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Speaker 1: Tuesday morning, Prime Minister Crystal Blackson's with us. Very good

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Speaker 1: morning to you.

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Speaker 2: Good morning Mike.

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Speaker 1: Now let me up. Are you aware of the Winston

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Speaker 1: pulp and paper mills thing in Awakuni.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm a where mills under huge pressure with rising

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Speaker 2: energy costs across the country.

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Speaker 1: Actually, right, how can we run a country and an

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Speaker 1: economy far less a couple of mills if we can't

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Speaker 1: afford the power bill?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, that's exactly the reason why we're reversing the

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Speaker 2: oil and gas band because the problem that we've got

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Speaker 2: is that band was announced in the second and third

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Speaker 2: order implications we're considered and we're feeling that right now

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Speaker 2: because we don't have enough gas in the country and

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Speaker 2: as a result, we need it for a number of

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Speaker 2: a boilers, we need it for the mills, we need

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Speaker 2: it for a number of places, and we can't get

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Speaker 2: enough of it. And so that's why we've got a

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Speaker 2: gas a play group working together. But frankly, this is

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Speaker 2: a consequence of a decision taken by the our journe

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Speaker 2: government without thinking through the consequences. We need gas for

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Speaker 2: a number of decades as a transitionary source of energy

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Speaker 2: before you get to Nirvana with full renewable but as

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Speaker 2: a result, without it in the system and with a

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Speaker 2: shortage of it in the system, electricity and energy prices

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Speaker 2: are going up, and for people like pulp and paper

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Speaker 2: walls in particular and others, that cause a huge pressure.

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Speaker 1: When Shane Jones says last week we were paying the

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Speaker 1: most for electricity in the developed world, is he right?

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Speaker 2: Look? I think. I mean, I haven't checked every single country,

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Speaker 2: so I wouldn't want to say that, but he is

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Speaker 2: right in a sense of we've had massive escalation and

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Speaker 2: energy prices and that is impacting some of our industrial base.

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Speaker 2: Now if you think about Fronterra and others that use boilers,

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Speaker 2: if you think about the malls as you have identified,

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Speaker 2: you think about schools and hospitals, and we still have

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Speaker 2: huge reliance upon gas. We need it, frankly, because if

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Speaker 2: we're going to be one hundred percent reliable on renewables,

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Speaker 2: we make levels are low. When it doesn't you know,

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Speaker 2: it's not funny and one doesn't blow, we're going to

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Speaker 2: need gas to make sure that we can keep the

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Speaker 2: lights on.

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Speaker 1: Right. Have you followed at all Northport's desire to expand

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Speaker 1: their business and the rejection from the council. His story.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I read that report yesterday and I just say,

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Speaker 2: you know, that is a classic case where you need

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Speaker 2: fast track one stuff. And I know people want to

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Speaker 2: pose us on that, but I'm sorry it is happening

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Speaker 2: because that is exactly the situation when you have a

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Speaker 2: regional project of significance like that that drives economic activity,

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Speaker 2: high paying jobs, or a national project. That's why we

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Speaker 2: want people to be able to use that mechanism to

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Speaker 2: get those projects delivered and done. So you know, I

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Speaker 2: won't go into specifics in the merits whether you know

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Speaker 2: they've got a case of fast track or not, but

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Speaker 2: you'd look at it and go, when we've got projects

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Speaker 2: generating economic activity and jobs, the whole point is that

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Speaker 2: shouldn't get blocked up. It should be getting done so

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Speaker 2: they can get that benefit into the country quicker.

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Speaker 1: Yes, exactly. So the councils accepted that the expansion plan

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Speaker 1: would result in more than a billion dollars worth of

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Speaker 1: wider economic activity annually, supporting up for sixteen thousand jobs,

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Speaker 1: and yet they still turned it down.

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Speaker 2: Yep. And I thought it was on cold eversation, environmental benefits.

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Speaker 2: I can't that is insane because essentially we need economic

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Speaker 2: activity in this country. We cannot turn off growth and

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Speaker 2: we cannot turn off economic development. And that's why we

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Speaker 2: want to do this fast track one stop because it

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Speaker 2: has got nuts. Obviously, the resource CONSENTI process is doubled,

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Speaker 2: the cost has gone through the roof. It takes an

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Speaker 2: ordinant amount of time to do things in this country

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Speaker 2: relative to other countries. And modern reliable infrastructure is one

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Speaker 2: of the five ways in which we actually left our

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Speaker 2: economic productivity and make me Zeel a more wealthy and

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Speaker 2: prosperous place. And so you know the reason we're building

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Speaker 2: a flay highway, form a quantupunga day and then to

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Speaker 2: be able to create economic opportunity. Those things unlock. Infrastructure

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Speaker 2: unlocks all of that exactly.

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Speaker 1: Speaking of Northland, do Transpower oh that region a significant

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Speaker 1: amount of money.

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Speaker 2: Well, I'll let Simmy and Brown work his way through that.

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Speaker 2: But I mean, there wasn't their finest moment.

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Speaker 1: What is the government's role in that? If Transpower turned

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Speaker 1: out to be a bunch of bastards.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to leave that to Simian. I know he's

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Speaker 2: all over it and incredibly frustrated by it. He went

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Speaker 2: up and actually saw the situation himself in the first

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Speaker 2: day or two, and he'll work it through with them,

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Speaker 2: and nor font.

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Speaker 1: Have they handled themselves well so far? Transpower and MIXIM well.

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Speaker 2: You'd like them to. I would personally, I think you

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Speaker 2: know when you screw up and when you when you

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Speaker 2: make a mistake, I should come out and say so,

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Speaker 2: and you should communicate to such quickly and early. There

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Speaker 2: probably wasn't as lucid communication at the very beginning, was

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Speaker 2: my observation of that.

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Speaker 1: Effect all are you selling Keywi Bank?

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Speaker 2: No, no, no, We're doing a review into banks in general,

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Speaker 2: and we want to make sure that it's competitive and

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Speaker 2: understand what else we can do to make it more competitive.

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Speaker 1: I think we have one of the things to make

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Speaker 1: it more competitive be to sell Keywi Bank.

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Speaker 2: That's not that's not the topic of discussion. We haven't

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Speaker 2: had that discussion. What we've talked about is actually opening

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Speaker 2: up a banking review both through the Finance Expensi Committee

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Speaker 2: and the Primary Production. We are concerned about rural banking practices.

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Speaker 2: We're concerned about the level of competition and profitability and

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Speaker 2: margin with the New Zealand banks.

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Speaker 1: So Nicola Willis didn't raise the subject broadly. You'll get

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Speaker 1: together in that cold haul over the weekend in any way,

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Speaker 1: shape or form.

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Speaker 2: She referenced it in her speech, as you well know.

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Speaker 2: But again, we're up for anything and everything that includes

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Speaker 2: getting more competition to the market. But in fairness, we

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Speaker 2: need to start at that review with the banks first

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Speaker 2: and foremost, and then will work out the best way

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Speaker 2: to what we'll do after that.

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Speaker 1: So in being up for anything and everything that presumably

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Speaker 1: means selling key we bank, then doesn't it potential?

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Speaker 2: Well, the first order of effect is actually to bring

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Speaker 2: in the cheers and CEOs of the banks and worked

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Speaker 2: out what the hell's going on. I am concerned in

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Speaker 2: rural banking in particular that they also have been charged

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Speaker 2: higher interest rates under some pressure at different times by

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Speaker 2: their banks. I'm concerned, you know that I want to

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Speaker 2: look at bank profitability and margins relative to other parts

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Speaker 2: of the world, and I make sure we've got a

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Speaker 2: competitive market and we've also got a fair market.

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Speaker 1: Okay, As regards education generally, the eighty four percent opposition

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Speaker 1: that ECE regulation changes, which is I think I'm right

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Speaker 1: in saying they're sort of act driven. But Erica Stanford

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Speaker 1: was on the program yesterday, obviously on this maths business,

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Speaker 1: and all I heard from our newsroom were a bunch

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Speaker 1: of unionists whining about how it's not you know, we're

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Speaker 1: doing fine, et cetera, et cetera. She said, don't we're

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Speaker 1: not doing fine? Well, no, exactly, I know we're all

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Speaker 1: we I mean, you can't argue with the fact we're

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Speaker 1: not doing fine. She said, you don't listen to the unions.

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Speaker 1: We've got to stop listening to the unions. Does she

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Speaker 1: have a fear point?

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean they can criticize us as much as

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Speaker 2: they want. I mean, we're coming out to we're worried

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Speaker 2: about parents, and we're worried about kids, and so no disrespect.

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Speaker 2: But when four out of five of our kids are

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Speaker 2: not READI coded to do math high school, that is

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Speaker 2: a major, major problem. When three out of five of

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Speaker 2: them are actually more than a year behind where they

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Speaker 2: should be, major major problems. So we are moving heaven

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Speaker 2: and earth to make sure we pull that curriculum ford

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Speaker 2: a year. We've now got the Teaching Council good on them.

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Speaker 2: They've responded to that same data and said, you know,

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Speaker 2: we've got to actually put an entry level requirement that

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Speaker 2: teachers coming into the system can have a lot called

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Speaker 2: form sex or level two maths, which would be good

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Speaker 2: because they're not being they ever felt confident to teach

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Speaker 2: maths to our kids. We're putting more money into professional

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Speaker 2: dealings for the existing teachers. We're doing two years the assessments.

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Speaker 2: We've got error in our focus on achievement and earlier

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Speaker 2: interventions around schools not achieving academically. So you know, look,

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Speaker 2: there's only two things we've got to do with our

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Speaker 2: kids at the moment in education, and we might you know,

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Speaker 2: we're sacrificing it and we want to push back the

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Speaker 2: nice to do stuff. We must do stuff is actually

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Speaker 2: teach our kids to read and teach them to do maths,

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Speaker 2: because how on earth do you get a four lane

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Speaker 2: highway from Aukland Finerray with the future generations they can't

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Speaker 2: do maths. How do you become the world leading country

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Speaker 2: and egre science if we don't have our kids knowing

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Speaker 2: how to do maths and to read properly.

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Speaker 1: So where I am on my point is that the

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Speaker 1: humans are arguing with you. They're saying you're wrong, and

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Speaker 1: it's only that you've had my money find it's just

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Speaker 1: the same old, same old.

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Speaker 2: Look, we are focused on outcomes, and there is no

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Speaker 2: way you can say anyone in New Zealand irrespect of

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Speaker 2: your politics. And there's not a political issue anymore to

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Speaker 2: New Zealand issue. Four out of five kids not ready

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Speaker 2: to go for maths into high school. And if you're

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Speaker 2: a thirteen year old and you sharp at high school

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Speaker 2: and you do mass like a ten or eleven year old,

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Speaker 2: no wonder you don't want to be at school anymore.

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Speaker 2: So then it links very quickly into attendance. So you know,

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Speaker 2: we're focused on two things achievement maths and reading and

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Speaker 2: attendance get kids to school. And if we can just

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Speaker 2: do those basics, well, and that may well mean that, yes,

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Speaker 2: we're going to defer our arts and music curriculum for now,

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Speaker 2: but we're going to focus on doing everything to get

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Speaker 2: those jobs done.

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Speaker 1: Right. Can you explain how it was you ever expected

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Speaker 1: a teacher who couldn't even get NCEEA Level two maths

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Speaker 1: to teach maths was going to work? How's that possible?

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Speaker 2: Well, well, that's been a challenge because you know, I

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Speaker 2: remember looking at the days of a year and a

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Speaker 2: half ago, forty percent that our teachers teaching year four kids,

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Speaker 2: which are nine year olds, don't feel enough, don't have

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Speaker 2: confidence to teach maths properly.

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Speaker 1: So has the never passed the starting I mean, what

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Speaker 1: do you expect?

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Speaker 2: It hasn't been a requirement, hasn't been a requirement, and

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Speaker 2: now it will be going forward?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I know you're fixing it. I mean this goes

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Speaker 1: back to this conversation we keep having every week, which

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Speaker 1: is like, I just can't understand the idiocy that's driven

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Speaker 1: this country. How do you expect a teacher who can't

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Speaker 1: do maths then go along and teach maths. It doesn't work,

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Speaker 1: It was never going to It doesn't work.

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Speaker 2: It doesn't work. But the point is, I can't wallow

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Speaker 2: in the past, Bok. I have to focus on the future.

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Speaker 2: So I have to deal with the set of facts

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Speaker 2: and cards that I've been dealt and I'm trying to

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Speaker 2: fix things. And so one of the things we've got

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Speaker 2: to fix is clearly mathsive reading and education in general.

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Speaker 2: So we're being ruthlessly focused on saying we want everybody

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Speaker 2: coming to the Ministry of Education, everyone going to school today,

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Speaker 2: every parent to be getting their kids to school, to

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Speaker 2: focus on reading and mathematics and attendance because those are

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Speaker 2: the things that are going to set New Zealand up

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Speaker 2: for success, and so have kids up for success. And

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Speaker 2: you know, as I keep saying, I'm passionate about education

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Speaker 2: because I'm a kid who you know, parents have scoro

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Speaker 2: at fifteen sixteen, I did well because they had a

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Speaker 2: good education. And I want that for every key WEEKID,

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Speaker 2: irrespective where they come from, or what background they come

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Speaker 2: from or home life. So we've got to do this

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Speaker 2: and we've got to be you know, and we're going

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Speaker 2: to do it at speed, and we're going to do

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Speaker 2: it with ruthless focus and frankly, commentators pundits can say

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Speaker 2: what Union can say whatever the hell they want, but

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Speaker 2: we're to getting this job done.

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Speaker 1: Appreciate your time. Chris Well luxem Prime Minister. Tuesday Morning's

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Speaker 1: on The Mic Asking Breakfast. For more from The Mic

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Speaker 1: Asking Breakfast, listen live to news talks. It'd be from

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Speaker 1: six am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio