1 00:00:06,667 --> 00:00:10,547 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Vine 2 00:00:10,707 --> 00:00:11,747 Speaker 1: from newstalk ZEDB. 3 00:00:12,667 --> 00:00:16,507 Speaker 2: News broke on Friday night that three time America's Cup 4 00:00:16,547 --> 00:00:20,387 Speaker 2: winning helmsman with Emirates Team New Zealand Peter Berling will 5 00:00:20,467 --> 00:00:23,867 Speaker 2: join Luna Rossa for the next America's Cup. Former New 6 00:00:23,947 --> 00:00:26,707 Speaker 2: Zealand and World champion sailor Team New Zealand member and 7 00:00:26,787 --> 00:00:30,227 Speaker 2: sailing professor Mark Orams is with us to break this down. 8 00:00:30,347 --> 00:00:30,547 Speaker 3: Mark. 9 00:00:30,587 --> 00:00:32,467 Speaker 2: First of all, when you heard this news, were you 10 00:00:32,627 --> 00:00:33,907 Speaker 2: surprised by it? 11 00:00:35,747 --> 00:00:38,587 Speaker 3: Not too much of a surprise, given that we'd already 12 00:00:38,627 --> 00:00:41,987 Speaker 3: heard that Peter Berling was not going to be around 13 00:00:41,987 --> 00:00:44,427 Speaker 3: within the Team New Zealand ranks for the thirty eighth 14 00:00:44,467 --> 00:00:46,907 Speaker 3: America's Cup, so it was only a matter of time 15 00:00:46,987 --> 00:00:49,747 Speaker 3: before one of the other challenges picked them up. Such 16 00:00:49,747 --> 00:00:52,227 Speaker 3: a good get, and the fact that Lerna Rossa prior 17 00:00:52,307 --> 00:00:56,747 Speaker 3: to Pralli ended up with Pete as a massive cup 18 00:00:56,787 --> 00:00:57,107 Speaker 3: for them. 19 00:00:57,507 --> 00:01:00,387 Speaker 2: How much demand would Peter Berling have been in? Would 20 00:01:00,387 --> 00:01:02,867 Speaker 2: his phone have started ringing? Or not his phone maybe 21 00:01:02,867 --> 00:01:05,147 Speaker 2: but his agent's phone or whoever looks after these things. 22 00:01:05,147 --> 00:01:08,587 Speaker 2: Would there have been immediate contact made with his representatives 23 00:01:08,587 --> 00:01:11,467 Speaker 2: once it was known he was leaving Emirates Team New Zealand. 24 00:01:12,027 --> 00:01:14,107 Speaker 3: Oh absolutely. In fact, I think there would have been 25 00:01:14,267 --> 00:01:18,227 Speaker 3: communication and just sort of sounding out with Peter long 26 00:01:18,307 --> 00:01:21,707 Speaker 3: before that, immediately after the end of the last America's Cup. 27 00:01:22,187 --> 00:01:25,227 Speaker 3: Remembering that this is somebody who has a track record 28 00:01:25,267 --> 00:01:28,427 Speaker 3: now second to none, including Russell Coots in terms of 29 00:01:28,467 --> 00:01:33,347 Speaker 3: America's Cups, Skipper's victories and the Youth America's Cup before that. 30 00:01:33,587 --> 00:01:38,267 Speaker 3: So Pete Berling is as an outstanding all round sailor. 31 00:01:38,667 --> 00:01:42,867 Speaker 3: He's technically very very smart and from Luna Rossa prator 32 00:01:42,947 --> 00:01:46,467 Speaker 3: for Elli's perspective. This elevates them now to a very 33 00:01:46,547 --> 00:01:47,787 Speaker 3: very strong position. 34 00:01:48,307 --> 00:01:51,307 Speaker 2: In terms of what he can and can't do at 35 00:01:51,387 --> 00:01:54,667 Speaker 2: Luna Rossa under the nationality rules. Smart, can you just 36 00:01:54,747 --> 00:01:57,227 Speaker 2: explain where we are with that right now? 37 00:01:58,227 --> 00:02:01,227 Speaker 3: Yes, certainly so. At the moment, the protocol for the 38 00:02:01,227 --> 00:02:03,867 Speaker 3: thirty eighth America's Cup is still a draft so yet 39 00:02:03,907 --> 00:02:08,147 Speaker 3: to be finalized between the defend Emirates Team New Zealand 40 00:02:08,187 --> 00:02:10,987 Speaker 3: and the challenger of record A seen a racing that's 41 00:02:11,027 --> 00:02:14,787 Speaker 3: been Ainsley's name of his new team, but within the 42 00:02:14,867 --> 00:02:19,427 Speaker 3: draft protocol it puts forward exactly the same restrictions as 43 00:02:19,467 --> 00:02:22,587 Speaker 3: for the thirty seventh America's Cup last time, and that 44 00:02:22,787 --> 00:02:25,227 Speaker 3: being that if you've sailed for a team in the 45 00:02:25,467 --> 00:02:30,667 Speaker 3: America's Cup immediately prior, you're not allowed to actually sail 46 00:02:30,787 --> 00:02:34,067 Speaker 3: for your new team in the subsequent Cup. So if 47 00:02:34,107 --> 00:02:37,387 Speaker 3: that protocol is confirmed for the thirty eighth America's Cup, 48 00:02:37,427 --> 00:02:40,427 Speaker 3: that means Peter Berling will not be permitted to sail 49 00:02:40,467 --> 00:02:43,627 Speaker 3: on board during the racing. Of course, for practice racing 50 00:02:44,827 --> 00:02:47,707 Speaker 3: and so on, he can, but during the racing itself 51 00:02:47,747 --> 00:02:50,307 Speaker 3: he won't be permitted to be part of the sailing team. 52 00:02:50,627 --> 00:02:54,227 Speaker 2: How much would that dilute his value to Lunarossa. 53 00:02:55,187 --> 00:02:57,827 Speaker 3: I don't think a huge amount. The value that Pete 54 00:02:57,867 --> 00:03:02,747 Speaker 3: brings is his experience, and especially I think in terms 55 00:03:02,827 --> 00:03:06,427 Speaker 3: of his understanding of the critical decisions that are made 56 00:03:06,547 --> 00:03:08,667 Speaker 3: in the years leading up to the America's Cup. So 57 00:03:09,107 --> 00:03:13,547 Speaker 3: the performance in the America's Cup itself is determined by 58 00:03:13,587 --> 00:03:16,907 Speaker 3: what happens in the key decisions the years leading up 59 00:03:16,907 --> 00:03:20,827 Speaker 3: to it, and Peter has been intimately involved with all 60 00:03:20,867 --> 00:03:24,387 Speaker 3: of those decisions as the skipper and the lead of 61 00:03:24,427 --> 00:03:26,667 Speaker 3: the sailing team with an Emirates Ta New Zealand on 62 00:03:26,747 --> 00:03:30,747 Speaker 3: the three occasions now that they've won. So that's the 63 00:03:30,827 --> 00:03:34,067 Speaker 3: big value that he brings. What Lunar, Rossi, Prada Prelia 64 00:03:34,187 --> 00:03:36,947 Speaker 3: doing is setting themselves up for the future. They've already 65 00:03:36,987 --> 00:03:40,307 Speaker 3: indicated that they are changing out from their long standing 66 00:03:40,387 --> 00:03:46,027 Speaker 3: helmsman and skippers in Francesco Brunie the Italian and Jimmy Spittle, 67 00:03:46,427 --> 00:03:50,547 Speaker 3: and they've changed out to two extremely talented Italian sailors, 68 00:03:51,267 --> 00:03:56,187 Speaker 3: Ruggiero Tito and Marco Gridoni. And they've indicated that before 69 00:03:56,227 --> 00:04:00,467 Speaker 3: Marco Goredoni is an outstanding talent like Peter Berling before 70 00:04:00,507 --> 00:04:03,827 Speaker 3: him won the Youth America's Cup last time. So you know, 71 00:04:03,907 --> 00:04:05,827 Speaker 3: this is a team that is looking to the future, 72 00:04:06,467 --> 00:04:09,747 Speaker 3: and the investment with Peter Berling adds value to bringing 73 00:04:09,827 --> 00:04:14,387 Speaker 3: those two new talented young helmsman on board to form 74 00:04:14,427 --> 00:04:15,867 Speaker 3: a very formidable sailing team. 75 00:04:16,267 --> 00:04:18,947 Speaker 2: I understand all of what you've said about Peter Burling 76 00:04:18,987 --> 00:04:22,387 Speaker 2: being involved in everything that leads up to the regatta itself, 77 00:04:22,467 --> 00:04:25,227 Speaker 2: but I don't know Mark. Peter Berling strikes me as 78 00:04:25,227 --> 00:04:27,707 Speaker 2: an on the water sailor. He wants the ocean spray 79 00:04:27,747 --> 00:04:30,147 Speaker 2: in his face. That's how I feel about Peter Berling. 80 00:04:30,147 --> 00:04:34,307 Speaker 2: How would he go in an off the water roll. 81 00:04:34,427 --> 00:04:37,307 Speaker 3: I think you'll add enormous value. We're Peter, and this 82 00:04:37,347 --> 00:04:41,867 Speaker 3: is really what caused the I guess the decision from 83 00:04:41,867 --> 00:04:45,867 Speaker 3: Grand Bolton for Peter not to continue on with Emirates 84 00:04:45,867 --> 00:04:50,267 Speaker 3: teamsyonder is that Peter is very much focused on the 85 00:04:50,307 --> 00:04:54,027 Speaker 3: Black Foils and the sale GP given them. You think 86 00:04:54,067 --> 00:04:58,067 Speaker 3: about a competitive person like Peter Berling three straight America's Cups, 87 00:04:58,507 --> 00:05:00,507 Speaker 3: but what he hasn't done is he hasn't won sale 88 00:05:00,547 --> 00:05:03,987 Speaker 3: GP in four straight seasons. He's come close, but this 89 00:05:04,027 --> 00:05:06,707 Speaker 3: is something he's yet to knock off, and so his 90 00:05:06,867 --> 00:05:10,707 Speaker 3: competitive ambitions will be really driven to develop the Black 91 00:05:10,747 --> 00:05:13,787 Speaker 3: Foils to be successful in something that they haven't knocked 92 00:05:13,787 --> 00:05:17,507 Speaker 3: off yet. So he will get in effect his competitive 93 00:05:17,507 --> 00:05:21,627 Speaker 3: sailing fixed through his sail GP endeavors and the Lunarosi 94 00:05:21,667 --> 00:05:24,107 Speaker 3: Prator Pralli will be him at a stage in his 95 00:05:24,187 --> 00:05:26,267 Speaker 3: life and career in the America's Cup where I think 96 00:05:26,267 --> 00:05:28,907 Speaker 3: he'll get satisfaction out of seeing the value he can 97 00:05:28,947 --> 00:05:33,787 Speaker 3: add to developing some rookie America's Cup helms people in 98 00:05:35,307 --> 00:05:38,787 Speaker 3: the new team that they're bringing together on this sailing 99 00:05:38,827 --> 00:05:40,547 Speaker 3: crew for Lunarossa if. 100 00:05:40,387 --> 00:05:42,507 Speaker 2: You look into your crystal ball, then beyond the thirty 101 00:05:42,547 --> 00:05:45,107 Speaker 2: eighth to the thirty ninth, when presumably, if the rules 102 00:05:45,107 --> 00:05:47,627 Speaker 2: stay the same, he would be eligible to get back 103 00:05:47,667 --> 00:05:49,907 Speaker 2: on the boat. Can you see him doing that or 104 00:05:49,987 --> 00:05:51,947 Speaker 2: do you think that for the America's Cup he'll be 105 00:05:51,987 --> 00:05:53,787 Speaker 2: off the water and is on the water stuff will 106 00:05:53,827 --> 00:05:55,467 Speaker 2: be with the black foils moving forward. 107 00:05:57,027 --> 00:05:58,027 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a good question. 108 00:05:58,707 --> 00:05:59,147 Speaker 2: Hard to know. 109 00:05:59,267 --> 00:06:02,107 Speaker 3: I meanole, there's a whole bunch of things that will 110 00:06:02,107 --> 00:06:07,627 Speaker 3: determine that. I think Peter Berling will certainly had the 111 00:06:07,707 --> 00:06:10,947 Speaker 3: talent and certainly the experience to be successful if he 112 00:06:11,107 --> 00:06:13,547 Speaker 3: was to come back to a sailing position. Whether the 113 00:06:13,547 --> 00:06:16,107 Speaker 3: thirty ninth America's Cup will allow him to do that 114 00:06:16,147 --> 00:06:18,947 Speaker 3: will largely depend on who wins the thirty eighth America's 115 00:06:18,987 --> 00:06:21,307 Speaker 3: Cup and the rules that they set up for the 116 00:06:21,347 --> 00:06:23,627 Speaker 3: next edition. So you know, there are a whole bunch 117 00:06:23,667 --> 00:06:25,587 Speaker 3: of things that would need to happen there. But Peter 118 00:06:25,667 --> 00:06:28,467 Speaker 3: Burley's not done yet. One of the things about the 119 00:06:28,507 --> 00:06:31,227 Speaker 3: sport of sailing is that you can stay very competitive, 120 00:06:31,667 --> 00:06:34,747 Speaker 3: unlike many other sports, into your forties. Remembering that Peter 121 00:06:34,827 --> 00:06:38,067 Speaker 3: Burling is still in his thirties, so he's not done 122 00:06:38,147 --> 00:06:42,387 Speaker 3: yet and wouldn't surprise me to see him helming in 123 00:06:42,427 --> 00:06:44,907 Speaker 3: America's Cup boat again sometime down the track. 124 00:06:44,827 --> 00:06:47,307 Speaker 2: Well on or off the water, and likely off the 125 00:06:47,307 --> 00:06:50,187 Speaker 2: water for the thirty eighth. Then how much does this 126 00:06:50,227 --> 00:06:53,787 Speaker 2: boost lunar Rossa. Are they now likely to be the 127 00:06:53,867 --> 00:06:55,787 Speaker 2: challenger for the thirty eighth America's Cup. 128 00:06:56,507 --> 00:06:58,867 Speaker 3: Well, it's a long way out, but what we know 129 00:06:59,227 --> 00:07:02,547 Speaker 3: is that the key decisions that you make now determine 130 00:07:02,547 --> 00:07:04,787 Speaker 3: how competitive you're going to be when it comes to 131 00:07:04,867 --> 00:07:07,787 Speaker 3: race time. And remember that this cycle is quite short. 132 00:07:07,867 --> 00:07:10,907 Speaker 3: It's only two years until the next America's Cup series. 133 00:07:11,667 --> 00:07:14,387 Speaker 3: So Lunarosa Prator Prarey have a number of things in 134 00:07:14,427 --> 00:07:17,107 Speaker 3: their favor now. One is that are a very very 135 00:07:17,147 --> 00:07:21,347 Speaker 3: stable and competitive team. They've got continuity in terms of 136 00:07:21,427 --> 00:07:24,747 Speaker 3: key personnel, in terms of sponsors, so they don't have 137 00:07:24,827 --> 00:07:27,667 Speaker 3: to go out there and hustle like Ben Ainsley's having 138 00:07:27,667 --> 00:07:29,187 Speaker 3: to do at the moment to try and sort of 139 00:07:29,227 --> 00:07:33,307 Speaker 3: resurrect his team post Anios breakup. So they've got that continuity. 140 00:07:33,627 --> 00:07:37,107 Speaker 3: They've recruited extremely well and by the way, Peter Booley 141 00:07:37,187 --> 00:07:39,547 Speaker 3: is not the only ex Emirates team New Zealand member 142 00:07:39,627 --> 00:07:42,707 Speaker 3: Josh Jr. One of the key members of Emirates Team 143 00:07:42,747 --> 00:07:45,667 Speaker 3: New Zealand's success, moved to Lunarosa Prator Parali at the 144 00:07:45,707 --> 00:07:49,427 Speaker 3: beginning of this year. So they've built their stocks and 145 00:07:49,507 --> 00:07:52,507 Speaker 3: of course they've now got and effect the home court advantage. 146 00:07:53,547 --> 00:07:56,147 Speaker 3: With the announcement that Naples is the host of the 147 00:07:56,187 --> 00:07:59,627 Speaker 3: thirty eighth America's Cup, that's only a very short distance 148 00:07:59,667 --> 00:08:04,547 Speaker 3: from the base southern Endisidinia where Lunarosi Prata Parelli is, 149 00:08:04,587 --> 00:08:07,307 Speaker 3: So there's a whole bunch of things stacking up in 150 00:08:07,347 --> 00:08:09,987 Speaker 3: favor of Lunarosa Prata Parali. Now they will be a 151 00:08:10,027 --> 00:08:14,027 Speaker 3: formidable team. They already are, they're even more formidable now. 152 00:08:14,147 --> 00:08:16,907 Speaker 3: So you would have to say that at this stage, 153 00:08:16,907 --> 00:08:18,747 Speaker 3: even though it's two years away, they are in the 154 00:08:18,787 --> 00:08:20,827 Speaker 3: box seat to be the challenger and they will be 155 00:08:20,867 --> 00:08:23,987 Speaker 3: a very strong challenger if they get through the series 156 00:08:24,027 --> 00:08:25,987 Speaker 3: to challenge for the thirty eighth America's Cup. 157 00:08:26,427 --> 00:08:29,627 Speaker 2: Mark what about the dynamic between Peter Berling and some 158 00:08:29,667 --> 00:08:31,827 Speaker 2: of his Black Foils teammates, And I think about Bleair 159 00:08:31,907 --> 00:08:36,667 Speaker 2: Chuck for example, who he is a teammate of with 160 00:08:37,307 --> 00:08:40,387 Speaker 2: the Black Foils and sale GP and now will presumably 161 00:08:40,427 --> 00:08:44,267 Speaker 2: be an adversary of during the America's Cup. How are 162 00:08:44,307 --> 00:08:46,347 Speaker 2: those dynamics play out. 163 00:08:47,267 --> 00:08:49,987 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's an interesting point, isn't it. I think? And 164 00:08:50,027 --> 00:08:52,187 Speaker 3: this is not the first time where we've seen the 165 00:08:52,227 --> 00:08:57,627 Speaker 3: sort of the type four of the basis of the 166 00:08:57,627 --> 00:09:00,987 Speaker 3: Emirates Team New Zealand and the Black Foils. Andy Maloney 167 00:09:01,147 --> 00:09:03,667 Speaker 3: was quite a surprise when he chose to move on 168 00:09:03,707 --> 00:09:05,667 Speaker 3: from the Black Foils and he's now sailing for the 169 00:09:05,707 --> 00:09:10,267 Speaker 3: Brazilian team in sale GP, but he's remaining with Emirates 170 00:09:10,307 --> 00:09:14,147 Speaker 3: Team New Zealand. So and Blair Chuck of course and 171 00:09:14,187 --> 00:09:18,467 Speaker 3: Pete Berlin there tight. They've been great mates, Olympic partners 172 00:09:18,507 --> 00:09:24,187 Speaker 3: for three campaigns and co CEOs of the Black Foils. 173 00:09:24,267 --> 00:09:28,427 Speaker 3: So you know, those friendships I think transcend who these 174 00:09:28,467 --> 00:09:31,627 Speaker 3: people are competing for. They run long, they run deep, 175 00:09:32,027 --> 00:09:35,027 Speaker 3: and we're in a stage now I think in professional 176 00:09:35,067 --> 00:09:38,947 Speaker 3: sailing where people moving and competing for different teams, there's 177 00:09:38,947 --> 00:09:40,787 Speaker 3: analogous to what we see in a lot of other 178 00:09:40,827 --> 00:09:46,107 Speaker 3: professional sports where those friendships remain. You're absolutely fear as competitors, 179 00:09:46,707 --> 00:09:48,827 Speaker 3: in this case on the water or in other places 180 00:09:48,827 --> 00:09:52,067 Speaker 3: on the field, on the court, but off the court 181 00:09:52,547 --> 00:09:54,627 Speaker 3: or off the field, off the water, you still retain 182 00:09:54,707 --> 00:09:57,467 Speaker 3: those friendships in the respect that's been built over decades 183 00:09:57,827 --> 00:10:00,107 Speaker 3: of sailing with and now sailing against one another. 184 00:10:00,507 --> 00:10:02,827 Speaker 2: Fascinating times ahead, Mark, thanks so much for joining us 185 00:10:02,827 --> 00:10:05,587 Speaker 2: this afternoon and lending us your analysis. Really appreciate it 186 00:10:06,387 --> 00:10:09,307 Speaker 2: so pleasure. No thanks, my, that's our professor, Mark Orams, 187 00:10:09,347 --> 00:10:13,107 Speaker 2: Sailing Professor Mark Orams, former New Zealand and World champion 188 00:10:13,147 --> 00:10:14,627 Speaker 2: Silo and Team New Zealand member. 189 00:10:15,507 --> 00:10:18,667 Speaker 1: For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live 190 00:10:18,787 --> 00:10:22,067 Speaker 1: to News Talk Set B weekends from midday, or follow 191 00:10:22,107 --> 00:10:23,667 Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio