation is shut down,

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Speaker 3: there's no room for talking back and forth. So lead

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Speaker 3: with a positive angle about like what good stuff is happening,

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Speaker 3: and make sure the conversation is consented by the other persons.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think if I've learned anything from from working

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Speaker 2: as a political journalist, it's that you can't kind of

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Speaker 2: shame people into nothing, you know, into lifestyle changes and

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Speaker 2: you know it changes in society more broadly, Like you

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Speaker 2: you really want to you know, you kind of you

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Speaker 2: want to bring people with you, as opposed to as

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Speaker 2: opposed to barking at them. So I think that's a

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Speaker 2: really good one. Focusing on what you control.

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Speaker 3: You can't control so exactly. You know, I can't control

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Speaker 3: the fact that my husband Tim loves Vogels Sammige bread

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Speaker 3: for his breakfast, like and sure it's in a plast bag. Absolutely,

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Speaker 3: I would have loved to have gone down to the

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Speaker 3: bakery and use my own cotton bag and you know,

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Speaker 3: for him to get bred that way, but that's something

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Speaker 3: that's his choice. I'm not. I'm not you know, reflecting

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Speaker 3: my values in his life. So again, yeah, yeah, you

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Speaker 3: have plastic got on your toast? How could you know?

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Speaker 3: So that's something that's out of my control and that's

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Speaker 3: not up to me, not up to me to change.

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Speaker 3: So I can focus on, you know, what I eat

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Speaker 3: for atfist instead, I can focus on uh, you know,

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Speaker 3: what sustainable toidet trees I have in use. I can

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Speaker 3: focus on other things that are within my control, which

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Speaker 3: I think is a really important one for people who

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Speaker 3: live with others. You know a lot of people have

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Speaker 3: flatmates or family members can get really quite frustrated at

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Speaker 3: observing unsustainable behavior every day. But that is someone else's

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Speaker 3: life and it's not up to you to judge or

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Speaker 3: control it. And I can actually guarantee if you're just

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Speaker 3: trying to control what you can and doing that in

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Speaker 3: a really positive way, people are going to see what

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Speaker 3: you're doing and probably ask you questions about it and

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Speaker 3: potentially switch to that change anywhere. So yeah, focus on

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Speaker 3: those things and that will make you feel more I guess, yeah,

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Speaker 3: less kind of anxious or upset too by the stuff

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Speaker 3: that you can't.

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Speaker 2: Then that kind of leads you to the next one.

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Speaker 2: Showing a bit of grace for others.

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Speaker 3: Totally, absolutely, and I you know, I preach this whole

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Speaker 3: don't judge, don't look at other people's supermarket shopping trolley

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Speaker 3: and things like that. But obviously, you know, when I

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Speaker 3: have learned and known so much over the last eight

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Speaker 3: years of researching and being in this space, I can't

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Speaker 3: help sometimes, you know, have a little thoughts cross my

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Speaker 3: mind around that person could just easily you know, learn

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Speaker 3: how to you know what, then go on and recycling.

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Speaker 3: Then like that's actually given grace to everyone and to yourself,

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Speaker 3: and knowing that we can only do what we can do.

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Speaker 3: It's actually not up to you know, just individuals to

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Speaker 3: make these changes. There are big corporates and government that

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Speaker 3: all need to kind of come to the party as well.

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Speaker 3: So knowing that, yeah, just because you need to buy

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Speaker 3: a plastic drink bottle of water because you forgot your

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Speaker 3: reusable bottle and you really just need water otherwise you're

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Speaker 3: going to get dehydrated. Yeah, just actually giving yourself grace,

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Speaker 3: giving the other people in your life.

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Speaker 2: That as well in your final tip I suppose relates

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Speaker 2: to your nation wide tour at the moment, Yes, build

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Speaker 2: a supportive circle exactly.

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Speaker 3: So I think this is a tough one because some

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Speaker 3: people build such a support of circle that they find

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Speaker 3: themselves in a little kind of echo chamber of the

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Speaker 3: thoughts that they want to hear. I guess that's the

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Speaker 3: same you probably find a lot with politics and things

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Speaker 3: like that. Right, we can, here's just what we want

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Speaker 3: to But I think there's a great balance between having

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Speaker 3: people in your life who share your value, support your values,

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Speaker 3: live similar to you. But also obviously keeping conversation open

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Speaker 3: with other people who disagree is really really helpful, just

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Speaker 3: for any topic really. But that's heard of. Yeah, why

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Speaker 3: we're doing the tour in these events because I think

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Speaker 3: sometimes it can feel overwhelming like you're always kind of

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Speaker 3: going against the grain, and when you come together and

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Speaker 3: just you know, share a picnic and spend time with

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Speaker 3: people who share your values, that can just be you know,

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Speaker 3: the little moment in cupful and kind of Yeah, I

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Speaker 3: can still do this, I can still try my best

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Speaker 3: in terms of sustainable living. Yeah, it's important.

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Speaker 2: Very good. Hey, Thanks, Okay, good luck with a tour. Obviously,

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Speaker 2: you'll keep us up to speed is that continues. You

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Speaker 2: can find Kate on all the social media platforms by

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Speaker 2: searching ethically Kate.

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Speaker 1: For more from Saturday Morning with Jack Tame, listen live

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Speaker 1: to News talks ' b from nine am Saturday, or

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