WEBVTT - Why council, locals and players are once again clashing over an Auckland golf course 

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<v Speaker 1>Kyoda. I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page,

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<v Speaker 1>a daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. Over

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<v Speaker 1>the last decade, as New Zealand has grappled with the

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<v Speaker 1>housing crisis, golf courses have become a lightning rod for controversy.

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<v Speaker 1>Auckland Council alone owns or managers thirteen golf courses across

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<v Speaker 1>the supercity, and many campaigners have targeted these sites as

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<v Speaker 1>being prime land for housing, though as with any major project,

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<v Speaker 1>there are plenty of loud voices on the other side

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<v Speaker 1>of the debate. The recent controversy to hit the Green

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<v Speaker 1>has nothing to do with housing though, but instead with wetlands,

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<v Speaker 1>flooding and the Takapuna golf Course. Ahead of the delivery

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<v Speaker 1>of review findings next week, on this case today on

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<v Speaker 1>the Front Page, we're unpacking the contentious nature of golf

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<v Speaker 1>courses in Auckland, firstly with contributing writer for the spin

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<v Speaker 1>off Hayden Dennell. So, Hayden tell me about what's going

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<v Speaker 1>on with the Takapoona golf course.

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<v Speaker 2>The basic of it is that this all started on

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<v Speaker 2>the Auckland Anniversary Weekends flood when the whole White oh Valley. Basically,

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<v Speaker 2>when underwater, two people died, Homes, businesses were destroyed. In

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<v Speaker 2>the after mass is that the council had to look

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<v Speaker 2>for ways to make sure it wouldn't happen again. And

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<v Speaker 2>so they were basically looking for council owned land that

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<v Speaker 2>could draw a whole heap of water as flooding ever

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<v Speaker 2>took place. And they found that the only big enough

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<v Speaker 2>and appropriate section of land that they own is a

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<v Speaker 2>copoon of golf course. And so they're proposing to turn

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of it into a wetland so that blood's

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<v Speaker 2>ever happened and that will store all the water. But

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<v Speaker 2>that would mean at least reducing the golf course to

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<v Speaker 2>nine holes. That has proved You would never guess this,

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<v Speaker 2>but it has proved controversial.

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<v Speaker 1>Is the golfers aren't happy. Have they proposed anything else?

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<v Speaker 2>In the meantime, the golfers have got their own proposal.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm going to be looking at it a bit deeper

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<v Speaker 2>later this week, but they want to They say that

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<v Speaker 2>they're going to keep eighteen holes. They say that they

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<v Speaker 2>can keep ating holes and still provide enough drainage for

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<v Speaker 2>any future floods. I think it's five hundred million liters

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<v Speaker 2>of wader or something that needs to be stored to

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<v Speaker 2>prevent a repeat of the Upen Anniversary weekend floods. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>I think there's being assessed right now by council officials

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<v Speaker 2>and there are some doubts about whether that is feasible

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<v Speaker 2>or not. And as I understand it as well, there

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<v Speaker 2>are other people that have interest in the course and

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<v Speaker 2>taking on the lease and maybe working a little bit

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<v Speaker 2>closer with the council as well.

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<v Speaker 1>Why is it so difficult to get rid of or

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<v Speaker 1>to simply amend a golf course.

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<v Speaker 2>It's emotional. I'm not a golfer, so I don't have

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<v Speaker 2>the I can't relate to it on a deep emotional

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<v Speaker 2>personal level. But I think there's so many people that

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of their social life is tied up there,

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of their enjoyment takes place in this course,

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<v Speaker 2>and the idea of doing away with it that really

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<v Speaker 2>offends them on a personal level. There's also I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>there's a lot of money, let's say, that's tied up

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<v Speaker 2>in a lot of golf courses, and there's a lot

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<v Speaker 2>of resources for people that are passionate about the sports

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<v Speaker 2>to access and so it's often hard to dislodge the

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<v Speaker 2>courses because you'll get a backlash from some of the

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<v Speaker 2>more wealthy and well connected members of society who enjoy

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<v Speaker 2>using that course. And I mean there's a whole heap

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<v Speaker 2>of reasons.

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<v Speaker 1>Are you surprised to see so much backlash towards this proposal?

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely not. I mean you just remember a few years ago,

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<v Speaker 2>twenty nineteen, I think it was that Chamberlaine Park golf

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<v Speaker 2>course and Mount Albert. The local board they're proposed to

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<v Speaker 2>remove half of it and make it nine holes and

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<v Speaker 2>give some they definitely needed some sports facilities, community sports facilities,

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<v Speaker 2>and that caused a massive backclash. The board was voted out,

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<v Speaker 2>the proposal was put on hold or supported. Now so,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm absolutely not surprised. It seems like this happens whenever

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<v Speaker 2>a golf course is in any way threatened with some

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<v Speaker 2>sort of different use remu edit golf course another one

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<v Speaker 2>where where Bill Golf is talking about potentially using it

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<v Speaker 2>for a different purpose than the local board. The Orducky

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<v Speaker 2>local Board extended its least betweenty ninety one, I think.

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<v Speaker 2>So this seems to happen just about every time, And

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<v Speaker 2>just for context, the council owns. I think thirteen golf

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<v Speaker 2>courses an autant and there is something like forty three overall,

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<v Speaker 2>so it's not a city that is short of golf courses,

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<v Speaker 2>but it's still it proves incredibly difficult to get rid

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<v Speaker 2>of any of them.

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<v Speaker 3>If the golf courses plan for eighteen holes and the

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<v Speaker 3>wetland proposal that they're proposed works, it covers the same

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<v Speaker 3>money and covers the same amount of space, then it

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<v Speaker 3>was it would stay a golf course, but they would

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<v Speaker 3>be up to the local board. If the council one

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<v Speaker 3>was the only one that was possible, be up to

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<v Speaker 3>the local board what to do in that remaining space,

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<v Speaker 3>So it could be mine, whole golf course and driving range,

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<v Speaker 3>it could be whatever the local board.

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<v Speaker 2>Went out with.

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<v Speaker 1>I did love the bit in your article about the

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<v Speaker 1>woman complaining about duck poo.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I thought, I mean this is I thought this

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<v Speaker 2>was one of the most furious arguments again redeveloping the

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<v Speaker 2>golf course. That was a local woman who says that

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<v Speaker 2>she likes to use the course to walk her dog.

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<v Speaker 2>And if there's a wet land, there'll be heaps of

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<v Speaker 2>ducks here, and the ducks or crapp everywhere, and then

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<v Speaker 2>the dog it seems will be mainlining the duck poo

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<v Speaker 2>and the story that was the story from staff and

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<v Speaker 2>it had a picture of the dog looking very forlornly

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<v Speaker 2>into the middle distance, which I think was probably the

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<v Speaker 2>dog contemplating it set to eating duck footh.

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<v Speaker 1>I love how it was just like the title of

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<v Speaker 1>the image, just look looking towards its future of duck

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<v Speaker 1>oo meals it.

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<v Speaker 2>Didn't look happy about it. Now I know this is

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<v Speaker 2>this is one of the more low costs golf courses.

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<v Speaker 2>And Chamberlain part was the same where it's not just

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<v Speaker 2>the toity toity rich members of society. He use it.

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<v Speaker 2>And so there's an argument from like an an equity

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<v Speaker 2>perspective to keep as much of this golf course as possible.

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<v Speaker 2>But you just couldn't take a better argument. For you,

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<v Speaker 2>if you're going to try to do away with some

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<v Speaker 2>of the golf course and maybe keep nine holes, then

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<v Speaker 2>literally people died and we need a place to store

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<v Speaker 2>water so that that will never happen again, and homes

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<v Speaker 2>and businesses were destroyed. And if even there's going to

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<v Speaker 2>be a time that a golf course actually goes then

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<v Speaker 2>it's probably this time, but I still give it up.

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<v Speaker 2>I think my last pods was given them a twenty

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<v Speaker 2>five to the council twenty five percent jump. I sort

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<v Speaker 2>of offer it between that.

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<v Speaker 1>I saw a figure on Golf New Zealand's website that

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<v Speaker 1>last year golf club membership sat at about one hundred

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<v Speaker 1>and forty two thousand, eight hundred and eighty registrations nationwide.

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<v Speaker 1>New Zealand has more than four hundred golf courses, which

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<v Speaker 1>is apparently the second in the world per capita, behind Scotland.

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<v Speaker 1>Why do we need all of them?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I would argue, and I have argued in the past,

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<v Speaker 2>that we don't and I have really no problem with

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<v Speaker 2>having a heap of golf courses. People enjoy them used.

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<v Speaker 2>But when when they're on public land in places that

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<v Speaker 2>could be used for any manner of community facilities or

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<v Speaker 2>even housing to address the housing crisis, that's sort of

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<v Speaker 2>where it starts getting a bit techier. In this case,

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<v Speaker 2>it's where it's needed to prevent flooding that could damage

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<v Speaker 2>lives of businesses or homes. Takapuna is one of the

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<v Speaker 2>cheapest courses, but also located right next to Smails Farm

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<v Speaker 2>in the middle of the heap of housing developments, a

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<v Speaker 2>heap of business, and it's public land that we're not

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<v Speaker 2>getting a huge return on that for sure, and so

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<v Speaker 2>I would argue that, look, we should be able to

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<v Speaker 2>use some of these courses for different purposes, particularly when

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<v Speaker 2>they're in dense urban areas, right next to public transport

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<v Speaker 2>in the middle of housing development.

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<v Speaker 1>Does it feel a bit like the council's hands are

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<v Speaker 1>tied here. It's not like we need a law change

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<v Speaker 1>to get this done. The council could do this tomorrow,

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<v Speaker 1>but the public just doesn't want to let them.

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<v Speaker 2>I think that it's really just the political consequences that

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<v Speaker 2>people fear, and it is, as you say, it's council land.

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<v Speaker 2>They should be able to do what they like with it.

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<v Speaker 2>But it has proved incredibly difficult to just get over

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<v Speaker 2>the amount of angst and lobbying that any proposals to

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<v Speaker 2>get rid of a golf course generates. I remember going

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<v Speaker 2>to a meeting about Chamberlain Park and one of the

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<v Speaker 2>local board members, I think it might have been Peter

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<v Speaker 2>Hayes being referred to as Judas Haines or something like that.

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<v Speaker 2>Grahams maybe Judas Es. There's pretty vehement opposition to it.

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<v Speaker 2>It can often have political ramifications for the local councilors

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<v Speaker 2>or local board members, and so I think there's a

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<v Speaker 2>reticence Todre to coect the hornet's nest, so to speak.

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<v Speaker 1>Thanks for joining us, Hayden, thanks a lot.

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<v Speaker 4>Chelsea to talk us through the golf course and Auckland

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<v Speaker 4>Council's views on it.

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<v Speaker 1>We're joined now by Nsitt Herald reporter Benjamin Plumber. Benjamin,

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<v Speaker 1>can you talk about the Takapoona Golf Club's alternate proposal

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<v Speaker 1>to wal Auckland councils suggested?

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, So the Takapuna Golf Club wants the retain the

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<v Speaker 5>courses eighteen holes and proposes a dry base on which

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<v Speaker 5>would create a flood retention zone. And both ideas are

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<v Speaker 5>now being stacked up against each other by the Auckland

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<v Speaker 5>Council and it.

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<v Speaker 1>Seems like to me that the alternate option, they're pretty

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<v Speaker 1>confident that they're going to hit that five hundred and

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<v Speaker 1>fifty million leaders as well taught me through that. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 5>So the council's proposal to restore part of the park

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<v Speaker 5>area to a wetland and dry detention areas which will

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<v Speaker 5>increase flood storage, which they say will be a minimum

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<v Speaker 5>from sixty million leaders to five hundred and fifty million leaders,

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<v Speaker 5>which is about equivalent to two hundred and twenty Olympic

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<v Speaker 5>swimming pools. And they say that any alternative plan would

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<v Speaker 5>need to hold this amount as a minimum.

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<v Speaker 1>So I understand that local golfing hero Ryan Fox has

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<v Speaker 1>now come out of the would work in favor of

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<v Speaker 1>the revised plan.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey, yeah, he has.

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<v Speaker 3>So.

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<v Speaker 5>Ryan was playing it tech Burner Golf Club Whindow. He's

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<v Speaker 5>trying to get on the PGA Tour. He's now two

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<v Speaker 5>time PGA Tour winner, and he had a message over

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<v Speaker 5>the weekend just throwing his support behind retaining the full

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<v Speaker 5>eighteen hole course. He says it the club provides affordable

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<v Speaker 5>access to the game for those wanting to get into

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<v Speaker 5>the sport. And you know, it's really exploded in like

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<v Speaker 5>the numbers. The number of golfers has exploded since COVID.

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<v Speaker 5>I think Golf New Zealand reported a fifty percent growth

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<v Speaker 5>club memberships in the last five years, so you know

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<v Speaker 5>there's record participation numbers at the moment. In Ryan Fox

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<v Speaker 5>says the techapun of golf course is a significant public

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<v Speaker 5>asset that provides a great service to golf in New Zealand.

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<v Speaker 1>I think a lot of us have this view of

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<v Speaker 1>golf as being a rich person sport. I saw a

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<v Speaker 1>quote from Golf and z ED CEO Jeff Latch where

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<v Speaker 1>he said that golf is the most played sport in

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<v Speaker 1>New Zealand, attracting more than five hundred thousand participants annually

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<v Speaker 1>now first off, and initially I was like, oh, I

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<v Speaker 1>saw that this morning, and I was like, Okay, that

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<v Speaker 1>seems a bit odd to me. But after consulting some

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<v Speaker 1>of our colleagues from the Sports department, including Newstalk ZBS

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<v Speaker 1>Andrew Olderson, I've come around to it.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, no, it's it's obviously, like I said, it's grown

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<v Speaker 5>in popularity in recent years, and you know, it's a

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<v Speaker 5>game for everyone. Anyone can sort of get involved and

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<v Speaker 5>get started at any age of their life. Rugby where

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<v Speaker 5>you often started as a kid and play through, but yeah,

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<v Speaker 5>a lot of people can start at whatever age. So

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<v Speaker 5>just on the point that golf is expensive, a lot

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<v Speaker 5>of clubs are, but Takapuna, for example, it's one of

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<v Speaker 5>only two public courses in Auckland and very accessible, very

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<v Speaker 5>very cheap, so it would be quite a big loss

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<v Speaker 5>for those wanting to get into golf.

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<v Speaker 6>I've encourage as much speed intemperance as possibly can quickly

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<v Speaker 6>to say it doesn't have you always best because there

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<v Speaker 6>is out We'll have a look at that when it comes.

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<v Speaker 1>And how has Auckland Council responded to all of this.

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<v Speaker 5>Auckland Council at the moment, so they're working hard to

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<v Speaker 5>balance the needs of the wire Ow community and those

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<v Speaker 5>that use the land. At the moment, they say they've

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<v Speaker 5>seen great support for golf and say they'll do whatever

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<v Speaker 5>they can to accommodate recreational needs, including golf. But they

0:13:26.240 --> 0:13:29.320
<v Speaker 5>say what they won't do is prioritize them over the

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<v Speaker 5>urgent need to protect people's lives and properties from extreme flooding.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, both plans are being considered at the moment, things

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<v Speaker 1>like costs and the differences between the proposals and those

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<v Speaker 1>of we shared after the reviewers complete I believe next week.

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<v Speaker 5>Yes, correct, they say they're currently in the final stages

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<v Speaker 5>of anate feasibility assessment of Takapoona's plan, Takapoona Golf Club's plan,

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<v Speaker 5>and that's going to be concluded early next week. They

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<v Speaker 5>haven't given specifics on how much this will cost, but

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<v Speaker 5>the Auckland Council's original plan indicated costs of around fifty

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<v Speaker 5>seven million.

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<v Speaker 1>So we're expecting that announcement on Monday about the review

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<v Speaker 1>into the project. Then it'll be up to the local

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<v Speaker 1>board to make a decision that it'll go out to

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<v Speaker 1>the public. Do you think public and industry pushback could

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<v Speaker 1>overrule what the council wants to do in the end?

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<v Speaker 5>I think the just on the number of people that

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<v Speaker 5>have gone to these public meetings. You know, it's obviously

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<v Speaker 5>a hot topic at the moment, and speaking to the

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<v Speaker 5>Tech Golf Club, I know there's a lot of sport

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<v Speaker 5>for them as well as the rest of the golf

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<v Speaker 5>and community, so I know that they're not going to

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<v Speaker 5>just lie down without a fight. But I guess we'll

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<v Speaker 5>wait and see.

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<v Speaker 1>Thanks for joining us, Ben.

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<v Speaker 5>Thank you.

0:14:43.720 --> 0:14:46.840
<v Speaker 1>That's it for this episode of The Front Page. You

0:14:46.840 --> 0:14:50.680
<v Speaker 1>can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage

0:14:50.680 --> 0:14:54.720
<v Speaker 1>at enzadherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is

0:14:54.760 --> 0:14:58.480
<v Speaker 1>produced by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin, who is also

0:14:58.640 --> 0:15:03.320
<v Speaker 1>a sound engineer. I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to the front

0:15:03.320 --> 0:15:06.920
<v Speaker 1>page on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts, and

0:15:07.040 --> 0:15:12.640
<v Speaker 1>tune in tomorrow for another look behind the headlines.