1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:04,120 Speaker 1: The Huddle with New Zealand Southby's International Realty, a name 2 00:00:04,160 --> 00:00:06,359 Speaker 1: you can trust locally and globally. 3 00:00:06,480 --> 00:00:08,240 Speaker 2: On the huddle of this evening we have Jordan Williams 4 00:00:08,280 --> 00:00:13,280 Speaker 2: of the Taxpayers Union of Mark Sainsbury Broadcaster. Hello lads, Jordan, listen, 5 00:00:13,320 --> 00:00:15,120 Speaker 2: this news is obviously just broken this afternoon. 6 00:00:15,160 --> 00:00:21,200 Speaker 3: Do you have any view on this on the puberty blocking? Yeah, hither, 7 00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:26,599 Speaker 3: I have enough enemies fighting for lower taxes. I as 8 00:00:27,000 --> 00:00:31,240 Speaker 3: I am. It's probably the only topic I don't want 9 00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:33,880 Speaker 3: to go there. I mean, I I hold on. 10 00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:36,120 Speaker 4: Well, okay, well, well Jordan, so is it for you 11 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 4: so tricky? 12 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 1: Like? 13 00:00:37,840 --> 00:00:39,400 Speaker 2: Do you think that this is such a tricky and 14 00:00:39,479 --> 00:00:41,879 Speaker 2: vexed issue you actually don't even want to talk about it. 15 00:00:44,240 --> 00:00:48,240 Speaker 3: I have a staffer who has strong views on transgender 16 00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:50,680 Speaker 3: matters and gets death threats nearly every day. 17 00:00:50,840 --> 00:00:51,080 Speaker 5: Wow. 18 00:00:51,120 --> 00:00:55,480 Speaker 3: I think that this is the most awful area of policy. 19 00:00:55,560 --> 00:00:58,040 Speaker 3: I think what the I'm happy to quontificate that what 20 00:00:58,080 --> 00:01:01,800 Speaker 3: the government is doing I think is smart, notwithstanding saying, 21 00:01:01,800 --> 00:01:03,280 Speaker 3: you know, flick it off to the experts when the 22 00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:08,200 Speaker 3: effect cabinet has the following internet, you know, particularly the UK. 23 00:01:08,840 --> 00:01:15,840 Speaker 3: But what governments are doing using the latest clinical information 24 00:01:15,959 --> 00:01:23,160 Speaker 3: that they've been given. There is at least a as 25 00:01:23,200 --> 00:01:25,559 Speaker 3: you know, some people advocate that we will look back 26 00:01:25,600 --> 00:01:29,400 Speaker 3: on the last few years in the way that young 27 00:01:29,480 --> 00:01:35,360 Speaker 3: people that have question the sexuality and being arguably or 28 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:38,759 Speaker 3: affern or shepherded into lopping off their breasts or doing 29 00:01:38,840 --> 00:01:42,480 Speaker 3: terrible things. That one could argue that we could look 30 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:46,280 Speaker 3: back on the period of the last ten years with horror, 31 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 3: which here I am taking a position, but it is 32 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:53,680 Speaker 3: a real It's one I don't really like to get 33 00:01:53,840 --> 00:01:58,400 Speaker 3: to get into because it's just awful the treatment of 34 00:01:58,440 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 3: people on both sides. 35 00:02:00,480 --> 00:02:01,920 Speaker 4: I don't think that you should feel ashamed of that. 36 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:03,360 Speaker 2: I think that there are some issues that are just 37 00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:05,240 Speaker 2: so difficult that people don't want to talk about it, 38 00:02:05,240 --> 00:02:07,280 Speaker 2: and it is one of them saying so, look, I mean, 39 00:02:07,520 --> 00:02:09,440 Speaker 2: this is a it is a difficult subject, but it 40 00:02:09,560 --> 00:02:12,079 Speaker 2: is it is very difficult to see it as being 41 00:02:12,120 --> 00:02:15,000 Speaker 2: the right thing to do to allow young people before 42 00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:17,520 Speaker 2: they really are old enough to make decisions to effectively 43 00:02:17,520 --> 00:02:20,280 Speaker 2: sterilize themselves right by preventing their own pberty. 44 00:02:21,200 --> 00:02:23,560 Speaker 5: My view on this is colored a bit by a 45 00:02:23,600 --> 00:02:26,200 Speaker 5: good friend of mine who went through exactly that their 46 00:02:26,320 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 5: child decided that this wasn't the they believed they were 47 00:02:30,639 --> 00:02:34,240 Speaker 5: of a different gender, and they started procedures and then 48 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:37,040 Speaker 5: there was a change of sudden or no, I was 49 00:02:37,080 --> 00:02:39,239 Speaker 5: just going through a phase. I don't believe that now. 50 00:02:39,320 --> 00:02:43,360 Speaker 5: Oh it's just a nightmare, Heather, nightmare. Now, that doesn't 51 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:47,320 Speaker 5: mean that it couldn't necessarily be youthful for you know, 52 00:02:47,919 --> 00:02:50,640 Speaker 5: this is where the psychiatrists and everyone else has to 53 00:02:50,639 --> 00:02:52,720 Speaker 5: come into it. I mean, anyone you talk to in 54 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:57,160 Speaker 5: that area, it is there's so many whether it's caused 55 00:02:57,160 --> 00:03:01,040 Speaker 5: by the dysmorphear or whatever, but there are so many issues, 56 00:03:01,520 --> 00:03:04,880 Speaker 5: mental health issues around the whole treatment and preparation. 57 00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:07,120 Speaker 2: I mean, I think you're getting at there saying it 58 00:03:07,240 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 2: was a very salient point, right that there will be 59 00:03:09,080 --> 00:03:12,560 Speaker 2: a very small number of kids who truly are trans. 60 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:14,720 Speaker 2: But if we know one thing about kids having been 61 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:18,079 Speaker 2: kids and raised kids, is that kids convince themselves of 62 00:03:18,160 --> 00:03:20,440 Speaker 2: a thing that that they are like their friends, and 63 00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:22,960 Speaker 2: it's very hard to kind of pick apart who really 64 00:03:23,000 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 2: is trans and who is just going with the kind 65 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:26,680 Speaker 2: of trendy thing. Right, that's part of the problem. 66 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:32,560 Speaker 5: Yep, Yeah, I mean, and look the big the fair 67 00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 5: with it I suppose was you know, Tayden steps that 68 00:03:35,160 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 5: certainly that couldn't be reversed or couldn't be dealt with, 69 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:39,840 Speaker 5: and like in this particular case, it was just it 70 00:03:39,880 --> 00:03:40,760 Speaker 5: was just horrific. 71 00:03:42,240 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 2: So wasn't reversible you're talking about? Sorry, was it reversible 72 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:49,240 Speaker 2: in the case that you're talking about. 73 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:52,600 Speaker 5: That's still going through issues over the ether? Yeah? I 74 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:56,040 Speaker 5: know that wasn't quite as simple. There wasn't a simple So. 75 00:03:56,920 --> 00:03:58,560 Speaker 4: We'll take a quick break. I really appreciate it. We'll 76 00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:01,840 Speaker 4: come back with another subject in just to take the huddle. 77 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:05,120 Speaker 1: With New Zealand Southeby's International Real Team, the only truly 78 00:04:05,320 --> 00:04:06,000 Speaker 1: global brand. 79 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:08,480 Speaker 2: Right back of the huddle Jordan Williams and Mark Sainsbury. Jordan, 80 00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:11,080 Speaker 2: do you buy Winston Peter's argument that he saved billions 81 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:11,720 Speaker 2: on the Fairies? 82 00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:15,320 Speaker 3: Well, I mean they were landed with a pretty terrible 83 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:20,599 Speaker 3: situation with Kiwi Rail that it totally boils it up 84 00:04:20,640 --> 00:04:22,919 Speaker 3: and Treasurrey Advice saying it was going to cost what 85 00:04:23,040 --> 00:04:26,000 Speaker 3: four and a half billion or twice what what Kibi 86 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:29,200 Speaker 3: Rail initially said it was going to but of course 87 00:04:29,279 --> 00:04:33,159 Speaker 3: being the government instead of you know, clearing out Kiwi 88 00:04:33,240 --> 00:04:35,600 Speaker 3: Rail and doing a proper job and asking a fundamental question, 89 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:38,279 Speaker 3: which is, why do the taxpayer needed sun fairies? And 90 00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:40,359 Speaker 3: we've got private operators and the rest of the world 91 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:43,480 Speaker 3: that do this sort of stuff every day instead. And 92 00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:46,120 Speaker 3: I can tell you that the text page Union had 93 00:04:46,120 --> 00:04:50,080 Speaker 3: snuffed this out. We discovered about an hour ago that 94 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:54,640 Speaker 3: in our building no less, this Faery Holdings company takes 95 00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:57,279 Speaker 3: up our whole floor. So it may have saved billions, 96 00:04:57,400 --> 00:05:00,200 Speaker 3: very good. But instead of sorting out, you know, the 97 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:02,919 Speaker 3: actual company that's supposed to run the theories and you 98 00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 3: know that would presumably include you know, buying them, they've 99 00:05:06,279 --> 00:05:09,960 Speaker 3: created a whole new bureaucracy and a floor on lamp 100 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:15,320 Speaker 3: and tea of of bureaucrats to manage the classic Wellington 101 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:16,719 Speaker 3: but credit credit I. 102 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:18,760 Speaker 4: Can't remember them. I can't remember the exact figure. But 103 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:20,320 Speaker 4: I saw the I saw how much Fairy. 104 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:23,599 Speaker 2: Holdings is costing us, and it's it's a surprisingly big number. Actually, 105 00:05:24,120 --> 00:05:26,200 Speaker 2: says that were you impressed with the steal? I mean 106 00:05:26,279 --> 00:05:28,880 Speaker 2: bearing in mind so and the context is it was 107 00:05:28,920 --> 00:05:31,320 Speaker 2: going to cost Labor two point six billion for their fairies. 108 00:05:31,360 --> 00:05:34,080 Speaker 2: It's essentially costing US two point five billion for the steal. 109 00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:35,640 Speaker 2: Which doesn't feel like a massive saving. 110 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:38,400 Speaker 5: No, and then if you had in the cost of 111 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:44,039 Speaker 5: Winston flying to China to have a celebratory me I 112 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:46,600 Speaker 5: mean that look in some ways, maybe it's part of 113 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 5: the diplomacy, but you're going on and on about all 114 00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:51,600 Speaker 5: these unnecessary costs and these consultants and all these people 115 00:05:51,640 --> 00:05:54,880 Speaker 5: who are you feeding off the teeth, and then the're 116 00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:57,599 Speaker 5: going we're all flying over to kind of to have 117 00:05:57,760 --> 00:05:59,600 Speaker 5: some sort of serum seramony. 118 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:03,800 Speaker 3: Well, I think you're being a bit but I'm not 119 00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:05,600 Speaker 3: If you guys know, I'm not one to sort of 120 00:06:05,640 --> 00:06:09,320 Speaker 3: whole fire on wins done. But the Treasury advice was 121 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:12,280 Speaker 3: that this was going to this doubled and cost there 122 00:06:12,360 --> 00:06:14,719 Speaker 3: was a projection though there is a real saving here. 123 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:17,479 Speaker 2: That was that a projection or was that actually like 124 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:19,120 Speaker 2: could they actually give us the receipts for that? 125 00:06:20,520 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 3: Pulled the plug on? And that seemed come on, Jordan. 126 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:25,120 Speaker 2: You were you didn't come down in a rain shower 127 00:06:25,240 --> 00:06:27,479 Speaker 2: last night. You know very well that Treasury tells you 128 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:29,080 Speaker 2: what you want Treasury to tell you. 129 00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:33,240 Speaker 3: Right, So I think when they entered off us, this 130 00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:35,800 Speaker 3: was one of the flashing red lights saying, list you've 131 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:36,880 Speaker 3: got to deal with us. 132 00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:40,680 Speaker 2: I mean, there's probably a whole whole chat and how 133 00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:44,479 Speaker 2: we've lost confidence in treasury saying, so, is it the 134 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:47,080 Speaker 2: fault of the Breakers for not wanting to wear the 135 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:47,719 Speaker 2: Pride flag? 136 00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:50,000 Speaker 4: Or is it the fault? Is it the fault? 137 00:06:50,040 --> 00:06:52,839 Speaker 2: Alternative theory, is it the fault of the NBL, the 138 00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:55,919 Speaker 2: league for making a Pride week and and creating a 139 00:06:55,920 --> 00:06:59,160 Speaker 2: situation like this the potential for it to happen, you 140 00:06:59,160 --> 00:06:59,479 Speaker 2: would like. 141 00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:01,280 Speaker 5: To say, to create and the shoe haul them into it. 142 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 3: Lookay tell you this sort. 143 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:04,920 Speaker 5: Of raised a bit of I second, remember old Israel 144 00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:10,200 Speaker 5: Phalau and yeat of trouble he got into Because I'm 145 00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 5: sort of reading this thing and I'm trying to work 146 00:07:11,760 --> 00:07:14,240 Speaker 5: out so they're trying to protect individual players. So obviously 147 00:07:14,280 --> 00:07:16,560 Speaker 5: they are individual players within the Breakers who don't want 148 00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:19,280 Speaker 5: to wear it, and so to avoid them being singled 149 00:07:19,280 --> 00:07:21,120 Speaker 5: out for not wearing it, they all won't wear it, 150 00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 5: which is a bit said it taken nowhere, isn't it? 151 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:28,720 Speaker 5: You know? I thought a pastor that a bit you don't. Yeah, look, 152 00:07:29,120 --> 00:07:32,880 Speaker 5: I just found the whole thing about brading. But then again, 153 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:34,520 Speaker 5: I think you got a point there. They should have 154 00:07:34,520 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 5: thought this thing through before they put teams into this position. 155 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:41,320 Speaker 5: See what you know, the rugby did it during the 156 00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:44,760 Speaker 5: Rugby Championship. Yeah, the Super Rugby. You know, there was 157 00:07:44,800 --> 00:07:48,280 Speaker 5: different themes each each week, and Pride was one of those. 158 00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:52,239 Speaker 5: It's sort of become part of it. But there's shoes 159 00:07:52,280 --> 00:07:55,520 Speaker 5: and a lot of conservative, conservative sports people. 160 00:07:55,720 --> 00:07:56,760 Speaker 4: Well this is the thing, Jordan. 161 00:07:56,840 --> 00:07:59,640 Speaker 2: And in twenty twenty two, a year before these guys 162 00:07:59,680 --> 00:08:02,440 Speaker 2: started doing it in basketball, the same thing happened in 163 00:08:02,480 --> 00:08:03,000 Speaker 2: the NRL. 164 00:08:03,120 --> 00:08:04,440 Speaker 4: So why did they not learn from that? 165 00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:07,600 Speaker 3: Well, I think the opening window has shifted a bit 166 00:08:07,600 --> 00:08:09,160 Speaker 3: on this. You know, I would say good on the 167 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:13,600 Speaker 3: breakers for doing it, because I'm sorry, it's not homophobia 168 00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:18,600 Speaker 3: to not go along with what you know, the pride 169 00:08:18,680 --> 00:08:21,240 Speaker 3: movement and what it now is. I mean, you look 170 00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:24,640 Speaker 3: at I have gay staff who don't agree with the 171 00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:27,840 Speaker 3: Rainbow movement because of where it's gone on the trans 172 00:08:27,840 --> 00:08:31,760 Speaker 3: issues and various other file eves activism. But you look 173 00:08:31,800 --> 00:08:34,760 Speaker 3: at someone like Stephen Rainbow, the Human Rights Commissioner. You know, 174 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:38,280 Speaker 3: he was attacked by the despite being the wrong sort 175 00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:43,560 Speaker 3: of rainbow, so not subscribing to all the other activist views. Look, 176 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:45,680 Speaker 3: I'm sorry, but I mean we see this all the 177 00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:49,440 Speaker 3: time through the Free Speech Union, that government agencies think 178 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:51,880 Speaker 3: you must be you must be virtuous, you must go 179 00:08:51,920 --> 00:08:55,360 Speaker 3: along with this pride activism, or there's something wrong with you. 180 00:08:55,440 --> 00:08:59,679 Speaker 3: Well no, look, I'm sorry. Well we're well passed, you know. 181 00:08:59,800 --> 00:09:03,600 Speaker 3: The it's not bigotry to not go along with all 182 00:09:03,640 --> 00:09:07,240 Speaker 3: the other things that are tacked on to these activist movements. 183 00:09:07,240 --> 00:09:09,800 Speaker 3: And I say good on the breakers actually saying look, 184 00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:13,439 Speaker 3: we here to play rugby. Sorry, let we'll let on, 185 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:15,280 Speaker 3: you know, kind of rugby. 186 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:22,520 Speaker 2: Like basketball, basketball like rugby. Says oh, or has Jordan 187 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:28,079 Speaker 2: just shown that it doesn't understand sports guys, sports ball 188 00:09:28,160 --> 00:09:28,840 Speaker 2: beat sports ball. 189 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:33,000 Speaker 4: I say, oh lord, good, thank you so much. You 190 00:09:33,040 --> 00:09:35,480 Speaker 4: guys appreciate it. Mark Sainsbrie, Jordan Williams a hut All 191 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:35,920 Speaker 4: this Evening. 192 00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:39,800 Speaker 1: For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to 193 00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:42,959 Speaker 1: news talks. It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow 194 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:44,760 Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio.