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Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from news talks it B.

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Speaker 1: Follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: It's time for all the attitude, all the opinion, all

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Speaker 1: the information, all the debates of this now the Leyton

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Speaker 1: Smith Podcast powered by news talks it B.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to podcasts two hundred and forty five for July third,

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty four. Speaking of dates, nineteen ninety four saw

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Speaker 2: the publication of a book with the title Lost Rights,

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Speaker 2: The Destruction of American Liberty. It was the third book

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Speaker 2: by libertarian journalist James Bouvart, who is now, by the way,

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Speaker 2: written eleven books. Then in nineteen ninety nine came Freedom

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Speaker 2: in Chains, The Rise of the State and the Demise

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Speaker 2: of the Citizen. And I recall referencing this on properly

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Speaker 2: quoted a bit. In fact, here's an example of what

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Speaker 2: the book contained. Paternalism is a desperate gamble that lying

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Speaker 2: politicians will honestly care for those who fall under their power.

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Speaker 2: The night watchmen state has been replaced by highway robber states,

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Speaker 2: governments in which no asset, no contract, no domain is

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Speaker 2: safe from the fleeting whim of politicians. So much of

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Speaker 2: political philosophy throughout history has consisted of concocting reasons why

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Speaker 2: people have a duty to be tame animals in politicians' cages.

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Speaker 2: The surest effect of exalting government is to make it

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Speaker 2: easier for some people to drag others down. The growth

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Speaker 2: of government is like the spread of a dense jungle,

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Speaker 2: and the average citizen can hack through less of it

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Speaker 2: every year. And trusting governments nowadays means dividing humanity into

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Speaker 2: two classes, those who can be trusted with power to

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Speaker 2: run other people's lives and those who cannot even be

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Speaker 2: trusted to run their own lives. Now, I got feedback

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Speaker 2: from somebody who told me that I was wrong. The

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Speaker 2: book was wrong. There was no truth to it, and

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Speaker 2: I suspected at the time, and I think eventually time

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Speaker 2: has proven that James Bouvard was right on target, that

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Speaker 2: the loss of rights doesn't matter whether it's America, Australia,

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Speaker 2: New Zealand, Britain. The loss of rights, the invasion if

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Speaker 2: you like, of more and more of what is now

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Speaker 2: called the authoritarian state, has succeeded in doing what he

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Speaker 2: suggested it would. So let's get to the year of

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty four. His latest book, Last Writes, The Death

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Speaker 2: of American Liberty. The other books that I've got of

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Speaker 2: his are all hardcover, so therefore there are cover flaps

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Speaker 2: that I can refer to. The trouble with paperback is

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Speaker 2: that there are no cover flaps. So from the West

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Speaker 2: Coast Review of Books three hundred and thirty five well

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Speaker 2: packed but easily read pages of condemnations. Seldom, if ever,

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Speaker 2: I have so many egregious acts of government and officers

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Speaker 2: been presented so succinctly as in this book at a

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Speaker 2: Wall Street Journal. Remarkable, astonishingly, broad, excellent. Mister Bouvard's unrivaled

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Speaker 2: research has resulted in a virtual encyclopedia of modern government abuse.

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Speaker 2: And I think that we can relate to that in

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Speaker 2: this country, or any country, but particularly English speaking countries,

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Speaker 2: which seem to becoming more and more prolific in their failings.

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Speaker 2: So in the conversation to be had in a few moments,

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Speaker 2: I can promise that you'll be impressed with his ability

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Speaker 2: to cope with an unstructured interview, my favorite kind, his

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Speaker 2: retention of events and details, and his sometimes intentional humor,

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Speaker 2: sometimes not. We had a lot of fun, and I

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Speaker 2: hope you enjoy it now a little bit of domestic housekeeping.

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Speaker 2: Mister producer is enjoying herself in London. She'll be back

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Speaker 2: in two weeks time, but she's having a great time

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Speaker 2: with her girls and meeting up with old family and

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Speaker 2: friends and what have you. I get two reports today

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Speaker 2: and there's always a smile on her face. Well, the

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Speaker 2: reason I mentioned that is because she's not going to

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Speaker 2: be here for the mail room. But I've grabbed two

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Speaker 2: or three letters that I wanted to share, and I

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Speaker 2: will follow that with an opinion piece by a highly

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Speaker 2: esteemed law professor with regard to the Supreme Court's historic

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Speaker 2: presidential immunity decision. Everybody is talking about it. If they're

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Speaker 2: not talking about it, it's only because they're writing about it.

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Speaker 2: And I've never seen anything quite like it. So many frustrations,

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Speaker 2: so many opinions of varying kinds, and the unwillingness of

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Speaker 2: some people to understand exactly what the Supreme Court is

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Speaker 2: there for. And I'll quote you that after the letters,

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Speaker 2: there are essential fat nutrients that we need in our diets,

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Speaker 2: as the body cart manufacture them. These are Omega three

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Speaker 2: and Omega six fatty acids, Equisine is a combination of

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Speaker 2: fish oil and virgin evening primrose oil, a formula that

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Speaker 2: provides an excellent source of Omega three and Omega six

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Speaker 2: fatty acids in their naturally existing ratios. The Omega six

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Speaker 2: from evening primrose oil assists the Omega three fish oil

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Speaker 2: to be more effective. Equisine is a high quality fish

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Speaker 2: oil supplement enriched with evening primrose oil that works synergistically

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Speaker 2: for comprehensive health support. Source from the deep sea sardines

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Speaker 2: Anchovisa magrol provide essential Amiga three fatty acids in their

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Speaker 2: purest form without any internal organs or toxins. Every batch

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Speaker 2: is tested for its purity before it's allowed to be sold.

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Speaker 2: Equisine supports cells to be flexible, so important to support

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Speaker 2: healthy blood flow and overall cardiovascular health. Equisine can support mood,

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Speaker 2: balance and mental clarity and focus in children, all the

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Speaker 2: way to supporting stiff joints, mental focus, brain health, and

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Speaker 2: healthy eyes as we get older. It was in as

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Speaker 2: a premium, high grade fish and evening primrose oil to

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Speaker 2: be taken in addition to a healthy diet and is

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Speaker 2: only available from pharmacies and health stores. Always read the

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Speaker 2: label and users directed and if symptoms persist, seeing your

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Speaker 2: healthcare professional. Farmer broker Auckland James Bovard. James is the

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Speaker 2: author of eleven books, including the nineteen ninety four bestseller

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Speaker 2: Lust Writes The Destruction of American Liberty Now just so

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Speaker 2: happens when I made contact with Jim to do this podcast,

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Speaker 2: because we spoke first of all, back in twenty twenty one,

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Speaker 2: and we will make mentions of that, I'm sure in

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Speaker 2: a moment. But I got in touch with him as

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Speaker 2: the debate of last Friday Our Time was about to

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Speaker 2: get underway, and I invited him on to the podcast,

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Speaker 2: and after the debate was over, he sent me an acceptance,

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Speaker 2: and one of the first things he said to me

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Speaker 2: was I've got a new book out, and I thought, well,

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Speaker 2: that's great. The new book is called Last Rites, and

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Speaker 2: it's published thirty years after a book called Lost Rights

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Speaker 2: that we discussed with James the first time we spoke.

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Speaker 2: And I'm looking at it now and I've got green

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Speaker 2: ink all over it where I have marked it for

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Speaker 2: that particular interview. Thirty years between those two books, Lost

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Speaker 2: Rights and Last Rites. Jim Bovart, it's great to have

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Speaker 2: you back on the podcast. I'm thrilled that you were

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Speaker 2: able to do it, and thank you.

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Speaker 3: Hey, thanks so much for having me back on. I'm

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Speaker 3: just glad that since we talked loud fun, that you

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Speaker 3: were able to persuade your Prime minister to leave the country.

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Speaker 2: I think that she got persuaded by all and sundry

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Speaker 2: to be honest.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, she's certainly left a void in the hearts

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Speaker 3: of people like you.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's no room in my heart. I'm afraid. But

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Speaker 2: she but she she claimed that she had run out

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Speaker 2: of gas and didn't have enough to carry on at

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Speaker 2: the time, something which I think proved itself to be incorrect.

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Speaker 2: That was the reason that she gave, and that's what

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Speaker 2: that's what they accepted, well, most people. But I think

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Speaker 2: I think we've seen otherwise. I would I would prefer

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Speaker 2: to suggest that because of the policies that she followed,

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Speaker 2: the price of petrol went so high that she couldn't

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Speaker 2: afford it to fill it up anymore.

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Speaker 3: That's a good line. That's a good line.

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Speaker 2: Now, Lost Rights and Lost Rights, the second book, which

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Speaker 2: is new, was based as a follow one to the

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Speaker 2: first book, Lost Rights, Was it not.

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Speaker 3: It's fairly obvious to me. Yeah, well, you know, it's funny.

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Speaker 3: Back when Last Rites came out in nineteen ninety four,

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Speaker 3: people thought I was cynical, But you know, here we

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Speaker 3: are thirty years down down the road, and the nineteen

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Speaker 3: nineties looks like practically a golden era for American liberty

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Speaker 3: compared to nowadays, because so many things have gotten so

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Speaker 3: much worse. It was like it was like the politicians,

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Speaker 3: both parties, presidents see so much power after the nine

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Speaker 3: to eleven attacks, starting wars, setting torture loose around the world,

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Speaker 3: and then then we had COVID, and it was a

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Speaker 3: sign that the politicians could destroy far more rights and

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Speaker 3: liberties than they ever thought possible. And there are so

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Speaker 3: many dangerous precedents from that. There are me biting Americans

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Speaker 3: in the backside for a long time.

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Speaker 2: The other book that I have enjoyed of yours, not

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Speaker 2: that there aren't more, I was or is Freedom and Change,

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Speaker 2: The Rise of the States and the Demise of the Citizen.

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Speaker 2: So this was ninety nine from memory that you published

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Speaker 2: that twenty five years ago, and I look across to

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Speaker 2: my bookshelf and I see won by Victor Davis Henson,

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Speaker 2: The Dying Citizen. So we've got the rise of the

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Speaker 2: States and the demise of the citizen, the dying citizen.

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Speaker 2: Twenty five years later, how much of things changed in

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Speaker 2: that twenty five years.

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Speaker 3: Well, things have gotten a whole lot worse. And part

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Speaker 3: of what's frustrating to me is here I am top

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Speaker 3: thumping on this issue going back forty years now. But

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Speaker 3: what's striking to me is that there was at the

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Speaker 3: time I was coming of age in the seventies, maybe

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Speaker 3: the eighties as well, there was still it was like

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Speaker 3: a trade market of Americans. They were proud of their

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Speaker 3: love of freedom and independence and basically telling the government

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Speaker 3: to go screw itself. I mean that it was almost

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Speaker 3: an American trademark. Maybe it was already fading a lot

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Speaker 3: by that point, but nowadays folks have got a lot

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Speaker 3: more docile attitude. There was a survey, a recent survey

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Speaker 3: showed that over a recent survey that showed around thirty

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Speaker 3: percent of young adults support mandatory government surveillance cameras inside

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Speaker 3: the home to prevent domestic violence or other violations of

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Speaker 3: the law. Now, if someone is so boneheaded that they

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Speaker 3: want to have a government surveillance camera in their own home,

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Speaker 3: they are lost souls. I mean, I guess I try to.

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Speaker 3: I try to use intellectual triage in this sense. There

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Speaker 3: are some people who can recognize this, or some people

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Speaker 3: have got the instincts or the values. But when someone's

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Speaker 3: in favor of having government surveillance cameras in their own

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Speaker 3: home just to make sure that they don't don't misbehave,

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Speaker 3: it's like, I mean, this is this is like a

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Speaker 3: parody of a free society, of a free citizen. And

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Speaker 3: it's interesting to see how this came out. During the

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Speaker 3: COVID pandemic, I followed the government advisories closely, and I

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Speaker 3: got a lot of laughs. And thanks to Anthony Fauci,

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Speaker 3: I never had any rust build up in my cynicism.

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Speaker 3: It was always out there. But something which I would

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Speaker 3: do almost every weekend during the pandemic. I was out

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Speaker 3: leading hikes because hey, we're outside. People need to get

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Speaker 3: out and breathe and banter and joke and scoff at

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Speaker 3: the government. And so there was a there was an

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Speaker 3: old canal towpath from the eighteen twenties nearby here along

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Speaker 3: the Potomac River, the scene now canal towpath, and so

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Speaker 3: so I'd be leading hikes out there, and you know,

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Speaker 3: I'm outside, and so I wasn't wearing a mask. And

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Speaker 3: I literally had people screaming and cussing at me because

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Speaker 3: I wasn't wearing a mask. And this is a towpath.

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Speaker 3: There was wide enough for a team of mules, so

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Speaker 3: it was basically wind enough for an eighteen wheel truck.

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Speaker 3: And there was there was one guy. Actually it was

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Speaker 3: about three years ago. I was walking along with the

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Speaker 3: group and I was in front of the group and

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Speaker 3: guy points at me like he'd seen Dracula and he

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Speaker 3: holds his coat up above over his face and points

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Speaker 3: at me. He says, you're not wearing a mask. And

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Speaker 3: I felt like saying good one, sherlock, and I just

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Speaker 3: said yep, and then just kept walking. And then he

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Speaker 3: turns and shouts, you know, so you think your beard

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Speaker 3: is a mask? And I just kind of shrugged and

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Speaker 3: kept walking and then he shouts, your beard is ugly.

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Speaker 3: So here I am. I'm walking along, there's simping to

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Speaker 3: doing a hike, and I'm getting heckled for my beard

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Speaker 3: because I'm not wearing a not wearing a COVID mask.

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Speaker 3: But the mask didn't work. You're outside, your sunshine there's when.

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Speaker 3: But it was like it brought out the cravenness and

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Speaker 3: so many people, uh there was there were so many,

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Speaker 3: So many governments were encouraging people to become narcs, to

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Speaker 3: be phoning in reports of violators. A favorite example mine

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Speaker 3: came from Massachusetts. Somebody went to a strip tees bar

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Speaker 3: and filed a complaint that the stripper did not have

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Speaker 3: a face mask.

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Speaker 2: Did any of these people get put through i Q tests?

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Speaker 2: You know, you could have You could have come to

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Speaker 2: New Zealand. You could have spent you could have spent

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Speaker 2: a couple of weeks in a hotel, and then you

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Speaker 2: could have gone walking on some of our beautiful tracks.

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Speaker 2: They're world famous, and you could have caught the same abuse.

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Speaker 3: Really yeah, wow. I would have thought people in New

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Speaker 3: Zealand would have been more reasonable, But obviously I'm ignorant.

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Speaker 2: Well you've never been here, so you can be excused

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Speaker 2: for being underinformed. I want to go back now and

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Speaker 2: start with the because this was the reason, and then

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Speaker 2: we'll come back and we'll spend plenty of time on

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Speaker 2: last rite, the death of American liberty. But come back

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Speaker 2: to to what I said at the beginning, and this

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Speaker 2: was all about the debate. You watched it, I would imagine, Oh,

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Speaker 2: how I suffered, didn't we all? I had to get

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Speaker 2: up and walk around from time to time, which sort

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Speaker 2: of relieved the shortness of breath that I was experiencing.

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Speaker 2: But out of that And I don't want to spend

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Speaker 2: too much time on this because I had plenty of

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Speaker 2: discussion already. But what was your take once it was over,

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Speaker 2: or if you prefer soon after it began?

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Speaker 3: Well, actually I enjoyed watching it, so it was cat

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Speaker 3: nep persnics. People have attacked me for the last couple

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Speaker 3: of years because I've written a bunch of articles for

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Speaker 3: New York Posts and other places pointing out that Biden

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Speaker 3: is losing it, pointing out that Bien can't walk across

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Speaker 3: the stage without falling over, sometimes pointing out that Bien

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Speaker 3: did us UH five hours of interviews with the Special

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Speaker 3: Council over his U five hours over the his crimes

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Speaker 3: with federal documents were classified, and the Biden administration is

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Speaker 3: fighting tooth and nail to prevent Americans from hearing the

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Speaker 3: audio tapes of those interviews because they show how incredibly

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Speaker 3: out of it is. But there were there were there

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Speaker 3: were a lot of comments in there, which which I found,

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Speaker 3: you know, fascinating. I mean, Biden was at one point

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Speaker 3: was was attacking Trump for his position on abortion, and

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Speaker 3: Biden talked about the huge problem with the young women

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Speaker 3: who were raped by their sisters and therefore would need

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Speaker 3: to have access to abortion. And this is not a

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Speaker 3: problem I'd heard of before. So there was it was interesting.

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Speaker 3: It was interesting Biden. Twelve years ago, Biden was a

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Speaker 3: vice president, he debated Senator Tim Congressman Paul Ryan, who

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Speaker 3: was the nominee for the Republicans. Biden was very quick.

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Speaker 3: Biden put on one of the best performances of any

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Speaker 3: president or vice president in debates, uh, since since the

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Speaker 3: turn of the century. Very good, but I mean, he

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Speaker 3: was Biden was. Biden in that debate was just kind

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Speaker 3: of pawing and he wasn't able to fall up. And

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Speaker 3: the worst news that he got from the host at

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Speaker 3: one point is you still have eighty seconds left, and

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Speaker 3: it's like he's this and he's just kind of struggling.

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Speaker 3: And it was, I mean, and it was he was

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Speaker 3: so badly couch a coach by the his White House

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Speaker 3: staffers campaign team. Uh, there was there was a line

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Speaker 3: he was doing his closing statement, he suddenly starts talking

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Speaker 3: about lead pipes, and I'm thinking, you know, not a

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Speaker 3: good idea to bring a lead pipe to a closing

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Speaker 3: after how you performed tonight.

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Speaker 2: It was a surprise, so it appears, so they claim

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Speaker 2: to many many people Democrats specifically, I wasn't surprised in

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Speaker 2: the slightest, were you.

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Speaker 3: I was expecting Biden to do a little bit better.

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Speaker 3: I was. I was thinking that they'd be able to

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Speaker 3: get him, you know, pumped up like they did for

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Speaker 3: the City of the the for the State of the

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Speaker 3: Union address. Uh, I guess four or five months ago,

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Speaker 3: when he actually performed much better than expected. I wasn't

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Speaker 3: surprised that Biden did badly. Uh. And but it was

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Speaker 3: clear from the first five minutes that he just wasn't

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Speaker 3: talking well.

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Speaker 4: Uh.

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Speaker 3: There was there was someone who was kind of saying,

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Speaker 3: well that Biden had actually Biden had Biden had won

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Speaker 3: the debate if you looked only at the transcript, Well,

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Speaker 3: it's hard to have a transcript when the guy's mumbling

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Speaker 3: and just simply not enunciating well at all. So it's

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Speaker 3: just it didn't make any sense. I mean, there was

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Speaker 3: there was an answer he gave it about roe versus

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Speaker 3: weight and the rules for the final trimester, final trimester

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Speaker 3: of abortions, that that he just pulled it out of

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Speaker 3: his backside. It was just there were so many things

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Speaker 3: that were just completely wrong. He was claiming that that

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Speaker 3: no US soldiers had died abroad during his term of office,

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Speaker 3: and tell that to the widows of the Afghanists, the

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Speaker 3: Americans killed in the Afghanist ce withdrawal. It was just,

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Speaker 3: it was so out of touch, and it's it's actually

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Speaker 3: kind of amusing to see the anguish of folks who

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Speaker 3: have been covering for him. But there are so many folks,

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Speaker 3: so many of these pundits and these big donors. They

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Speaker 3: aren't upset by how Biden did. They're upset that Americas

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Speaker 3: now saw it because it had been covered up.

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Speaker 2: I want to I want to ask you about lies,

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Speaker 2: the lies that we've lived through. Actually it's a Victor

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Speaker 2: Davis Hanson Peace from from July, which is well for us.

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Speaker 2: It was yesterday after last Thursday's debate, Biden himself laid

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Speaker 2: to rest the Democratic lie that he was that he

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Speaker 2: was robust and in control of his faculties. In truth,

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Speaker 2: he demonstrated to the nation that he is a sad,

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Speaker 2: failing octogenarian who could not perform any job in America

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Speaker 2: other than apparently the easy task of presidents of the

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Speaker 2: United States and the commander in chief in charge of

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Speaker 2: our nuclear codes. Everybody is accusing everybody else, and this

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Speaker 2: has been a growing plague of lying. He's a liar,

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Speaker 2: He's a liar. Now you're a liar. How did it

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Speaker 2: get to this point where people fail to understand who's

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Speaker 2: lying and who's not.

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Speaker 3: Well, perhaps the real problem is that people ever expected

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Speaker 3: politicians not to be liars, because it's possible turn back

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Speaker 3: the clock twenty five hundred years to Aristophanes and ancient

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Speaker 3: Athens making jokes about paulicians just being the biggest liars

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Speaker 3: and scant scoundrels scoundrels around And that's certainly that's our

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Speaker 3: experience in this country. I think it's the experience in

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Speaker 3: most countries where they have fairly open elections. Contested elections

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Speaker 3: might be a better term. There was a There was

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Speaker 3: a piece I did in October twenty twenty one month

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Speaker 3: before the when Biden was first elected. He run against Bush,

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Speaker 3: and I said Americans had to choose your liar election.

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Speaker 3: Because both both Trump and Biden were just lying up

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Speaker 3: and down and back and forth. It's still the same thing.

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Speaker 3: Trump is not as dishonest as Biden, but I mean

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Speaker 3: a lot of his ideas, a lot of the things

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Speaker 3: he says are simply not accurate. But Trump can sound coherent,

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Speaker 3: and that's you know, that's a big advantage when you're

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Speaker 3: trying to con voters.

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Speaker 2: Want to give you my opinion. Trump actually doesn't lie.

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Speaker 2: You touched on it then and now and now I've

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Speaker 2: forgotten already what you what you said. But Trump exaggerates,

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Speaker 2: he embellishes, but I don't think he sets out to

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Speaker 2: tell a lie, whereas others, and Biden's one of them. Obviously,

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Speaker 2: go back to that first debate and that that question

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Speaker 2: was regard to the to the to the laptop. Lied

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Speaker 2: through his teeth and did it again and again, and

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Speaker 2: it's only one example of thousands of them. Would you

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Speaker 2: agree with you with with with my definition of each?

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Speaker 3: I would I would agree with your definition. On Biden,

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Speaker 3: I mean, folks forget and the final debate in October

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Speaker 3: twenty twenty with Trump, Biden insisted that his family had

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Speaker 3: never gotten any money from China, and this is just

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Speaker 3: the biggest load of crap. I mean, at that point

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Speaker 3: it wasn't a question of bribe or kickbacks or anything

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Speaker 3: like that, but there was all kinds of money flowing

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Speaker 3: from Chinese companies to various members of the Biden family,

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Speaker 3: perhaps Joe himself. I'm not sure, but you know, Trump

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Speaker 3: is okay. Back in the nineteen nineties, Back in the

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Speaker 3: late eighties early nineties, I wrote a lot about agriculture

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Speaker 3: policy and trade policy, and that was where I first

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Speaker 3: learned that the things were special, and that in some

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Speaker 3: ways New Zealand was one of the world leaders as

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Speaker 3: far as moving to free market agriculture. I'm not sure

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Speaker 3: if it's still the case, but they were doing far

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Speaker 3: better than the US agriculture policy makers were Trump's comments

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Speaker 3: about tariffs. So Trump wants to have a ten percent

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Speaker 3: across the board tariff, which is just the dumbest damn

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Speaker 3: idea around, because if you put a tariff on products

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Speaker 3: which the US never produced and never will produce, it's

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Speaker 3: simply attacks which multiple would multiplies as it's passed through

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Speaker 3: the economy, and it cost it costs businesses and consumers

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Speaker 3: far more than a benefits government and if you look

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Speaker 3: at the impact of Trump's tariff policies in his first

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Speaker 3: term in office, they were a disaster. But it's it's

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Speaker 3: it's almost and it's sad because there's a big swath

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Speaker 3: of conservatives now in America who are who are basically

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Speaker 3: going back to you know, John Maynard Keynes as a

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Speaker 3: guide for the economic policy. And and it's the same

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Speaker 3: people who have no faith in politicians in general, somehow

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Speaker 3: think that the US Commerce Department should be able to

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Speaker 3: set prices for practically anything in this country by controlling

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Speaker 3: and penalizing imports. And most of these folks have never

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Speaker 3: even been to the Commerce Department. Uh, I was, you know,

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Speaker 3: I spent I did a book on early nineties, and

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Speaker 3: so I spent quite a bit of time there. There

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Speaker 3: we was just all these bureaucrats walking down the hallway,

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Speaker 3: and you could tell that it was possible to tell

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Speaker 3: how many years it had worked for the Commerce Department

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Speaker 3: by how low the seat of their parts hung.

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Speaker 2: Intriguing.

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Speaker 3: Maybe maybe not, Okay, maybe I'm telling too many jokes.

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Speaker 2: Go ahead, No, no, no, no, it was I was

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Speaker 2: listening intently. I was. I was un disavoided when you stopped.

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Speaker 3: They said there, okay, waiting, where's the punchline? Okay, he's

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Speaker 3: leaning up. Is there going to be a punchline? I

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Speaker 3: hope there's a punchline.

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Speaker 2: Were you in fact making reference there to the administrative

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Speaker 2: state in part at least?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? So it's it's Trump has made some very good

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Speaker 3: comments condemning the deep state, and it was a deep

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Speaker 3: state that had a big role in his defeat in

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Speaker 3: twenty twenty. There was there were so many dirty tricks

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Speaker 3: by the FBI, by the CIA, by other agencies. A

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Speaker 3: lot of that stuff we have never yet learned. Part

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Speaker 3: of my frustration is that Trump did not pull back

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Speaker 3: the curtain behind hiding the Wizard of Oz. Trump. Trump

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Speaker 3: talked tough, but when it came down to it, Trump

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Speaker 3: put in. Trump put as the his chief of the

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Speaker 3: c I A. A. Gina Haspellhood had had been a

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Speaker 3: leader in the destruction of evidence of the US torture

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Speaker 3: during the Bush administration as and it was Trump who

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Speaker 3: appointed the FBI chief who utterly failed to curb the

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Speaker 3: FBI agents from trampling the Constitution, especially the Fourth Amendment,

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Speaker 3: which prohibits warrantless seizures. There were a lot of appointments

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Speaker 3: that Trump made John Bolton, that's that's okay. You're talking

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Speaker 3: about the need for peace and you bring in the

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00:26:58,093 --> 00:27:06,453
Speaker 3: biggest warmonger in Washington, John Bolton, a liar as John

431
00:27:06,493 --> 00:27:13,213
Speaker 3: Bolton a liar. Uh, maybe he's just very, very badly

432
00:27:13,253 --> 00:27:15,533
Speaker 3: informed and has a very bad memory.

433
00:27:15,853 --> 00:27:19,453
Speaker 2: It's interesting. So back to back to the debate, or

434
00:27:20,013 --> 00:27:23,853
Speaker 2: more specifically now the results of that debate. The world

435
00:27:23,933 --> 00:27:25,973
Speaker 2: was in meltdown, at least half of it was in

436
00:27:26,013 --> 00:27:30,253
Speaker 2: your country before the debate even even finished. For a start,

437
00:27:30,533 --> 00:27:33,533
Speaker 2: I spent quite a bit of time the following day

438
00:27:33,853 --> 00:27:39,973
Speaker 2: on CNN, and I'll i'll do a hard day. I'll

439
00:27:40,013 --> 00:27:42,613
Speaker 2: dip in and out of CNN occasionally when when there's

440
00:27:42,613 --> 00:27:45,973
Speaker 2: something that warrants it and there's an AD break on

441
00:27:46,373 --> 00:27:51,573
Speaker 2: my preferred channel. But I left it there because because

442
00:27:51,653 --> 00:27:55,813
Speaker 2: they were crying all over the screen, and I wanted

443
00:27:55,853 --> 00:27:58,453
Speaker 2: to know how long they could keep this this fraud

444
00:27:58,613 --> 00:28:01,853
Speaker 2: up for I can't I don't believe it's not I

445
00:28:01,893 --> 00:28:06,653
Speaker 2: can't believe. I don't believe that any of them did

446
00:28:06,693 --> 00:28:09,133
Speaker 2: not understand what they would do dealing with in the

447
00:28:09,173 --> 00:28:13,533
Speaker 2: first place, that they covered for as much as they

448
00:28:13,573 --> 00:28:17,053
Speaker 2: could and successfully for years, and all of a sudden

449
00:28:17,613 --> 00:28:21,893
Speaker 2: that curtain was rent asunder and the exposure was there

450
00:28:21,933 --> 00:28:26,453
Speaker 2: for everybody to see, and it was actually very entertaining

451
00:28:27,293 --> 00:28:31,293
Speaker 2: because they didn't know what to do. And then following that,

452
00:28:31,413 --> 00:28:34,173
Speaker 2: I suppose that the day after that, it was it

453
00:28:34,213 --> 00:28:36,133
Speaker 2: was a case of well, who who was going to

454
00:28:36,173 --> 00:28:39,573
Speaker 2: replace him? And so they were debating that and not one,

455
00:28:40,013 --> 00:28:43,413
Speaker 2: not one decent suggestion was put forward, of course, because

456
00:28:43,453 --> 00:28:48,133
Speaker 2: there is no decent suggestion. But the very latest when

457
00:28:48,173 --> 00:28:52,413
Speaker 2: I went to bed last night was Michelle Obama was

458
00:28:51,933 --> 00:28:55,813
Speaker 2: was was on the make, and she was being she

459
00:28:55,933 --> 00:29:00,653
Speaker 2: was being set up for the conference when it happens.

460
00:29:01,053 --> 00:29:02,013
Speaker 2: Do you think that's likely?

461
00:29:04,253 --> 00:29:06,973
Speaker 3: I don't know, But I mean, folks are forgetting that

462
00:29:06,973 --> 00:29:11,093
Speaker 3: that the that the Democrat already have someone who could

463
00:29:11,173 --> 00:29:14,893
Speaker 3: be called in who is mentally sharper than Biden and

464
00:29:14,973 --> 00:29:19,733
Speaker 3: has experience dealing with international crises. That's former President Jimmy Carter.

465
00:29:20,253 --> 00:29:20,853
Speaker 2: Isn't he dead?

466
00:29:23,013 --> 00:29:24,933
Speaker 3: No, No, he's not dead yet. I think he's in

467
00:29:24,973 --> 00:29:28,893
Speaker 3: a hospice. But you know, I bet he would have

468
00:29:28,933 --> 00:29:31,413
Speaker 3: done bear in the debate that Biden did. So I

469
00:29:31,453 --> 00:29:35,693
Speaker 3: don't know about Michelle Obama. I've heard I'm hearing that.

470
00:29:35,773 --> 00:29:39,053
Speaker 3: I'm hearing that more I wrote about her, I think

471
00:29:40,253 --> 00:29:45,413
Speaker 3: in twenty twenty and before, she was leading a leading

472
00:29:45,453 --> 00:29:50,893
Speaker 3: a crusade in childhood obesity. And as part of this crusade,

473
00:29:50,933 --> 00:29:55,853
Speaker 3: the Obama administration pushed through a new federal program to

474
00:29:55,893 --> 00:29:59,973
Speaker 3: give children free breakfasts in the classroom. And it was

475
00:30:00,013 --> 00:30:03,253
Speaker 3: important to sway the kids to eat the breakfast, so

476
00:30:03,293 --> 00:30:05,653
Speaker 3: they had a lot of doughnuts and chocolate milk and

477
00:30:05,693 --> 00:30:10,573
Speaker 3: sweetened cereal and it was a huge sugar bomb. It

478
00:30:10,653 --> 00:30:14,613
Speaker 3: was sort of like Homer Simpson was a patron saint

479
00:30:14,773 --> 00:30:17,413
Speaker 3: of this program. I don't know if you've watched the

480
00:30:17,453 --> 00:30:22,533
Speaker 3: Simpsons Simpsons, but Homer Simpson, the cartoon character, is always

481
00:30:22,533 --> 00:30:25,453
Speaker 3: eating a donut, so he's a patron saint of this

482
00:30:25,573 --> 00:30:29,333
Speaker 3: Michelle Obama program. And it was a disaster as far

483
00:30:29,413 --> 00:30:32,333
Speaker 3: as making kids healthier, but it gave her lots of,

484
00:30:33,013 --> 00:30:35,493
Speaker 3: you know, camera time, and she could be out there

485
00:30:35,533 --> 00:30:39,373
Speaker 3: getting praise to solve problems. But no, I mean, I

486
00:30:39,373 --> 00:30:43,773
Speaker 3: think that the Democrats are really desperate. The Michigan governor

487
00:30:43,853 --> 00:30:48,973
Speaker 3: Gretchen Gretchen Whitmer is another name that's often being mentioned

488
00:30:49,013 --> 00:30:53,493
Speaker 3: but written about her and folks. Folks forget that. People

489
00:30:53,493 --> 00:30:57,573
Speaker 3: in Michigan. Michigan referred to her as the seed Demon.

490
00:30:58,293 --> 00:31:00,733
Speaker 3: And she's called that because at the start of the

491
00:31:00,773 --> 00:31:04,373
Speaker 3: pandemic she prohibited stores from selling garden seeds.

492
00:31:04,773 --> 00:31:05,653
Speaker 2: Why did you do then?

493
00:31:07,093 --> 00:31:10,893
Speaker 3: Because she said it was not essential, unlike the sale

494
00:31:10,973 --> 00:31:12,453
Speaker 3: of government lottery tickets.

495
00:31:13,253 --> 00:31:16,493
Speaker 2: It's amazing, isn't it. I heard someone who I respect

496
00:31:17,133 --> 00:31:20,773
Speaker 2: yesterday saying that the mocking her and saying she was

497
00:31:20,893 --> 00:31:22,173
Speaker 2: she was a straight out liar.

498
00:31:22,613 --> 00:31:24,013
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I.

499
00:31:23,933 --> 00:31:28,013
Speaker 2: Mean every where, every way, every way you listen these days,

500
00:31:28,013 --> 00:31:32,053
Speaker 2: specifically at the moment, the word liar is not infrequent.

501
00:31:33,493 --> 00:31:37,013
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, but this, this is actually a good thing.

502
00:31:37,133 --> 00:31:39,333
Speaker 3: And as I said, you know, I felt like the

503
00:31:40,053 --> 00:31:43,733
Speaker 3: seeing the seeing that debate, it was cat nip for centics.

504
00:31:44,333 --> 00:31:48,853
Speaker 3: Uh and Americans. You know, Americans need to be more

505
00:31:48,893 --> 00:31:52,453
Speaker 3: cynical about their elected leaders. Part of the trouble is

506
00:31:52,893 --> 00:31:56,053
Speaker 3: so many people still expect the government to save their butt.

507
00:31:56,493 --> 00:31:59,333
Speaker 3: And it's like, no, I mean, this is not what

508
00:31:59,533 --> 00:32:03,773
Speaker 3: Washington does. Washington extends its own power, it sets I mean,

509
00:32:03,813 --> 00:32:08,253
Speaker 3: it's always finding reasons to uh further intrude into private life,

510
00:32:08,893 --> 00:32:12,533
Speaker 3: to trample more of our constitutional rights they haven't learned,

511
00:32:12,573 --> 00:32:18,093
Speaker 3: and unfortunately, more and more Americans are completely unfamiliar, are

512
00:32:18,133 --> 00:32:23,493
Speaker 3: completely unfamiliar with living life outside of federal control.

513
00:32:25,053 --> 00:32:27,933
Speaker 2: Let me ask you a couple of questions regarding the

514
00:32:27,933 --> 00:32:33,053
Speaker 2: Supreme Court. You have I think mixed mixed approaches to

515
00:32:33,133 --> 00:32:34,213
Speaker 2: the Supreme Court? Am I right?

516
00:32:36,453 --> 00:32:38,853
Speaker 3: What is the mixed approach? I'm dying to hear this.

517
00:32:39,613 --> 00:32:42,533
Speaker 2: Well, I'm sure that somewhere you've you've complimented them.

518
00:32:44,373 --> 00:32:46,373
Speaker 3: Yeah, back in nineteen eighty six.

519
00:32:46,533 --> 00:32:50,013
Speaker 2: It won't happened. No, No, I mean since eighty six,

520
00:32:50,053 --> 00:32:51,613
Speaker 2: what happened to change minds?

521
00:32:53,773 --> 00:32:57,333
Speaker 3: They have made some good decisions. There are some justices

522
00:32:57,813 --> 00:33:03,053
Speaker 3: who have have made some very good calls. The first

523
00:33:03,173 --> 00:33:07,093
Speaker 3: page of the of the new book quote Supreme Court

524
00:33:07,253 --> 00:33:11,213
Speaker 3: Justice Neil Gorsa of saying that everything has been criminalized

525
00:33:11,253 --> 00:33:14,733
Speaker 3: now by the government. So that's a huge problem. But

526
00:33:15,133 --> 00:33:19,533
Speaker 3: you know, sometimes they get it right. But it's it's

527
00:33:19,573 --> 00:33:23,853
Speaker 3: frustrating that that they have this fairy tale notion of

528
00:33:23,933 --> 00:33:28,453
Speaker 3: government power. There was a big decision on the censorship

529
00:33:28,493 --> 00:33:34,653
Speaker 3: cases the the FBI, the White House Centers for Disease

530
00:33:34,733 --> 00:33:39,773
Speaker 3: Control croudbeat Twitter, Facebook, and other social media companies to

531
00:33:39,893 --> 00:33:44,733
Speaker 3: censor critics of Bim's policies to censor people that were

532
00:33:45,453 --> 00:33:51,413
Speaker 3: raising alarms about election fraud, and it was a complete travesy.

533
00:33:51,493 --> 00:33:56,413
Speaker 3: It's heavily documented. But the Supreme Court said, well, we

534
00:33:56,493 --> 00:33:59,133
Speaker 3: don't think we're going to decide on this because the

535
00:33:59,253 --> 00:34:03,653
Speaker 3: victims did not bring signed confessions by the government agents

536
00:34:03,653 --> 00:34:07,853
Speaker 3: that censored them. And it's like the First Amendment. I mean,

537
00:34:08,133 --> 00:34:12,293
Speaker 3: it's it's frustrating to me that people don't recognize if

538
00:34:12,293 --> 00:34:16,693
Speaker 3: you let the government censor during an election, then there

539
00:34:16,773 --> 00:34:20,213
Speaker 3: is no chance you're going to have an honest reading

540
00:34:20,293 --> 00:34:22,973
Speaker 3: of Pollock preferences.

541
00:34:23,813 --> 00:34:27,853
Speaker 2: Let me just quote you from that first page of

542
00:34:28,293 --> 00:34:31,093
Speaker 2: Last Rites. We live in a world in which everything

543
00:34:31,093 --> 00:34:35,613
Speaker 2: has been criminalized. You mentioned that, warned Supreme Court Justice

544
00:34:35,693 --> 00:34:39,253
Speaker 2: Neil Gorsich, there are now more than This is what

545
00:34:39,333 --> 00:34:42,853
Speaker 2: I wanted to do, because this is frightening. There are

546
00:34:42,893 --> 00:34:47,853
Speaker 2: now more than five two hundred separate federal criminal offenses,

547
00:34:48,693 --> 00:34:52,493
Speaker 2: a thirty six percent increase since the nineteen nineties, along

548
00:34:52,533 --> 00:34:55,653
Speaker 2: with tens of thousands of state and local crimes. More

549
00:34:55,733 --> 00:34:59,333
Speaker 2: laws mean more violators who can be harshly punished on command,

550
00:34:59,853 --> 00:35:03,613
Speaker 2: resulting in arrests of more than ten million Americans each year.

551
00:35:04,373 --> 00:35:07,133
Speaker 2: Thanks to the Supreme Court, police can lock up anyone

552
00:35:07,173 --> 00:35:11,853
Speaker 2: accused of even quote, even a very minor criminal offense

553
00:35:12,333 --> 00:35:16,253
Speaker 2: such as an unbeckled seat belt. How did it happen

554
00:35:16,813 --> 00:35:20,733
Speaker 2: that those numbers skyrocketed like that? How did it happen

555
00:35:20,813 --> 00:35:22,133
Speaker 2: that Americans let it happen?

556
00:35:24,173 --> 00:35:25,893
Speaker 3: Those are two very good questions.

557
00:35:26,133 --> 00:35:26,213
Speaker 4: Uh.

558
00:35:26,493 --> 00:35:30,253
Speaker 3: The first question, how did it happen? You had the

559
00:35:30,293 --> 00:35:34,173
Speaker 3: Supreme Court put the government power on a pedestal, both

560
00:35:34,213 --> 00:35:38,213
Speaker 3: on a political pedestal, a legal pedestal, and a moral pedestal.

561
00:35:38,893 --> 00:35:44,573
Speaker 3: The Supreme Court has bent so far over backwards that

562
00:35:44,693 --> 00:35:48,533
Speaker 3: even when there are cases of police wrongfully shooting people

563
00:35:49,133 --> 00:35:52,733
Speaker 3: or government officials lying, the Court has said, well, it's

564
00:35:52,733 --> 00:35:55,373
Speaker 3: important not to be too strict here. Because I was

565
00:35:55,413 --> 00:35:58,693
Speaker 3: writing about this case a day or two ago, and

566
00:35:58,733 --> 00:36:01,853
Speaker 3: there was a wonderful phrase, which course escapes my memory.

567
00:36:02,213 --> 00:36:05,373
Speaker 3: But the gist if it was that the that the

568
00:36:05,493 --> 00:36:09,373
Speaker 3: Supreme Court was so biased in favored government officials and

569
00:36:09,453 --> 00:36:12,333
Speaker 3: government intervention that they did not want to have any

570
00:36:12,413 --> 00:36:15,413
Speaker 3: rulings that would inhibit the government from doing what the

571
00:36:15,453 --> 00:36:18,573
Speaker 3: government thought needed to be done and what the government

572
00:36:18,613 --> 00:36:22,453
Speaker 3: thought was best. This ties into the line from the

573
00:36:22,573 --> 00:36:27,253
Speaker 3: Supreme Court decision last week. It was from the oil

574
00:36:27,413 --> 00:36:29,493
Speaker 3: arguments a few months ago, but you had one of

575
00:36:29,493 --> 00:36:35,653
Speaker 3: the Justice justices openly fretting about the openly fretting that

576
00:36:35,773 --> 00:36:39,373
Speaker 3: the First Amendment could hamstring the federal government when it

577
00:36:39,453 --> 00:36:43,573
Speaker 3: needed to intervene. And it's like, well, you know, this

578
00:36:43,693 --> 00:36:47,253
Speaker 3: is why we have the First Amendment to hamstring the government,

579
00:36:48,253 --> 00:36:50,693
Speaker 3: Because if you don't hamstring the government when they want

580
00:36:50,693 --> 00:36:54,733
Speaker 3: to censor, then you don't have You don't have any

581
00:36:54,813 --> 00:36:58,333
Speaker 3: kind of republic. You certainly don't have a democracy. You

582
00:36:58,373 --> 00:37:02,453
Speaker 3: simply have the people in power for outbeating critics and

583
00:37:02,853 --> 00:37:06,253
Speaker 3: misleading people. And that's what we had in this country

584
00:37:06,253 --> 00:37:08,253
Speaker 3: for a long time, and I got a heck of

585
00:37:08,253 --> 00:37:12,413
Speaker 3: a lot worse after nine to eleven. Unfortunately, most of

586
00:37:12,453 --> 00:37:16,373
Speaker 3: the American media and most of the politicians don't seem

587
00:37:16,413 --> 00:37:19,293
Speaker 3: to have learned anything about the failures of government in

588
00:37:19,333 --> 00:37:20,533
Speaker 3: the last couple of decades.

589
00:37:21,613 --> 00:37:24,613
Speaker 2: It has become ingrained in me that the media has

590
00:37:24,693 --> 00:37:28,133
Speaker 2: as much to answer as anybody, if not more than everybody,

591
00:37:28,613 --> 00:37:30,373
Speaker 2: that question that I asked you about, how did the

592
00:37:30,373 --> 00:37:34,453
Speaker 2: American people let it happen? The media in the main,

593
00:37:35,093 --> 00:37:38,893
Speaker 2: and I'm talking about the core media, the usual the

594
00:37:38,893 --> 00:37:43,533
Speaker 2: New York Times, Washington Post and CNN and all the others,

595
00:37:44,693 --> 00:37:47,133
Speaker 2: and by extension, by the way, to much of the

596
00:37:47,173 --> 00:37:51,853
Speaker 2: rest of the world, because our media here take articles

597
00:37:51,893 --> 00:37:56,253
Speaker 2: from those particular journals. CNN is the one that they

598
00:37:56,293 --> 00:38:00,733
Speaker 2: refer to on television, in the papers, the New York Times,

599
00:38:00,733 --> 00:38:05,773
Speaker 2: there's Washington Post articles, and I read some of them,

600
00:38:06,093 --> 00:38:08,493
Speaker 2: and I come very close to throwing up in discuss

601
00:38:08,973 --> 00:38:12,173
Speaker 2: somebody raised was Mike Levin actually a day or two back,

602
00:38:12,493 --> 00:38:17,533
Speaker 2: raised the question of the owners of these institutions, because

603
00:38:17,573 --> 00:38:22,173
Speaker 2: they're all they're all businesses who have shareholders, and why

604
00:38:22,373 --> 00:38:27,333
Speaker 2: the people involved in the ownership don't start pulling their

605
00:38:27,373 --> 00:38:28,533
Speaker 2: administrations apart.

606
00:38:29,133 --> 00:38:32,413
Speaker 3: That makes it the assumption that their owners are unhappy

607
00:38:32,453 --> 00:38:35,373
Speaker 3: with what the papers or their TV networks are doing.

608
00:38:36,173 --> 00:38:38,533
Speaker 3: And I think that the owners are probably felt like

609
00:38:38,533 --> 00:38:43,573
Speaker 3: they're being served very well by the kind of hogwash

610
00:38:43,653 --> 00:38:45,733
Speaker 3: that's being served up to readers and viewers.

611
00:38:46,173 --> 00:38:48,733
Speaker 2: Well, that question could link back to another one with

612
00:38:48,773 --> 00:38:53,773
Speaker 2: regard to the debate last week. The two protagonists who

613
00:38:53,853 --> 00:38:59,533
Speaker 2: were asking the questions were predicted to lean very heavily

614
00:38:59,573 --> 00:39:05,293
Speaker 2: in favor of the incumbent president, but they have been commended,

615
00:39:05,453 --> 00:39:08,573
Speaker 2: if not praised, in some quarters for being re to

616
00:39:08,613 --> 00:39:10,413
Speaker 2: be pretty well balanced.

617
00:39:10,893 --> 00:39:15,093
Speaker 3: You'll come in, Yeah, I mean I was expecting there'd

618
00:39:15,133 --> 00:39:19,773
Speaker 3: be more biased and favorite Biden. But it's funny. There

619
00:39:19,813 --> 00:39:22,493
Speaker 3: was a front page New York Times story, I guess

620
00:39:22,653 --> 00:39:26,813
Speaker 3: on Saturday, and I just passed by it in the

621
00:39:26,853 --> 00:39:29,853
Speaker 3: grocery store, and it was talking about how the silent

622
00:39:30,013 --> 00:39:33,933
Speaker 3: microphone ended up being really bad for Joe Biden because

623
00:39:34,213 --> 00:39:37,853
Speaker 3: flashback four years ago, Trump kept interrupting, I mean during

624
00:39:37,893 --> 00:39:42,373
Speaker 3: Biden's speaking time, and so there was I think it

625
00:39:42,493 --> 00:39:46,573
Speaker 3: was Napoleon who said, never interrupt your opponent when he's

626
00:39:46,573 --> 00:39:50,333
Speaker 3: making a mistake, and that could be the guy for

627
00:39:50,453 --> 00:39:54,653
Speaker 3: how Trump played that played the most recent debate, but

628
00:39:54,813 --> 00:39:57,653
Speaker 3: it was the rules that were set ahead of time.

629
00:39:58,173 --> 00:40:01,653
Speaker 3: Another part was you probably heard this is people were

630
00:40:01,693 --> 00:40:05,413
Speaker 3: saying that the split screen that most Americans saw with

631
00:40:05,573 --> 00:40:10,093
Speaker 3: the debate, I just it was devastating from Bye because

632
00:40:11,053 --> 00:40:13,013
Speaker 3: he was there with his mouth hanging open and his

633
00:40:13,093 --> 00:40:15,613
Speaker 3: eyes kind of on focused and you're thinking, like, you know,

634
00:40:17,213 --> 00:40:18,813
Speaker 3: you know, it was probably a mistake for him to

635
00:40:18,813 --> 00:40:20,133
Speaker 3: go with decaf.

636
00:40:20,533 --> 00:40:21,973
Speaker 2: A mistake to go decaf.

637
00:40:22,413 --> 00:40:25,813
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was a mistake for him to go a

638
00:40:25,853 --> 00:40:29,413
Speaker 3: mistake for him to go with decaf needed coffee. Okay,

639
00:40:29,653 --> 00:40:32,653
Speaker 3: the joke did not translate, well, doll, but decaff means

640
00:40:32,653 --> 00:40:35,653
Speaker 3: that you're having that you're getting no caffeine and you're

641
00:40:35,693 --> 00:40:36,373
Speaker 3: low energy.

642
00:40:36,853 --> 00:40:40,893
Speaker 2: Well I interpreted that correctly. I got it right, but

643
00:40:42,573 --> 00:40:45,613
Speaker 2: I don't think you went far enough. So, I mean,

644
00:40:45,973 --> 00:40:47,893
Speaker 2: we're jumping around all over the place. But you're very

645
00:40:47,893 --> 00:40:52,493
Speaker 2: good at this, so I'm enjoying it. The the the

646
00:40:52,573 --> 00:40:56,213
Speaker 2: opinion was, and it's certainly mine that in the State

647
00:40:56,253 --> 00:41:00,253
Speaker 2: of the Union address he was spiked. Wasn't just it

648
00:41:00,293 --> 00:41:04,493
Speaker 2: wasn't just non non decaf or caffeinated. He was spiked

649
00:41:04,493 --> 00:41:09,053
Speaker 2: to the to the gills. Now I know, no, so

650
00:41:09,093 --> 00:41:13,373
Speaker 2: the doctors would do that. I am shocked. I am shocked.

651
00:41:13,893 --> 00:41:15,453
Speaker 2: I think that you're one of the last people to

652
00:41:15,453 --> 00:41:18,253
Speaker 2: be shocked. And who said the doctors, who said the

653
00:41:18,253 --> 00:41:19,773
Speaker 2: doctors were involved.

654
00:41:19,933 --> 00:41:22,933
Speaker 3: Ah, that's true. Well, it's important to avoid an overdose

655
00:41:22,973 --> 00:41:24,933
Speaker 3: in public if you're going to be doing those kind

656
00:41:24,973 --> 00:41:26,653
Speaker 3: of supplements.

657
00:41:27,253 --> 00:41:29,773
Speaker 2: And there and there was the other occasion earlier, and

658
00:41:29,813 --> 00:41:33,653
Speaker 2: that was the one where he did it outside outside

659
00:41:33,653 --> 00:41:37,413
Speaker 2: of building. I forget which, and it was stressed up was, well,

660
00:41:37,453 --> 00:41:41,053
Speaker 2: the whole area was staged to look like the devil

661
00:41:41,173 --> 00:41:42,293
Speaker 2: was speaking.

662
00:41:42,613 --> 00:41:46,093
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, are you talking about his speech in Philadelphia

663
00:41:46,133 --> 00:41:51,093
Speaker 3: in September twenty twenty two. Yes, yes, that was. You know,

664
00:41:51,213 --> 00:41:55,693
Speaker 3: it's always bad to take your inspiration on lighting from

665
00:41:55,773 --> 00:41:58,293
Speaker 3: the from the woman who did Triumph of the Will.

666
00:41:58,893 --> 00:42:02,133
Speaker 3: Is that what they did was a Nazi Yeah, well

667
00:42:02,613 --> 00:42:05,733
Speaker 3: it seemed that way. The Triumph of the Will was

668
00:42:05,733 --> 00:42:09,853
Speaker 3: a famous Nazi film of their rally at Nuremberg, I

669
00:42:09,893 --> 00:42:14,253
Speaker 3: believe in nineteen thirty four. So, but with the red,

670
00:42:14,373 --> 00:42:17,613
Speaker 3: with the red coloring and just some of the very

671
00:42:17,653 --> 00:42:22,493
Speaker 3: angry type of lighting. And that was just after Biden

672
00:42:22,533 --> 00:42:27,253
Speaker 3: had said that had said that Republicans were semi fascists,

673
00:42:27,853 --> 00:42:31,733
Speaker 3: and I think it was in January the speech near

674
00:42:31,813 --> 00:42:36,533
Speaker 3: Valley Forge. Fine came out and said Trump was, you know,

675
00:42:36,853 --> 00:42:40,853
Speaker 3: quoting Hitler or being guided by Hitler. Basically tried to

676
00:42:40,893 --> 00:42:45,253
Speaker 3: tie Hitler to Trump very tightly. There's there's certain standards

677
00:42:45,333 --> 00:42:48,613
Speaker 3: there that used to be in American politics that you

678
00:42:48,653 --> 00:42:52,013
Speaker 3: don't say that your opponent is Hitler. Okay, I mean,

679
00:42:52,053 --> 00:42:55,573
Speaker 3: this is this is just this is bad form.

680
00:42:56,053 --> 00:42:58,413
Speaker 2: Well that we've seen, We've seen a lot of that

681
00:42:58,453 --> 00:43:02,613
Speaker 2: in the last few years. But going back to that

682
00:43:03,413 --> 00:43:07,733
Speaker 2: decaffeinated appearance, to me, it was not fairly obvious. It

683
00:43:07,813 --> 00:43:10,813
Speaker 2: was very old that he was on something. The next day,

684
00:43:11,253 --> 00:43:13,013
Speaker 2: here is a guy that they tell us can only

685
00:43:13,053 --> 00:43:15,653
Speaker 2: work between ten and four in the day. Other than

686
00:43:15,693 --> 00:43:18,533
Speaker 2: that he falls apart. And he lived up to that

687
00:43:19,093 --> 00:43:23,293
Speaker 2: without any shall we say, input from elsewhere. But the

688
00:43:23,333 --> 00:43:26,093
Speaker 2: next morning after he was out of he was out

689
00:43:26,093 --> 00:43:31,653
Speaker 2: of the waffle bar at two am. And so how

690
00:43:31,693 --> 00:43:35,053
Speaker 2: much sleep did he get that night before going out

691
00:43:35,093 --> 00:43:39,133
Speaker 2: the next day and at least pretending that he was

692
00:43:39,533 --> 00:43:41,133
Speaker 2: full of vibrants and energy.

693
00:43:42,213 --> 00:43:44,333
Speaker 3: No, I think you're right that there are that he

694
00:43:44,453 --> 00:43:50,293
Speaker 3: was on some type of pharmaceutical boost, some type of drug.

695
00:43:51,533 --> 00:43:53,973
Speaker 3: I mean, I think that's happened with other presidents in

696
00:43:54,013 --> 00:43:57,213
Speaker 3: the past. Folks don't realize how much of a scandal

697
00:43:57,893 --> 00:44:00,613
Speaker 3: the president's health has been in this country ever since

698
00:44:00,653 --> 00:44:07,453
Speaker 3: Woodrow Wilson, who was incapacitate with a stroke in nineteen nineteen,

699
00:44:07,733 --> 00:44:11,013
Speaker 3: but his I took over and basically ran the government

700
00:44:11,013 --> 00:44:14,653
Speaker 3: practically for the final year of his presidency. There's I

701
00:44:14,693 --> 00:44:18,053
Speaker 3: saw on Twitter today a photo of the cover of

702
00:44:18,093 --> 00:44:22,493
Speaker 3: the new issue of Vogue, and it's a big portrait

703
00:44:23,373 --> 00:44:27,173
Speaker 3: basically full size of Jill Biden, Jill Biden, and so

704
00:44:27,493 --> 00:44:30,133
Speaker 3: I had fun with Twitter. I said, Vogue has got

705
00:44:30,173 --> 00:44:35,213
Speaker 3: a great photo cover photo of President Biden. So there

706
00:44:35,213 --> 00:44:38,293
Speaker 3: have been a lot of lies about President's health of

707
00:44:38,693 --> 00:44:41,453
Speaker 3: President Reagan in his last year in office was pretty

708
00:44:41,533 --> 00:44:44,413
Speaker 3: much mentally shot, but they kind of cover that up.

709
00:44:44,813 --> 00:44:49,493
Speaker 3: He would babble in public, but not too much. You know.

710
00:44:49,813 --> 00:44:53,813
Speaker 3: It's but the fundamental problem is we have a structure

711
00:44:53,853 --> 00:44:56,973
Speaker 3: of government at this point that gives so much power

712
00:44:57,453 --> 00:45:02,573
Speaker 3: and arbitrary power and impunity to the president's I mean,

713
00:45:03,533 --> 00:45:06,693
Speaker 3: it's practically the mirror image of what the founding fathers wanted.

714
00:45:07,253 --> 00:45:10,413
Speaker 3: And this whole that we have to let the president

715
00:45:10,533 --> 00:45:12,573
Speaker 3: do what he thinks right, no matter what the law

716
00:45:12,613 --> 00:45:15,653
Speaker 3: of their constition is. It used to be a complete

717
00:45:15,653 --> 00:45:19,533
Speaker 3: travecy of American values and American ethics. But this is

718
00:45:19,573 --> 00:45:22,493
Speaker 3: where the country has been heading. And I've been barking

719
00:45:22,533 --> 00:45:24,933
Speaker 3: at the Moon on this issue, but I haven't had

720
00:45:25,013 --> 00:45:28,653
Speaker 3: much effect on the Moon or on American politics.

721
00:45:29,213 --> 00:45:31,293
Speaker 2: Well, next time you're barking at the Moon or going

722
00:45:31,333 --> 00:45:34,253
Speaker 2: to let me know and I'll join you down here.

723
00:45:35,373 --> 00:45:36,133
Speaker 3: All right, the.

724
00:45:37,613 --> 00:45:40,773
Speaker 2: The Supreme Court decisions that have been handed down in

725
00:45:40,813 --> 00:45:45,413
Speaker 2: the last few days, today being or yesterday actually being

726
00:45:45,613 --> 00:45:50,213
Speaker 2: the last day of the year for them. Two cases

727
00:45:50,373 --> 00:45:52,493
Speaker 2: that I want to mention to you, the Chevron case

728
00:45:53,613 --> 00:45:57,253
Speaker 2: and of course the Trump case. Can you give us

729
00:45:57,373 --> 00:46:03,813
Speaker 2: your precise opinion of each one and the results? And

730
00:46:03,853 --> 00:46:07,013
Speaker 2: I'm asking this question now because you just made a

731
00:46:07,053 --> 00:46:11,573
Speaker 2: comment about giving the president too much power, and I'm

732
00:46:11,613 --> 00:46:14,613
Speaker 2: wondering whether or not the Supreme Court has realized that

733
00:46:14,693 --> 00:46:18,973
Speaker 2: things are out of kilt her and realized that.

734
00:46:19,533 --> 00:46:20,733
Speaker 3: Sorry, I shouldn't have laughed.

735
00:46:21,373 --> 00:46:23,493
Speaker 2: Well, obviously said something stupid.

736
00:46:24,573 --> 00:46:27,493
Speaker 3: No no, no, no, no, no, you didn't say anything stupid.

737
00:46:27,573 --> 00:46:30,733
Speaker 3: It's a Supreme Court that it's been. But no, So

738
00:46:30,853 --> 00:46:35,093
Speaker 3: you asked about the Chevron decision. The nineteen eighty four

739
00:46:35,213 --> 00:46:41,053
Speaker 3: case canonized the notion that federal agencies deserved deference, far

740
00:46:41,133 --> 00:46:45,333
Speaker 3: more difference than private citizens or even the Constitution in

741
00:46:45,453 --> 00:46:48,773
Speaker 3: judging the powers that they seized and the policies which

742
00:46:48,813 --> 00:46:53,733
Speaker 3: they proclaimed. And that was that's a license for administrative tyranny,

743
00:46:54,213 --> 00:46:57,213
Speaker 3: and that's how it's played out in this country. And

744
00:46:57,853 --> 00:47:01,053
Speaker 3: the Court pulled that back last week with the Chevron

745
00:47:01,453 --> 00:47:07,213
Speaker 3: with a new decision striking down the Chevron precedence. It's

746
00:47:07,213 --> 00:47:10,413
Speaker 3: a step in the right direction. There's a long ways

747
00:47:10,453 --> 00:47:12,493
Speaker 3: to go back towards what we used to have in

748
00:47:12,493 --> 00:47:16,453
Speaker 3: this country. As far as the Trump case, you know,

749
00:47:16,813 --> 00:47:20,773
Speaker 3: it's it's a it's a frustrating situation here because there

750
00:47:20,773 --> 00:47:24,173
Speaker 3: have been a lot of bullshit charges against Donald Trump

751
00:47:24,213 --> 00:47:27,613
Speaker 3: in the last couple of years. Trump's opponents, including Biden,

752
00:47:27,653 --> 00:47:31,093
Speaker 3: are using law fair. I mean, there were you know,

753
00:47:31,173 --> 00:47:34,133
Speaker 3: there were so many, uh so many cases where they've

754
00:47:34,133 --> 00:47:37,613
Speaker 3: simply waived a statue of limitation. And so you're going

755
00:47:37,653 --> 00:47:41,293
Speaker 3: back several decades and he said, she said, it's like, well,

756
00:47:41,333 --> 00:47:43,293
Speaker 3: if it was so bad, how come she didn't say

757
00:47:43,293 --> 00:47:47,973
Speaker 3: that in nineteen ninety six. And if you and if

758
00:47:47,973 --> 00:47:50,653
Speaker 3: you look at what they did in Georgia, I mean

759
00:47:51,013 --> 00:47:57,253
Speaker 3: completely rigged situation. The the the the prosecution by Alvin

760
00:47:57,333 --> 00:48:02,493
Speaker 3: Bragg which Jerry convicted Trump of thirty four felonies. I

761
00:48:02,533 --> 00:48:06,373
Speaker 3: think that was a complete crock of you know bs

762
00:48:07,253 --> 00:48:07,533
Speaker 3: what I.

763
00:48:07,653 --> 00:48:16,013
Speaker 4: Said about the judge judge, Yeah, yeah, well, well I

764
00:48:16,093 --> 00:48:18,613
Speaker 4: assume he'll get nominated to New York Supreme Court.

765
00:48:18,773 --> 00:48:22,493
Speaker 3: So I mean it was a farce. It was a farce,

766
00:48:23,133 --> 00:48:26,213
Speaker 3: and it was a farce from the get go. Having

767
00:48:26,413 --> 00:48:30,373
Speaker 3: said that, I mean, it's certainly possible that Trump violated laws,

768
00:48:30,573 --> 00:48:34,653
Speaker 3: that Trump, uh, that Trump did commit crimes. But the

769
00:48:34,693 --> 00:48:39,173
Speaker 3: Supreme Court today basically said that a president is exempt

770
00:48:39,813 --> 00:48:43,413
Speaker 3: from legal liability for his official acts during his term

771
00:48:43,493 --> 00:48:46,653
Speaker 3: of office and afterwards. As I under said, I haven't

772
00:48:46,693 --> 00:48:49,413
Speaker 3: read that closely. I was chasing some other rabbits today.

773
00:48:50,053 --> 00:48:55,653
Speaker 3: But and so it's it's a very disturbing ruling. And

774
00:48:55,813 --> 00:48:59,133
Speaker 3: there's I think there were three justices that were kind

775
00:48:59,173 --> 00:49:04,373
Speaker 3: of uh, perhaps barking at the moon for their cause.

776
00:49:04,853 --> 00:49:06,613
Speaker 3: But if you look at look at some of the

777
00:49:06,693 --> 00:49:09,973
Speaker 3: rhetoric there, Yeah, there is reason to be concerned Nixon.

778
00:49:11,613 --> 00:49:14,373
Speaker 3: Nixon was driven out of office in nineteen seventy four.

779
00:49:15,053 --> 00:49:19,413
Speaker 3: Nineteen seventy seven, he sat down David Frost. It's great

780
00:49:19,453 --> 00:49:23,093
Speaker 3: interviews with him, and one of and the best known

781
00:49:23,133 --> 00:49:25,853
Speaker 3: line from that is the jest of it is, it's

782
00:49:25,893 --> 00:49:30,533
Speaker 3: not illegal if the president does it. This is, unfortunately,

783
00:49:30,693 --> 00:49:33,413
Speaker 3: this is the rule of thumb for the oval office

784
00:49:33,493 --> 00:49:36,413
Speaker 3: in this century, starting with George W. Bush.

785
00:49:36,573 --> 00:49:41,773
Speaker 2: Okay, so let's let me throw a couple of let

786
00:49:41,773 --> 00:49:44,053
Speaker 2: me throw a couple of examples at you. The court

787
00:49:44,133 --> 00:49:48,453
Speaker 2: ruled that as long as it was official duties, the

788
00:49:48,493 --> 00:49:53,053
Speaker 2: president could not be held accountable. So who's going to

789
00:49:53,133 --> 00:49:56,133
Speaker 2: decide and the court will obviously who's going to decide though,

790
00:49:56,373 --> 00:50:00,133
Speaker 2: whether or not something is official part of his official

791
00:50:01,053 --> 00:50:06,813
Speaker 2: job and what's not. For instance, when he made that

792
00:50:06,893 --> 00:50:11,813
Speaker 2: speech on the sixth of January, was he fulfilling official

793
00:50:11,893 --> 00:50:13,533
Speaker 2: function question one?

794
00:50:13,653 --> 00:50:18,813
Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, yeah, it's it's so sad to see how

795
00:50:18,853 --> 00:50:22,013
Speaker 3: the Biden administration and a lot of the media have

796
00:50:22,253 --> 00:50:26,493
Speaker 3: endlessly demogogued. On January sixth, I actually had an article

797
00:50:26,533 --> 00:50:29,493
Speaker 3: that came out during that ruckus, and it was talking

798
00:50:29,493 --> 00:50:33,813
Speaker 3: about how even before then, the media and the Democrats

799
00:50:34,133 --> 00:50:38,293
Speaker 3: had greatly expanded the definition of treason, and so they

800
00:50:38,333 --> 00:50:41,053
Speaker 3: were talking about someone being guilty of treason practically if

801
00:50:41,053 --> 00:50:44,853
Speaker 3: they questioned the twenty twenty election result. And this is

802
00:50:44,933 --> 00:50:48,693
Speaker 3: before the ruckus at the Capitol. There were there were

803
00:50:49,573 --> 00:50:53,093
Speaker 3: quite a few people, mostly guys who did violence or

804
00:50:53,133 --> 00:50:56,933
Speaker 3: attack police that day, who deserve our sentences. But this

805
00:50:56,973 --> 00:50:59,893
Speaker 3: whole notion that anybody who was within a mile of

806
00:51:00,013 --> 00:51:03,933
Speaker 3: radius of the US Capitol wearing a MAGA hat deserves

807
00:51:03,933 --> 00:51:07,333
Speaker 3: time in prison, it was crazy. It never made any

808
00:51:07,413 --> 00:51:10,373
Speaker 3: sense to take a step back, going back to the

809
00:51:10,453 --> 00:51:15,493
Speaker 3: question of the president and the law, turned back the

810
00:51:15,533 --> 00:51:19,213
Speaker 3: clock twenty one years in this country. You've got George W.

811
00:51:19,413 --> 00:51:24,733
Speaker 3: Bush invading Iraq on false pretenses. George Bush misled the nation.

812
00:51:25,373 --> 00:51:29,253
Speaker 3: He knew or should have known that it was completely bogus.

813
00:51:30,013 --> 00:51:33,173
Speaker 3: Bush and his team were out there blaming Saddam Hussein

814
00:51:33,573 --> 00:51:36,813
Speaker 3: for the nine to eleven attacks. That was always bs.

815
00:51:37,093 --> 00:51:39,013
Speaker 3: The Saudis had a hell of a lot more to

816
00:51:39,053 --> 00:51:41,333
Speaker 3: do with it, but they were Bush's buddies, so we

817
00:51:41,333 --> 00:51:44,893
Speaker 3: didn't hear about that. But you had vast carnish resulting

818
00:51:44,933 --> 00:51:48,053
Speaker 3: from that. As I understand it, with the Supreme Court

819
00:51:48,093 --> 00:51:53,813
Speaker 3: decision on the presidential immunity, Bush would be immune from

820
00:51:54,573 --> 00:51:57,813
Speaker 3: indictment or prosecution on that. Granted it wasn't going to

821
00:51:57,853 --> 00:52:02,093
Speaker 3: happen anyhow, but as a moral principle, I'm totally opposed

822
00:52:02,133 --> 00:52:07,613
Speaker 3: to letting I'm totally opposed to letting presidents have this

823
00:52:08,133 --> 00:52:10,733
Speaker 3: un over the power over the entire globe.

824
00:52:11,573 --> 00:52:15,133
Speaker 2: See, I'm struggling to agree with you. At that particular time,

825
00:52:15,173 --> 00:52:19,293
Speaker 2: I argued on radio in favor of what the Bush

826
00:52:19,333 --> 00:52:23,693
Speaker 2: regime was doing, and I anchored it specifically to the

827
00:52:23,693 --> 00:52:28,613
Speaker 2: fact that Todam Hussein claimed at one point that he

828
00:52:29,173 --> 00:52:31,893
Speaker 2: or at least hinted strongly at one point that he

829
00:52:31,973 --> 00:52:35,973
Speaker 2: had weapons of mass destruction, and on that basis where

830
00:52:36,013 --> 00:52:38,573
Speaker 2: the words came from his own lips, I thought that

831
00:52:38,693 --> 00:52:41,533
Speaker 2: validated what they were doing. Why was I wrong?

832
00:52:43,653 --> 00:52:46,973
Speaker 3: Weapons of mass destruction is not a reason the slaughter

833
00:52:47,173 --> 00:52:50,133
Speaker 3: a foreign nation. I mean, many, if not most, of

834
00:52:50,173 --> 00:52:53,533
Speaker 3: the garments in the world, certainly the ones that are

835
00:52:53,573 --> 00:52:56,173
Speaker 3: not in the Third World, have a lot of weapons.

836
00:52:56,413 --> 00:53:00,013
Speaker 3: Somewhech would be classified as weapons of mass destruction. Simply

837
00:53:00,053 --> 00:53:03,973
Speaker 3: because he possessed weapons did not give the American garment

838
00:53:04,053 --> 00:53:08,693
Speaker 3: the right to kill tens of thousands of Iranqis if

839
00:53:08,693 --> 00:53:11,693
Speaker 3: they had had weapons of mass destruction, unless they were

840
00:53:11,813 --> 00:53:15,133
Speaker 3: using them against UH, using them to launch an attack

841
00:53:15,253 --> 00:53:18,053
Speaker 3: against the US, the US had no right to go

842
00:53:18,133 --> 00:53:18,653
Speaker 3: after him.

843
00:53:19,413 --> 00:53:23,333
Speaker 2: His intention, though at the time was conveyed as being

844
00:53:23,493 --> 00:53:25,493
Speaker 2: one of doing exactly that, was it not?

845
00:53:27,253 --> 00:53:30,653
Speaker 3: And who was it who was conveying his intention him?

846
00:53:32,493 --> 00:53:37,373
Speaker 3: I don't I don't think he was. I mean he

847
00:53:37,453 --> 00:53:39,333
Speaker 3: made a lot of mistakes. He was. He was a

848
00:53:39,413 --> 00:53:43,293
Speaker 3: ruthless dictator. H he killed a lot of innocent Iraqis,

849
00:53:44,013 --> 00:53:47,373
Speaker 3: but I don't think that he ever said things that

850
00:53:47,413 --> 00:53:50,493
Speaker 3: would have been justifiable pretext for US invasion.

851
00:53:50,773 --> 00:53:53,133
Speaker 2: All right, let me let me stretch this just a

852
00:53:53,213 --> 00:53:59,373
Speaker 2: little longer. So the the Iranians are undoubtedly unquestionably working

853
00:53:59,413 --> 00:54:01,533
Speaker 2: on nuclear weapon weaponry.

854
00:54:01,893 --> 00:54:02,773
Speaker 3: What's your source?

855
00:54:03,693 --> 00:54:08,653
Speaker 2: Multiple sources? Are they credible? Well, it's a mean, I

856
00:54:09,533 --> 00:54:13,373
Speaker 2: take your question. I've thought about it. I have thought

857
00:54:13,413 --> 00:54:17,093
Speaker 2: about it constantly. Let me put it this way. We

858
00:54:17,213 --> 00:54:20,573
Speaker 2: know what the what the Iranians are doing in supporting

859
00:54:20,813 --> 00:54:27,573
Speaker 2: various groups like Hezballah over a period of time, and

860
00:54:27,573 --> 00:54:32,013
Speaker 2: that their intentions, the intentions of the present administration, and

861
00:54:32,053 --> 00:54:35,053
Speaker 2: it's been there for some time to wipe out Israel.

862
00:54:35,253 --> 00:54:36,093
Speaker 2: Would you accept that?

863
00:54:36,533 --> 00:54:38,013
Speaker 3: No?

864
00:54:38,213 --> 00:54:41,293
Speaker 2: I mean, then what's what's your what's your source?

865
00:54:42,733 --> 00:54:42,853
Speaker 1: Uh?

866
00:54:44,213 --> 00:54:48,413
Speaker 3: Uh, there's there's a lot of alternative sources on the news.

867
00:54:48,493 --> 00:54:51,493
Speaker 3: I mean, I think it's a bad government. Uh, it's

868
00:54:51,533 --> 00:54:54,373
Speaker 3: a very oppressive government. But it's a part of the

869
00:54:54,373 --> 00:54:57,533
Speaker 3: world where almost all the governments are bad and oppressive.

870
00:54:57,613 --> 00:55:00,453
Speaker 2: Yes, but they're the biggest, they're the biggest, the biggest

871
00:55:00,453 --> 00:55:05,613
Speaker 2: supporters of of terror, certainly in that part of the world,

872
00:55:05,653 --> 00:55:06,613
Speaker 2: if not elsewhere.

873
00:55:08,973 --> 00:55:13,413
Speaker 3: What is your definition of terror. Is it only private groups,

874
00:55:13,613 --> 00:55:16,613
Speaker 3: because if you include government, governments do a hell of

875
00:55:16,693 --> 00:55:19,053
Speaker 3: a lot more terrorizing than private groups.

876
00:55:19,293 --> 00:55:22,813
Speaker 2: Would you accept that there is a danger that the

877
00:55:22,853 --> 00:55:27,933
Speaker 2: Iranians might be behind a forthcoming attack on America and

878
00:55:28,053 --> 00:55:29,853
Speaker 2: a nine eleven Is that possible?

879
00:55:30,533 --> 00:55:33,653
Speaker 3: It's possible that they and a lot of other nations

880
00:55:33,653 --> 00:55:37,453
Speaker 3: and other groups could attempt to launch another attack on

881
00:55:37,533 --> 00:55:42,773
Speaker 3: the US. But it doesn't build confidence that it took

882
00:55:42,853 --> 00:55:48,293
Speaker 3: US fifteen years to see the confidential Congress report linking

883
00:55:48,333 --> 00:55:51,613
Speaker 3: the Saudi government to the nine to eleven attacks. I mean,

884
00:55:53,053 --> 00:55:56,413
Speaker 3: you know, there were so many levels of so many

885
00:55:56,453 --> 00:55:59,373
Speaker 3: shovels of bs that the US government and a lot

886
00:55:59,413 --> 00:56:03,453
Speaker 3: of the American media did to avoid fingering the Saudis

887
00:56:03,453 --> 00:56:06,453
Speaker 3: on the nine to eleven attacks. And the US government

888
00:56:06,493 --> 00:56:11,213
Speaker 3: is still blocking lawsuits seeking to discover to discover the

889
00:56:11,253 --> 00:56:15,213
Speaker 3: full extent of Saudi's support for the hijackers. Fifteen of

890
00:56:15,253 --> 00:56:19,773
Speaker 3: the nineteen were Saudi's but that fact practically vanished once

891
00:56:19,853 --> 00:56:24,093
Speaker 3: George W. Bush and Cheney said, Hey, it was Saddan. So,

892
00:56:24,573 --> 00:56:27,013
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't trust folks who are trying to

893
00:56:27,093 --> 00:56:28,613
Speaker 3: drag us into another war.

894
00:56:29,493 --> 00:56:33,293
Speaker 2: Well, I have some sympathy with that. But my final

895
00:56:33,333 --> 00:56:37,773
Speaker 2: point is if we accept that, I do that Iran

896
00:56:38,453 --> 00:56:43,213
Speaker 2: has ambitions beyond its entitlementers. Okay, the different when they

897
00:56:43,253 --> 00:56:47,493
Speaker 2: develop nuclear capability, they are going to be much harder

898
00:56:47,493 --> 00:56:51,853
Speaker 2: to deal with. Would you approve then, if any administration

899
00:56:52,053 --> 00:56:57,173
Speaker 2: of the United States, or for that matter, the Israelis

900
00:56:57,373 --> 00:57:03,973
Speaker 2: with American backing, took out their nuclear capabilities before they

901
00:57:04,013 --> 00:57:04,653
Speaker 2: reached the goal.

902
00:57:05,973 --> 00:57:08,773
Speaker 3: No, I would not do that because for over twenty

903
00:57:08,853 --> 00:57:12,093
Speaker 3: years we've been hearing that the Iranians are two or

904
00:57:12,173 --> 00:57:15,533
Speaker 3: three or four years away from having nuclear weapons. There

905
00:57:15,613 --> 00:57:18,773
Speaker 3: have been so many false claims on this, and I

906
00:57:18,773 --> 00:57:22,573
Speaker 3: think it would be folly to go into another Middle

907
00:57:22,613 --> 00:57:24,973
Speaker 3: Eastern war with the nation that was a whole lot

908
00:57:25,013 --> 00:57:28,893
Speaker 3: bigger than Iraq, and the US basically lost the Iraq war,

909
00:57:29,293 --> 00:57:33,213
Speaker 3: that lost the Afghanistan war. And I don't see, you

910
00:57:33,253 --> 00:57:35,493
Speaker 3: know what best out of three or best out of

911
00:57:35,573 --> 00:57:38,053
Speaker 3: five here or what I mean. I don't see any

912
00:57:39,173 --> 00:57:43,693
Speaker 3: reason for the US to intervene because things have worked

913
00:57:43,693 --> 00:57:46,133
Speaker 3: out very badly for the US and for the nations

914
00:57:46,173 --> 00:57:47,093
Speaker 3: where they intervened.

915
00:57:47,853 --> 00:57:50,493
Speaker 2: So what would your advice be if you had Easia

916
00:57:51,013 --> 00:57:54,733
Speaker 2: to the next president with regard to dealing with the Iranians.

917
00:57:55,533 --> 00:57:58,133
Speaker 3: With regard to dealing with the Iranians, I mean I

918
00:57:58,173 --> 00:58:00,933
Speaker 3: would I'd keep an eye on them. I would definitely

919
00:58:01,013 --> 00:58:04,373
Speaker 3: keep an eye on them and see what they're up to.

920
00:58:04,573 --> 00:58:07,613
Speaker 3: But it's not like we can afford to. You know,

921
00:58:08,413 --> 00:58:14,053
Speaker 3: the the basic basic problem that has plagued the US

922
00:58:14,093 --> 00:58:17,773
Speaker 3: foreign policy for decades is this notion that the US

923
00:58:17,973 --> 00:58:21,853
Speaker 3: has a right and a duty to scourge any foreign threats.

924
00:58:22,293 --> 00:58:25,653
Speaker 3: And uh, and it's been and it's it's a kind

925
00:58:25,653 --> 00:58:30,373
Speaker 3: of notion that bligns Americans to the failures and follies

926
00:58:30,413 --> 00:58:33,173
Speaker 3: of US foreign policy. And they're being a hell of

927
00:58:33,173 --> 00:58:36,053
Speaker 3: a lot more than Congress or the American media recognize.

928
00:58:36,893 --> 00:58:40,653
Speaker 2: Mm hmm. Let me ask you some quick questions. Having

929
00:58:40,693 --> 00:58:44,253
Speaker 2: mentioned Michelle Obama already, who would you who would you

930
00:58:44,373 --> 00:58:47,093
Speaker 2: choose or who would you rather see as the president

931
00:58:47,693 --> 00:58:52,373
Speaker 2: if it came down to Michelle Obama and Kamala Harris.

932
00:58:56,213 --> 00:58:58,733
Speaker 3: Oh, this is a great choice. I mean, this is like,

933
00:58:58,893 --> 00:59:03,053
Speaker 3: you know, there's a good comic comparison here. It's like, uh,

934
00:59:03,293 --> 00:59:07,093
Speaker 3: and and second prize is two weeks in Philadelphia, right, yes,

935
00:59:08,133 --> 00:59:13,853
Speaker 3: uh yeah, I I you know, they're both bad choices.

936
00:59:13,933 --> 00:59:16,853
Speaker 3: So However, I think if either one of them is

937
00:59:16,933 --> 00:59:18,533
Speaker 3: nominated then they will not win.

938
00:59:18,893 --> 00:59:21,333
Speaker 2: So no, no, no, But if there was, I'm asking

939
00:59:21,373 --> 00:59:23,773
Speaker 2: you which one you would prefer not to have.

940
00:59:24,333 --> 00:59:27,213
Speaker 3: Well, Harris has more of a record as far as

941
00:59:27,253 --> 00:59:30,493
Speaker 3: working for the government. The abuses that she committed as

942
00:59:30,533 --> 00:59:34,613
Speaker 3: a prosecutor in California shouldn't have disqualified her forever, But

943
00:59:34,693 --> 00:59:35,213
Speaker 3: they haven't.

944
00:59:35,773 --> 00:59:36,733
Speaker 2: Extraordinary, isn't it.

945
00:59:37,213 --> 00:59:40,693
Speaker 3: Yep? Biden, Well this is sorry, No, please go ahead.

946
00:59:40,813 --> 00:59:43,733
Speaker 2: The Biden clan, I'm talking the whole family, you know,

947
00:59:43,893 --> 00:59:47,733
Speaker 2: Camp David and what have you. The Biden clan do

948
00:59:47,933 --> 00:59:50,373
Speaker 2: have issues that need to be dealt with? Do you

949
00:59:50,413 --> 00:59:51,053
Speaker 2: not think.

950
00:59:53,893 --> 00:59:58,013
Speaker 3: Like thievery and money laundering and collecting all kinds of bribes,

951
00:59:58,213 --> 01:00:01,573
Speaker 3: those kinds of issues. Yeah, that'll do for stuff. Yeah,

952
01:00:01,613 --> 01:00:03,853
Speaker 3: it'll do for a start. But here again, this is

953
01:00:04,013 --> 01:00:07,373
Speaker 3: this is something with that Supreme Court decision. Well, he

954
01:00:07,573 --> 01:00:09,613
Speaker 3: was in office, and so it'd be kind of rude

955
01:00:09,613 --> 01:00:13,293
Speaker 3: to prosecute, but it was kind of official because because

956
01:00:13,333 --> 01:00:15,773
Speaker 3: he was seeing the president of China, this, that and

957
01:00:15,813 --> 01:00:19,733
Speaker 3: the other. Yeah, I mean it used to be that

958
01:00:20,453 --> 01:00:24,253
Speaker 3: presidents were like people understood that the rule of law

959
01:00:24,373 --> 01:00:27,573
Speaker 3: means that no one is above the law. But with

960
01:00:27,653 --> 01:00:30,373
Speaker 3: the Supreme Court decision today, and with a trend in

961
01:00:30,373 --> 01:00:33,693
Speaker 3: this country for decades, not only do you have presidents

962
01:00:33,733 --> 01:00:36,333
Speaker 3: who are above the law, you've got a vast number

963
01:00:36,413 --> 01:00:40,573
Speaker 3: of top government officials who can commit crimes with impunity.

964
01:00:41,213 --> 01:00:43,453
Speaker 2: Is it impunity because nobody will pursue them.

965
01:00:44,213 --> 01:00:45,933
Speaker 3: That's how impunity normally works.

966
01:00:46,013 --> 01:00:49,573
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, not because they're protected by the law,

967
01:00:49,613 --> 01:00:53,013
Speaker 2: but because nobody wants to Well to this point, nobody

968
01:00:53,013 --> 01:00:55,413
Speaker 2: wants to take the head off the beast.

969
01:00:57,373 --> 01:00:59,613
Speaker 3: You know, as some of both. I mean, but there's

970
01:00:59,693 --> 01:01:03,213
Speaker 3: another wrinkle here, and that is a secrecy. The US

971
01:01:03,293 --> 01:01:06,853
Speaker 3: government is creating trillions of phases of new secrets every year.

972
01:01:07,773 --> 01:01:11,773
Speaker 3: That's equivalent to twenty billion filing cabinets full of double

973
01:01:11,813 --> 01:01:18,813
Speaker 3: space pages. So government is committing more crimes than Americans

974
01:01:18,813 --> 01:01:21,933
Speaker 3: will ever know. And so that's one more way that

975
01:01:22,013 --> 01:01:25,733
Speaker 3: the deck is stacked against preserving our rights and liberties.

976
01:01:27,013 --> 01:01:29,093
Speaker 2: What to quote you from your own work. Rather than

977
01:01:29,133 --> 01:01:31,933
Speaker 2: the rule of law, we have a government of threats, intimidation,

978
01:01:32,013 --> 01:01:37,333
Speaker 2: and browbeating. Government of the people defaulted into government for

979
01:01:37,373 --> 01:01:42,613
Speaker 2: the people, which degenerated into perennially punishing people for their

980
01:01:42,613 --> 01:01:46,533
Speaker 2: own good. Twenty five years ago, Supreme Justice Ruth Bader

981
01:01:46,573 --> 01:01:52,853
Speaker 2: Ginsburg warned against permitting federal agencies the extraordinary authority to

982
01:01:53,053 --> 01:01:57,173
Speaker 2: manufacture crimes? Has that got? That was twenty five years ago?

983
01:01:58,013 --> 01:01:59,013
Speaker 2: How much worse is it?

984
01:01:59,093 --> 01:02:02,733
Speaker 3: Got? A whole lot worse, a whole lot worse. If

985
01:02:02,773 --> 01:02:05,613
Speaker 3: you look at a lot of gun violations, there's a

986
01:02:05,613 --> 01:02:08,773
Speaker 3: lot of entreatment and those things drug case have been

987
01:02:08,893 --> 01:02:13,373
Speaker 3: entrapment from the get go. It often happens when you're

988
01:02:13,373 --> 01:02:17,613
Speaker 3: trying to do nail people for non violent or crimes

989
01:02:17,653 --> 01:02:21,573
Speaker 3: of consent where people were selling something the government doesn't improve.

990
01:02:21,653 --> 01:02:25,733
Speaker 3: You set somebody up. But no, I mean, there's just

991
01:02:25,773 --> 01:02:30,013
Speaker 3: so many different sting operations. You've had the FBI setting

992
01:02:30,133 --> 01:02:33,893
Speaker 3: up people, setting up people to do Ku Klux Klan

993
01:02:34,013 --> 01:02:39,093
Speaker 3: protests with the FBI informants in charge. You've got the

994
01:02:39,213 --> 01:02:44,653
Speaker 3: FBI paying for neo Nazi propaganda in some cases. You've

995
01:02:44,693 --> 01:02:49,173
Speaker 3: got the FBI covering for all kinds of horrendous folks

996
01:02:49,613 --> 01:02:51,893
Speaker 3: that help the FBI generate more cases.

997
01:02:52,693 --> 01:02:55,813
Speaker 2: How much was the FBI involved in January sixth?

998
01:02:56,973 --> 01:02:59,213
Speaker 3: You know, I wish I knew, I wish I knew.

999
01:02:59,333 --> 01:03:01,653
Speaker 3: I think that they were involved a hell of a

1000
01:03:01,693 --> 01:03:04,613
Speaker 3: lot more than media's admitted. There were so many warning

1001
01:03:04,653 --> 01:03:07,933
Speaker 3: signs that were disregarded, they were involved in it. It

1002
01:03:07,973 --> 01:03:10,253
Speaker 3: would be great if we knew. Here we are three

1003
01:03:10,253 --> 01:03:14,653
Speaker 3: and a half years later and the governments has succeeded

1004
01:03:14,693 --> 01:03:19,253
Speaker 3: in covering up most of its role, and that ruckus.

1005
01:03:19,813 --> 01:03:22,373
Speaker 2: Well, by the way, you've just triggered something I hadn't

1006
01:03:22,373 --> 01:03:27,413
Speaker 2: even thought of. Trump has said that rather rapidly after

1007
01:03:27,693 --> 01:03:33,013
Speaker 2: gaining office he would release the files on the Kennedy murder.

1008
01:03:33,613 --> 01:03:35,213
Speaker 2: What do you think those What do you think is

1009
01:03:35,213 --> 01:03:36,253
Speaker 2: in those files?

1010
01:03:37,613 --> 01:03:40,373
Speaker 3: Lots of dirt? But Trump said, you do that last

1011
01:03:40,373 --> 01:03:45,773
Speaker 3: time too. Trump was making a big shortly before he

1012
01:03:45,893 --> 01:03:48,173
Speaker 3: left office. Trump made a big deal about all these

1013
01:03:48,613 --> 01:03:51,573
Speaker 3: federal documents he was going to release, but he got rolled.

1014
01:03:52,093 --> 01:03:52,813
Speaker 3: He didn't do it.

1015
01:03:53,453 --> 01:03:55,773
Speaker 2: Do you not think that this time around he's in

1016
01:03:55,813 --> 01:03:58,093
Speaker 2: a much different position to what he was for the

1017
01:03:58,133 --> 01:04:02,413
Speaker 2: first term, that he can capitalize on the knowledge that

1018
01:04:02,413 --> 01:04:05,053
Speaker 2: that he garnered during that period and the lessons that

1019
01:04:05,093 --> 01:04:05,813
Speaker 2: he learned.

1020
01:04:07,973 --> 01:04:10,693
Speaker 3: That rush and brings to mind my favorite line from

1021
01:04:10,773 --> 01:04:14,773
Speaker 3: Samuel Johnson about the triumph of hope over experience.

1022
01:04:15,453 --> 01:04:18,293
Speaker 2: Mmm. I felt there was something personal in that comment.

1023
01:04:20,933 --> 01:04:24,173
Speaker 3: No, it's just, uh, I would I would like to

1024
01:04:24,253 --> 01:04:28,213
Speaker 3: see you know, I'd be happy if Trump gets if

1025
01:04:28,853 --> 01:04:31,453
Speaker 3: if Trump does get elected, if he opens up these

1026
01:04:31,773 --> 01:04:35,173
Speaker 3: files and opens up these secrets. And I guess I'm

1027
01:04:35,253 --> 01:04:38,053
Speaker 3: I'm I'm skeptical because because a lot of the people

1028
01:04:38,173 --> 01:04:42,133
Speaker 3: that Trump has put around him and has has endorsed.

1029
01:04:42,533 --> 01:04:46,453
Speaker 3: There's a guy, a Congressman Mike Rogers, running from Michigan.

1030
01:04:46,773 --> 01:04:49,293
Speaker 3: He's going up against the guy who's really good, former

1031
01:04:49,333 --> 01:04:53,173
Speaker 3: Congressman Justin Mamash, who was great on civil liberties. But

1032
01:04:53,533 --> 01:04:58,613
Speaker 3: Mike Rogers was the chairman of the House Intelligence Committee.

1033
01:04:58,653 --> 01:05:02,013
Speaker 3: I think when Edward Snowden did his leagues and this

1034
01:05:02,053 --> 01:05:04,453
Speaker 3: is a paraphrase, I think I'm doing it injustice. But

1035
01:05:05,093 --> 01:05:07,853
Speaker 3: Rogers said something to the fact, well, if people don't

1036
01:05:07,893 --> 01:05:11,173
Speaker 3: know that they're privacy has been violated, then their privacy

1037
01:05:11,253 --> 01:05:14,973
Speaker 3: really hasn't been violated. And it sounded kind of like

1038
01:05:15,053 --> 01:05:17,733
Speaker 3: the slogan that you hear from some guy that used

1039
01:05:17,813 --> 01:05:19,533
Speaker 3: date rape drugs, because.

1040
01:05:19,293 --> 01:05:24,253
Speaker 2: I wouldn't have thought of that. Thank goodness, you.

1041
01:05:24,253 --> 01:05:26,733
Speaker 3: Have a much loftier mind than I do. That's the

1042
01:05:26,773 --> 01:05:30,333
Speaker 3: difference in this entire interview. You know, that's where the

1043
01:05:30,373 --> 01:05:33,413
Speaker 3: disconnet comes from You're you're way up there amount olympus

1044
01:05:33,453 --> 01:05:35,453
Speaker 3: and I'm just just a muck raker.

1045
01:05:36,093 --> 01:05:37,093
Speaker 2: What are you talking about?

1046
01:05:37,853 --> 01:05:39,613
Speaker 3: I was trying to make a joke. It didn't work

1047
01:05:39,693 --> 01:05:42,813
Speaker 3: very well. Feel free to edit it out if you want.

1048
01:05:43,293 --> 01:05:45,613
Speaker 2: Maybe I'm just too busy trying to think of where

1049
01:05:45,613 --> 01:05:48,213
Speaker 2: we're going because I want to get a couple more

1050
01:05:48,293 --> 01:05:53,813
Speaker 2: things in before we conclude. Trump has yet to announce

1051
01:05:53,853 --> 01:05:56,653
Speaker 2: who his running mate will be. It's a pretty wide

1052
01:05:56,653 --> 01:06:00,573
Speaker 2: open field, and there's all sorts of arguments for all

1053
01:06:00,653 --> 01:06:04,133
Speaker 2: sorts of different people. Is there anybody that stands out

1054
01:06:04,173 --> 01:06:04,453
Speaker 2: for you?

1055
01:06:05,173 --> 01:06:07,813
Speaker 3: Well, I think it'd be great if he would choose

1056
01:06:07,933 --> 01:06:11,453
Speaker 3: Rand Paul is his running mate. That would be a

1057
01:06:11,493 --> 01:06:17,213
Speaker 3: real boost of confidence. Mike Lee would also be very good. Uh, basically,

1058
01:06:17,293 --> 01:06:20,293
Speaker 3: as far as someone who would give would have a

1059
01:06:20,453 --> 01:06:24,213
Speaker 3: very good compass on foreign policy, Center Vance would be good.

1060
01:06:24,933 --> 01:06:28,573
Speaker 3: A wild card would be Tulci Gavn, former Democratic congresswoman,

1061
01:06:28,613 --> 01:06:31,933
Speaker 3: but that's probably not gonna happen. There's lots of people

1062
01:06:31,933 --> 01:06:36,333
Speaker 3: whose names I'm seeing Benny about are utterly chilling, But

1063
01:06:37,133 --> 01:06:37,613
Speaker 3: give me a.

1064
01:06:37,573 --> 01:06:45,613
Speaker 2: Couple of those. Nikki Haley interesting why she's a warmonger.

1065
01:06:46,213 --> 01:06:48,173
Speaker 2: Do you think she would influence him that much?

1066
01:06:49,293 --> 01:06:52,853
Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, I mean, you know, Trump is interesting. He's

1067
01:06:53,493 --> 01:06:56,893
Speaker 3: very intelligent, but in his you know, his in his

1068
01:06:57,653 --> 01:07:00,973
Speaker 3: initial term, perhaps his only term, but his first term. Anyhow,

1069
01:07:01,453 --> 01:07:03,373
Speaker 3: he didn't seem to pay that much attention to the

1070
01:07:03,413 --> 01:07:07,253
Speaker 3: details of government policy. He was busy tweeting and you know,

1071
01:07:07,373 --> 01:07:10,693
Speaker 3: watching Fox News, and it's like, you know, dude, you know,

1072
01:07:10,773 --> 01:07:13,173
Speaker 3: how about you put some control. It seemed like he

1073
01:07:13,293 --> 01:07:17,333
Speaker 3: just handed the keys to his administration to a son

1074
01:07:17,413 --> 01:07:19,773
Speaker 3: in law and his daughter, and it's like, you know, well,

1075
01:07:19,813 --> 01:07:23,133
Speaker 3: you know, good luck with this. That's an overstatement, but

1076
01:07:23,253 --> 01:07:25,013
Speaker 3: you know, he didn't do that well. But it was

1077
01:07:25,013 --> 01:07:27,253
Speaker 3: always a man issues in which he was pretty good.

1078
01:07:27,293 --> 01:07:27,533
Speaker 3: What's that?

1079
01:07:27,733 --> 01:07:34,413
Speaker 2: I think it was a bad look, the dreadful look. Dredful.

1080
01:07:35,253 --> 01:07:37,973
Speaker 2: So I want to throw a name at you and

1081
01:07:37,973 --> 01:07:42,253
Speaker 2: get your immediate reaction. John Radcliffe, Oh.

1082
01:07:41,533 --> 01:07:45,253
Speaker 3: You know on the it's ringing a small bell. Where's

1083
01:07:45,293 --> 01:07:45,653
Speaker 3: the bell?

1084
01:07:46,253 --> 01:07:52,333
Speaker 2: National Security advisor? Okay, he was involved in national security?

1085
01:07:53,373 --> 01:07:57,533
Speaker 3: Okay? And what him is VP or what?

1086
01:07:57,773 --> 01:08:00,853
Speaker 2: Yeah?

1087
01:08:00,053 --> 01:08:02,573
Speaker 3: I don't know enough to react.

1088
01:08:02,413 --> 01:08:07,693
Speaker 2: Okay, and that's fair enough. So probably finally I'm intrigued

1089
01:08:07,693 --> 01:08:12,773
Speaker 2: in your view of the developments in the Julian Massange case.

1090
01:08:13,333 --> 01:08:17,053
Speaker 3: Okay, Biden is you know there was a line and

1091
01:08:17,053 --> 01:08:19,853
Speaker 3: I wrote about this last week and I said, this

1092
01:08:19,893 --> 01:08:23,573
Speaker 3: is one of the areas where the Biden administration has

1093
01:08:23,653 --> 01:08:27,413
Speaker 3: been slightly less odious than the Trump administration, because it

1094
01:08:27,533 --> 01:08:30,373
Speaker 3: was a Trump administration that indicted him and hounded him.

1095
01:08:31,093 --> 01:08:34,853
Speaker 3: There was a USA Today article I did I guess

1096
01:08:34,893 --> 01:08:38,093
Speaker 3: six years ago that set of it that that said,

1097
01:08:38,213 --> 01:08:41,813
Speaker 3: instead of an indictment, Julian Nissan should get a Presidential

1098
01:08:41,853 --> 01:08:45,693
Speaker 3: Medal of Freedom for all the things that he exposed,

1099
01:08:46,093 --> 01:08:51,573
Speaker 3: helping Americans understand their government and the failures of US

1100
01:08:51,653 --> 01:08:53,133
Speaker 3: interventions in many countries.

1101
01:08:54,053 --> 01:08:58,493
Speaker 2: I have members of my family who are ex military,

1102
01:08:59,013 --> 01:09:02,813
Speaker 2: and just then for a start, I think otherwise, but

1103
01:09:02,933 --> 01:09:06,973
Speaker 2: I am I used them as an example of the

1104
01:09:07,013 --> 01:09:09,533
Speaker 2: fact that I've actually got had a bit of conversation

1105
01:09:09,813 --> 01:09:13,093
Speaker 2: with regard to this. But it's mostly military people or

1106
01:09:13,093 --> 01:09:15,933
Speaker 2: military connections who think otherwise and think that he should

1107
01:09:15,933 --> 01:09:19,773
Speaker 2: have been locked up for life or whatever. The fact

1108
01:09:19,773 --> 01:09:22,093
Speaker 2: that he the fact that he ended up not being

1109
01:09:22,653 --> 01:09:26,973
Speaker 2: Do you really think it was Biden's decision, because I don't.

1110
01:09:29,133 --> 01:09:33,133
Speaker 3: I think that the Biden people recognize that they could

1111
01:09:33,133 --> 01:09:37,653
Speaker 3: be embarrassed hugely by defeat in British court on whether

1112
01:09:37,693 --> 01:09:42,093
Speaker 3: he would be extradited. There was there was some impact

1113
01:09:42,093 --> 01:09:44,693
Speaker 3: from the media campaign, some of the top papers and

1114
01:09:44,733 --> 01:09:48,693
Speaker 3: outlets here pushing for assigns for the charges to be dropped.

1115
01:09:50,093 --> 01:09:53,293
Speaker 3: I don't know what other strings were being pulled. I mean,

1116
01:09:53,533 --> 01:09:56,173
Speaker 3: you know, this is a good example. Okay, so it was.

1117
01:09:56,373 --> 01:09:59,333
Speaker 3: It was a good decision, But how many years is

1118
01:09:59,333 --> 01:10:01,733
Speaker 3: it going to be until we find out what really happened?

1119
01:10:01,973 --> 01:10:04,853
Speaker 3: Five years, ten years, maybe after both of us are dead.

1120
01:10:05,413 --> 01:10:07,973
Speaker 2: Well, the same thing applies, I suppose to the to

1121
01:10:08,053 --> 01:10:10,213
Speaker 2: the Kennedy records.

1122
01:10:11,333 --> 01:10:16,053
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, and that's the perfect example, because what

1123
01:10:16,133 --> 01:10:19,693
Speaker 3: the Chief Justice, Earl Warren, head of the Warrant Commission

1124
01:10:19,853 --> 01:10:23,413
Speaker 3: and others did. They had this big investigation and then

1125
01:10:23,493 --> 01:10:26,493
Speaker 3: sealed the records for seventy five years. I mean, this

1126
01:10:26,573 --> 01:10:29,813
Speaker 3: is complete bs. I mean that standard policy. I guess

1127
01:10:29,813 --> 01:10:32,613
Speaker 3: in Britain with the Official Secrets Act, maybe not the

1128
01:10:32,653 --> 01:10:37,133
Speaker 3: same number of years, but it makes a travesy of democracy.

1129
01:10:37,373 --> 01:10:41,733
Speaker 3: If folks don't know what the government is doing in

1130
01:10:41,773 --> 01:10:44,373
Speaker 3: their name, then they might as well be serfs in

1131
01:10:44,413 --> 01:10:45,213
Speaker 3: the Middle Ages.

1132
01:10:45,733 --> 01:10:49,053
Speaker 2: Again, I want to quote from last rites. School children

1133
01:10:49,413 --> 01:10:53,453
Speaker 2: are being sacrificed on an altar of social justice, from

1134
01:10:53,813 --> 01:10:59,213
Speaker 2: no child left behind to common core. Federal dictats have

1135
01:10:59,333 --> 01:11:03,533
Speaker 2: subverted academic standards and squanted billions of ours of our kids' lives.

1136
01:11:03,853 --> 01:11:06,973
Speaker 2: Teacher unions have worked to destroy local control of education,

1137
01:11:07,333 --> 01:11:11,053
Speaker 2: prevent teacher account ability, deny parents any voice, any voice

1138
01:11:11,093 --> 01:11:15,053
Speaker 2: in their children's education, and pointlessly shut down schools during

1139
01:11:15,093 --> 01:11:19,773
Speaker 2: the pandemic in lieu of literacy. Government schools are redefining

1140
01:11:19,893 --> 01:11:24,013
Speaker 2: gender and indoctrinating kids with values that many parents detest.

1141
01:11:24,533 --> 01:11:27,333
Speaker 2: When mothers and fathers raised hell at school board meetings,

1142
01:11:27,613 --> 01:11:31,453
Speaker 2: the Biden administration and the FBI labeled them as terrorst

1143
01:11:31,533 --> 01:11:34,173
Speaker 2: suspects and treated some of them, I will add, and

1144
01:11:34,213 --> 01:11:36,293
Speaker 2: treated some of them accordingly.

1145
01:11:36,813 --> 01:11:37,093
Speaker 3: Yep.

1146
01:11:37,973 --> 01:11:39,453
Speaker 2: I mean I knew that was going on, but I

1147
01:11:39,493 --> 01:11:42,653
Speaker 2: read that paragraph and I was It seriously got to me,

1148
01:11:43,093 --> 01:11:44,573
Speaker 2: how on earth.

1149
01:11:45,093 --> 01:11:50,853
Speaker 3: How on earth had this happened? Government schools. Teacher unions

1150
01:11:50,853 --> 01:11:54,573
Speaker 3: are some of the strongest unions in this country. They

1151
01:11:54,573 --> 01:12:00,053
Speaker 3: have really rolled a lot of the opposition. They've turned

1152
01:12:00,093 --> 01:12:03,333
Speaker 3: the schools, and especially in big cities where the schools

1153
01:12:03,373 --> 01:12:06,013
Speaker 3: are worse, where kids are at least likely to learn

1154
01:12:06,053 --> 01:12:09,733
Speaker 3: how to read to teacher unions have got the almost

1155
01:12:09,813 --> 01:12:13,373
Speaker 3: unlimited sway and it's it was fascinating to see how

1156
01:12:13,413 --> 01:12:16,853
Speaker 3: they shut down. There were all these protests by teachers

1157
01:12:16,893 --> 01:12:20,613
Speaker 3: they would have Teachers were outraged that they would have

1158
01:12:20,693 --> 01:12:24,013
Speaker 3: any risk when they went back to school during the pandemic.

1159
01:12:24,413 --> 01:12:27,173
Speaker 3: I mean, other workers had to accept the risk, but

1160
01:12:27,613 --> 01:12:31,213
Speaker 3: the teachers wanted to have their full salary and have

1161
01:12:31,373 --> 01:12:36,053
Speaker 3: these zoom classes where that were a complete failure and

1162
01:12:36,093 --> 01:12:38,973
Speaker 3: it did the greatest harm to low income kids that

1163
01:12:39,133 --> 01:12:42,973
Speaker 3: might not have good internet connections. So and then there's

1164
01:12:43,013 --> 01:12:46,213
Speaker 3: the other thing that the that the schools have gone

1165
01:12:46,333 --> 01:12:50,373
Speaker 3: on a crusade they are ignoring, like the phonics method

1166
01:12:50,453 --> 01:12:53,533
Speaker 3: for teaching reading, part of the reason that reading skills

1167
01:12:53,533 --> 01:12:57,213
Speaker 3: have gone so bad here, and instead they're just encouraging

1168
01:12:57,293 --> 01:13:00,773
Speaker 3: kids in kindergarten to question their own gender. I mean,

1169
01:13:00,853 --> 01:13:03,773
Speaker 3: this is this is I mean, it's a full employment

1170
01:13:03,853 --> 01:13:07,693
Speaker 3: program for therapists and it's an absolute travesy and there's

1171
01:13:07,733 --> 01:13:10,173
Speaker 3: so many loud is being messed up by this, and it's.

1172
01:13:10,013 --> 01:13:15,773
Speaker 2: An insanity yep. So the latest book, which came out

1173
01:13:16,653 --> 01:13:22,053
Speaker 2: a few months ago, is called Last Rights based on

1174
01:13:22,213 --> 01:13:27,653
Speaker 2: the book Thirty years Ago, Lost Rights, Last Rights, the

1175
01:13:27,733 --> 01:13:31,573
Speaker 2: Death of American Liberty. Why would why would people in

1176
01:13:31,613 --> 01:13:35,853
Speaker 2: this part of the world, New Zealand, Australia. I got

1177
01:13:36,173 --> 01:13:39,013
Speaker 2: a reasonable audience in America too, by the way, But

1178
01:13:39,853 --> 01:13:42,613
Speaker 2: in this part of the world, why would they know?

1179
01:13:42,853 --> 01:13:43,013
Speaker 4: Not?

1180
01:13:43,053 --> 01:13:45,533
Speaker 2: Why what would they get from reading that book?

1181
01:13:47,533 --> 01:13:51,813
Speaker 3: I think it'd be of interest to anyone in English

1182
01:13:51,813 --> 01:13:56,253
Speaker 3: speaking nations or other nations where you've got democratic or

1183
01:13:56,413 --> 01:14:00,613
Speaker 3: semi democratic nations where the government is seizing so much power,

1184
01:14:00,933 --> 01:14:04,493
Speaker 3: it's making a travacy of the constitution and people's rights

1185
01:14:04,533 --> 01:14:08,613
Speaker 3: are being lost every passing year. There are a lot

1186
01:14:08,653 --> 01:14:12,533
Speaker 3: of parallels. Uh, for instance, the the the chapter in

1187
01:14:12,573 --> 01:14:16,053
Speaker 3: the book Last Rice on COVID policy, a lot of

1188
01:14:16,053 --> 01:14:19,573
Speaker 3: parallels to what happened in Australia and New Zealand. Same

1189
01:14:19,613 --> 01:14:22,213
Speaker 3: type of hissoria we had Fauci here. I'm sure there

1190
01:14:22,213 --> 01:14:25,933
Speaker 3: were other demagogues in Australians in some of these states.

1191
01:14:26,133 --> 01:14:28,453
Speaker 3: Is it called states, provinces.

1192
01:14:28,173 --> 01:14:30,213
Speaker 2: States states in Australia.

1193
01:14:30,093 --> 01:14:32,533
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I mean there were a couple of states

1194
01:14:32,613 --> 01:14:34,853
Speaker 3: I was reading about and it was just it was

1195
01:14:34,973 --> 01:14:38,053
Speaker 3: bizarre how far the power stretched, and.

1196
01:14:37,853 --> 01:14:40,933
Speaker 2: That would have been Victoria just for a stop.

1197
01:14:41,933 --> 01:14:44,973
Speaker 3: Okay. Well, and there's the the chapter and gun control

1198
01:14:45,013 --> 01:14:48,333
Speaker 3: in there. I've got a discussion on the Second Amendment

1199
01:14:48,733 --> 01:14:52,733
Speaker 3: that talks about how firearms are a are an insurance

1200
01:14:52,733 --> 01:14:56,493
Speaker 3: policy against tyranny, because if the government takes away all

1201
01:14:56,533 --> 01:15:02,453
Speaker 3: your means means to resist, then your your cannon fodder

1202
01:15:02,493 --> 01:15:05,213
Speaker 3: for them. They can do whatever they want. And it's

1203
01:15:05,253 --> 01:15:08,613
Speaker 3: something the Founding Father is recognized. There's some one wonderful

1204
01:15:08,693 --> 01:15:11,933
Speaker 3: quotes from early American history because this is how the

1205
01:15:11,973 --> 01:15:15,933
Speaker 3: Americans beat the British in the seventeen seventies and seventeen eighties.

1206
01:15:16,253 --> 01:15:19,173
Speaker 3: But it's almost as if we're supposed to hate guns

1207
01:15:19,213 --> 01:15:23,293
Speaker 3: because people might resist the garment. But you know, if

1208
01:15:23,373 --> 01:15:25,773
Speaker 3: you look at history, there's a lot of garments that

1209
01:15:25,853 --> 01:15:26,853
Speaker 3: deserve resisting.

1210
01:15:27,533 --> 01:15:33,053
Speaker 2: Absolutely true, Jim. It's been well over now and it's

1211
01:15:33,093 --> 01:15:35,893
Speaker 2: been most enjoyable. I feel like I want to go

1212
01:15:35,933 --> 01:15:39,733
Speaker 2: on for longer, but I shan't stress you, but we'll

1213
01:15:39,733 --> 01:15:43,013
Speaker 2: do it again, hopefully in another three years. It's been

1214
01:15:43,053 --> 01:15:43,773
Speaker 2: a privilege.

1215
01:15:44,133 --> 01:15:47,213
Speaker 3: Oh well, it's a privilege for me to talk to

1216
01:15:47,253 --> 01:15:53,293
Speaker 3: such a great host who's famous, famous in multiple countries

1217
01:15:53,733 --> 01:15:58,733
Speaker 3: for your long record of top quality stuff. So and

1218
01:15:58,813 --> 01:16:01,653
Speaker 3: thanks for your thoughtful questions that pushed me to think

1219
01:16:01,693 --> 01:16:04,213
Speaker 3: a little bit and almost push me to the edge

1220
01:16:04,213 --> 01:16:08,293
Speaker 3: of my cynicism. That would be a victory or perhaps

1221
01:16:09,493 --> 01:16:13,293
Speaker 3: so Thank you and you take care, thanks so much

1222
01:16:13,333 --> 01:16:13,893
Speaker 3: having me on.

1223
01:16:14,093 --> 01:16:14,693
Speaker 2: Thank you Jack.

1224
01:16:30,893 --> 01:16:31,053
Speaker 4: Now.

1225
01:16:31,093 --> 01:16:33,173
Speaker 2: The name of the company is Wet and Forget, and

1226
01:16:33,213 --> 01:16:36,533
Speaker 2: we all know why because the original product that Wet

1227
01:16:36,533 --> 01:16:39,533
Speaker 2: and Forget began to produce was Wet and Forget Moss

1228
01:16:39,573 --> 01:16:42,173
Speaker 2: and mold remover. But there's two kinds of Wet and

1229
01:16:42,213 --> 01:16:44,733
Speaker 2: Forget that you can purchase. There is the Wet and Forget,

1230
01:16:44,733 --> 01:16:47,333
Speaker 2: the original moss and mold remover, and there is the

1231
01:16:47,653 --> 01:16:50,893
Speaker 2: rapid application Wet and Forget. Now they have exactly the

1232
01:16:50,893 --> 01:16:54,213
Speaker 2: same active ingredient and they'll cover a similar area. It

1233
01:16:54,293 --> 01:16:59,413
Speaker 2: is only the actual application using the revolutionary reach nozzle

1234
01:16:59,733 --> 01:17:03,373
Speaker 2: that is so different. Rapid Application is non caustic and

1235
01:17:03,413 --> 01:17:07,653
Speaker 2: non acidic, and it contains absolutely no bleach none. Rapid

1236
01:17:07,653 --> 01:17:11,133
Speaker 2: Application is your concentrate and garden sprayer all in one.

1237
01:17:11,333 --> 01:17:14,973
Speaker 2: The most outstanding feature of Rapid Application is its reach nozzle,

1238
01:17:15,333 --> 01:17:18,853
Speaker 2: with its unparalleled reach of eight meters or if you like,

1239
01:17:18,893 --> 01:17:22,853
Speaker 2: two stories without using a ladder for a large concrete driveways, paths,

1240
01:17:22,853 --> 01:17:25,693
Speaker 2: et cetera. A quick change on the revolutionary reach novel

1241
01:17:26,013 --> 01:17:30,253
Speaker 2: gives you an incredibly fast application, more than fifty times

1242
01:17:30,293 --> 01:17:32,333
Speaker 2: that of a garden sprayer. So where do you get

1243
01:17:32,453 --> 01:17:36,213
Speaker 2: Wet and Forget? From Wet and Forgets over twenty standalone

1244
01:17:36,253 --> 01:17:39,533
Speaker 2: company stores nationwide. You can order online at wetinfiget dot

1245
01:17:39,573 --> 01:17:42,013
Speaker 2: co dot NZ ring them eight hundred and three zero

1246
01:17:42,133 --> 01:17:44,733
Speaker 2: three thousand, and don't forget. You can buy Wet and

1247
01:17:44,773 --> 01:17:48,093
Speaker 2: Forget in America, Britain, Australia and of course the Homeland,

1248
01:17:48,133 --> 01:18:00,093
Speaker 2: New Zealand. Now it's no fun doing the mail room

1249
01:18:00,093 --> 01:18:01,973
Speaker 2: on your own. It's not what it was intended for.

1250
01:18:02,373 --> 01:18:06,413
Speaker 2: But here are a couple maybe three letters that I

1251
01:18:06,493 --> 01:18:10,893
Speaker 2: shall dispatch my missus producer will be back in a

1252
01:18:10,893 --> 01:18:14,093
Speaker 2: couple of weeks. I watched the first twenty twenty four

1253
01:18:14,093 --> 01:18:17,533
Speaker 2: American presidential debate twice because I couldn't believe what I

1254
01:18:17,613 --> 01:18:21,933
Speaker 2: saw the first time round. I couldn't believe how unbiased

1255
01:18:22,013 --> 01:18:25,373
Speaker 2: the CNN moderators were. They gave reasonably fair treatment to

1256
01:18:25,373 --> 01:18:29,213
Speaker 2: both Trump and Biden. Secondly, I couldn't believe how bad

1257
01:18:29,293 --> 01:18:32,013
Speaker 2: Biden was. He was like a man with stage four

1258
01:18:32,053 --> 01:18:36,933
Speaker 2: Alzheimer's stuttering repeatedly and forgetting what he was saying mid sentence. Thirdly,

1259
01:18:37,173 --> 01:18:40,733
Speaker 2: I couldn't believe how witty Trump was. He was smashing

1260
01:18:40,733 --> 01:18:44,853
Speaker 2: back funny zingers and memorable one liners at a sitting

1261
01:18:44,893 --> 01:18:49,293
Speaker 2: possum that was Biden. Biden was the possum to Trump's headlights.

1262
01:18:49,813 --> 01:18:53,533
Speaker 2: In a post debate analysis, Daily Wire's CEO said something

1263
01:18:53,613 --> 01:18:57,333
Speaker 2: utterly profound. He said something along the following lines. Donald

1264
01:18:57,373 --> 01:19:01,293
Speaker 2: Trump initially ran for president in twenty sixteen, expecting he'd lose,

1265
01:19:01,933 --> 01:19:05,453
Speaker 2: and he won. Trump then ran for president in twenty twenty,

1266
01:19:05,493 --> 01:19:09,573
Speaker 2: expecting he'd win, and he lost. Trump now runs for

1267
01:19:09,653 --> 01:19:14,293
Speaker 2: president in twenty twenty four knowing he has to win. Indeed,

1268
01:19:14,333 --> 01:19:18,213
Speaker 2: if Biden or Kamada Harris wins the twenty twenty four election,

1269
01:19:18,813 --> 01:19:23,133
Speaker 2: America will lose her very soul. And then, on a

1270
01:19:23,133 --> 01:19:26,133
Speaker 2: completely different note, did you hear Tucker Carlson's brutal one

1271
01:19:26,213 --> 01:19:31,573
Speaker 2: liner on Jacinda Adern at his recent speech in Australia? Wow?

1272
01:19:31,773 --> 01:19:36,093
Speaker 2: Talk about zingers? I think I did, actually, but a

1273
01:19:36,093 --> 01:19:40,573
Speaker 2: couple of comments. Couldn't believe how unbiased the CNN moderators were.

1274
01:19:41,013 --> 01:19:44,173
Speaker 2: They gave fairly. They gave reasonably fair treatment to both

1275
01:19:44,213 --> 01:19:48,973
Speaker 2: Trump and Biden. True, that was my feeling too. Then

1276
01:19:49,053 --> 01:19:52,173
Speaker 2: somebody drew attention to the fact that there were and

1277
01:19:52,213 --> 01:19:55,333
Speaker 2: I can't remember the numbers now, how many questions twenty

1278
01:19:55,373 --> 01:20:00,213
Speaker 2: two questions, I think, And there were percentages of questions

1279
01:20:00,213 --> 01:20:05,013
Speaker 2: that were directed favorably for Biden, and the number that

1280
01:20:05,093 --> 01:20:09,053
Speaker 2: were favorable towards towards Trump were far fewer. I can't

1281
01:20:09,093 --> 01:20:11,413
Speaker 2: remember the numbers, but you get my drift. The other

1282
01:20:11,493 --> 01:20:13,853
Speaker 2: point was that he was like a man was a

1283
01:20:13,933 --> 01:20:18,253
Speaker 2: stage for Alzheimer's. No, he's more advanced than that. Apparently,

1284
01:20:18,813 --> 01:20:22,973
Speaker 2: what I gather he is in stage five. The estimation

1285
01:20:23,173 --> 01:20:28,533
Speaker 2: is that he's in stage five of seven stages of Alzheimer's.

1286
01:20:28,933 --> 01:20:32,973
Speaker 2: So not a good look now from Eileen. The father

1287
01:20:33,053 --> 01:20:37,253
Speaker 2: of communism, Karl Marx defined communism as the abolition of

1288
01:20:37,293 --> 01:20:40,773
Speaker 2: private property. So do we really want to enact animal

1289
01:20:40,813 --> 01:20:43,893
Speaker 2: farm here in New Zealand? Good luck for the future

1290
01:20:43,933 --> 01:20:47,693
Speaker 2: of our food production under that hammer. Climate change Marxists

1291
01:20:47,773 --> 01:20:52,013
Speaker 2: are essentially social activists, posing as guardians of the environment

1292
01:20:52,413 --> 01:20:57,693
Speaker 2: while they live up large as Champagne socialists, big carbon

1293
01:20:57,733 --> 01:21:01,773
Speaker 2: footprints in their designer footwear as well dedicated followers of

1294
01:21:01,853 --> 01:21:07,773
Speaker 2: fast Fashion with a special twist lurid green hypocrisy. Well,

1295
01:21:08,693 --> 01:21:13,533
Speaker 2: I don't know that the Champagne socialists Chardonnay, maybe not Champagne.

1296
01:21:13,573 --> 01:21:17,413
Speaker 2: I don't think they could afford Champagne, and I suppose

1297
01:21:17,413 --> 01:21:21,373
Speaker 2: if they did have it, it was probably shoplisted, if

1298
01:21:21,373 --> 01:21:24,333
Speaker 2: you get my drift. And then, finally, in this very

1299
01:21:24,333 --> 01:21:27,413
Speaker 2: short mail room, thank you both for the podcast, but

1300
01:21:27,493 --> 01:21:31,493
Speaker 2: please don't bring mister Trump into the conversations. Sorry to

1301
01:21:31,533 --> 01:21:34,053
Speaker 2: say it makes me wonder if you're getting contributions to

1302
01:21:34,133 --> 01:21:37,533
Speaker 2: include him and shore up support while we've got an

1303
01:21:37,573 --> 01:21:41,373
Speaker 2: audience in the US, I don't think the numbers are

1304
01:21:41,413 --> 01:21:44,453
Speaker 2: big enough to make a difference. I'm desperately wanting New

1305
01:21:44,533 --> 01:21:46,733
Speaker 2: Zealanders to take on board a lot of what is

1306
01:21:46,813 --> 01:21:50,213
Speaker 2: talked about in your podcasts, and I occasionally forward them

1307
01:21:50,693 --> 01:21:52,853
Speaker 2: in the hope that they make a difference or at

1308
01:21:52,933 --> 01:21:56,773
Speaker 2: least in form because we can't rely on our media.

1309
01:21:57,493 --> 01:22:00,053
Speaker 2: Having Trump as an opening topic would put a lot

1310
01:22:00,093 --> 01:22:03,693
Speaker 2: of people off, and rightly so. Yes, most of us

1311
01:22:03,693 --> 01:22:06,253
Speaker 2: don't know much about American politics, but what we do

1312
01:22:06,413 --> 01:22:10,693
Speaker 2: know is in the past your subject has proven over

1313
01:22:10,853 --> 01:22:15,253
Speaker 2: and over his arrogance, and in my book, humility is

1314
01:22:15,293 --> 01:22:18,333
Speaker 2: a far greater trait. Thank you again and hoping you'll

1315
01:22:18,373 --> 01:22:20,773
Speaker 2: stick to the huge concerns that we have here in

1316
01:22:20,813 --> 01:22:23,933
Speaker 2: our own country. Look forward to your next podcast. Very

1317
01:22:23,973 --> 01:22:27,973
Speaker 2: grateful for Oliver Hart, which is perspective and experience. Sincerely

1318
01:22:28,053 --> 01:22:31,133
Speaker 2: hope he stays put and doesn't add to the brain drain.

1319
01:22:31,173 --> 01:22:31,333
Speaker 3: Well.

1320
01:22:31,373 --> 01:22:34,453
Speaker 2: I concur with you on that point, and I can

1321
01:22:34,493 --> 01:22:36,933
Speaker 2: only suggest that you're going to have to be selective

1322
01:22:37,213 --> 01:22:40,933
Speaker 2: in what you forward on because Trump is going to

1323
01:22:40,973 --> 01:22:45,293
Speaker 2: feature ever more so in the next few months. It

1324
01:22:45,373 --> 01:22:48,573
Speaker 2: is unavoidable, and there is good reason for it too.

1325
01:22:49,013 --> 01:22:52,053
Speaker 2: And I hope that you enjoyed the interview today. You

1326
01:22:52,093 --> 01:22:54,893
Speaker 2: say that most New Zealanders or many New Zealanders don't Yes,

1327
01:22:54,933 --> 01:22:58,293
Speaker 2: most of us don't know much about American politics. I've

1328
01:22:58,333 --> 01:23:01,933
Speaker 2: worked over the years to try and assist in that regard.

1329
01:23:02,493 --> 01:23:05,613
Speaker 2: Maybe I'm failing, And that would appear to be the

1330
01:23:05,693 --> 01:23:09,853
Speaker 2: right place and time to introduce the article that I

1331
01:23:09,853 --> 01:23:14,333
Speaker 2: may mention of the introduction with regard to the decision

1332
01:23:14,413 --> 01:23:18,973
Speaker 2: by the Supreme Court as it's called this historic Presidential

1333
01:23:19,053 --> 01:23:23,893
Speaker 2: Immunity decision, and the author is Jonathan Turley, who is

1334
01:23:23,933 --> 01:23:27,493
Speaker 2: a very successful professor of law. He is a Democrat,

1335
01:23:27,853 --> 01:23:30,653
Speaker 2: has been a democrat, is still a Democrat. But he

1336
01:23:30,693 --> 01:23:34,733
Speaker 2: has to be about the most intelligent Democrat that exists anyway.

1337
01:23:35,293 --> 01:23:37,413
Speaker 2: He is more concerned, I think, than anything else with

1338
01:23:37,533 --> 01:23:43,293
Speaker 2: the Constitution and its retention in its original form at

1339
01:23:43,293 --> 01:23:49,093
Speaker 2: appropriate interpretations thereof. He writes columns for various organizations, including

1340
01:23:49,173 --> 01:23:52,533
Speaker 2: The New York Post, and this is where this particular

1341
01:23:52,613 --> 01:23:55,373
Speaker 2: article finished. He has a prelude on his website to this,

1342
01:23:55,733 --> 01:23:59,813
Speaker 2: but I think I should cut straight to the column itself.

1343
01:24:00,293 --> 01:24:03,933
Speaker 2: Within minutes of the Supreme Court's decision on presidential immunity,

1344
01:24:04,853 --> 01:24:09,013
Speaker 2: liberal politicians and pundits seem to move from hyperpose to

1345
01:24:09,213 --> 01:24:14,653
Speaker 2: hyperventilation when not breathing into paperbags. Critics predicted again the

1346
01:24:15,013 --> 01:24:19,333
Speaker 2: end of the republic. CNN's Van Jones declared that it

1347
01:24:19,973 --> 01:24:23,813
Speaker 2: was quote almost a license to thug in a way.

1348
01:24:24,413 --> 01:24:29,533
Speaker 2: Senator Richard Blumenthal declared, my stomach turns with fear and

1349
01:24:29,653 --> 01:24:33,453
Speaker 2: anger that our democracy can be so endangered by an

1350
01:24:33,493 --> 01:24:37,973
Speaker 2: out of controled court close quote, and denounced six justices

1351
01:24:38,093 --> 01:24:43,733
Speaker 2: as extreme and nakedly partisan hacks politicians in robes. Limenthal

1352
01:24:43,773 --> 01:24:47,533
Speaker 2: has previously shown greater intestinal fortitude as when he threatened

1353
01:24:47,533 --> 01:24:51,333
Speaker 2: the justices that they would either rule as Democrats demanded

1354
01:24:51,933 --> 01:24:55,893
Speaker 2: or face seismic changes to their court. Jones warned the

1355
01:24:56,013 --> 01:25:00,093
Speaker 2: justices that politically it's bad for them to rule this way.

1356
01:25:00,413 --> 01:25:05,733
Speaker 2: The comment captures the misguided analysis of many media outlets.

1357
01:25:06,533 --> 01:25:10,453
Speaker 2: The Supreme Court was designed to be unpopular to take

1358
01:25:10,573 --> 01:25:16,973
Speaker 2: stands that are politically unpopular but constitutionally correct. Indeed, Democrats

1359
01:25:16,973 --> 01:25:19,333
Speaker 2: have become the very threat that the Court was meant

1360
01:25:19,333 --> 01:25:23,653
Speaker 2: to resist. Recently, senators demanded the Chief Justice, John Roberts

1361
01:25:23,733 --> 01:25:28,333
Speaker 2: peer to answer to them for his decisions. Roberts wisely declined.

1362
01:25:28,773 --> 01:25:32,093
Speaker 2: Senate Majority leader Chuck Schumer previously declared in front of

1363
01:25:32,133 --> 01:25:34,533
Speaker 2: the Supreme Court, this is out the front of the building.

1364
01:25:34,933 --> 01:25:37,333
Speaker 2: I want to tell you Gossich. I want to tell

1365
01:25:37,413 --> 01:25:41,213
Speaker 2: you Kavanagh, you have released the whirlwind and you will

1366
01:25:41,253 --> 01:25:45,013
Speaker 2: pay the price. Leveling threats at the justices of the

1367
01:25:45,053 --> 01:25:50,893
Speaker 2: Supreme Court. Now, Representative Alexandria Acasia Cortez announced that she

1368
01:25:50,973 --> 01:25:54,213
Speaker 2: will seek the impeachment of all six of the Conservative judges.

1369
01:25:54,733 --> 01:25:59,173
Speaker 2: She was immediately joined by other Democrat members. Notably, scholars

1370
01:25:59,173 --> 01:26:02,573
Speaker 2: have long disregarded where to draw the line on presidential immunity.

1371
01:26:03,053 --> 01:26:07,773
Speaker 2: The Court adopted a middle approach that rejected rejected extreme

1372
01:26:07,853 --> 01:26:12,373
Speaker 2: arguments on both sides. Yet, because Ecazio Cortez disagrees with

1373
01:26:12,413 --> 01:26:16,573
Speaker 2: their decision, she's declared that this is an assault on

1374
01:26:16,613 --> 01:26:20,213
Speaker 2: American democracy. It's up to Congress to defend our nation

1375
01:26:20,333 --> 01:26:24,893
Speaker 2: from this authoritarian gamchare. Previously, Acazio Cortez admitted that she

1376
01:26:24,933 --> 01:26:28,573
Speaker 2: doesn't understand why we even have a Supreme Court. She asked,

1377
01:26:28,813 --> 01:26:31,893
Speaker 2: how much does the current structure benefit us? I don't

1378
01:26:31,893 --> 01:26:35,493
Speaker 2: think it does. Other members, such as Senator Elizabeth Warren,

1379
01:26:36,133 --> 01:26:39,213
Speaker 2: have called for the packing of the court with additional

1380
01:26:39,213 --> 01:26:43,133
Speaker 2: members to immediately secure a liberal majority to rule as

1381
01:26:43,453 --> 01:26:48,333
Speaker 2: she desires. For these pundits and politicians, justice is merely

1382
01:26:48,373 --> 01:26:52,013
Speaker 2: an extension of politics and subject to the whims of

1383
01:26:52,053 --> 01:26:55,813
Speaker 2: the majority. These are the same voices who chastised to

1384
01:26:55,933 --> 01:27:00,173
Speaker 2: Judge Eileen Cannon for slow walking her decisions by holding

1385
01:27:00,253 --> 01:27:05,573
Speaker 2: hearings on constitutional questions. They pointed to Judge Tanya Chutkam,

1386
01:27:05,773 --> 01:27:09,093
Speaker 2: who supported the efforts of Special Counsel Jacksmith to try

1387
01:27:09,133 --> 01:27:14,253
Speaker 2: Trump before the election, turning her court into a rockets docket. Indeed,

1388
01:27:14,493 --> 01:27:18,533
Speaker 2: at the oral argument. Chief Justice Roberts marveled at the

1389
01:27:18,653 --> 01:27:24,253
Speaker 2: conclusory analysis by Patricia Ann Millet in upholding Chutkin. He

1390
01:27:24,373 --> 01:27:27,893
Speaker 2: reverred to the opinion celebrated by the left as little

1391
01:27:27,933 --> 01:27:31,933
Speaker 2: more than declaring a former president can be prosecuted because

1392
01:27:32,413 --> 01:27:36,133
Speaker 2: he's being prosecuted. Chutkin and the d C Circuit were fast,

1393
01:27:36,173 --> 01:27:39,933
Speaker 2: but ultimately wrong. Indeed, the Supreme Court noted that the

1394
01:27:40,053 --> 01:27:43,813
Speaker 2: judge created little record for the basis of her decisions.

1395
01:27:44,293 --> 01:27:48,173
Speaker 2: In a perverted sense, democrats are giving the public a

1396
01:27:48,253 --> 01:27:53,213
Speaker 2: powerful lesson in constitutional law. As Alexander Hamilton stated in

1397
01:27:53,253 --> 01:27:58,133
Speaker 2: The Federalists Number seventy eight, judicial independence is the best

1398
01:27:58,213 --> 01:28:02,253
Speaker 2: expedient which can be devised in any government to secure

1399
01:28:02,333 --> 01:28:08,093
Speaker 2: a steady, upright, and impartial administration of laws. This is

1400
01:28:08,093 --> 01:28:11,493
Speaker 2: the moment that the Framers envisaged in creating the Court

1401
01:28:11,733 --> 01:28:14,933
Speaker 2: under Article three of the Constitution. It would be our

1402
01:28:14,973 --> 01:28:19,773
Speaker 2: bulwark even when politicians lose faith in our constitution and

1403
01:28:19,893 --> 01:28:24,173
Speaker 2: seek to dictate justice for those who they dislike. In

1404
01:28:24,213 --> 01:28:26,933
Speaker 2: my new book, The Indispensable Right Free Speech in an

1405
01:28:26,933 --> 01:28:30,693
Speaker 2: Age of Rage, I discuss other such moments in our history.

1406
01:28:31,173 --> 01:28:34,373
Speaker 2: This is not our first age of rage, During periods

1407
01:28:34,373 --> 01:28:37,773
Speaker 2: of intense fear or anger, people often turn on free

1408
01:28:37,773 --> 01:28:42,573
Speaker 2: speech and other rights as inconvenient and outdated. We've heard

1409
01:28:42,573 --> 01:28:47,413
Speaker 2: the same voices of the faithless today. MSNBC commentator Eli

1410
01:28:47,493 --> 01:28:51,573
Speaker 2: Mistel has called the Constitution trash, and I argued that

1411
01:28:51,613 --> 01:28:56,013
Speaker 2: we should simply dump it. Law professors Ryan Doffler of

1412
01:28:56,093 --> 01:28:59,933
Speaker 2: Harvard and Samuel Moyne of Yale called for the Constitution

1413
01:29:00,133 --> 01:29:06,533
Speaker 2: to be radically altered to reclaim America from constitutionalism. None

1414
01:29:06,533 --> 01:29:10,053
Speaker 2: of these threats or bloviating will work. The Court is

1415
01:29:10,093 --> 01:29:15,253
Speaker 2: designed to stand against everyone and everything except the Constitution.

1416
01:29:16,173 --> 01:29:20,733
Speaker 2: It was forged for this moment, and Jonathan Turley is

1417
01:29:20,773 --> 01:29:25,413
Speaker 2: the JB. And Borris C. Shapiro Professor of Public Interest

1418
01:29:25,533 --> 01:29:29,213
Speaker 2: Law at the George Washington University School of Law. I

1419
01:29:29,213 --> 01:29:32,613
Speaker 2: think that column lays it out as well as anybody

1420
01:29:32,653 --> 01:29:37,813
Speaker 2: can on what the situation is, why it's happening, and

1421
01:29:37,973 --> 01:29:40,933
Speaker 2: why the Constitution is what term what matters more than

1422
01:29:41,053 --> 01:29:44,893
Speaker 2: anything else. It's been a very, very busy week on

1423
01:29:44,933 --> 01:29:47,413
Speaker 2: the news front, and I can only imagine it's going

1424
01:29:47,453 --> 01:29:51,333
Speaker 2: to be maintained for a period of time. So we

1425
01:29:51,333 --> 01:29:53,413
Speaker 2: shall see what happens in the next few days. And

1426
01:29:54,853 --> 01:29:57,653
Speaker 2: as much that could, and take our leave from two

1427
01:29:57,693 --> 01:30:00,573
Speaker 2: forty five. So if you'd like to correspond with us

1428
01:30:00,733 --> 01:30:04,293
Speaker 2: Layton at NEWSTALKSB dot co dot NZ, Latin at newstalks

1429
01:30:04,293 --> 01:30:07,693
Speaker 2: AB dot co dot NZ, or Carolyn at NEWSTALKSZNB dot

1430
01:30:07,693 --> 01:30:11,413
Speaker 2: co dot com in Z. We shall return for podcast

1431
01:30:11,453 --> 01:30:15,573
Speaker 2: two hundred and forty six very shortly. Until then, as always,

1432
01:30:16,173 --> 01:30:18,173
Speaker 2: thank you for listening and we'll talk soon.

1433
01:30:26,093 --> 01:30:29,813
Speaker 1: Thank you for more from News Talks ed B. Listen

1434
01:30:29,893 --> 01:30:32,853
Speaker 1: live on air or online, and keep our shows with

1435
01:30:32,933 --> 01:30:36,093
Speaker 1: you wherever you go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio