1 00:00:09,093 --> 00:00:11,973 Speaker 1: You're listening to a podcast from News Talk Sat B. 2 00:00:12,373 --> 00:00:19,293 Speaker 1: Follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on Iheartradios. 3 00:00:19,413 --> 00:00:20,013 Speaker 2: Take it on the pad. 4 00:00:20,093 --> 00:00:21,013 Speaker 3: How we don't if you'll get in. 5 00:00:21,413 --> 00:00:22,133 Speaker 2: It's a trick. 6 00:00:22,733 --> 00:00:23,293 Speaker 4: It is out. 7 00:00:23,613 --> 00:00:24,413 Speaker 3: The test is over. 8 00:00:26,693 --> 00:00:28,893 Speaker 2: Goodness smooths, a beauty. 9 00:00:28,933 --> 00:00:32,093 Speaker 3: It is out here, you guys. This delivery has in 10 00:00:32,213 --> 00:00:33,693 Speaker 3: neu uses the Gold. 11 00:00:35,773 --> 00:00:39,173 Speaker 1: On the Front foot with Brian Waddell and Jeremy Cody, 12 00:00:39,493 --> 00:00:43,373 Speaker 1: powered by News Talks head be at iHeart Radio. 13 00:00:47,653 --> 00:00:48,413 Speaker 3: Hello, here we. 14 00:00:48,373 --> 00:00:52,093 Speaker 4: Are again on the front foot and on the front 15 00:00:52,133 --> 00:00:55,813 Speaker 4: foot enjoys success and the success has been with the 16 00:00:55,813 --> 00:00:59,693 Speaker 4: black Caps so far preparation for the Champions Trophy two 17 00:00:59,693 --> 00:01:02,573 Speaker 4: from two and a place in the final. 18 00:01:03,333 --> 00:01:06,013 Speaker 3: Odio Cricket hasn't been high on the black Caps gender 19 00:01:06,053 --> 00:01:09,573 Speaker 3: in recent years. Just six men just played in the 20 00:01:09,653 --> 00:01:13,573 Speaker 3: last twelve to eighteen months previousits Ri Laica earlier this 21 00:01:13,693 --> 00:01:16,973 Speaker 3: year and then last year. You're against the Bangladesh So 22 00:01:17,373 --> 00:01:20,573 Speaker 3: Jeremy Gunny, this new eras started pretty well, a lot 23 00:01:20,613 --> 00:01:24,293 Speaker 3: of new faces there, but encouraging as a build up 24 00:01:24,333 --> 00:01:25,373 Speaker 3: to the champions Troping. 25 00:01:25,853 --> 00:01:29,933 Speaker 2: Yeah, this isn't it's that started as you say, very well. 26 00:01:29,933 --> 00:01:33,093 Speaker 2: Two from two a night match where they were set 27 00:01:33,093 --> 00:01:35,493 Speaker 2: a target and in a day match where they chased. 28 00:01:35,853 --> 00:01:40,253 Speaker 2: So that's good that you're doing both the different questions 29 00:01:40,253 --> 00:01:44,293 Speaker 2: and answering. Answering them well, really three point thirty for 30 00:01:44,533 --> 00:01:47,213 Speaker 2: six setting and then three hundred and eight for four chasing, 31 00:01:47,693 --> 00:01:52,653 Speaker 2: so two wins. Yeah, it's going to be interesting, isn't it. 32 00:01:52,733 --> 00:01:55,053 Speaker 2: If you're going to be getting those sorts of totals 33 00:01:55,093 --> 00:01:59,333 Speaker 2: three hundred plus. You can't get there just with six's. 34 00:02:00,373 --> 00:02:03,253 Speaker 2: You've got to play kind of a bit of orthodox 35 00:02:03,373 --> 00:02:08,053 Speaker 2: cricket as well, because the risk you take hitting the 36 00:02:08,053 --> 00:02:12,853 Speaker 2: big shots you lose wickets. And I think that's been 37 00:02:12,893 --> 00:02:16,533 Speaker 2: the feature for me is that New Zealand have played 38 00:02:16,573 --> 00:02:21,053 Speaker 2: generally orthodox cricket strokes. Yes, there have been the odds six, 39 00:02:21,093 --> 00:02:25,533 Speaker 2: but they've been down the ground, but they played, you know, 40 00:02:25,613 --> 00:02:28,893 Speaker 2: they played properly and that's what I've really enjoyed. Kept 41 00:02:28,893 --> 00:02:32,213 Speaker 2: me up a bit later than I wist actually, so 42 00:02:33,053 --> 00:02:38,573 Speaker 2: it was pleasing to see some of those batsmen going well, 43 00:02:39,373 --> 00:02:45,453 Speaker 2: particularly obviously Williamson is such a key component. When he 44 00:02:45,533 --> 00:02:52,133 Speaker 2: returns to the side, he just rijudifies if I could 45 00:02:52,133 --> 00:02:56,493 Speaker 2: put these steals up, you know, and tempers the whole 46 00:02:56,533 --> 00:02:59,133 Speaker 2: of that top and middle order because he bats through. 47 00:03:00,773 --> 00:03:03,453 Speaker 2: And I do hope that others are sort of inhaling 48 00:03:04,573 --> 00:03:08,213 Speaker 2: what he does when he arrives. You know, they watch 49 00:03:08,413 --> 00:03:11,453 Speaker 2: him at practice, they watch him what he does before 50 00:03:11,533 --> 00:03:13,813 Speaker 2: he bets. They watch him in the first four or 51 00:03:13,853 --> 00:03:16,933 Speaker 2: five overs and how he works out the shots you 52 00:03:17,053 --> 00:03:19,093 Speaker 2: need to play to succeed on that pitch. 53 00:03:19,813 --> 00:03:22,693 Speaker 3: Yeah, he's been the success and it is always important 54 00:03:22,973 --> 00:03:25,733 Speaker 3: part of the New Zealand side when you've got quality 55 00:03:25,733 --> 00:03:29,613 Speaker 3: play like that, Well says the tri series a little 56 00:03:29,613 --> 00:03:32,373 Speaker 3: bit further. And I'm able to say because we've got 57 00:03:32,413 --> 00:03:36,893 Speaker 3: Wally Lees joining the program this week. He's going to 58 00:03:37,293 --> 00:03:41,413 Speaker 3: play a part of history. Him and I we replay 59 00:03:42,053 --> 00:03:45,413 Speaker 3: from forty two years ago. In fact, we'll start with 60 00:03:45,453 --> 00:03:48,733 Speaker 3: it some exciting cricket. It was a losing cause it 61 00:03:48,853 --> 00:03:52,613 Speaker 3: was this week in nineteen eighty three, and I've searched 62 00:03:52,613 --> 00:03:55,893 Speaker 3: the vault of old commentary. Listen to us lot. 63 00:03:55,813 --> 00:04:01,173 Speaker 1: Jerry, Brian Waddell, Jeremy Cooney on the front foot, remember this. 64 00:04:08,413 --> 00:04:09,093 Speaker 2: When they get this. 65 00:04:09,213 --> 00:04:11,653 Speaker 5: Time and he's got all it and the diving a 66 00:04:11,773 --> 00:04:14,973 Speaker 5: first plus six what with a square leg turned from 67 00:04:15,013 --> 00:04:15,653 Speaker 5: two girls? 68 00:04:17,253 --> 00:04:20,013 Speaker 2: When you every one new home comes back and canvas. 69 00:04:20,013 --> 00:04:24,013 Speaker 1: And got a half whatever from them that hit over. 70 00:04:24,133 --> 00:04:27,573 Speaker 1: I'm on relief from the seven ends bowl to can 71 00:04:27,773 --> 00:04:31,253 Speaker 1: Senno pep square. 72 00:04:31,293 --> 00:04:38,853 Speaker 2: They have defended neer the one hander never the make 73 00:04:38,933 --> 00:04:40,453 Speaker 2: amazing shot I think I. 74 00:04:40,373 --> 00:04:43,053 Speaker 1: Have ever seen till he comes in and bowls the 75 00:04:43,133 --> 00:04:43,693 Speaker 1: Cans again. 76 00:04:43,773 --> 00:04:46,573 Speaker 2: The tiny air w underneath it. It might go off 77 00:04:46,613 --> 00:04:48,693 Speaker 2: the top. Evern had a front bl. 78 00:04:50,573 --> 00:04:53,613 Speaker 3: Yes, how could you forget it? It was only like 79 00:04:53,933 --> 00:04:59,093 Speaker 3: yesterday when Lance Cans launched an assault on the pride 80 00:04:59,133 --> 00:05:04,893 Speaker 3: of Australia's bowling nineteen eighty three February, and it was 81 00:05:04,933 --> 00:05:09,253 Speaker 3: an assault like no others, thick sixes and innings. It 82 00:05:09,253 --> 00:05:12,293 Speaker 3: didn't last very long, but then Lance Ken's innings never 83 00:05:12,373 --> 00:05:16,133 Speaker 3: lasted very long. But we were watching on TV that 84 00:05:16,813 --> 00:05:20,533 Speaker 3: outcome a man who was closer than that was former 85 00:05:20,533 --> 00:05:24,293 Speaker 3: New Zealand wicket keeper and Black Caps coach Warren Lees. 86 00:05:24,853 --> 00:05:28,053 Speaker 3: You had probably the worst seat in the house. You're 87 00:05:28,053 --> 00:05:28,693 Speaker 3: at the other end. 88 00:05:29,133 --> 00:05:31,453 Speaker 5: Yeah, it was once. I don't know how that came about. 89 00:05:31,573 --> 00:05:34,493 Speaker 5: I mean, in fact, it also tells you something. I 90 00:05:34,493 --> 00:05:36,453 Speaker 5: think I was up higher in the order than Lance 91 00:05:36,453 --> 00:05:38,253 Speaker 5: as well, so he came up to join me, I 92 00:05:38,293 --> 00:05:42,733 Speaker 5: think at the wicket and yeah, the next half hour 93 00:05:42,813 --> 00:05:47,053 Speaker 5: was a surprising amount of cricket and a hugely surprising 94 00:05:47,093 --> 00:05:49,173 Speaker 5: amount of hitting. Really it was great. 95 00:05:49,013 --> 00:05:51,293 Speaker 3: And the end result was the game was all over 96 00:05:51,373 --> 00:05:54,453 Speaker 3: anyway because you were chasing a massive target and you'd 97 00:05:54,533 --> 00:05:56,533 Speaker 3: lost the better part of your top audit. 98 00:05:56,973 --> 00:06:00,253 Speaker 5: Well, we had, really and in those days when Australia 99 00:06:01,093 --> 00:06:04,093 Speaker 5: took to us, they really got off the mark and 100 00:06:04,133 --> 00:06:08,253 Speaker 5: they bat it first and posted a very very competitive score. 101 00:06:09,053 --> 00:06:11,653 Speaker 5: I guess it. Halfway we thought, you know, we've got 102 00:06:11,653 --> 00:06:14,293 Speaker 5: a chance if we can get started. Well, I think 103 00:06:14,373 --> 00:06:18,973 Speaker 5: we're at one stage about five to forty, and really 104 00:06:18,973 --> 00:06:22,533 Speaker 5: the game had gone. The only thing you could expect 105 00:06:22,533 --> 00:06:24,933 Speaker 5: from from the lower part of the New Zealand team 106 00:06:24,933 --> 00:06:27,653 Speaker 5: at that stage would be could we crawel to one 107 00:06:27,733 --> 00:06:30,653 Speaker 5: hundred or could someone make their mark on the game 108 00:06:30,733 --> 00:06:33,493 Speaker 5: and give us just a little bit of confidence or 109 00:06:33,533 --> 00:06:36,693 Speaker 5: a little bit of during in our dressing room, we 110 00:06:36,733 --> 00:06:38,813 Speaker 5: wouldn't have expected it to happen the way it did, 111 00:06:38,853 --> 00:06:42,133 Speaker 5: but Lance Ken's was someone we leant on pretty heavily, 112 00:06:42,213 --> 00:06:45,573 Speaker 5: and you know, the big man that he was. It 113 00:06:45,613 --> 00:06:48,133 Speaker 5: was an exciting thing to watch from twenty meters away. 114 00:06:48,853 --> 00:06:50,373 Speaker 3: Yeah, I was going to say, would you have had 115 00:06:50,453 --> 00:06:52,733 Speaker 3: much of a team talk at that stage in terms 116 00:06:52,733 --> 00:06:54,253 Speaker 3: of how are you going to go about it? Or 117 00:06:54,413 --> 00:06:58,133 Speaker 3: would he have just taken control of the game. You 118 00:06:58,173 --> 00:07:02,173 Speaker 3: were placing the likes of Lawson, Hog, Lily and McLay, 119 00:07:02,413 --> 00:07:05,813 Speaker 3: so they weren't such a bad bowling lineup in terms 120 00:07:05,853 --> 00:07:07,133 Speaker 3: of seam bowling anyway. 121 00:07:08,413 --> 00:07:12,533 Speaker 5: I remember being at the non striker's end most of 122 00:07:12,613 --> 00:07:15,173 Speaker 5: the time, which was where I probably played my best cricket. 123 00:07:15,213 --> 00:07:19,213 Speaker 5: But yeah, planning it was was quite interesting. Lance Caf 124 00:07:19,653 --> 00:07:22,373 Speaker 5: Lance and I got together right at the start of 125 00:07:22,413 --> 00:07:25,773 Speaker 5: that so called partnership and that it was a very 126 00:07:25,893 --> 00:07:28,413 Speaker 5: very noisy crowd. That I mean the Australian crowd when 127 00:07:28,413 --> 00:07:34,453 Speaker 5: they're winning in those days, was just so loud, and 128 00:07:34,493 --> 00:07:37,133 Speaker 5: I was yelling at Lance about how we could get 129 00:07:37,333 --> 00:07:40,893 Speaker 5: a bit of a partnership going. Lance of course nodded 130 00:07:40,973 --> 00:07:44,173 Speaker 5: a lot and wandered back down the other end, and 131 00:07:44,533 --> 00:07:46,933 Speaker 5: I'm sure he never heard me. I'm sure he didn't 132 00:07:47,453 --> 00:07:49,853 Speaker 5: take much notice of what I was saying. It was 133 00:07:50,453 --> 00:07:54,053 Speaker 5: an interesting thing to happen though, because Lance just said 134 00:07:54,093 --> 00:07:57,653 Speaker 5: at one stage I'll give it a go, and I 135 00:07:57,693 --> 00:08:00,773 Speaker 5: didn't really get a full understanding of what he meant 136 00:08:00,933 --> 00:08:03,133 Speaker 5: when he hit the first one, and I think the 137 00:08:03,133 --> 00:08:07,093 Speaker 5: first one went wide of mid on and mcgesus how 138 00:08:07,133 --> 00:08:10,013 Speaker 5: of a big ground. He hit right in the middle, 139 00:08:10,413 --> 00:08:13,133 Speaker 5: and I actually thought, I don't think I've ever seen 140 00:08:13,173 --> 00:08:14,973 Speaker 5: anyone hit the ball so far, and I think it 141 00:08:15,053 --> 00:08:18,293 Speaker 5: might have been McLay, I can't remember. It was quite 142 00:08:18,333 --> 00:08:20,373 Speaker 5: exciting and I sort of said to him at the 143 00:08:20,453 --> 00:08:23,453 Speaker 5: end of that over, that's good hitting. You know, you're 144 00:08:23,493 --> 00:08:26,213 Speaker 5: really onto it. He just looked at me and wandered 145 00:08:26,213 --> 00:08:31,453 Speaker 5: off again, and he was sort of in a daze. 146 00:08:32,573 --> 00:08:34,133 Speaker 5: I mean, he was never going to win the game. 147 00:08:34,253 --> 00:08:35,813 Speaker 5: He would have had to score about one hundred and 148 00:08:35,813 --> 00:08:37,533 Speaker 5: forty for us to get any went close to the 149 00:08:37,533 --> 00:08:41,493 Speaker 5: Australian score. I think in the during the partnership, I 150 00:08:41,573 --> 00:08:45,573 Speaker 5: went from nought to three and he went from nought 151 00:08:46,093 --> 00:08:48,773 Speaker 5: to about forty six or something that I can't remember now. 152 00:08:48,933 --> 00:08:52,533 Speaker 5: But he was heading the ball so well. The Australian 153 00:08:52,613 --> 00:08:55,773 Speaker 5: team never got upset about it. Obviously they were going 154 00:08:55,853 --> 00:08:59,933 Speaker 5: to win the game. I can't say they enjoyed it individually. 155 00:08:59,973 --> 00:09:03,253 Speaker 5: The ballers didn't like it, but he hit over mid off. 156 00:09:03,773 --> 00:09:06,773 Speaker 5: He hit the big one hander that went wide of 157 00:09:07,293 --> 00:09:11,813 Speaker 5: fine leg, very wide down between finding and squealing. It 158 00:09:11,893 --> 00:09:14,733 Speaker 5: was basically one hand because his other hand came off 159 00:09:14,733 --> 00:09:19,133 Speaker 5: the bat. It was just something that you had to 160 00:09:19,173 --> 00:09:21,853 Speaker 5: be there to really believe it was happening. I was 161 00:09:21,893 --> 00:09:24,373 Speaker 5: so excited down my end. I remember once at the 162 00:09:24,373 --> 00:09:28,653 Speaker 5: start of an over getting a single and Lance nodded 163 00:09:28,733 --> 00:09:32,093 Speaker 5: as if I had deliberately tried to give him the strike. Well, 164 00:09:32,173 --> 00:09:36,893 Speaker 5: that was not happening. I had no intention of trying 165 00:09:36,893 --> 00:09:38,893 Speaker 5: to give him the strike. I was quite keen on 166 00:09:38,973 --> 00:09:41,693 Speaker 5: me not having the strike. But it was exciting, it 167 00:09:41,733 --> 00:09:44,373 Speaker 5: really was, and it launched something for Lance as well, 168 00:09:44,853 --> 00:09:47,853 Speaker 5: because remember he had the Newberry bats which had a 169 00:09:47,893 --> 00:09:51,013 Speaker 5: sort of an orangey really sort of stripe across the 170 00:09:51,053 --> 00:09:54,213 Speaker 5: top of them. And I think a long time ago, 171 00:09:54,333 --> 00:09:56,933 Speaker 5: but I think that's what launched the excal of it, 172 00:09:56,973 --> 00:09:59,733 Speaker 5: which was the bat that Lance became really famous for 173 00:10:00,173 --> 00:10:03,333 Speaker 5: with the sloping shoulders. And I think really it was 174 00:10:03,573 --> 00:10:06,693 Speaker 5: around that time that people were sort of picking up 175 00:10:06,773 --> 00:10:10,653 Speaker 5: on different types of bat, and the original old bats, 176 00:10:12,013 --> 00:10:15,293 Speaker 5: the endless willows, weren't as popular perhaps as the bats 177 00:10:15,293 --> 00:10:19,413 Speaker 5: that were being made on mass in Australia and in India, 178 00:10:19,413 --> 00:10:24,013 Speaker 5: and that's what you got Lance's name up in headlines. 179 00:10:24,013 --> 00:10:25,453 Speaker 5: Really was it the bat? 180 00:10:25,853 --> 00:10:29,653 Speaker 3: Was it him or was it his ability to time 181 00:10:29,813 --> 00:10:32,773 Speaker 3: the ball? Because they were sweet sexes, It wasn't. They 182 00:10:32,813 --> 00:10:35,573 Speaker 3: weren't miss it as such, they cleared the fence by 183 00:10:35,653 --> 00:10:39,373 Speaker 3: quite some considerable margin. How much was it his strength 184 00:10:39,813 --> 00:10:42,213 Speaker 3: or how much might have been the bat? And how 185 00:10:42,213 --> 00:10:42,973 Speaker 3: heavy was it? 186 00:10:43,133 --> 00:10:45,093 Speaker 5: Was his strength for a start, where if we can 187 00:10:45,133 --> 00:10:48,413 Speaker 5: remember Lance Ken's and we remember him mainly with his 188 00:10:48,493 --> 00:10:54,333 Speaker 5: bowling action and the size of his shoulders, the handshake 189 00:10:54,453 --> 00:10:57,813 Speaker 5: that crushed your fingers, Lance is a big chap And 190 00:10:58,733 --> 00:11:01,613 Speaker 5: on his day he could hit the ball very very hard. 191 00:11:01,653 --> 00:11:04,493 Speaker 5: Now we watched modern day cricket and they hit the 192 00:11:04,493 --> 00:11:07,613 Speaker 5: ball not very hard at all. They used the pace 193 00:11:07,653 --> 00:11:09,853 Speaker 5: of the ball and it flies to the boundary which 194 00:11:09,933 --> 00:11:12,733 Speaker 5: is now obviously thirty or forty meters short of what 195 00:11:12,893 --> 00:11:15,533 Speaker 5: used to be at Melbourne. He hit it clean, and 196 00:11:15,573 --> 00:11:19,013 Speaker 5: he hit it, you know, really with the timing he had. 197 00:11:19,653 --> 00:11:22,453 Speaker 5: And also I think sometimes you get into a wee 198 00:11:22,493 --> 00:11:25,173 Speaker 5: bit of a rhythm. Probably happened once in my life, 199 00:11:25,173 --> 00:11:29,693 Speaker 5: I suppose. But he was he was in the mood 200 00:11:30,373 --> 00:11:33,493 Speaker 5: and they were bowling in the slot and he just 201 00:11:33,533 --> 00:11:36,053 Speaker 5: decided we're not going to win the game, we'll have 202 00:11:36,093 --> 00:11:39,173 Speaker 5: some fun. And he didn't show a lot of emotion 203 00:11:39,293 --> 00:11:42,093 Speaker 5: mans He just hit it, looked down my way, had 204 00:11:42,093 --> 00:11:44,573 Speaker 5: a bit of a smile on it, just a slight 205 00:11:44,613 --> 00:11:47,213 Speaker 5: smile on his face, and shrugged his shoulders and waited 206 00:11:47,253 --> 00:11:51,093 Speaker 5: for the next delivery. I think I was doing most 207 00:11:51,093 --> 00:11:55,173 Speaker 5: of the laughing, and probably probably laughing because I was 208 00:11:55,173 --> 00:11:57,653 Speaker 5: at the other end and I was close to the action, 209 00:11:57,973 --> 00:12:01,253 Speaker 5: but not I wasn't the action, which was pretty beneficial 210 00:12:01,253 --> 00:12:01,453 Speaker 5: for me. 211 00:12:01,533 --> 00:12:04,533 Speaker 3: Really well, the Australian bowlers and I mean I can't 212 00:12:04,573 --> 00:12:09,733 Speaker 3: imagine Lily accepting being hit for six or Rodney Hogg 213 00:12:09,813 --> 00:12:10,653 Speaker 3: being hit for six. 214 00:12:11,533 --> 00:12:17,133 Speaker 5: No, I can't remember them bouncing him, which was either 215 00:12:17,173 --> 00:12:21,053 Speaker 5: they weren't giving him credit for coming out and being 216 00:12:21,253 --> 00:12:24,693 Speaker 5: a batsman and therefore they thought we could just move 217 00:12:24,693 --> 00:12:26,933 Speaker 5: it around off the seam a little bit, or bowl 218 00:12:26,933 --> 00:12:29,853 Speaker 5: a slightly slower ball or whatever and we'd get the wicket. 219 00:12:30,133 --> 00:12:33,013 Speaker 5: Because I can remember in test matches you would never 220 00:12:33,013 --> 00:12:35,733 Speaker 5: have got away with that. You would hit one ball 221 00:12:35,733 --> 00:12:37,773 Speaker 5: well for a boundary and you'd know the next one 222 00:12:37,893 --> 00:12:41,333 Speaker 5: we got past your nose. They I don't think they 223 00:12:41,333 --> 00:12:44,373 Speaker 5: were happy with it, but they were also were never panicking. 224 00:12:44,373 --> 00:12:47,213 Speaker 5: They were never going to lose the game. They were 225 00:12:47,253 --> 00:12:51,653 Speaker 5: just thinking, well, this can't continue. One six, two six's, 226 00:12:52,133 --> 00:12:55,013 Speaker 5: three six's. And I think there was a little bit 227 00:12:55,013 --> 00:12:58,293 Speaker 5: of hey, come on, that's enough of that. But Lance 228 00:12:58,413 --> 00:13:00,453 Speaker 5: was just as I said before, he was in the mood. 229 00:13:00,893 --> 00:13:06,253 Speaker 5: Timing was important, and also the leg side hitting using 230 00:13:06,333 --> 00:13:10,053 Speaker 5: his front shoulder and being able to hit it over 231 00:13:10,133 --> 00:13:13,493 Speaker 5: what he was aiming at mid wicket. Perhaps if he 232 00:13:13,573 --> 00:13:15,773 Speaker 5: hit it earlier went to mid on if you heard it. 233 00:13:15,813 --> 00:13:18,253 Speaker 5: If he hit it slightly later, it went finer than that. 234 00:13:18,893 --> 00:13:21,333 Speaker 5: It was just one of those occasions that I'm sure 235 00:13:21,373 --> 00:13:25,133 Speaker 5: even Lance now will look back on and deep down 236 00:13:25,173 --> 00:13:26,533 Speaker 5: it will be we smile on his face. 237 00:13:27,573 --> 00:13:30,653 Speaker 3: Yes, there would have been a bit of I suppose 238 00:13:31,253 --> 00:13:36,413 Speaker 3: liquid refreshment consumed at the mcg bay thirteen or whatever 239 00:13:36,413 --> 00:13:38,693 Speaker 3: it was in that place, and they seemed to be 240 00:13:38,733 --> 00:13:42,573 Speaker 3: getting excited. It was a case of either is he 241 00:13:42,573 --> 00:13:44,453 Speaker 3: going to hit another six? Or when's he going to 242 00:13:44,493 --> 00:13:44,893 Speaker 3: get out? 243 00:13:45,933 --> 00:13:48,133 Speaker 5: I think I think the crowd were willing him. They 244 00:13:48,173 --> 00:13:53,493 Speaker 5: were willing him on the noise from the crowd and 245 00:13:52,893 --> 00:13:57,453 Speaker 5: the hand clapping, the rhythmical hand clapping just got louder 246 00:13:57,453 --> 00:14:01,213 Speaker 5: and louder as Lance was as bowlers were running into 247 00:14:01,293 --> 00:14:05,173 Speaker 5: Lance and he turned the whole crowd. I mean it 248 00:14:05,293 --> 00:14:07,893 Speaker 5: went completely on his side. Of course, Australia, we're going 249 00:14:07,893 --> 00:14:09,693 Speaker 5: to win the game. There was no way in New 250 00:14:09,773 --> 00:14:12,013 Speaker 5: Zealand we're going to win the game. But they liked 251 00:14:12,013 --> 00:14:16,413 Speaker 5: the entertainment and they love the underdog. And the underdog 252 00:14:16,613 --> 00:14:17,813 Speaker 5: on that occasion was Lance. 253 00:14:18,453 --> 00:14:21,053 Speaker 3: You put on forty eight. I think it was in 254 00:14:21,093 --> 00:14:26,773 Speaker 3: a partnership. You faced nine balls and scored three three singles, 255 00:14:26,853 --> 00:14:27,693 Speaker 3: quite clearly. 256 00:14:27,973 --> 00:14:30,933 Speaker 5: Yeah, each time trying to give Lance the strike. Don't 257 00:14:31,093 --> 00:14:33,733 Speaker 5: take that away. I mean it was quite important. No, 258 00:14:33,933 --> 00:14:36,053 Speaker 5: So I was trying to get a single off ball 259 00:14:36,093 --> 00:14:38,773 Speaker 5: one or ball two to give Lance the strike, which 260 00:14:38,813 --> 00:14:42,013 Speaker 5: was yeah, Lance was looking for that, but I was 261 00:14:42,133 --> 00:14:46,253 Speaker 5: encouraging him to come down the other end and to continue. 262 00:14:46,813 --> 00:14:48,133 Speaker 5: I don't know why. I don't know why I was 263 00:14:48,213 --> 00:14:50,933 Speaker 5: encouraging him, because he just looked blankly at me and 264 00:14:51,013 --> 00:14:54,493 Speaker 5: wandered off. The noise of the crowd was probably too 265 00:14:54,573 --> 00:14:55,773 Speaker 5: much because he didn't hear much. 266 00:14:56,693 --> 00:15:00,853 Speaker 3: Yeah, well, we all knew about Kensey's problem with hearing 267 00:15:01,453 --> 00:15:05,093 Speaker 3: as such, during his career. Jerry, you played that match, 268 00:15:05,293 --> 00:15:10,413 Speaker 3: not memorable for the result, but Lance playing as only 269 00:15:10,533 --> 00:15:12,013 Speaker 3: he seemed capable of. 270 00:15:12,413 --> 00:15:14,453 Speaker 2: Yeah, he's a classic, he was. He was a very 271 00:15:14,453 --> 00:15:19,973 Speaker 2: important part of our team. Lance, you know, obviously for 272 00:15:20,053 --> 00:15:25,773 Speaker 2: his bowling. First of all longovers, you know, long long spells, 273 00:15:26,493 --> 00:15:31,253 Speaker 2: moved the ball most in most conditions, had varieties, loved 274 00:15:31,693 --> 00:15:37,133 Speaker 2: loved trying things out. He used to anger Jeff howerth 275 00:15:37,173 --> 00:15:42,333 Speaker 2: a lot. He used to call him Hines the Heinz bowler. Heines. 276 00:15:42,373 --> 00:15:46,533 Speaker 2: Of course, they had many different varieties of baked beans 277 00:15:46,573 --> 00:15:51,213 Speaker 2: and all sorts of things. So yeah, it was. It 278 00:15:51,253 --> 00:15:51,773 Speaker 2: was a shame. 279 00:15:51,893 --> 00:15:52,213 Speaker 3: Really. 280 00:15:52,613 --> 00:15:55,573 Speaker 2: We'd played pretty well right throughout that whole series against 281 00:15:55,613 --> 00:15:59,213 Speaker 2: England and we'd made the finals. This was the second 282 00:15:59,333 --> 00:16:02,773 Speaker 2: final and first one was was a wet affair in 283 00:16:02,853 --> 00:16:08,253 Speaker 2: Sydney and it was interrupted and so it suited Australia. 284 00:16:09,373 --> 00:16:12,733 Speaker 2: And then this match was I think at the mcg 285 00:16:13,933 --> 00:16:20,333 Speaker 2: large ground, big crowd, and yeah, they batted pretty well 286 00:16:22,093 --> 00:16:27,013 Speaker 2: and all I remember is them getting a very large score. 287 00:16:27,053 --> 00:16:30,013 Speaker 2: I think in those days, anything over three hundred was 288 00:16:30,053 --> 00:16:34,093 Speaker 2: massive and they did get over that. I did get 289 00:16:34,093 --> 00:16:37,653 Speaker 2: a wicket. Graham Wood fell asleep from hitting me and 290 00:16:37,733 --> 00:16:42,133 Speaker 2: missed was a pretty straight one. But apart from that, Wads, 291 00:16:42,333 --> 00:16:46,693 Speaker 2: I think I've got a feeling, you know, Kim Hughes 292 00:16:46,813 --> 00:16:50,333 Speaker 2: might have been captain instead of Greg Chapel. I think 293 00:16:50,333 --> 00:16:55,053 Speaker 2: he was there before Greg Chapel. And yeah, and after 294 00:16:55,093 --> 00:16:58,493 Speaker 2: he was pretty patronizing after it he said, oh New 295 00:16:58,533 --> 00:17:02,333 Speaker 2: Zealand aren't a bad side. But really we always felt 296 00:17:02,373 --> 00:17:05,693 Speaker 2: that England with a team to beat, and we all 297 00:17:05,733 --> 00:17:08,813 Speaker 2: felt up felt as if we was going and someone 298 00:17:08,893 --> 00:17:10,813 Speaker 2: was going to bomb in Pat's Lance. But perhaps he 299 00:17:10,893 --> 00:17:16,053 Speaker 2: didn't hear him either when he spoke, But I I 300 00:17:16,053 --> 00:17:20,933 Speaker 2: do remember Wally betting with him actually and having to 301 00:17:20,973 --> 00:17:25,333 Speaker 2: hold up his hand and try to try to get 302 00:17:25,333 --> 00:17:27,333 Speaker 2: communication with Lance because because I mean there was a 303 00:17:27,493 --> 00:17:32,453 Speaker 2: there was a hell of a noise and Lance I 304 00:17:32,453 --> 00:17:35,813 Speaker 2: wouldn't have heard him at all. So we'd all sort 305 00:17:35,813 --> 00:17:38,053 Speaker 2: of worked out that you had to use hands signals 306 00:17:38,133 --> 00:17:41,453 Speaker 2: rather like a traffic officer than those days when the points, 307 00:17:41,493 --> 00:17:45,813 Speaker 2: you know, all the lights stop and you so. But 308 00:17:46,213 --> 00:17:50,493 Speaker 2: he could certainly hit Kensy. So a disappointing end to 309 00:17:50,573 --> 00:17:54,533 Speaker 2: what had been actually a bloody good sort of you know, 310 00:17:54,733 --> 00:17:58,733 Speaker 2: series of matches, lots of matches and we got through. 311 00:17:59,013 --> 00:18:02,493 Speaker 3: Yes, and wonderful memories there from Jeremy Canney and from 312 00:18:02,893 --> 00:18:04,813 Speaker 3: Wally Lees. He's going to stay with us and give 313 00:18:04,893 --> 00:18:08,693 Speaker 3: us some comments on the Try series as well, and 314 00:18:08,733 --> 00:18:11,493 Speaker 3: I love those moments and you can never forget the 315 00:18:11,493 --> 00:18:15,693 Speaker 3: way Ken's battered on that occasion and on other occasions 316 00:18:15,733 --> 00:18:19,013 Speaker 3: he was very exciting to watch. Not always winning games 317 00:18:19,013 --> 00:18:21,573 Speaker 3: for New Zealand, but certainly an entertainer. 318 00:18:21,813 --> 00:18:25,573 Speaker 1: Brian Wadall Jeremy Coney on the front foot. 319 00:18:26,973 --> 00:18:29,973 Speaker 3: Well, the black Caps have another date with Pakistan and 320 00:18:30,013 --> 00:18:33,813 Speaker 3: the Tri Series final, warming up for the champions Trophy 321 00:18:34,573 --> 00:18:37,733 Speaker 3: and they're due to meat to Pakistan in Karachi in 322 00:18:37,733 --> 00:18:40,853 Speaker 3: the first game. But two from two you can't ask 323 00:18:40,973 --> 00:18:43,853 Speaker 3: four better than that, well perhaps you can. There are 324 00:18:43,893 --> 00:18:47,773 Speaker 3: a few things to sharpen up. And while he's been 325 00:18:47,773 --> 00:18:51,173 Speaker 3: watching the games as well as Jerry, and it does 326 00:18:51,213 --> 00:18:55,453 Speaker 3: make for late nights and various things. But interesting to 327 00:18:55,533 --> 00:19:00,893 Speaker 3: look at the black Caps. They've been testing out their 328 00:19:01,093 --> 00:19:04,773 Speaker 3: new boys. They've been consistent in their selection the same side, 329 00:19:04,773 --> 00:19:08,333 Speaker 3: apart from one change because of injury, and the new 330 00:19:08,413 --> 00:19:11,893 Speaker 3: boys in the bowling lineup. We've been working with some 331 00:19:11,973 --> 00:19:14,893 Speaker 3: of the more experienced players at the top level. 332 00:19:16,053 --> 00:19:19,773 Speaker 5: There is some experience in the bowling attack. The team 333 00:19:19,853 --> 00:19:22,893 Speaker 5: have a lot of players who have gone on many 334 00:19:22,973 --> 00:19:26,493 Speaker 5: tours and play very few games, and therefore again they're 335 00:19:26,533 --> 00:19:30,893 Speaker 5: being exposed now and given the opportunity. It's an important tour. 336 00:19:31,813 --> 00:19:34,533 Speaker 5: Williamson's back and I think that's very, very key to 337 00:19:34,613 --> 00:19:37,253 Speaker 5: the New Zealand performance. I mean, the black Caps are 338 00:19:37,293 --> 00:19:40,373 Speaker 5: searching for the Williamson experience both on the field and 339 00:19:41,013 --> 00:19:43,333 Speaker 5: in the dressing room, and I think that's quite important. 340 00:19:44,213 --> 00:19:47,853 Speaker 5: I did note that the commentators made quite a lot 341 00:19:47,853 --> 00:19:52,493 Speaker 5: of comment about playing South Africa b or not their 342 00:19:52,533 --> 00:19:56,013 Speaker 5: top team, and we understand that's the way of the 343 00:19:56,053 --> 00:19:59,893 Speaker 5: world in cricket now because players aren't available and some 344 00:20:00,493 --> 00:20:03,533 Speaker 5: countries don't always see in the top players. But the 345 00:20:03,573 --> 00:20:06,053 Speaker 5: important thing is to win and to win well. And 346 00:20:06,173 --> 00:20:10,413 Speaker 5: both games have been really laid quite constructively by the 347 00:20:10,453 --> 00:20:14,373 Speaker 5: New Zealand team and everyone seems to be informed or 348 00:20:14,813 --> 00:20:18,213 Speaker 5: getting themselves back in form. I think that's quite important 349 00:20:19,213 --> 00:20:23,013 Speaker 5: because it's a try series. I suppose it's a wee 350 00:20:23,053 --> 00:20:26,933 Speaker 5: bit of experimentation and looking for who's really at the 351 00:20:26,933 --> 00:20:28,893 Speaker 5: top of their game when they get to the champions 352 00:20:29,653 --> 00:20:31,973 Speaker 5: the big tournament and I think it's a really good 353 00:20:32,693 --> 00:20:34,653 Speaker 5: lesson that we learned a couple of years ago when 354 00:20:34,693 --> 00:20:38,533 Speaker 5: we appeared on one of these overseas tours and hadn't 355 00:20:38,613 --> 00:20:42,773 Speaker 5: taken the time to practice and get practice games. If 356 00:20:42,813 --> 00:20:44,893 Speaker 5: you remember, there was a bit of controversy about the 357 00:20:45,133 --> 00:20:49,293 Speaker 5: we appeared at one of these tournaments unprepared. Well this time, 358 00:20:49,333 --> 00:20:52,573 Speaker 5: I think we've given the players every opportunity and I 359 00:20:52,613 --> 00:20:57,413 Speaker 5: think it's pretty successful. I like the way people can 360 00:20:57,453 --> 00:20:59,653 Speaker 5: move slightly up and down the order and they're in 361 00:20:59,693 --> 00:21:02,613 Speaker 5: good form. And it also gives you the impression that 362 00:21:02,653 --> 00:21:06,453 Speaker 5: it's a happy team again, because I really think that 363 00:21:06,933 --> 00:21:09,733 Speaker 5: is key to the way we play. We haven't always 364 00:21:09,733 --> 00:21:13,653 Speaker 5: fielded well in some of these games recently, and we 365 00:21:13,733 --> 00:21:16,213 Speaker 5: need our fielding to be honest. The fielding comes from 366 00:21:16,253 --> 00:21:18,613 Speaker 5: a happy team because that's when you that's when you 367 00:21:18,653 --> 00:21:21,653 Speaker 5: communicate with each other the most. And I think the 368 00:21:21,693 --> 00:21:25,693 Speaker 5: preparations pretty jolly good. But Williamson absolutely key to the 369 00:21:25,693 --> 00:21:26,133 Speaker 5: whole thing. 370 00:21:27,133 --> 00:21:31,413 Speaker 3: Yeah right, well, he can't disagree and inform. Williamson is 371 00:21:31,493 --> 00:21:33,693 Speaker 3: key to any Black Cap side. Just what you were 372 00:21:33,693 --> 00:21:36,413 Speaker 3: saying a little bit earlier at the start of the program, Jerry, 373 00:21:36,453 --> 00:21:40,653 Speaker 3: that the need for somebody of class and being able 374 00:21:40,693 --> 00:21:45,453 Speaker 3: to use his skills and help the team develop it. 375 00:21:45,453 --> 00:21:48,613 Speaker 3: It's it's important in the way you go. And they've 376 00:21:48,653 --> 00:21:50,253 Speaker 3: made the right sort of start, haven't they. 377 00:21:50,533 --> 00:21:52,933 Speaker 2: Yeah, he came in early in the first game, didn't he? 378 00:21:52,973 --> 00:21:57,453 Speaker 2: When when Young was dismissed and he was he had 379 00:21:57,533 --> 00:22:00,613 Speaker 2: to battle in that first and things. It wasn't an 380 00:22:00,613 --> 00:22:04,293 Speaker 2: easy pitch for him and and he but he worked out. 381 00:22:04,293 --> 00:22:08,773 Speaker 2: He solves problems really well out in the middle and 382 00:22:09,613 --> 00:22:14,293 Speaker 2: finally worked a bit of rhythm into his game. And 383 00:22:14,373 --> 00:22:18,253 Speaker 2: that's what he does. He doesn't give it away and 384 00:22:18,293 --> 00:22:20,573 Speaker 2: play a big shot and get out. He just works 385 00:22:20,613 --> 00:22:22,333 Speaker 2: away out And so he got a fifty odd in 386 00:22:22,333 --> 00:22:26,613 Speaker 2: that match and had a good partnership with Mitchell who 387 00:22:26,653 --> 00:22:31,333 Speaker 2: came in a little later and was able to sort 388 00:22:31,333 --> 00:22:38,413 Speaker 2: of play his style as well. But Williamson, he's such 389 00:22:38,573 --> 00:22:42,013 Speaker 2: a hard competitor as well. He doesn't appear that way 390 00:22:42,973 --> 00:22:46,053 Speaker 2: if he has quite a gentle sort of guy, and 391 00:22:46,133 --> 00:22:49,573 Speaker 2: yet he knows exactly what he's trying to do, trying 392 00:22:49,613 --> 00:22:55,133 Speaker 2: to work out solutions to certain bowlers and the range 393 00:22:55,173 --> 00:22:58,933 Speaker 2: of shots that he can play. And then of course 394 00:22:58,973 --> 00:23:01,253 Speaker 2: a very big partnership came in a little bit later 395 00:23:01,853 --> 00:23:07,213 Speaker 2: in the second match, once Conway and Young had set fifty, 396 00:23:07,253 --> 00:23:10,693 Speaker 2: I think up for the first wicket, and there he 397 00:23:10,813 --> 00:23:14,293 Speaker 2: was able to show everybody on a better pitch this 398 00:23:14,453 --> 00:23:21,133 Speaker 2: time batting second, just the range of shots that he's gotten. 399 00:23:21,133 --> 00:23:26,253 Speaker 2: You can't stop him. He's continually scoring and so he 400 00:23:26,453 --> 00:23:28,973 Speaker 2: was over a runner ball easily, I think in that 401 00:23:29,173 --> 00:23:33,293 Speaker 2: second innings against South Africa, and in a week in 402 00:23:33,373 --> 00:23:35,533 Speaker 2: South Africa, one would say that's not going to be 403 00:23:35,613 --> 00:23:38,693 Speaker 2: the side we're going to see in the Champions Trophy. 404 00:23:39,013 --> 00:23:44,293 Speaker 2: But nevertheless they had to play well. Conway, of course, 405 00:23:44,453 --> 00:23:49,013 Speaker 2: wadds he looks, he looked like he looked the change man. 406 00:23:49,053 --> 00:23:53,533 Speaker 2: Really didn't he gone was that, you know, the one 407 00:23:53,573 --> 00:23:58,773 Speaker 2: hand on the bat constantly, that the worry about defense, 408 00:23:59,853 --> 00:24:02,693 Speaker 2: and he kind of showed us the form that we 409 00:24:02,733 --> 00:24:06,813 Speaker 2: saw when he first arrived. Some of the shots through 410 00:24:06,853 --> 00:24:13,253 Speaker 2: the covers a perceptible difference really, you know when he 411 00:24:13,293 --> 00:24:15,773 Speaker 2: plays that way against the new ball for New Zealand 412 00:24:15,773 --> 00:24:20,733 Speaker 2: and a major boost to the side. Mitchell didn't quite 413 00:24:20,773 --> 00:24:25,213 Speaker 2: get so many the second innings, but you know, he's 414 00:24:25,253 --> 00:24:28,453 Speaker 2: just got to keep pushing himself. He's got to learn 415 00:24:28,533 --> 00:24:31,693 Speaker 2: from Williamson about how you keep working and working and 416 00:24:31,773 --> 00:24:36,093 Speaker 2: working at it. Latham, of course, look if he's not 417 00:24:36,213 --> 00:24:38,853 Speaker 2: scoring runs, He's got two ducks so far, hasn't he 418 00:24:39,413 --> 00:24:42,493 Speaker 2: And if you go back into the Sri Lankan series 419 00:24:42,533 --> 00:24:47,413 Speaker 2: as well, that wasn't against the in the ode eyes 420 00:24:48,093 --> 00:24:50,173 Speaker 2: he didn't bat in the base in reserve and then 421 00:24:50,213 --> 00:24:53,093 Speaker 2: Hamilton he got one off the first ball and then 422 00:24:53,213 --> 00:24:56,053 Speaker 2: ran himself out going for a second. And then in 423 00:24:56,133 --> 00:24:59,333 Speaker 2: the third innings he punched one off the back foot 424 00:24:59,373 --> 00:25:02,213 Speaker 2: and was caught backward point first ball. So he's had 425 00:25:02,533 --> 00:25:06,813 Speaker 2: a series of low scores now and he just really 426 00:25:06,893 --> 00:25:10,773 Speaker 2: needs to get himself in. We haven't got another wicket 427 00:25:10,893 --> 00:25:14,853 Speaker 2: keeper over there. Really, I think the days of Conway 428 00:25:14,933 --> 00:25:18,493 Speaker 2: and using people like that are gone. We've got to 429 00:25:18,533 --> 00:25:23,493 Speaker 2: start start picking keepers, don't we. I mean keeper first, 430 00:25:24,613 --> 00:25:27,813 Speaker 2: and if Latham isn't going to score the runs, then 431 00:25:27,853 --> 00:25:31,373 Speaker 2: we go to somebody else, our best keeper. But he's 432 00:25:31,373 --> 00:25:34,413 Speaker 2: got to get himself in in this competition five or 433 00:25:34,453 --> 00:25:39,493 Speaker 2: six balls and get forward or get back and play tightly. 434 00:25:39,613 --> 00:25:41,773 Speaker 2: Don't even play a shot if you don't have to. 435 00:25:42,493 --> 00:25:47,493 Speaker 2: And really it's not a long term solution. We've always 436 00:25:47,573 --> 00:25:52,733 Speaker 2: done these things, and really he's an opener and test matches. 437 00:25:53,773 --> 00:25:54,013 Speaker 1: Yeah. 438 00:25:54,173 --> 00:25:58,933 Speaker 3: Interesting point made there, Jerry about the wiki keeper and Whalley. 439 00:25:59,373 --> 00:26:02,333 Speaker 3: I know you have views on that in terms of 440 00:26:02,333 --> 00:26:04,933 Speaker 3: being a former coach and also a former wiki keeper. 441 00:26:05,133 --> 00:26:09,173 Speaker 3: Do we need to have a frontline keeper like Mitchay 442 00:26:09,253 --> 00:26:12,013 Speaker 3: who they've started about, but he looks totally adequate. 443 00:26:13,093 --> 00:26:17,213 Speaker 5: I think too too often we worry about the lower 444 00:26:17,333 --> 00:26:20,453 Speaker 5: middle order as we bat. And I know it doesn't 445 00:26:20,453 --> 00:26:22,053 Speaker 5: sound like the question you've asked. What it is that 446 00:26:22,173 --> 00:26:25,813 Speaker 5: in the actual fact, we're looking at the second spinner 447 00:26:26,413 --> 00:26:30,173 Speaker 5: and we think where will he bat? And we're thinking 448 00:26:30,173 --> 00:26:32,773 Speaker 5: about the wicket keeper and thinking, well, where can he that? 449 00:26:33,613 --> 00:26:36,013 Speaker 5: And I think you're did right. You've got to have 450 00:26:36,133 --> 00:26:38,653 Speaker 5: your best wicket keeper. And if he happens to be 451 00:26:38,733 --> 00:26:41,293 Speaker 5: someone who needs to beat at eight because we've got 452 00:26:41,293 --> 00:26:43,613 Speaker 5: a second spinner who can bat at seven or a 453 00:26:43,693 --> 00:26:46,253 Speaker 5: fourth seaman who can bat at seven, that's so be it. 454 00:26:46,853 --> 00:26:50,373 Speaker 5: And I think they're forgetting that the wiki keeper is 455 00:26:50,413 --> 00:26:53,533 Speaker 5: a specialist position. It's not an all rounder position. You 456 00:26:53,613 --> 00:26:56,893 Speaker 5: don't need to be someone who can can bat it. 457 00:26:57,053 --> 00:27:00,733 Speaker 5: Five or six other players can do that job. I 458 00:27:00,733 --> 00:27:03,853 Speaker 5: think we've missed the Boat over the last three or 459 00:27:03,853 --> 00:27:06,213 Speaker 5: four years a little bit with wicket keeping, and that 460 00:27:07,533 --> 00:27:10,333 Speaker 5: it doesn't look like there's a wicket keeping coach. I'm 461 00:27:10,373 --> 00:27:12,013 Speaker 5: not saying Warren Leeds is going to be one, so 462 00:27:12,093 --> 00:27:14,893 Speaker 5: don't worry, but there's not a wicket keeping coach in 463 00:27:14,933 --> 00:27:19,853 Speaker 5: the country who's solely producing wicket keepers. So we've got 464 00:27:19,893 --> 00:27:22,333 Speaker 5: lots and lots of part timers and all our first 465 00:27:22,333 --> 00:27:26,773 Speaker 5: class teams. I think there's the Otago team, for example, 466 00:27:27,013 --> 00:27:29,413 Speaker 5: has got as many as four people who could wicket keep, 467 00:27:29,813 --> 00:27:33,453 Speaker 5: and they're all could wiki keep. But I think we 468 00:27:33,493 --> 00:27:35,933 Speaker 5: lost the We lost the boat a weaver, but when 469 00:27:36,573 --> 00:27:39,213 Speaker 5: we had players were he only fellow cipher it. I 470 00:27:39,253 --> 00:27:40,413 Speaker 5: don't know if you remember the name. 471 00:27:41,093 --> 00:27:41,653 Speaker 2: Wow. 472 00:27:42,013 --> 00:27:45,173 Speaker 5: I thought he was a specialist. I thought he was agile, 473 00:27:45,653 --> 00:27:49,813 Speaker 5: he had great timing, he had good hands, he was confident. 474 00:27:50,093 --> 00:27:52,573 Speaker 5: He was a little cheeky guy, a pit I didn't 475 00:27:52,573 --> 00:27:55,053 Speaker 5: even meet him, but he appeared that way, and he 476 00:27:55,133 --> 00:27:59,413 Speaker 5: took that attitude to his batting. And he's gone and 477 00:27:59,533 --> 00:28:01,973 Speaker 5: he plays around the world. Now I can see that. 478 00:28:02,013 --> 00:28:05,133 Speaker 5: But I think we just lost a webit there, and 479 00:28:05,173 --> 00:28:07,333 Speaker 5: I think what we need to do now is find 480 00:28:07,373 --> 00:28:10,573 Speaker 5: the best keeper and really work on that person that 481 00:28:10,853 --> 00:28:15,693 Speaker 5: runout that one handed catch, that person who tidies up 482 00:28:15,693 --> 00:28:19,453 Speaker 5: a loose fielding effort by the whole team and watches 483 00:28:19,493 --> 00:28:21,933 Speaker 5: the ball bounce in front of him rather than running 484 00:28:21,933 --> 00:28:24,973 Speaker 5: forward and catching on the fall and keep the game tidy. 485 00:28:25,333 --> 00:28:28,693 Speaker 5: Is very, very important to the overall performance on the 486 00:28:28,693 --> 00:28:30,373 Speaker 5: field of the New Zealand team and we need to 487 00:28:30,413 --> 00:28:31,533 Speaker 5: have the best keeper. 488 00:28:32,773 --> 00:28:36,693 Speaker 3: Yeah, fair point too, Wally. Both you and Jerry clearly 489 00:28:36,733 --> 00:28:39,733 Speaker 3: agree on the issue of having a keeper there, a 490 00:28:39,773 --> 00:28:43,573 Speaker 3: full time keeper, an expert keeper. I'm not being derogatory 491 00:28:44,053 --> 00:28:46,253 Speaker 3: of Conway and Lathan. I've done a great job behind 492 00:28:46,253 --> 00:28:49,133 Speaker 3: the stunts for New Zealand over a long period of time, 493 00:28:49,173 --> 00:28:51,093 Speaker 3: but I think we've got to get away from that. 494 00:28:51,573 --> 00:28:57,293 Speaker 3: As you were saying, getting back to the others who 495 00:28:57,293 --> 00:29:01,133 Speaker 3: were talking about previously and Jerry you were talking about, 496 00:29:01,693 --> 00:29:05,813 Speaker 3: as Wally, was the importance of Williamson in the side 497 00:29:05,893 --> 00:29:09,613 Speaker 3: and learning from him in the dressing room, copying what 498 00:29:09,733 --> 00:29:12,973 Speaker 3: he does or using his skills and making part of 499 00:29:12,973 --> 00:29:17,573 Speaker 3: the game. I noticed a change in Glenn Phillips with 500 00:29:17,733 --> 00:29:21,853 Speaker 3: that hundred. He hasn't been a high score in recent times, 501 00:29:22,413 --> 00:29:24,773 Speaker 3: but he spent some time he didn't look as though 502 00:29:24,773 --> 00:29:27,293 Speaker 3: he wanted to hit ball one for six and then 503 00:29:27,333 --> 00:29:30,373 Speaker 3: every second ball for six. He did the sixth hitting 504 00:29:30,373 --> 00:29:33,813 Speaker 3: when it came at happy hour. But that hundred I 505 00:29:33,893 --> 00:29:36,813 Speaker 3: thought was a quality innings from Phillips on the first game. 506 00:29:37,573 --> 00:29:41,453 Speaker 2: Yeah, just what was required really, because New Zealand needed 507 00:29:41,453 --> 00:29:43,653 Speaker 2: a bit of a lift, didn't they. And that's what 508 00:29:43,773 --> 00:29:47,213 Speaker 2: he supplies for the team. But you can't start from 509 00:29:47,333 --> 00:29:51,533 Speaker 2: ball one. Usually was and you know, lobbed the ball 510 00:29:51,973 --> 00:29:56,853 Speaker 2: consistently over the boundary. He paced himself, I thought throughout 511 00:29:56,933 --> 00:30:01,373 Speaker 2: that first innings when he was batting with Williamson and 512 00:30:03,093 --> 00:30:06,893 Speaker 2: then towards the end when he realized Williamson had gone. 513 00:30:06,893 --> 00:30:11,493 Speaker 2: At that stage, Latham of course had been dismissed, Mitchell 514 00:30:11,693 --> 00:30:15,293 Speaker 2: was gone, and you know brace will had an innings 515 00:30:15,333 --> 00:30:18,653 Speaker 2: that's good as well. And then Phillips of course, in 516 00:30:18,693 --> 00:30:23,413 Speaker 2: that last stection of that match against Pakistan, showed the 517 00:30:23,573 --> 00:30:28,733 Speaker 2: power that he that he had and possesses. So that's 518 00:30:28,773 --> 00:30:31,533 Speaker 2: good and that's what he is in that side. So 519 00:30:31,733 --> 00:30:34,293 Speaker 2: but he's better than just a slogger, and that's what 520 00:30:34,373 --> 00:30:36,733 Speaker 2: he's got to realize. There are plenty of things he 521 00:30:36,773 --> 00:30:39,933 Speaker 2: can offer. The Other thing was I think is we're 522 00:30:40,053 --> 00:30:46,293 Speaker 2: probably going to need six bowlers. It looks as though 523 00:30:47,493 --> 00:30:52,173 Speaker 2: the pictures in Pakistan are going to be high scoring affairs, 524 00:30:52,813 --> 00:30:58,173 Speaker 2: and if that's the case, then you know we're going 525 00:30:58,213 --> 00:31:01,733 Speaker 2: to probably need a six bowler at some point, and 526 00:31:01,973 --> 00:31:07,693 Speaker 2: maybe Phillips is that man. So he did pick up 527 00:31:07,733 --> 00:31:12,533 Speaker 2: a wicket that got an lbw I think at some point, 528 00:31:12,933 --> 00:31:17,453 Speaker 2: and I just feel he might well be the person 529 00:31:17,853 --> 00:31:20,933 Speaker 2: to keep him involved in the game as well, because 530 00:31:20,933 --> 00:31:25,093 Speaker 2: he's such a strong fielder, and to use them. And 531 00:31:25,093 --> 00:31:27,893 Speaker 2: we've got some young bowlers, as you pointed out right 532 00:31:27,933 --> 00:31:31,693 Speaker 2: at the top of the program, you know, like O'Rourke 533 00:31:31,813 --> 00:31:38,373 Speaker 2: still and like Sears and you know, particularly those two. Now, 534 00:31:38,813 --> 00:31:41,973 Speaker 2: whether Ferguson is coming, I don't know. I don't know 535 00:31:42,013 --> 00:31:44,973 Speaker 2: whether he's Has that been decided yet? 536 00:31:45,773 --> 00:31:49,093 Speaker 3: No, well, I mean apparently was. I don't know. We 537 00:31:49,213 --> 00:31:51,253 Speaker 3: just have to wait and see Duffy is there as 538 00:31:51,293 --> 00:31:51,813 Speaker 3: a backup. 539 00:31:52,413 --> 00:31:55,773 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Well it's a question of whether they give 540 00:31:55,813 --> 00:31:57,733 Speaker 2: Duffy a role in in that case. If they know 541 00:31:57,853 --> 00:32:00,493 Speaker 2: Ferguson's not going to be there, they might just want 542 00:32:00,533 --> 00:32:03,653 Speaker 2: to give him a role as well in the in 543 00:32:03,693 --> 00:32:06,493 Speaker 2: the final. I'm not sure but they'll need to sort 544 00:32:06,533 --> 00:32:09,013 Speaker 2: out a few things with the ball. When you're under 545 00:32:09,053 --> 00:32:12,573 Speaker 2: pressure and teams are scoring over three hundred against you, 546 00:32:13,093 --> 00:32:17,253 Speaker 2: there are going to be awkward parts to the field 547 00:32:17,653 --> 00:32:24,133 Speaker 2: and to the bowlers in particular, I think really, I mean, 548 00:32:24,213 --> 00:32:28,093 Speaker 2: O'Rourke's an interesting one. Isn't he such a talented young 549 00:32:28,133 --> 00:32:32,333 Speaker 2: bowlin And we forget how young he is. He's only 550 00:32:32,373 --> 00:32:37,493 Speaker 2: twenty three, I think. But in his od eyes you know, 551 00:32:38,133 --> 00:32:42,973 Speaker 2: against Sri Lanka he went for fifty and fifty seven 552 00:32:43,573 --> 00:32:47,373 Speaker 2: and then over there he's been he's gone for forty 553 00:32:47,413 --> 00:32:50,973 Speaker 2: six or six overs and then ten overs match against 554 00:32:51,013 --> 00:32:54,333 Speaker 2: South Africa for seventy two and he's bold in those 555 00:32:54,413 --> 00:32:57,573 Speaker 2: five games, three against Sri Lanka and turned Pakistan twenty 556 00:32:57,613 --> 00:33:02,293 Speaker 2: three wides. Now that's in five games. That's almost an 557 00:33:02,333 --> 00:33:06,373 Speaker 2: extra over, isn't it. You know you're getting towards that 558 00:33:07,573 --> 00:33:12,053 Speaker 2: five balls over, you know, five balls per match, and 559 00:33:12,093 --> 00:33:15,293 Speaker 2: in that last game he had ten words, So that's 560 00:33:15,293 --> 00:33:19,613 Speaker 2: almost two extra overs. You can't afford that, And so 561 00:33:20,413 --> 00:33:25,813 Speaker 2: there's something And how we use O'Rourke I think is 562 00:33:25,853 --> 00:33:27,853 Speaker 2: important as well. Are we going to use him in 563 00:33:27,893 --> 00:33:31,493 Speaker 2: the power play? Is he really a sort of a 564 00:33:31,613 --> 00:33:34,733 Speaker 2: six or seven over man, and not at the death 565 00:33:35,653 --> 00:33:38,893 Speaker 2: because he tends to drop short a little bit and 566 00:33:38,933 --> 00:33:43,893 Speaker 2: that opens up third man over the keeper square on 567 00:33:43,973 --> 00:33:46,973 Speaker 2: the off side. And if you're really quick, he doesn't 568 00:33:47,013 --> 00:33:49,333 Speaker 2: get his line, then you can go leg side as well. 569 00:33:49,733 --> 00:33:52,533 Speaker 2: So if you're going to be a quick bowler in 570 00:33:52,693 --> 00:33:58,533 Speaker 2: international cricket and the big score is as you know, 571 00:33:58,573 --> 00:34:02,053 Speaker 2: as looming, you have to have a slower ball, I think, 572 00:34:02,373 --> 00:34:06,173 Speaker 2: and a good one. And both he and Seers I 573 00:34:06,173 --> 00:34:08,253 Speaker 2: shall see has tried a couple and they both went 574 00:34:08,373 --> 00:34:11,533 Speaker 2: wides down league side, but at least he was trying something, 575 00:34:13,093 --> 00:34:15,613 Speaker 2: and that's got to be something I think that they 576 00:34:15,693 --> 00:34:20,973 Speaker 2: need to develop. So they are the key ones as 577 00:34:21,013 --> 00:34:24,213 Speaker 2: far as I'm concerned. As far as the bowling is concerned, 578 00:34:24,333 --> 00:34:27,213 Speaker 2: I mean, Henry can do his thing. He uses that 579 00:34:27,373 --> 00:34:30,933 Speaker 2: shorter ball, he uses the slower ball, and then you're 580 00:34:30,933 --> 00:34:33,493 Speaker 2: into the spinners who are actually both bowling quite well. 581 00:34:33,573 --> 00:34:36,253 Speaker 2: Braceful has had two good games for the ball. 582 00:34:36,693 --> 00:34:39,133 Speaker 3: And Santa's going to need the variety, isn't he. You 583 00:34:39,173 --> 00:34:41,333 Speaker 3: say the sixth bowler is going to be important. We 584 00:34:41,413 --> 00:34:47,133 Speaker 3: can't expect the newer bowlers to be a million dollars 585 00:34:47,213 --> 00:34:50,453 Speaker 3: right from the odset, I mean sears and OROURQ our 586 00:34:50,493 --> 00:34:53,853 Speaker 3: future with pace and they obviously want pace and that's 587 00:34:53,893 --> 00:34:57,653 Speaker 3: a that's a good move. That's why they picked Ferguson 588 00:34:57,693 --> 00:34:59,893 Speaker 3: as well, to have a little bit of pace in 589 00:34:59,973 --> 00:35:03,693 Speaker 3: the lineup. But you know with that also comes those 590 00:35:04,093 --> 00:35:07,093 Speaker 3: sort of issues that you talked about, the odd wide 591 00:35:07,173 --> 00:35:09,813 Speaker 3: or the fact that they might be a little bit 592 00:35:09,973 --> 00:35:12,573 Speaker 3: expensive and satin that needs to be able to use 593 00:35:12,653 --> 00:35:15,893 Speaker 3: those players quite judiciously, doesn't he. 594 00:35:16,453 --> 00:35:21,013 Speaker 2: Yep, that's a challenge for the captain and the player 595 00:35:21,133 --> 00:35:24,933 Speaker 2: himself really just has to accept, well, today I may 596 00:35:24,973 --> 00:35:27,653 Speaker 2: not get ten overs. He doesn't have to feel he 597 00:35:27,733 --> 00:35:30,053 Speaker 2: lets the team down in any way. It's just the 598 00:35:30,053 --> 00:35:31,933 Speaker 2: way that it is, and you learn as you go. 599 00:35:32,133 --> 00:35:36,573 Speaker 2: It's a great learning experience for those two bowlers. So 600 00:35:37,573 --> 00:35:40,573 Speaker 2: Rurke's got the out and outpace and the bounce. He 601 00:35:40,693 --> 00:35:44,933 Speaker 2: really had them jumping in the South African innings and 602 00:35:44,973 --> 00:35:47,493 Speaker 2: so there's no doubt that both of them have got 603 00:35:47,533 --> 00:35:50,413 Speaker 2: their skills and they're worth their place in the side. 604 00:35:50,693 --> 00:35:54,013 Speaker 2: It's a different format, it has different questions that it 605 00:35:54,133 --> 00:35:57,053 Speaker 2: asks and they've got to then start to learn the 606 00:35:57,173 --> 00:36:01,053 Speaker 2: skills and the sets of skills that you require for 607 00:36:01,093 --> 00:36:03,893 Speaker 2: that format, and there are the ones that they haven't 608 00:36:03,933 --> 00:36:06,653 Speaker 2: perhaps used quite so much, they haven't needed to do, 609 00:36:07,173 --> 00:36:09,613 Speaker 2: so they're having to learn on the job, so to speak, 610 00:36:09,653 --> 00:36:10,293 Speaker 2: just a little bit. 611 00:36:10,533 --> 00:36:12,973 Speaker 3: Yeah, well that's the development of the side and it's 612 00:36:13,293 --> 00:36:17,053 Speaker 3: encouraging to see in the Try Series the development. It's 613 00:36:17,053 --> 00:36:19,933 Speaker 3: not the major prize, of course, that's the Champions Trophy. 614 00:36:20,413 --> 00:36:23,413 Speaker 3: We'll be keeping up to date with that throughout its progress. 615 00:36:23,413 --> 00:36:25,653 Speaker 3: It's over pretty quickly, the Champions Trophy. They get their 616 00:36:25,693 --> 00:36:29,013 Speaker 3: games done quick, smart and on the road again. And 617 00:36:29,013 --> 00:36:32,133 Speaker 3: of course we'll have Pakistan back here before we know it. 618 00:36:32,373 --> 00:36:35,773 Speaker 3: That's coming up a little bit later in the year, 619 00:36:37,133 --> 00:36:42,013 Speaker 3: just before we go, Jerry the rise of franchise cricket 620 00:36:42,693 --> 00:36:44,693 Speaker 3: and we'll talk a bit more about it, because I 621 00:36:44,693 --> 00:36:49,613 Speaker 3: think it's quite a bigger subject than just passing reference. 622 00:36:50,133 --> 00:36:53,173 Speaker 3: But from New Zealand's point of view, they've had the 623 00:36:53,213 --> 00:36:57,533 Speaker 3: Dream elevens Supersmass New Zealand's own T twenty competition. It's 624 00:36:57,573 --> 00:37:01,533 Speaker 3: never going to rival the Ossie Big Besh League that 625 00:37:01,573 --> 00:37:05,413 Speaker 3: they have got reasonable crowds, but you know you're not 626 00:37:05,453 --> 00:37:08,253 Speaker 3: going to draw in fifty sixty seventy thousand as the 627 00:37:08,333 --> 00:37:12,453 Speaker 3: Big Best League does. It obviously works over there. There's 628 00:37:12,533 --> 00:37:15,333 Speaker 3: rumors going around that New Zealand might want a franchise 629 00:37:15,773 --> 00:37:18,773 Speaker 3: in the Big Best League. What Australia want us? Would 630 00:37:18,773 --> 00:37:21,413 Speaker 3: it do anything for our game? Is it worth investigating? 631 00:37:21,693 --> 00:37:26,013 Speaker 2: Well, it's certainly worth investigating. You know, you say franchise cricket. 632 00:37:26,013 --> 00:37:28,773 Speaker 2: There's there's big movement, isn't there over in the UK 633 00:37:28,933 --> 00:37:32,133 Speaker 2: at the moment they started a game And now they've 634 00:37:32,133 --> 00:37:35,253 Speaker 2: reached the point after five years where they're selling those 635 00:37:35,933 --> 00:37:40,933 Speaker 2: franchised teams which have been owned by the ECB. Now 636 00:37:40,973 --> 00:37:45,653 Speaker 2: they're becoming owned well really by the ip ip UK, 637 00:37:45,973 --> 00:37:50,213 Speaker 2: isn't it really, And so they're selling those. As far 638 00:37:50,253 --> 00:37:52,693 Speaker 2: as New Zealanders consent, doesn't seem to me that we 639 00:37:52,773 --> 00:37:56,133 Speaker 2: can sell a hell of a lot. We don't, you know, 640 00:37:56,293 --> 00:38:00,373 Speaker 2: as you say, Super Smash can't can't do that. We 641 00:38:00,413 --> 00:38:05,333 Speaker 2: can't sell that anywhere. So yeah, I think as far 642 00:38:05,413 --> 00:38:09,933 Speaker 2: as as getting a team into the into the Big bashwards, 643 00:38:09,933 --> 00:38:13,173 Speaker 2: that would be fantastic for New Zealand, I think not 644 00:38:13,253 --> 00:38:15,693 Speaker 2: from a money perspective, I don't think we would make 645 00:38:15,773 --> 00:38:18,533 Speaker 2: money from that as a as a you know, as 646 00:38:19,093 --> 00:38:22,933 Speaker 2: the New Zealand Cricket Council. I just think that all 647 00:38:22,973 --> 00:38:24,493 Speaker 2: we could do is we could use it as a 648 00:38:24,493 --> 00:38:28,373 Speaker 2: developmental thing and develop our game in that format. That 649 00:38:28,413 --> 00:38:32,333 Speaker 2: would be very handy indeed, But we would still presumably 650 00:38:32,933 --> 00:38:36,573 Speaker 2: have to have our marquee players, so the Williamson's there, 651 00:38:36,573 --> 00:38:38,973 Speaker 2: the Henry's would be there, you know, the Ravenders and 652 00:38:39,013 --> 00:38:42,413 Speaker 2: so on. They would need to be available, I think 653 00:38:42,893 --> 00:38:47,413 Speaker 2: to provide the you know, the interest for the Big 654 00:38:47,493 --> 00:38:51,093 Speaker 2: Bash themselves, and so I'm sure they would want to 655 00:38:51,493 --> 00:38:54,373 Speaker 2: if it was possible to have a team in there, 656 00:38:54,413 --> 00:38:56,773 Speaker 2: and if they want an extra side. I don't know 657 00:38:56,813 --> 00:38:59,613 Speaker 2: how that would work in terms of have they got 658 00:38:59,613 --> 00:39:01,653 Speaker 2: an even number of sides at the moment, I think 659 00:39:01,693 --> 00:39:05,413 Speaker 2: they could we have them, so yeah, I don't know 660 00:39:05,413 --> 00:39:08,053 Speaker 2: how they'd do that, but anyway, it would make it 661 00:39:08,053 --> 00:39:11,333 Speaker 2: a bit longer, but it would certainly be helpful for 662 00:39:11,413 --> 00:39:13,853 Speaker 2: New Zealand. I would have thought. I think i'd support that. 663 00:39:15,493 --> 00:39:18,573 Speaker 3: Yeah, well, it's interesting proposition. I think there'll be a 664 00:39:18,613 --> 00:39:21,773 Speaker 3: lot of people that would be in behind it as well. 665 00:39:21,773 --> 00:39:23,973 Speaker 3: But as I say, we can talk about that along 666 00:39:24,013 --> 00:39:27,573 Speaker 3: with that hundred scenario, because that is quite interesting at 667 00:39:27,613 --> 00:39:30,373 Speaker 3: the moment and the franchise leagues that are growing up 668 00:39:30,413 --> 00:39:33,413 Speaker 3: all around the world. We can have a chat about 669 00:39:33,413 --> 00:39:34,453 Speaker 3: that in. 670 00:39:34,253 --> 00:39:34,933 Speaker 2: A later program. 671 00:39:34,973 --> 00:39:39,053 Speaker 3: We're running out of time, thanks very much to Wally. 672 00:39:39,253 --> 00:39:41,613 Speaker 3: He's had to leave us a little bit early, but 673 00:39:42,133 --> 00:39:46,893 Speaker 3: thank you for your contribution, Wally, and also to you Jerry. 674 00:39:46,933 --> 00:39:49,813 Speaker 3: You can sit back and have Oh no, there's a 675 00:39:49,813 --> 00:39:53,533 Speaker 3: few late nights still ahead, isn't there with the champions Trophy, 676 00:39:53,613 --> 00:39:55,853 Speaker 3: so you'll be able to put your feet up and 677 00:39:55,973 --> 00:39:58,293 Speaker 3: you won't have to search through the internet to try 678 00:39:58,333 --> 00:40:01,333 Speaker 3: and find it as we've had for the warm up games. 679 00:40:01,653 --> 00:40:04,613 Speaker 3: I think it'll be live on our TV. Here's hoping 680 00:40:04,653 --> 00:40:05,453 Speaker 3: fingers crossed. 681 00:40:06,653 --> 00:40:10,013 Speaker 2: Yeah, that'd be good ones. That's that's great, that's great, 682 00:40:10,093 --> 00:40:12,013 Speaker 2: so I'm looking forward to it. I hope New Zealand 683 00:40:12,093 --> 00:40:13,093 Speaker 2: keep playing well. 684 00:40:14,493 --> 00:40:15,453 Speaker 3: And enduring the sunshine. 685 00:40:16,413 --> 00:40:23,253 Speaker 2: We'll do what Genus YouTube see later fine all the world. 686 00:40:23,173 --> 00:40:33,333 Speaker 1: A qualities of summerting. Do for more from News Talks 687 00:40:33,333 --> 00:40:36,573 Speaker 1: at b Listen live on air or online, and keep 688 00:40:36,613 --> 00:40:39,373 Speaker 1: our shows with you wherever you go with our podcasts 689 00:40:39,413 --> 00:40:40,493 Speaker 1: on iHeartRadio.