1 00:00:06,120 --> 00:00:06,560 Speaker 1: Kyoda. 2 00:00:06,600 --> 00:00:09,640 Speaker 2: I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page, a 3 00:00:09,720 --> 00:00:16,599 Speaker 2: daily podcast presented by The New Zealand Herald. The Trump 4 00:00:16,840 --> 00:00:21,880 Speaker 2: tariff wars are officially on US President Donald Trump's first 5 00:00:21,960 --> 00:00:26,400 Speaker 2: two targets are Mexico and Canada, imposing twenty five percent 6 00:00:26,480 --> 00:00:30,480 Speaker 2: tariffs on their products and twenty percent on Chinese imports. 7 00:00:30,840 --> 00:00:33,640 Speaker 2: These three countries accounted for more than forty percent of 8 00:00:33,680 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 2: imports into the US last year. He's also introduced a 9 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:41,720 Speaker 2: twenty five percent tariff on all steel and aluminum products worldwide. 10 00:00:42,000 --> 00:00:45,440 Speaker 2: On his social media scide Truth Social, Trump said if 11 00:00:45,479 --> 00:00:49,559 Speaker 2: the EU doesn't remove a proposed fifty percent tariff on 12 00:00:49,880 --> 00:00:53,479 Speaker 2: US bourbon, the US will place a two hundred percent 13 00:00:53,560 --> 00:00:57,640 Speaker 2: tariff on all wines, champagnes and alcoholic products coming out 14 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:01,120 Speaker 2: of the EU. New Zealand's Foreign Minister, Winston Peters, is 15 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:04,120 Speaker 2: currently in the US. He said is approaching the Trump 16 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:08,319 Speaker 2: administration with eyes wide open, and that he's prepared to listen, 17 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:11,360 Speaker 2: hear them out, hear their side of the story. But 18 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:14,280 Speaker 2: will that be enough to shift New Zealand out of 19 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:17,479 Speaker 2: Trump's firing line. Later on the Front Page, we'll speak 20 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:21,280 Speaker 2: to buy New Zealand made Executive director Dane Ambler about 21 00:01:21,280 --> 00:01:25,160 Speaker 2: whether we've seen any impact here yet. But first, CBC 22 00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:29,400 Speaker 2: News Senior Parliamentary reporter Jp Tasker is with us from Ottawa, 23 00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:34,240 Speaker 2: where citizens are actively boycotting US made products in response. 24 00:01:38,920 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 2: So Jp, give me a little background about the back 25 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:45,280 Speaker 2: and forth between Trump and I guess everyone when it 26 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 2: comes to tariffs. 27 00:01:46,640 --> 00:01:49,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, so Trump essentially feels like the world is ripping 28 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:52,800 Speaker 3: off the United States that for too long the United 29 00:01:52,800 --> 00:01:55,960 Speaker 3: States has, you know, had essentially a tear free relationship 30 00:01:55,960 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 3: with every other country honors, but they don't get that 31 00:01:58,640 --> 00:02:02,480 Speaker 3: same respect in But it's really nonsense when it comes 32 00:02:02,480 --> 00:02:04,960 Speaker 3: to Canada, because we've had a ter free relationship with 33 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:07,520 Speaker 3: the United States for decades. We've had a free trade 34 00:02:07,520 --> 00:02:10,400 Speaker 3: deal since the nineteen eighties, and really all of the 35 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:13,400 Speaker 3: goods we trade between the United States and Canada, the 36 00:02:13,440 --> 00:02:16,440 Speaker 3: two way trade is almost entirely tear free. So when 37 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:20,280 Speaker 3: he talks about Canada, it is essentially bogus. He is 38 00:02:20,680 --> 00:02:24,360 Speaker 3: lying constantly about us and our trading relationship, and a 39 00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:26,440 Speaker 3: lot of us in this country are getting absolutely fed 40 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:29,560 Speaker 3: up with it and are very frustrated with a country 41 00:02:29,560 --> 00:02:33,760 Speaker 3: that was for decades really our closest friend, partner, and ally, 42 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:35,760 Speaker 3: and a lot of us in this country don't think 43 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:38,200 Speaker 3: of them that way anymore. And a lot of it 44 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:39,400 Speaker 3: has to do with Donald Trump. 45 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 1: So what's Canada done in response? 46 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:44,720 Speaker 3: Canada has really hit back at the United States. We've 47 00:02:44,760 --> 00:02:48,640 Speaker 3: slapped some retaliatory tariffs on the US because Donald Trump 48 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:53,200 Speaker 3: has put unfair, unjustified, unjustifiable tariffs, as our government calls it, 49 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:56,040 Speaker 3: on our goods. So he's put twenty five percent tariffs 50 00:02:56,080 --> 00:02:58,799 Speaker 3: on most goods. He's put an extra twenty five percent 51 00:02:58,840 --> 00:03:02,480 Speaker 3: on stealing aluminum exports, and so Canada has hit back 52 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:05,760 Speaker 3: with about sixty billion dollars worth of retaliatory tariffs on 53 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:12,120 Speaker 3: American goods, targeting everything from steel and sporting equipment, cast iron, goods, cosmetics, cologne, 54 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:14,240 Speaker 3: you name it. It's a long list, and we're trying 55 00:03:14,240 --> 00:03:18,800 Speaker 3: to essentially make Republican states in particular pay for the 56 00:03:18,840 --> 00:03:21,240 Speaker 3: actions of Donald Trump. So we're trying to be very 57 00:03:21,280 --> 00:03:24,720 Speaker 3: targeted in our approach as we implement these countermeasures. We're 58 00:03:24,720 --> 00:03:26,960 Speaker 3: trying to make it more difficult for some of the 59 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:30,520 Speaker 3: President's supporters in Congress and for some of their constituents 60 00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:33,000 Speaker 3: and some of the businesses and the workers in those areas, 61 00:03:33,120 --> 00:03:36,240 Speaker 3: and Canada is essentially saying we're ready to go further 62 00:03:36,320 --> 00:03:38,600 Speaker 3: and farther if we need to, we will ramp up 63 00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:41,400 Speaker 3: these retaliatory terrafts. If Trump wants to take us on 64 00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:43,520 Speaker 3: again in April, as he says he does. 65 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:47,600 Speaker 2: How will the tariffs affect Canada's economy. 66 00:03:47,280 --> 00:03:50,840 Speaker 3: Well, the tariffs are absolutely devastating for the Canadian economy 67 00:03:50,840 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 3: because we are so dependent on the United States por trade. 68 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:55,880 Speaker 3: So many of the goods that we produce in this 69 00:03:55,960 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 3: country are exported to the US. So if you're making 70 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:02,080 Speaker 3: all of these goods twenty five percent more expensive, but 71 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:05,000 Speaker 3: essentially prices out a lot of these Canadian goods, it 72 00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 3: becomes less economically viable for American importers to bring in 73 00:04:08,600 --> 00:04:12,000 Speaker 3: Canadian stuff. So a lot of businesses, a lot of 74 00:04:12,120 --> 00:04:15,040 Speaker 3: jobs are on the line as a result of Trump's attacks, 75 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:17,360 Speaker 3: as a result of his trade war, So a lot 76 00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:20,960 Speaker 3: of people are gearing up for unemployment in this country, frankly, 77 00:04:21,080 --> 00:04:24,039 Speaker 3: and that's why there's so much anger, there's so much frustration, 78 00:04:24,200 --> 00:04:28,560 Speaker 3: there's so much fear because we have essentially been dependent 79 00:04:28,640 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 3: on the United States when it comes to trade. Seventy 80 00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:34,320 Speaker 3: five eighty percent of all of our exports go to 81 00:04:34,360 --> 00:04:37,240 Speaker 3: that single market, and so there's going to be a 82 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:41,159 Speaker 3: very abrupt period of adjustment. That's going to be pretty ugly, 83 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:44,160 Speaker 3: that's not going to be pleasant, and it's going to 84 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:48,159 Speaker 3: be very, very unfortunate for us because we have essentially 85 00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:50,560 Speaker 3: only been wedded to the Americans. We've let a lot 86 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 3: of our other relationships atrophy over the years, and we've 87 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 3: just been sucked into their vortex. And now a lot 88 00:04:57,320 --> 00:04:59,880 Speaker 3: of people are questioning whether that was a good idea. 89 00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 3: So we'll do a Canadian a. 90 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:12,880 Speaker 4: Coffee shop on Vancouver Island and a quiet act of defiance. 91 00:05:15,440 --> 00:05:16,039 Speaker 3: Let's do it. 92 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:20,320 Speaker 4: What's beneath the bravado a seeding sense of betrayal. 93 00:05:20,839 --> 00:05:24,320 Speaker 5: You know, this this bullying. You know we're a tenth 94 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:27,520 Speaker 5: of the size of that country, but we picked no fight, 95 00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:29,839 Speaker 5: but it just keeps coming to us. 96 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:33,080 Speaker 4: On the top shelf, Alan hides the labels of American 97 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:34,520 Speaker 4: made bottles. 98 00:05:34,080 --> 00:05:38,039 Speaker 5: Tennessee Wayne Gretzky Cream and it's basically it's just about 99 00:05:38,040 --> 00:05:38,720 Speaker 5: empty anyway. 100 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:42,880 Speaker 4: Wayne Gretzky Cream. Liqueur wants a Canadian ice hockey hero, 101 00:05:43,480 --> 00:05:46,320 Speaker 4: now considered a traitor for his support of. 102 00:05:46,320 --> 00:05:51,680 Speaker 5: Trump, he's proven that he doesn't even respect our country anymore. 103 00:05:56,120 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 2: I'm saying there's a push amongst the public to boycott 104 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:02,960 Speaker 2: US product. This movement has reached Europe as well. Tesla 105 00:06:03,040 --> 00:06:06,040 Speaker 2: styles of falling and absent. Online groups are springing up 106 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:09,960 Speaker 2: everywhere to help consumers choose non US items. What have 107 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 2: you heard in saying on the ground In Canada. 108 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 3: There's a huge movement to stop buying American products. It 109 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:18,840 Speaker 3: is pretty remarkable. I mean every time you go to 110 00:06:18,920 --> 00:06:21,520 Speaker 3: the grocery store, you see people picking up goods and 111 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:23,880 Speaker 3: looking at where was this made? If it says made 112 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:26,919 Speaker 3: in America, it gets put back on the shelf. People 113 00:06:27,120 --> 00:06:30,960 Speaker 3: are there's a coordinating effort not to buy American products 114 00:06:31,040 --> 00:06:33,920 Speaker 3: right now. And I mean there's a Facebook group online 115 00:06:33,960 --> 00:06:37,400 Speaker 3: Chelsea for example. It has one point three million members 116 00:06:37,640 --> 00:06:40,599 Speaker 3: alone and there's one group and it's all about how 117 00:06:40,680 --> 00:06:44,360 Speaker 3: to buy Canadian and how to avoid American. So people 118 00:06:44,480 --> 00:06:48,559 Speaker 3: are absolutely voting with their wallet right now and making 119 00:06:48,600 --> 00:06:51,520 Speaker 3: the decision to buy Canadian or buy from other countries, 120 00:06:51,800 --> 00:06:53,880 Speaker 3: as long as it's not the United States, that's the 121 00:06:53,920 --> 00:06:56,919 Speaker 3: main that's the main factor people are considering right now. 122 00:06:57,040 --> 00:06:59,840 Speaker 3: And we know it's working grocers. The major grocers in 123 00:06:59,880 --> 00:07:03,560 Speaker 3: the country are reporting that sales are down dramatically for 124 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 3: US goods. They're bringing in a lot more products from 125 00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:10,200 Speaker 3: countries that we don't normally buy from, you know, Peru, Israel, 126 00:07:10,440 --> 00:07:15,360 Speaker 3: other places, Morocco, South America, places where we traditionally don't 127 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:17,520 Speaker 3: have much of a trading relationship at all. Now we're 128 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:19,960 Speaker 3: bringing in their oranges, in their nuts, and their grocery goods. 129 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:23,800 Speaker 3: And it's all because Canadians are diametrically opposed. Many of 130 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:26,680 Speaker 3: them are diametrically opposed of buying anything from south of 131 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:27,200 Speaker 3: the border. 132 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:31,360 Speaker 2: I see. Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albernezi has ruled out 133 00:07:31,440 --> 00:07:35,120 Speaker 2: reciprocal tariffs on the US after Trump ruled out exemptions 134 00:07:35,160 --> 00:07:39,880 Speaker 2: for any countries, calling Trump's move entirely unjustified, but he 135 00:07:39,960 --> 00:07:44,480 Speaker 2: said imposing these reciprocal tariffs would only push prices up 136 00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:47,880 Speaker 2: for Australian consumers and spur inflation. Now is there a 137 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:50,640 Speaker 2: worry in Canada that pushback could do the same. 138 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:53,640 Speaker 3: There is a concern, but it really is a minority 139 00:07:53,720 --> 00:07:57,440 Speaker 3: voice right now. The country is completely behind doing whatever 140 00:07:57,480 --> 00:08:00,480 Speaker 3: we can to make the Americans pay for this situation. 141 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:03,320 Speaker 3: So people are not thinking about their pocketbook right now. 142 00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:05,480 Speaker 3: They really think it's in the best interests of the 143 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:09,760 Speaker 3: country to push back, to not take Trump and his nonsense, 144 00:08:10,240 --> 00:08:12,320 Speaker 3: and to do whatever we can to try and make 145 00:08:12,360 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 3: it clear to him and other people in his administration, 146 00:08:14,920 --> 00:08:17,560 Speaker 3: other people in Congress that Canada will not just roll 147 00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 3: over when he tries to come for us economically. Most 148 00:08:20,640 --> 00:08:24,640 Speaker 3: people are unified. Polls suggest eighty ninety percent of Canadians 149 00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 3: are completely in favor of retaliatory measures. And the reason 150 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:30,960 Speaker 3: why they are is we've been down this road before, Chelsea. 151 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:34,079 Speaker 3: If you remember, Trump slapped tariffs on Canadian steel and 152 00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:36,680 Speaker 3: aluminum in his first term and it was very damaging 153 00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:39,560 Speaker 3: at the time, and Canada hit back with retaliatory tariffs 154 00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:41,880 Speaker 3: and that's part of the reason why he ultimately dropped 155 00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:44,080 Speaker 3: those tariffs in the first term. So we have a 156 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:47,040 Speaker 3: lot of experience with his trade nonsense, and what's worked 157 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:49,319 Speaker 3: for us in the past is making the Americans pay. 158 00:08:49,440 --> 00:08:52,560 Speaker 3: If there's no pain point for the Americans, why would 159 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:55,560 Speaker 3: they ever drop their tariffs. That's sort of the reasoning 160 00:08:55,600 --> 00:08:57,560 Speaker 3: from the federal government, and that's why they're going this 161 00:08:57,640 --> 00:08:58,320 Speaker 3: route again now. 162 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:01,680 Speaker 2: When you said Canada po kind of pigeonholed in having 163 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:03,840 Speaker 2: all of its trade in one place. I mean that 164 00:09:03,920 --> 00:09:06,199 Speaker 2: hit home because New Zealand is actually in the midst 165 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:09,720 Speaker 2: of diversifying its trade deals because one of our biggest 166 00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:13,320 Speaker 2: trade partners is China. Our Prime minister is solely focused 167 00:09:13,320 --> 00:09:16,520 Speaker 2: on the likes of India and Southeast Asia. I saw 168 00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:20,720 Speaker 2: Alberta Premier Danielle Smith said her province is looking for 169 00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:23,800 Speaker 2: customers beyond the US, kind of in Asia and Europe. 170 00:09:23,920 --> 00:09:27,720 Speaker 2: Who could Canada's biggest trading partners become. 171 00:09:27,840 --> 00:09:30,360 Speaker 3: Well well, Canada is very keen to cozy up to 172 00:09:30,360 --> 00:09:33,720 Speaker 3: the United Kingdom and frankly Australia and New Zealand. There 173 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:37,199 Speaker 3: is this push to kind of rebuild Commonwealth ties and 174 00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 3: to kind of bring you know, the Commonwealth cousins back 175 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:43,240 Speaker 3: together again. The government just had a huge trade mission 176 00:09:43,280 --> 00:09:46,160 Speaker 3: to Australia. Our Foreign Minister was just in the UK 177 00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:49,079 Speaker 3: saying we need the UK more than ever and the UK, 178 00:09:49,200 --> 00:09:51,240 Speaker 3: I think is receptive to that, in part because they've 179 00:09:51,280 --> 00:09:54,480 Speaker 3: been through Braxit, they've been through some economic convulsions with Europe. 180 00:09:54,480 --> 00:09:56,880 Speaker 3: They're also looking for trade partners. We're about to sign 181 00:09:56,960 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 3: a free trade deal with the UK. I mean, these 182 00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:02,160 Speaker 3: are some of the ways that we can bolster our 183 00:10:02,200 --> 00:10:05,440 Speaker 3: economic links to other countries. We're talking about South Korea too, 184 00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:08,160 Speaker 3: in Japan, some of the major Asian markets, especially as 185 00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 3: it relates to energy. As you point out, they's talk 186 00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:14,360 Speaker 3: about building more pipelines to tide water to get more 187 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:18,400 Speaker 3: of our abundant oil to other markets, but principally in Asia. 188 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:22,079 Speaker 3: But yeah, the problem is we're so geographically tied to 189 00:10:22,120 --> 00:10:24,559 Speaker 3: the United States. I mean, ninety percent of our population 190 00:10:24,679 --> 00:10:27,520 Speaker 3: lives within one hundred and sixty kilometers of the US border. 191 00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:29,840 Speaker 3: So it's going to be very difficult for US to 192 00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:33,640 Speaker 3: pivot from being so reliant for so long on one customer. 193 00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:36,400 Speaker 3: And frankly, will never be able to replace the US. 194 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:39,080 Speaker 3: None of these other countries, no offense to them, great 195 00:10:39,120 --> 00:10:41,679 Speaker 3: friends and partners and allies, will never be able to 196 00:10:41,760 --> 00:10:46,320 Speaker 3: replace the economically dominant force that is the United States, 197 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:48,560 Speaker 3: especially when we live right next to them. So it's 198 00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:52,240 Speaker 3: going to be tough, but we will strategically, the government says, 199 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:55,280 Speaker 3: reach out, make alliances with other countries that could take 200 00:10:55,320 --> 00:10:57,600 Speaker 3: some of our goods if the US doesn't want them anymore. 201 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:02,720 Speaker 4: Will you be traveling to the States anytime soon. 202 00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 3: Not ever. 203 00:11:03,559 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 2: I wouldn't go over the border again. 204 00:11:05,400 --> 00:11:09,600 Speaker 6: Unfortunately things have changed in the States and I'm happy 205 00:11:09,679 --> 00:11:13,000 Speaker 6: to spend most of my holidays here in Canada. 206 00:11:13,120 --> 00:11:18,359 Speaker 2: Yes, I'm starting to love Mexico because our money's not good, 207 00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:21,600 Speaker 2: so you might as well stay south of the border. 208 00:11:22,559 --> 00:11:30,640 Speaker 1: Down Mexico way. Good voice, huh. 209 00:11:30,679 --> 00:11:34,000 Speaker 2: I read on Forbes that last month, the number of 210 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:38,240 Speaker 2: Canadians taking road trips into the US, representing the majority 211 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:41,320 Speaker 2: of Canadians who visit the US, dropped by twenty three 212 00:11:41,400 --> 00:11:44,839 Speaker 2: percent compared to February twenty twenty four, according to data 213 00:11:45,160 --> 00:11:48,520 Speaker 2: from Statistics Canada, while Canadian air travel to the US 214 00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:51,840 Speaker 2: was down by two point four percent of the same period. 215 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:55,600 Speaker 2: What's it like anecdotally? Are you seeing less Canadians choosing 216 00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:57,560 Speaker 2: the US as a travel destination now? 217 00:11:57,840 --> 00:12:00,720 Speaker 3: So many Canadians are saying, you know, I am not 218 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:04,040 Speaker 3: going to the United States right now. It is not happening. 219 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:06,680 Speaker 3: It is not on. And you know that's a big 220 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:08,520 Speaker 3: thing because, as I said, we live so close to 221 00:12:08,559 --> 00:12:10,360 Speaker 3: the border. So many of us, it's very easy to 222 00:12:10,400 --> 00:12:12,360 Speaker 3: go to the United States. It's just a very quick 223 00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:16,560 Speaker 3: day trip in many instances. So many Canadians own property 224 00:12:16,600 --> 00:12:19,760 Speaker 3: in the state of Florida, in Arizona and California. I'm 225 00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:23,600 Speaker 3: talking hundreds of thousands of Canadians own property in the US. 226 00:12:23,679 --> 00:12:26,000 Speaker 3: So there's a lot of traffic back and forth, and 227 00:12:26,080 --> 00:12:29,280 Speaker 3: so it is a big deal to see those numbers 228 00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:32,360 Speaker 3: drop as they have, especially right now in our winter. 229 00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 3: You know, it's pretty cold in Canada in March, and 230 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:38,559 Speaker 3: so to see those numbers drop means there are fewer 231 00:12:38,559 --> 00:12:41,480 Speaker 3: people going to sunnier climbs in the southern United States. 232 00:12:41,480 --> 00:12:43,240 Speaker 3: And I mean that really means for a serious I 233 00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:45,000 Speaker 3: guess because so many of us I want to get 234 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:48,640 Speaker 3: out of here when it's so cold, But people are saying, 235 00:12:48,760 --> 00:12:51,000 Speaker 3: enough is enough. We don't want to go to Trump's America. 236 00:12:51,080 --> 00:12:53,679 Speaker 3: We don't want to be in the United States when 237 00:12:53,720 --> 00:12:55,839 Speaker 3: so much of this rhetoric is flying around, when he's 238 00:12:55,840 --> 00:12:58,520 Speaker 3: threatening our sovereignty, when he's taunting us with the fifty 239 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:03,040 Speaker 3: first state talk. Is a very dramatic shift. It's truly 240 00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:05,680 Speaker 3: remarkable to see how we have gone from being so 241 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:09,200 Speaker 3: close to being really in many respects enemies. 242 00:13:09,600 --> 00:13:11,000 Speaker 1: What do you reckon the next play is? 243 00:13:11,720 --> 00:13:13,800 Speaker 3: I think Canada will continue to press ahead with these 244 00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:17,560 Speaker 3: retaliatory tariffs, that there could be an escalation. I mean, 245 00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:20,800 Speaker 3: we have seen some of our provincial leaders float the 246 00:13:20,880 --> 00:13:24,520 Speaker 3: idea of holding back energy. We export a ton of 247 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:27,640 Speaker 3: energy to the United States, whether it's oil, natural gas, 248 00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:32,240 Speaker 3: or hydro electricity. There's a potential to play that sort 249 00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:34,520 Speaker 3: of trump card, if you will, and try and force 250 00:13:34,559 --> 00:13:36,400 Speaker 3: them to back down on some of their more aggressive 251 00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:41,840 Speaker 3: economic measures by sort of using our energy as a 252 00:13:41,880 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 3: way to corral them into dropping their actions against US. 253 00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:48,240 Speaker 3: I mean, I also think that frankly, they could get 254 00:13:48,240 --> 00:13:51,280 Speaker 3: to the point where it just gets even uglier, you know, 255 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:53,719 Speaker 3: and then there is really a break, and then it's 256 00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:56,439 Speaker 3: much more difficult to come back together. So I think 257 00:13:56,480 --> 00:13:59,040 Speaker 3: the government, the federal government here in Ottawa, is doing 258 00:13:59,120 --> 00:14:02,760 Speaker 3: its best to try and give Trump some off ramps, 259 00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:05,440 Speaker 3: to give him the chance to dial this back, to 260 00:14:05,480 --> 00:14:07,760 Speaker 3: maybe give him a couple wins, but not all that 261 00:14:07,800 --> 00:14:10,240 Speaker 3: he wants, and that might be a possibility. We have 262 00:14:10,280 --> 00:14:12,360 Speaker 3: a new prime minister that is going to be sworn 263 00:14:12,360 --> 00:14:15,360 Speaker 3: in on Friday. He was just elected in a Liberal 264 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:19,200 Speaker 3: Party election on Sunday, and he has been pretty forceful 265 00:14:19,320 --> 00:14:22,040 Speaker 3: about the United States, saying that we can't really consider 266 00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:25,120 Speaker 3: them an ally anymore. But he has also talked about 267 00:14:25,200 --> 00:14:28,080 Speaker 3: the possibility of bringing this to a close. So there's 268 00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:31,120 Speaker 3: a chance things get a lot worse before they get better, 269 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:32,640 Speaker 3: and that's how I suspect it will be. 270 00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:33,960 Speaker 2: Thanks for joining us JP. 271 00:14:34,520 --> 00:14:36,480 Speaker 3: Thank you so much, Chelsea. I appreciate you having. 272 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:51,920 Speaker 2: The Canada isn't the only country sidelining American products at 273 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:55,080 Speaker 2: the moment, so could we see the same happen here. 274 00:14:55,680 --> 00:14:58,040 Speaker 2: We put this to the executive director of Buy New 275 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:04,720 Speaker 2: Zealand made Dane Ambler. Dane, do you think Kewe's might 276 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:08,359 Speaker 2: start boycotting American products along with the Canadians? 277 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:13,240 Speaker 6: I think it's probably too early to tell. It's still really, 278 00:15:13,440 --> 00:15:15,400 Speaker 6: you know, up in the air as to what Trump's 279 00:15:15,440 --> 00:15:19,240 Speaker 6: tariffs actually mean for New Zealand. So I think we 280 00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:22,120 Speaker 6: need to wait a while for the dust to settle 281 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:23,960 Speaker 6: and see what it means for us as a country. 282 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:26,480 Speaker 6: But obviously, if you look around the world, you know, 283 00:15:26,680 --> 00:15:30,360 Speaker 6: even to Australia, Urban Easy came out last week saying 284 00:15:30,400 --> 00:15:32,200 Speaker 6: that you know, the next budget would have like an 285 00:15:32,200 --> 00:15:36,400 Speaker 6: Australian made focus, and there's this real sense of economic 286 00:15:36,560 --> 00:15:41,480 Speaker 6: nationalism sort of sweeping through Canada and Australia and other countries. 287 00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:44,560 Speaker 6: So yeah, we'll see what happens over the next few weeks. 288 00:15:44,880 --> 00:15:48,880 Speaker 2: I know people were really behind supporting local businesses, especially 289 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:52,920 Speaker 2: during COVID and lockdowns and keeping the economy alive that 290 00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:56,000 Speaker 2: kind of thing. Are we still seeing that attitude here 291 00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:58,000 Speaker 2: or has it kind of tape it off a bit? 292 00:15:58,480 --> 00:16:03,800 Speaker 6: Yeah? Absolutely, We've seen considerable momentum since COVID. It probably 293 00:16:03,840 --> 00:16:06,640 Speaker 6: has taped off a little bit. But to be honest 294 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:08,720 Speaker 6: with you, you know, the world's changed a lot, and 295 00:16:08,760 --> 00:16:11,960 Speaker 6: a lot of businesses that we've spoken to have made 296 00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:15,560 Speaker 6: quite significant changes and already pulled out of those unreliable 297 00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:18,800 Speaker 6: supply chains and started to bring things closer to home. 298 00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:21,840 Speaker 6: So I think, you know, with the ongoing sort of 299 00:16:21,880 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 6: geopolitical tensions that are happening in the world at the moment, 300 00:16:25,160 --> 00:16:28,400 Speaker 6: and the lack of control that businesses have over the 301 00:16:28,520 --> 00:16:32,560 Speaker 6: costs and the risks associated with manufacturing overseas, we're just 302 00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:35,760 Speaker 6: going to see more and more companies bringing manufacturing closer 303 00:16:35,800 --> 00:16:38,920 Speaker 6: to home. I think another really interesting element of it 304 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:42,000 Speaker 6: is what happens with China and Taiwan over the next 305 00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:45,280 Speaker 6: couple of years, and if China does decide to make 306 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:48,120 Speaker 6: moves there, you know, as a country we're so reliant 307 00:16:48,240 --> 00:16:50,640 Speaker 6: on and what does that mean for the future of 308 00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:53,200 Speaker 6: manufacturing for New Zealm businesses as well. 309 00:16:53,320 --> 00:16:55,720 Speaker 2: So you've seen a lot of New Zealand businesses bring 310 00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:57,360 Speaker 2: manufacturing back on on shore. 311 00:16:57,600 --> 00:16:59,360 Speaker 6: Yeah, that's right. Yeah, we are seeing a bit of 312 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:02,200 Speaker 6: a trend towards coming home and that was really sparked 313 00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:06,679 Speaker 6: through the COVID period when shipping costs surged and there 314 00:17:06,680 --> 00:17:10,679 Speaker 6: were massive, lengthy delays and disruptions. So companies are starting 315 00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:12,520 Speaker 6: to think about it, you know, probably not as many 316 00:17:12,560 --> 00:17:15,280 Speaker 6: as we'd like to see, but they are thinking about it. 317 00:17:15,359 --> 00:17:18,560 Speaker 2: Yes, do we import much from the US that could 318 00:17:18,600 --> 00:17:20,600 Speaker 2: be easily boycotted anyway? 319 00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:24,159 Speaker 6: Yeah, you know, the two way trade with America is 320 00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:27,520 Speaker 6: quite significant. You know, we you know, most importantly, send 321 00:17:27,560 --> 00:17:29,600 Speaker 6: a lot of products over there. So there's a lot 322 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:36,040 Speaker 6: of agricultural and food product exports. You know, you've got meat, dairy, wine, 323 00:17:36,119 --> 00:17:40,040 Speaker 6: and all of these industries are particularly vulnerable to tariff. 324 00:17:40,160 --> 00:17:41,760 Speaker 6: So we do do a lot of trade with the 325 00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:44,239 Speaker 6: US and we are you know, quite reliant on them 326 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:45,159 Speaker 6: as a trading partner. 327 00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:48,600 Speaker 2: I've seen stories about apps popping up in Europe and 328 00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:52,399 Speaker 2: Facebook groups in Canada to help people buy locally grown 329 00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:55,399 Speaker 2: and made products. Is there something similar people can use 330 00:17:55,440 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 2: in New Zealand. 331 00:17:56,720 --> 00:17:58,639 Speaker 6: We don't have anything like that in New Zealand, but 332 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:00,800 Speaker 6: you know, you can keep an eye for, you know, 333 00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:03,199 Speaker 6: the made in New Zealand logo. It's on you know, 334 00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:06,840 Speaker 6: one thousand and four hundred small businesses products throughout the country. 335 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:10,560 Speaker 6: I do think, you know, while you know pro localization, 336 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:13,919 Speaker 6: we also have to be quite realistic about this. And 337 00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:17,080 Speaker 6: you know, New Zealand is a trading nation. Exports comprise 338 00:18:17,160 --> 00:18:19,560 Speaker 6: about a quarter of our GDP and they's only going 339 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:21,720 Speaker 6: to grow in coming years. So I think we also 340 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:24,360 Speaker 6: have to be realistic about, you know, what we can 341 00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:26,840 Speaker 6: buy locally and what we can't as well. 342 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:29,760 Speaker 2: What are some easy swaps that can be made when 343 00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:31,720 Speaker 2: it comes to New Zealand made. If I go to 344 00:18:31,760 --> 00:18:34,200 Speaker 2: the shops and I usually buy one thing, what's something 345 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:36,840 Speaker 2: that I can easily just chuck my cart that's actually 346 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:37,720 Speaker 2: from New Zealand. 347 00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:41,679 Speaker 6: Honestly, we can make pretty much anything in New Zealand. 348 00:18:41,960 --> 00:18:45,120 Speaker 6: Not cars obviously, but if you go to the supermarket, 349 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:48,679 Speaker 6: there's often a trade off between a New Zealand made 350 00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:51,679 Speaker 6: and an overseas made products, especially in the food and 351 00:18:51,720 --> 00:18:54,000 Speaker 6: beverage sector, and also when you start getting through to 352 00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:57,600 Speaker 6: larger items like furniture and bedding and things like that, 353 00:18:57,760 --> 00:19:00,480 Speaker 6: often the cost to import something like that is so 354 00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:03,560 Speaker 6: significant and the shipping costs is so much that you're 355 00:19:03,600 --> 00:19:06,280 Speaker 6: best to buy local anyway. So there's a whole range 356 00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:08,200 Speaker 6: of products, just keep an eye out for the ones 357 00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:10,560 Speaker 6: that are signaling that they are made in New Zealand. 358 00:19:10,680 --> 00:19:13,000 Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us, Dane, Thank you so much. 359 00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 2: That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You 360 00:19:19,840 --> 00:19:23,680 Speaker 2: can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage 361 00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:27,720 Speaker 2: at enzdhrald dot co dot nz. The Front Page is 362 00:19:27,760 --> 00:19:31,520 Speaker 2: produced by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin, who is also 363 00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:32,760 Speaker 2: our sound engineer. 364 00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:34,760 Speaker 1: I'm Chelsea Daniels. 365 00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:38,480 Speaker 2: Subscribe to The Front Page on iHeartRadio or where you 366 00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:42,280 Speaker 2: get your podcasts, and tune in tomorrow for another look 367 00:19:42,359 --> 00:19:43,640 Speaker 2: behind the headlines.