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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Saturday Morning with Jack team podcast

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Speaker 1: from News Talks.

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Speaker 2: That'd be Google Sutherland. Second, the core psychologist from Umbrella

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Speaker 2: well Being is with us this morning. Calderdogle Curder Jack.

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Speaker 3: How are you?

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Speaker 2: I'm very well, thank you. Hey. A few weeks ago,

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Speaker 2: Interesting Are You and I were discussing adolescents that that

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Speaker 2: amazing Netflix series. And then this week, of course, the

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Speaker 2: well A National MP has put forward a member's bill

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Speaker 2: that would that would effectively ban social media for under

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Speaker 2: sixteen year olds. But there's a new report from the

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Speaker 2: Classification Office that actually looks at what young people are

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Speaker 2: being exposed to online, which is fascinating.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, fascinating and to be frank quite quite frightening

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Speaker 3: as well. And you know that that's that they had

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Speaker 3: They spoke to about ten groups of young people so

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Speaker 3: that stage between twelve and twenty five, and look, it

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Speaker 3: was incredibly common, almost universal, that they had encountered what

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Speaker 3: what the Classic Office called extremely harmful content, and that's

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Speaker 3: things like you know, graphic real world depictions of violence

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Speaker 3: and cruelty to animals, amongst other things. They won't go

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Speaker 3: through the whole list because it's a little bit stomach turning.

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Speaker 3: But you know, this was I guess the message was

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Speaker 3: that young people are seeing really distressing content online. Now,

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Speaker 3: I do want to say it's not just social media.

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Speaker 3: There was a variety of ways that they've seen it.

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Speaker 3: But it was a real eye opener, I think, and

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Speaker 3: would be probably a surprise perhaps to many, particularly parents,

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Speaker 3: about the content that young people are actually seeing, not

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Speaker 3: not always intentionally.

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Speaker 2: Well, and that's a key point, right, A lot of

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Speaker 2: the time it was actually unintentional that they came across

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Speaker 2: the stuff.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, it was. It was you know, it

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Speaker 3: wasn't Sometimes people searched it, you know, they would hear

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Speaker 3: something and search it and then go, oh my god,

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Speaker 3: that's horrible. But sometimes it just sort of turned up

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Speaker 3: and their news speeds, or somebody messaged them with it,

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Speaker 3: or or they saw it on a friend's device. So yes,

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Speaker 3: a lot of it was just unintentional that they hadn't

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Speaker 3: searched it out. It just it just appeared and they

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Speaker 3: suddenly were exposed to these really distressing sort of images online.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and you can't unsee it. It's like it must

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Speaker 2: be pretty affecting, especially for young people.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and some of them used that to them, you know,

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Speaker 3: they said, look, some things you just can't unsee, and

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Speaker 3: they use words are horrified and terrified, and probably, you know,

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Speaker 3: depending on what they've seen, there's that there's a real

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Speaker 3: risk of some of them probably developing things like ptsd

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Speaker 3: as as a result of that of seeing something, particularly

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Speaker 3: if it's real, you know, it's real life, so it's

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Speaker 3: you know, it's quite it's quite sobering. I think that

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Speaker 3: the what's out there and what our young people have

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Speaker 3: been often inadvertently exposed to.

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Speaker 2: Do young people know what to do if they come

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Speaker 2: across the stuff, like do they feel like they can

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Speaker 2: tell their parents? Do they feel like they can you know,

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Speaker 2: to pearency, like they can try and tell the platform

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Speaker 2: or you.

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Speaker 3: Know, well that that that's there. They're often unsure. That

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Speaker 3: was one of the findings is that they were often

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Speaker 3: unsure about what to do. They were worried that if

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Speaker 3: they told a parent or a teacher, then that the

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Speaker 3: immediate result would be right, you know, give us your

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Speaker 3: phone or your device, you're not having that anymore. And

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Speaker 3: they didn't, you know, the message from them was that

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Speaker 3: that they didn't want that they didn't and they weren't

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Speaker 3: often confident about reporting it, you know, to a platform,

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Speaker 3: because it seemed for many of them quite a laborious

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Speaker 3: process and it wasn't really clear that it would work.

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Speaker 3: But they did say they wanted to have they wanted

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Speaker 3: to be able to have open communications with trusted people

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Speaker 3: in their lives when they had come across it, and

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Speaker 3: and to be able to and I guess it's respecting

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Speaker 3: the fact that they're developing into adults to be able

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Speaker 3: to be supported and figuring out what to do. So

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Speaker 3: rather than having parents are adult to jump and removing

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Speaker 3: things immediately, it was like, actually, let's try and knuck

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Speaker 3: this out together, and let's give you the skills that

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Speaker 3: you can use next time you come across it, you know,

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Speaker 3: because it does sound like there will be next time.

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Speaker 3: So yeah, so it was a sort of a more

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Speaker 3: nuanced thing that they were really asking for, not not.

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Speaker 3: And I think the danger is, of course, if things

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Speaker 3: are removed immediately, then it just you just I'm not

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Speaker 3: sure that that will necessarily stop it, but it's likely

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Speaker 3: to push the behavior underground. Yeah, so they might see it,

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Speaker 3: but then they won't tell anybody about it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the thing, because a natural impulse from a

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Speaker 2: parenting perspective will be like, wow, all right, well we've

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Speaker 2: just gotta you know, we're just gonna have to keep

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Speaker 2: you off the enginet for the rest of your life.

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Speaker 2: That's here.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I agree. I think it is a really

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Speaker 3: natural impulse as parents that if you know, if our

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Speaker 3: kids have seen something that's really upsetting and distressing, you

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Speaker 3: naturally want to protect them from that. But I'm you know,

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Speaker 3: and I can see that, I can see the argument there.

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Speaker 3: But I firstly, I mean, if you've banned them from

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Speaker 3: social media, you probably are not not actually going to

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Speaker 3: fix the whole problem because it wasn't always on social media.

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Speaker 3: And then what are you going to do? You're going

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Speaker 3: to are you going to ban the internet? You know,

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Speaker 3: you're going to ban it for a sixteen year old.

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Speaker 3: It's literally in the air around us. And so I'm not,

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Speaker 3: you know, I understand that desire, but I'm not one

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Speaker 3: hundred percent sure that it would be the would actually

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Speaker 3: be the best thing, you know, And we do want

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Speaker 3: to keep those communication channels open to the young people

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Speaker 3: so if they do see it, they can come and

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Speaker 3: tell someone, because it's super important, you know, to be

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Speaker 3: able to not want to hold that in. If you've

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Speaker 3: seen something really distressing, be able to have somebody safe

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Speaker 3: that you can go and sort of de stress and

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Speaker 3: unwind with and let them know and just just you know,

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Speaker 3: share that with somebody. So it's perhaps take some of

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Speaker 3: this thing out of it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's the thing. The nuance is the key,

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Speaker 2: the key thing when it comes to the parents' response,

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Speaker 2: you just want to and try and have some nuance there.

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Speaker 2: What do you think of the banning under sixteen some

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Speaker 2: social media idea.

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Speaker 3: I don't know. I'm mixed about today. I mean, I like,

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Speaker 3: I understand it, but I and especially being exposed to

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Speaker 3: difficult stuff. On the other hand, we know that a

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Speaker 3: lot of social it's a big source of social contact

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Speaker 3: for a lot of young people, particularly in minority groups

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Speaker 3: or who are perhaps geographically remote, that it's a real

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Speaker 3: source of social connection. And I know the augument will be, well,

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Speaker 3: we grew up with it, you know, we didn't have

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Speaker 3: the Internet when we grew up. But you know that's

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Speaker 3: I know that. And I grew up in that area

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Speaker 3: era too, and it's like, well, we still made friends,

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Speaker 3: but we're not in that era anymore. That's history. And

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Speaker 3: I kind of get the sentiment, but I just worried

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Speaker 3: that it won't actually be as effectives as people would

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Speaker 3: like it to be. Be interesting to sit, you know,

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Speaker 3: to trace Australia see what's going to happen there, because

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Speaker 3: they you know, they have effectively done that, and so

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Speaker 3: it'd be interesting to see how they go. But I

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Speaker 3: worry about the policing of it. What I would say

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Speaker 3: is i'd support I definitely support, you know, social media

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Speaker 3: companies from having having continuing to improve the content that

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Speaker 3: that's on their platform and kind of put it back

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Speaker 3: on them and say, hey, look, you know, if you

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Speaker 3: are going to have a make money from this, can

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Speaker 3: you at least make sure that it's not harmful to people?

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Speaker 3: You know? And maybe there's a separate platform front of

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Speaker 3: sixteens or something. I don't know, but but but you know,

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Speaker 3: I'm in favor of certainly putting the emphasis on those

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Speaker 3: social media companies to be continue to police things even

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Speaker 3: more strongly than they are now.

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Speaker 2: Such a tricky one. Hey, thanks so much, Google. We

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Speaker 2: really appreciate your dialing insight as always, so of course

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Speaker 2: I just google something. They're from Umbrella Well Being.

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Speaker 1: For more from Saturday Morning with Jack Tame, Listen live

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