1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,880 Speaker 1: I ever mentioned it, probably while mainly because nothing to 2 00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:05,800 Speaker 1: mention they are in the meeting. Still the meeting has 3 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:07,880 Speaker 1: taking place. Mind you, if you looked at earlier on 4 00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:10,799 Speaker 1: when we were featuring the chat around the dining table 5 00:00:11,320 --> 00:00:13,400 Speaker 1: where each of them got to say, you can see 6 00:00:13,400 --> 00:00:15,560 Speaker 1: why these things take so long, because as you hear 7 00:00:15,600 --> 00:00:19,040 Speaker 1: one person articulates something, everyone else sits around going mmmmm, 8 00:00:21,440 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 1: and so it goes right. Anyway, this is what Starmer 9 00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:24,560 Speaker 1: said before he went in. 10 00:00:24,720 --> 00:00:28,400 Speaker 2: A trilateral meeting seems the sensible next step. So thank 11 00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:31,240 Speaker 2: you for being prepared to take that forward, because I 12 00:00:31,280 --> 00:00:37,159 Speaker 2: think if we can ensure that that is the progress 13 00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:39,800 Speaker 2: out of this meeting, both security guarantees and some sort 14 00:00:39,800 --> 00:00:43,720 Speaker 2: of progress on trilateral meeting of some sort to bring 15 00:00:44,680 --> 00:00:47,400 Speaker 2: some of the difficult issues to a head, then I 16 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:50,760 Speaker 2: think today we'll be seen as a very important day 17 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:51,880 Speaker 2: in recent years. 18 00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:55,520 Speaker 1: Rod morning, to you, to you, So half of Europe. 19 00:00:55,520 --> 00:00:57,120 Speaker 1: No one's left in Britain, of course, because half of 20 00:00:57,160 --> 00:00:59,360 Speaker 1: Europe is in Washington as we speak at the big 21 00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 1: meeting in the chain way as Starmer left. What hope 22 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:05,440 Speaker 1: does Britain see that this could end? 23 00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:10,959 Speaker 3: Well? More hope than we had. I think yesterday, and 24 00:01:11,080 --> 00:01:17,400 Speaker 3: indeed on Saturday, Friday and Saturday our time, one had 25 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:23,360 Speaker 3: only fully grave reservations about the Trump Putin summit, especially 26 00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:28,560 Speaker 3: given the treatment meeted out to Vladimir Putin by Donald Trump. 27 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:33,959 Speaker 3: And since then the European leaders have been ringing Donald 28 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 3: Trump and speaking with greater and greater urgency to him, 29 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:42,479 Speaker 3: which is to say, you know, Russia can't come out 30 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:44,800 Speaker 3: of this with more land than it has of the moment, 31 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 3: which is one of the central issues. But now we've 32 00:01:49,160 --> 00:01:55,000 Speaker 3: had both Zelensky and indeed Sekir Starma Zelensky said needs 33 00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:58,280 Speaker 3: have been the best talk so far, and Starma saying 34 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:01,560 Speaker 3: that he's in that they can make real progress to 35 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:04,480 Speaker 3: end the war, that a trilateral meeting is the sensible 36 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 3: next step, and it would be a historical step forward. 37 00:02:09,280 --> 00:02:11,440 Speaker 3: I think that comes about if you look at what 38 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:18,880 Speaker 3: Vladimia putinies has offered us his conditions for peace. If 39 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:22,600 Speaker 3: Russia got the whole of the Don Bass, I think 40 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:28,120 Speaker 3: that Britain, France, Germany would complain. I think there would 41 00:02:28,120 --> 00:02:31,799 Speaker 3: be fury amongst the Western European leaders if that happened, 42 00:02:31,800 --> 00:02:35,680 Speaker 3: apart from in Hungary obviously, but if there could be 43 00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:38,800 Speaker 3: suddenly or done which involved just part of the donbassali 44 00:02:38,919 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 3: the Eastern region that it is split into two. Then 45 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:46,079 Speaker 3: I think that's more likely. That's something which is possible 46 00:02:46,120 --> 00:02:50,000 Speaker 3: to achieve. But that being said, it's a long way 47 00:02:50,040 --> 00:02:51,280 Speaker 3: away yet, Yes, it is. 48 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:54,720 Speaker 1: What's more important to a Starma or Europe for that matter. 49 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:58,639 Speaker 1: Is it the security guarantee that if you give put 50 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:00,800 Speaker 1: in a chunk of land, that's it and we believe 51 00:03:00,880 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: that's it, or is it just the security guarantee and 52 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:05,600 Speaker 1: you give away any thing you want because it's not 53 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:06,520 Speaker 1: yours in the first place. 54 00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:09,840 Speaker 3: I think it's it's two or three things. Firstly, a 55 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:12,280 Speaker 3: domestic political front. He needs to be seen to be 56 00:03:12,360 --> 00:03:17,000 Speaker 3: strong Starma, and he's been reasonably strong on Ukraine, not 57 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:20,120 Speaker 3: as strong perhaps as Boris Johnson, but still reasonably strong. 58 00:03:21,520 --> 00:03:25,400 Speaker 3: Then on the more pragmatic rends, Western Europe really does 59 00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:29,840 Speaker 3: not want to see Vladimir Putin rewarded for his invasion 60 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:34,200 Speaker 3: in twenty twenty two because they fear, with some justification, 61 00:03:34,280 --> 00:03:36,960 Speaker 3: that it could lead to another invasion, either of Ukraine 62 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 3: again or indeed of one of the Baltic states or 63 00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 3: mold Over wherever. So that is the strategically important thing. 64 00:03:45,680 --> 00:03:48,400 Speaker 3: I think the third important thing for Starma is to 65 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 3: ensure that what ever happens at this meeting, there is 66 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:56,120 Speaker 3: no rifft to be seen between the Western European leaders 67 00:03:56,600 --> 00:04:03,920 Speaker 3: and Donald Trump, because this meeting kind of is it 68 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:07,800 Speaker 3: written to amount of possibilities that NATO could be under threat. 69 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:09,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, well, if you go back to the beginning, that 70 00:04:10,040 --> 00:04:12,640 Speaker 1: was what I mean. When Trump stormed into office, he 71 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:14,720 Speaker 1: basically said, well, you know, NATO's a pain, and you've 72 00:04:14,720 --> 00:04:16,839 Speaker 1: only paid two percent, and you need to pay five percent, 73 00:04:16,880 --> 00:04:18,880 Speaker 1: and you've been doing nothing in America pays the bills 74 00:04:18,880 --> 00:04:20,200 Speaker 1: and the whole thing look for a while to be 75 00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:24,400 Speaker 1: a complete cluster. Is Starmer in lockstep with Europe. 76 00:04:25,279 --> 00:04:31,400 Speaker 3: Probably slightly more inclined to the American position than the 77 00:04:31,400 --> 00:04:38,600 Speaker 3: French or Germans, but nowhere near us closely aligned. You 78 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:41,320 Speaker 3: know that some of the visit grab states are aligned 79 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:45,600 Speaker 3: with were allied actually with Russia. If we're honest, I 80 00:04:45,640 --> 00:04:49,520 Speaker 3: think Starmer sees himself in some justification it was a 81 00:04:49,640 --> 00:04:53,520 Speaker 3: kind of mid Atlantic stepping stone between the Europe and 82 00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 3: the USA, and that's certainly the role which has been 83 00:04:57,680 --> 00:05:01,359 Speaker 3: playing for the last year. Didn't he before that before 84 00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:03,520 Speaker 3: even he was he became Prime minister. 85 00:05:03,640 --> 00:05:05,800 Speaker 1: All right, might catch up on Thursday. Appreciate it very much. 86 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:07,440 Speaker 1: Rot a little out of Britain, just a couple of 87 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:09,719 Speaker 1: things in that particular part of the world. For more 88 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:12,880 Speaker 1: from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to news talks. 89 00:05:12,880 --> 00:05:16,080 Speaker 1: It'd be from six am weekdays, or follow the podcast 90 00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:17,000 Speaker 1: on iHeartRadio.