1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,000
Speaker 1: And the Sally's back here are back with the uninitteenth

2
00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:04,440
Speaker 1: State of the Nation report. Key finding showed child poverty

3
00:00:04,440 --> 00:00:07,200
Speaker 1: and material hardship are up, unemployment up along with the

4
00:00:07,280 --> 00:00:10,240
Speaker 1: unaffordable rent and homelessness. Flip side, youth offending. An overall

5
00:00:10,280 --> 00:00:13,440
Speaker 1: alcohol use has fallen, there's a drop and illicit drug use,

6
00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:15,240
Speaker 1: if you can believe it, meth is a major problem.

7
00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:18,160
Speaker 1: So this is interesting. Paul Barber is the Sally's principal

8
00:00:18,160 --> 00:00:19,799
Speaker 1: social policy analyst, standers with us.

9
00:00:19,800 --> 00:00:23,320
Speaker 2: Paul, good morning, Yeah, I cured them. Good to be here.

10
00:00:23,560 --> 00:00:26,520
Speaker 1: How do you get your information because I don't know

11
00:00:26,560 --> 00:00:28,960
Speaker 1: anyone who would argue that drug use is down.

12
00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:32,879
Speaker 2: Well, this is what we do in our report each year.

13
00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:36,400
Speaker 2: We look to the various sources of publicly available information

14
00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:40,400
Speaker 2: are around these various social indicators that we look at.

15
00:00:40,640 --> 00:00:43,040
Speaker 2: And when it comes to the use of drugs, there's

16
00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:46,880
Speaker 2: two real sources of information. Firstly, there's anual drug survey

17
00:00:46,920 --> 00:00:50,720
Speaker 2: that's done as a independent so that actually talks to

18
00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:54,040
Speaker 2: people who are and finds out what proportion of people

19
00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:57,920
Speaker 2: are actually using drugs. And it's that from that report

20
00:00:57,960 --> 00:01:01,880
Speaker 2: that we actually get the information about a reduction in

21
00:01:01,920 --> 00:01:04,920
Speaker 2: the number of people using jokes. The other sources of

22
00:01:04,920 --> 00:01:11,880
Speaker 2: information is from what's wastewater measure that measures the volume

23
00:01:11,920 --> 00:01:15,640
Speaker 2: of drugs being used, and the indicators from that are

24
00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:19,840
Speaker 2: kind of the opposite in that more is being used.

25
00:01:19,840 --> 00:01:22,760
Speaker 2: So we saw we saw a huge spike in the

26
00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:27,200
Speaker 2: consumption of drugs like method, antatamine and cocaine over the

27
00:01:27,240 --> 00:01:30,399
Speaker 2: past year and it's stayed elevated. So we think what's

28
00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:33,760
Speaker 2: going on is perhaps there are well the concern is

29
00:01:33,760 --> 00:01:37,480
Speaker 2: that there are not fewer people using or slightly fewer

30
00:01:37,520 --> 00:01:40,240
Speaker 2: people using, but they're more using a lot more and

31
00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:42,840
Speaker 2: the potential of harm for that is obviously.

32
00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:45,320
Speaker 1: The problem is also the people using might be lying

33
00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:47,920
Speaker 1: to you, and that's why we trust the wastewater because

34
00:01:47,960 --> 00:01:49,080
Speaker 1: wastewater doesn't lie.

35
00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:52,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think when when we're going to have some

36
00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:55,000
Speaker 2: faith in the in the skill and the patients and

37
00:01:55,040 --> 00:01:56,960
Speaker 2: the quality of the people who really put an effort

38
00:01:57,000 --> 00:01:59,760
Speaker 2: into the various surveys that we use in this country

39
00:01:59,800 --> 00:02:03,200
Speaker 2: to understand social problems, they're very very well aware when

40
00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:07,360
Speaker 2: the people who design these surveys that people, you know

41
00:02:08,040 --> 00:02:10,839
Speaker 2: that they need methodologies that will actually try and get

42
00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:15,680
Speaker 2: true financewers for instance, and preserving confidentiality and privacy so

43
00:02:15,680 --> 00:02:18,600
Speaker 2: that people can be honest with them. So it's a

44
00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:19,560
Speaker 2: survey we can trust.

45
00:02:19,919 --> 00:02:23,960
Speaker 1: Okay, unaffordable rents, how do we define unaffordable and who's

46
00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:25,600
Speaker 1: the arbiter of that particular adjective.

47
00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:31,919
Speaker 2: Well, unaffordable rents is a pretty acceptable definition is around

48
00:02:31,919 --> 00:02:34,679
Speaker 2: thirty percent of income. So for instance, we said to them,

49
00:02:34,919 --> 00:02:39,800
Speaker 2: we who oh, yeah, that's kind of interesting. Well, again

50
00:02:39,840 --> 00:02:43,600
Speaker 2: it's from that from work being done that shows, for instance,

51
00:02:43,639 --> 00:02:47,919
Speaker 2: the people who are in income rent in public housing,

52
00:02:47,960 --> 00:02:50,720
Speaker 2: community housing and coying order, they paid twenty five percent

53
00:02:50,720 --> 00:02:52,919
Speaker 2: of their income and rent. So somewhere between twenty five

54
00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:56,120
Speaker 2: and thirty percent of income is considered to be broadly

55
00:02:56,160 --> 00:02:59,720
Speaker 2: affordable for most people when you're thinking middle to low

56
00:03:01,520 --> 00:03:04,919
Speaker 2: what we're seeing, unfortunately, is in a numbers of communities

57
00:03:04,919 --> 00:03:08,359
Speaker 2: around the country, particularly the low income communities, is their

58
00:03:08,360 --> 00:03:10,960
Speaker 2: facing rents that are well about thirty percent and some

59
00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:13,480
Speaker 2: over forty percent of their incomes. And that does not

60
00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:14,640
Speaker 2: leave you leave much.

61
00:03:14,880 --> 00:03:17,320
Speaker 1: No, there will be true. I think we'd accept that.

62
00:03:17,639 --> 00:03:21,280
Speaker 1: Is there too much editorial editorializing in this particular report,

63
00:03:21,280 --> 00:03:25,360
Speaker 1: a connection belonging cultural foundations are being undermined by material hardship,

64
00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:29,440
Speaker 1: housing instability, and long term structural inequities. That's an editorial,

65
00:03:29,480 --> 00:03:30,160
Speaker 1: that's not fact.

66
00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:37,840
Speaker 2: Well, we're seeking to bring into this report the perspective

67
00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:42,400
Speaker 2: to our Maori and that recognizes the fact that are

68
00:03:42,440 --> 00:03:44,480
Speaker 2: almost half of the people that we're working with in

69
00:03:44,560 --> 00:03:48,360
Speaker 2: the Salvatian Army identify as Maori, and it's important for

70
00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:52,680
Speaker 2: us to understand in behind the data and facts that

71
00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:55,400
Speaker 2: we present in each chapter, we've taken time to give

72
00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:58,480
Speaker 2: voice to the experience of people and one of the

73
00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:01,920
Speaker 2: new things we've done this year in the different approach

74
00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:06,000
Speaker 2: is including a series of case stories shared by Kaimahi,

75
00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:09,040
Speaker 2: people who are working with us in the Salvation Army

76
00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:12,480
Speaker 2: about their journeys and how important it has been that

77
00:04:12,560 --> 00:04:16,159
Speaker 2: some of these are less tangible, harder to measure things

78
00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:19,920
Speaker 2: have played a role in helping them stabilize their lives,

79
00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:23,000
Speaker 2: get into education for instance, fine employments, and turn their

80
00:04:23,040 --> 00:04:24,120
Speaker 2: lives around good stuff.

81
00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:27,440
Speaker 1: Paul, appreciate your time. Paul Barbara are the Salvation Army

82
00:04:27,440 --> 00:04:30,840
Speaker 1: principal social analyst. On the state of the nation. If

83
00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:34,200
Speaker 1: I had time, which I don't, and I've never asked

84
00:04:34,240 --> 00:04:35,800
Speaker 1: this question before, and I think it would be important

85
00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:37,440
Speaker 1: when he sees fifty percent of the people he deals

86
00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:41,120
Speaker 1: with the marii is the state of the nation? Report

87
00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:44,080
Speaker 1: the state of their nation in other words, the people

88
00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:46,039
Speaker 1: they deal with, or is it the state of the

89
00:04:46,200 --> 00:04:49,360
Speaker 1: nation as in the whole nation. We need to clarify that,

90
00:04:49,400 --> 00:04:51,800
Speaker 1: don't we Because it's the same every year, it's miserable.

91
00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:55,120
Speaker 1: For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to

92
00:04:55,240 --> 00:04:58,320
Speaker 1: news talks that'd be from six am weekdays, or follow

93
00:04:58,360 --> 00:04:59,920
Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio.