WEBVTT - Helen O'Sullivan: Trade Me data shows rent prices falling 0:00:05.761 --> 0:00:09.441 You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks 0:00:09.521 --> 0:00:38.001 Ed Bassure. 0:00:39.481 --> 0:00:40.921 Yesterday was bad. 0:00:44.121 --> 0:00:46.841 And welcome back to the Weekend Collective. It is time 0:00:46.881 --> 0:00:49.041 now for the One roofe radio show. We want your calls. 0:00:49.081 --> 0:00:51.361 We'd love to have your participation on one highty ten 0:00:51.401 --> 0:00:54.721 eighty in text on nine two nine two, And today 0:00:54.801 --> 0:00:57.921 my guest is from Velocity with an A at the 0:00:57.961 --> 0:01:01.281 start and her name is Hello Sullivant, Hello Helen, how 0:01:01.281 --> 0:01:01.721 are you going? 0:01:01.841 --> 0:01:04.441 Good tim? I am great to thank you? How are you? 0:01:05.361 --> 0:01:08.641 Very good things and just explain a little bit for 0:01:08.721 --> 0:01:11.961 those people who will have heard of Velocity about what 0:01:12.001 --> 0:01:12.481 you guys do. 0:01:12.841 --> 0:01:16.761 Yeah, Velocity is a quibi o proptic that provides a 0:01:16.761 --> 0:01:20.201 lot of valuation ordering and management software for banks. And 0:01:20.241 --> 0:01:23.121 we also have a new product called Velocity Nexus which 0:01:23.161 --> 0:01:26.041 we provide to the real estate industry, which is a 0:01:26.201 --> 0:01:32.281 property research tool that real estate agents use to assess 0:01:32.321 --> 0:01:34.121 and research their markets. 0:01:35.481 --> 0:01:37.361 And so for the average punter, what would they use 0:01:37.401 --> 0:01:37.761 for them? 0:01:38.401 --> 0:01:41.001 For the average we don't have a consumer offering, but 0:01:41.121 --> 0:01:44.161 what we are providing is parwering real estate agents. And indeed, 0:01:44.161 --> 0:01:47.641 the one roof website is kind of kind of what. 0:01:47.521 --> 0:01:50.761 Brings me here, Tim, That is fantastic because we love 0:01:50.801 --> 0:01:54.321 the one Roof website actually on the velocity on the 0:01:54.441 --> 0:01:56.241 value side of things. So the first thing we want 0:01:56.281 --> 0:01:59.841 to have a chat about is that, were you surprised 0:01:59.881 --> 0:02:04.921 that trade Me data shows that rent prices are for 0:02:05.881 --> 0:02:07.081 the first time in a couple. 0:02:06.921 --> 0:02:11.121 Of years, not surprised to see that that market is 0:02:11.121 --> 0:02:15.361 definitely softening. Yeah, all my sources are telling me that 0:02:15.401 --> 0:02:18.121 the rental market is definitely a lot softer than it 0:02:18.161 --> 0:02:21.241 has been. Demand as low. I mean, that's normal for 0:02:21.281 --> 0:02:25.121 this time of year anyway for some peculiar reason, and 0:02:25.161 --> 0:02:28.001 Auckland people don't like shifting their stuff in pouring rain. 0:02:28.321 --> 0:02:31.761 Go figure. Yeah, it's definitely softer than usual. 0:02:31.921 --> 0:02:35.001 It did surprise me because I think until recently the 0:02:35.041 --> 0:02:37.761 immigration figures had shown this massive number of people who 0:02:37.761 --> 0:02:41.001 are leaving and of course we're sort of importing people 0:02:41.081 --> 0:02:44.081 to make up for that, but in fact, sorry, a 0:02:44.161 --> 0:02:46.321 massive number of people still arriving as well. We had 0:02:46.401 --> 0:02:50.281 in the past year some amazing immigration stats. But it 0:02:50.281 --> 0:02:55.121 does surprise me that that hasn't well, it hasn't equated 0:02:55.161 --> 0:02:58.321 to one a rise in property prices or rents, but 0:02:59.441 --> 0:03:02.041 in terms of the rental price drop. How much of 0:03:02.081 --> 0:03:07.041 that has to do with government policy because well, for instance, 0:03:07.081 --> 0:03:11.561 the lack of deductibility was obviously to me a factor 0:03:11.601 --> 0:03:13.881 in putting rents up, because you make it more expensive 0:03:13.881 --> 0:03:15.841 to be a landlord, you're going to pass that on. 0:03:15.921 --> 0:03:18.681 But is that a factor at all or not yet? 0:03:19.321 --> 0:03:21.761 I don't really think so, because the thing with rent 0:03:22.441 --> 0:03:24.881 is that it's not really set by the costs that 0:03:24.921 --> 0:03:30.721 the landlord is experiencing. It is mainly driven by the 0:03:30.761 --> 0:03:35.161 market and what is achievable for that property. Most rental 0:03:35.201 --> 0:03:38.601 properties do actually run out a cash loss. 0:03:38.961 --> 0:03:42.001 Okay, well, how about this then? Is the market driven 0:03:42.081 --> 0:03:44.601 by the fact that overall for all landlords it was 0:03:45.001 --> 0:03:48.001 more expensive too, you know, you couldn't deduct as much. 0:03:48.041 --> 0:03:51.841 So is the market influenced by policies like that? And 0:03:51.881 --> 0:03:53.361 we don't worry people, We're not going to make this 0:03:53.401 --> 0:03:56.761 a discussion abound whether deductibility and text ductibility and all 0:03:56.801 --> 0:03:58.681 that sort of thing is a good thing or not. 0:03:58.761 --> 0:04:02.401 But I mean, if you take a macro view. 0:04:03.121 --> 0:04:06.481 Look, my macro view is my my experience of the market, 0:04:06.601 --> 0:04:11.921 is that what landlords is, what is achievable in revenue 0:04:12.041 --> 0:04:15.561 and rent is very much driven by the supply and 0:04:15.601 --> 0:04:21.561 demand as opposed to input prices, which is where the 0:04:21.721 --> 0:04:23.521 deductibility or otherwise comes in. 0:04:23.961 --> 0:04:29.201 Okay, So when they're talking about a drop in rental prices, 0:04:29.241 --> 0:04:33.321 I guess that is we're not seeing people haggling their 0:04:33.321 --> 0:04:36.441 rents down yet, are we? Would that be just as 0:04:36.601 --> 0:04:39.321 new listings come up. We've just noticed that the average 0:04:39.321 --> 0:04:42.521 price of new listings for rental is slightly cheaper. 0:04:42.561 --> 0:04:45.841 Now, I think it's more. Number one, we're not saying 0:04:45.841 --> 0:04:48.321 rents continue to go up as they had been doing. 0:04:49.521 --> 0:04:53.601 And number two, you if you spent a lot of 0:04:53.641 --> 0:04:59.721 time monitoring rental sites, as geeks like me do, you 0:04:59.761 --> 0:05:02.001 will see properties that have been on the market for 0:05:02.121 --> 0:05:06.841 some time starting to drop in price. And then when 0:05:06.841 --> 0:05:11.281 a new when new stock comes to market, they landlord 0:05:11.281 --> 0:05:13.321 will probably managing when they're setting the rent We'll look 0:05:13.321 --> 0:05:17.121 at what's being advertised around the area and in that space, 0:05:17.361 --> 0:05:21.881 and they'll set their price accordingly. Yeah, because there's no 0:05:21.921 --> 0:05:25.641 point in you know, it's surprising how price sensitive the 0:05:25.681 --> 0:05:28.481 rental market is. If you overprice a rental property by 0:05:28.521 --> 0:05:32.041 twenty or even twenty dollars, you will find that you 0:05:32.081 --> 0:05:33.441 don't get inquiry for it. 0:05:34.841 --> 0:05:37.121 Actually, by the way, we should give these stat actually, 0:05:37.241 --> 0:05:40.201 just because when you hear that rentals have dropped, it 0:05:40.241 --> 0:05:43.161 makes you think, oh wow, how much. But it's a 0:05:43.841 --> 0:05:47.801 month on month looks like it's a five dollars a 0:05:47.841 --> 0:05:51.161 week drop to six hundred and forty five bucks, So 0:05:51.201 --> 0:05:54.481 it's it's hardly plummeted or anything. But I guess it's 0:05:54.521 --> 0:05:57.321 just a relief to people who are renting or looking 0:05:57.321 --> 0:06:01.441 to rent that it's not this crazy market where you know, 0:06:01.481 --> 0:06:03.321 you've got to go bid against it with other people 0:06:03.361 --> 0:06:06.161 and or guess what, you know, another fifty bucks will 0:06:06.161 --> 0:06:07.241 do it more. 0:06:07.121 --> 0:06:10.281 Than anything else. It's preferable to find yourself at an 0:06:10.321 --> 0:06:13.921 open home with a horde of people, which I remember 0:06:13.961 --> 0:06:17.481 doing in my bad old days renting, and you'd turn 0:06:17.561 --> 0:06:20.681 up and there'd be fifty people standing outside the open home. 0:06:20.761 --> 0:06:23.321 You go, oh my god, Actually, actually I do. I 0:06:23.361 --> 0:06:26.641 only remember that because when we rented, we bought the 0:06:26.681 --> 0:06:29.761 place that we were renting. But when we rented it 0:06:29.841 --> 0:06:32.241 and we had a couple hundred meters from Saint Helia's Beach, 0:06:33.201 --> 0:06:34.721 and there was no one interested in looking at it 0:06:34.721 --> 0:06:37.281 because it was an old it was old like the 0:06:37.361 --> 0:06:40.521 day course you know, sort of that sort of eighties 0:06:40.561 --> 0:06:42.321 pink sort of car. 0:06:43.361 --> 0:06:45.921 Yes, oh gosh, avocado. 0:06:46.681 --> 0:06:49.481 It was all pretty pastal and it was pretty dated 0:06:49.561 --> 0:06:52.361 and all that. But the agent it was well priced, 0:06:52.881 --> 0:06:56.961 but it was well priced, but no one was looking. Literally, 0:06:57.121 --> 0:06:59.521 I didn't have to burd against anyone. No one was 0:06:59.561 --> 0:07:01.881 looking at it. And I think I made an offer 0:07:01.921 --> 0:07:04.681 for a bit cheaper than it was and the agent said, yeah, sure, 0:07:04.761 --> 0:07:06.801 And I mean it was the best news ever. But 0:07:07.041 --> 0:07:09.921 of course then you go forward ten years or something 0:07:10.481 --> 0:07:15.481 and it's just it went nuts. What sees do we 0:07:15.521 --> 0:07:18.081 ever have a sort of balanced market where maybe you've 0:07:18.121 --> 0:07:20.761 got three or four in parties, it's not sure. What 0:07:20.921 --> 0:07:23.481 is the happy medium? Do you think? Well, actually, the 0:07:23.521 --> 0:07:25.921 happy medium depends on whether your renter, because the happy 0:07:25.921 --> 0:07:28.641 medium for a renter is you're the only one interested 0:07:29.041 --> 0:07:31.201 and it's nice and cheap. The happy medium for you 0:07:31.241 --> 0:07:36.041 as a landlord is you've got people you know, fighting 0:07:36.081 --> 0:07:38.441 to get the property, and more. 0:07:38.241 --> 0:07:42.121 Than anything else, you're keeping your you're keeping it occupied. 0:07:42.321 --> 0:07:44.761 I mean, one of the things that we the counsel 0:07:44.841 --> 0:07:47.841 that I always used to give landlords who you're wanting 0:07:47.841 --> 0:07:50.201 to hang on for a higher price, it takes a 0:07:50.201 --> 0:07:52.921 lot of weeks at twenty or thirty dollars a week 0:07:53.881 --> 0:07:56.641 extra rent to pay for three or four weeks of 0:07:56.961 --> 0:08:00.641 vacant occupation, and so you are far better to meet 0:08:00.641 --> 0:08:03.241 the market in terms of the rental price and get 0:08:03.241 --> 0:08:04.201 the property occupied. 0:08:04.361 --> 0:08:06.601 Actually that's not because that's quite a useful thing for 0:08:06.641 --> 0:08:08.721 rents to bear in mind and remark like this. Then 0:08:08.761 --> 0:08:12.841 that because if a property's been sitting vacant for a 0:08:12.841 --> 0:08:15.921 couple of weeks and you're offering, say twenty bucks less, 0:08:16.001 --> 0:08:18.161 it's worth make an offer. I mean it's worth that 0:08:18.281 --> 0:08:19.481 because it's like trying to. 0:08:19.441 --> 0:08:24.201 Buy a house. You don't necessarily pay the asking. You'll 0:08:24.201 --> 0:08:27.361 make an offer, so you know, you might get knocked back. 0:08:27.481 --> 0:08:28.921 But how much does know who? 0:08:29.041 --> 0:08:30.881 Well, look at it this way, if it's. 0:08:30.761 --> 0:08:32.161 Doesn't cost you anything to get to know. 0:08:32.561 --> 0:08:34.321 For instance, if it's six hundred and fifty bucks and 0:08:34.361 --> 0:08:35.921 you're thinking, you know what I'm going to ask, offer 0:08:35.921 --> 0:08:39.121 them six one hundred and I don't know, ten or twenty. 0:08:40.081 --> 0:08:42.921 I mean that's quite a few weeks that they would 0:08:42.961 --> 0:08:45.441 have to make up for it. I mean, if they 0:08:45.481 --> 0:08:48.681 had another couple of weeks vacant, that's probably worth the 0:08:48.761 --> 0:08:50.961 landlord thinking, oh, you know what, you're a good tenant. 0:08:51.001 --> 0:08:54.841 You look reliable, Bengo, it's yours absolutely, and the same 0:08:54.881 --> 0:08:57.001 when you've got tenants who are in situ and you're 0:08:57.001 --> 0:09:00.681 looking at written rises. As a landlord, way better to 0:09:00.721 --> 0:09:03.681 retain a good tenant than try and squeak an extra 0:09:03.761 --> 0:09:05.561 at ten to fifteen dollars out of it and loser 0:09:05.641 --> 0:09:07.881 a good sitting tenant. Have a few weeks back. 0:09:08.361 --> 0:09:09.761 We'd love to have your cause on this on how 0:09:09.801 --> 0:09:12.361 you go about negotiating your rent when you're looking for 0:09:12.401 --> 0:09:15.601 a property. But would you ever here's here's the big one, 0:09:15.601 --> 0:09:17.841 and I don't to be honest, I'm not sure we're 0:09:17.881 --> 0:09:21.201 really in this territory yet unless you are overpaying, unless 0:09:21.201 --> 0:09:23.681 you're one of those tenants who I don't know, for 0:09:23.721 --> 0:09:25.521 some reason, you look at your rent and you're going, wow, 0:09:25.561 --> 0:09:29.281 we're paying way too much. Have you ever negotiated a 0:09:29.281 --> 0:09:33.481 rental decrease? Have you ever back in your rental days? 0:09:33.521 --> 0:09:36.041 If you've always Once you're in there, you're sort of like, oh, 0:09:36.081 --> 0:09:37.521 well this is my budget, just keep paying. 0:09:38.481 --> 0:09:39.561 Yeah, well, I look. 0:09:39.361 --> 0:09:42.441 We've seen it happen, particularly when a property's value is compromised. 0:09:42.481 --> 0:09:45.441 You know there's road works going on outside, or all 0:09:45.521 --> 0:09:51.481 the buildings is under renovation, or you know, something's something 0:09:51.521 --> 0:09:54.201 major happens. You know, we saw quite a bit of 0:09:54.241 --> 0:09:58.401 it during post pandemic, when you know, particular in the 0:09:58.401 --> 0:10:01.281 inner city there's a lot of vacancy. People who reached 0:10:01.321 --> 0:10:02.961 the end of the e fixed to take a look 0:10:03.001 --> 0:10:06.041 at trade me and go, karke place underneath me is 0:10:06.041 --> 0:10:09.161 one hundred bucks cheaper than what I'm paying, and that's 0:10:09.201 --> 0:10:13.361 a valid mart You know, ultimately, when it comes to rent, 0:10:13.841 --> 0:10:16.361 you can appeal to the tendency tribunal and then and 0:10:16.401 --> 0:10:19.641 say this is not market rent that I'm being changed, 0:10:19.721 --> 0:10:21.881 and then you know, then it all comes down to 0:10:21.881 --> 0:10:25.961 the evidence. What are some of the properties so renting 0:10:26.001 --> 0:10:27.841 for around you? And it's pretty easy to find that 0:10:27.881 --> 0:10:30.081 stuff on all the websites because. 0:10:29.921 --> 0:10:33.801 These days, actually I was thinking in the older days, 0:10:33.841 --> 0:10:36.561 where more landlords manage their own rentals, that would be 0:10:36.601 --> 0:10:39.921 a more awkward conversation, isn't But these days most I mean, 0:10:39.961 --> 0:10:42.281 what do we know what proportion of properties are managed 0:10:42.281 --> 0:10:43.281 by property managers? 0:10:43.361 --> 0:10:46.241 That data always used to say it was thirty to 0:10:46.241 --> 0:10:49.801 forty percent. We're managed by property managers, And you know, 0:10:49.921 --> 0:10:53.241 sort of sixty to seventy percent where self managed. Really, 0:10:53.401 --> 0:10:56.121 I suspect things have changed, but it's really hard to 0:10:56.121 --> 0:10:58.481 get a sense of what the you know, there's no 0:10:58.561 --> 0:11:01.361 market share data that you can kind of reliably get. 0:11:02.361 --> 0:11:05.521 But kiwis are very we're good deal. Oh wire is 0:11:05.641 --> 0:11:10.281 right and in property management as much as anything else. 0:11:10.361 --> 0:11:14.321 That actually surprises me. But I guess because every I 0:11:14.361 --> 0:11:18.281 think just about every expert that we've had or commentator 0:11:18.321 --> 0:11:21.401 we've had in the studio when it comes to property investment, 0:11:21.881 --> 0:11:26.041 the question around who should manage your property has almost 0:11:26.121 --> 0:11:29.841 resounding I would say ninety five percent of the opinion 0:11:29.921 --> 0:11:32.601 is that if you don't, if you just get someone 0:11:32.601 --> 0:11:34.281 else to do it and avoid yourself a whole world 0:11:34.321 --> 0:11:38.041 of headaches unless you are really really seasoned, have the 0:11:38.081 --> 0:11:40.561 time to do it and the expertise, and you just 0:11:40.681 --> 0:11:41.281 grate at it. 0:11:41.321 --> 0:11:45.041 Look, I'd totally agree, it's an incredibly complicated business these days. 0:11:45.921 --> 0:11:48.281 You know, there's a lot of compliance and ultimately you're 0:11:48.321 --> 0:11:51.001 in business, so there's a number of things that you 0:11:51.041 --> 0:11:54.081 have to comply with, and my personal preference has always 0:11:54.121 --> 0:11:56.441 been to pay someone else to work that stuff out 0:11:57.081 --> 0:12:00.321 for me and take those you know, so that when 0:12:00.441 --> 0:12:04.721 the sync overflowers or the toilet blocks on a Saturday 0:12:04.761 --> 0:12:07.041 after no, I don't get the phone call. 0:12:07.361 --> 0:12:11.281 Yeah, actually, on that thing about if you are if 0:12:11.321 --> 0:12:14.121 you do think you're in an apartment or a house 0:12:14.241 --> 0:12:17.681 where you are paying too much, look the first price. 0:12:17.841 --> 0:12:20.241 The first step would be surely to talk to you 0:12:20.321 --> 0:12:22.641 wouldn't go to the tendency to no, you wouldn't start. 0:12:23.241 --> 0:12:27.201 I mean that's pretty I don't know a blunt instrument, 0:12:27.321 --> 0:12:30.561 isn't it. So you talk to the landlord of the 0:12:30.601 --> 0:12:32.041 letting agent and just say. 0:12:32.961 --> 0:12:36.121 First I gather the evidence, so you know, as opposed 0:12:36.161 --> 0:12:38.921 to just going might reckon? Is I reckon I'm paying 0:12:38.961 --> 0:12:42.121 too much? What are some of the properties in a 0:12:42.161 --> 0:12:46.521 similar condition renting for around where you're living? Sometimes it's 0:12:46.561 --> 0:12:49.161 really hard to find comparables. You know, you might have 0:12:50.001 --> 0:12:54.921 the penthouse apartment, you might have the sort of the 0:12:55.041 --> 0:12:57.361 dark thing on the corner on the corner of the block. 0:12:58.321 --> 0:13:01.201 But there will be something. There will be There's always 0:13:01.281 --> 0:13:04.521 data on on websites. One roof it has a great 0:13:04.561 --> 0:13:07.121 mental set as well. Take a look at it and 0:13:07.161 --> 0:13:09.641 see what some of the properties are renting for. Start 0:13:09.681 --> 0:13:13.161 with data. As always, always my default position. 0:13:13.441 --> 0:13:16.321 Yeah, because I thinking if you're renting a house, the 0:13:16.401 --> 0:13:18.801 comparisons are probably a bit more tricky, isn't it, Because 0:13:19.161 --> 0:13:21.201 you could be a house on the same street. You 0:13:21.201 --> 0:13:23.121 could be a three bedroom house on the same street 0:13:23.201 --> 0:13:25.681 along with another three bedroom house, but you know, one 0:13:25.761 --> 0:13:29.441 house might be I don't know, brand new bathroom, freshly decorated, 0:13:29.481 --> 0:13:33.841 all that sort of thing. It's not so straightforward, is it. 0:13:33.561 --> 0:13:39.241 It's not straightforward, and that's why data and judgment comes 0:13:39.281 --> 0:13:39.641 into it. 0:13:40.761 --> 0:13:43.761 And Okay, so you've had a chat with the landlord 0:13:43.761 --> 0:13:46.881 and the letting agent and they've said, no, no, we're 0:13:46.881 --> 0:13:48.881 not prepared for just the rent you signed up to it. 0:13:49.801 --> 0:13:52.881 That was the market, and that is the market. If 0:13:52.921 --> 0:13:56.561 you decide you want to take that further, then what 0:13:56.761 --> 0:13:57.681 it is the tend to. 0:13:57.641 --> 0:13:58.161 Be in is it? 0:13:58.321 --> 0:13:59.161 Yeah? 0:13:59.201 --> 0:14:00.361 And so what's involved with that? 0:14:00.441 --> 0:14:04.641 Then filling in lots of forms, waiting your turn for 0:14:04.761 --> 0:14:11.841 a hearing, attending the hearing, presenting your evidence. The landlord 0:14:12.041 --> 0:14:14.881 or the leading agent would debtend the hearing as well, 0:14:15.001 --> 0:14:20.481 present their counter evidence, and adjudicator listens carefully, blimey, and 0:14:20.841 --> 0:14:21.921 then make the decision do. 0:14:21.921 --> 0:14:23.841 You have to actually turn up to the tenth stritripunal 0:14:23.841 --> 0:14:26.481 in the flesh or is it done sort of, there's 0:14:26.521 --> 0:14:27.281 a lot more of it. 0:14:27.281 --> 0:14:32.961 It's done remotely. They discovered that little handy technique during 0:14:33.241 --> 0:14:36.521 during the pandemic, and then we went, why don't we 0:14:36.561 --> 0:14:38.081 do this all the time. It's kind of a lot 0:14:38.121 --> 0:14:39.881 easier and it's a lot less confronting. 0:14:40.361 --> 0:14:42.921 Actually, yeah, I imagine that would be, because that's half 0:14:42.921 --> 0:14:44.281 the thing. You take the heat out of it. When 0:14:44.281 --> 0:14:47.281 you've got an adjudicator who's down the phone line. 0:14:47.081 --> 0:14:48.801 And everyone has to be can be a lot more 0:14:48.841 --> 0:14:51.321 complicated though in terms of because sometimes there's a lot 0:14:51.321 --> 0:14:54.881 of paper we're involved and you know, here's my copy 0:14:54.961 --> 0:14:57.841 of this, and you know, so, yeah, it can be 0:14:57.921 --> 0:15:01.601 more complicated, and you've you've got to be really organized, 0:15:02.001 --> 0:15:04.481 and you've got to be good at making your case. 0:15:05.081 --> 0:15:09.361 The adjudicator is a pretty good at being balanced. You 0:15:09.361 --> 0:15:12.121 know that they're accustomed to having a bit of everything 0:15:12.161 --> 0:15:16.281 come before them. You get some interesting decisions out of 0:15:16.321 --> 0:15:20.121 them occasionally. But I can couldn't cut both ways. Really. 0:15:20.241 --> 0:15:23.041 Yeah, Look, we'd love to hear from you, just if 0:15:23.081 --> 0:15:26.201 you are a renter, or actually even if you're a landlord. Actually, 0:15:26.241 --> 0:15:29.361 have you ever been asked for a reduction, and what's 0:15:29.401 --> 0:15:31.841 your approach being to it. What's the best way to 0:15:31.841 --> 0:15:35.281 negotiate your rent? If you think that maybe you've got 0:15:35.281 --> 0:15:36.961 a bit of a room to wiggle, or because I 0:15:37.001 --> 0:15:39.201 think if you look, if you make a cheeky offer, 0:15:39.441 --> 0:15:41.761 then see you later. So I think there's no such 0:15:41.801 --> 0:15:44.281 thing as there wouldn't be any point in making anything 0:15:44.321 --> 0:15:47.601 other than a reasonable offer. But you can add your 0:15:47.601 --> 0:15:50.201 comment on that, Helen. Just as the music playing before 0:15:50.241 --> 0:15:52.281 we go to the break, A big. 0:15:52.081 --> 0:15:53.321 Fan of the reasonable offer me. 0:15:54.361 --> 0:15:56.241 Okay, we'll be back in just a moment. It's twenty 0:15:56.281 --> 0:16:01.761 two past four News Talk z B inside a clean instance. 0:16:05.361 --> 0:16:31.321 Thinne and welcome back to the Weekend Collective. 0:16:31.361 --> 0:16:32.841 This is one road you show what your calls on 0:16:32.921 --> 0:16:34.961 eight hundred eighty ten eighty or text nine two nine too. 0:16:34.961 --> 0:16:36.961 We're talking about how do you go about negotiating a 0:16:37.401 --> 0:16:43.401 rent reduction? Look, possibly it's not the easiest game to 0:16:43.401 --> 0:16:45.401 play right now, given the rents have gone down, but 0:16:45.561 --> 0:16:49.561 just to put it in perspective, only five bucks to 0:16:49.721 --> 0:16:51.921 six hundred and forty five a week. But you might 0:16:51.961 --> 0:16:53.881 be one of those ones who you know on a 0:16:53.881 --> 0:16:56.641 six hundred and forty five property. You're you thought I 0:16:56.641 --> 0:16:58.601 wouldn't need the property and you're paying seven hundred bucks. 0:16:58.681 --> 0:17:00.041 You want to have a chat with the landlord about it? 0:17:00.081 --> 0:17:00.921 How do you go about it? 0:17:01.001 --> 0:17:01.121 Oh? 0:17:01.161 --> 0:17:03.001 Eight hundred eighty ten eighty right, let's go to some 0:17:03.041 --> 0:17:07.961 calls Rod. Hello, I can't hear Rod for some reason, 0:17:08.001 --> 0:17:11.881 so we just need to hound right, right, So I 0:17:12.081 --> 0:17:14.281 just start again. Sorry, we just had a right block. 0:17:15.401 --> 0:17:17.761 So I've been alan ord, been there for some time, 0:17:18.201 --> 0:17:23.641 well aware that much rather have my properties tenanted. The 0:17:23.641 --> 0:17:27.761 losses that you do between tendencies, between tendencies cannot be 0:17:27.841 --> 0:17:31.281 quite significant, particularly compared to any rein increase that might 0:17:31.321 --> 0:17:35.041 be achieved. So I have very good tenants and one 0:17:35.081 --> 0:17:39.041 on one properly owned. They had been there for over 0:17:39.081 --> 0:17:43.641 two years, and they wanted to do some things, mind 0:17:43.681 --> 0:17:48.641 the things inside which I'm entry to do coming to them. Okay, 0:17:48.721 --> 0:17:51.281 that's fine, but we need to look at the rent 0:17:52.081 --> 0:17:55.641 and so my sugistan to them was you have a 0:17:55.641 --> 0:17:58.521 look at rents in the area, what you think you 0:17:58.521 --> 0:18:03.081 can pay, and then we'll talk about So two or 0:18:03.081 --> 0:18:05.761 three weeks later they said, okay, we thought about it. 0:18:06.241 --> 0:18:09.401 We think we can afford thirty dollars a week. I 0:18:09.601 --> 0:18:11.721 had in mind that I was going to ask for 0:18:11.721 --> 0:18:12.441 forty dollars a week. 0:18:12.441 --> 0:18:13.321 Well, this is a non crise. 0:18:13.321 --> 0:18:18.241 You're talking about an increase. Yeah, that they were aware that, 0:18:18.401 --> 0:18:21.281 you know, there's been signaltt increases in terms of insurance 0:18:21.561 --> 0:18:26.681 and rates. So I said, okay, if that's you're comfortable 0:18:26.681 --> 0:18:29.761 with that, then I would accept that. Thank you. I 0:18:29.761 --> 0:18:32.201 thought they were very lucky because pretty soon after that 0:18:32.321 --> 0:18:35.681 I would monitor Bodom lodgment with Bond Center, which has 0:18:35.721 --> 0:18:39.361 got to be an indication of current rents, and at 0:18:39.361 --> 0:18:44.361 that point the property was in number of bedrooms, et 0:18:44.401 --> 0:18:49.561 cetera in that area another forty dollars, so forty plus 0:18:49.561 --> 0:18:53.801 thirty seventy dollars more right rents in that area. So 0:18:54.561 --> 0:18:58.841 they were lucky to negotiate a reasonable price quickly and 0:18:58.961 --> 0:19:02.801 therefore avoid me reviewing it at an even higher amount, 0:19:02.841 --> 0:19:05.281 which I thought would have been equitable market. 0:19:05.921 --> 0:19:08.361 I guess it's sounded like it all went reasonably well 0:19:08.361 --> 0:19:10.881 as a negotiation because you both were trying to understand 0:19:10.881 --> 0:19:12.281 each other's position. 0:19:12.601 --> 0:19:14.321 Is that right correct? 0:19:14.761 --> 0:19:14.961 Yeah? 0:19:15.161 --> 0:19:19.201 I mean I don't I know others who think they 0:19:19.201 --> 0:19:21.801 should put in every year. I don't see what it is. 0:19:22.241 --> 0:19:27.521 Certainly in terms of the costs that have come through Untald, 0:19:28.161 --> 0:19:31.401 nothing that's in my control in the last three through 0:19:31.721 --> 0:19:35.841 three or four years, saying that the rents are significantly 0:19:36.241 --> 0:19:40.241 low compared to we started out. 0:19:41.561 --> 0:19:44.441 Yeah, Actually, you know the question that comes out of 0:19:44.441 --> 0:19:46.641 all this in a way, and you've probably reflected that 0:19:46.681 --> 0:19:50.561 a bit by accepting a lower increase than you're looking for. 0:19:50.881 --> 0:19:55.241 How much is a good tenant actually worth? How do 0:19:55.281 --> 0:19:57.681 you quantify? I think that's the that's the big question, 0:19:57.881 --> 0:20:00.561 because I think much more it's a lot. 0:20:00.401 --> 0:20:04.241 Isn't it much more than trying to squeezed another twenty 0:20:04.361 --> 0:20:08.361 or three dollars we out in one go. The time, 0:20:08.521 --> 0:20:12.201 in my opinion, to go to a bit harder with 0:20:12.321 --> 0:20:16.241 read is when a tendency changes. And I've said that 0:20:16.321 --> 0:20:18.761 there's a costly process changing tenancies. 0:20:18.881 --> 0:20:21.721 Actually that is that is I think through that call 0:20:21.761 --> 0:20:25.001 with Rod Helen, that is the question, isn't it? Because 0:20:25.121 --> 0:20:27.361 all it boils down to is what is a good 0:20:27.361 --> 0:20:32.041 tenant worth? And if your property is something that's quite 0:20:32.081 --> 0:20:33.921 precious to you and you don't want to have to 0:20:34.401 --> 0:20:38.641 worry about chasing people for the extra costs of repairs 0:20:38.721 --> 0:20:41.041 or something, or what is a good tenant worth? 0:20:41.081 --> 0:20:46.521 That's well, a bad tenant can be catastrophically expensive, But 0:20:47.081 --> 0:20:49.881 it comes down to whether or not do you think 0:20:49.881 --> 0:20:52.921 there's another nice fish in the sea. How hard or 0:20:52.921 --> 0:20:55.161 easy is it to find good tenants? And that's an 0:20:55.161 --> 0:20:58.121 interesting it's a question that Tony Alexander asked and his 0:20:58.401 --> 0:21:03.441 regular column which is published on one where you know, 0:21:03.641 --> 0:21:07.121 they ask how asked land to rate how much easier 0:21:07.241 --> 0:21:09.641 is it to find good tenants than it used to be? 0:21:10.601 --> 0:21:14.201 And they you know, the negatives outweigh the positives, And 0:21:14.241 --> 0:21:16.921 at the moment more landlords are saying it's harder to 0:21:16.961 --> 0:21:20.241 find good tenants than I think we've seen in that 0:21:20.321 --> 0:21:21.161 reading for a while. 0:21:21.721 --> 0:21:24.641 Actually, yeah, And I mean it's a very broad question 0:21:24.761 --> 0:21:26.441 is what is a good tenant worth? Of course, but 0:21:27.161 --> 0:21:29.001 it depends on the property and the rent and all 0:21:29.041 --> 0:21:32.001 that sort of thing. But I guess how many weeks 0:21:32.041 --> 0:21:34.801 rent is a good tenant worth? In terms of negotiating, 0:21:34.801 --> 0:21:36.641 you know, if you're looking like if I'm going to 0:21:36.841 --> 0:21:39.801 I mean, I don't know how you budgets as a landlord. 0:21:40.201 --> 0:21:42.961 As an investor, some people will budget on the idea 0:21:42.961 --> 0:21:44.681 that they're going to have it tenanted fifty two weeks 0:21:44.721 --> 0:21:46.361 of the year. But that's alltalistic. 0:21:46.441 --> 0:21:48.321 Yeah, you've got to expect to have a couple of weeks, 0:21:48.321 --> 0:21:50.681