1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:02,760 Speaker 1: Now, Labor Party leader Chris Hopkins is trying very hard 2 00:00:02,759 --> 00:00:05,800 Speaker 1: to pretend he doesn't care about Winston Peter's ruling out 3 00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:07,920 Speaker 1: ever working with him again. Stuart Nash is a former 4 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:10,160 Speaker 1: Labour Party cabinet memberinct. 5 00:00:09,600 --> 00:00:11,639 Speaker 2: Most people in the Labor Party look at Winston Peters 6 00:00:11,640 --> 00:00:13,040 Speaker 2: and I think we'd rather not have to work with 7 00:00:13,119 --> 00:00:13,600 Speaker 2: him anyway. 8 00:00:13,760 --> 00:00:15,760 Speaker 1: Plenty of water to flow under the bridge before the 9 00:00:15,760 --> 00:00:16,280 Speaker 1: next selection. 10 00:00:16,600 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 2: Got My goal is to grow Labors vote as large as. 11 00:00:19,280 --> 00:00:21,000 Speaker 1: I can there. He is trying very hard to pretend 12 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 1: he doesn't care. Stuart Nash is a former Labor Party 13 00:00:23,360 --> 00:00:26,160 Speaker 1: cabinet minister and with us now, hey, Stu, hey, how 14 00:00:26,160 --> 00:00:29,200 Speaker 1: are you? He sounds a bit flat though, doesn't he Well. 15 00:00:29,880 --> 00:00:31,479 Speaker 2: First of all, before I make any commentary in this, 16 00:00:31,520 --> 00:00:33,360 Speaker 2: I do want to say I've got no insights on 17 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:35,960 Speaker 2: this whatsoever. I haven't spoken to Winston about this or Chris, 18 00:00:36,840 --> 00:00:41,240 Speaker 2: but you know, Hopkins has got a well Labor Actually 19 00:00:41,360 --> 00:00:43,560 Speaker 2: it's a very interesting dilemma here because of course Labor 20 00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:46,800 Speaker 2: wants to grow their vote. It's not inconceivable, Heather, that 21 00:00:46,920 --> 00:00:49,600 Speaker 2: Labor could get let's say thirty five thirty six at 22 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:53,000 Speaker 2: the next election. And you know, I live in the 23 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 2: regions and I spend a lot of time in the regions. 24 00:00:55,040 --> 00:00:58,280 Speaker 2: The only party at the moment that's resonating really with 25 00:00:58,880 --> 00:01:01,640 Speaker 2: good hard working men and woman is New zeald First. 26 00:01:01,720 --> 00:01:03,720 Speaker 2: I mean, Chris Luxem sort of alienated quite a few 27 00:01:03,720 --> 00:01:06,119 Speaker 2: of them. Labour has as well. They've become a bit 28 00:01:06,160 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 2: of a liberal party once again, a liberal, big city 29 00:01:09,280 --> 00:01:12,520 Speaker 2: party once again. The thing is is if you get 30 00:01:12,760 --> 00:01:16,039 Speaker 2: Labor at thirty six and then I'll turn to Reality 31 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:18,039 Speaker 2: and New Zealand vers is on fifteen, then you can 32 00:01:18,080 --> 00:01:21,200 Speaker 2: form a government. Imagine then that you had National on 33 00:01:21,280 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 2: thirty three, New Zealand First on fifteen, and Act on 34 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:26,399 Speaker 2: sort of five. I don't know what the numbers are, 35 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:29,360 Speaker 2: so you would so you'd have a choice between Labor 36 00:01:29,360 --> 00:01:33,279 Speaker 2: and New Zealand First or New Zealand First, National and Act. 37 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:36,640 Speaker 2: Now keep in mind Winston's only said he ruled out 38 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:39,320 Speaker 2: working with Chris Hopkins. I did not hear him say 39 00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:40,600 Speaker 2: he's ruled out working with Labor. 40 00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:43,280 Speaker 1: No, he hasn't. He's it's only Chris Sippins, which means 41 00:01:43,319 --> 00:01:45,400 Speaker 1: to you that Chip he's got a target on his back, 42 00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:46,720 Speaker 1: or should have at least. 43 00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:51,080 Speaker 2: Right Well, it's a really important conversation that Labour has 44 00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:53,400 Speaker 2: to have because you know, if you end up in 45 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:56,400 Speaker 2: a situation where Winston says, look, I'll work with Labor 46 00:01:56,400 --> 00:01:57,720 Speaker 2: and I'd prefer to be in a you know, a 47 00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:01,120 Speaker 2: two party coalition then a three party coalition, then Labor 48 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:04,280 Speaker 2: will have to make a very a very important decision 49 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:06,360 Speaker 2: around whether they say, because you know, I have no 50 00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:08,239 Speaker 2: doubt that Hipkins will be the leader going into the election, 51 00:02:09,080 --> 00:02:12,639 Speaker 2: we will that Hipkins will stand aside and will appoint 52 00:02:12,720 --> 00:02:16,400 Speaker 2: someone that Winston can work with, or no, we're not 53 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:17,560 Speaker 2: going to go into power. And now, the thing we 54 00:02:17,560 --> 00:02:19,720 Speaker 2: know about opposition is you don't have an ability to 55 00:02:19,720 --> 00:02:22,240 Speaker 2: influence anything. It's a complete and utter waste of time 56 00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:25,000 Speaker 2: from a political perspective. When you're in government, you get 57 00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:27,639 Speaker 2: to change the world. Right, So you go into politics 58 00:02:27,639 --> 00:02:30,919 Speaker 2: to be in government. So it is a really interesting dilimit. Now, 59 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:33,320 Speaker 2: it may be that that situation doesn't arise, but I 60 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:39,120 Speaker 2: can see a situation where that where the Labor cabinet, sorry, 61 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:42,800 Speaker 2: the Labor caucus, has to make a very important decision 62 00:02:42,800 --> 00:02:44,840 Speaker 2: around what they do in a post election environment. 63 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:46,320 Speaker 1: Problem is I'll tell you what the problem with them 64 00:02:46,360 --> 00:02:50,360 Speaker 1: stew Is that they I think they need to realize 65 00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:53,120 Speaker 1: how badly they need Winston, and in order for them 66 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:56,720 Speaker 1: to realize that, they need to realize that most people 67 00:02:56,840 --> 00:02:59,680 Speaker 1: do not want to see the Maldi Party in government, right. 68 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:01,960 Speaker 1: I don't think that. I don't know that they've realized 69 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:02,440 Speaker 1: that yet. 70 00:03:03,160 --> 00:03:04,880 Speaker 2: I don't know. I think they probably have. I mean, 71 00:03:04,919 --> 00:03:06,520 Speaker 2: you know, I've been urging them, Not that they listen 72 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:09,399 Speaker 2: to me, but I've been urging them to rule out 73 00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:11,959 Speaker 2: working with to Party Mary. I mean, I haven't spoken 74 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:14,760 Speaker 2: to one person that I know that says I know, 75 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 2: we'd love to see to Party Marray was the government. 76 00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 2: I don't know. I really don't know. Maybe closer the election, i'd. 77 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:24,840 Speaker 1: Rule that Jay and Willie Jackson thinks that Marty Party 78 00:03:24,919 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 1: totally fine. 79 00:03:26,080 --> 00:03:28,720 Speaker 2: Oh my god, no, No. I think if they don't 80 00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:30,880 Speaker 2: rule out to Party Marray as they hidden the election, 81 00:03:31,560 --> 00:03:34,440 Speaker 2: they haven't got a hope in hell of getting their 82 00:03:34,440 --> 00:03:35,960 Speaker 2: hands on the leaves of power. 83 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:39,040 Speaker 1: Okay, listen, you were the police minister, what's your insight 84 00:03:39,120 --> 00:03:41,640 Speaker 1: on whether the cops turn up to shoplifting under five 85 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:42,680 Speaker 1: hundred dollars? 86 00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:45,520 Speaker 2: Well, I would go, you know, I've been on your 87 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 2: show before talking about the systems the rest. I think 88 00:03:47,480 --> 00:03:50,040 Speaker 2: that's really important. You know, the cops got limited resources. 89 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:52,560 Speaker 2: I would rather they chase after you know, the pe 90 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:55,280 Speaker 2: dealers and those are of causing the most mischief. 91 00:03:56,160 --> 00:03:59,640 Speaker 1: Did that ring true for you, Well, I don't know. 92 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:02,720 Speaker 2: Minute. It sounds a little strange because please deploy resources 93 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:04,600 Speaker 2: based on needs. So if there's nothing much going on, 94 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:06,760 Speaker 2: then of course they'll turn up. But if there's that 95 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:10,920 Speaker 2: or they're chasing after someone who's committed a more serious crime, 96 00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 2: then they will go for the more serious crime. But 97 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:16,720 Speaker 2: it doesn't ring true that they just flatly refuse to 98 00:04:16,760 --> 00:04:19,120 Speaker 2: turn up and keeping a mind. Retail crime, man, it's 99 00:04:19,120 --> 00:04:21,320 Speaker 2: a killer if you've got to book some water store 100 00:04:21,320 --> 00:04:22,440 Speaker 2: and in the main street. 101 00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:24,880 Speaker 1: Absolutely, Stuart, thank you so much, appreciate it. Stuart Nash, 102 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:29,039 Speaker 1: former Labor Party minister. For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, 103 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:32,560 Speaker 1: listen live to news Talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, 104 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:34,920 Speaker 1: or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.