1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,400 Speaker 1: The unions are back with more strike action on the way. 2 00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:05,320 Speaker 1: The secondary teachers there are this Wednesday. The nurses are 3 00:00:05,320 --> 00:00:07,560 Speaker 1: out for two more days next month. Anyway, Judith Collins 4 00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:09,559 Speaker 1: is the Minister of the Public Service, anders with us 5 00:00:09,600 --> 00:00:12,560 Speaker 1: on all of this. Judith, morning to you, good morning. 6 00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:14,840 Speaker 1: I think you were standing with ere Ak Stanford yesterday 7 00:00:14,840 --> 00:00:16,680 Speaker 1: when she was suggesting this is a bit of a stunt. 8 00:00:16,720 --> 00:00:19,479 Speaker 1: How as far as the teachers are concerned, is it 9 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:21,040 Speaker 1: a stunt? Do you think they've only been there for 10 00:00:21,079 --> 00:00:21,640 Speaker 1: six days? 11 00:00:22,600 --> 00:00:25,200 Speaker 2: Well, not only six days, but clearly they looks like 12 00:00:25,239 --> 00:00:27,840 Speaker 2: they spent more time on their marketing than they did 13 00:00:27,880 --> 00:00:30,920 Speaker 2: at the bargaining table. And you know they haven't even 14 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:33,879 Speaker 2: put the offer to their members. They've just let's all 15 00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:36,400 Speaker 2: go out and strike. And what they're going to find is, 16 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:39,000 Speaker 2: on top of the four percent to seven and a 17 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:42,400 Speaker 2: half percent annual pay progression that's still there, there's an 18 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:45,200 Speaker 2: extra one percent on top of that, or three percent 19 00:00:45,240 --> 00:00:47,519 Speaker 2: over three years. I just say to them, you know 20 00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:52,040 Speaker 2: these kids that they're targeting, which are the secondarys kids, 21 00:00:52,120 --> 00:00:55,960 Speaker 2: the senior secondary kids going through exam times and worrying 22 00:00:56,000 --> 00:00:59,440 Speaker 2: about NCAA and Cambridge, those are the same kids who 23 00:00:59,560 --> 00:01:02,400 Speaker 2: missed out two years of education when we were stuck 24 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:05,200 Speaker 2: in these lockdowns in Auckland. And when I think about 25 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:08,080 Speaker 2: what they've already gone through, and the teachers don't forget 26 00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:12,360 Speaker 2: their pay has increased massively over the last few years. 27 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:16,119 Speaker 2: You know, I just have a heart stop using these 28 00:01:16,200 --> 00:01:20,240 Speaker 2: kids like some football and get a union that actually 29 00:01:20,240 --> 00:01:21,040 Speaker 2: cares about them. 30 00:01:21,319 --> 00:01:23,600 Speaker 1: Do you haven't? I mean, it's an impossible question to answer, 31 00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:25,800 Speaker 1: I think, but do you have a sense that is 32 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:29,240 Speaker 1: this union driven and there are plenty of teachers out 33 00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:31,959 Speaker 1: there who actually, in a quiet moment, wouldn't be going 34 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:33,920 Speaker 1: along with it? Or are they all in and they 35 00:01:33,920 --> 00:01:36,000 Speaker 1: hate you and they're feeling ripped off and they're on 36 00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:36,760 Speaker 1: strike No matter what. 37 00:01:37,360 --> 00:01:40,240 Speaker 2: I don't think the teachers hate us. I mean they've 38 00:01:40,240 --> 00:01:43,000 Speaker 2: got a minister in Erica Stanford, who was the biggest 39 00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:47,160 Speaker 2: advocate ever for teachers. I mean she and the government, 40 00:01:47,280 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 2: without being asked to, went off and paid for all 41 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:54,320 Speaker 2: of their teacher registration fees that have been an ex 42 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:57,040 Speaker 2: for a long time. She's put huge amounts of money 43 00:01:57,080 --> 00:02:01,720 Speaker 2: into professional development, She's done all the things, and you know, 44 00:02:01,800 --> 00:02:04,440 Speaker 2: it gets the bargaining table. We go to the bargaining table, 45 00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 2: and it's obviously all just a stunt. That's they don't 46 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:09,400 Speaker 2: even put an offer back. They just go, we're not 47 00:02:09,440 --> 00:02:12,560 Speaker 2: even putting it to our people were on strike. What 48 00:02:12,639 --> 00:02:15,600 Speaker 2: those same teachers are going to find is that actually 49 00:02:15,720 --> 00:02:19,240 Speaker 2: partial strikes means partial loss of pay as well. Now, 50 00:02:19,919 --> 00:02:23,600 Speaker 2: and I don't think there's these unions are actually put 51 00:02:23,600 --> 00:02:26,440 Speaker 2: in their teachers first. What they are, as they've said 52 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:29,120 Speaker 2: it for you know, we've seen it from the public 53 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:33,280 Speaker 2: service sector unions. They're going to keep on striking and striking, 54 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:36,480 Speaker 2: carrying on to cause as much disruption because they don't 55 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:38,680 Speaker 2: want this particular government. They want another. 56 00:02:38,720 --> 00:02:42,840 Speaker 1: One was going to ask, how much do you think 57 00:02:42,880 --> 00:02:45,240 Speaker 1: of this as ideological? They simply don't like you. 58 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:49,720 Speaker 2: You know, look, you've got a where were they worrying 59 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:51,919 Speaker 2: about what was happening with our kids when they were 60 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:55,280 Speaker 2: locked down? You know we were they I don't remember 61 00:02:55,280 --> 00:02:58,079 Speaker 2: them ever saying anything about what's going to happen with 62 00:02:58,160 --> 00:03:00,600 Speaker 2: these kids. What I did know is that there are 63 00:03:00,639 --> 00:03:03,760 Speaker 2: teachers who are worried about it. Dan near the union there, No, 64 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:07,920 Speaker 2: they were right in there supporting the then government no 65 00:03:07,960 --> 00:03:08,320 Speaker 2: matter what. 66 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:12,160 Speaker 1: As I think we've discussed this before, but certainly nurses. 67 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:13,959 Speaker 1: I mean that number of the Prime Minister often quotes 68 00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:15,680 Speaker 1: about one hundred and twenty five hundred and twenty seven 69 00:03:15,720 --> 00:03:18,040 Speaker 1: thousand dollars for senior nurse. It's on. It's commensurate with 70 00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:20,240 Speaker 1: New South Wales. Now, I think we can say the 71 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:24,680 Speaker 1: same about teachers, can't we. Teachers are are actually quite 72 00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:26,040 Speaker 1: well paid, now, aren't they. 73 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 2: Well, when you've taken to account twelve weeks, that's three 74 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:35,400 Speaker 2: months paid leave every year, plus all the professional development, 75 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:38,720 Speaker 2: plus everything else that goes with it, all the allowances. 76 00:03:38,960 --> 00:03:42,120 Speaker 2: If you've got ten years experience with the normal allowances 77 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:44,960 Speaker 2: that most would be getting, that's one hundred and forty 78 00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:47,880 Speaker 2: seven thousand a year. And you add in that the 79 00:03:47,920 --> 00:03:52,880 Speaker 2: fact that there's three months paid leave. Now who else 80 00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:53,320 Speaker 2: gets that? 81 00:03:54,600 --> 00:03:55,240 Speaker 1: It's not bad? 82 00:03:56,440 --> 00:03:56,520 Speaker 2: No? 83 00:03:57,040 --> 00:03:59,840 Speaker 1: Just quickly, Well, I've got you as a seasoned practitioner, 84 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:03,680 Speaker 1: and I'm a wonk. But watching yesterday Jerry and his philosophy, 85 00:04:03,920 --> 00:04:08,160 Speaker 1: the philosophy that he sees the public attacking you guys, 86 00:04:09,000 --> 00:04:12,160 Speaker 1: and to do something about that, we need to tidy 87 00:04:12,160 --> 00:04:14,920 Speaker 1: ourselves up in the house, I actually thought that wasn't 88 00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:15,840 Speaker 1: a bad argument. 89 00:04:17,920 --> 00:04:20,920 Speaker 2: Well, I'm a careful what I say because just just 90 00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:24,000 Speaker 2: in case, and I don't want to have an opinion 91 00:04:24,040 --> 00:04:29,040 Speaker 2: on it. Anything goes to Privileges Committee, but I'm ma 92 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:32,000 Speaker 2: sure of it, but it is important. We've always had 93 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:35,799 Speaker 2: rules about what you can say and not say in Parliament, 94 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:39,839 Speaker 2: and one of them is to call someone else lacking 95 00:04:39,880 --> 00:04:43,120 Speaker 2: and courage and that's those rules have been there forever, 96 00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:47,680 Speaker 2: well before some of these newer MPs have turned up, 97 00:04:48,240 --> 00:04:51,679 Speaker 2: and they're there for a reason, and it's about acting 98 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:55,440 Speaker 2: and behaving in a professional manner. Parliament does have a 99 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:58,400 Speaker 2: certain amount of theater to it and that keeps us 100 00:04:58,440 --> 00:05:02,279 Speaker 2: all excited about every day, obviously apart from the great work. 101 00:05:03,000 --> 00:05:05,720 Speaker 2: But the other thing is it shouldn't become just a 102 00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:11,000 Speaker 2: comedy of jokes and stupid behavior, because ultimately we end 103 00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:14,039 Speaker 2: up with this is the same body that asked the 104 00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:17,240 Speaker 2: public to respect us to act in a way that 105 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 2: is professional. And what we don't want to do is 106 00:05:21,000 --> 00:05:25,120 Speaker 2: to see Parliament descend into some sort of, as I said, 107 00:05:25,120 --> 00:05:26,000 Speaker 2: comedy of errors. 108 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:30,240 Speaker 1: What do you make of Hipkins and co Ah. 109 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:32,320 Speaker 2: Well, you know, would it be too rude to call 110 00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:37,039 Speaker 2: them gutless, spineless, hypocritical? I look at this and think 111 00:05:37,160 --> 00:05:40,680 Speaker 2: you guys were every single day telling us all through 112 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:43,559 Speaker 2: those lockdowns and everything else when we were a threat 113 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:46,960 Speaker 2: of lockdown. In lockdown, just come out of lockdown. Why 114 00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:50,440 Speaker 2: you are the sole source of truth and suddenly you're 115 00:05:51,320 --> 00:05:54,760 Speaker 2: too chicken to turn up? And the excuses that I've heard, 116 00:05:54,839 --> 00:05:58,599 Speaker 2: I think imagine if Christopher Luxeon pulled that one. Can 117 00:05:58,640 --> 00:06:01,240 Speaker 2: you imagine it? I actually wouldn't be surprised. I mean, 118 00:06:01,279 --> 00:06:03,600 Speaker 2: we saw how to Cindra doing decided you couldn't go 119 00:06:03,640 --> 00:06:06,839 Speaker 2: on your show because you asked your some hard questions. Okay, 120 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 2: I expect that Chris Hipkins will probably do the same. 121 00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:13,200 Speaker 1: Now, yeah, all right, appreciate it. Judith Collins, we started 122 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:15,640 Speaker 1: out Minister of Public Service and we moved to other areas. 123 00:06:15,680 --> 00:06:18,320 Speaker 1: But that's the fun of this program, isn't it. For 124 00:06:18,400 --> 00:06:21,480 Speaker 1: more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to news 125 00:06:21,520 --> 00:06:24,440 Speaker 1: talks that'd be from six am weekdays, or follow the 126 00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:25,920 Speaker 1: podcast on iHeartRadio.