WEBVTT - Stadium wars set to continue - but which venue is really the best for Auckland? 0:00:06.360 --> 0:00:06.760 Gilda. 0:00:06.840 --> 0:00:10.040 I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page, a 0:00:10.119 --> 0:00:18.120 daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. The so 0:00:18.320 --> 0:00:22.640 called stadium wars in Auckland have been raging quietly. 0:00:22.280 --> 0:00:25.280 Behind the scenes for several years now. 0:00:25.040 --> 0:00:27.760 But last week the battle popped up in the public 0:00:27.880 --> 0:00:31.600 once again, with Auckland Council voting to throw at support 0:00:31.680 --> 0:00:35.160 behind a plan to upgrade Eden Park over the proposed 0:00:35.479 --> 0:00:38.800 new stadium on the city's waterfront. Eden Park may have 0:00:38.840 --> 0:00:42.640 won on the day, but questions remain over how the 0:00:42.760 --> 0:00:46.400 upgrades will be funded, while the government still needs to 0:00:46.440 --> 0:00:49.680 weigh in on which project to support ends at. Herald 0:00:49.760 --> 0:00:53.400 sports writer Michael Burgess has been following these discussions for 0:00:53.560 --> 0:00:56.360 over a decade and joins us today on the Front 0:00:56.360 --> 0:00:58.760 Page to dig into what this latest. 0:00:58.440 --> 0:01:00.360 Vote means in the long term. 0:01:03.160 --> 0:01:06.679 So, Michael, what did Auckland Council vote on last week 0:01:06.720 --> 0:01:08.240 with regards to the stadiums. 0:01:08.680 --> 0:01:11.480 Well, they were sort of a sort of a halfway 0:01:11.520 --> 0:01:17.920 house really. They decided to partly endorse Eden Park's proposal, 0:01:18.160 --> 0:01:20.120 So it's not the full endorsement. They're not saying hey, 0:01:20.600 --> 0:01:22.800 you can go ahead and do everything you want. They're 0:01:22.800 --> 0:01:26.040 saying that, look, we think you might be the best option, 0:01:26.400 --> 0:01:29.160 and we're going to endorse heart one, but there's no 0:01:29.240 --> 0:01:31.280 money for it. So it's a bit like, you know, 0:01:31.360 --> 0:01:34.440 you're having this great plan to turn your villa into 0:01:34.480 --> 0:01:37.640 all these apartments and the developer saying, look, we'll let 0:01:37.640 --> 0:01:40.080 you do the garage. That's sort of about it at 0:01:40.080 --> 0:01:45.319 the moment. So it was a funny, really funny situation, Chelsea, 0:01:45.400 --> 0:01:49.520 because it feels like they still haven't completely made their 0:01:49.560 --> 0:01:52.080 mind up. But I guess you can interpret it in 0:01:52.120 --> 0:01:55.720 the first instance as a slight vote of confidence in 0:01:55.920 --> 0:01:59.760 eden Park's proposal, but it's still contingent on so many things, 0:02:00.240 --> 0:02:02.560 especially the fact that there's no money for it, so 0:02:02.600 --> 0:02:05.680 they still need money from somewhere, and of course now 0:02:05.760 --> 0:02:07.320 they're talking about money from the. 0:02:07.280 --> 0:02:10.080 Government, right, So they vote really doesn't do much beyond 0:02:10.200 --> 0:02:13.760 I guess signaling to the government which one they should back. 0:02:14.120 --> 0:02:16.040 Yeah, I mean, that's right. And the thing is the 0:02:16.080 --> 0:02:18.519 government's also tried to stay out of this as well. 0:02:18.520 --> 0:02:20.160 The government has sort of said, well, wait a minute, 0:02:20.200 --> 0:02:23.000 this is an Auckland thing, this is a council thing. 0:02:23.680 --> 0:02:26.919 We may get involved with some legislation with some fast 0:02:26.960 --> 0:02:29.720 tracking we might help in the future, but Auckland, this 0:02:29.800 --> 0:02:33.480 is really this is your baby. So that's what is 0:02:34.280 --> 0:02:37.639 kind of confusing about all this. It feels to me 0:02:38.360 --> 0:02:41.040 like Auckland Council are still not completely sure. You know, 0:02:41.120 --> 0:02:43.720 they're not completely sure about Eden Park if it is 0:02:43.760 --> 0:02:47.760 actually completely viable. They're not sure about Key Park. So 0:02:47.840 --> 0:02:51.160 I do wonder if it might have been smarter to say, hey, 0:02:51.240 --> 0:02:53.639 we still need a bit more time. But I also 0:02:53.760 --> 0:02:56.880 understand that people are perhaps tired of hearing that the 0:02:56.919 --> 0:02:59.960 council needs more time and the council wanted to be 0:03:00.120 --> 0:03:02.919 seed to be making a definitive decision. 0:03:06.360 --> 0:03:11.200 Are we not actually selling ourselves short by not asking, 0:03:11.560 --> 0:03:15.520 not taking the time to allow a business case to 0:03:15.560 --> 0:03:18.640 be looked at by both parties as leaders. 0:03:18.680 --> 0:03:22.800 When it's taken approach based on evidence, based on rational planning, 0:03:23.120 --> 0:03:24.920 it should actually be kind of as boring as we 0:03:24.960 --> 0:03:27.760 can make it out to be, rather than fiery speeches 0:03:27.800 --> 0:03:28.560 about this and that. 0:03:28.600 --> 0:03:33.040 In my view, in some ways, I'm wondering, what is 0:03:33.080 --> 0:03:38.480 that decision today and what outcome does it achieve. 0:03:39.120 --> 0:03:42.880 I certainly cannot, for the life of me, understand what 0:03:42.880 --> 0:03:44.000 it is we're doing here. 0:03:44.360 --> 0:03:47.600 Nothing is absolutely deadly dead as a result of this. 0:03:47.720 --> 0:03:51.360 But I think that we're injecting a bit of oxygen 0:03:51.400 --> 0:03:52.280 into one of them. 0:03:52.440 --> 0:03:54.800 This is kind of like the firmer. 0:03:54.360 --> 0:03:57.920 Of a couple of evils, and I'm quite comfortable with it. 0:04:02.040 --> 0:04:06.520 So neither plan is necessarily alive or dead. So that's 0:04:06.520 --> 0:04:07.800 a bit of an odd vote, don't you. 0:04:07.800 --> 0:04:09.160 Think it is a bit odd? 0:04:09.520 --> 0:04:11.960 I think Wayne Brown summed it up when he said that, 0:04:12.440 --> 0:04:15.480 you know, we've injected a bit of oxygen into Eden Park. 0:04:15.600 --> 0:04:18.320 So he's saying that, you know, we're keeping them alive 0:04:18.680 --> 0:04:22.000 and they're a good chance. But it's not the end 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:24.960 of the road for Key Park. The interesting thing was 0:04:25.000 --> 0:04:27.240 the council and their report came in and said, look, 0:04:28.040 --> 0:04:29.880 we like a lot of things that Key Park could 0:04:29.920 --> 0:04:32.919 do in terms of the regeneration of the downtown, the 0:04:33.000 --> 0:04:38.840 economic benefits. We think it's technically feasible, it's environmentally feasible. 0:04:39.320 --> 0:04:43.159 But they just don't. The council has doubts if Key 0:04:43.200 --> 0:04:46.520 Park can deliver. In other words, can they raise all 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:48.839 the money they say they're going to raise from the precinct. 0:04:49.080 --> 0:04:51.599 Can they raise all the money from their apartments the 0:04:51.680 --> 0:04:55.440 hotels to pay for the Steatum. That's the main council doubt, 0:04:55.720 --> 0:04:58.839 and that's fair enough. But the thing that's confusing is 0:04:59.360 --> 0:05:02.599 they haven't had the same microscope on eden Park in 0:05:02.680 --> 0:05:06.000 terms of where's eden Park's money coming from. Because the 0:05:06.040 --> 0:05:08.800 whole point of this process Chelsea back in September twenty 0:05:08.920 --> 0:05:10.880 twenty three when it started. I mean, this goes back 0:05:10.880 --> 0:05:13.440 to twenty twelve, but we won't go into that. Back 0:05:13.480 --> 0:05:17.000 in September twenty twenty three, the council's whole point of 0:05:17.040 --> 0:05:19.480 this was that the stadiums had to come up with 0:05:19.839 --> 0:05:24.560 proposals that didn't need public money, neither government nor council, 0:05:24.680 --> 0:05:29.080 ratepayers nor taxpayers. And Eden Park still hasn't passed that bar. 0:05:29.200 --> 0:05:31.560 You know, they still need this one hundred and ten 0:05:31.640 --> 0:05:34.360 million for the first phase of their proposal and who 0:05:34.360 --> 0:05:36.440 knows how many more hundreds of millions for the other 0:05:36.480 --> 0:05:40.480 phases because they haven't proven that there's any private investment. 0:05:40.560 --> 0:05:43.520 So that's where when you talk about doubt over both, 0:05:44.000 --> 0:05:46.400 I think that's where the doubt, the major doubts still 0:05:46.440 --> 0:05:47.400 lose over eden Park. 0:05:47.839 --> 0:05:50.240 So if we had to declare a winner here, I 0:05:50.279 --> 0:05:52.320 guess it'd have to be Eden Park, wouldn't it. 0:05:52.360 --> 0:05:53.880 What exactly are they proposing? 0:05:54.440 --> 0:05:56.080 Well, so, yeah, they've stepped back. 0:05:56.240 --> 0:06:00.000 Their initial Eden Park two point zero was a big 0:06:00.240 --> 0:06:03.839 bells and whistles new roof, new stands. They scaled that 0:06:03.880 --> 0:06:06.240 back a bit over more than a year ago to 0:06:06.320 --> 0:06:08.720 call it at Epark two point one, which reduced the 0:06:08.760 --> 0:06:11.080 cost a little bit and was a bit more about 0:06:11.160 --> 0:06:14.240 upgrades rather than new stands. What they're doing now, which 0:06:14.279 --> 0:06:16.560 is quite smart in a way, is they're trying to 0:06:16.600 --> 0:06:19.159 make it more palatable. So they're saying, hey, we're going 0:06:19.240 --> 0:06:21.839 to do this in three stages. The first stage is 0:06:21.880 --> 0:06:25.320 a little upgrade of the North stand which brings fans 0:06:25.360 --> 0:06:28.080 closer for rugby matches but also allows them to have 0:06:28.120 --> 0:06:30.599 an oval for cricket matches. And then they've got two 0:06:30.600 --> 0:06:33.640 more phases, which they're being a bit not completely clear 0:06:33.680 --> 0:06:36.160 about the costs. They're still talking about a roof, which 0:06:36.160 --> 0:06:38.320 they're saying will cost around three hundred million or that. 0:06:38.440 --> 0:06:42.000 Most people have doubts about that figure because a roof 0:06:42.160 --> 0:06:45.640 over Eden Park with its four existing grand stands is 0:06:45.640 --> 0:06:49.080 a major project, so let's see where that cost goes. 0:06:49.160 --> 0:06:52.640 But I think their strategy is really let's get Phase 0:06:52.720 --> 0:06:56.720 one done, approved and funded, and then by that stage 0:06:56.839 --> 0:06:58.719 it's pretty hard to go back, isn't it. You know, 0:06:58.800 --> 0:07:01.440 once you've started on this student, it's hard to go 0:07:01.480 --> 0:07:03.600 back and say, now, actually we do want to pursue 0:07:03.640 --> 0:07:07.520 another option on the water frontal downtown. So it's quite 0:07:07.560 --> 0:07:11.200 a clever strategy for Meadom Park. Whether it's the best 0:07:11.200 --> 0:07:15.400 strategy for Auckland as a whole, that's probably a bigger question. 0:07:16.520 --> 0:07:20.280 With improvements to the East and West stands and a 0:07:20.360 --> 0:07:24.520 new pedestrian butch bringing traveling fans right to our doorstep, 0:07:25.800 --> 0:07:29.679 a new north stand transforms the park into the ultimate 0:07:29.760 --> 0:07:33.120 theater and a retractable roof. 0:07:33.280 --> 0:07:35.280 She turns that theater into. 0:07:35.040 --> 0:07:40.200 A fortress, a fortress with the ingrandest of entries for 0:07:40.280 --> 0:07:45.360 the grandest of occasions, and the flexibility to host every event. 0:07:46.000 --> 0:07:49.840 It kind of feels like Eden Park has just got 0:07:49.880 --> 0:07:53.040 their Pinterest board open to the public, because we all 0:07:53.080 --> 0:07:55.640 go shopping on Pinterest, don't we for ideas for our 0:07:55.680 --> 0:07:57.440 houses when we don't have any money? 0:07:57.720 --> 0:07:58.760 Is that kind of the thing here? 0:07:58.800 --> 0:08:00.600 They're like, look, this is all what what we want 0:08:00.640 --> 0:08:02.440 to do, but actually we don't have the money for it. 0:08:02.480 --> 0:08:04.400 But here's what we want to do. Let's get excited 0:08:04.440 --> 0:08:05.280 about it anyway. 0:08:05.800 --> 0:08:08.840 Yeah, that's a good point. They're sort of trying to 0:08:08.880 --> 0:08:11.200 get the public excited. And you know, as always with 0:08:11.280 --> 0:08:15.840 the stadium things, Chelsea, the plans and the pictures look great, 0:08:16.040 --> 0:08:19.240 but I think you know, as a rate payer, as 0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:22.400 a taxpayer, all of us, we've all poured tens of 0:08:22.440 --> 0:08:25.800 millions as rate payers and hundreds of millions as taxpayers 0:08:26.120 --> 0:08:30.720 into Eden Park, and that's where you would start to question, 0:08:31.200 --> 0:08:33.480 why why is everyone still pouring money into it and 0:08:33.520 --> 0:08:36.800 park when it's a private stadium owned by a private trust, 0:08:37.120 --> 0:08:40.560 with no money that comes back to the council or 0:08:40.600 --> 0:08:44.199 to any of us. So that's sort of the overriding question, 0:08:44.240 --> 0:08:48.400 and that's why the council insisted that no public money 0:08:48.440 --> 0:08:51.800 should or very little public money should go into any 0:08:51.840 --> 0:08:53.920 of these proposals, because there's a view that, hey, the 0:08:54.000 --> 0:08:56.680 city doesn't have any money at the moment and that's 0:08:56.679 --> 0:08:59.600 not likely to change in the future. But yeah, Eden 0:08:59.640 --> 0:09:04.559 Park is certainly trying to drum up interest, support and excitement. 0:09:04.600 --> 0:09:07.600 As you say. The other big advantage Reading Park, of course, 0:09:07.679 --> 0:09:10.760 is they're already there. You know, it's a stadium that's there, 0:09:10.920 --> 0:09:13.880 it's a safe bet. It's got the history, it's got 0:09:13.880 --> 0:09:16.720 all the wonderful memories of all the sports events and 0:09:16.840 --> 0:09:20.200 entertainment that's been on that ground over the years, and 0:09:20.240 --> 0:09:22.720 that of course is a key thing in their favor. 0:09:23.040 --> 0:09:26.160 So currently you get rugby, cricket, football and occasionally league 0:09:26.160 --> 0:09:29.120 at Eden Park. Would any other sports be able to 0:09:29.160 --> 0:09:32.000 go there under this proposal, Well. 0:09:31.840 --> 0:09:34.360 Not really no, I think they're the core ones that wouldn't. 0:09:34.559 --> 0:09:38.640 There's no proposal, for example, to build an athletics track 0:09:38.720 --> 0:09:41.160 or something which you know could bring in some other options. 0:09:41.240 --> 0:09:43.240 I think the fact they're still trying to keep cricket 0:09:43.320 --> 0:09:46.520 is interesting because that does bring pros and cons. It 0:09:46.559 --> 0:09:50.360 certainly isn't great for the rugby and the codes that 0:09:50.400 --> 0:09:52.720 need a rectangular field, which is what a lot of 0:09:52.760 --> 0:09:55.200 sports people are sort of interested in. I think the 0:09:55.520 --> 0:09:58.120 other question around this, though, Chelsea, is the fact that 0:09:58.800 --> 0:10:02.040 the major teams in all Cland don't play at Eden Park, 0:10:02.200 --> 0:10:04.560 and they don't particularly want to play at Eden Park. 0:10:04.600 --> 0:10:06.520 I know the Warriors for a fact, they're not interested 0:10:06.520 --> 0:10:08.920 in playing at eden Park. They've been word by eden 0:10:09.000 --> 0:10:11.199 Park for years, but they don't want to leave Mount Smart. 0:10:11.240 --> 0:10:14.000 They've said they won't leave Mount Smart unless there is 0:10:14.400 --> 0:10:16.720 a downtown option. That's what they said years ago. Hawk 0:10:16.760 --> 0:10:19.160 and the FC, the new football team that everyone's talking 0:10:19.200 --> 0:10:21.680 about and they're going so well, they weren't interested in 0:10:21.760 --> 0:10:24.560 eden Park. They opted for Mount Smart. They felt eden 0:10:24.600 --> 0:10:26.640 Park was too big for them, and even the Blues 0:10:26.679 --> 0:10:29.320 who have been there a long time. The last negotiations 0:10:29.320 --> 0:10:31.920 with eden Park went on for quite some time before 0:10:31.960 --> 0:10:34.080 they agreed to a two year deal. Wasn't like hey, 0:10:34.120 --> 0:10:36.400 like I said, for ten years? So that to me 0:10:36.480 --> 0:10:39.520 is another question. If you've got these sporting codes that 0:10:39.800 --> 0:10:43.080 feel that eden Park doesn't particularly suit them, then how 0:10:43.280 --> 0:10:46.680 viable is eden Park as a main stadium for sport? 0:10:47.440 --> 0:10:48.760 And what about concerts? 0:10:48.840 --> 0:10:50.920 I mean, would Taylor Swift to be able to bring 0:10:50.920 --> 0:10:53.640 her next tour to eden Park if this proposal is 0:10:53.679 --> 0:10:56.120 done by the time the next Era's tour comes around. 0:10:56.840 --> 0:10:59.360 Yeah, that's the other big question, isn't it, Because that's 0:10:59.360 --> 0:11:02.800 obviously me. Park has pivoted towards concerts. They've been very successful, 0:11:02.840 --> 0:11:05.600 They've hosted a lot of concerts and of course they've 0:11:05.640 --> 0:11:08.680 got the resource consent now to do a lot more 0:11:08.720 --> 0:11:11.040 than in the past. The Taylor Swift film is an 0:11:11.080 --> 0:11:12.920 interesting one. I know Nick Sorton have brought that up 0:11:13.000 --> 0:11:15.920 quite a bit during her tour to Australia and said, hey, look, 0:11:16.000 --> 0:11:19.040 she could have been here. The experts I've talked to 0:11:19.160 --> 0:11:21.199 said there was no chance of her coming here because 0:11:21.200 --> 0:11:24.240 this wasn't really on her schedule and she already couldn't 0:11:24.240 --> 0:11:27.839 fit in more concerts in Australia. So could we host 0:11:27.960 --> 0:11:30.920 more concerts because of this proposal, I don't think so. 0:11:30.960 --> 0:11:33.760 It's not particularly at the moment going to increase the 0:11:33.840 --> 0:11:40.080 capacity or the attraction of Eden Park to potential touring acts. 0:11:40.240 --> 0:11:43.520 The other tricky thing with eden Park I think is 0:11:43.559 --> 0:11:47.000 that the new christ Jutch Stadium will also change the 0:11:47.080 --> 0:11:50.520 equation a bit because the fact that's new, it's quite 0:11:50.520 --> 0:11:53.760 a bit easier to stage concerts there. In terms of 0:11:53.000 --> 0:11:56.600 the setting up, Eden Park is not a particularly easy 0:11:56.600 --> 0:11:59.880 place to set up. They can't work overnight because of 0:11:59.880 --> 0:12:02.360 the residents. It takes quite a few days to pack 0:12:02.400 --> 0:12:04.200 in and pack out, and they've got to put the 0:12:04.240 --> 0:12:06.839 stage on the field on the grass, which which is 0:12:06.880 --> 0:12:09.520 also another tricky scenario without going to too many details. 0:12:09.559 --> 0:12:12.000 Whereas for example, Melt Smart they've got the big slab 0:12:12.040 --> 0:12:14.080 of concrete at one end that the stage goes on, 0:12:14.600 --> 0:12:16.080 so they don't need to protect the grass. 0:12:16.120 --> 0:12:17.040 It's a lot less work. 0:12:17.160 --> 0:12:20.920 So Eden Park has stage concerts and they will continue 0:12:20.920 --> 0:12:23.520 to and it'll be an attraction. But it's also not 0:12:23.679 --> 0:12:27.280 completely straightforward. And to answer your first question at the moment, 0:12:27.400 --> 0:12:30.720 I don't think it is. This new proposal will open 0:12:30.760 --> 0:12:35.480 the door for a million more concerts. 0:12:45.200 --> 0:12:49.800 So the loser here sounds like Tetuanga or the brand 0:12:49.800 --> 0:12:55.120 new Auckland Waterfront Stadium water the backers they're proposing. 0:12:54.559 --> 0:12:56.320 And why did it lose out on the day? 0:12:56.720 --> 0:12:57.320 Good question. 0:12:57.559 --> 0:13:00.040 Yeah, I mean that's right, it's not I don't I 0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:02.360 think it's the end of the road for them. 0:13:02.600 --> 0:13:03.600 You know, they're still alive. 0:13:03.679 --> 0:13:06.560 It could still happen, but this is definitely a setback, 0:13:06.600 --> 0:13:09.119 a pretty major setback. 0:13:09.280 --> 0:13:11.240 They were, of course proposing. 0:13:11.200 --> 0:13:14.640 This massive precinct in the I think it's about fifteen 0:13:14.640 --> 0:13:17.920 hectacres from memory in the vicinity of Spark Arena on 0:13:17.960 --> 0:13:21.520 this old brownfield land madely. They talked about two or 0:13:21.559 --> 0:13:24.439 three thousand apartments. They talked about commercial buildings, three or 0:13:24.440 --> 0:13:27.760 four hotels, including an all black hotel, and a new stadium. 0:13:28.040 --> 0:13:31.560 I guess their issues have been twofold. Number one is 0:13:31.640 --> 0:13:35.960 convincing Council they can raise the money. They're saying they've 0:13:36.000 --> 0:13:38.640 got a lot of private investment, and certainly the documents 0:13:38.679 --> 0:13:40.679 that were presented the Council have shown they've got a 0:13:40.720 --> 0:13:44.360 lot of prime investment coming in from overseas. Because people 0:13:44.559 --> 0:13:47.200 think this precinct could make money. Stadiums don't make money. 0:13:47.280 --> 0:13:49.240 The precincts do, and that's the whole point of it. 0:13:49.360 --> 0:13:49.720 Council. 0:13:49.800 --> 0:13:52.560 Theoy aren't completely convinced, as we were talking about earlier. 0:13:53.000 --> 0:13:55.400 They think that Key Park is being a bit optimistic 0:13:55.440 --> 0:13:57.640 in terms of how much money that can make from, 0:13:57.760 --> 0:14:00.640 for example, apartments, which would then pay for the stadium. 0:14:00.720 --> 0:14:03.319 The second point is there are some complexities with the 0:14:03.400 --> 0:14:06.200 Key Part plan because the stadium will have to be 0:14:06.240 --> 0:14:09.680 built in an area where there's an existing rollery line. 0:14:09.840 --> 0:14:12.240 It is tricky with what they have to do given 0:14:12.280 --> 0:14:14.480 the roway liners there, and the stadium has to go 0:14:14.920 --> 0:14:16.720 beside it and in parts has to go on top 0:14:16.760 --> 0:14:16.960 of it. 0:14:17.000 --> 0:14:17.480 Not easy. 0:14:18.000 --> 0:14:20.760 The backers say that's not insurmountable and that has been 0:14:20.800 --> 0:14:23.920 done in other stadiums around the world, so they're quite 0:14:23.920 --> 0:14:28.680 relaxed about it. But obviously councils saw that as another obstacle. 0:14:29.040 --> 0:14:30.960 But I guess to go back to what we talked 0:14:30.960 --> 0:14:33.880 about at the start. The confusing thing about this is 0:14:33.920 --> 0:14:36.360 that key part did take a lot of other boxes. 0:14:36.880 --> 0:14:39.600 Council omitted that, and it also an option that would 0:14:39.600 --> 0:14:44.520 regenerate downtown and also bring in massive economic benefits. So 0:14:45.080 --> 0:14:48.560 it's kind of surprising to see that council has seemingly 0:14:48.600 --> 0:14:51.640 turned their back on that when the other option doesn't 0:14:51.680 --> 0:14:53.360 have the money behind it either. 0:14:53.520 --> 0:14:53.960 It would have. 0:14:54.040 --> 0:14:57.280 Maybe been pragmatic to say, look, let's give them both 0:14:57.320 --> 0:14:59.680 six more months to prove their business case. But it 0:15:00.040 --> 0:15:02.680 and turn out that way. 0:15:05.560 --> 0:15:07.920 Big deck Bill who came over here and has got 0:15:07.920 --> 0:15:11.440 the football franchise, he is saying he wants to build 0:15:11.520 --> 0:15:16.400 like a twenty thousand seat waterfront stadium and maybe around 0:15:16.440 --> 0:15:17.520 the Tank Army area. 0:15:17.680 --> 0:15:18.720 Yeah, the Tank Farmers. 0:15:19.280 --> 0:15:22.600 Is that where the council just vetos Russell Kurtz building 0:15:22.640 --> 0:15:23.720 a temporary stand. 0:15:23.800 --> 0:15:27.760 Yes, yeah, because the soil had a petrol of it. 0:15:27.800 --> 0:15:30.040 I could just see. This is so classic New Zealand. 0:15:30.040 --> 0:15:32.080 Someone's coming from outside New Zealand with a bunch of 0:15:32.080 --> 0:15:33.720 money and an idea to make our country better. 0:15:34.000 --> 0:15:35.920 Oh, hang on, hang on, hang on here, and we 0:15:35.960 --> 0:15:36.360 can't do. 0:15:36.320 --> 0:15:40.080 That sporting loyalties assigned. 0:15:40.240 --> 0:15:42.680 Michael, do you have a preference of which one you'd 0:15:42.760 --> 0:15:43.600 like to see build? 0:15:44.240 --> 0:15:45.280 Well, that's a good question. 0:15:45.320 --> 0:15:48.360 I mean, I think for me, it's not actually about 0:15:48.680 --> 0:15:52.040 the stadium, you know, it's about what is best for 0:15:52.120 --> 0:15:55.240 the city, and it's about what unlocking the potential of 0:15:55.240 --> 0:15:57.400 the city without going into too many cliches, and I 0:15:57.440 --> 0:15:58.920 think about. 0:15:58.000 --> 0:16:00.280 What the city might need in fifty year, year or 0:16:00.280 --> 0:16:00.880 one hundred years. 0:16:00.920 --> 0:16:04.120 I know as Kiwi's Chelsea were not very good at 0:16:04.200 --> 0:16:06.760 doing that. The Australians are much better at thinking long term, 0:16:06.760 --> 0:16:07.400 as you see. 0:16:07.200 --> 0:16:07.880 With their planning. 0:16:08.240 --> 0:16:12.920 But I just my big thing is what could unlock 0:16:12.960 --> 0:16:15.280 the potential of the city, And it seems to me 0:16:15.440 --> 0:16:19.520 it's pretty obvious that downtown, the city center is slowly dying. 0:16:19.800 --> 0:16:21.960 You know, it's really hard to get people in there, 0:16:22.200 --> 0:16:25.840 really hard to drag people into Queen Street, onto the waterfront. 0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:28.640 It's not a place that seems to attract people to go. 0:16:28.880 --> 0:16:32.000 Businesses are struggling. So I guess the appeal of Key 0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:34.440 Park for me was that it's a vehicle. Having that 0:16:34.480 --> 0:16:37.720 precint in the stadium there drags people into the city. 0:16:37.760 --> 0:16:39.760 You imagine having an all Blacks game, they're having a 0:16:39.760 --> 0:16:42.280 concert downtown, Having a big Warriors game on a Sunday 0:16:42.320 --> 0:16:45.600 afternoon suddenly got thousands of people in the city spending 0:16:45.640 --> 0:16:48.440 their money. They're going to all the bars after the concert, 0:16:48.560 --> 0:16:51.920 after the game, and that's something that could actually change 0:16:51.920 --> 0:16:55.120 the face of Auckland. So that was what excited me 0:16:55.200 --> 0:16:58.560 about Key parkile was possible. Whereas Eden Park, we've seen 0:16:58.600 --> 0:17:02.560 that it's got limitations for the sporting codes, it's got 0:17:02.600 --> 0:17:05.000 limitations in terms of where it is, and it's certainly 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:07.120 got limitations in terms of the facts that it hasn't 0:17:07.160 --> 0:17:09.280 been able to pay for itself. So if you put 0:17:09.320 --> 0:17:12.840 those two things beside each other, then you know, it 0:17:12.920 --> 0:17:16.240 seems pretty compelling to me that Key Park would have 0:17:16.320 --> 0:17:19.919 been quite an exciting option for Auckland as a city 0:17:20.119 --> 0:17:23.880 in terms of providing an economic boost for a long, 0:17:24.040 --> 0:17:24.880 long term. 0:17:25.240 --> 0:17:28.600 Well, it sounds like the conversation certainly isn't over and 0:17:28.640 --> 0:17:29.920 it's not dead in the water yet. 0:17:29.960 --> 0:17:31.280 Hey no, I don't think so. 0:17:31.480 --> 0:17:34.679 I don't think the conversation is definitely over, and I 0:17:34.720 --> 0:17:37.880 think there's still be a few more twists and turns. 0:17:38.280 --> 0:17:40.600 As I said, Charles, have been covering this stadium debate 0:17:40.640 --> 0:17:44.360 since twenty twelve, and sometimes I think that actually nothing 0:17:44.440 --> 0:17:47.720 has really changed because we're still asking the same questions 0:17:47.720 --> 0:17:50.639 that we were back in twenty twelve. I think the 0:17:50.720 --> 0:17:53.240 great thing about this process that it has put the 0:17:53.280 --> 0:17:56.280 microscope on what we want, what's possible. It's put the 0:17:56.280 --> 0:18:00.080 microscope on Eden Park, the microscope on the other proposals, which. 0:18:00.040 --> 0:18:01.960 Has actually been a good thing to do. 0:18:02.119 --> 0:18:05.120 So there has been some positive stuff to come out 0:18:05.160 --> 0:18:09.200 of this proposal, and I think the next step, as 0:18:09.240 --> 0:18:11.800 you say, will be fascinating in terms of, hey, what 0:18:11.920 --> 0:18:13.240 is the next chapter, what. 0:18:13.119 --> 0:18:13.800 Are we going to do? 0:18:17.960 --> 0:18:21.080 That's it for this episode of The Front Page. You 0:18:21.119 --> 0:18:24.880 can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage 0:18:24.920 --> 0:18:28.760 at enzed Herald dot co dot enz. The Front Page 0:18:28.840 --> 0:18:33.320 is produced by Ethan Seals. Dan Goodwin is the sound engineer. 0:18:33.680 --> 0:18:38.080 I'm Chelsea Daniels. Subscribe to The Front Page on iHeartRadio 0:18:38.320 --> 0:18:41.679 or wherever you get your podcasts, and tune in tomorrow 0:18:41.920 --> 0:18:44.240 for another look behind the headlines.