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Speaker 1: On the front foot with Brian Waddell and Jeremy Coney
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Speaker 2: Hello on the front Poots. This week, what is the
Speaker 2: future of Test cricket? Well, I went for our a
Speaker 2: team in Bangladesh. Will be no more Test cricket for
Speaker 2: Verrat Coley and another unusual outcome in short form cricket
Speaker 2: and will us once again is Jerry Katy and Jerry.
Speaker 2: I don't know whether you be watching the New Zealand
Speaker 2: a great terror for them. Sometimes you wonder whether the
Speaker 2: result is that important that the amount of cricket and
Speaker 2: what they're getting out of it, rather than wins and losses.
Speaker 2: That is the way I seem to think about it, anyway.
Speaker 3: I think, so what's high?
Speaker 4: Look, it seems as though some of the batsmen are
Speaker 4: obviously going a bit better than the others. It seems
Speaker 4: like our bowlers have got their work cut out. They
Speaker 4: obviously finished the one day series with a victory, which
Speaker 4: should make them feel a lot better going into the
Speaker 4: longer formats now. And they've already had a day, haven't
Speaker 4: they they? I saw sort of two twenty for eight.
Speaker 4: Is that about right? I didn't see any of it yesterday.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the four day game played on the same venue, Selects,
Speaker 2: which is sort of just south of Daka, getting a
Speaker 2: little bit closer to the coast as well. But the
Speaker 2: fact that they had that win was significant for them
Speaker 2: changing the team around. I've given everybody a run. I
Speaker 2: like the idea of Ashok and Lenox getting plenty of
Speaker 2: bowling and getting work. It's Dean Foxcroft has come to
Speaker 2: the forefront as a all rounder offspinner and somebody who's
Speaker 2: providing good runs. We've thought of him as a sort
Speaker 2: of a big hitter and a man who can score
Speaker 2: at a fast pace. But you know, we may be
Speaker 2: seeing the best part of his game because in the
Speaker 2: first day of the four day he was one of
Speaker 2: the saviors along with Mitch Hay.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's He's not runs every time he's batted, hasn't he? Foxcroft?
Speaker 4: He's more I've so far thought of him as sort
Speaker 4: of top top order almost three and four, hasn't he
Speaker 4: where he's batted for Otago and for New Zealand A
Speaker 4: in the past. Here they're using him presumably as an
Speaker 4: all rounder more, batting down at sort of eight, and
Speaker 4: it seems to be he, you know, working very well
Speaker 4: and he's also picking up wickets with his off spinners
Speaker 4: in the one day as anyway, so he's having a
Speaker 4: good tour. Mitch Hay's got a couple of innings now
Speaker 4: under his belt. We know what he's like as a
Speaker 4: keeper as well. Some of the bowlers they have done
Speaker 4: Lennox you mentioned. I think he's looked interesting as a
Speaker 4: left arm orthodox and Addie Ashock. You always like to
Speaker 4: have one legie, don't you if you can in your country,
Speaker 4: to to sort of challenge things and do differently when
Speaker 4: you need, perhaps those Asian tours. So's he's a fairly
Speaker 4: important young man as well. So yeah, I think things
Speaker 4: are you know, well, let's wait and see how this
Speaker 4: one goes. They got put in on what on a
Speaker 4: on a rainy kind of day? Was it because it's
Speaker 4: coming near, it's coming near, you know, the monsoons isn't
Speaker 4: it really over there?
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it was difficult conditions, but you know that's
Speaker 2: the important part of these tours, that they are being
Speaker 2: forced to work a little bit harder, and you know
Speaker 2: that's I think it's great and we'll get a chance
Speaker 2: at some stage. It's difficult to get through and have
Speaker 2: a conversation with Paul Wiseman about how they're going, but
Speaker 2: certainly these are the players we've got to watch. I
Speaker 2: don't know if you had a chance to have a
Speaker 2: look at it. I know you've been resting up and
Speaker 2: looking after your body for a long winter. Stince, Jerry,
Speaker 2: did you see Did you see the five penalty runs
Speaker 2: in that third salt? You must have seen it.
Speaker 3: I did once. I did see it.
Speaker 4: Very very unusual position for a keeper to take up
Speaker 4: looking for it, because there was also a slip there
Speaker 4: wasn't there.
Speaker 3: Yes, Well, the keeper.
Speaker 2: Who was standing at first slip.
Speaker 3: It's just extraordinary.
Speaker 4: The keeper left his post and went over to a
Speaker 4: first slip position and there was also a slip beside
Speaker 4: him as well as a second slip if you like. Yeah,
Speaker 4: and so lying on the ground, well, he forgot to
Speaker 4: take the helmet with him, didn't he yeah, not normally,
Speaker 4: I suppose. And of course I wasnt Mario batting or
Speaker 4: someone like that, wasn't it who just let the ball go?
Speaker 4: Yeah and yeah, and through she went, took the helmet
Speaker 4: that but bounced and away it went. So five runs,
Speaker 4: dead ball, And okay, it's quite weird.
Speaker 3: The whole thing. Obviously the keeper forgot to take it,
Speaker 3: take it with him.
Speaker 2: There wasn't only so much that he forgot to take
Speaker 2: it with him. He didn't even make an effort to
Speaker 2: dive and stop. He just stood there. It was like
Speaker 2: those social games we used to play with a wicket keeper,
Speaker 2: unless the ball came directly to him, you know, it
Speaker 2: was waved on the way down of the boundary as
Speaker 2: it went past.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yours, Well, there is a bit of that.
Speaker 4: I've heard Parkerd tell the story when he was standing
Speaker 4: at slip one stage and it just got a wee
Speaker 4: bit wide for the keeper and he didn't come across.
Speaker 4: And he did he cried out yours quite early, and
Speaker 4: Parks has.
Speaker 3: Let it go, I think.
Speaker 4: But it's an interesting one because where else would you
Speaker 4: put the helmet? I thought to myself, you could leave
Speaker 4: it immediately behind the stumps, But then there might be
Speaker 4: a trouble, mightn't there with the keeper safe for a
Speaker 4: runout running up to the stumps or moving around the
Speaker 4: stumps to collect the throw, that might disturb the helmet
Speaker 4: and then the bales. Or you could leave it maybe
Speaker 4: behind the umpire. You want to have it fairly close
Speaker 4: because it's for a close in fielder, isn't it really.
Speaker 4: I mean you can put it anywhere you like on
Speaker 4: the ground.
Speaker 2: Could be the keeper's helmet as well. Sometimes they have
Speaker 2: them and take them off too, don't they.
Speaker 4: They do, they do, And when a spinner is operating,
Speaker 4: of course they usually got a helmet on, haven't they.
Speaker 4: And sometimes if there's no close in fielder it's close
Speaker 4: in catcher, they don't have a helmet there for the
Speaker 4: field as they run it on. Yeah, it's an interesting one,
Speaker 4: I suppose with the umpire again, it's the same thing
Speaker 4: of him moving out of the way once runners taken
Speaker 4: as well.
Speaker 3: It's a bit of an issue. So I think it's
Speaker 3: probably in the best position.
Speaker 4: Behind the behind the keeper because that's where he's supposed
Speaker 4: to be stationed.
Speaker 3: And strange part of it until he moves to first slip.
Speaker 3: It looked weird. Didn't it look absolutely weird.
Speaker 2: I can remember a game that I played in many
Speaker 2: many years ago when a part time keeper or sorry,
Speaker 2: a part time stopper was playing for the Wellington Wanderers,
Speaker 2: and the Wanderers just happened to have a fellow called
Speaker 2: Archie Taylor in his younger year, so you know how
Speaker 2: far back we're going, and another guy called Jason J.
Speaker 2: Parson John Parsons from John. Yeah, they were the quickest
Speaker 2: around the Wellington region at the time. And the guy,
Speaker 2: I won't mention his name when to put the gloves
Speaker 2: on even though they had another couple of wicket teams
Speaker 2: in this a guy called alis To Botting who was
Speaker 2: a good, wicked killer and I wouldn't be surprised that
Speaker 2: TG was there. But this fellow put the gloves on
Speaker 2: it because he was going to be the key. It
Speaker 2: didn't want to go running around the outfield, and he
Speaker 2: stood up to the stumps to Archie Taylor and Archie
Speaker 2: to stop. Halfway through his rap, he said, do you
Speaker 2: know I bowled quite quick? And the keeper said, yeah,
Speaker 2: I'll be right, I'll be able to cope, And of
Speaker 2: course the first one went swinging down the leg side
Speaker 2: and he just turned his head and watched it and
Speaker 2: go down to the boundary for four and he took
Speaker 2: a couple of places back. And that is a true story.
Speaker 2: I kid you not. So wow, I've seen it happened.
Speaker 2: But it was just amazing to see five penalty runs
Speaker 2: because in a close game that can cost you dearly.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah.
Speaker 2: The World Test Championship, we talked about it last week.
Speaker 2: Was the editor Lawrence Booth joined on the front foot
Speaker 2: and detailed in his review of the Cricket Year thing
Speaker 2: called his editor's note it's anitatorial I suppose he had
Speaker 2: some gathing criticism of the ICC. He suggested the plan
Speaker 2: to a World Test Championship, called it a shambles masquerading
Speaker 2: as a show piece. He wants to change things double
Speaker 2: at SLINKs the four years, like football and rugby said,
Speaker 2: and ensure the top nine in the rankings all play
Speaker 2: each other, so that's a nine team competition. And he
Speaker 2: wants a home and away over the series of at
Speaker 2: least three years. Anything he said. But Barclay's mess, well
Speaker 2: that's a reference to Greg Barclay, who was the president
Speaker 2: before Jay Shah before we we have a bit of
Speaker 2: a chair about it during It's Welcome Lawrence Beck because
Speaker 2: he's glad that he was able to come and join
Speaker 2: us again this week and explain how his plan was shaping. Yeah.
Speaker 5: I mean, look, I think there should be a World
Speaker 5: Test Championship. I just don't like the way it's configured
Speaker 5: at the moment. So as it stands, it's a league effectively,
Speaker 5: but different teams play different numbers of games against different opponents.
Speaker 5: Now that that isn't satisfactory as far as I'm concerned.
Speaker 5: Every team should play the same number of matches against
Speaker 5: the same opponents so that by the end of it
Speaker 5: you have a symmetrical fair system where you can you
Speaker 5: can say that the best two teams have risen to
Speaker 5: the final as things stand. I mean South Africa, I
Speaker 5: mean fair play to them. They beat the opponents in
Speaker 5: front of them and have got to the final where
Speaker 5: they play Australia. And it's not their fault that they
Speaker 5: didn't get long Test series against Australia India, and that's
Speaker 5: the greed of the Big three who carve it up
Speaker 5: to suit themselves. But we still have a situation where
Speaker 5: South Africa, who sent effectively a C team to New
Speaker 5: Zealand at the start of the cycle of you'll remember
Speaker 5: that well, of course, and gave the Zealand their first
Speaker 5: ever series win against South Africa. Partly as a result
Speaker 5: of that. They might have beaten them anyway, but it
Speaker 5: devalued that series. And then South Africa in their fourth
Speaker 5: coming home winter or home summer, do not play a
Speaker 5: home Test match. They have five T twenties against West Indies.
Speaker 5: We're talking here about the team that has reached the
Speaker 5: final of the World Test Championship. Now what we need
Speaker 5: is my suggestion in wisdom is to play, is to
Speaker 5: expand the cycle to four years. It's currently two four
Speaker 5: years works very well in rugby and football, and it
Speaker 5: gives the World Cups a certain stature, certain scarcity value.
Speaker 5: Expanded four years and that would allow each team, probably
Speaker 5: i'd say the top nine to play each other home
Speaker 5: and away in a series of a minimum of three tests.
Speaker 5: They forget these two tests, nonsense, three tests. You have
Speaker 5: a proper test series and by the end of it
Speaker 5: we'll know that it's a fair it's a fair draw.
Speaker 5: At the moment they are muddling through. Look, it's better
Speaker 5: than nothing. An imperfect World Test Championship it's better than
Speaker 5: no World Test Championship. And I accept that we have
Speaker 5: a problem now increasingly so with India against Pakistan and
Speaker 5: what to do about that. You could play those on
Speaker 5: neutual territory, but I can see that lots of people
Speaker 5: in Indian cricket are saying we shouldn't play them, play
Speaker 5: Pakistan at all in any form of cricket after the
Speaker 5: Kashmir atrocity from a few weeks ago. So that is
Speaker 5: clearly a logistical problem. But I think as a basic
Speaker 5: principle it should be fairer and more symmetrical.
Speaker 2: It's interesting because a four years there's still got to
Speaker 2: be enough windows to play test cricket. Danger they seem
Speaker 2: to struggle to find that window. Is there a danger
Speaker 2: that they might shorten Test matches to four days in length?
Speaker 2: There's been talk about that in the past, It's been dismissed.
Speaker 2: Sometimes there are only four days in the Test, but
Speaker 2: five days as of WOWED, so that you can complete
Speaker 2: a Test match in it, and we've seen some wonderful
Speaker 2: results over that period of time. Is there going to
Speaker 2: be enough time? Will the world cricketing bodies want to
Speaker 2: go with that format?
Speaker 5: Well, as you say, I think four day cricket might
Speaker 5: might end up being a solution, whether we like it
Speaker 5: or not. What you could do then clearly is you
Speaker 5: could have Test matches in three successive weeks with a
Speaker 5: bit of time in between for rest and recuperation, and
Speaker 5: if a day is lost to rain, you just tag
Speaker 5: it on to the end. You know, you say we
Speaker 5: turn it into a fifth day. You'd have to get
Speaker 5: overrates up. I mean at the moment. You know, if
Speaker 5: you're a seam if you're a seam bowling side like
Speaker 5: England or New Zealand, you're struggling to get more than
Speaker 5: eighty two eighty three overs in a day. If you're
Speaker 5: a spin bowling team, that that's fine, But so you'd
Speaker 5: have to say, look, you've got to get through overs
Speaker 5: more quickly because you'd probably need ninety six overs a
Speaker 5: day rather than the current ninety. That may be the
Speaker 5: way it has to go to fit it in. Again,
Speaker 5: it's imperfect, but it might be better than the scenario
Speaker 5: we have where teams are playing two match series and
Speaker 5: they're there's kind of they feel meaningless. But it comes
Speaker 5: back to the earlier point as making about the spread
Speaker 5: of money in a Test match. Fund And if teams
Speaker 5: are allowed to make a bit of a loss in
Speaker 5: Test cricket because they knew they were financially supported and
Speaker 5: that they were that money was coming in from a
Speaker 5: white ball game, you could tolerate a three match series
Speaker 5: more easily. It just needs a bit of collaboration between
Speaker 5: the boards. It can be done if there's a will.
Speaker 5: The problem is everyone's chasing money, Brian, Everyone's chasing their
Speaker 5: own T twenty solution. You know, New Zealand cricket getting
Speaker 5: into bed with Major League cricket is the latest example
Speaker 5: of how teams are trying to future proof themselves against
Speaker 5: the loss of bilateral TV rights. So I'm frobly talking
Speaker 5: idealistically here when the cricketing world is getting on pragmatically
Speaker 5: with the problem.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's interesting because it's just starting point anyway for
Speaker 2: the discussion from your discussions around the U. Okay, how
Speaker 2: many people are of a similar opinion or are they
Speaker 2: a divided group of people who want to do something else?
Speaker 5: No, I mean Test cricket still is the format here.
Speaker 5: I mean, you know, you watch a Test match in
Speaker 5: England and the grounds are packed out. Now the grounds
Speaker 5: in England aren't as big as the grounds in Australia,
Speaker 5: but you're still talking about thirty thousand at Lord's and
Speaker 5: twenty six twenty seven thousand at the Oval. The English
Speaker 5: Test cricket still routinely sells out and that is the
Speaker 5: format that people want to see thrive. The problem we've
Speaker 5: got is that the ECB, the English and Wales Cricket
Speaker 5: board know very well that the easiest solution to that
Speaker 5: is to play five match series against India in Australia.
Speaker 5: I mean this calendar year, England have a one off
Speaker 5: four day Test actually against Zimbabwe in Nottingham at the
Speaker 5: end of May, and after that their test program is
Speaker 5: five home tests against India and five in Australia to
Speaker 5: try and get the ashes back. So it is already
Speaker 5: happening to a degree. They're talking the ECBER talking about
Speaker 5: more longer Test series against other nations. We'll see, we'll
Speaker 5: see whether that happens. But there is a will to
Speaker 5: save Test cricket. It's just whether there can be a
Speaker 5: kind of global will to do it.
Speaker 2: Just a last word on the Test Championship, do you
Speaker 2: see it being run in two groups? A group and
Speaker 2: then a lower tier Because there's been a resistance to
Speaker 2: vet from the sides that would come in to the
Speaker 2: lower tier and the likes of West Indies we're talking
Speaker 2: about that, wren't.
Speaker 5: They Yeah, I don't like tears. I think there's Test
Speaker 5: cricket is more competitive than the people realize. You know,
Speaker 5: West Indies squared the series against Australia last year. In Australia,
Speaker 5: no one gave them a chance. In hell Bangladesh one
Speaker 5: in Pakistan, no one thought that would happen. Sermnanka won
Speaker 5: a Test match at the Oval against England New Zealand
Speaker 5: as we're talking earlier, winning three nil in India. West
Speaker 5: Indies squared the series in Pakistan. It's far more competitive
Speaker 5: than people give it credit for. So I think if
Speaker 5: we go down the two tiers system, we will exacerbate
Speaker 5: the gap between the haves and the have not. That
Speaker 5: is precisely the scenario I would like to see Test
Speaker 5: cricket avoid. I think we all need to work together
Speaker 5: to promote Test cricket and if we can convince people
Speaker 5: that it's a marketable, watchable format, then maybe the TV
Speaker 5: companies will get more involved as well and more money
Speaker 5: will come in that way. Let's not give up on
Speaker 5: Test cricket. If we go down two divisions, two tiers,
Speaker 5: whatever they decided, that gap will grow and it will
Speaker 5: simply hasten the demise of the smaller nations.
Speaker 2: Yes, will be interesting. We will be looking to have
Speaker 2: a discussion about that in this part of the world
Speaker 2: because I think there is a group of people that
Speaker 2: are traditionalists to the heart and they love the game.
Speaker 2: We love it when England coming out because they bring
Speaker 2: the Bami Army in all the tour groups and we
Speaker 2: have a wonderful time. We wish England could come out
Speaker 2: every year because the last two was successful. This year
Speaker 2: we've got kiss matches against Zimbabwe and I think a
Speaker 2: couple against the West Indies. That's basically it. And you
Speaker 2: mentioned South Africa in terms of their home program and
Speaker 2: you're gearing up for a test mat against Zimbabwe very shortly.
Speaker 5: That's right. And you know it's nice they're playing Zimbabwe
Speaker 5: for a one off test. I mean, I don't know
Speaker 5: exactly what it will achieve in the long run, but
Speaker 5: at least it's England. I mean, it's our first Test
Speaker 5: against Zimbabwe for twenty two years, so at least that
Speaker 5: shows they haven't forgotten them. But of course it might
Speaker 5: just be window dressing. I don't know what you know,
Speaker 5: how all the Zimbabwean players, how are they going to
Speaker 5: become proper test players if they just play a one
Speaker 5: off test here and there and then a couple against
Speaker 5: Bangladesh or Ireland. I mean, it's a problem that the
Speaker 5: World Cricket hasn't got to grips with.
Speaker 2: Oh well, the good thing is that New Zealand are
Speaker 2: hitting over there for a couple of Test matches and
Speaker 2: then they'll get that opportunity. And I think that the
Speaker 2: likes of Zimbabwe and even Afghanistan are on the future
Speaker 2: program for New Zealand or so we just have to
Speaker 2: hope that those sides can take part.
Speaker 3: Brian Waddell Jeremy Coney on the front foot.
Speaker 2: Interesting concept from Lawrence Bruth and thanks very much Lawrence
Speaker 2: for joining us once again. I tend to think we
Speaker 2: probably agree in many aspects of what's needed to be done.
Speaker 2: But how to achieve it, I think is going to
Speaker 2: be the challenge, isn't it.
Speaker 3: Well totally I'm with you on that. I have sympathy
Speaker 3: for the proposal. Why it's fair all sides, It's easy
Speaker 3: to follow.
Speaker 4: You get a feeling that after the four year cycle
Speaker 4: that the two best sides.
Speaker 3: Will contest the final.
Speaker 4: The four year term doesn't bother me really, It's like,
Speaker 4: as you say, World Cut, ODIs and a lot of
Speaker 4: other competitions around tournaments.
Speaker 3: And so on, lots of them use it.
Speaker 4: So I guess I would also have to admit that
Speaker 4: it's because I played Test cricket and because I've always
Speaker 4: regarded Test cricket as this of the challenge that a
Speaker 4: player confronts, and you know, I prefer to follow it
Speaker 4: as a format over others. I would have to say, so,
Speaker 4: not everybody's that, and I appreciate that. How do you
Speaker 4: feel a little bit the same way? I suspect that's
Speaker 4: a guest from me.
Speaker 2: Yeah. No, well, I think we've talked about these things
Speaker 2: in the past, and you know, the players will always
Speaker 2: tell you this is the truest form of the game.
Speaker 2: It's the real challenges. As you point out that that's
Speaker 2: why it's called a test. It tests more of your
Speaker 2: game than any other aspect of white ball cricket. And
Speaker 2: you know, I mean I enjoy the cut and thrust
Speaker 2: of the Test match, which you don't see in T
Speaker 2: twenty to a certain extent. You can see it inn
Speaker 2: ODI cricket at times, but the test matches is what
Speaker 2: really gives you the chance to really how the game
Speaker 2: is developing and changing.
Speaker 3: Home and Away.
Speaker 2: Three test series, four year period. Is there going to
Speaker 2: be enough time You're more of a mathematician than I am.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that comes under the heading I mean after stating yeah,
Speaker 4: I'm with this. I think it's very fair and it's easy,
Speaker 4: and it removes some of the problems that exist with
Speaker 4: the current setup playing a different number of games each
Speaker 4: or all those things, the points system, all those stuff
Speaker 4: is difficult. So the calendar congestion, which is I think
Speaker 4: what you're talking about. I see the events, a burgeoning
Speaker 4: number of T twenty leagues, bilateral arrangements that'd probably go.
Speaker 4: I would think if you went into this new kind
Speaker 4: of setup, if it actually occurred, I think that go,
Speaker 4: wouldn't They briefly mean nine sides, so you'd play eight
Speaker 4: opponents over two series, is what you're talking about Home
Speaker 4: and Away.
Speaker 3: So that's eight opponents, that's sixteen series. You would play
Speaker 3: two series for each side over the four years, three
Speaker 3: tests in each of the series, so three sixteens forty
Speaker 3: eight tests each side would play in the four years
Speaker 3: spread out, so that's twelve tests per year on average,
Speaker 3: on average, So New Zealand I went and had a quick.
Speaker 4: Look, wads how many tests of say New Zealand played
Speaker 4: in the last ten years May twenty fifteen to twenty five.
Speaker 4: Sixty six is the answer, and they would have to
Speaker 4: that's right over the ten years. So that's about half
Speaker 4: six point six would be, wouldn't it. That's about half
Speaker 4: what we're talking about getting the twelve tests per year,
Speaker 4: and on average England over the same period one hundred
Speaker 4: and thirty one tests they have played. They are the
Speaker 4: only side that play that number. India ninety two, Australia
Speaker 4: ninety eight tests. And then you get to sides a
Speaker 4: little bit more like New Zealand. South Africa sixty two.
Speaker 4: These are all ten year times. South Africa sixty two,
Speaker 4: Pakistan seventy eight, interesting, Sri Lanka sixty nine, Bangladesh fifty six,
Speaker 4: and the West Indies seventy three. So it gives you
Speaker 4: an idea of those teams that have not played the
Speaker 4: same number of tests that Lawrence Booth his plan suggests.
Speaker 4: So I'd have to assume onds that in the twelve
Speaker 4: tests a year, they would have to change to four tests.
Speaker 4: They couldn't be five, which means then a discussion I
Speaker 4: think about how many overs would there be in a day?
Speaker 3: How do you feel about those questions?
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think that that's something he sort of
Speaker 2: covered ninety six overs the day instead of ninety But
Speaker 2: teams can't even bowl ninety in a day now, so
Speaker 2: how they're going to bowl ninety six? But there would
Speaker 2: have to be some effort made to do that. But
Speaker 2: you also got to include in that England Australia ashes
Speaker 2: test matches. They're five tests series, aren't they? And then
Speaker 2: the matches that have played, you know against India they
Speaker 2: seem to want five. There England to put you know,
Speaker 2: in their home program five test matches, so you know
Speaker 2: it's going to be a lot more Test matches. But
Speaker 2: it just shows how New Zealand lag behind. I mean
Speaker 2: they play less cricket by your figures than the West
Speaker 2: Indies in tests.
Speaker 3: That's correct. I think there's a bit of West Indies
Speaker 3: still holding.
Speaker 4: That sort of period where they played and there's a
Speaker 4: feeling that they want to play against the West Indies
Speaker 4: a different.
Speaker 3: Way that they play. Perhaps the method they play. I
Speaker 3: don't know.
Speaker 4: I can't say more than that about the number seventy
Speaker 4: three that they played in New Zealand's sixty six. I
Speaker 4: guess the next question for me Wadds is player fatigue, starts.
Speaker 3: And burnout and injuries.
Speaker 4: With all the World Cups and the T twenties plus
Speaker 4: these twelve tests, England have got quite a group, haven't they,
Speaker 4: that they can use in different tests.
Speaker 3: Would that mean that players would.
Speaker 4: Pick and choose a little bit the various tests that
Speaker 4: they played of the twelve and would players prioritizing some
Speaker 4: games over others?
Speaker 3: Would that weeken the league a little bit?
Speaker 4: So suddenly you arrive at watching what you anticipate as
Speaker 4: a good test and you find that Williamson and Henry
Speaker 4: aren't playing, or something like that.
Speaker 2: That's slightly different to New Zealand. Are slightly different to England,
Speaker 2: don't they? I mean the players don't decide, it's the
Speaker 2: selection panel that decides what they play. One day's T
Speaker 2: twenty test matches. New Zealand doesn't have quite the depth
Speaker 2: do they? In terms of numbers?
Speaker 5: Well?
Speaker 4: No, that's right, eighteen eighteen first class sides, don't they?
Speaker 4: And then a nineteenth side because they don't really release
Speaker 4: their test players that much back to those county sides
Speaker 4: that they play for, so there's kind of nineteen sides.
Speaker 4: Well you can just see the numbers are vastly different
Speaker 4: from our six sides that we have, so that's a
Speaker 4: bit of an issue I think a little bit around this.
Speaker 4: So the calendar, then the players, I think costs for
Speaker 4: all those teams I talked about the West and these
Speaker 4: would certainly be one would boards struggle to pay for
Speaker 4: hosting teams for their test for their sort of requisite
Speaker 4: number of tests that they would have to they would
Speaker 4: have to put on, and then of course the travel
Speaker 4: to go to other places as well, and that leads
Speaker 4: to where will the money come from exactly? Now, The
Speaker 4: fact of it is, it's very clear in this system,
Speaker 4: I think the big guys are going to have to
Speaker 4: give money away.
Speaker 3: It can't be done otherwise.
Speaker 4: You could perhaps have an overall broadcaster who handled the
Speaker 4: whole of the test matches that obviously sublet some of
Speaker 4: those two other teams you know, to other broadcasters, but
Speaker 4: they would do the main ones they saw and you'd
Speaker 4: have to pull the money that that brought broadcast that
Speaker 4: main broadcaster you paid for the right to broadcast those tests,
Speaker 4: and the money from that pool would go out to
Speaker 4: players and to playing airfares and to paying venues and
Speaker 4: so on. This is a vastly different system than what
Speaker 4: we've got operating at the moment. So I don't know
Speaker 4: what you feel about those ideas. These are just my
Speaker 4: ideas I see them as I see them as slightly
Speaker 4: obstacles to this going ahead.
Speaker 2: Well, they have to come into consideration when they're deciding
Speaker 2: to do and they what they intend to do with
Speaker 2: the World Test Championship. And I think that's the suggestion
Speaker 2: Lawrence Booth was making to Jayshar. One of the important
Speaker 2: jobs he faces is to decide what is going to happen.
Speaker 2: I just wonder, added to that, whether there is the
Speaker 2: appetite within the administration of the game for this to
Speaker 2: happen and to make those changes or just do as
Speaker 2: he call the fact that it's a shambles masquerading as
Speaker 2: a show piece.
Speaker 4: Yeah, well and it is a but he's kind of
Speaker 4: he said it in a nice memorable kind of way,
Speaker 4: in a phrase, he's good, he's good at doing that.
Speaker 4: But yeah, absolutely, but he you know, but but basically
Speaker 4: the idea behind the words I think a lot of
Speaker 4: people would agree with, and that's what we have the
Speaker 4: sympathy for his suggestion. There are political tensions odds, how
Speaker 4: are we going to approach Pakistan India neutral grounds or
Speaker 4: are we just going to cancel them playing each other?
Speaker 4: In which case what happens to the points? Do they
Speaker 4: both get zero? I don't think they'd be very happy
Speaker 4: about that, But anyway, the viability of some grounds we
Speaker 4: are obviously going to Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, p away in
Speaker 4: Siliette for example. And then there's the other last thing
Speaker 4: I know, all a couple of things. Marginalization of Zimbabwe,
Speaker 4: Ireland and Afghanistan. That's an issue I think, and to
Speaker 4: exclude them as they are anyway at the moment, and
Speaker 4: then the points system would have to be organized and
Speaker 4: overrates and all that sort of thing. The main point
Speaker 4: I would make Wads is something you've just picked up on,
Speaker 4: is it would need a consensus from all the countries
Speaker 4: to show the will and to value the format enough
Speaker 4: to run a proper league. And this is a proper
Speaker 4: league he's talking about, and a fair league and to
Speaker 4: produce the best sides at the end of it. Booth
Speaker 4: doesn't talk about the final, does he. I don't think.
Speaker 4: I don't think you could just have one match after
Speaker 4: four years a final. I think you'd have to have
Speaker 4: three matches, perhaps one in each of the finalists place
Speaker 4: and then a neutral place, and that might be decided
Speaker 4: by the flick of a coin. I don't know, yep,
Speaker 4: so a third venue, I think so. The last point
Speaker 4: would be for the size of this and there's over
Speaker 4: three hundred tests and all of it aren't there is.
Speaker 4: You can't just layer it onto what's existing already. There
Speaker 4: will have to be changes made to other parts of
Speaker 4: the schedule. It's a seismic shift in developing. Also, the
Speaker 4: selfishness that exists at the moment around board to board
Speaker 4: to board and looking after things for themselves that would
Speaker 4: have that attitude would have to change.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it makes it makes a real change. And that's
Speaker 2: basically what is being suggested that some of these other
Speaker 2: tours would be in its tess of that you'd be
Speaker 2: then playing every side twice, one home, one away, so
Speaker 2: you would get that to regular test contact. The issue
Speaker 2: of Zimbabwe, Ireland, et cetera. That is a problem they
Speaker 2: have to deal with because, as Lawrence Booth says, and
Speaker 2: I think we probably agree, the tea system is probably
Speaker 2: not a satisfactory way of going about it. But we
Speaker 2: can't just have those extra countries Afghanistan, et cetera waiting
Speaker 2: for the crumbs that drop their way because they have
Speaker 2: to have an opportunity to get some experience. Twelve countries
Speaker 2: makes it even harder to organize if you include those
Speaker 2: in your group. So you know it is a challenge,
Speaker 2: but I think it's a challenge that has to be
Speaker 2: accepted and has to be dealt with. Otherwise the test
Speaker 2: game is going to go into decline that some people
Speaker 2: think it's inevitable. I don't want to get into that
Speaker 2: inevitability club. But if something is not done to spread
Speaker 2: the message amongst all the countries, then it will head
Speaker 2: that way, won't it is?
Speaker 4: It will, And we're not really growing the game, are we.
Speaker 4: The game is not growing, And you know my feelings
Speaker 4: about this. I think anybody should be able to play
Speaker 4: a test as long as they have venues that are
Speaker 4: suitable and they have various leagues going on around the world.
Speaker 4: But that's big changes to people's attitudes words I can't
Speaker 4: quite see it happening and I'm whispering.
Speaker 3: That I can't quite see it.
Speaker 2: You whispering goodness me. Yeah, yeah, well yeah, I agree
Speaker 2: with you on that. But that becomes a tear system,
Speaker 2: doesn't it, But to you know, with Lagre. But you've
Speaker 2: got to do something to allow those sides like to develop.
Speaker 2: You know, they appear along with Kenyere and the Netherlands
Speaker 2: at our short form whiteball competitions. They need to get
Speaker 2: the opportunity to develop their game through the test match.
Speaker 2: So you know, there are challenges there, and if any
Speaker 2: listener has an opinion on what we've been talking about,
Speaker 2: then send us an email on the front foot twenty
Speaker 2: at gmail dot com. On the Front Foot twenty at
Speaker 2: gmail dot com. It's an interesting one because there are
Speaker 2: different outcomes, aren't there. You're not going to get universal
Speaker 2: agreement until you discuss it. You know, here we are
Speaker 2: discussing Laurence Spoon's point of view and you know our agreement.
Speaker 2: But there are things that have to be taken into
Speaker 2: consideration and hopefully our international administrators will do that, not
Speaker 2: just think about the money that's going into their pocket
Speaker 2: because of some good deal they've done with some good company. Yes,
Speaker 2: the World Test Championship isn't far away because the teams
Speaker 2: or the squads for both countries have been chosen just quickly.
Speaker 2: I don't know if you've seen the squads, but I
Speaker 2: fancy Australia just at the moment in terms of the
Speaker 2: balance that they've got. But you can never discount South
Speaker 2: Africa in any form of the competition. But they don't
Speaker 2: have a history of winning the big ones, do they.
Speaker 4: They don't fighters all the way, aren't they? Though they're
Speaker 4: very competitive people generally. I think i'd agree if you
Speaker 4: wanted to put a favoritism tag to either of the side,
Speaker 4: you'd probably say Australia slightly. Yeah, the Australia seem to
Speaker 4: have a little question mark about who will be in
Speaker 4: their top three? Will they for example, while Constance is there,
Speaker 4: will they choose them? And if they choose them, they
Speaker 4: can't kind of fit Green into the side, and they
Speaker 4: will want to do that if he is fit. He's
Speaker 4: come back into the the squad. Hummins's course has come
Speaker 4: back as well. So Webster Webster, well, bo Webster has
Speaker 4: been there and he kind of covers Green, doesn't he
Speaker 4: He's a tall lad.
Speaker 3: He bowls with me. He bats and he's kick. He
Speaker 3: also feels in the slips quite useful. So it's just
Speaker 3: a question of who's.
Speaker 4: Going to open with Kwaja. Are you going to push
Speaker 4: Laboshane up or are you going to put someone like
Speaker 4: Ingless who's been around for a while. You're going to
Speaker 4: put head up there after the moving ball or leave
Speaker 4: him at five. So Labershane, Smith, Green Webster carry then
Speaker 4: right down you can. You know. The people who are
Speaker 4: going to miss out probably are people like Doggett, who's
Speaker 4: who's people.
Speaker 3: Might not know him.
Speaker 4: He's a wicket taker in the final. Wasn't he poon
Speaker 4: him in the left left arm spinner Constance. I've mentioned Engless,
Speaker 4: the keeper and the batsman, and then Boland Boland they
Speaker 4: might feel might come and may be for Hazelwood. Don't
Speaker 4: know whether he's completely fit yet or not. Well, yeah,
Speaker 4: he he is, that's right, and he's very direct and.
Speaker 3: At you the whole time.
Speaker 4: So so yeah, so it's an interesting one. The South
Speaker 4: Africans ones very quickly. Top ordered Desaucei, the left hander
Speaker 4: Ryan Rickleton and Aden Markram and then in the middle
Speaker 4: order timber Bavooma, David Beddingham who came out here. You know,
Speaker 4: the right handed bat's quite nicely, and the younger hand Tristan, yeah,
Speaker 4: and Tristan Stubbs Veraina the keeper, and then the two
Speaker 4: all round is Marco Jansson. People will know the left
Speaker 4: armor tall and we are molder a right arm Seemer
Speaker 4: and then Rabarda's back there now and also Gide is
Speaker 4: there as well, Maharaj. They you know, they've got some
Speaker 4: good players, but whether they've got players that can grab
Speaker 4: a match like a Head, you know, Travis Head, I'm
Speaker 4: not quite so sure they have that. And the bowling
Speaker 4: I think from coming Stark Hazlewood or Bowland and Lion
Speaker 4: just a little bit perhaps more threatening than the South
Speaker 4: Avenge without North here.
Speaker 2: Yes, interesting, we will look a little bit more closely
Speaker 2: at that. There's an opportunity for you to be there,
Speaker 2: I think too, isn't he Yep.
Speaker 3: I'll be there once hopefully if I can limp the
Speaker 3: way there.
Speaker 2: Oh, I'm sure you'll be able to do that.
Speaker 3: It's set off for a little bit, yeah, you know.
Speaker 2: Like tomorrow. It's an event, look, just a quick one finally,
Speaker 2: and it's come from the title in cricket you've never
Speaker 2: seen at all. The Asia qualifier for the twenty twenty
Speaker 2: six Women's Tea twenty World Cup in Thailand, the UAE
Speaker 2: were getting twitchy because of the weather conditions. They got
Speaker 2: to one hundred and ninety two for none and sixteen
Speaker 2: ovens against Kuta, but rain was looming. They wanted to declare,
Speaker 2: they weren't allowed to. You can't declare in a short
Speaker 2: form game. So what they did was they retired all
Speaker 2: their bats when they walked out to the middle, retired
Speaker 2: and came out and so they were able to win
Speaker 2: the game. They dispatched Qatar for something like thirty two
Speaker 2: I think it was. It was. It wasn't a very
Speaker 2: good performance, but it brings to mind some of those
Speaker 2: incidentss of how you can manufacture the result of a game.
Speaker 2: And you and I both thought of seventy seven runs
Speaker 2: from and over about how to manufacture a result Bert
Speaker 2: vance Bowling against Canterbury in nineteen ninety.
Speaker 3: Yep, looking for a result on the last day.
Speaker 4: They fed them runs with Bert Bowling deliberate no ball
Speaker 4: keeping the thing going. And I think who was the
Speaker 4: wicketkeeper who captain for New Zealand as well?
Speaker 3: He got about a hundred and sixty.
Speaker 4: Yeah, got one hundred and sixty odd not out, didn't
Speaker 4: he in that innings as well? Yeah, ittis it's an
Speaker 4: interesting one. Quite clever work by you know the UAE captain.
Speaker 4: Wasn't it ready to go out and say to the amps, look,
Speaker 4: can we declare no you can't. Well, then I'm going
Speaker 4: to retire all my batsmen out because they were numbed
Speaker 4: down at that point for about Yeah, they had about
Speaker 4: one hundred and ninety and the rain was coming. I
Speaker 4: think there are two ways of retiring.
Speaker 3: Of course.
Speaker 4: You can be either injured or ill, and you get
Speaker 4: the umpire's permission. In that case, off you go, and
Speaker 4: if you get better you can come back out again,
Speaker 4: can't you. The other way, of course, is to be
Speaker 4: retired out, nothing to do with the amp. You retire
Speaker 4: yourself out, doesn't need umpire permission at all. If you're
Speaker 4: retired not out, of course the umpire has he can
Speaker 4: stop you. He said, I don't believe you. I think
Speaker 4: you're fine, you're not ill at all. He can do that.
Speaker 3: So, but if you're retired out you can't and you're
Speaker 3: not allowed to return.
Speaker 4: But if suddenly was the rain that was coming in
Speaker 4: this match. Suddenly a vicious wind came in and blew
Speaker 4: it all away. And suddenly the batting captain who's retired
Speaker 4: them all out wants to change their decision. In their mind,
Speaker 4: they seek to reinstate some of the retired batsmen. You
Speaker 4: can ask for that, but you've got to ask the
Speaker 4: opposing captain, and that captain, the one in the field,
Speaker 4: has the final say, and I'm not sure they. I'm
Speaker 4: not sure they would say yeah, go ahead. So that's
Speaker 4: that's the rule as it happened. It has happened. In
Speaker 4: Test cricket two thousand and one, Marvin Artapatu and mahala
Speaker 4: Jaia Wardener both retired themselves out against Bangladesh two thousand
Speaker 4: and one. They'd got their runs and they wanted the
Speaker 4: rest of the team to have some batting practice. And
Speaker 4: it was thought very poorly of the whole thing. They
Speaker 4: should have either missed a straight one or hit one
Speaker 4: up in the air or whatever you like. But you
Speaker 4: don't retire yourself out, I don't think too in order
Speaker 4: for other batsmen to have a crack. And the other
Speaker 4: time I could find that used wads was this quite
Speaker 4: a nice one actually, West Indies playing India nineteen.
Speaker 3: Eighty two.
Speaker 4: Fifth Test match. Gordon Greenwich got one hundred and fifty
Speaker 4: four not out. Overnight he got new that his two
Speaker 4: year old daughter was critically ill and so he retired
Speaker 4: retired out because you know, there was no injury to
Speaker 4: him and he wasn't ill. And so he flew off
Speaker 4: that night from Antigua where the game was being played,
Speaker 4: to Barbados, where his daughter was in hospital, and he
Speaker 4: visited them. She was being treated there, but she died
Speaker 4: two days later and Greenidge took no further part in
Speaker 4: the match. And then as a mark of respect, keppel
Speaker 4: Dev the Indian captain, granted an exemption to Greenwich and
Speaker 4: he was recorded retired not out. So the difference was
Speaker 4: he didn't have the average. You know, it wasn't counted
Speaker 4: as out, if you know what I mean. So those
Speaker 4: are the two things. It's more tactical in t twenties,
Speaker 4: isn't it. People can retire themselves out because they're not
Speaker 4: scoring fast enough.
Speaker 2: And the reason why declarations weren't allowed that it stems
Speaker 2: back to nineteen seventy nine when Brian Rose in Somerset
Speaker 2: declared at one without loss against Glenn Turner's Worcestershire who
Speaker 2: got one of the runs to win the game. It's
Speaker 2: a long story and we haven't got time to go
Speaker 2: through it, but that's why the English County Cricket Board
Speaker 2: decided that declarations were not the required thing. I don't
Speaker 2: know whether it's a possibility that it may come back,
Speaker 2: who knows. But on that note, Jerry, we come to
Speaker 2: an end of another on the front foot. I hope
Speaker 2: you're resting well and we'll be able to talk again
Speaker 2: next week. To enjoy some more of crickets, many happenings.
Speaker 4: Thanks words, enjoyed it and quite unusual things happen in cricket,
Speaker 4: don't they. I mean, you couldn't really make it up
Speaker 4: some of these things.
Speaker 2: Ease Upsoma sing do do
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