1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:01,880 Speaker 1: So let's talk be another call for a freeze on 2 00:00:01,920 --> 00:00:04,520 Speaker 1: excise tax. Australia is just frozen. There's on the draft beer. 3 00:00:04,559 --> 00:00:06,440 Speaker 1: So the pub business is doing it hard over there. 4 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:08,560 Speaker 1: At the moment, excise is up more than twenty percent 5 00:00:08,600 --> 00:00:11,520 Speaker 1: and five years consumptions fallen, which is part of the problem. 6 00:00:11,600 --> 00:00:13,720 Speaker 1: The government pulls in about four hundred and seventy million 7 00:00:13,760 --> 00:00:16,360 Speaker 1: dollars from brewers each year. Dylan Firth is the Bruce 8 00:00:16,400 --> 00:00:19,200 Speaker 1: Association executive director and as well as Dylan, very good 9 00:00:19,239 --> 00:00:19,840 Speaker 1: morning to you. 10 00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:21,600 Speaker 2: Good morning Mike. 11 00:00:22,040 --> 00:00:25,560 Speaker 1: It's an interesting conundrum, isn't it what you're asking for 12 00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:26,720 Speaker 1: essentially as a handout. 13 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:30,600 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, if you look at Australia, they've frozen it, 14 00:00:30,640 --> 00:00:32,120 Speaker 2: but I think they're already one step ahead in the 15 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:34,400 Speaker 2: fact that they have a separate rate for kegs. So 16 00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:36,880 Speaker 2: that's draft beer, a beer that are poured out of taps. 17 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:38,800 Speaker 2: And so what we're saying is that in New Zealand 18 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:41,159 Speaker 2: that's something where we should go into first, so we 19 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:43,000 Speaker 2: can get some sort of parody there because at that 20 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:46,040 Speaker 2: lower rate it would be much better for businesses versus 21 00:00:46,040 --> 00:00:46,640 Speaker 2: just a freeze. 22 00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:48,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, but of course if you had no tax on 23 00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:50,800 Speaker 1: beer whatsoever, it'll be even better, wouldn't it. I mean, 24 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:53,159 Speaker 1: that's that's what we're arguing about. 25 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:55,600 Speaker 2: Look, no tax on anything would be great, but unfortunately, 26 00:00:55,680 --> 00:00:56,880 Speaker 2: you know, tax is one of the things that we 27 00:00:56,960 --> 00:00:58,480 Speaker 2: have to have. But one of the things about the 28 00:00:58,480 --> 00:01:00,960 Speaker 2: excise tax is that it's increased a year with CPI. 29 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 2: So while a lot of other taxes don't go up, 30 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:05,479 Speaker 2: XOS tax does. And what it's done is that it's 31 00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:07,640 Speaker 2: linked with CPI. So in the times when it is 32 00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:10,679 Speaker 2: tough and CPI is higher and people have less discretionary spend, 33 00:01:10,840 --> 00:01:13,240 Speaker 2: we're seeing businesses hit with higher tax rates. What we're 34 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:16,119 Speaker 2: saying is that, well, actually, this system overall doesn't really work. 35 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:19,360 Speaker 2: We've taken you know, one point two five billion dollars 36 00:01:19,360 --> 00:01:21,640 Speaker 2: in tax for the last five years straight now, when 37 00:01:21,640 --> 00:01:24,679 Speaker 2: it's been going up by twenty percent over that time. Overall, 38 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:26,440 Speaker 2: that's going to be unsustainable. 39 00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:27,919 Speaker 1: Yes, it is. What the reason I'm asking the questions 40 00:01:27,920 --> 00:01:30,200 Speaker 1: the way I'm asking is, I wonder if your problem 41 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:34,040 Speaker 1: is not actually money, it's just people are off beer 42 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:36,320 Speaker 1: because it's not as good for and people are working 43 00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:40,280 Speaker 1: that there's a global move against alcohol, and that's your issue, 44 00:01:40,319 --> 00:01:42,399 Speaker 1: not really what it costs. Is that fair or not. 45 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:45,320 Speaker 2: I think there's a combination of a number of things, 46 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:47,480 Speaker 2: and one of them is around people choosing to moderate more, 47 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:50,240 Speaker 2: people are drinking less overall. We're seeing higher levels of 48 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 2: zero percent beer consumption. You know, we're seeing less levels 49 00:01:53,760 --> 00:01:57,280 Speaker 2: of harmful drinking as well as lower levels of drinking overall. 50 00:01:57,320 --> 00:02:00,560 Speaker 2: Although those are slightly different. What we do see those 51 00:02:00,600 --> 00:02:03,040 Speaker 2: is that people are still enjoying a bear and one 52 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:05,080 Speaker 2: of the things that's happening is that they are not 53 00:02:05,160 --> 00:02:07,120 Speaker 2: going out as much, so they'll be choosing to drink 54 00:02:07,120 --> 00:02:08,519 Speaker 2: at home. So we used to see a kind of 55 00:02:08,600 --> 00:02:11,880 Speaker 2: forty sixty percent split of bars versus hospitality. Now it's 56 00:02:11,919 --> 00:02:14,200 Speaker 2: about fifteen percent of beer sold an on premise, and 57 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:16,119 Speaker 2: part of that is price, and a lot of that's 58 00:02:16,200 --> 00:02:18,120 Speaker 2: driven by the cost of the product, and a lot 59 00:02:18,120 --> 00:02:19,960 Speaker 2: of the cost of the product in this case is tax. 60 00:02:20,280 --> 00:02:22,240 Speaker 2: So what we're saying is that if you split it 61 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:24,679 Speaker 2: a little bit more better, or hospitality venues to have 62 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:27,440 Speaker 2: their own care grape similar to what was in Australia, 63 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:29,959 Speaker 2: then would see that hospitality venues probably wouldn't have to 64 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:31,640 Speaker 2: push as much to get their margins. They need to 65 00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:34,160 Speaker 2: stay open so we don't lose these venues and ultimately 66 00:02:34,200 --> 00:02:36,440 Speaker 2: people don't lose those socialized spaces. 67 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:39,760 Speaker 1: Well, argued Dylan Firth, who is the Bruce Association executive director. 68 00:02:39,840 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 1: And my suggestion is in a country where we pay 69 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:43,760 Speaker 1: nine to ten billion dollars a year on the interest 70 00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 1: on our debt, reducing your revenue from the government's point 71 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:48,440 Speaker 1: of view is a no go. 72 00:02:49,040 --> 00:02:51,960 Speaker 2: For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to 73 00:02:52,040 --> 00:02:55,120 Speaker 2: news talks that'd be from six am weekdays, or follow 74 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:56,720 Speaker 2: the podcast on iHeartRadio.