Speaker 1: Hilda.
Speaker 2: I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page, a
Speaker 2: daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. Your chance
Speaker 2: of winning powerball is one in thirty eight million.
Speaker 1: And it could be about to get a lot harder.
Speaker 2: The Herald has revealed Lotto and z bosses are keen
Speaker 2: to increase the number of balls in the powerball draw
Speaker 2: and are already seeking permission from the government for what
Speaker 2: has been described as a matrix change for the game.
Speaker 2: But how will this affect your odds and why do
Speaker 2: they want to change the game anyway? Today on the
Speaker 2: front Page ends at Herald's senior reporter, Neil Readers here
Speaker 2: to crunch the numbers and tell us more about these
Speaker 2: potential changes on the way. So, Neil, how does the
Speaker 2: Lotto matrix currently work?
Speaker 3: At the moment?
Speaker 4: To win Powerball, you've got to have six first division
Speaker 4: numbers and then get the powerball. And at the moment
Speaker 4: there's ten balls and powerball number one through ten, and
Speaker 4: the odds of winning Lotto Powerball currently are one and
Speaker 4: thirty eight million, But potentially by twenty twenty nine that
Speaker 4: could be quite harder.
Speaker 2: So that old adage of you're more likely to die
Speaker 2: in a plane crash than win lotto.
Speaker 1: Is that still the deal?
Speaker 3: I think definitely.
Speaker 4: Our numbers guru Chris Knox ran some potential Lotto powerball
Speaker 4: changes through his matrix machine. Last time there was a
Speaker 4: powerball change was in two thousand and seven, so I
Speaker 4: went to ten balls. So currently it's one in thirty
Speaker 4: eight million with six first division numbers in the power ball.
Speaker 4: Shouldlow added an additional powerball number, the odds would decrease
Speaker 4: to one and forty two point two million on previous
Speaker 4: track records, where the previously other two numbers. If they
Speaker 4: added twelve numbers to the powerball, kissy, your odds would
Speaker 4: it would decrease even further to one and forty six million.
Speaker 4: And if the Loto en Ze bosses went all the
Speaker 4: way out and added five extra numbers to the powerball, kidd,
Speaker 4: you'll be looking at one in fifty seven point five million.
Speaker 3: So yeah, way more likely to die on a plane
Speaker 3: creation than win lotto.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So tell me about these proposed changes. What's the
Speaker 1: thinking behind it?
Speaker 4: Around the world, it's no sort of shortage of changes
Speaker 4: to different lotto games or powerball games. In particular, Australia
Speaker 4: changed their Powerball matrix in twenty eighteen in America's Mega Millions,
Speaker 4: which has got a record payout of two point five billion,
Speaker 4: which is a bit bigger than our Lotto Powerball's fifty
Speaker 4: million record. They changed their matrix simply waiting a price
Speaker 4: change earlier this year to make the tickets more expensive.
Speaker 4: Games are always looking to evolve. I think in New
Speaker 4: Zealand there's obviously added competition of sports betting now more
Speaker 4: horse betting options. Lotto end zet are very keen to
Speaker 4: make sure that they don't reduce the financial returns to
Speaker 4: the community, but via the Lotteries Trust at the moment,
Speaker 4: that's four hundred and thirty four million that they pump
Speaker 4: back into the community. So they're trying to safeguard well,
Speaker 4: they're trying to say, they're trying to safeguard both the
Speaker 4: game's financial future and also the returns to the community
Speaker 4: by making Blotto Powerball even more attractive.
Speaker 3: For the future.
Speaker 2: What are the risks here with changing it? I mean,
Speaker 2: problem gambling is a bit of an issue at the moment.
Speaker 2: It always has been. Could this be a problem?
Speaker 4: Problem gaming foundation they do, I mean, they've made no
Speaker 4: secret in the past about people being hopped on lotto.
Speaker 4: Their research, The Problem Gambling Foundation's research shows about twelve
Speaker 4: percent of their client owl who have received gambling harm
Speaker 4: treatment services, lotto was their primary mode of gambling. Just
Speaker 4: for context that that compares with fifty percent of listed
Speaker 4: playing the pokeys in nine percent said they're impacted by
Speaker 4: gambling on sports or horse racing with the TB. But
Speaker 4: I mean, definitely if these changes do have been which
Speaker 4: will mean more bigger jackpots such as the fifty million
Speaker 4: must be one, I mean, I think the Problem Gaming
Speaker 4: Foundation will be quite concerned about that. You know, a
Speaker 4: lot of people will be keen to buy tickets for
Speaker 4: the big draws.
Speaker 5: In terms of those that play all the time, there's
Speaker 5: what we call a near miss phenomenon, which is maybe
Speaker 5: I got three numbers last week or four the week before,
Speaker 5: and therefore, in my brain, I think that increases my
Speaker 5: odds of winning the big time, which we all know
Speaker 5: every time you play you back at square one.
Speaker 4: It seems while we're playing lotto, our brain's playing games
Speaker 4: with us.
Speaker 5: If I can remember other people winning the lotto, which
Speaker 5: we see all over the news, actually makes my brain
Speaker 5: I think that I've got higher chance or higher of.
Speaker 2: So there are already some rules around how the game
Speaker 2: is played. Hey at the like how much the jackpot
Speaker 2: can actually get up to? How much does it cap
Speaker 2: off at now? And if they were to add more numbers, say,
Speaker 2: have they talked about how much we could possibly win?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 4: At present, the maximum that loto can get to before
Speaker 4: it has to be struck as fifty million, so sort
Speaker 4: of jackpots every week that it's not drawn, And the
Speaker 4: mount that a jackpots kind of depends on how many
Speaker 4: tickets they sell for the previous draw. So last week
Speaker 4: you obviously rows to thirty million dollars that was split
Speaker 4: by between two lucky winners. I think that week lotoside
Speaker 4: about one point five million tickets, which is quite a
Speaker 4: big upturn on what they'd sell for say a four
Speaker 4: or a ten million dollar draw. For the figure to
Speaker 4: be the maximum payout limit to lift that would take
Speaker 4: approvabley internal affairs in the government.
Speaker 3: A lot of New Zealand aren't trying to seek that
Speaker 3: at the moment.
Speaker 4: What they are trying to work through is if they
Speaker 4: can increase the numbers and the power ball to change
Speaker 4: the matrix. But I mean, I think if you look
Speaker 4: at our powerball lot, it's fifty million. In America, you
Speaker 4: can win billions and their powerball. Australia's got a record
Speaker 4: powerball payout of one hundred and sixty two million, so
Speaker 4: we're still still kind of small frin terms of payouts.
Speaker 1: Really, what's the most someone's won in New Zealand?
Speaker 4: The record PAOUD is just over forty four million, which
Speaker 4: is pretty mouth watering and could change your life in
Speaker 4: so many ways. There have been two previous fifty million
Speaker 4: dollar jaws which have been shared by multiple winners. Twenty
Speaker 4: twenty four there were seven players that shared that fifty
Speaker 4: million prize for when they got just over seven million
Speaker 4: dollars each, which I wouldn't.
Speaker 3: Say no to seven million. I don't know if you
Speaker 3: would either. Chelsea.
Speaker 2: Well, you've spoken about some of the global lotto trends
Speaker 2: and how they compare to New Zealand. Is there any
Speaker 2: reason why, say, America goes into the billions, Australia goes
Speaker 2: over one hundred million, and why do we cap it?
Speaker 3: The big reason is population.
Speaker 4: We've got sort of a fifth of quarter of the
Speaker 4: population of Australia, so when you sort of maybe leverage
Speaker 4: it out that way, our payments. Probably maximum payment proportionally
Speaker 4: is fairly even with Australia.
Speaker 3: America or America is a whole different beast all together.
Speaker 4: Obviously a huge country which has got multiple gambling options.
Speaker 4: Probably that American dream that everyone wants to get rich there.
Speaker 4: The A Lotto games are huge over the air, and
Speaker 4: it's not just the mega millions. For New Zealand, the
Speaker 4: fifteen million limit. Part of that is to do with
Speaker 4: problem gambling. I think if it would be pretty hard argument,
Speaker 4: I think for a lot of New Zealand to put
Speaker 4: forward and I don't know even if they want to
Speaker 4: put it forward to increase that level. I think if
Speaker 4: they did, they're probably be quite a bit of blowback
Speaker 4: from Problem Gambling Foundation and other community organizations about the
Speaker 4: potential risks that could could pose with gambling traits.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that makes sense because I saw that the forty
Speaker 2: four million dollar one that was in twenty sixteen in
Speaker 2: November that was actually the greatest number of tickets sold
Speaker 2: for a draw was that draw. And I suppose as
Speaker 2: soon as it gets up to fifty everyone, even even
Speaker 2: people who don't usually buy a Lotto tickets want to
Speaker 2: get involved.
Speaker 4: Hey, absolutely, family's going away on holidays, always want to
Speaker 4: buy a ticket for those big draws when they're in
Speaker 4: a different place.
Speaker 3: For luck.
Speaker 4: Last weekend when Lotto had thirty million, it's the first
Speaker 4: time for a while that has actually been sort of
Speaker 4: if you drive past lot of outlets, and I did,
Speaker 4: there were lines and queues outside some of the lotto
Speaker 4: sellers at supermarkets and different places around town.
Speaker 3: When it really does drive a bus.
Speaker 4: I remember sort of the other those two weekends when
Speaker 4: there were fifty million dollar draws.
Speaker 3: It was massive.
Speaker 4: You know, they'd be driving past a stationary store or
Speaker 4: bookshop or a supermarket and gave sort of lines of
Speaker 4: ten twenty people longer waiting to get a ticket to
Speaker 4: potentially change their life.
Speaker 6: Wouldn't I have got the money I put all the
Speaker 6: tune deposits, which was suggested by the Lotto commission. Then
Speaker 6: I started getting all these friends coming in and people
Speaker 6: and people are asking me, and these new people I
Speaker 6: didn't even know, and hey, can I have, can I have?
Speaker 1: Can I borrow?
Speaker 6: Can I learn? And I was doing I was giving them,
Speaker 6: I was answering them, and all of a sudden, have
Speaker 6: got too much. I'm not seeing the results of what
Speaker 6: they wanted the money for and things like that. So
Speaker 6: that sort of turned me upside down of it. I
Speaker 6: sort of had to stop doing that, and I felt
Speaker 6: quite distinct stopping that.
Speaker 2: And of course we've heard some horror stories, but also
Speaker 2: some real success stories from winners.
Speaker 1: It really depends what kind of road you go down.
Speaker 2: Hey, I mean, you hear stories and I'm thinking of
Speaker 2: one in the UK, I think where somebody won lotto
Speaker 2: and just completely wasted all their money. I mean it's heartbreaking.
Speaker 2: And you see those kinds of things in the news A.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, I think the things you imagine.
Speaker 4: I mean, if I won touch Wood forty million dollars,
Speaker 4: it would change my life. And most people just aren't
Speaker 4: prepared for that overnight sensation of, you know, never having
Speaker 4: to work again. Really, you know, some people there's been
Speaker 4: winners in New Zealand that have taught previously confidentially about
Speaker 4: it that people came out of the woodwork that you
Speaker 4: didn't really know before. They want money, you're not used
Speaker 4: to budgeting for what to do with it. I think
Speaker 4: a lot of news doing a lot more proactive now
Speaker 4: than maybe what they were earlier on. I know it's
Speaker 4: the big winners they're given opportunities for counseling, for financial literacy,
Speaker 4: the Office of Financial Coaching. You know what potentially what
Speaker 4: to do with their money in terms of what your
Speaker 4: ISSUA could invest in. But you think, sort of if
Speaker 4: your bank account went from Jesus one hundred and fifty
Speaker 4: bucks in your bank account on a Saturday morning to
Speaker 4: potentially thirty million dollars when your bank your winning ticket
Speaker 4: and it's it's a hell of a life style change.
Speaker 4: It'd be pretty hard not to go on a bit
Speaker 4: of a slurge. I know, I'd probably buy a couple
Speaker 4: of nice cars and go on holiday and waste the rest.
Speaker 1: Of it and give me a couple of meal, wouldn't you?
Speaker 3: Absolutely? Chelsea?
Speaker 2: How do you think that these changes might go down
Speaker 2: with the general public? Noil, I think we all know
Speaker 2: that people are obsessed with lotto at the moment. Do
Speaker 2: you think a bigger jackpop could outweigh a harder chance
Speaker 2: of winning.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a.
Speaker 4: Real cruck sort of if these number change the matrix
Speaker 4: change goes ahead, Loto were very happen with me when
Speaker 4: I talk to them that a matrix change of me
Speaker 4: at a be tougher to win lotto when it's like
Speaker 4: a four million dollar draw, six million dollar draw, et cetera,
Speaker 4: et cetera.
Speaker 3: But the flip side is that there are going to
Speaker 3: be bigger, more regular, bigger jackpots.
Speaker 4: So and the last almost decad there's only been two
Speaker 4: fifty million dollar draws. You could have a fifty million
Speaker 4: dollar drawer every year, potentially every couple of years, which
Speaker 4: is what Lotto would love to have. I think that
Speaker 4: the punters would definitely like it. I think the dream
Speaker 4: of getting rich from Lotto. People probably stick with Lotto
Speaker 4: if they think that he you know, is a chance
Speaker 4: we could win, they get even though it's probably least
Speaker 4: likely we're going to win the big prize every week
Speaker 4: or for for six million dollars every weekend of course
Speaker 4: is that they're going to change Powerball, so things with
Speaker 4: like fierce Division or strike for those other options won't
Speaker 4: be changing.
Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us, Neil.
Speaker 2: Lotto and Z's chief innovation and product Officer Ben Coney
Speaker 2: said the ideas about evolving the game so that it
Speaker 2: can remain compelling to players. The prize value is not
Speaker 2: eroded through inflation, and the odds of winning move in
Speaker 2: line with population growth.
Speaker 1: He said, Our enduring interest is.
Speaker 2: In having a powerball game that is appealing to our customers,
Speaker 2: generates consistent profit for distribution to the community, and allows
Speaker 2: for responsible growth over time. The details of exactly what
Speaker 2: they'll change and what it would mean for customers is
Speaker 2: still to be confirmed, as they are subject to regulatory
Speaker 2: consultation and ministerial approval. That's it for this episode of
Speaker 2: The Front Page. You can read more about today's stories
Speaker 2: and extensive news coverage at enzedherld dot co dot nz.
Speaker 2: The Front Page is produced by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin,
Speaker 2: who is also our sound engineer.
Speaker 1: I'm Chelsea Daniels.
Speaker 2: Subscribe to The Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you
Speaker 2: get your podcasts, and tune in tomorrow for another look
Speaker 2: behind the headlines.