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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Weekend Sport podcast with Jason Fine

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Speaker 1: from Newstalk ZEDB.

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Speaker 2: But let's bring in a true Wallaby's legend. John Eels

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Speaker 2: eighty six Test matches in Green and Gold, fifty five

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Speaker 2: of those as Wallaby's captain, Rugby World Cup winner in

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Speaker 2: nineteen ninety nine and again in nineteen ninety one and

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Speaker 2: again in nineteen ninety nine, the best lock and in

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Speaker 2: the eyes of many, the best players player in the world.

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Speaker 2: For a decade. Under his captaincy, the Wallabies became the

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Speaker 2: number one rugby team in the world. In nineteen ninety

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Speaker 2: eight he lifted the Bledisloe Cup as the Wallabies of

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Speaker 2: that year became the first Australian side since nineteen twenty

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Speaker 2: nine to beat the All Blacks three nil in a series.

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Speaker 2: Under his stewardship, Australia also won the Try Nations for

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Speaker 2: the first time in two thousand and Among his many honors,

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Speaker 2: he was made a Member of the Order of Australia

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Speaker 2: for services to rugby, inducted into the International Rugby Board

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Speaker 2: Hall of Fame, the wall Hall of Fame and the

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Speaker 2: Legions of Australian Sports. So so many accolades and as

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Speaker 2: mentioned in the year two thousand, right here in Wellington

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Speaker 2: he did this.

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Speaker 1: How about this.

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Speaker 3: For stepping up to the mark, Johnny is he's going

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Speaker 3: to take the kick himself? Well he has to because

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Speaker 3: turning Mortlock's off the field, and I guess he's the

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Speaker 3: only other goalkicker recognized goalkicker Joe Roth.

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Speaker 2: Perhaps on occasions.

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Speaker 3: This kick were the side the frights of the Brenoslowk.

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Speaker 2: Jeniss Kich has retained a bitters. Yeah, it was twenty

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Speaker 2: four years ago. John Iills is with us on weekend sport. John,

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Speaker 2: I'm sitting here looking out at the patch of grass

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Speaker 2: on which that happened. I'm looking at what I reckon

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Speaker 2: is the spot from which you kicked that winning penalty

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Speaker 2: back in the year two thousand. Where does that game

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Speaker 2: sit in your memory banks?

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Speaker 3: Well, it's deep in the memory banks because it's so

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Speaker 3: long ago, sadly, because it's look at some look Obviously

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Speaker 3: it was a great moment for our team at that time. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: we had obviously very good team at the time, and

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Speaker 3: that week had happened to be me other week, so

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Speaker 3: there was other people who took up those moments, but

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Speaker 3: it was a very special moment in a very special team.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, tell us about that Wallaby's team that we remember

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Speaker 2: so fondly over here, especially the back end of the

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Speaker 2: nineties and into the two thousands, where you never knew

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Speaker 2: from week to week who was going to come out

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Speaker 2: on top between the Wallabies and the All Blacks. What

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Speaker 2: was so special about that team that you led.

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Speaker 3: I think I'll probably put it down to it was

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Speaker 3: an experienced scene. But we did actually have a fair

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Speaker 3: bit of change through that team through that era, and

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Speaker 3: and because we had very strong systems in the team,

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Speaker 3: I think we were quite composed in the ways in

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Speaker 3: the way that we hit it and the way that

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Speaker 3: we put things together on the field, and the way

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Speaker 3: we didn't panic when things weren't necessarily going our way.

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Speaker 2: So new players coming into the environment were pretty quick

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Speaker 2: to understand and to grasp what was required. There wasn't

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Speaker 2: a lot of initiation required for the new players coming

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Speaker 2: into the environment.

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Speaker 3: Now, I think that's right. People understood what they had

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Speaker 3: to do, they understood their responsibility, their place in the team.

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Speaker 3: And then we had very strong patterns of play, but

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Speaker 3: also were a team that were smart enough to read

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Speaker 3: the game and what was in front of us and

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Speaker 3: then adjust to how we play the game. As a results,

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Speaker 3: you played.

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Speaker 2: The All Blacks twenty times in your career, eleven wins

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Speaker 2: in those twenty games, so very tightly thought obviously were

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Speaker 2: they your would you call them your favorite opponent? Were

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Speaker 2: other games you look forward to the most?

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Speaker 3: Now, there were certainly games you'd get nervous about because

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Speaker 3: they meant more than any other games for Australians. Playing

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Speaker 3: against New Zealand for the waters like Cup, we're in

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Speaker 3: the big games. But I think you did look forward

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Speaker 3: to them because the great thing about playing against New

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Speaker 3: Zealand is they would always back themselves, and that backed

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Speaker 3: themselves to play good rugby, So therefore you knew it

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Speaker 3: was the game if your best rugby against their best rugby.

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Speaker 3: It wasn't guess so were physical when you played them,

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Speaker 3: but it wasn't quite like playing against the spring Box,

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Speaker 3: where the spring Box would almost want to win the

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Speaker 3: physical battle before they'd even consider about winning the game,

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Speaker 3: whereas the All Blacks would guess physical battle was part

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Speaker 3: of it, but it was more about how do you

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Speaker 3: win this game? And they would be trying their best

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Speaker 3: against our best, so it was always good and as

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Speaker 3: it said over that career is roughly fifty fifty so

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Speaker 3: it was always very close and.

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Speaker 2: Often close matches which were won right near the end.

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Speaker 2: I look at your very final test, John, the twenty

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Speaker 2: nine to twenty six win over the All Black Stadium,

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Speaker 2: Australia two thousand and one total carefu scoring a late try.

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Speaker 2: It felt for a while there as though late tries

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Speaker 2: and late points were the order of the day. Did

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Speaker 2: it always feel like you had to play for the

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Speaker 2: eighty minutes sometimes the eighty five?

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Speaker 3: Well, no one beats the All Blacks in sixty or

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Speaker 3: seventy minutes. You beat them through an eighty minute effort.

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Speaker 3: You can never be you can never relax against them.

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Speaker 3: And you see that all the time. So yeah, we

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Speaker 3: knew it was going to always come to that, and

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Speaker 3: we were ready for that, and we tried to make

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Speaker 3: sure that we approached it in exactly the same way

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Speaker 3: each time. And then whether it was the first minute

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Speaker 3: of the game or the last minute of the game,

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Speaker 3: we had to focus on the same things, getting the

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Speaker 3: execution of your basic stuff correct.

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Speaker 2: If we fast forward to the present day, what do

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Speaker 2: you see says that as the Wallabies state of being

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Speaker 2: right now, how do you assise where they are at

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Speaker 2: the moment.

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Speaker 3: I think they're on a journey towards building the confidence

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Speaker 3: they need to compete regularly at this high level. Now

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Speaker 3: they've got the skills that can match it in the

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Speaker 3: best moments, but we've got to lock in the downside

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Speaker 3: of our play. And its generally not bad minutes or

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Speaker 3: it's not a bad group of ten minutes or something.

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Speaker 3: It's just the bad moments where we're just not where

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Speaker 3: we let ourselves down through it just that breath and

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Speaker 3: gets away for a second. They were all months or

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Speaker 3: a try or Argentinas or a try. But we're generally

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Speaker 3: competing for most of the games. We just have to

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Speaker 3: make sure we keep that intensity, keep the skill level,

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Speaker 3: and therefore keep the pressure on for larger components of

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Speaker 3: the game.

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Speaker 2: Does that come largely with experience? John?

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Speaker 3: A lot of that is experience, the ability to read

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Speaker 3: certain parts of the game, know what's going on, and

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Speaker 3: be able to react, but have the composure to not

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Speaker 3: get worried if something is not quite going your way.

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Speaker 2: Do you think Joe Schmid's the right man to take

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Speaker 2: this team forward?

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Speaker 3: Yes, I do think he is. I think from a

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Speaker 3: coaching perspective, He's got experience dealing with dealing with teams

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Speaker 3: that are trying to change the way they do things.

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Speaker 3: But also what he did with Ireland, I think he

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Speaker 3: got a lot out of a system that wasn't necessary,

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Speaker 3: verily the deepest system in the world, and I think

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Speaker 3: he helped create a very strong structure that then was

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Speaker 3: reliable for developing players to come in and step into

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Speaker 3: that structure. Now he's starting from early stages with the

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Speaker 3: Wallabies that I think he's the right person to be

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Speaker 3: leading this drive all right.

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Speaker 2: And just to finish, what would you like to see

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Speaker 2: from the wallabiests tonight? You mentioned before, you know, the

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Speaker 2: big moments and maybe the moments where they don't quite

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Speaker 2: get to the level that they need to be. What

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Speaker 2: are you hoping to see from the Wallabies and Wellington tonight?

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Speaker 3: What I hope to see is consistency and just building

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Speaker 3: on building on the performance of last week, and just

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Speaker 3: less of those bad moments where they let the All

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Speaker 3: Blacks in. Like if you start well, the Wallabies came

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Speaker 3: back into the game, they showed a lot of character,

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Speaker 3: a lot of courage, commitment and skill. So making sure

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Speaker 3: that they can show that from the start. I'll give

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Speaker 3: you one example. I think there was three or four

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Speaker 3: I can't remember exactly. You'll probably be able to correct me.

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Speaker 3: Three or four lineouts that we lost attacking lineouts in

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Speaker 3: the all blackness twenty two through the game. Then that's

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Speaker 3: a classic example of a moment where you've got an

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Speaker 3: opportunity to turn the screws and apply pressure. But if

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Speaker 3: the opposition knows that that's fifty to fifty ball in

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Speaker 3: those moments, well they're not going to feel the same pressure. Now,

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Speaker 3: all teams struggle to some extent under pressure. The Wallabies

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Speaker 3: has to learn to build and apply that pressure for

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Speaker 3: longer periods of time.

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Speaker 2: Fascinating time, Bey on both sides of the Tessman, John,

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Speaker 2: you broke our hearts on more than one occasion, particularly

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Speaker 2: here in Wellington. We're on broadcasting today. Really appreciate you

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Speaker 2: taking the time for a chat this afternoon.

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Speaker 3: Thanks. It's a pleasure and I hope it's a great

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Speaker 3: game there today.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we hope so too, John. Thanks in date, John

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Speaker 2: Eels there Wallaby's legend. They used to call them nobody,

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Speaker 2: didn't they because Nobody's perfect. What a terrific nickname and

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Speaker 2: what a player just generational and I think the greatest

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Speaker 2: Wallabies player ever.

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Speaker 1: For more from Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, listen live

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Speaker 1: to News Talk Said Be weekends from midday, or follow

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Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio