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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Saturday Morning with Jack Team podcast

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Speaker 1: from News Talks at Me. After a lengthy career in

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Speaker 1: Hollywood and beyond as the star of blockbusters like The

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Speaker 1: Hobbit and the revered BBC series Spooks, Richard Armitage has pivoted.

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Speaker 1: The actor known for his brooding scowl, has turned his

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Speaker 1: hand to the written word instead. Richard's second novel has

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Speaker 1: just been published. It's called The Cut, and Richard is

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Speaker 1: with us this morning.

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Speaker 2: Kilder kyodah, very good.

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Speaker 1: Thank you. You nailed the Kyoda spoken like someone who's

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Speaker 1: saying for the first time in their life.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, abs in my life.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah. It is great to be speaking with you.

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Speaker 1: Thank you so much for your time. I'm going to

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Speaker 1: start with a really basic question. Can you just give

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Speaker 1: us a little bit of context you tell us about

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Speaker 1: The Cut.

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Speaker 3: So, The Cut is my second novel. It was inspired

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Speaker 3: by a real conversation I had in the cemetery and

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Speaker 3: it's it's the story of a group of teenagers at

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Speaker 3: their graduation from high school. They're in celebration mode. One

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Speaker 3: of the girls tragically dies and one of her classmates

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Speaker 3: goes to prison. And then in the present day, a

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Speaker 3: filmmaker comes back to that village to make a found

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Speaker 3: footage horror movie.

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Speaker 2: But the horror movie.

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Speaker 3: Is not quite what it seems, And that's me trying

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Speaker 3: not to give spoilers away.

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Speaker 1: No, you did very well. I mean I think I

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Speaker 1: think you probably had all of us at the moment.

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Speaker 1: You see. This is inspired by a real conversation I

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Speaker 1: had in a symmetry. Yeah, yeah, it sounds well. I

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Speaker 1: mean it does sound slightly macab, but yeah, yeah, I

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Speaker 1: think you've nailed the balance and not giving and not

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Speaker 1: giving too much away. Talk to us then, about this

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Speaker 1: kind of process you've been on over the last couple

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Speaker 1: of years, because obviously storytelling is in your blood, but

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Speaker 1: you have seen a bit of a professional transition of sorts.

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Speaker 3: I have, And it's interesting because I've worked a lot

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Speaker 3: with Audible. I've been narrating a lot of other author's

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Speaker 3: incredible work and quite a diverse range of work. And

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Speaker 3: then Audible asked me if I'd be interested in writing

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Speaker 3: a crime thriller of my own, and I immediately said yes.

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Speaker 3: And then they talked about ghost writing, and I absolutely

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Speaker 3: said no, no, no, If I'm going to write this and

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Speaker 3: if I'm going to narrate this. These are going to

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Speaker 3: be my own words, and it's amazing. I hadn't quite

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Speaker 3: realized how many kind of stories I had plotted somewhere

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Speaker 3: in my head, and stories that kind of leap out

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Speaker 3: of things like a conversation in a cemetery. But yeah,

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Speaker 3: the books are audible audio first, so they're written for audio,

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Speaker 3: and then the print version is like a bonus extra

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Speaker 3: that I never expected.

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Speaker 1: And so how different is the writing process for a

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Speaker 1: book that is designed to be listened to rather than

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Speaker 1: in a book that is, you know, initially designed to

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Speaker 1: be read with ice.

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Speaker 3: Well, the way I work on it is to visualize

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Speaker 3: it as a piece of cinema or television, and then

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Speaker 3: I write it down in as sort of visceral way

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Speaker 3: as I can, focusing on dialogue and how it sounds

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Speaker 3: rather than what it looks like.

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Speaker 2: So for example, I.

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Speaker 3: Don't need to say he said with his Scottish accent

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Speaker 3: because the man you're going to hear the Scottish accent.

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Speaker 3: So it's slightly more pared back, and I'm kind of

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Speaker 3: leaning into atmosphere and I'm working with order. But at

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Speaker 3: the moment on book three, and we're trying to get

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Speaker 3: in a bit more soundscape, so it's a sort of

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Speaker 3: immersive experience at first.

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Speaker 1: It's interesting, it's almost it sort of harks back to

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Speaker 1: the good old days of radio plays and that kind

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Speaker 1: of thing.

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Speaker 2: Right exactly.

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Speaker 3: And I've I did an adaptation of Clarissa with Alison

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Speaker 3: Stedman years ago, and I miss radio plays. I mean,

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Speaker 3: I don't think any or I mean, I guess people

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Speaker 3: don't really listen to radio plays so much anymore. But

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Speaker 3: audio books have become a massive.

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Speaker 1: Industry, of course, I mean a phenomenon in such a

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Speaker 1: such a pleasurable way to kind of, you know, weave

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Speaker 1: a bit more storytelling in your life, into your life.

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Speaker 1: So do you think that, like, what, don't take this

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Speaker 1: the wrong way? What an audible se in you when

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Speaker 1: they came to you and said, would you like to

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Speaker 1: write a crime thriller? And this is what lead to

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Speaker 1: Geneva right at your first book? Yeah, Like, did they

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Speaker 1: know that you would be able to pull this off?

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Speaker 1: Because it's quite I mean it's quite a yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: quite a complex skill.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well I didn't know I could pull it off.

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Speaker 3: I'd never written anything longer than an essay for my

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Speaker 3: English A level, but I had written biography of character,

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Speaker 3: and you know, we did it in incrementally, so they said, look,

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Speaker 3: send us a story outline, send us a sample of

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Speaker 3: your writing before they actually approved it, and gain and

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Speaker 3: contracted me. But it turns out that I do have

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Speaker 3: a half decent turn of phrase. And I think I've

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Speaker 3: picked that up from working on, as I said, other audiobooks,

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Speaker 3: but also screenplay, just you know, looking at adaptation and

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Speaker 3: looking at listening to a lot of producers and directors

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Speaker 3: and editors and what works and what doesn't work. I

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Speaker 3: think I've got a bit of a toolkit, now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it's funny though, with a screenplay, I

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Speaker 1: suppose when you are creating a story, and whether it's

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Speaker 1: a whether it's a showrunner or a director or a

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Speaker 1: DP or whatever, they are storyboarding and visualizing how a

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Speaker 1: story is going to look, and then they are creating

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Speaker 1: that visual whereas the process for you is that you

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Speaker 1: are visualizing how a story might look, but then using

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Speaker 1: only words and sound to create that image. Right.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I storyboard the entire book really in my head.

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Speaker 3: That's what the outline is. It's I mean, it's not

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Speaker 3: pictures necessarily, but it's definitely the same the same process.

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Speaker 3: I mean, at the moment, I'm working on a character

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Speaker 3: who's a journalist, and it's a way of sort of

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Speaker 3: unraveling this story for the listener. But there's a problem

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Speaker 3: with it at the moment because I'm bored with this

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Speaker 3: character and I had to work out why am I

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Speaker 3: struggling to write this character? And I thought to myself, well,

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Speaker 3: how would you deal with this if you were an

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Speaker 3: actor a dealing, you know, trying to play this role

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Speaker 3: that is terribly tedious. And I realized that I hadn't

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Speaker 3: thrown enough obstacles in her path. And these are the

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Speaker 3: things that you pick up as an actor, Like a scene.

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Speaker 3: Something has to happen in a scene in order for

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Speaker 3: it to be interesting. So yeah, I'm playing all of

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Speaker 3: those rules.

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Speaker 1: So do you think this is a new genre of

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Speaker 1: sorts in the stories specifically written for audio books rather

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Speaker 1: than novels that have then been read out on it

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Speaker 1: or addicted into audiobooks.

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Speaker 3: I think if you ask Audible that question, they'd say absolutely,

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Speaker 3: because you know, the marketplace is very competitive. You know,

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Speaker 3: lots of people are now broadcasting audiobooks, So anything which

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Speaker 3: comes to the platform as an original is you know,

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Speaker 3: a great piece of IP. So, but I'm very grateful

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Speaker 3: to Audible for believing in me.

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Speaker 1: So what is the process like when you have to

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Speaker 1: get into the both and record a whole book? Is

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Speaker 1: it quite a daunting experience?

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Speaker 3: Well, in a way, they say to me, You've got

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Speaker 3: to have the finished manuscript before you start recording, and

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Speaker 3: I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah. But then when I get

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Speaker 3: in there, I'm like, oh, that doesn't sound very good,

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Speaker 3: and I need to correct. There's a bit of flex,

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Speaker 3: you know, because sometimes things sound very different.

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Speaker 2: When you actually get in there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Of course, if you're doing real time eat it sometimes.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm doing.

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Speaker 3: And what's lovely is listening to because you often there's

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Speaker 3: more than one reader, and listening to another reader read

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Speaker 3: your words and realizing how skillful actors can be when

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Speaker 3: they make it sound better than it looks on the page.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And and how about the actual kind of logistics of

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Speaker 1: getting in a both, protecting your voice to the point

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Speaker 1: that you can read out and entire novels worth of content,

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Speaker 1: and then do it again several times over in your case,

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Speaker 1: how do you find it?

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Speaker 3: It sounds like the easiest thing in the world to

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Speaker 3: sit down in front of a microphone and read nine

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Speaker 3: and a half to ten hours of story. But actually

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Speaker 3: I think the concentration getting it absolutely correct. And I

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Speaker 3: have a problem because I'm quite a mobile person. I'm

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Speaker 3: quite physical as an actor, and so I'm constantly being

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Speaker 3: told by the sound editor in the other room, like,

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Speaker 3: you can't You've got to sit still. You can't jump

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Speaker 3: them down, you can't wave your arms around. If there's

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Speaker 3: a fight sequence, stop punching the mic. So, because I

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Speaker 3: tend to start acting it out, and it's really hard

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Speaker 3: to just sit there very still and focus on the voice.

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Speaker 1: And presumably, I mean presumably you make little eras and

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Speaker 1: scuffs and things from time to time and you have

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Speaker 1: to go backwards and correct things. But that must take

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Speaker 1: a lot. I mean, I'm just thinking, I'm reading my

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Speaker 1: eight year old Famous five at the moment, and I

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Speaker 1: can barely get through a paragraph with that confusing you know,

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Speaker 1: dick and to me or something like that. It must

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Speaker 1: it must actually take a lot of concentration.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I do quite a lot of prep.

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Speaker 3: I'll do a couple of passes on a book and

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Speaker 3: I'll mark it up very clearly so that you know

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Speaker 3: you don't stumble, especially if it's really long sentences.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, you can. You can correct it and it

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Speaker 2: will all come out perfect in the end.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. How how do you feel about this form of

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Speaker 1: storytelling versus all of the on screen stuff or versus

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Speaker 1: all the on screen stuff that you've done over the years.

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Speaker 3: Well, I mean they're all feeding each other and what's

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Speaker 3: really amazing And I haven't quite got to the to

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Speaker 3: the realization of it yet, but both Geneva and The

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Speaker 3: Cut have been optioned for adaptations, So you know, the

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Speaker 3: dream come true would be to be on set on

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Speaker 3: the very first day of filming of Geneva or The

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Speaker 3: Cut and just think I created this story, I'm the

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Speaker 3: architect of this and now I'm stepping into my own universe.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, it's it's.

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Speaker 3: It's amazing, but it's I do have a very vivi

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Speaker 3: visual imagination, so creating the world that I'm going to

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Speaker 3: write about has always been quite easy for me, and

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Speaker 3: I thank Peter Jackson for that, if I'm honest.

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Speaker 2: Yes, Segue.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, when we were working on The Hobbit and we'd

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Speaker 3: work on a pure green screen set, he would come

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Speaker 3: in with his amazing, childlike imagination and start describing everything

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Speaker 3: that we were seeing around us. And of course I

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Speaker 3: was triggered by that, but I realized his attention to

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Speaker 3: detail is everything.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, ah, fantastic. How do you reflect on that

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Speaker 1: experience film in the Hobbit?

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Speaker 2: It was amazing.

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Speaker 3: And you know, one of the things I really remember

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Speaker 3: is the guy and I've forgotten his name, but the

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Speaker 3: guy who sculpted the prosthetic for Thorn's face, because we

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Speaker 3: did I think they had to do about fourteen or

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Speaker 3: fifteen different sculpts. And he told me that he had

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Speaker 3: earplugs in every day and he would listen to ten

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Speaker 3: or eleven audiobooks a week while sculpting this face. And

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Speaker 3: that's when I thought, oh my goodn this this is

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Speaker 3: a This is a really useful tool storytelling to the

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Speaker 3: man who's sculpting Thorign's face. So I think about him

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Speaker 3: every time I sit down in front of a microphone. No,

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Speaker 3: it was a life changing experience for me. I left

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Speaker 3: my heart in New Zealand, fell in love with the place,

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Speaker 3: started looking at the possibility to live there.

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Speaker 1: You know, Richard will take you any day. You know.

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Speaker 3: I have a theory about quis though I always think,

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Speaker 3: you know, they're desperate to travel the world, and then

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Speaker 3: they do, and they go all over the planet and

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Speaker 3: realize what they were missing, that the world is a

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Speaker 3: bit of a shithole and I better go home pretty quick.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, there's some. There's some like t s Elliott quite

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Speaker 1: or something. The more you travel, the more you actually

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Speaker 1: come to appreciate the place you're from, I think. And yes,

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Speaker 1: in New Zealand. Yeah, yeah, Look, congratulations on the cat

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Speaker 1: and thank you so much for giving us your time.

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Speaker 1: We really appreciate it. And like I say, I'm sure

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Speaker 1: we will gladly take you anytime.

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Speaker 2: Richard, I will come back in a heartbeat. Please we

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Speaker 2: can do it for.

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Speaker 1: We would love that. Thank you so much, Richard Armitage.

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Speaker 1: He is the author of the cut. We'll make sure

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Speaker 1: all the details are up on the News Talks. He'd

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Speaker 1: be website for more from Saturday Morning with Jack Tame.

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Speaker 1: Listen live to news Talks he'd be from nine am Saturday,

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Speaker 1: or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.