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Speaker 1: Here's what you need to know about this police statement

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Speaker 1: on Tom Phillips today. They detected him several times over

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Speaker 1: the years, but it was never safe enough to actually

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Speaker 1: catch them. They used the Special Tactics Group, Armed Defenders Squad,

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Speaker 1: search and rescue, support from the Defense Force, drones, helicopters,

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Speaker 1: tracking cameras four years, still couldn't find them. Bush was

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Speaker 1: too dense. They say, why the statement? Now is the

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Speaker 1: question and what does it mean? Lance burd Debt is

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Speaker 1: former police negotiated with us Lance, good evening.

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Speaker 2: Good evenings, Brian.

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Speaker 3: What did you make the lengths they went to?

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Speaker 2: Well, I thought it was a little unusual because some

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Speaker 2: in there as tactics that they use, so I thought

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Speaker 2: it was just a little unusual there, you know. But

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Speaker 2: the big thing that we have to be mindful of

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Speaker 2: is that we don't have all of the facts yet,

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Speaker 2: so once you know all that, we can make a judgment.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, it did seem to you know, I think

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Speaker 2: there was everything in there except the CIA drone. They

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Speaker 2: tried everything, you know. I suspect human source was tried,

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Speaker 2: so they would have probably put an undercover police officer

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Speaker 2: into the community stage or somewhere around there. They would

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Speaker 2: have tried going to organizations like volunteer firefighters. They know

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Speaker 2: everything about their neighborhood, so I'm sure they've tried everything,

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Speaker 2: though they could have. It's a balancing act between causing physical,

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Speaker 2: emotional or psychological distress the children. So it is a

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Speaker 2: hell of a call. But you know, as things transpired hindsight,

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Speaker 2: it's a wonderful thing.

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Speaker 1: They did say that they detected the family and you know,

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Speaker 1: sort of in transit on occasion, but couldn't intervene safely.

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Speaker 1: Does that raise questions for you, you know, detected and

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Speaker 1: then lost again or is it just the bush?

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Speaker 2: Well, it would be just the bush and there's but

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Speaker 2: the other thing is there's caves there as well. The

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Speaker 2: thing that there's a couple of things that sort of

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Speaker 2: I query having young children in the bush in the

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Speaker 2: wintertime for four years, that that heart that he was under,

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Speaker 2: I mean, anyone could put that up. So there would

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Speaker 2: have been some secure I'm sure during the wintertime, some

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Speaker 2: some refuge for them to go to. But all of

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Speaker 2: these deployments, the question would be asked of when were

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Speaker 2: they deployed them for how long? Because I mean, you

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Speaker 2: haven't got finite resources, so you wouldn't want to be

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Speaker 2: putting drones up with the Special Tactics Group and perhaps

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Speaker 2: dogs going at the same time. It's about spacing them

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Speaker 2: out so that when Tom may come out after everybody's

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Speaker 2: left the bush, that that's when you put your drones up.

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Speaker 2: So the timing is really imperative.

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Speaker 3: So what do you think? You said? It's interesting the

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Speaker 3: level of detail they've gone into. Why do you think

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Speaker 3: they're doing.

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Speaker 2: Well? I think they've been heavily criticized, and it's a

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Speaker 2: way of saying, well, look, you know, this is what

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Speaker 2: we've done. That's sort the only thing I can think of. Well,

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Speaker 2: as I've seen your investigator, I wouldn't give out some

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Speaker 2: of this information, although it's pretty much what you're seeing

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Speaker 2: in the movies, but you know, these are tactics that

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Speaker 2: they have. The other thing that sort of bugging me

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Speaker 2: a little bit is police tend not to use their specialists.

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Speaker 2: They don't use them as much as they could. The

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Speaker 2: Special Tactics Group are highly trained, we have an advanced

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Speaker 2: negotiation team who are well versed in psychological practices and

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Speaker 2: human behavior. I don't think they use them enough, and

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Speaker 2: sometimes they go outside of their own capabilities. And don't

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Speaker 2: look deep enough within their own staff levels.

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Speaker 3: Interesting, Lance, thank you for that.

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Speaker 1: Lance Burdette, former police negotiator, on the Tom Phillips police

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Speaker 1: statement today.

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Speaker 3: For more from Hither Duplessy Alan Drive, listen live to

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